Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

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Agnimitra
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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Agnimitra » 17 May 2015 10:54

Not sure which thread this should go into...
johneeG wrote:your theory of 'Triangulating Hindutva: The Fundamentalist, Reformist & Traditionalist' is very thought-provoking.

I think Fundamentalism would be a person who 'insists that we go back to fundamentals of a creed'. Generally, in most other creeds, fundamentalists and traditionalists are on the same side which makes it a very powerful block. So, in most other creeds, fundamentalists and traditionalists are one and the same. The major movements come when they oppose each other.

Reformists are strengthened when they either side with fundamentalists or traditionalists. This is possible only if fundamentalists and traditionalists are not on the same page.

In Hindhuism, fundamentalism is a difficult thing because there are so many schools, sects, Gods, Goddesses, ...etc. Each school, sect, caste, ...etc differs on what is the definition of foundations.

johneeG ji, what you say is correct. However, while different sects may have different texts/agamas and different morphologies, their ontologies are more often than not mostly shared. 'Structure of Thought' versus 'Structure of Reality'. This meta-view is missed by authors like Shri Arun Shourie ji (whom I respect) who claim most Hindu sects are all contradictory and therefore not to be taken seriously for any theological or philosophical value.

A meta-view (ontological) of Indic tradition shows that the unique differing/contradictory claims of each sect actually fit into different unique points on a scale. They each appeal and apply to people whose basic tone level (sthaayi-bhaava) is at that point. For example, the reason for Agni being supreme offers one particular "bhaava", Shaakta agamas offer another reason in a different "bhaava" for Shakti being supreme, Shaiva agamas another, and Vaishnava another, etc. Each of these bhaavas is unique, and presents a good study of emotion as such. Some Tantra texts such as the Bhaavana Upanishad also go into this meta-analysis.

For this reason, the morphology must be considered separately from ontology in terms of 'fundamentals', because in Indic theory fundamentals of Dharma are subtle, sookshma. They are not cut and dried textual claims like the Abrahamic. Rather, the fundamentals have a 'relative' component - relative to the Individual.

The whole spectrum of morphologies taken together gives deeper insight into the ontology. For this reason, Madhva says that it is not 'Vishnu' but rather the whole 'Hierarchy' that is to be worshiped.

johneeG wrote:The present day Hindhuism is actually closer to Agamas and Tantra than Vedhas. One could say that Agamas/Tantra are continuation of the Vedhic tradition. In which case, the question is: why are these considered as distinct from Vedhas?

Because the semantic scope of Veda is different from Upanishads, Agamas, Tantra, etc. The Veda and its "meaning" is transcendent to the intellectual, mental and emotive ratiocination of these other texts. Thus, the Veda, with its sounds, it kept as a placeholder for a transcendent epistemic space that the human being can access. That special 'placeholder' nature of the Veda is itself a fundamental of Hinduism's epistemology.

johneeG wrote:One could say that Arya Samaj of Dayananda Saraswathi was a Vedhic fundamentalism i.e. going back to Vedhik religion and rejecting all other ideas which may have been developed along the way. This fundamentalism was opposed to the Tradionalist views on many issues. This allowed reformists a chance to enter the field by siding with traditionalists and fundamentalists on different issues.

Even Arya Samaj's interpretation of Veda can be contested - their interpretation itself is not 'fundamental'. It is Veda that is fundamental. Arya Samaj scholars will accept this fact.

johneeG wrote:Another doubt I have is: when did Bhakthi come into the picture in Hindhuism? Generally, Naradha is said to be the Guru of Bhakthi. Right now, I am assuming that Bhakthi came into the picture just before or just after the Agamas came. I think Agamas/Tantra developed somewhere around 1800 BCE. Wikipedia says that Tantra developed in 500 CE. According to Wiki ji, Ganapthi worship first appeared around 500 CE and became prominent in 1000 CE.

The word "tantra" occurs in Veda. Bhakti itself is implicit in the Veda hymns. It is a common mistaken notion that there is a semantic segregation between Karma-kanda, Jnana and Bhakti. That is only for purposes of understanding externally. Waves of preoccupation or indulgence in Karma, Jnana and Bhakti (and Nastika trends) would have arisen and subsided in the life of the civilization (and also an individual sadhaka). Those dates you cited were only the most recent 'waves'. If I understand correctly, "karma performed with jnana-poorna bhakti" is the goal.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Adrija » 17 May 2015 15:05

Hinduism is also as close as it gets to an "open-source" faith. It changes the environment and is changed by it. It can be rebuilt, redesigned, repeatedly reconceptualized, reorganized, taken apart and put together again etc etc and still retain its intangible soul.


Hakim sa'ab,

Another difference I have noted in the Indic knowledge systems vs the Abrahamic ones is in their essential focus- they are actually diametrically opposite of the other.

The Western world view essentially tries to indulge man and subjugate nature, whereas all Indic thought is about subjugating/ disciplining the mind and living harmoniously with nature

The differences show up in many ways, but I think they do explain to some extent the different trajectories the two civilizations have evolved into. The quest for mastery of nature by the west has resulted in stupendous material progress, evidenced in the world we live in today. But the logical end point is what we are facing today-ecological unsustainability, rampant consumerism, distress/ angst, medical turmoil etc

The Indic systems essentially try to discipline your mind. So the flip side is excessive focus on the individual (all moksha/ nirvana/ yoga/ bhakti/ peace of mind is essentially an individual tryst) and not adequate focus on societal aspects.

The counter to that was the concept of dharma and castes, but we forgot about the former, and the latter became rigid so resulted in statis and oppression....

On the same logical train but a bit tangential, I find it difficult to believe that a society which achieved so much advancement in thought could not translate that to material sciences, and most importantly, medical advances what the West achieved and which have done so much to alleviate human misery. Perhaps this could be because of many factors which we do not know yet- (a) we did but lost the knowledge in the turmoil of the last 1000 years, (b) the elite really did not care about human misery and looked at human suffering as ordained.....who knows...but personally I find that quite puzzling......

Sorry for the rambling....

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Hari Seldon » 18 May 2015 14:50

So its true. Telangana invented civilization. Take that, ye AndhrAs!

