India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

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Karan M
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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Karan M » 17 Sep 2015 16:42

ashvin wrote:It really depresses me to read that these liberal academics of Indic origin are all up against Modiji. Why? Why are they obsessed in this vilification? They speak of human rights violation like they live in some Shangrila where human rights have been sacrosanct for centuries. I never really understood these people and their compulsive obsessive anti-India or rather anti-Hindu position.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thirty_pieces_of_silver

While I was there in school I would avoid these people.


Good for you. You retained your sanity, your moral compass and your objectivity.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby amit » 17 Sep 2015 17:13

Karan M wrote:I'll gladly dish the liberal arts community involved in these actions, in these so called institutions especially the Indian origin one, because they have miserably failed in preventing their own group from being a bunch of rabid hinduphobes.


Your choice my friend. You didn't need to write an essay and sneak in a personal attack for good measure to make your point. Don't get me wrong about the personal attack, I don't mind (in fact I don't give damn).

Even though I quoted you my response was more general and I think there are many on this forum who would agree with me.

Incidentally, in case you didn't notice, instead of fuming on this forum I went and stuck my head out and responded on that blog not because I'm a Modi bhakt but because I am a India bhakt. But don't let such minor things distract you.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Karan M » 17 Sep 2015 17:21

amit wrote:
Karan M wrote:I'll gladly dish the liberal arts community involved in these actions, in these so called institutions especially the Indian origin one, because they have miserably failed in preventing their own group from being a bunch of rabid hinduphobes.


Your choice my friend. You didn't need to write an essay and sneak in a personal attack for good measure to make your point. Don't get me wrong about the personal attack, I don't mind (in fact I don't give damn).


Amit, there was no personal attack there. Your comments on the BJP, Hindu right wing in the past are a matter of record. You have expressed your distaste for them on several occasions, you are welcome to those opinions, your personal choices after all, but to spin this mere mention as a personal attack is hilarious.

In fact, your mixing up a mere reference to your own prior open stance, political/personal choices, which lead you to the kind of recommendation you espouse as a valid strategy based on their opinion, and why someone would disagree with it, as a personal attack, clearly shows the same sort of "hey wut" response we see from some of these folks we were discussing who get outraged when others disagree with them and label it as a personal attack!

Quite the irony there.

Even though I quoted you my response was more general and I think there are many on this forum who would agree with me.


And many wont - something I think by now you ought to recognize, if not admit. Besides, the question is not one of being uncivil, which seems to be what you have introduced. Its one of being blunt. If a bunch of hypocrites call their opponents fascists, then they should be addressed in turn. Those who engage civilly deserve a civil response.

Incidentally, in case you didn't notice, instead of fuming on this forum I went and stuck head out and responded on that blog. But don't such minor things distract you.


Sorry, but do you think that requires some sort of commendation & do you think everyone else here hasn't responded on that blog?

I am not distracted either.

I merely pointed out that your personal choices on how to engage with these bigots is not something I would follow.

That's about it.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Karan M » 17 Sep 2015 17:44

UlanBatori wrote:In that vein, Amit and jingos (note the fine distinction: I am larning from dem 'Skoliars', a few of whom have even taught dem gradoo-ate courses)


:lol:

If someone is standing around with a paint spray gun and a gallon of paint, hitting everyone passing by, one can either leave the place to keep one's chaddis clean, or put on a plastic sheet and walk right in and stuff the gun up the someone's u nowhere.

I say that (b) is the right thing to do. Both articles deserve ur gentle, persuasive, illuminating comments. By the hundreds as b4. :mrgreen:


Exactly, The likes of Mamzel Doniger call shri Malhotra a "filthy priest" and we poor souls have to be ultra courteous lest we be indoo fascists. Oh the horrors.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby amit » 17 Sep 2015 17:49

Karan M wrote:I merely pointed out that your personal choices on how to engage with these bigots is not something I would follow.


And so you needed two verbose posts to say this?

Finally!
:roll:

N.B. Each to his own. I think one small group of Left leaning Liberal Arts groupies don't tarnish the entire Liberal Arts community. Apparent there's another line of though that think all Liberal Arts types are guilty unless proven innocent by the jigra.

Interesting.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Arjun » 17 Sep 2015 17:50

amit wrote: Some of the most strident criticism of their actions have come from other liberal arts types.

I haven't come across any from US-based liberal arts faculty types. Any links ?

I saw a fabulous piece from Madhu Kishwar today on FirstPost - but she is based in India.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Karan M » 17 Sep 2015 18:00

amit wrote:
Karan M wrote:I merely pointed out that your personal choices on how to engage with these bigots is not something I would follow.


And so you needed two verbose posts to say this?

Finally!
:roll:


Oh my goodness, need I dig out your concise and non verbose posts amit, in times past, lest you be hoist on your own petard? For someone who has posted tons, you seem to forget the famous adage of glass houses etc, why is that not surprising.. :lol:

PS: Its good I was verbose given a) you attempted to spin my points as a personal attack and b) offered unsolicited and inaccurate advice which has so far resulted in zip, nada in terms of engaging these bigots and making a tangible difference.

N.B. Each to his own. I think one small group of Left leaning Liberal Arts groupies don't tarnish the entire Liberal Arts community. Apparent there's another line of though that think all Liberal Arts types are guilty unless proven innocent by the jigra.
Interesting.


So you were asked for evidence to prove this was a small group as versus a more representative one. So far, you have proffered none, including any rebutals by the bulk of the so called liberal arts fraternity to this bunch of overambitious narrative hijackers.

All you have are attempts to depict this as some sort of unfair slam against these poor chaps. Interesting.

PS: Many of us have wide exposure to liberal arts folks in India & abroad and suffice to say, the views espoused by the folks above (signers and what not) are the flavor of many a season. Until and unless you have convincing evidence to the contrary which shows the majority view, your opinion, remains your opinion but its not necessarily a fact.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Karan M » 17 Sep 2015 18:07

Arjun wrote:
amit wrote: Some of the most strident criticism of their actions have come from other liberal arts types.

I haven't come across any from US-based liberal arts faculty types. Any links ?


Arjun, its sort of hilarious that one of the few non STEM types to speak up, Vamsee Juluri actually says:

The truth is that there has been a near-total collapse of credibility for South Asia studies academicians and activists in the eyes of many Indians in India and the diaspora for several reasons[/b] :lol: which are not reducible to but nonetheless tend to cluster inevitably on the figure of Narendra Modi. Narendra Modi’s election as Prime Minister is seen by many Indians as the return of an indigenous, yet pluralistic, anti-colonial civilizational aspiration in India after several decades of domination and misrule by a corrupt regime hiding behind secularism as a hypocritical fig-leaf (please see my article in Foreign Affairs on how Modi’s rise marks a generational process of decolonization in Hinduism, rather than a mere upsurge of anti-secular religious nationalism as our colleagues on the original petition might view it).

Most South Asia studies scholars, on the other hand, have failed to engage in open debate about these issues, and have resorted to an intensive campaign of strategic silencing which is widely viewed in the Indian community today as a form of racism and neo-colonialism. [/
http://academeblog.org/2015/09/05/oppos ... dis-visit/
...

Unfortunately, what would Mr Juluri know. In his verbose response he has not been schooled about how unfair he is being to the liberal arts types engaged in Sooth Asia studies. :lol: :mrgreen:


I saw a fabulous piece from Madhu Kishwar today on FirstPost - but she is based in India.


Oh Madhu Mausi is regarded as a traitor now by many of our liberal types. Especially many in the Lutyens crowd and from the hallowed social justice DU/JNU pedigree. Poor FB feeds catch fire from all the ire she evoked. :lol:
Last edited by Karan M on 17 Sep 2015 18:09, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby deejay » 17 Sep 2015 18:07

I am way into speculation here, but the Liberal Arts community "Skoliars" in the US who have migrated from India and are in a habit of petitioning the strong powers of US, I am willing to bet around 75% originated in DU and JNU. I don't have much so can't bet much.

Maybe, two or three more places of origin but mostly these two universities.

