India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

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ramana
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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby ramana » 21 Mar 2016 03:43

F-16 in India under #MII would be a cruel joke on South Asia.
So will not happen or huge number of obsolete F-16s from surplus stocks will be sold/gifted to Pakistan just as F-86s were in the 1960s.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby UlanBatori » 21 Mar 2016 04:29

Hilarious.
Maintained by Hindoostan Aeronaatics Limited. Jai Hind! Quality checked by Sadashivam Gurmeet Singh Manikdandan Sharma, especially for the Pakistan Air Farce.

What happens to ur engines when you approach the LOC, ****? Wanna find out? Wanna bail out? Will ur rockets lift your seat, or Inshalla*, go right up ur musharraf? Will the canopy open or push ur thick skull into ur belly?

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby SSridhar » 21 Mar 2016 05:53

Standing up to patent bullying - Srividhya Raghavan, The Hindu
Earlier this month, the media reported that India “privately” assured the United States that it will not issue any more compulsory licenses. This report was reminiscent of a theory propounded by psychologist Lenore E. Walker in 1979 on abusive patterns in relationships.

Four stages of abuse

Walker studied abuse in family situations and outlined an important model detailing four stages of abuse. Had the U.S. and India been human beings, this would have been a classic case of household abuse. The first stage documented by Dr. Walker is tension-building where there is strain in the relationship and one partner tries to dominate the situation. Indeed, the U.S. has successfully dominated the discussions simply by citing India every single year, most often unfairly, to take control of the situation. For years, the Pharmaceutical Research and Manufacturers of America (PhRMA) has pounded India using the Office of the United States Trade Representative (USTR), an administrative body, as its chosen mechanism to repeatedly criticise India and unfairly escalate issues on a yearly basis. The preaching from the PhRMA filtered through the USTR’s pressure tactic has been in complete disregard of the impact on India’s sovereignty and public health. The issuance of notices by USTR for submissions by industry followed by the dramatisation to convene public hearings expecting sovereign nations to justify their positions to the U.S. administrative body are all acts leading towards escalation of tensions. In fact, the USTR process is a documented attempt to dominate and direct other countries’ trade postures. The process allows the U.S. to unilaterally exert pressure indirectly to amend laws or cease fair implementation of local laws although the U.S. has agreed to multilaterally resolve all disputes. Importantly, the legality of such unilateral Special 301 process of the USTR is, at best, shaky under the World Trade Organisation’s (WTO) jurisprudence. Yet, it allows the U.S. to cite the USTR’s Special 301 process to take control of the dialogue — this forms Dr. Walker’s second stage of the abusive cycle (the incident itself).

The announcement from India, though, landed the country into the third stage. Dr. Walker terms this as the honeymoon stage wherein the abused feels confused and may mistakenly feel responsible. India is in classic third stage, with Prime Minister Narendra Modi attempting to pacify President Barack Obama by instituting a committee to create a National Intellectual Property Rights policy long after the statutes were amended to become compliant with the WTO’s Agreement on Trade-Related Aspects of Intellectual Property Rights (TRIPS). Now, the “private” announcement to not implement an important flexibility — compulsory license — established as a safeguard to protect public health firmly posits India into the end of the third stage of abuse. The fourth stage, according to Dr. Walker, is a phase of relative calm and peace, which we hope India will enjoy.

If there is a cautionary note here, it is that reconciliation never ends the cycle of abuse. Assuredly, neither PhRMA nor the USTR will relent or retract from this pattern until India economically harms itself by instituting TRIPS and other measures leaving the Indian generic industry on a suicidal path. After all, abuse is a pattern of control that one party exercises over the other to force actions or inactions that cause some form of harm to the abused.

Compulsory license

Meanwhile, the Modi government needs to appreciate that compulsory license is an important flexibility that countries negotiated as part of their membership with the WTO. India has one of the most sophisticated compulsory licensing provisions which is fully compliant with the TRIPS agreement. Under the Indian law, compulsory licenses can be granted on several grounds including satisfying the reasonable requirements of the public with respect to the patented invention, ensuring availability to the public at reasonable price, meeting the demand for the patented product, and tackling national public health emergencies. The step India took when it compulsorily licensed the Bayer drug, Nexavar, which was originally priced approximately at $4,700 per month and beyond the reach of even the top 20 per cent of Indians, was bold. It showcased India’s confidence that its patent statute has been carefully engineered to accommodate India’s national objectives within the scope of the flexibilities accorded under the TRIPS agreement.

Patenting, a concern in the U.S.