Rare discovery pushes back Iron Age in India (TOI)

HYDERABAD: Iron Age may have come into existence in Telangana much before the rest of the world. At least that's the conclusion reached by archaeologists excavating the University of Hyderabad campus who found iron artefacts dating back to roughly 2,200 BC.

The team of archaeologists, led by professor KP Rao, has found several artefacts, including small knives and blades besides earthen pots. "The implements that were found were tested at the National Geophysical Research Institute (NGRI) using a method called Optically Simulated Luminescence (OSL). The metal objects were dated to anywhere between 1800 BC and 2,400 BC. So we are assuming they were made during 2200 BC," Prof KP Rao told TOI.

This, he said, predates the existing understanding about the advent of the Iron Age in the country. Worldwide, experts have put the dawn of the age around 1200 BC, marking the time when humans started exploiting metals to make basic tools.

"In India, it was understood that the Iron Age came into being around 1,800 BC in the Lahuradeva site in Uttar Pradesh. But this latest development shows that the Iron Age started much before that, at least in our country," Rao said.

"It only goes to show that our ancestors had a rudimentary yet good knowledge about wielding weapons made of metals. We had estimated that the only metal that was moulded was copper, but due to its scarce nature it was not a feasible option. The idea of using abundant iron ore for tools and weapons is a landmark achievement," he added.

The idea of using iron has only come to lead to more and more developments. "It is because of their advancements did we reach the space-age," he said.

Currently, archaeologists have excavated 25 burial sites in the UOH area and the samples have been subjected to DNA analysis.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby RamaY » 18 May 2015 18:05

^
In 2200BC they were part of Andhras :P because only evil-yindoos used iron.

Secular Nizam ushered Golden-age along with Telangana name :((

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby ramana » 29 May 2015 05:18

Suraj wrote:Should go into the UPA failures catalogue thread, but it's not a discussion thread.

So much for NREGA, Right to Food etc:
India tops world hunger list with 194 mn people: UN report
Number of hungry basically unchanged between 2004-2014.



IOW ten long years wasted and the resources misspent and /or looted.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby RamaY » 30 May 2015 16:36

Self-declared secular members believe in and propose that India should be able to live in peace with other Islamic, Christian, Communist, Atheist, Non-Hindu nations. They also firmly believe that humanity has some core principles that cannot be influenced/diluted by religions, however exclusivist a religion might be.

Then why can't such a society/world have space for a Hindu India? Why can't Hindu India, however exclusivist it might be, demonstrate the core principles of humanity that non-Hindu nations demonstrate?

Why wouldn't such a Hindu-India be a non-secular entity when secularism doesn't interact with religion by definition?

Why do self-styled secular members do not support a Hindu India project when 80% of Indians claim to be Hindus? How can Islamic, Christian, Communist etc nations have business, people-to-people and even civilizaironal relationships with each other but wouldn't interact with a Hindu India?

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Philip » 30 May 2015 16:42

When BRF was started,I remember posting a piece about the massive environmental damage of big dams,as experienced in Lanka from a global environmental mag.Apartf rom drastically altering the ecology,the cost of human resettlement is also a major factor,rarely if ever on the promised scale.In such a sensitive region as the Himalayas,big dams will end up being an unmitigated disaster,the recent Nepal earthquake has shown. This review has not come too late and a moratorium on big dams should be immediately enforced.

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/ ... ver-basins
Indian government to review hydroelectric dams in two river basins
Within a week, India’s ministry of environment and forest finds itself committed to conducting an overall impact assessment of dams in the rivers Ganga and Brahmaputra

Ranganadi hydroelectric project, one of several dams in Arunachal Pradesh, India. Photograph: Alamy

Janaki Lenin
Saturday 30 May 2015

The supreme court stopped the construction of dams on the river Ganga soon after the devastating floods that swept the state of Uttarakhand in June 2013. Many blamed them for exacerbating destruction. An 11-member expert committee recommended that 23 dams on the Alaknanda and Bhagirathi rivers, the two main tributaries of the Ganga, be scrapped. Builders of six dams in the upper Ganga basin asked the court to allow their projects to proceed. The six were among the 23 vetoed dams. Instead of accepting the expert committee’s advice, the court asked for a review committee to specifically examine the environmental clearances given to these six dams.

What difference does it make whether the six dams had environmental clearances? Besides the expert committee, these dams were vetoed by the wildlife institute of India as well, because they would damage biodiversity irrevocably. Ordinarily, environmental clearances that functioned as if ecosystems and wildlife mattered would winnow out destructive projects. In India, these systems are flawed. Take the case of the Dibang hydroelectric dam in Arunachal Pradesh for instance. The environment impact assessment (EIA) was farcical, and forest clearance was granted under pressure from the prime minister’s office.

In a report submitted to the ministry of environment and forests on February 12 this year, a four-member review committee said although the six dams possessed all the requisite environmental clearances, they needed re-evaluation. Since the floods had altered the terrain dramatically, the clearances were outdated. Instead of reporting this to the supreme court, the ministry said the committee had verified that the six dams had all the required environmental clearances. And they were good to go.


When the Business Standard pointed this out, the court asked the ministry to submit the committee’s full report.

On May 12, instead of submitting its affidavit and the full report, the ministry asked for yet another committee to examine the recommendations of the 4-member review committee as well as evaluate all other dams throughout the Ganga basin. Environmentalists have been demanding just this kind of assessment.

Meanwhile, in eastern Himalayas, Pradip Kumar Bhuyan and Joydeep Bhuyan, who run a school in Guwahati, Assam, have filed a case in the national green tribunal. They want the ministry to evaluate 135 dams slated to be built across the river Brahmaputra and its tributaries in the state of Arunachal Pradesh. Several of the dams face widespread opposition from residents in downstream Assam who expect their livelihoods to take a beating.


A fisherman on the banks of the river Brahmaputra in Assam. Fishing is one occupation expected to suffer from the construction of dams.