If these two universities change their approach, the anti India voices of Indian origin will almost vanish.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby amit » 17 Sep 2015 18:09

Arjun wrote:
amit wrote: Some of the most strident criticism of their actions have come from other liberal arts types.

I haven't come across any from US-based liberal arts faculty types. Any links ?

I saw a fabulous piece from Madhu Kishwar today on FirstPost - but she is based in India.


Arjun,

I suggest you check out the work of Vamsee Juluri. He is at the forefront of the movement against that despicable group which signed the Digital India petition. There are others a simple Google search would show them.

My point is the Wendy Doinger and her type hardly represent the Indian origin Liberal Arts academics in the US. Those who hold her up as the high priestess of Indian Liberal Arts just plays in her groups hand. But then who has the time to think before leaping? (This last comment is not directed towards you, just so that you don't misunderstand me).

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Karan M » 17 Sep 2015 18:14

amit wrote:I suggest you check out the work of Vamsee Juluri. He is at the forefront of the movement against that despicable group which signed the Digital India petition. There are others a simple Google search would show them.

My point is the Wendy Doinger and her type hardly represent the Indian origin Liberal Arts academics in the US. Those who hold her up as the high priestess of Indian Liberal Arts just plays in her groups hand. But then who has the time to think before leaping? (This last comment is not directed towards you, just so that you don't misunderstand me).


What an irony then, that Shri Juluri sticks two big oars into the latter theory of poor misrepresented sooth asia scholars onlee.

The truth is that there has been a near-total collapse of credibility for South Asia studies academicians and activists in the eyes of many Indians in India and the diaspora for several reasons

Most South Asia studies scholars, on the other hand, have failed to engage in open debate about these issues, and have resorted to an intensive campaign of strategic silencing which is widely viewed in the Indian community today as a form of racism and neo-colonialism.

All simple onlee. All silent onlee. "Strategically silencing" all those who hold opposing viewpoints. Poor sooth asia scholars.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Karan M » 17 Sep 2015 18:33

Here is the awesome piece of research Doniger did which our strategically silent lib art sooth asian scholars were.. silent about.
Amazon review:

Where Exactly Is India, Ms. Doniger?
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13 April 2014 By Ali Sheikh
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Banned in Bangalore, the New York Times op-ed said. Why ban a book, no matter how offensive, the literati fumed. No one can truly ban a book in the Internet age, friends pointed out. The book in question is a 690-page nonfiction account of Hinduism titled "The Hindus: An Alternative History," written by Ms. Wendy Doniger, a university professor with doctorates from Harvard and Oxford. Naturally, I bought a copy (I am a Non Resident Indian)and more to the point, read the book.

Before we proceed, let me say that I do not support banning any book (or even legally requiring a book to be withdrawn from circulation, as was the case with this book in India). But I do hold that every banned book isnt necessarily a well-written, scholarly work. Indeed, a ban of any kind instantly confers an aura of hyper-legitimacy on the banned work, regardless of its intrinsic merit, and I believe thats what happened with Ms. Donigers book. I contend that her book is biased and sloppy, and thats what this review is all about.

Lets start with the big picture. A well-written alternative history of anything, let alone Hinduism, generally has the effect of making the reader pause and think twice about what he may have held all along as the truth. From someone of Ms. Donigers stature, I was hoping to hear a serious insight or two that would make me go, "Gosh, Ive known that story all my life, but why didnt I look at things that way before"?

So, what major insights does the book offer? According to the author, the main aspects are diversity and pluralism in Hindu thought, treatment of women and lower castes, the erotic side of Hinduism, and the many tensions and conflicts within Hinduism.

Thats where my disappointment startedthose are not major insights, nor do they add up to an alternative history. Lets go item by item. Diversity and Pluralism? Caste system? Anyone with a passing interest in India knows about it. Treatment of women? I am not trying to minimize the importance of women, but whats new here? Were the other ancient cultures any better? Conflict and tension within? Hardly surprising for a country of a billion people. Eroticism in ancient India? Oh please, who hasnt heard of that? Yes, yes, Ms. Doniger adds a ton of detail, but my point is that things dont become groundbreaking by adding detail. Its as if someone wrote a very detailed book about the Mississippi river and Southern cuisine and called it "The Americans: An Alternative History."

All the detail opens up an even bigger disappointment. It appears that Ms. Doniger frequently cherry-picked the facts to suit her views, and on occasion, even twisted them to suit her narrative. I realize these are harsh accusations and the burden of proof lies on me, so please allow me to present enough examples to make my case (within the space limitations of an opinion piece).

Lets begin with the epic Ramayana, with the king Dasharatha and his three wives. The youngest, the beautiful Kaikeyi, assists the king in a hard-fought battle. In return, the king grants her two wishes, to be claimed at any time of her choosing. Many years later, when the king is about to retire and Rama, his son from the eldest wife, is about to be crowned, Kaikeyi claims her two wishes: that her son Bharata be named king, and Rama be exiled to the forest for fourteen years. The king is torn between his promise to Kaikeyi and his obligation to name the eldest son as the next king, as convention dictated. When Rama hears of the kings predicament, he abdicates his claim to the throne and leaves the city. This is a defining moment for Ramathe young man respects the kings word (i.e., the law) enough to renounce his own claim to the throne and loves his father so much that he spares him the pain of having to enact the banishment. Indeed, this point in Ramas life even foretells the rest of the storythat the young man would, in the years to come, make even bigger personal sacrifices for the sake of his ideals.

Thats the mainstream narrative. Lets hear Ms. Donigers alternative narrative, in her own words. The youngest queen, Kaikeyi, uses sexual blackmail (among other things) to force Dasharatha to put her son, Bharata, on the throne instead and send Rama into exile.

Now, was Kaikeyi beautiful? Yes. Was the king deeply enamored with her? Yes. Did Kaikeyi lock herself in a room and create a scene? Absolutely. Was the king called a fool and other names by his own sons? You bet. But there is far more to Ramas exile than sexual blackmail. Ms. Doniger covers this topic in excellent detail (page 223 onwards), but its interesting that she doesnt bring up the kings longstanding promise. Before we draw conclusions, lets move on to a different story from the same epic.

Ms. Doniger retells the story of the ogre Shurpanakha, who approaches Rama and professes her love for him. Rama tells her he is a married man and mocks her. In the end, Ramas younger brother Lakshmana mutilates the ogre. To Ms. Doniger, this data point (to be fair, not the only data point) indicates Ramas cruelty toward women. Ms. Doniger then contrasts this story with one from the Mahabharata, where an ogre named Hidimbi professes her love for Bheema and is accepted as his wifeagain underscoring the authors point about Ramas cruelty. All of this might sound reasonable at first glance, but lets look closer.

This is how the story goes in the epic. Shurpanakha approaches Rama when he is sitting next to his wife, Sita. When Rama mocks her, the ogre gets angry and charges at Sita. Rama holds the ogre back to save Sita and then orders his younger brother to mutilate the ogre. Rama even says, That ogre almost killed Sita. One would think these details are pertinent to the discussion, but strangely enough, Ms. Doniger doesnt bring them up. Also, Rama was a committed monogamist, whereas Bheema was (at that point in the story) a single man. Arent we comparing apples to oranges here? Isnt this just the kind of nuance one would expect a researcher to pick up?

To be fair to Ms. Doniger, there are many versions of the Ramayana (and sadly enough, some scholars have received a lot of undeserved flak for pointing this out). So, is it possible that she and I were reading different renditions of the same epic? I checked. Turns out we both got our details from the Valmiki Ramayana (also known as the original Sanskrit version). Whats going on here?

Normally, one would expect an alternative narrative to add nuanceas if to say, There is more to the story than what you lay people know. But Ms. Doniger manages to do the oppositeshe takes a nuanced, compelling moment in the epic and reduces it to sexual blackmail or cruelty or sexual urges, whatever her current talking point is. Speaking of sexual urges, indeed there are no sex scenes in her book. But it can justifiably be called a veritable catalog of all the phalluses and vaginas that ever existed in ancient India, and there is no dearth of detail in Donigers book when it comes to private parts. She even cares to tell you whether any given phallus is erect or flaccid. Details, people!