Further, the Modi government will do well to appreciate that even in the U.S., patenting and its effect on unrealistic drug pricing has become a major concern. For example, in 2015, Senate Finance Committee Ranking Member Ron Wyden and senior committee member Chuck Grassley sought public comments on the high price of Sovaldi, a Gilead drug, and its impact on the U.S. health care system. In 2016, several Democratic members of the House reportedly urged government agencies to consider diluting or diminishing the exclusive rights of drug companies. Recently, a survey from the Kaiser Family Foundation reported that 77 per cent of the American public picked the increasing prices of drugs for HIV, hepatitis, mental illness and cancer as their foremost health concern. Given such realities, India needs to confidently showcase how it handled Bayer’s unrealistically high pricing of Nexavar using Section 84 of the patent statute (compulsory licenses).

Importantly, compulsory licensing forms a part of a larger package of flexibilities that India negotiated with the support of other G-77 and African countries in the Doha Development Round. These are valuable concessions that India cannot afford to forget or renege from. The burden is on this government to ensure that its work is not seen as resulting in losing the ground that previous governments had gained on the subject. In any event, it is best for the Modi government to stop engaging U.S. bureaucrats as patent consultants and instead showcase the Indian patent statute as an exemplar for a balanced patent regime to the rest of the developing world.

(Srividhya Ragavan is Professor of Law, Texas A&M University School of Law.)

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby schinnas » 21 Mar 2016 17:00

ramana wrote:F-16 in India under #MII would be a cruel joke on South Asia.
So will not happen or huge number of obsolete F-16s from surplus stocks will be sold/gifted to Pakistan just as F-86s were in the 1960s.


The geo strategic calculations are changing fast. It is increasingly clear that with shale oil and expectation of other fuel sources drastically reducing world reliance on oil in the coming decades, ME is becoming less and less important to US in the long term. Due to Puki double speak in Afghanistan, it has lost nearly all the goodwill it had in Pentagon and DC circuits. The only long term use case US has w.r.to Pukis is regarding it use as a leverage against an assertive India.

However, with Cheen openly questioning US in South China Sea, there is far greater urgency and panic in US strategic circles to co-opt India into the US umbrella in IOC region. In the longer term, Pukiland does not have anything to offer to US. So Unkil probably decided to throw it minion few crumbs to get a face saving exit in Afghanistan and go all the way in fully courting India in the evolving dynamic against China.

The economics of going with a proven platform such as F-16 Block 60 are compelling. If the entire production line of F-16 Block 60 can be set up in India with reasonable ToT, India should move fast on it, imho. Even if it means some obsolete F-16 have to be dropped into the begging bowl of our neighbor.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Manish_P » 21 Mar 2016 19:17

there is far greater urgency and panic in US strategic circles to co-opt India into the US umbrella in IOC region


OK then will Khan gift us 3-4 squadrons of F-16's free as part of it's 'courting' :P

Hell we will even offer to help the poor minions in their zarb a dard ops and co-opt it as part of the aman di tamasha :mrgreen:

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Singha » 21 Mar 2016 19:45

The economics of going with a proven platform such as F-16 Block 60 are compelling. If the entire production line of F-16 Block 60 can be set up in India with reasonable ToT

:rotfl: don't mean to be rude sir but wake up.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby NRao » 21 Mar 2016 20:34

Due to Puki double speak in Afghanistan, it has lost nearly all the goodwill it had in Pentagon and DC circuits. The only long term use case US has w.r.to Pukis is regarding it use as a leverage against an assertive India.


You are right WRT the Pentagon. But, the Pentagon is not the one pushing these F-16s (to Pakistan), it is Foggy Bottom. And perhaps a bunch of think tanks.

No idea what the 16 brings to the table (for India), but we need to wait till Carter visits India and see what he has to offer. Carter has been able to deliver, bet to the chagrin of the SD.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby ramana » 21 Mar 2016 23:56

schinnas, Mostly right analysis.

India is asking show me the commitment.

Apropos the Texas A&M law prof, Obama is on his way out*. NaMo knows that so don't expect any falling over.

To make a big shindig of opening up Cuba is a sign of this. Its not China!!!

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby RajeshA » 22 Mar 2016 00:48

Published on Mar 21, 2016
By Philip Rucker and Robert Costa
Trump questions need for NATO, outlines non-interventionist foreign policy: Washington Post

Trump cast China as a leading economic and geopolitical rival and said the United States should toughen its trade alliances to better compete.

