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Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby TSJones » 04 Jan 2017 10:00

^^^^
currently there are no nukes in so korea. there are none in japan.

and there are none on any US a/c carrier.

there are none on any US submarine except for the Ohio class.

there are only two ohio class subs on patrol at any given time.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby abhik » 04 Jan 2017 10:57

Only 2 Ohio class submarines on patrol out of the 14(?), I was expecting something more like 50%.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby ramana » 04 Jan 2017 23:16

Prem wrote:
NRao wrote:


Trump team have indicated they will encourage Japan and SOKO's strategic independence . Even Biden has whispered in Chinese Ears that Japan can go Nuclear within few months whenever the decision is made. From our POV, Japan, SOKO and Vietnam all 3 should have strategic saw to cut through PRC paws and toes pinching its selfmade foes.



If post War Europe had UK, France, Russia and US as nuke powers, Asia with more rogue nations in alliance with US can have more nuke powers for balance.

US has China and Pak as its allies
India is only other Asian power.
Russia is too Eurocentric to be an Asian power.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby ramana » 05 Jan 2017 04:26

Article in India Today

China is rattled by India's Agni tests:

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/chin ... 49908.html

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby ramana » 05 Jan 2017 05:32

X-P...
Cosmo_R wrote:
ramana wrote:A relevant editorial on the A4 and A5 tests

China rattled over Agni tests

Long time ago when I used MS Word it would suggest Agony for Agni.

Looks like China has that now.


Add the potential 'Israeli Samson' option to that and you've got checkmate: if Pakistan nukes us, we're taking you down with us.

I've got nothing to lose, madman (Nixon in 1973) theory works as a deterrent
.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby Ashokk » 05 Jan 2017 11:53

If India makes more long-range ICBMs, Beijing may help Pakistan do the same, says Chinese state media
NEW DELHI: Beijing wants to communicate the message that if India increases the number of its long-range missiles, it will help "all-weather friend" Pakistan do the same, Chinese media said.

The context to this comment was India's final test firing of the Agni-IV+ inter-continental ballistic missile (ICBM) on Monday.

"If the UN Security Council has no objection over this (ICBMs), let it be. The range of Pakistan's nuclear missiles will also see an increase," the state-run Global Times said in an editorial, hinting that China will help Pakistan come on par with India.

News outfits in China are often used by the government to convey its opinions or to test the waters or to deliver rebukes it can't through diplomatic channels.

Global Times's editorial further batted for Pakistan saying it should be accorded the same nuclear privileges as India.

"If the Western countries accept India as a nuclear country and are indifferent to the nuclear race between India and Pakistan, China will not stand out and stick rigidly to those nuclear rules as necessary. At this time, Pakistan should have those privileges in nuclear development that India has," the editorial said.

On the one hand, the editorial said China isn't bothered by India's testing of missiles that can carry nuclear warheads, but on the other it did sound like Beijing was perturbed by Agni-IV, especially as it came close on the heels of the successful test-firing of Agni-V+ .

"...Chinese don't feel India's development has posed any big threat to it. And India wouldn't be considered as China's main rival in the long run," the editorial first says.

"But it (China) will not sit still if India goes too far...New Delhi understands that it does little good to itself if the Sino-Indian relations are ruined by any geopolitical tricks," the editorial says later.

Aside from these issues, the editorial alleged that India "has broken the UN's limits" on how many nuclear weapons and long-range ballistic missiles it can produce.

"The US and some Western countries have also bent the rules on its nuclear plans. New Delhi is no longer satisfied with its nuclear capability and is seeking intercontinental ballistic missiles that can target anywhere in the world and then it can land on an equal footing with the UN Security Council's five permanent members," the editorial said.