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A fisherman on the banks of the river Brahmaputra in Assam. Fishing is one occupation expected to suffer from the construction of dams. Photograph: Anupam Nath/AP

The Lower Subansiri dam has been stuck since 2011 because of people’s opposition to it. Since 2003, the estimated cost of building it has more than doubled from Rs. 6,285 crores (£630m) to Rs. 15,894 crores.

Although numerous dams were approved individually, the ministry has not looked at their impact on the entire river basin. Chief minister Nabam Tuki of Arunachal Pradesh said his state had the potential to generate nearly 60,000 megawatts of power from the Brahmaputra basin. Despite growing environmental, safety, and displacement concerns, 160 projects with a capacity of almost 47,000 megawatts have already been allotted.

On May 7, the tribunal ordered the ministry to evaluate the dams’ overall impact on biodiversity and on the people of the Brahmaputra basin.

Finally, the ministry will conduct what environmentalists have been demanding for a long time: basin-wide impact assessments of dams scheduled to be constructed across two of the largest rivers in India.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Prem » 31 May 2015 08:39

http://www.newindianexpress.com/thesund ... 841183.ece
Vishwa Hindu Parishad (VHP) in its recent ‘Marg Darshak Mandal’ meeting in Hardwar called for ban on river rafting and Islamic structures in Ayodhya. The Sangh-affiliated body, currently in its golden jubilee year, is in the forefront of highlighting Hindutva agenda. VHP General Secretary Champat Rai talks to The Sunday Standard on the recent controversies concerning the organisation and the Modi government’s one year. Excerpts from the interview:
One of the resolutions said no Islamic structure be allowed in Ayodhya. What is the rationale?
Jawaharlal Nehru removed George V (statue) from the India Gate. Ram Manohar Lohia broke the nose of George V. Indira Gandhi changed the names of hospitals. No self-respecting person would allow symbols of slavery. Babur had nothing do with the Indian Muslims. Why would we have invaders’ symbols in India? Ayodhya is a pilgrimage site for the Hindus, so no Muslim institutions should be allowed there. A delegation of sadhus would take up the issue with the government and meet Prime Minister regarding building of Ram temple.
Recently BJP President Amit Shah said his party does not have the mandate to decide on core issues. How do you react?
It’s okay. Their statement is not a reason for our discomfit. I don’t object to it [the statement].
VHP was running Ghar Wapsi programme. Is there a decline in such programmes?
If there is a decline, then those people who are opposing it should be happy. People should be happy who do conversion using foreign funds.
VHP had hailed Narendra Modi’s victory as Hindu rule after 1,000 years. How do you rate his government’s first year?
Who has taken the Bhagavad Gita all over the world? Who went to America and said he was doing Bhagwati upasana and fasting? Have you seen a PM doing Ganga Aarti? Our prestige has gone up in the world. Our soldiers were beheaded earlier, now it’s tit for tat.
Are there any issues which you want the government to respond to or take up?
Everything will be done. Let it function properly. We are not in a hurry. We are religious people. The first sign of religion is patience.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby sanjaykumar » 31 May 2015 08:55

Should Muslims be allowed in Ayodhya?

Should Hindus be allowed in Makkah?

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Prem » 31 May 2015 23:33

He notice Mercantile mentality

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Prem » 01 Jun 2015 01:26

"Pump eight bullets into the head of these Baloch" - Pakistani TV Host: Ahmadi Shahid Masood

[youtube]4C8gM_gKstc?t=12[/youtube]

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby member_22733 » 01 Jun 2015 01:41

Jhujar wrote:He notice Mercantile mentality


As much as I hate Tarek Fatah for his immature views about Islam and Indian Sikularism (which he supports), this interview is a must watch. I agree with him almost everywhere (except for the usual hindooootwa, casteism, sikular kamoonal nonsense). His stress on how people view each other when they are separated economically is spot on.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Pulikeshi » 01 Jun 2015 03:25

^^^ TF's take on classism in India is spot on... irrespective of how skeptical I am of his other views.
It is also true, that I share with him the optimism, when money becomes old, there will arise better behavior.

As the saying goes in Kannada - "Alpage aishwarya bandare, arda ratriyalli kode hididanate"
(If a crude man suddenly gets rich - he asks to hold the ceremonial umbrella even in the middle of the night) :mrgreen:

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Karthik S » 05 Jun 2015 02:15

Major Bakshi on India's independence

[youtube]yKHU2XEcht8&feature=youtu.be[/youtube]

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Manny » 07 Jun 2015 00:13

WORLD WAR II AND THE MAHABHARATA.

http://www.desicontrarian.com/?p=961



”The Legend of Bagger Vance”’s Hindu parallels

http://www.ancientworlds.net/aw/Article/543965

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby member_23692 » 07 Jun 2015 20:07

Self deleted per request from moderator
Last edited by member_23692 on 08 Jun 2015 17:37, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby JE Menon » 08 Jun 2015 10:05

^this is certainly not the thread for this. Please take it to GDF great Indian political drama thread or any other more suitable thread on this forum.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Prem » 09 Jun 2015 03:06

http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/k ... witterfeed
Ancient royal ring found in Karur riverbed

A silver ring with an inscription in the ancient Tamil Brahmi script has been found reportedly from the Amaravathi riverbed at Karur in Tamil Nadu. The highly stylised script depicts the punctuated Pandya fish emblem.Ms Beena Sarasan, an expert in numismatics, who purchased the ring from an antique dealer, suggested that the script reads “peruvazhuthi.”Peruvazhuti is the name of a Pandya king who, according to the Tamil sangam tradition, has performed several vedic yagas and rituals . The letters are engraved in bold and legible characters.The full name of this Pandya king was Palyagasalai Mutukutumi Peruvazhuthi who finds mention in several early Tamil sangam songs.Dr. M.R. Raghava Varier, former Professor of Epigraphy, Calicut University said the letters on the ring can be attributed to an early stage of evolution of the Tamil Brahmi characters on the basis of the palaeographical features of the script.Dr. Varier observed that the characters representing the peculiar Dravidian sound “Zha” show the earliest form of the letter found in the cave labels of Arittappatti- Mangulam group of inscriptions of the 3rd or 2nd century BCE.The characteristic rightward stroke of the Tamil Brahmi letters as suggested by earlier scholars are also present in the third letter “Va”. The artefact is a valuable find in the historical and epigraphical studies of ancient Tamilakam, Dr. Raghava Varier added.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby ramana » 10 Jun 2015 21:54

One thing to think about in terms of Empire and Congress party.