But enough about men and women. Lets move on to animals. In the Mahabharata, Arjuna burns up a large forest and many creatures die; the epic even describes the animals pain at some length. Somehow, Ms. Doniger finds this worthy of filing under the Violence toward Animals section. Was Arjuna supposed to first clear the forest of all the wild animals and only then set the forest on fire? Is that how other cultures cleared forests so they could grow crops and build cities? Has it occurred to Ms. Doniger the very fact that the narrator of the epic bothered to describe the animals pain (instead of just saying Arjuna burned the forest) indicates some sympathy toward animals in those times? Then the professor brings upand this is a recurring talking point under the cruelty sectionthe line from Mahabharata that says, fish eat fish. Ms. Doniger calls it Manus terror of piscine anarchy. Oh, the humanity!

Yet there is no mention of what Bheeshma says in the Mahabharata (Book 13), over pages and pages of discourse, on the virtues of vegetarianism and kindness toward all animal life. Bheeshma calls abstention from cruelty the highest religion, highest form of self-control, highest gift, highest penance and puissance, highest friend, highest happiness and the highest form of truth. One would think this passage merits a mention when discussing cruelty towards animals in the Mahabharata, but it doesnt get one.

Ms. Doniger uses the phrase working with available light when describing how she had approached her subject matter, which is very true when working with a complex topic such as Hinduism. But the problem is, she then proceeds to turn off many lights in the house and use a microscope to detail the bits she cares to see. She is of course free to do what she likes, but can someone please explain to me why the end result from such an approach qualifies as an alternative map of my home?

Still on the topic of animals, lets discuss dogs, a subject Ms. Doniger covers in great detail. Even lay readers of the Mahabharata remember that in the end, Yudhishtira declined his chance to go to heaven unless the stray dog that had been loyal to him was also allowed in, and many Mahabharata enthusiasts may recall a different dog at the beginning that was unjustly beaten up. Ms. Donigers book mentions many other dogs as well, and for good measure, she even shares a weird story from contemporary India, 150 words long, quoted verbatim from an Indian newspaper, about a man marrying a dog.

What about Krishnas words in the Bhagavad Gita, where he says wise people cast the same gaze on a learned Brahmin, a cow, an elephant, a dog and someone who might cook a dog? Ms. Doniger does mention those lines, but with an interesting twist. She prefaces those 24 words with though and reverts to her chosen narrative without even waiting for that thought to finish: though the Gita insists that wise people cast the same gaze on a learned Brahmin, a cow, an elephant, a dog, or a dog cooker, the Mahabharata generally upholds the basic prejudice against dogs. Has it occurred to Ms. Doniger that, while men were beating up dogs, God was professing a kinder, more egalitarian approach? The whole man vs. God angle escapes her, and in the end we are left with a world where man marries dog gets 150 words and Gods words of compassion are limited to 24, topped with a though.

Ms. Doniger calls her book a history, not the history, of the Hindus, which is, of course, fine. Further, I do not hold the mainstream narrative to be beyond reproach, nor do I expect an alternative narrative to merely confirm the status quo. Alternative histories do very frequently upset the balance, and, frankly, thats how progress is made. But my problem here is that Ms. Doniger seems to think the mainstream narrative is ipso facto a biased one, and that her alternative narrative is more compelling, never mind the facts and the counterevidence. She draws the graph first and then looks for data points. Thats a very interesting trend youve spotted there, Ms. Doniger, but what about all those big, ugly blots of truth that dont fit your graph?

So much for stories from ancient India. For the benefit of any kind souls from the Western world who have been patiently reading through all this, let me throw in an example from relatively recent times that involves America. No doubt you've heard what the physicist Robert Oppenheimer said while reflecting on the first nuclear blast he had helped spawn. He quoted a passage from the Bhagavad Gita, "Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds." Why would he quote Gita? The simplest explanation I can think of is that Oppenheimer was a well-read man, and he felt the passage was appropriate when describing the unprecedented firepower he had just witnessed. Its not much different from Carl Sagans quoting Mahapurana in his book Cosmos, one would think. But no, there is more to it. Ms. Donigers take:

Perhaps Oppenheimers inability to face his own shock and guilt directly, the full realization and acknowledgment of what he had helped create, led him to distance the experience by viewing it in terms of someone elses myth of doomsday, as if to say: This is some weird Hindu sort of doomsday, nothing we Judeo-Christian types ever imagined. He switched to Hinduism when he saw how awful the bomb was and that it was going to be used on the Japanese, not on the Nazis, as had been intended. Perhaps he moved subconsciously to Orientalism when he realized that it was Orientals (Japanese) who were going to suffer.

There you have it. Weird Hindu doomsdays. Sex-crazed kings. Cruel gods. Men marrying dogs. Phalluses everywheresome erect and some flaccid. Ladies and gentlemen, we finally have an alternative history of Hinduism. And yes, left uncontested, in all likelihood these are the insights a whole new generation of students and researchers might learn, internalize, and cite in future scholarly works.

So much for an alternative history. Now, how about some mundane, regular history stuff? Lets go back to the Mahabharata, an epic that Ms. Doniger brings up dozens of times in her book (she even calls the Mahabharata 100 times more interesting than the Iliad and the Odyssey). Lets ask two questions: When did the main events of Mahabharata occur? And exactly how long is the epic?

Ms. Doniger mentions the years as: between 1000 BCE and 400 BCE, most likely 950 BCE, or around 3012 BCE, or maybe 1400 BCE. That narrows down the chronology quite a bit, doesn't it? Really, there is more to writing history (particularly the alternative kind) than looking up the reference books and throwing in all the numbers one could find. But in Ms. Donigers defense, she is not a historian per se (and she clearly tells us so), so lets let this one slide by. Id even say she does deserve some credit here for at least bothering to look up things. On the next topic, she fails to do even that.

Ms. Doniger says the Mahabharata is about 75,000 verses long. Then she helpfully adds, sometimes said to be a hundred thousand, perhaps just to round it off a bit." My goodness, 25,000 verses is some rounding error, don't you think? Most sources put it between 75,000 and 125,000. It took me all of two hours to find a very detailed account (not on the Internet though), compiled in the 11th century, putting the total at 100,500and Im not a researcher, not by a long shot. And yes, the exact number of verses is secondary to the big picture. What bothers me is the offhandedness with which Ms. Doniger brushes off 25,000 verses as a rounding issue. Why this half-baked research?

Oh well, maybe we expected too much from the bestselling book on Hinduism and its our fault. So, lets try again, one last time. Where is India located?

Ms. Doniger states, very clearly, without any ambiguity, on page 11 (footnote): Most of India is in the Northern Hemisphere.

I think Ill stop here.


http://www.amazon.in/gp/aw/cr/rR1XA7KWW884J77

I am not going to even post this lady's perverted comments on Indian divinity.

PS: If this sort of stuff is what is acceptable amongst the fraternity, don't sit and whine when folks think the fraternity are a bunch of jerks

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Arjun » 17 Sep 2015 18:51

amit wrote:Arjun,

I suggest you check out the work of Vamsee Juluri. He is at the forefront of the movement against that despicable group which signed the Digital India petition. There are others a simple Google search would show them.

My point is the Wendy Doinger and her type hardly represent the Indian origin Liberal Arts academics in the US. Those who hold her up as the high priestess of Indian Liberal Arts just plays in her groups hand. But then who has the time to think before leaping? (This last comment is not directed towards you, just so that you don't misunderstand me).