On Monday, India successfully tested - for the final time - its long-range ballistic missile, Agni-IV, which can travel 4,000 kilometres. No long before that, it successfully test-fired Agni-V that has a range of more than 5,000 kilometres and can reach Europe and the northernmost parts of China

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby LokeshC » 05 Jan 2017 12:49

Excellent strategic move by Cheeni blothels. They should give bakis mijjiles that can reach anywhere in the world, it will solve a lot of problems for us, and while they are making all these noises, please remember to change diapers, because it stinks of fear and immaturity.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby SSridhar » 05 Jan 2017 13:01



I am surprised by that. Why does Pakistan need an ICBM of that range? Does it not already cover the whole of India by the missiles transferred by China through North Korea? Is PRC threatening the US and its Western allies now? Is Pakistan a proxy for China against the US as well? Does it now want to do overtly what it has been doing all along under the burqa? Is it now a no-holds barred situation? Has China given up all pretensions?

Many things are clear from this open admission.
  • Proves, by its own admission, that Pakistan is China's proxy vis-a-vis India
  • The reason why China transferred nuclear weapons, their technology and delivery systems to Pakistan
  • The reason why China opposes India in all world fora
  • Above all, it confirms the theory that we have been discussing here lately that China is playing a huge Power Game to confine India to the South Asian quagmire and also to shrink our influence further even within the region.

The Thucydide's trap is very visible here, that of a clash between emerged and emerging power. That is the same between the US & China and between China & India.

Though the Chinese reaction may be over the board as far as helping Pakistan to get ICBM capabilities, it voiced nervousness at the very first test of Agni-V. When it was first tested on April 19, 2012, the Chinese newspapers variously described it as a strong political message from New Delhi and a wake-up call for Beijing to boost its preparedness. The launch was described in commentaries in several State-run newspapers as “a political missile” aimed at China, serving a “reminder” to it to be ready to confront “more complicated security challenges.” In the lead-up to the launch, several newspapers close to the Communist Party, including the official People's Daily , the Global Times and the Guangzhou Daily , all published articles that struck a similar tone. Analysts said the articles reflected a growing sense of distrust and mutual suspicion on account of a continuing military build-up on both sides of the border. The Global Times in an editorial, warned India not to “overestimate its strength”. However, China itself tested a 14000-km multiple warhead (10 warheads) DF-41 in late August 2012.

China's diplomacy is a bundle of huge contradictions and always enjoys its foot-in-the-mouth.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby SSridhar » 05 Jan 2017 13:13

I will recall Sardar Patel's prescient words to Nehru 66 years back, (Nov 7, 1950)

The Chinese Government has tried to delude us by professions of peaceful intention. . . indicates that even though we regard ourselves as the friends of China, the Chinese do not regard us as their friends. . . we have practically been alone in championing the cause of Chinese entry into UN. Inspite of this, China is not convinced about our disinterestedness; it continues to regard us with suspicion . . . wild insinuation that our attitude is determined by foreign influences. It looks as though it is not a friend speaking in that language but a potential enemy. . . . We can, therefore, safely assume that very soon they will disown all the stipulations which Tibet has entered into with us in the past. That throws into the melting pot all frontier and commercial settlements with Tibet on which we have been functioning and acting during the last half a century. . . . Recent and bitter history also tells us that Communism is no shield against imperialism and that the communists are as good or as bad imperialists as any other. . . . Chinese irredentism and communist imperialism are different from the expansionism or imperialism of the western powers. The former has a cloak of ideology which makes it ten times more dangerous. In the guise of ideological expansion lie concealed racial, national or historical claims. . . Thus, for the first time, after centuries, India's defence has to concentrate itself on two fronts simultaneously. . . . a communist China which has definite ambitions and aims and which does not, in any way, seem friendly disposed towards us. . . . In my judgement the situation is one which we cannot afford either to be complacent or to be vacillating. . . . The question of China's entry into the UN. In view of the rebuff which China has given us and the method which it has followed in dealing with Tibet, I am doubtful whether we can advocate its claim any longer. . . . we might have to consider whether we should not enter into closer association with Burma in order to strengthen the latter in its dealings with China. I do not rule out the possibility that, before applying pressure on us, China might apply pressure on Burma.