In short terms early on the Congress party was trying to establish an imperial policy by creating a power center in Delhi which is in harmony with the far off periphery.
This resulted in the drive to establish Congress party governments in the periphery states.
The imperial impulse/driver was to be the Congress party system of C-System.
The first signs of disharmony between Kerala in 1956 elections which elected CPI govt. at the state level. The govt. was promptly dismissed by Congress.
We then saw other signs of disharmony, language agitations, linguistic re-organization etc.
Yet the disharmony manifested itself with rout of Congress govts. in states by 1967 elections. And went on to threaten the Center leading to Emergency ten years later.

This harmony-disharmony led to coalition govts., over three decades e.g. United Front and later NDA and UPA.

2014 elections is a landmark for it resolved the disharmony between Center and Periphery except in some states and re-established stability.

NaMo mantra is to work even with disharmonious centers in the Periphery to strengthen the nation and preserve the Empire or nation-state.
This is why he is not using the mandate he got in 2014 to dismiss Governors or destabilize state governments.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Rony » 17 Jun 2015 07:46

SAD, SGPC, wine contractors, transporters in Punjab, all own private armies now !

It is tragic that the mighty Punjab Police is losing its sheen under political shadow and trend of owing private armies is on the rise in Punjab more on the lines of Bihar and Uttar Pradesh where people are forced to live under constant dictat and threat of mafias.

Not only that wine contactors, sand and transport mafias have raised their private armies to protect and promote their business interests, the the SGPC and ruling Shiromani Akali Dal (SAD) too have formed their private armies. The Guru Granth Sahib Satkar Committee, Gau Raksha Dal ec, taking law into their hands are extra-constitutional forces mushrooming in Punjab.

On June 14 (Saturday) a NRI family of Mansa who was travelling to Delhi airport to catch the flight to Canada was chased and assaulted on the way by the henchmen of a local wine contractor. The henchmen of the contractor who were hired to check the vehicles and find if somebody is carrying liquor bottles purchased from some other area. Most of these henchmen are criminals who are wanted in criminal cases and given shelter by the infleuntial contractors having proximity with the ruling Shiromani Akali Dal(SAD).

The incident of beating up of NRI Daljit Singh on the highway is an eye opener and serious threat to the society. Daljit Singh who escaped with minor injuries had missed the flight. He said that he was lucky that he managed to flee when being beaten up on the road. Daljit Singh is not the only victim of 'private armies' raised by the wine contractors and hundereds of local people face the wrath of armed henchmen who need no legal permission to check your vehicles and thrash you if violated law laid by their masters.

As per a news report in the Hindustan Times, another victim Tushar who was returning with his friends from a marriage party was chased and assaulted by the henchmen of wine contractor. They also took away valuables in the possession of victims. It was on Tushar's complaint that finally Mansa police registered a case under sections 307,, 392, 427, 146 and 149 of IPC against unidentified persons.

Not only in Mansa but in whole of the state the liquor contactors have raised private squades who barge into marriage functions to check illegal purchase of liquor and misbehave with the guests. The SAD government has made it mandatory to purchase the liquor for parties from the jurisdiction of liquoir contactor where marraige function is being held. The contactors charge double the normal rates for marriage functions and if you dare to bring the liquor from other vends, you and your guests might be humiliated and fined in connivance with the excise officials.

The goons also travel in the private buses and number of incidents are reported where passengers who demand ticket or defy the dictats of bus staff were beaten up and thrown out of the bus.
The Moga Orbit bus incident in whcih a minor girl Arshdeep Kaur and her mother were thrown out of the bus killing the girl was handiwork of henchmen of the Orbit Aviation Company owned by Deputy Chief Minister Sukhbir Singh Badal. This is common practice with all transporters.

Even the ruling SAD has raised a private army to counter the protests agains the Punjab Government.Recently about 200 private musclemen were deployed by SAD to counter a protest by the Orbit Kand action committee at Rampurphul, the home constituency of Rural Development minister Sikandar Singh Maluka. The musclemen were in addition to police deploy by district administration.

Many of the Youth Akali Dal workers who run the gangs of criminals were found involved in henious crimes like rape and murder. For the first time Punjab has witnessed gang wars. These very gangsters are private army in themselves and getting political protection.

Similarly the task force of SGPC is like a private army which is used to take possession of controversial Gurdawaras and land attached to Gurdwaras.
Though this is the duty of Police to resolve the disputes, SGPC is not depending on police for its affairs. SGPC had never got verified the antecedents of persons recrtuited in the task force.

If the trend of raising private forces to protect the business and political interests continued as such, Punjab would become a mafia ruled state and common people would just be slaves of these private armies.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby kmkraoind » 17 Jun 2015 18:16

Cross posting.

Reviving the Hindu Temple Ecosystem - Indiafacts by Sandeep Balakrishna @sandeepweb

And so, the answer to the Lamenting Hindus is this: a well-thought out revival of the ancient and medieval Temple Culture is one of the major keys to revive and rejuvenate Sanatana Dharma itself.

If the Vedas, the Upanishads, and the Dharmashastras provided the philosophical, moral, ethicaland societal foundation and the Epics (Itihasa) and Puranas, the rich literary framework to sustain this foundation, it was the Temple Culture that spawned, incubated, nurtured, sustained, and spread Sanatana
........
Under Pandit Jawaharlal Nehru, the Temple Culture was systematically relegated to the dustbin with a really simple device—by putting temples directly under Government control as part of his poisonous project of de-Hinduizing India.
This sinister projectproved even more malevolent because while it didn’t physically destroy temples, it ensured the same cultural outcome—the outcome which makes even staunch Hindus wear their non-temple-going as a badge of pride.

And then these selfsame Hindus wonder why classical music concerts and dance performances get no sponsorship. And they also wonder why our native languages and literature are dying out. And they wonder still, why we don’t build such grand, artistic and awe-inspiring temples anymore.