"China has got unbelievable ambitions," Trump said. "China feels very invincible. We have rebuilt China. They have drained so much money out of our country that they’ve rebuilt China. Without us, you wouldn’t see the airports and the roadways and the bridges. The George Washington Bridge [in New York], that’s like a trinket compared to the bridges that they build in China. We don’t build anymore. We had our day."

He questioned the United States’ continued involvement in NATO and, on the subject of Russia’s aggression in Ukraine, charged that America’s allies are "not doing anything."

"Ukraine is a country that affects us far less than it affects other countries in NATO, and yet we’re doing all of the lifting," Trump said. "They’re not doing anything. And I say: 'Why is it that Germany’s not dealing with NATO on Ukraine? Why is it that other countries that are in the vicinity of Ukraine, why aren’t they dealing? Why are we always the one that’s leading, potentially the third world war with Russia.' "

Trump said that U.S. involvement in NATO may need to be significantly diminished in the coming years, breaking with nearly seven decades of consensus in Washington. "We certainly can’t afford to do this anymore," Trump said, adding later, "NATO is costing us a fortune, and yes, we’re protecting Europe with NATO, but we’re spending a lot of money."

Trump sounded a similar note in discussing the U.S. presence in the Pacific. He questioned the value of massive military investments in Asia and wondered aloud whether the United States still was capable of being an effective peacekeeping force there.

“South Korea is very rich, great industrial country, and yet we’re not reimbursed fairly for what we do," Trump said. "We’re constantly sending our ships, sending our planes, doing our war games — we’re reimbursed a fraction of what this is all costing."


Asked whether the United States benefits from its involvement in the region, Trump replied, "Personally, I don’t think so." He added, "I think we were a very powerful, very wealthy country, and we are a poor country now. We’re a debtor nation."


A Presidential candidate has positioned himself as the pacifist, isolationist, protectionist candidate and it is not Bernie Sanders!

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby ramana » 22 Mar 2016 07:12

trump is economic nationalist and a foreign policy isolationist.

Mood of the nation now.

Any way Israel should think if they want support of the millenarians who want to see them suffer for their prophecy.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby chetak » 22 Mar 2016 07:35

schinnas wrote:
ramana wrote:F-16 in India under #MII would be a cruel joke on South Asia.
So will not happen or huge number of obsolete F-16s from surplus stocks will be sold/gifted to Pakistan just as F-86s were in the 1960s.


The geo strategic calculations are changing fast. It is increasingly clear that with shale oil and expectation of other fuel sources drastically reducing world reliance on oil in the coming decades, ME is becoming less and less important to US in the long term. Due to Puki double speak in Afghanistan, it has lost nearly all the goodwill it had in Pentagon and DC circuits. The only long term use case US has w.r.to Pukis is regarding it use as a leverage against an assertive India.

However, with Cheen openly questioning US in South China Sea, there is far greater urgency and panic in US strategic circles to co-opt India into the US umbrella in IOC region. In the longer term, Pukiland does not have anything to offer to US. So Unkil probably decided to throw it minion few crumbs to get a face saving exit in Afghanistan and go all the way in fully courting India in the evolving dynamic against China.

The economics of going with a proven platform such as F-16 Block 60 are compelling. If the entire production line of F-16 Block 60 can be set up in India with reasonable ToT, India should move fast on it, imho. Even if it means some obsolete F-16 have to be dropped into the begging bowl of our neighbor.



IMVHO, we need the engine TOT even more. That will certainly not be a part of the package.

If such a package comes to us, the big politically connected "businessmen" will horn in to entirely swallow the deal and that is simply a case of "from the frying pan into the fire".

rafale started to flex it's muscles after it signed a JV deal with powerful, politically savvy business interests in India. GOK how many hundreds of crores have already flowed into shady coffers.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby NRao » 22 Mar 2016 08:07

IMVHO, we need the engine TOT even more. That will certainly not be a part of the package.


The engine part is under the DTTI effort, with a dedicated Jet Engine Joint Working Group (JEJWG). What is being promised is TBD, but MP seemed excited last Dec.

IF at all the Teens offer anything it will (should) be AESA, manufacturing techniques and supply chain - provided all could be transferred to other projects (in some shape or form). Code would be important too, to improve the platform within India or perhaps integrate Indian products.

Much is still left to our imagination. Need to wait for Carter.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby disha » 22 Mar 2016 08:27

I am so glad for Trump's position. Too long europe has been fighting its wars using men and material deprived from others. Let the europe sink into a hell hole it was before the so-called 'age of exploration'. Europe's or is it Britain's biggest bug bear that the Russian bear will embrace all of Europe? Still Europe is Russia's backyard (or front yard)., let the oiropeans figure out how they can deal with the great bear. What will happen? Another Hitler will rule all of Europe? The prospect may or may not impact distant Asia or America.