India sponsored 40 resolutions in UNGA for PRC’s admission in the period 1950-’58, ignoring Sardar Patel's strong and reasoned advice. Did the Chinese bear India any gift? Yes, of course. In c. 1958, China completed Tibet-Sinkiang Highway through Aksai Chin

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby kittoo » 05 Jan 2017 14:19

Either China is extremely stupid (at least vis a vis India) or the Agni tests have kicked them in the balls. Why do we care if they provide more range to the Pakis? Paki missiles already cover whole of India. If the Chinis want to give the Paki headache to many more countries too, please go ahead.

And by God if there is one guy whose name gets my blood boiling, its that blithering idiot Nehru. That a$$hole screwed India on both Pakistan and China front.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby jagga » 05 Jan 2017 17:37

kittoo wrote:Either China is extremely stupid (at least vis a vis India) or the Agni tests have kicked them in the balls. Why do we care if they provide more range to the Pakis? Paki missiles already cover whole of India. If the Chinis want to give the Paki headache to many more countries too, please go ahead.

And by God if there is one guy whose name gets my blood boiling, its that blithering idiot Nehru. That a$$hole screwed India on both Pakistan and China front.

Agni tests have kicked them in the balls. Flustlated China!

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby Amoghvarsha » 05 Jan 2017 17:48

Good ji.Provide Pakis with longer range mijjiles so they become everyone's headache.Good for us onlee.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby SSridhar » 05 Jan 2017 18:49

China’s stance on terror self-defeating: India - The Hindu
India on Wednesday said that China is following “double standard” on terrorism and asked Beijing to support its campaign to blacklist Pakistan-based terror mastermind Masood Azhar.

Addressing the mid-term press conference of the MEA to mark two-and-a-half years of the government of Prime Minister Narendra Modi, Minister of State for External Affairs M.J. Akbar said China’s block at the 1267 committee of the UN Security Council that prevented India from blacklisting the terror boss was “self-defeating”.

‘Listen to world’s voice’

“China should listen to the voice of the world and we hope that Beijing can be persuaded to see the evil of the menace,” said Mr. Akbar and added, “as a responsible and mature nation, China will understand the double standards of this self-defeating purpose,” said Mr. Akbar.

Reiterating the government’s position on terror, Mr. Akbar said India had zero tolerance for terrorism. “Talks and terror do not, cannot go together,” he said, emphasising that the government would consider dialogue with Pakistan only after cross-border terror ends.

The press conference, led by both Ministers of State for External Affairs, V.K. Singh, and Mr. Akbar projected the diplomatic trajectory of the Modi government since May 2014 and acknowledged that despite tranquillity on India-China border, there remained “divergences” in bilateral ties, including China’s stand on Pakistan-based terror outfits such as Jaish-e-Mohammed (JeM).

Mr. Akbar’s was the first Minister-level response from India after China blocked India’s New Year eve bid to blacklist Masood Azhar under the counter-terror 1267 committee of the UN Security Council. Following the block, Pakistan had criticised India’s move as “politically motivated”.


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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby SSridhar » 05 Jan 2017 19:20

China responds to MoS, MEA MJ Akbar

China justifies its stand on Masood Azhar, denies double standards - PTI
China on Thursday dismissed as “untrue” allegations of double standards by India by blocking its bid to list Jaish-e-Mohammed (JeM) leader Masood Azhar as global terrorist by the United Nations, claiming that it had adopted a “just, objective and professional” attitude in deciding the matter.

“With regard to the listing matter of the security council 1267 committee, the so-called double standards adopted by China on this relevant issue is not true. We take action based on solid evidence that is the standard upheld by us,” Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Geng Shuang told media briefing here.

Responding to remarks made by Minister of State for External Affairs M.J. Akbar on Azhar’s issue during the press conference in New Delhi on Wednesday, Mr. Geng said, “We have taken a responsible and constructive part in relevant discussion in a professional and objective way.”