Freeing up of Temples from govt means, rebuilding our own narrative back.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby ramana » 18 Jun 2015 03:56

I bought the book "Roman Revolution: by Ronald Syme published in 1930s. The book studies Octavio Caesar and the people round him to discover what was the basis of the Roman Empire.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby ramana » 18 Jun 2015 03:59

ramana wrote:One thing to think about in terms of Empire and Congress party.

In short terms early on the Congress party was trying to establish an imperial policy by creating a power center in Delhi which is in harmony with the far off periphery.
This resulted in the drive to establish Congress party governments in the periphery states.
The imperial impulse/driver was to be the Congress party system of C-System.
The first signs of disharmony between Kerala in 1956 elections which elected CPI govt. at the state level. The govt. was promptly dismissed by Congress.
We then saw other signs of disharmony, language agitations, linguistic re-organization etc.
Yet the disharmony manifested itself with rout of Congress govts. in states by 1967 elections. And went on to threaten the Center leading to Emergency ten years later.

This harmony-disharmony led to coalition govts., over three decades e.g. United Front and later NDA and UPA.

2014 elections is a landmark for it resolved the disharmony between Center and Periphery except in some states and re-established stability.

NaMo mantra is to work even with disharmonious centers in the Periphery to strengthen the nation and preserve the Empire or nation-state.
This is why he is not using the mandate he got in 2014 to dismiss Governors or destabilize state governments.



What NaMo has to transform this Empire into is an entity that finds no benefit in secession i.e. every part on the periphery keeps the Center strong. In other words a 'hub and spokes' model that make up the wheel.
He has already achieved this partly by being elected from a periphery state and win hugely all over the country. His electoral map replicates the Maratha map. It needs to proceed gradually and expand.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby RamaY » 18 Jun 2015 04:26

^ Another aspect of Modi vision is to integrate the periphery states into Bharatiya foreign relations. This, when integrated with center's ability to bring empire's MIC to further that periphery states' international-relationship, the periphery states would want a stronger center in a mutually-strengthening power cycle/wheel.

Must look the Yemen-evacuation, Teesta/Border settlement with BD and even Myanmar ops from this angle.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby kmkraoind » 18 Jun 2015 10:07

“Swarajya” For Hindu Temples

Its not in Indic interest to artificially suppress interests and core system of Hindus (Temples). Its already been a year, and at least BJP should have freed Temples in BJP ruled states, so that that demand will get traction in non-BJP ruled states. But do not know, what is holding back even RSS and VHP to raise this important issue.

The near-total ignorance and indifference among the educated elite of India about how temples are managed baffles me. The unkindest cut usually comes in the context of discussing religious conversions in India. Leftist intellectuals and many among the educated elite accuse Hindus of “not performing adequate social service” unlike Christian missionaries, even as the government controls temple/institutional coffers and usurps monies for non-Hindu causes and others essentially run most of their schools and hospitals on a “for profit” basis (that funds other charitable endeavors) free from any government interference. George Orwell would be proud.

The long-term process of turning Hindu temples and institutions over to the control of Hindus themselves ought to be the second major item in the social agenda of the Modi sarkar.
There are many legitimate questions about who would manage the temples and how corruption can be avoided. Local temple committees drawn from and reflecting the composition of the devotees who worship at the temple can provide governance, ensure democratic participation of locals, and be subject to filing financial information like all non-profits. The Sikh Shiromani Gurudwara Prabandak Committee and the Islamic Wakf boards already provide a ready model for temple management. These bodies may not be perfect, but no one questions their right, or that of various missionary orders, in managing their respective places of worship. Claiming that the government must manage temples makes the implicitly bigoted assumption that Hindus alone are incapable of managing their own temples.

The Hindu Dharma Acharya Sabha, an umbrella body consisting of the leaders of all traditional Hindu sampradayas, is one possible organization that can serve as an overall coordinating body and provide a broader vision for how the surplus from some temples can be used to provide social service to the poor near each temple as well as to support other temples. Handing temples over to Hindus will go a long way in ensuring proper conduct of rituals, cleanliness of temples, and service to society.


P.S. I despise using too much bold facing and coloring, but this issue is more vital, so I am doing here, so Mods give me some leeway here.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Sagar G » 18 Jun 2015 19:08

Ramayana not a work of fiction

Ramsevak Kol, a tribe from the Sidhi district of Madhya Pradesh, stands head and shoulders above other Indians. Genetic studies prove that he is one of the descendants of King Guha of Ramayana. An international team of researchers consisting of geneticists, anthropologists, archaeologists and historians have found that Ramayana, written 10,000 years ago, is a chronicle of events and characters recorded by Sage Valmiki and not a work of fiction.

The mystery behind the characters in Ramayana has been solved by a team led by Dr Gyaneshwer Chaubey, ace genetic scientist of the Estonian Biocentre in Estonia. A three-year long research by Dr Chaubey and his team drawn out from Centre for Cellular and Molecular Biology, Hyderabad, Delhi University, Indian Institute of Technology-Kharagpur and Institute of Scientific Research on Vedas has found that the Bhils, Gonds and the Kols, categorised as Scheduled Castes and Tribes by the modern day administrators of India are the true descendants of characters featured in Ramayana. The peer reviewed scientific paper authored by the team has been published by PLOS ONE, a respected scientific portal.

The Kol tribe, found mainly in areas like Mirzapur, Varanasi, Banda and Allahabad in Uttar Pradesh, are the descendants of the Kol mentioned in Ramayana, according to Dr Chaubey and his team. Remember Guha, the chieftain of Sringiverapuram who helped Lord Rama, Sita and Laksmana cross the Ganga during their journey to the forests? “Guha, the Nishad King, is the ancestor of the present day Kol tribe we found in these regions. This ancestry was established by genetic studies. These groups of people carry the basic indigenous genetic traits of India. Ramsevak and thousands like him spread across the States of UP, MP, Odisha, Chhattisgargh are the true descendants of Lord Rama and his contemporaries,” Dr Chaubey told The Pioneer from Tartu in Estonia via video conferencing.