Ok, so the North America-based Liberal Arts folks I counted who have signed the Komerath letter:

    Ramesh N. Rao, Ph.D., Professor, Department of Communications, Columbus State University, Columbus, GA
    Anantanand Rambachan, Ph.D, Professor, Department of Religion, St. Olaf College, Northfield, MN
    Samar Mitra, Ph.D, Professor, Department of Sociology, Emory, Atlanta, GA
    Shrinivas Tilak, Ph.D., Research Scholar, Department of Religion, Concordia University, Montreal, Quebec
    Jeffery Long, Ph.D., Professor, Department of Religion & Asian Studies, Elizabethtown College, Elizabethtown, PA
    Madan Lal Goel, Ph.D., Professor Emeritus, Department of Political Science, University of West Florida, Pensacola, FL
    Royal James Hartigan, Ph.D., Professor, Fullbright Scholar, Department of Music, University of Massachusetts, Dartmouth, Dartmouth, MA Fullbright Scholar (2014-2015)
    Bina Gupta, Ph.D., Emeritus, Department of Philosophy, University of Missouri, Columbia, MO
    Mark Zachary Taylor, Ph.D., Associate Professor, Sam Nunn School of International Affairs, Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta, GA
    Geetanjali Tiwari, Ph.D., Coordinator, Department of South Asian Studies, University of Kansas, Lawrence, KS

So thats 10 out of the 150 who signed...as opposed to the 120 odd Liberal Arts faculty who signed the KV letter. A ratio of 1:12.

I think we are entitled to stereotype American Liberal Arts faculty based on these statistics alone- more specifically the faculties of South Asia studies and Feminism. While commending a Geetanjali Tiwari (see above) for resisting the low-IQ groupthink of her colleagues - we need many, many more Geetanjali Tiwaris for the reputation of these programs to improve unfortunately.
Last edited by Arjun on 17 Sep 2015 18:56, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Karan M » 17 Sep 2015 18:55

BTW before we start thinking Shri Juluri himself is a paragon of objectivity regarding political developments in India, please note the following article - which BTW just goes to show the dominant narrative in "liberal arts circles" in the US about what Hindutva is.

In an otherwise ok article (exceptional only in that its not the usual blatantly racist tripe we have come to expect from western experts) but has the usual deliberately chosen oh lookie at them Indians pic as the headliner..

https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles ... nal-moment

But the increased popularity of Hinduism also has a dark side, represented most prominently in the spread of Hindutva, an early-twentieth-century right-wing ideology promoting Hindu nationalism and often used to repress minorities. An assertive discourse about being Hindu, and being aggrieved as Hindus, has also become widespread. The 2002 Hindu-Muslim riots in Modi’s home state of Gujarat, during which at least 790 Muslims and 254 Hindus were killed, remains a worrying example of religious anger in India.

Whether Modi will usher in a Hindu renaissance, as his supporters hope, or contribute to the rise of Hindu nationalism, as his detractors warn, remains to be seen. For the moment, his words have been promising, as he appears to have moved away from Hindutva identity politics toward a more universal and inclusive vision for India.


In short, our western interlocutors are still attempting to define for the average Indian what is acceptable and what is not in terms of Indian political choices and how certain movements have to be depicted perforce for popular consumption. And therein lies the concern.

Note no reference to western interventions in social engineering, missionary activities or IM fundamentalism. Merely a declaration, Hindutva is bad for minorities.

In short, don't expect these folks to think what an average Indian who voted for Modi, may think.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby UlanBatori » 17 Sep 2015 19:26

In all fairness, most desi Liberal Arts/Humanities faculty would not have been aware of this (engg-mgmt-dominated) letter. I hear that the evil conspirators deliberately selected engg ppl, mgmt ppl, then some very select and reliable desi Liberal Arts profs, then ran out of time and posted the first edition of the list. The link is still open, and at this point, if Humanities/Media/Social Sciences faculty are alert, they can find the link and join.

So the apparently paucity of LibArts/Hum signors is PARTLY because the originators knew few that are not Scholiars / L.O.S.E.R.S.

Then again, it is ALSO TRUE per the conspirators that the percentage of Humanities/community college faculty who responded was not overwhelming. :oops: Maybe they don't open emails from mere engg. faculty, esp. with desi/yindoo dhoti-shivering/ brown-skinned names. Dem nerds cyain't write Da King's English, as Dr. Sudha something, Indology expert at U. Sydney, commented on Herr Witzel's IndoEuracist Forum.

Some more have signed, will show up in updates. Prof. Juluri does not appear to have signed, don't pooch me 'Hwhai?"

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Karan M » 17 Sep 2015 19:36

>>>Dem nerds cyain't write Da King's English, as Dr. Sudha something, Indology expert at U. Sydney, commented on Herr Witzel's IndoEuracist Forum.

And dem nerds don't even know their Marx from their Lenin hainjee? Their daleet from their brahmeen hainjee? How non intellectual. Sniff.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby UlanBatori » 17 Sep 2015 20:53

Sudha Shenoy. Name slipped in all the poo they threw.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Suraj » 17 Sep 2015 21:09

amit wrote:If I may, lets not dish the entire liberal arts community, especially the Indian origin one based on the actions of these few left leaning hypocrites.

Excuse me for interjecting, but you are generalizing. They're not being dished for just happening to be liberal arts types. They're being dished specifically because they collectively made a statement about STEM topics that they're not competent to write about.

All academia puts a massive premium on the academic credibility of the participant of a conversation. Does Witzel or Doniger not assassinate the character of anyone they presume less than academically qualified to respond to them ? They dismiss the likes of Talageri as 'amateurs' , among several other things. No courtesy is due in these circumstances. In academic and professional circles, it's expected decorum - even if it's thinly veiled snobbery - that you know what you're talking about when you open your mouth and speak loudly.

When STEM, management and legal professors collectively sign a welcome letter speaking about progress on the PM's tech and administrative initiatives and encourage him, the signatories know what they're talking about. When a bunch of liberal arts types bloviate about Digital India in a letter that amounts to nothing more than waving their hands about while looking suitably horrified, that's something that deserves unreserved mockery. Half of them probably don't cannot even setup WEP (much less WPA2, or even know what that is) themselves on their home routers and they're talking about Digital India ?

They are posers who exposed themselves to public ridicule and deserve every last bit of it. They embarrassed their own field by speaking like that to one of world's most powerful men, and now their field collectively faces the stigma of lacking academic rigour. That is their own doing that that they're facing the consequences of. It's not a mistake on the part of those mocking them for it.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Karan M » 17 Sep 2015 22:10

>>>>All academia puts a massive premium on the academic credibility of the participant of a conversation. Does Witzel or Doniger not assassinate the character of >>anyone they presume less than academically qualified to respond to them ? They dismiss the likes of Talageri as 'amateurs' , among several other things. No >>courtesy is due in these circumstances. In academic and professional circles, it's expected decorum - even if it's thinly veiled snobbery - that you know what >>you're talking about when you open your mouth and speak loudly.

Which makes it even more hilarious when Doniger talks of India being mostly in the north hemisphere :lol: :lol: :lol: and sees p**n everywhere...and is a self proclaimed expert. Reminds me of the joker who goes to a pyschiatrist and then is shown a bunch of ink blots. Promptly declares each is p**nographic. Pysch says "wow, all you can think is p**n?" And the guy replies "hey you are the one with the dirty pictures!!". Thats Doniger and co & their academic studies in a nutshell.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby ramana » 17 Sep 2015 22:51

UB however Vamsee Juluri also led the other letter and is quoted by media.

Aside plan to meet him sometime later this month.
Will ask him to attend one of the notorious meets when set up.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby UlanBatori » 17 Sep 2015 23:44

Of course. Prof. Juluri also posted a fine blog at the AAUP site. Provided the 'blocking' for a good number of kicks.. :mrgreen:

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby ramana » 18 Sep 2015 00:25

Anyone correlate how many common signatories in the 2006 Deny US visa to Modi and current 125 odd liberal academia are there?

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Vayutuvan » 18 Sep 2015 01:23

arshyam wrote:Saar, please check Swarajya mag, they have the letter and the list. Typing from phone, so am not able to paste it here.

Got it sir. Quite a list.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Gus » 18 Sep 2015 01:31

But it can justifiably be called a veritable catalog of all the phalluses and vaginas that ever existed in ancient India, and there is no dearth of detail in Donigers book when it comes to private parts. She even cares to tell you whether any given phallus is erect or flaccid. Details, people!


i hereby dub thee doniger as lundiger. Kundy Lundiger.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby MurthyB » 18 Sep 2015 01:42

Karan M wrote:Which makes it even more hilarious when Doniger talks of India being mostly in the north hemisphere :lol: :lol: :lol: and sees p**n everywhere...and is a self proclaimed expert. Reminds me of the joker who goes to a pyschiatrist and then is shown a bunch of ink blots. Promptly declares each is p**nographic. Pysch says "wow, all you can think is p**n?" And the guy replies "hey you are the one with the dirty pictures!!". Thats Doniger and co & their academic studies in a nutshell.