Members differ on issue

“Relevant members differed on this issue. The purpose of China to put forward technical hold on that issue is to create enough time for the committee and relevant parties to consult with each other on the relevant issue,” he said.

‘As per 1267 panel rules’

When pointed out that China was the only member among the 1267 committee members to have objected, Mr. Geng said: “Relevant attitude and action of China comply with the resolution of the UNSC and rules of procedure of the committee.”

“China takes a very objective and just and professional attitude on that. Up to now, the Committee is yet to come to an agreement on this issue and we would like stay in communication and coordination with all relevant parties, including India, on this,” he said. {See the liar China caught with its pants down on the 'difference of opinion'}


The issue remained unresolved even after the two countries have held several rounds of talks on this issue.

Elaborating on China’s position, Mr. Geng said, “It is regrettable that an agreement is yet to be made. Relevant actions taken by China in the committee is to safeguard the authority and effectiveness of the committee.”

“It is out of the responsible attitude China will continue to stay in communication with all relevant parties including India in accordance with the security council resolution and rules of the procedures of the committee,” Geng said.


We are victims of terror

At the same time he said, “I also want to stress that both China and India are victims of terrorism. We have the same purpose and share the same goal on the issue of counter-terrorism and we hope to enhance cooperation and communication with the Indian side to uphold peace and security of the region.” {What can one say to such blatant lying on pious intentions of China?}

On the comments by Minister of State for External Affairs, General (retd.) V.K. Singh that India’s engagement with China under close developmental partnership continued to expand despite differences, Mr. Geng has said Beijing too wants to develop strategic partnership of cooperation with India.

“With regard to bilateral relationship with India, we all know that both China and India are major developing countries and emerging markets in the world,” he said.

“To build a more closely knit relationship for development serves the fundamental interest of the two countries and two peoples and it is also conducive to the stability of the region. We are also willing to develop strategic partnership of cooperation with India. This position remains unchanged,” he said.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby venug » 05 Jan 2017 19:21

India should take lead and unite Tibetan freedom fighters and Uighur freedom fighters and host a conclave for these leaders in India and form a coalition of freedom fighters against the oppression of Chinese. And see if they have any need of arms.


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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby Varoon Shekhar » 05 Jan 2017 20:45

"That is the same between the US & China and between China & India.}

The US hasn't confined or seriously tried to confine, China to East Asia or to any part of the globe. And positively not economically, with the massive trade between the two countries.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby Varoon Shekhar » 05 Jan 2017 20:52



Somewhat slimy remarks about India spurring Pakistan on to an arms race, by testing Agni 5!

But then, what about China causing, at the least partly, India to become involved in an arms race with China!

"China doesn't buy that argument" India doesn't buy any of China's arguments.

Yet another attempt to equate, and confine, India to Pakistan. With an approving quote from some Chinese spokesman.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby Varoon Shekhar » 05 Jan 2017 21:09

If CNN had any objectivity at all, it would go into some detail about India's threat perception of China, covering army, navy and air force. Then chronicle the missile development and testing of both countries in the last 60 years; compare China's nuclear testing with India's; discuss the important Tibet question, and the Chinese infrastructure there. Go into how India perceives South East Asia, and also India's perception of the Chinese presence in the Indian Ocean, and what it means for Indian security. CNN is being mindless and parochial in that article.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby ramana » 05 Jan 2017 21:52

venug wrote:India should take lead and unite Tibetan freedom fighters and Uighur freedom fighters and host a conclave for these leaders in India and form a coalition of freedom fighters against the oppression of Chinese. And see if they have any need of arms.



More useful is to have a World Buddhist conclave in India.

NaMo already started on this initiative.


I recommend watching the 2011 movie Shaolin. It shows how Buddhism brought civilization to the Sin Tzu inspired Chinese warlords.