Dr Chaubey and Prof VR Rao, an anthropologist in Delhi University, said that the studies proved that these groups of people have maintained their genetic continuity for more than 10,000 years. “This again sets at rest the Aryan invasion theory. There is no inflow into the genetic traits of these tribes from outside elements,” said Saroj Bala, a specialist in Vedic and Ramayana studies, who shot into fame by calculating the date of birth of Lord Rama based on planetary positions.

Prof Rao said the studies confirmed that the characters mentioned by Valmiki in Ramayana are real life characters. “King Dasaratha, Rama and others were not fictional characters,” he said. Dr S Kalyanaraman, an Indologist of repute, said the Kols are the iron smelters about whom there are mentions in Indus Script excavated from the banks of Indus as well as River Saraswathi.

“This paper by Gyaneswer Chaube and team is an attempt to explain the roots of Hindu civilisation which has been distorted by creating false ethnic identities by the categorisation of people,” said Dr Kalyanaraman. He said a comprehensive study incorporating all tribes should be undertaken which would prove that the breaking up of essential unity of Bharatiya identity based on caste and ethnicity are academic fiction with no basis and a distortion of the history of ancient India.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Sagar G » 18 Jun 2015 20:14

Communal medical research :(( :((

Triphala can cure cancer and more: SPPU study

In a breakthrough study carried out by the School of Health Sciences (SHS) at the Savitribai Phule Pune University (SPPU), it was discovered that Triphala, an ayurvedic medicine known to be a laxative, can cure life-threatening diseases like cancer, diabetes and cardiac illnesses as well. The study, done early this year, was highly appreciated by the Ministry of AYUSH, Government of India, which is now planning to fund further research work so that the medicine can be put to practical use.

Speaking to Mirror, Dr Bhushan Patwardhan, SHS director at SPPU, explained that Triphala has been around for many years now. "But, we were able to prove that there is more to it than mere laxative properties with a newly used concept in understanding drug research known as network of pharmacology . It studies drugs and its limitations. This concept helped us understand the main active components and their corresponding targets that can help in therapeutic applications of complex formulations of a medicine like triphala, which is a combination of three fruits — harad, baheda and amla," Bhushan said, adding, "We found that it helps in building immunity and fights the diseased cells, thus helping a patient improve. "

With people increasingly turning to natural remedies like yoga, ayurveda is also gaining momentum as an alternative medicine, what with the overuse of antibiotics and other adverse effects of regular medicines. Considering the need to bring in cheaper drugs with high efficacy, SHS undertook the study where the new concept helps in studying complex relationships, formulations between bioactives, targets, diseases and genes that helps in proving the curing qualities of the traditional drug.

"Now, we are looking forward to validate this study by testing triphala's medicinal value in subjects. We have already written to AYUSH and will be publishing the study in international research journals as this is a first-of-its kind research, which shows that ayurveda can save the lives of people suffering from high-mortality diseases," Bhushan informed.

Dr Atul Rakshe, secretary general of International Ayurveda Association, said, "This is good news for all of us. We should conduct many such research studies with the help of pharmacology. Triphala was always seen in poor light as it was a medicine used in constipation. But, we hope that this study will force people to change their outlook." The Ministry of AYUSH was all praise for the study, too, with Union minister Shripad Naik saying, "We are extremely enthusiastic about the breakthrough and are waiting to discuss the details to understand how triphala can be put to use. Funding will be made accordingly ."

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby RoyG » 19 Jun 2015 06:05

Securing foreign hydrocarbon reserves is a high stakes game that India may not have to play sometime in the near future. Despite hydrogen, ammonia, electricity, and mass transit technologies become more efficient for daily transportation, industrial processes and strategic systems like fighter planes, tanks, missiles, etc. still require hydrocarbons.



Audi and Sunfire have just come out with E-Diesel technology building on well known processes. This IMO, this technology will be a game changer.

We can use high temperature reactors to produce it on an industrial scale.

http://www-pub.iaea.org/MTCD/Meetings/P ... gramme.pdf

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Manny » 21 Jun 2015 05:56

Image

Yoga Needed for Pot-bellied Rich, Not Poor: Lalu Prasad

LOL.This piece of garbage douchebag epitomizes the political left of India and the congress party that represents these douchebags.

http://www.newindianexpress.com/nation/ ... 875500.ece

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby nawabs » 02 Jul 2015 06:07

Maharashtra dubs madrassas 'non-schools'

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 902687.cms
The Maharashtra government has classified madrassas in Maharashtra as non-schools and has directed the district administrations to declare madrassa students as "out-of-school children".

A letter to this effect has been sent by Jayshree Mukherjee, principal secretary of the minority affairs department, to Nand Kumar, principal secretary, school education and sports department.

The department of school education has planned a massive survey on July 4 to identify out-of-school children in the state and bring them into mainstream education. State chief secretary Swadheen Kshatriya had issued a detailed notification to this effect on May 20, but no mention of madrassas was made.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby johneeG » 02 Jul 2015 15:26

Sagar G wrote:Ramayana not a work of fiction

Ramsevak Kol, a tribe from the Sidhi district of Madhya Pradesh, stands head and shoulders above other Indians. Genetic studies prove that he is one of the descendants of King Guha of Ramayana. An international team of researchers consisting of geneticists, anthropologists, archaeologists and historians have found that Ramayana, written 10,000 years ago, is a chronicle of events and characters recorded by Sage Valmiki and not a work of fiction.

The mystery behind the characters in Ramayana has been solved by a team led by Dr Gyaneshwer Chaubey, ace genetic scientist of the Estonian Biocentre in Estonia. A three-year long research by Dr Chaubey and his team drawn out from Centre for Cellular and Molecular Biology, Hyderabad, Delhi University, Indian Institute of Technology-Kharagpur and Institute of Scientific Research on Vedas has found that the Bhils, Gonds and the Kols, categorised as Scheduled Castes and Tribes by the modern day administrators of India are the true descendants of characters featured in Ramayana. The peer reviewed scientific paper authored by the team has been published by PLOS ONE, a respected scientific portal.