I posted a video of her earlier where she makes that joke about herself in relation to the accusation against her that she is p0rn-obsessed. But she is apparently dumb enough that she doesn't realize that making this joke about herself implicates her, and not the texts as she is attempting to. I think she means to say that she writes about p0rn because the texts themselves are apparently full of them, but making the Rorschach test joke undermines that position and she doesn't even realize it.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby MurthyB » 18 Sep 2015 01:44

http://www.firstpost.com/india/silicon-valley-will-be-laughing-at-anti-modi-moral-advisory-by-academics-2435872.html

Good hard hitting article that spares no punches. Glad she makes the point about NSA snooping and Snowden etc that was just waiting to be made..

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby ramana » 18 Sep 2015 02:30

Finally went through the names in the anti-Modi letter.
Four names of interest: Wendy Doniger, Sheldon Pollock, V Narayana Rao & MV Ramana.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Raja Bose » 18 Sep 2015 03:10

Wendy Doniger sees sex in every Hindu tale and tradition but I doubt any heterosexual male would have sex on his mind when he sees Wendy Doniger.

---

Can someone confirm that the academic retards have put up an anti Modi billboard on I-880 near Dixon Landing? That would be an appropriate place for it since then it will be rightfully accompanied 24/7 by the Eau de Effluvia aroma emanating from the Dixon Landing Sewage Treatment plant and landfill - the world's largest stink joint. :mrgreen:

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Vayutuvan » 18 Sep 2015 04:07

Karan M wrote: No easy answers.

There is an easy answer. Work harder :) to become independent. Otherwise we keep paying the price of being ignorant. No amount of perception management and what we want people to think is going to help. It is all going to be "booDida lO pOsina panneeru" (a vat of perfumed water poured into a pile of ashes).

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Prem » 18 Sep 2015 04:11

Raja Bose wrote:Wendy Doniger sees sex in every Hindu tale and tradition but I doubt any heterosexual male would have sex on his mind when he sees Wendy Doniger.--
Can someone confirm that the academic retards have put up an anti Modi billboard on I-880 near Dixon Landing? That would be an appropriate place for it since then it will be rightfully accompanied 24/7 by the Eau de Effluvia aroma emanating from the Dixon Landing Sewage Treatment plant and landfill - the world's largest stink joint. :mrgreen:


From Now on this Libetardibending junction will be known as U-69 DoningerLaanding.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby ramana » 18 Sep 2015 04:15

RB what confirmation! I saw it yesterdin. The hashtag was #ModiFail

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Raja Bose » 18 Sep 2015 04:22

Someone should tweet about the stink accompanying that #ModiFail sign.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Vayutuvan » 18 Sep 2015 04:35

Profs. S. Pollock and V. Narayana Rao are two of the scholars who are translating Indian classics for the murTee Sanskrit Classics Library (Did I get that ostentatious name right? I hope so, otherwise I will be branded an "illiterate" who is the "product" of a state university). Prfo. V. Narayana Rao is translating Manu Charitra by allasAni peddanna.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Vayutuvan » 18 Sep 2015 04:38

ramana: Are the monies paid by the 124 (or it sri 420) south asia studies professori (pardon my eye-talian).

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby ramana » 18 Sep 2015 04:49

I don't think so.
Milpitas has an ICC which has old WKKs running the show. Could be some affiliate group.

Yep those are funded by Infosys monies.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Karan M » 18 Sep 2015 05:46

VT saar, that is a given. That approach will take time and is the work of decades. Which is why no easy answers aka shortcuts.

Also:

Profs. S. Pollock and V. Narayana Rao are two of the scholars who are translating Indian classics for the murTee Sanskrit Classics Library (Did I get that ostentatious name right? I hope so, otherwise I will be branded an "illiterate" who is the "product" of a state university). Prfo. V. Narayana Rao is translating Manu Charitra by allasAni peddanna.

Translating or mutilating is the question we need to ask.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby UlanBatori » 18 Sep 2015 06:44

ramana wrote:Anyone correlate how many common signatories in the 2006 Deny US visa to Modi and current 125 odd liberal academia are there?


And the 2002 FOIL Faculty List. I am sure that is somewhere in the archives.

Look what I found on Googleswara. Not the FOIL faculty list but something related

Here is one related Petition list circa 2004. Numbered backwards.