China is a warlord society.
Mao and current crop are just modern versions of warlords.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby ramana » 05 Jan 2017 22:02

kittoo wrote:Either China is extremely stupid (at least vis a vis India) or the Agni tests have kicked them in the balls. Why do we care if they provide more range to the Pakis? Paki missiles already cover whole of India. If the Chinis want to give the Paki headache to many more countries too, please go ahead.

And by God if there is one guy whose name gets my blood boiling, its that blithering idiot Nehru. That a$$hole screwed India on both Pakistan and China front.


China was given to understand by US Clinton gang in the 1996 time frame, that they will be the Asian overlords with US as uber overlords.
That's what G2 is all about.

China transferred nukes to TSP to ensure eventual de-nuclearization of Indian Subcontinent. And to NoKo to come up with a similar plan for East Asia.
The biggest threat to China are US nukes. So Korean peninsula non-nuclear pact between four powers: US, China, NoKo and SoKo is crucial. This removes the tactical nukes away.

Strategic weapons are part of big arms control and here its a tussle between US and Russia.
Others (UK, France) have minor role and will get nuked for gratis.

However on the Indian Sub-Continent arena:

1998 tests, MND, and the Agni missiles give China agony.

The A4 and A5 missiles give teeth to the MND clause about attacks by countries in alliance against India.
This rattles their bones.

BTW its high time NaMo reactivated the Balochistan and PoK project now that the Chinese intents are very clear.

And shut those MEA morons who eat French apple tarts and sip champagne in foreign capitals and ignore desi dahi papdi chaat.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby Varoon Shekhar » 05 Jan 2017 22:04

^
Agree. There has been an attempt to downplay or ignore the impact of Buddhism, and hence partially of India, on Chinese culture and society. And this despite the influence of Buddhism being entirely peaceful. Not a drop of blood was shed in the transmission of Buddhism, and all its related art, literature and philosophy, on China and the rest of East Asia.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby Bart S » 05 Jan 2017 23:22

LokeshC wrote:Excellent strategic move by Cheeni blothels. They should give bakis mijjiles that can reach anywhere in the world, it will solve a lot of problems for us, and while they are making all these noises, please remember to change diapers, because it stinks of fear and immaturity.


This threat is not directed directly at India but at the west. The threat is, cap India's delivery systems or we will make sure Pakis get the means to deliver missiles to your continent just like North Korea.

India needs to counter by making it very explicit that any MAD counterattack to WMD will include in it's scope anybody who was responsible of transferring nuclear technology and delivery systems to China. And through unofficial channels, leave nobody in doubt that we are referring to China and NK.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby Bheeshma » 05 Jan 2017 23:39

US just needs to move THAAD shield to Japan and SoKo. Even if pakis get a 4000 km missile what is it they will do? Nothing at all. Suddenly all the IMF loans and baksheesh will stop and china cannot support pakis economically like the west. Its an empty threat directed at US.

Though I think Vietnam could use Agni-1/2 and Brahmos urgently.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby Vivek K » 06 Jan 2017 00:01

India needs to consider Balochistan for Pak and the Ujghurs for China. Sitting and fretting will do nothing. Merely hyping Doval = Chanakya will achieve nothing. One time speeches accomplish even less. Formulation of a coherent, long term strategy is what is needed to keep Pak and China off balance. And it is time to raise the profile of alliance with Vietnam to the level of the China-Pak alliance.

India needs to invest in a sister ship to the Vikrant and dedicate the two to the eastern seaboard so that one of the two is available at all times with a potent CBG.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby sanjaykumar » 06 Jan 2017 00:12

India can help Pakistan achieve ICBM capability.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby venug » 06 Jan 2017 00:22

Why cant we facilitate Vietnam gain nukes and test for us, NoKo does it for TSP if I am not mistaken. That would be more beneficial. We can also get to be good boys and get into NSG while happily test nukes via Vietnam.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby pankajs » 06 Jan 2017 00:34

Did Vietnam ask for nukes?