Basically Trump has signaled that emperor has no clothes., the alarm bells have started ringing in the state department and 'traditional' republicans are lining up now to defeat him. What will happen is actually they will end up creating Trump!

Of course Trump is all for Israel and he is ready to wind down the Iran deal. It is not a bad thing., since it is better to not have any nuclear related technology in the hands of the ME zealots (neither in the hands of the commies and the other zealots who owe their allegiance to vatican)., as long as Saudi Barbaria does not get the tech as well from its pig the bakistanis.

If US wants India's help in reshaping the world in a democratic image., it needs to hand over the near neighbourhood - from the Central Asian -Stans to Burma into India's lap.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Prem » 22 Mar 2016 09:02

disha wrote:I

If US wants India's help in reshaping the world in a democratic image., it needs to hand over the near neighbourhood - from the Central Asian -Stans to Burma into India's lap.


Same was asked in Gelf War 2 and denied but now geo-political-strategic-economic scenario is different.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Singha » 22 Mar 2016 09:14

I sure hope all these soothing visions of india being appointed the chowkidar from the cape of good hope to malacca is true and the mouth watering ice creams like EMcats, engines whatever we desire but cannot make.
are there freebies and good wages for chowkidari? does it mean we can slap TSP occasionally?

but if we look back at history and claim that to be a guide
- these gaajar are just to keep the cow engaged from naughtier stuff like A5 (cold storage by PMO diktat), K4 (do not deploy on arihant class), domestic projects funding cuts and apathy...
- more F-solah to TSP to help it feel safe and secure :mrgreen:
- even more costly american imports which subsidize feel-good gear to TSP

"beware of washington bearing gifts" ...

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Hari Seldon » 22 Mar 2016 10:04

I can only hope amrika tires of chai-biskoot by desi baboo(n)s and tightens tech denial ... which will finally force GoI's hand into funding half-decent R&D for indigenous and ingenious desi maal... and perhaps, just maybe, a full fledged desi MIC.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Singha » 22 Mar 2016 10:59

I believe despite 4000+ production run and some kind of assembly line turkey(?) the core comps of the F-solah like radar , engine, FBW and its vast range of PGMs continue to be made entirely in the US and some foreign weapons like asraam , brimstone might have been integrated on user request.

the only instances I can recall of US selling crown jewels would be tomahawk and Trident to UK and handing over nuclear bum data to UK in 1950s and some "laser simulation data" to UK and France in early 90s to make them feel confident of signing CTBT

thawk to my knowledge has not been sold to anyone else though nations like spain were interested. it was denied to israel under mtcr.

global hawk another very high end asset is being sold to EU but surely with all the classified US-only sensors removed and EU would put the best of rest thales type gear on it instead.

^^ these are to countries deep inside circle of trust and proven track record of joining the US on any project good or bad.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby JE Menon » 22 Mar 2016 11:41

There are pros and cons of close engagement with the US. But it will happen, no matter who is in power. Simultaneously there will be ever closer linkages with Russia too. That is the strategic imperative. Difficult to deny or ignore. Will come into play and manifest in many ways. F16 is just one. It's a matter of managing it right. Most of the concerns seem to be related to a conviction that we cannot and that we will be slaves and servants again. If we do, we will deserve it. Let's try not to. A little self confidence and self belief would help.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Philip » 22 Mar 2016 12:18

As I said in the Raffy td,this F-16 offer is a sick joke.We wanted for the MMRCA the best of the West and chose the Raffy,after the most exhaustive evaluation of any fighter in history.Then what? Becos of cost,we are willing to consider the equiv of the venerable old Amby ,and be the global garage mechanics of this 4th-gen bird, already being flown by our mortal enemy! There are more than a few screws loose in the MOD and IAF.

The Yanquis will also be laughing all the way to the bank,making billions out of the misery of both India and Pak,allowing it to also have a stranglehold on our air power.Our air force equipped with Yanqui ancients will be useless if we ever have to spar off with them,or against a nation which is their partner/ally but inimical to India.It will also kill off the LCA being a single-seater given that we will have to produce the bird in the hundreds to make the enterprise viable,unlike acquiring just a few sqds of Gripens while still developing and producing the LCA.