The Kol tribe, found mainly in areas like Mirzapur, Varanasi, Banda and Allahabad in Uttar Pradesh, are the descendants of the Kol mentioned in Ramayana, according to Dr Chaubey and his team. Remember Guha, the chieftain of Sringiverapuram who helped Lord Rama, Sita and Laksmana cross the Ganga during their journey to the forests? “Guha, the Nishad King, is the ancestor of the present day Kol tribe we found in these regions. This ancestry was established by genetic studies. These groups of people carry the basic indigenous genetic traits of India. Ramsevak and thousands like him spread across the States of UP, MP, Odisha, Chhattisgargh are the true descendants of Lord Rama and his contemporaries,” Dr Chaubey told The Pioneer from Tartu in Estonia via video conferencing.

Dr Chaubey and Prof VR Rao, an anthropologist in Delhi University, said that the studies proved that these groups of people have maintained their genetic continuity for more than 10,000 years. “This again sets at rest the Aryan invasion theory. There is no inflow into the genetic traits of these tribes from outside elements,” said Saroj Bala, a specialist in Vedic and Ramayana studies, who shot into fame by calculating the date of birth of Lord Rama based on planetary positions.

Prof Rao said the studies confirmed that the characters mentioned by Valmiki in Ramayana are real life characters. “King Dasaratha, Rama and others were not fictional characters,” he said. Dr S Kalyanaraman, an Indologist of repute, said the Kols are the iron smelters about whom there are mentions in Indus Script excavated from the banks of Indus as well as River Saraswathi.

“This paper by Gyaneswer Chaube and team is an attempt to explain the roots of Hindu civilisation which has been distorted by creating false ethnic identities by the categorisation of people,” said Dr Kalyanaraman. He said a comprehensive study incorporating all tribes should be undertaken which would prove that the breaking up of essential unity of Bharatiya identity based on caste and ethnicity are academic fiction with no basis and a distortion of the history of ancient India.


I am sceptical about such studies. 'True descendent of Raama' are Kols? And rest of the Bhaarathiyas came from outside?

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Manny » 03 Jul 2015 21:16

The Confidence Of Hindus

Quote: Rambachan advocates ‘self-critical humility’ as the appropriate approach for Hindus in this context; I say the days of being meek and mild are over.

In the context of Hinduphobia, this unlevel playing field on which we are forced to compete, this negative baggage that others saddle Hinduism with, developing a strong, positive Hindu identity founded on pride and confidence is absolutely necessary. Confidence counters bigotry and gives us the courage and conviction to stand up for ourselves, our tradition and our identity.Confidence is what allows us to define ourselves rather than letting others define us.

Confidence does not mean fundamentalism or fanaticism; it does not mean violence or the issuance of fatwas. It means that we will fight scholarship with scholarship (but we absolutely do not accept that the only valid scholarship is that which is produced by academic cartels in the Ivy League and other elite Western universities); we will fight bias in the media through media channels of our own; we will counter stereotypes in popular culture and art through new art forms of our own; we will proceed with gharwapsi ("Homecoming" reconversion) programmes of our own so long as predatory proselytization continues unchecked and unimpeded.

We will not let our traditions of yoga and meditation be looted, distorted, digested and appropriated by the West and we will not concede sovereignty over the definition and depiction of our dharma to outside interests.

http://swarajyamag.com/culture/the-conf ... of-hindus/

A brilliant article!

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Manny » 03 Jul 2015 21:17

:rotfl: johneeG, that theory is as valid as the Aryan Invaion theory or that JEsus died and went to heaven theory and history!

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Tuvaluan » 04 Jul 2015 00:14

http://www.outlookindia.com/article/in-which-mr-haridas-edged-out-mrs-haridas/294769


Finally all those who lied in our history books , Romila Thapar and Irfan Habib's ilk are thrown out of ICHR...about time. Maybe this new committee will working on explaining the truth rather than create a new kind of fictional history. They owe it to future generations.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby g.sarkar » 05 Jul 2015 08:59

Do not know where to put this, apologize if already posted:
http://www.newswala.com/Hyderabad-News/ ... 66079.html
Telangana Government to spend Rs. 26 Crore on Iftar, Dinners
Hyderabad, July 2, 2015: The Telangana Government will spend Rs. 26 crore to host Iftar and dinners for Muslims across the State in view of holy month of Ramzan. Addressing a press conference after chairing a review meeting on Ramzan arrangements on Thursday, Chief Minister K Chandrashekar Rao announced that the State Government would host Iftar and dinners across Telangana State on July 8. He also announced that the government would pay monthly salary of Rs. 1,000 each to Imams and Maozans of 5,000 mosques in the State. The government has earmarked Rs. 12 crore for the purpose. KCR announced that clothes will be distributed among 1.95 lakh poor Muslim families across the State on July 8. At the rate of Rs. 500 per family, the government will spend Rs. 9.75 crore on clothing. The main official Iftar party will be hosted at Nizam College Grounds on July 8 wherein nearly 5,000 people, including VIPs, will be invited. The Ambassadors of Arab countries will also be invited for the Iftar Dinner. On the same day, Iftar-cum-Dinner will be arranged at 100 mosques in the Greater Hyderabad limits. Similarly, Iftar-Dinner will be hosted at 1,000 mosques across the State on July 8..........
Gautam

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby schinnas » 05 Jul 2015 09:19

ramana wrote:
ramana wrote:One thing to think about in terms of Empire and Congress party.

In short terms early on the Congress party was trying to establish an imperial policy by creating a power center in Delhi which is in harmony with the far off periphery.
This resulted in the drive to establish Congress party governments in the periphery states.
The imperial impulse/driver was to be the Congress party system of C-System.
The first signs of disharmony between Kerala in 1956 elections which elected CPI govt. at the state level. The govt. was promptly dismissed by Congress.
We then saw other signs of disharmony, language agitations, linguistic re-organization etc.
Yet the disharmony manifested itself with rout of Congress govts. in states by 1967 elections. And went on to threaten the Center leading to Emergency ten years later.

This harmony-disharmony led to coalition govts., over three decades e.g. United Front and later NDA and UPA.

2014 elections is a landmark for it resolved the disharmony between Center and Periphery except in some states and re-established stability.