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby ramana » 06 Jan 2017 00:53

venug wrote:Why cant we facilitate Vietnam gain nukes and test for us, NoKo does it for TSP if I am not mistaken. That would be more beneficial. We can also get to be good boys and get into NSG while happily test nukes via Vietnam.



VenuG, Puranas give two examples of how it can backfire:

1) Bhasmasura - could be used against the giver. Soviet Union found this out in 1960s!
2) Ashwatthama- irresponsible usage!

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby Lisa » 06 Jan 2017 01:59

Also must not forget pandas other achievements vis-a-vis world security,

"In 1985, Saudi Arabia covertly purchased 36 CSS-2 East Wind intermediate range ballistic missiles and nine missile launchers from China."

http://thediplomat.com/2016/11/china-an ... ense-ties/

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby IndraD » 06 Jan 2017 02:49

Lisa wrote:Also must not forget pandas other achievements vis-a-vis world security,

"In 1985, Saudi Arabia covertly purchased 36 CSS-2 East Wind intermediate range ballistic missiles and nine missile launchers from China."

http://thediplomat.com/2016/11/china-an ... ense-ties/



Where are they and who will fire them when needed ! :eek:
Last heard their F 16 were being flown over Yemen by UK & Pk pilots.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby RKumar » 06 Jan 2017 02:53

^^ whats the expiring date of these missiles, after certain date the reliability goes down. It is almost 30 years since first batch provided. Could it be China is still providing the replacements for these?

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby ramana » 06 Jan 2017 03:12

RKumar wrote:^^ whats the expiring date of these missiles, after certain date the reliability goes down. It is almost 30 years since first batch provided. Could it be China is still providing the replacements for these?



KSA got a newer batch of replacements. We had the reports in the KSA thread....

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby Lisa » 06 Jan 2017 03:14

More to the point, what sort of warhead do you mate with reference to CEP? And nobody complained!

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby SSridhar » 06 Jan 2017 05:16

The CSS-2 deal was made in the mid-80s and China transferred about three dozen of them by early 1990 for a consideration USD 3.5B and are located in the Rab-al-Khali desert. The Chinese were even then working on converting the liquid-fuelled CSS-2 to solid-fuelled rocket (CSS-5 or DF-21) and by 2007 or 2008 timeframe, the Saudi missiles were replaced too. Obviously, kafir Chinese missile technicians are located in KSA. These CSS-2 were also placed by the Second Artillery in Tibet against us and were replaced in the same time frame to DF-21. The inaccurate CSS-2s were like the SCUDs and conventional ammunition would have been worthless. That's where the Pakistanis come in with their China-made nuclear weapons which were anyway bankrolled by KSA with that intention. DF-21s are of course more accurate but conventional ammunitions would not have a positive cost-benefit ratio. Besides, it is a prestige issue for KSA especially after the Iran nuclear issue and they have made open statements about a nuclear programme. So, China overtly transferred the delivery system to KSA and covertly transferred the nukes through Pakistan.
Last edited by ramana on 06 Jan 2017 06:13, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: ramana

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby SSridhar » 06 Jan 2017 06:01

Beijing bars Tibetans from Dalai Lama event, seizes passports - ToI
Beijing has blocked thousands of Tibetans from attending a Buddhist event in Bodh Gaya which is being attended by Dalai Lama, according to reports from Nepal and China.

China's state-run Global Times reported earlier this week that the "renewed" travel restrictions were imposed to battle terrorism and separatism.

However, according to the Tibetan government-in-exile, such travel restrictions have never been imposed by China at least in the recent past.

Chinese government has reportedly begun confiscating passports from Tibetans in Tibet since November 2016.

Nepali media reported that "China has reportedly issued a temporary travel restriction on its citizens visiting Nepal and asked its travel agencies and airlines to cancel all travel plans and bookings made until January 10 with immediate effect".

Chinese authorities are also said to have instructed the family members of pilgrims to inform them to return to Tibet by January 3 before the Dalai Lama begins his teachings.