QUOTE(utepian @ Jun 15 2005, 06:16 PM)
http://www.petitiononline.com/ipt1/petition.html
ROTFL.gif ROTFL.gif 523. Love Day Tall None 522. M C Hutiya Private 521. signature rejected 520. Abdul Karim Association For India's Development (AID), political activist 519. M. Arvan alshehi United Airlines 518. Ulloo Kabaccha AID_India Political Activist 517. signature rejected 516. signature rejected 515. Bev Aqoof CIIS student and AID volunteer 514. Connie North Graduate Student/UW-Madison 513. Meekal Mazgoonkar Association For India's Development (AID), political activist 512. Noor Mohammad Association For India's Development (AID), political activist 511. Ali Gulcu None 510. Ghulam Ali Association For India's Development (AID), political activist 509. Samiullah Khan Private 508. signature rejected 507. Chobal Rasool Association For India's Development (AID), political activist 506. Teenbaal Rasool Association For India's Development (AID), political activist 505. Dobal Rasool Association For India's Development (AID), political activist 504. Iqbal Rasool Association For India's Development (AID), political activist 503. signature rejected 502. Suhail Rizvi Khan Association For India's Development (AID), political activist 501. Ali Al Ali Association For India's Development (AID), political activist 500. signature rejected 499. signature rejected 498. Iqbal Hussain Suharwardy Association For India's Development (AID), political activist 497. H Aram Khor Association For India's Development (AID) 496. Ben D Taki Association For India's Development (AID) 495. signature rejected 494. Keerankumar Viscia Association For India's Development (AID) 493. ShatInder Bhangwat May God bless you. Association For India's Development (AID) 492. Rupyia Deshdrohi SINGH and Sabrang volunteer 491. Kiran Bhagat Political fundraiser, AID, Maryland 490. Autumn Hickman student 489. Brinda Karat Leader, AIDWA, India 488. Prakash Karat Mentor of CIIS faculty in India 487. signature rejected 486. signature rejected 485. Dr. Bharya Mardini CIIS student and AID-India Norfolk, VA booster 484. signature rejected 483. Teri Mah Coalition Against Genoside 482. signature rejected 481. Dr. Semily Terait CIIS alumna, Volunteer, Coalition Against Genocide 480. signature rejected 479. Apa Shakunam Student, CIIS. Volunteer, Bay Area AID-India 478. signature rejected 477. Haram Zada Association for India Development (AID) 476. Leah Rothstein Student 475. Julie Tennessen teacher 474. M. Tyhead CIIS student and AID-India political activist 473. Kristina M. Kemp Student/University of Wisconsin - Madison 473. Kristina M. Kemp Student/University of Wisconsin - Madison 472. Divya Student 471. Beth Davies Adjunct Faculty, Front Range Community College 470. Matthew Curtis University of Wisconsin-Madison 469. Katherine Alden Teacher Cooperative Playschool 468. ben hebel designer/ GA Communications 467. Karen Drake Senior Buyer 466. Kamina Nikhamma Association for India Development (AID) 465. Choo Tiya Gan Du Student 464. Soraya Serajeddini Board Member / Kurdish National Congress of North America 463. Kutti Chatthan AID-India Political Activist 462. signature rejected 461. Damon Jacob Luna,MA,MA,MS Doctoral student, Humanities 460. signature rejected 459. RuthBeau Takahara ZeroOne: The Art and Technology Network 458. Asok Dasgupta Retired Government Officer 457. Bhaskar Sarkar Associate Professor, UC Santa Barbara 456. alison happel student, california institute of integral studies 455. Isaac Fifi-Kwofie Financial Sofware Developer 454. Lynne henry Student 453. Rakesh Sharma Film-maker 452. Harsha Jaisinghani Buyer/Jamba Juice 451. John Isaac Financial Advisor 450. Maksudul ALAM Private Service 449. Loreta Castro Center for Peace Education 448. Anjan Ghosh Centre for Studies in Social Sciences, Calcutta 447. surabhi kukke Health Researcher 446. Samuel Abraham Director / Skyhi Global 445. Rishi Makhijani musician 444. Rukiye Nur Kart Artist and Student 443. Suheyla Banu Kart Singer and Student 442. Beyhan Kart Hair stylist 441. chris phelps student/therapist 440. Mustafa Kart Political Activist 439. Jake Dunn Fixer 438. Avani Tailor student 437. signature rejected 436. Alex V. Koshy Board Member, Dr. MLK Jr. Commission of New Jersey State 435. signature rejected 434. victoria brill student@ciis 433. Anne Vittoria professor-SUNY 432. signature rejected 431. signature rejected 430. ahmed khan AID-India Political Activist and student Ohio State U. 429. signature rejected 428. Rachel Constantine artist 427. signature rejected 426. signature rejected 425. Chandra Talpade Mohanty Syracuse University 424. signature rejected 423. signature rejected 423. signature rejected 422. signature rejected 421. signature rejected 420. Umesh Rajagopalan AID-India political activist 419. signature rejected 418. signature rejected 417. signature rejected 416. signature rejected 415. signature rejected 414. Mohammed Jabul Islam student 413. signature rejected 412. signature rejected 411. Cheri Hinkley Teacher 410. jayshree chander, m.d., mph physician 409. Kanu Sanyal Honorary Fellow, CPI(MLM) Politburo 408. Karyn Leibovitz student 407. Nirmala Nataraj Writer/various 406. Andrea Vaccariello social worker 405. Dana Jepsen actor 404. Nathaniel Gloekler Student 403. Sujani Reddy Asia Pacific Forum/WBAI Pacifica 402. deepak Gupta Programmer 401. Simmy Makhijani Student, California Institute of Integral Studies 400. Gyanendra Pandey Professor 399. signature rejected 398. Dr. Shyrl Topp Matias Teacher 397. TAYEB POONAWALA Consulting Civil Engineer/P.E. 396. Lydia Okelberry LAUSD Teacher 395. James Ryan Professor, California Institute of Integral Studies 394. Amitava Kumar Professor 393. line voided 392. Colleen Maloney Student, John F. Kennedy University 391. Salim Rizvi Journalist 390. Ania Loomba Professor, University of Pennsylvania 389. David Ludden University of Pennsylvania 388. Charu Majumdar AID-India Board Member 387. abraham mammen Inidan Christian Forum, Inc 386. Phil Morton self-employed 385. Lata Teacher 384. Mohmed Patel Investment Manager 383. Ayse Gul Altinay Assistant Professor, Sabanci University 382. Karen Krongold Student 381. Kelly McMenimen California Institute of Integral Studies 380. Simona Sawhney University of Minnesota 379. Alka Hingorani Student 378. Thomas Kim Assistant Professor/Scripps College 377. Jonathan Crosby teacher 376. Alan Gleason Editor, The Book & The Computer magazine 375. kannarkat Verghese Physician 374. Surti Student - Dimagahi Hospital - Sahadra 373. line voided 373. line voided 372. Saba Waheed SAMAR Magazine 371. Paula Buel student, Mills College 370. Neera Singh Student 369. Kundan Kumar Student 368. Kari Norgaard Professor 367. Prasad Vaidya Energy Consultant 366. Veena Achar Software Engineer 365. craig matsuzaki research and evaluation 364. Maithili Iyer Researcher 363. Crystal Social Worker 362. Benita Kline LKM Philanthropic Advisors 361. J. Manjrekar Alliance for a Secular and Democratic South Asia 360. Kusum Crimmel YouthWorks/ Y-Step 359. Sagar Khare UNC Chapel Hill 358. Raymond Sun student 357. Salud Dacumos nurse 356. Christine Choi student 355. Katie Waddell Publicist 354. Jeff Norman Artist 353. C. Duval student 352. William Artist 351. Aaron Lehmer Circle of Life 350. Teresa Martyny Riley Center 349. Sharon Guynn Administrative Assistant 348. Sanita Marshall Youth Cooordinator 347. victor Joseph Professor 346. Lynn Thompson visual artist 345. signature rejected 344. signature rejected 343. signature rejected 342. signature rejected 341. keira dubowsky sfwar volunteer 340. Christine Rack teacher 339. Lila Youn Korean American Coalition-San Francisco 338. Reuben Rutledge student/writer/ California Institute of Integral Studies 337. Erin Singer barista, rape crisis counselor 336. Letitia Momirov Marra Foundation 335. Sonia Estival Volunteer SFwar 334. Vivienne Ng Student, UC Berkeley 333. Neo Xwes HR 332. Prashant Jawalikar Programmer/AID Volunteer 331. Kim Franklin Educator 330. Winston Chu Graphic Designer 329. Laura Truxler student 328. Andrea Vargas Artist 327. Aaron Gardner student 326. Lalo Cervantes Artist 325. Malcolm James Adams Bee Farmer 324. Martha Marcella Diliberto Adams Pharmacist 323. Cliff Lee student 323. Cliff Lee student 322. Sam Wainwright student 321. Taryn Scanlon student 320. Sapna Gupta Writer/SAPAC 319. Marilyn Winter-Tamkin activist 318. Holly Alonso Non-profit worker 317. Rebecca Sutton Environmentalist 316. Jim Puskar Oakland Resident 315. Irene Payne Travel Consultant 314. Oran Payne Student 313. Shariffa Payne Student, UC Berkeley 312. Paul Reeder spiritual astrologer 311. Karen Sikie Paper Mosaic Studio 310. Judy Greenwald Graduate Student, California Instittute of Integral Studies 309. Mohammed Asim Pathan schering plough 308. Allan Greenbaum York University 307. Avani Tailor student 306. Paul P.Radha krishnan. Foundation for minorities rights and welfare 305. signature rejected 304. Mohsin Patel solicitor 303. Imran Mohmed Accounts Manager 302. shanti ranjan behera Human Rights Activist/Martin Luther King Centre for Democracy and Human Rights 301. tom cramp student 300. Jeanhee Kim Korea Solidarity Committee 299. Charles Whitmore Private 298. Rae Hendriksz Graduate, California Institute of Integral Studies 297. Shaun M. Hannan Intellectual / Social Justice Advocate 296. Shaheen Nilofer Scholar Activist. 