NaMo mantra is to work even with disharmonious centers in the Periphery to strengthen the nation and preserve the Empire or nation-state.
This is why he is not using the mandate he got in 2014 to dismiss Governors or destabilize state governments.



What NaMo has to transform this Empire into is an entity that finds no benefit in secession i.e. every part on the periphery keeps the Center strong. In other words a 'hub and spokes' model that make up the wheel.
He has already achieved this partly by being elected from a periphery state and win hugely all over the country. His electoral map replicates the Maratha map. It needs to proceed gradually and expand.


ramana-ji,
India is the world's foremost ideological state (ideally for and of dharma). India's core ideals are a pursuit for understanding, realizing and finally be one with the Supreme Reality and modelling all aspects of life as a way to or as a reflection of this ideal. Equally important is the celebration of diversity - not only in Spiritual paths, but in ways of life, in social structures, in customs and traditions, in languages, food, arts, culture and even in ways of governance. So any great leader of Bharath will not do justice to their role, if they define it by simplistic outcomes or tactical goals. Regardless of how well intention-ed, powerful or skilled, India's leader will be a success if and only if they get these two ideals and have their actions reflect these.

For NaMo, it is clear that he is reviving India's stature as Jagat Guru. However, I wasn't sure about his commitment to diversity (which is in general is a problem with many RSS followers, imho). Gandhiji on the other hand was a great leader who while inspired by India's spiritual strength laid lot more emphasis on the second ideal - of accepting and celebrating diversity. His ideals of panchayat raj - decentralization of power, local self governance, 3 language system to avoid imposition of one artificial national language, etc., were all laudable. Indira Gandhi while in private conversations with Spiritual leaders understood India's role as Jagat Guru, was very tactical in her functioning and spent her energies in securing India's strategic and geographic boundaries and abolishing economic disparity (Buddha smiles, elimination of zamindari system, nationalization of banks, 1971, empowerment of RAW and armed forces, etc) which saw India remain in tact and society largely cohesive during very challenging times. (She had her own mistakes arising out of her personality flaws which are beyond scope of this post).

Of late, there are increasing signs that NaMo might very well become the first mass leader of India in recent times who might actually realize both these ideals and contribute substantially to both. His emphasis on de-centralization of power, collective decision making of border states in foreign relations that impact border states (ex: WB and Bangladesh), embracing of minorities without indulging in cheap appeasements, etc., are all great signs which augur well for the Nation and will go towards evolving a model of governance that will truly fit Bharat's core ideals. when that happens, along with effiency in governance resulting in economic integration and prosperity, secession will be an issue of the past.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Prem » 15 Jul 2015 07:40

http://www.livemint.com/Opinion/Hi8y34o ... India.html
A garland of rivers across India

nter-linking the great rivers of India is a dream that has been around for a while. Many problems that confound the country—flood control, irrigation, limiting droughts and boosting farm output—can be sorted out by linking the country’s rivers in two big garlands. This requires a massive amount of political and financial capital, both scarce commodities. There are signs that the Narendra Modi government may be willing to invest both.
Viewed dispassionately, it is a miracle that India’s irrigation potential rose from 22.6 million hectares (mha) at independence to 113 mha by the end of the 11th five-year plan. This is not enough. As the country’s population grows, the need for better irrigated farmland will only increase. In this context, there are limits to what small and medium irrigation projects can do. While these projects are important for conserving water, their returns from investment are low and their potential is somewhat limited. Beyond a point, India’s geography dictates what needs to be done in this area.
While India boasts of some impressive irrigation projects—including the Bhakra Nangal and Narmada dams—a look at the map of the country shows the strong correlation between water-stressed regions and the distribution of water resources. Most of the water available for irrigation—from rivers, perennial and rain-fed—is to be found in the southwestern and northeastern regions. In contrast, the demand for water is largely in northern India and the eastern part of peninsular India. Local irrigation projects cannot do much unless innovative projects—such as the inter-linking of rivers—are carried out.
Here, by fortuitous circumstance, geography favours plans. A north to south inter-linking of rivers is physically not possible: the barrier imposed by the Vindhya mountains makes it prohibitively expensive to lift water along the north and south axis. It is also unnecessary. The river-water linking plan—one for peninsular India and the other for linking rivers from the east to the north—is an ideal solution for what India needs.
Between 2003 and now, precious little has been done for implementing the project. In the first National Democratic Alliance (NDA) government, a task force on inter-linking of rivers was created under Suresh Prabhu, the current railways minister; nothing much took place beyond the detailed project reports on individual river linking projects. In April, the second NDA government once again created another task force for inter-linking of rivers. The issue now is to move forward instead of replicating the same experience once again. There are plenty of issues to resolve, ones that need political attention.
For one, building consensus among states is essential if these projects are to take off. There are dozens of links in the overall inter-linking plan. One does not need to imagine hard what is required to get those projects started. States have to be convinced of the benefits—even if they are well known. For another some bit of environmental assessment is necessary in case of a project of this magnitude. This need not be of the destructive variety that is designed to derail projects. What is needed is a careful scientific assessment of the project and its impact on the environment, one that is best carried out by academicians.The other—yet unclear—issue is one of finding the financial and other resources for the task. River inter-linking is an expensive business: from building the link canals to the monitoring and maintenance infrastructure needed requires a tidy sum. Annual budgetary outlays will not do the trick. If one is to create innovative financial schemes required—such as bonds—then investors will need a credible answer on returns to their investment and credible guarantees they want.None of these issues have been sorted as of now. Playing committee games is an interesting sport but it does precious little for Indians wanting access to water and irrigation. The government needs to get cracking if this project is to succeed at all.

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Paul » 18 Jul 2015 21:49

Not sure where to ut this..Rare picture of anti cow slaughter efforts in late 19th century

Image

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Manny » 19 Jul 2015 21:01

http://www.desicontrarian.com/?p=1

DECONSTRUCTING WENDY DONIGER

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Re: Indian Interests (09-08-2014)

Postby Manny » 19 Jul 2015 21:03

Paul wrote:Not sure where to ut this..Rare picture of anti cow slaughter efforts in late 19th century

Image


Thank Paul. I hope I can borrow it.


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