Sources quoted a Tibetan pilgrim who chose to remain anonymous as saying that the authorities had taken signatures from their family members to make sure that the pilgrims have been informed and that they must return to Tibet.


"Distance cannot dampen the sacred ties between a lama and a disciple. You can all pray from the far-flung areas in Tibet and I assure you that you will receive the Kalachakra empowerment," said the Dalai Lama who arrived in Bodhgaya on December 28.

Kalachakra means wheel of time and is used to refer to a complex teaching in Buddhism.

ramana
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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby ramana » 06 Jan 2017 06:15

The KSA possessing undeclared Paki nukes for declared Chinese missiles could be one reason for the ambiguous US nuke deal with Iran.

Can't de-nuke Iran without KSA also being de-nuked.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby sanjaykumar » 06 Jan 2017 06:15

So the Chinese find agony in Agni and fear kalchakra kal ka chakar na banjaye.

India thou art mighty yet.

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby SSridhar » 06 Jan 2017 11:03

ramana wrote:The KSA possessing undeclared Paki nukes for declared Chinese missiles could be one reason for the ambiguous US nuke deal with Iran.

Can't de-nuke Iran without KSA also being de-nuked.

The fact is that both the maal gaadi and the maal were transferred to KSA right under the US nose. The Al Yamamah Palace always swarmed with American spies and the US was very close to KSA especially during the 80s & 90s. In the 80s, the Iranian Revolution, Afghan jihad, Iran-Iraq war, Op. Desert Storm etc had brought US-KSA-China-Pakistan very closely. China-KSA & Pakistan-KSA transfers should have taken place with American concurrence only. The rumour is that the Americans inspected the RV of the CSS-2 and DF-21 to satisfy themselves that they could carry only conventional weapons !! :rotfl:

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Re: Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Postby kit » 06 Jan 2017 12:23

https://www.stratfor.com/image/china-there-no-painless-escape-debt

The market will not solve China's oversized debt issue. Though Beijing has taken steps to liberalize its economy in recent years, most roads still lead to the state. It is no coincidence that the bulk of China's debt is owed by state-owned companies to state-owned banks. Aware of this reality, Beijing might be tempted to return to the age-old method of throwing money at the problem. But there are pitfalls in taking this path, too.

For example, the real remedy to China's financial troubles in 1999 was the surge in global demand that fueled double-digit growth, not public funds. Today's problems also exist on a much larger scale. China's GDP amounted to $1 trillion in 1999; now it is 10 times bigger, while the country's debt is nearly 20 times bigger.

Of course, not all of China's debt has to be settled. Most of its loans are still healthy. If Beijing wanted to, it could borrow the funds to recapitalize its banks. At first glance, China's public debt is a manageable 44 percent of GDP, which would allow some room for growth. But if local governments were factored into China's official debt-to-GDP ratios, its public debt would be closer to 90 percent of GDP, placing it up near developed countries in terms of indebtedness and limiting its room to maneuver.

n theory, China could try to inflate away its debt by printing more money. But that would simply shift the burden onto Chinese citizens, a move that would be deeply unpopular at home and abroad. It would also undermine China's own effort to shift its economy toward one based on consumption by eroding the public's purchasing power and weakening the yuan.

There are no easy answers to China's debt problem. The only painless escape would be a wave of economic growth, but at this point that seems unlikely. Achieving growth rates of more than 10 percent is much more difficult for an economy that is already the second largest in the world, and the global economic environment is not half as favorable to China as it was 15 years ago because the developed world is struggling to manage debt problems of its own. At home, Chinese wages are considerably higher, and the economy is less competitive. Because China's working-age population will soon begin shrinking, these wage hikes will make it harder for the country to achieve prodigious growth. Instead, Beijing appears to be on the verge of making a difficult choice: Sacrifice growth (and by extension, political support) to tackle Chinese debt head-on or risk suffering a debt-driven banking crisis


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