295. Barbara Allen Professor, Virginia Tech, U.S.A. 294. Pamela Keeley nurse and artist 293. karyn Leibovitz student 292. Matthew Barker Software Engineer 291. Beverly Naidus Artist and Associate Professor of Interdisciplinary Arts, UW Tacoma 290. Sefian Kasem Student 289. MUKUNDAN C. MENON Human Rights Defender (CHRO, Keralam)/Journalist 288. Paul Cienfuegos bookstore owner 287. Kazi K. Ashraf Asstt. Prof., Architecture, University of Hawaii 286. ari salomon graphic designer 285. Farah Nousheen Media activist 284. Priya Bhogaonker Student 283. Pamela Rita Cole Milliner 282. Theo Verinakis grad student 281. Rev. Girish Kallianpur Fellowship Of South Asian Christians (FOSAC) 280. Yahya Khan Accountant 279. James R. Hopfenbeck Physician, Clinical Faculty/University of Washington 278. Alice Dubiel Visual Artist/Planet Art 277. Thomas Mathew Environmental Planner 276. Alice Dubiel Visual Artist/Planet Art 275. grace chen San Francisco Women Against Rape 274. Riaz Ahmad Mathematician 273. Lamia Karim University of Oregon 273. Lamia Karim University of Oregon 272. Titus Mathew FOSAC 271. Elisabeth Sikie CIIS 270. Thomas David www.kalavedhi.com 269. Davis John Abraham Project Manager 268. Lydia MacKenzie Professor, Marketing 267. Finney Zechariah co-founder (vistawiz, inc) 266. sri subramaniam ilankai thamil sangam florida 265. rashidah tutashinda Women Spirituality CIIS 264. Irene L. Plunkett California Institute for Integral Studies 263. Nikki K. McGary Student, CIIS 262. Deanna Esquibel PDT Program Coordinantor/ CIIS 261. signature rejected 260. Louise M. Pare, Ph.D, Director/Educator 259. Karen Villanueva student 258. Alan B. Fletcher California Institute of Integral Studies 257. Shahab Uddin Engineer 256. mubbashir rizvi grad student 255. Eric Sienknecht Student 254. Jaclyn Higgs California Nurses Association 253. kathryn julyan ciis graduate student 252. Anastasia Prentiss Professor/Holy Names University 251. signature rejected 250. signature rejected 249. signature rejected 248. signature rejected 247. signature rejected 246. signature rejected 245. signature rejected 244. signature rejected 243. signature rejected 242. signature rejected 241. signature rejected 240. Kerri Welch student CIIS 239. Matthew C. Bronson Associate Professor 238. Valerie Bush Editor 237. Pei-Ching Wu Student / Fachhochschule Esslingen 236. John Johnson Pastor- Religious 235. Vijayanand software developer 234. Leonard Rifas EduComics 233. Tony Jenkins Columbia University 232. Sahar Driver Student, California Institute of Integral Studies 231. Amanda McBride California Institute of Integral Studies 230. Lisa Christie Student 229. Dr. Meg Jordan Global Health Media 228. ashwina mistry software developer 227. Lise McKean Anthropologist 226. Arisika Razak Associate Professor 225. Tulsi Dharmarajan In solidarity 224. Angie Choi CIIS 223. Yolanda Escamilla Student Affairs Officer/University of Calif.San Diego 223. Yolanda Escamilla Student Affairs Officer/University of Calif.San Diego 222. Ruchika Mehta California Institute of Integral Studies 221. signature rejected 220. Karuna Morarji Cornell University 219. Kalli Rose Halvorson California Institute of Integral Studies 218. Ken Abiko Accountant 217. Dr. Jay Jayadev President, Energy Savers 216. Reese Lovett Student, J.F.K. University 215. Billie Sopp retired 214. Farah L. Paradise service worker 213. Paula Palmer Executive Director, Global Response 212. rita manchanda south asia forum for human rights 211. Stephen R. Couch Pennsylvania State University 210. Carolyn Lee financial analyst 209. Diana Elrod Consultant to Governments 208. Smita Narula Center for Human Rights and Global Justice 207. signature rejected 206. signature rejected 205. signature rejected 204. signature rejected 203. signature rejected 202. signature rejected 201. signature rejected 200. signature rejected 199. signature rejected 198. signature rejected 197. signature rejected 196. signature rejected 195. Gayatri Menon Cornell University 194. Saadia Toor Assistant Professor 193. Dr. Thani Kumar Cheran Engineer 192. signature rejected 191. signature rejected 190. signature rejected 189. Betty A. Reardon Teachers College Columbia University (Retired) 188. Shabnum Tejani University Lecturer 187. Govindarajulu Ranganathan Parts Room Coordinator. 186. Suma Josson Film Maker 185. Ali Mir Professor 184. Leonard S. Sklar, Ph.D. Department of Geosciences, San Fransisco State University 183. naturemedia media 182. Keith Pezzoli academic/ UCSD 181. Jyoti Puri Professor, Simmons College 180. Ross Frank UCSD 179. K. Ramakrishnan Visiting Professor, North Eastern Hill University, Shillong, India 178. Chris Hostetter Engineer 177. Olivia Ford Independent 176. Mary Riley retired 175. Steven Chen, MD Asian Health Services 174. Arasu Chellaiah World Thamil Organization 173. Sandra Coliver lawyer/Center for Justice & Accountability 173. Sandra Coliver lawyer/Center for Justice & Accountability 172. Ernest Courant Educator/Ivy West 171. Robin Khundkar South Asia Forum 170. signature rejected 169. signature rejected 168. signature rejected 167. signature rejected 166. signature rejected 165. signature rejected 164. signature rejected 163. signature rejected 162. signature rejected 161. signature rejected 160. Muttahida J Council In solidarity (Muttahhida J Council) 159. signature rejected 158. signature rejected 157. signature rejected 156. signature rejected 155. signature rejected 154. signature rejected 153. signature rejected 152. signature rejected 151. signature rejected 150. signature rejected 149. signature rejected 148. signature rejected 147. signature rejected 146. signature rejected 145. In Hui Lee People of Color 144. signature rejected 143. signature rejected 142. signature rejected 141. signature rejected 140. signature rejected 139. signature rejected 138. signature rejected 137. signature rejected 136. signature rejected 135. signature rejected 134. signature rejected 133. line voided 132. signature rejected 131. signature rejected 130. signature rejected 129. Prof. Lucia Chiavola Birnbaum Professor of Philosophy and Religion, California Instsitute of Integral Studies, San Francisco 128. amanda morrison Student-CIIS 127. line voided 126. signature rejected 125. Drew Dellinger Poets for Global Justice 124. signature rejected 123. signature rejected 123. signature rejected 122. signature rejected 121. signature rejected 120. signature rejected 119. Denise Kall student 118. kathleen merletti Service Representative 117. John Kokko Student 116. Karma Smart Student 115. Grego Rachko Visual Artist 114. Kenneth Gould Professor of Sociology, St. Lawrence University 113. Brian Klocke Dr. of Sociology 112. Richard Shapiro Associate Professor, Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies 111. Brian Klocke Dr. of Sociology 110. Jennifer Woods graduate student 109. Sundar Kuppuswamy System Adminstrator 108. Nayna Jhaveri Postdoctoral Fellow/Colgate University 107. chukka srinivas Woburn, MA 106. Rahul Viswanathan System Administrator 105. Eric Bourgeois, Ph.D. Adjunct Professor Sociology 104. John Ishvaradas Abdallah World Without Borders 103. Simmy Makhijani CIIS 102. V.J. Babu Engineer 101. David Naguib Pellow Professor 100. Jos Anthony Puthenveetil Chairman, International Christian Coalition for Human Rights 99. Thilakarajan Retired professor of veterinary pathology 98. Michael McCamish Anthropologist and social worker 97. Jeanette Lee San Francisco Women Against War 96. akhila raman consultant 95. line voided 94. V.Thangavelu Thamil Creative Writers Association, Canada 93. Faiza Zafar Grad Student, University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign 92. Zine Sano Designer 91. Frances F. Rice Office Manager 90. Stella Ng Employment Advocate-Chinese for Affirmative Action 89. elizabeth harmuth Student, CIIS 88. Ravi Ganapathy Information Technology 87. Raza Mir William Paterson University 86. Shaik Ubaid IMC-USA 85. Robert Jensen University of Texas at Austin 84. Sara Gandhi Software Engineer 83. Kate Jones California Institute for Integral Studies 82. S. Sankarapandi IT Professional 81. Danton Thurairajah 80. Viswanathan.N World Thamil Organization 79. Kaleem Kawaja Association of Indian Muslims of America, Washington DC. 78. N. Poyyayil student 77. Ashok Prasad Student, Brandeis University, USA 76. carolyn mengel wholesale supervisor 75. Richard Ganis unorganized 74. Niyati Desai CIIS 73. signature rejected 73. signature rejected 72. Shakeel Tirmizi Scientist 71. Vinod Mubayi Scientist 70. Raafay Mohammed IMC-USA 69. Shalini Nataraj Alliance for a Secular and Democratic South Asia 68. Toni Nash student, California Institute of Integral Studies 67. Sarah Jimenez Social Worker/Student 66. rachel pomerantz ciis 65. Khalid Azam IMC-USA 64. Walter J. Tanner Student, California Institute of Integral Studies 63. Erin Johansen Graduate Student in Asian and Comparative Studies, California Institute of Integral Studies 62. Sriram Ananth Social Worker 61. Hyder Khan physician/Supporters of Human Rights in India 60. perlita payne student 59. jess diliberto student,california institute of integral studies 58. Dave Thibodeau Graduate Student / California Institute of Integral Studies 57. Kellie Conley California Institute of Integral Studies/student 56. kannan srinivasan monash asia institute clayton victoria 3800 australia 55. signature rejected 54. Rajinder Singh Mago Sikh American Heritage Organization 53. signature rejected 52. signature rejected 51. Shivali Tukdeo Grad Student, University of Illinois 50. Ra Ravishankar Grad Student, University of Illinois 49. Faith Yacubian student, CIIS 48. Ashwini Rao Columbia University 47. Arvind Raman Engineer 46. signature rejected 45. Jacob Simon Treasurer/NYPC 44. Jonathan Mills Operations Manager 43. Gregory Mengel Software Engineer/Oracle Corporation 42. Eswan Keyes Fundraiser 41. signature rejected 40. signature rejected 39. signature rejected 38. Rucha Ambikar Student, California Institute of Integral Studies. 37. Zuber A. Jafri CTO 36. signature rejected 35. line voided 34. Kenji Liu Doctoral Student, California Institute of Integral Studies 33. Joseph G SecularIndia.com 32. ali khan engineer 31. line voided 30. Attaulla Khan IMC-USA 29. line voided 28. line voided 27. Susan Cersosimo Student 26. Hari Sharma professor emeritus/also: South Asian Network for Secularism and Democracy 25. Imtiazuddin Executive Director, Coalition for a Secular and Democratic India (CSDI). 24. kamayani swami humanity 23. Piya Chatterjee Dept of Women' s Studies, University of California-Riverside 23. Piya Chatterjee Dept of Women' s Studies, University of California-Riverside 22. Shambhala Warrior, MSW Doctoral Student 21. Nandita Ghosh University Professor 20. Fredrick Cloyd Student, Calilfornia Institute of Integral Studies 19. Rasheed Ahmed Indian Muslim Council-USA (IMC-USA) 18. sreangsu acharyya student 17. Melinda McBride Education, Graduate of CIIS 16. Sean Michael Graduate, California Institute of Integral Studies 15. George Abraham NRI Coalition for Social Justice 14. Anjail Arondekar University of California- Santa Cruz 13. Srimati Basu DePauw University 12. Kamala Visweswaran professor 11. Abha Sur Alliance for a Secular and Democratic South Asia 10. Harsh Kapoor South Asia Citizen's Web - France 9. satish kolluri Pace University 8. Zara Zimbardo student 7. Sukant Khurana neurobiologist 6. Shrikumar Poddar India Foundation 5. phil STUDENT 4. lisa denenmark student, CIIS 3. Charles Jeehoon Cha Korea Solidarity Committee 2. Pei Wu Student, California Institute of Integral Studies 1. Annie Paradise Student, California Institute of Integral Studies


Look at the number of Signature Rejecteds and Line Voideds. Martyrs every one of them.

UlanBatori
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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby UlanBatori » 18 Sep 2015 06:58

[url=http://www.reocities.com/charcha_2000/essays/foilies/foilies62.html]Partial List of FOIL Faculty, 2002[/quote]

Who wants Jnana Prabodhini closed down as a “hate-mongering” organization?


A partial list: Dr. Biju Mathew, Rider U., Dr.Angana Chatterji, CIIS, Vijay Prashad, Trinity College, CT, Dr. Vinay Lal, Associate Professor of History, UCLA, Jamal Badawi, St. Mary’s University, Halifax, NS, [b]Akeel Bilgrami, Columbia University[/b], Deepak Kapur, University of New Mexico, Ayesha Jalal, Tufts University, Tayyab Mahmud, Cleveland State University, Muhammad Umar Memon, University of Wisconsin-Madison, Malini J. Schueller, University of Florida, Asma Afsaruddin, Assistant Professor of Islamic Studies, University of Notre Dame, Bulbul Chakraborty, Professor of Physics, Brandeis University, Partha Chatterjee, Professor of Political Science, Columbia University, Frank F. Conlon, Professor Emeritus of History & International Studies, University of Washington, Daisy Rockwell, Visiting Assistant Professor of Modern Languages and Literatures, Loyola University Chicago, Amitabha Roy, Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department, Boston College, Anindyo Roy, Associate Professor, English, Colby College, Maine, Vasudha Dalmia, Profesor and Chair, South and Southeast Asian Studies, UC Berkeley, E.Valentine Daniel, Professor of Anthropology, Columbia University, Gautam Ghosh, Assistant Professor of Anthropology, University of Pennsylvania

Kaushik Ghosh, Assistant Professor, Department of Anthropology , Vassar College, Louisa Gilbert, Senior Researcher, Columbia University School of Social Work, William Glover, Assistant Professor, University of Michigan, Lalitha Gopalan, Associate Professor, Georgetown University

Stewart Gordon, Senior Research Fellow, South Asia Center, University of Michigan. Sumit R. Das, Professor, Department of Physics and Astronomy, University of Kentucky and Department of Theoretical Physics Tata Institute of Fundamental Research, Kimberly Davis, Assistant Professor of Political Science, Adrian College, Adrian, MI, Samir Dayal, Associate Professor, Department of English, Bentley College Antoinette Burton, Professor of History, University of Illinois,Urbana-Champaign, Homi K. Bhabha, Anne F. Rothenberg Professor of English and American Literature, Chair, Program in History and Literature, Harvard University, Abha Sur, Lecturer, Science and Technology Studies, MIT, Leti Volpp Associate Professor Washington College of Law, American University, Milind Wakankar, Assistant Professor of English SUNY Stony Brook, Ed Haynes, Associate Professor of History, Winthrop University, Usha Zacharias, Assistant Professor of Communication, Westfield State CollegeCynthia Talbot, Associate Professor of History and South Asian Studies, University of Texas at Austin, Shubha Tewari, Visiting Assistant Professor,Department of Physics, Mount Holyoke College, Senthil Todadri, Assistant Professor, Departmentof Physics, Massachusetts Institute of Technology, T. Robert Travers, Assistant Professor of History, Harvard University, Brian Trinque Lecturer in Economics & Asian Studies, University of Texas,Austin, Jyostna Uppal, Assistant Professor, Dept. of History, Queens College, CUNY, Jyotsna Vaid, Associate Professor, Psychology, Texas A&M University

Rashmi Varma, Assistant Professor, Department of English, University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, Susan Hangen, Assistant Professor, Anthropology, Ramapo College

Mary Hancock, Associate Professor, Department of Anthropology University of California, Santa Barbara Patrick Heller, Associate Professor, Sociology, Brown University

Syed Akbar Hyder, Assistant Professor, South Asian Studies, The University of Texas at Austin Akeel Bilgrami, Johnsonian Professor of Philosophy, Columbia University

CRamS
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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby CRamS » 18 Sep 2015 07:52

Raja Bose wrote:
Can someone confirm that the academic retards have put up an anti Modi billboard on I-880 near Dixon Landing? That would be an appropriate place for it since then it will be rightfully accompanied 24/7 by the Eau de Effluvia aroma emanating from the Dixon Landing Sewage Treatment plant and landfill - the world's largest stink joint. :mrgreen:


I have been driving in that area past several days, but I must have missed it.

But as pernicious as it is, do these retards really think that Americans, consumed as they are by Trump and Carly and co, and the all other aspects of American life, really give a rat's behind for ModiJi or India? Sometimes this looks comical more than anything else. They give real meaning to "argumentative Indians".

Hari Seldon
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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Hari Seldon » 18 Sep 2015 07:56

Such stuff sadly can't be taken lightly. Stakes are high. How high? Well, legitimacy, precedent, turf and narrative control - all are up for grabs.

I still recall the Wharton "disinvite" to Modi's tele-address. AdarshLibs were hopping all over in joy at how yumreekan wisdom totally rejects the man. What the 124 are playing for now is the right to be able to say we made our presence and opinion felt or some such BS. Make even that claim laughable, I say.


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