The Lockheed offer is the most bizarre after both F-16s and F-18s were discarded a few years ago in the evaluation. We need to look forward in tech and not backward.However,given the predeliction for demanding "backward" status by our political parties for their captive tribes,,backwardness ever increasing,it truly reflects the state of Indian society and ourbabus,advising our decisionmakers!

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Vipul » 22 Mar 2016 15:54

All this heartburn because India is considering the 4th generation F 16 and F 18 from the US. If GOI now buys Mig 35, this angst will be gone right?

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Hari Seldon » 22 Mar 2016 15:55

Image

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby vishvak » 22 Mar 2016 19:18

Vipul wrote:All this heartburn because India is considering the 4th generation F 16 and F 18 from the US. If GOI now buys Mig 35, this angst will be gone right?

To be not dependent on Russia should not be an euphemism for dependence on American hardware, no? Gripen, another MMRCA contender, uses US engines too. What are the options. Besides, F-16s or F-18s have not passed muster for MMRCA to begin with, are F-16s/F-18s.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby ramana » 22 Mar 2016 20:31

Vipul, We understand the need for #MII for many reasons. But t same time F-16s is a sick joke.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby NRao » 23 Mar 2016 04:06

Mar 16, 2016 :: Lockheed To Make "Formal Offer" Next Month About F-16 Sale to India

For what it is worth, quotes:

Lockheed Martin is expected to make a formal offer to New Delhi about manufacturing the F-16 fighter aircraft in India next month.

Lockheed Martin officials will be travelling to India with a formal offer next month, Susan Ouzts, vice president of Lockheed’s F-16 program told reporters during the annual media day in Washington Tuesday.

“Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi had expressed “substantial” interest in the plane during a recent meeting with Lockheed,” Susan said.

“Lockheed was working with the US government, which is in talks with India about possibly building F-16s in India,” said Orlando Carvalho, Lockheed’s Aeronautics division.

"We are ready to manufacture F-16 in India and support the Make in India initiative," Phil Shaw, chief executive of Lockheed Martin India said during the Singapore Airshow 2016.

Industry observers said Lockheed Martin's "wish to manufacture F-16 is based on the strong demand from the Indian armed forces and would want to lower the cost of the planes for exports by using the low-cost capability in India”.

"Certainly, Lockheed Martin would want to exploit the engineering skill and low cost capabilities in India and make F-16 very competitive in the fighter jet markets," PTI news agency quoted an unnamed source as saying in Februrary.

“If the two governments reach an agreement this year or 2017, putting aside all differences on the mega project and the US' move to supply eight F-16 to Pakistan, Lockheed Martin could roll out the first made in India jet in 2019-2020,” the source said.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Hari Seldon » 23 Mar 2016 06:05

^Sounds more like brochure-paradropping and planting FUD via a pliant media only.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Suresh S » 23 Mar 2016 06:50

My answer to US offer of F-16. Too aur kanhi le ja. Right on cue just as Tejas is about to enter service, so predictable.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby krishna_krishna » 23 Mar 2016 06:56

ramana wrote:Vipul, We understand the need for #MII for many reasons. But t same time F-16s is a sick joke.


Too me its more smoking some weird substance, especially when they did not even clear the evaluation trials. Have them baksheesh munna we go buy S-400 with TOT and start donating mig 21 bis to afg, like they have done with their left over stock.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Vipul » 23 Mar 2016 08:40

I am no way supporting buying any less capable 4th gen aircraft except if we get them at special prices. LCA/AMCA will come in good time but we need extra jets soon to make up for the alarming drop in numbers.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Manny » 23 Mar 2016 10:17

Everyone is dumping on Trump... like that Christian supremacist Cruz is good. IMO. Cruz is the worst evil of them all.

Bernie is a commie socialist idiot....

Hillary is reasonable..but she has too many "moderate Islamists" as butt buddies.. These "moderate Islamists" are the greatest threat to to India...more than the Islamists themselves.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby habal » 23 Mar 2016 10:42

the reason everyone is dumping on DT is because he can shred Hillary to pieces and expose her totally in the one-on-one campaign stage itself. It will make her look very stupid even if she ultimately gets elected president. It will leave her very compromised.

And the Israel lobby and wars lobby needs her to launch wars now. So if she doesn't have any credibility, then she is lame duck right from get go.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby schinnas » 23 Mar 2016 15:58

Bernie is a socialist but US needs little bit of socialism now. The difference between rich and poor is at an all time high and accelerating. The system is so-skewed to the super rich that there is a strong self reinforcement of rich people becoming richer. If some intervention is not done, there could be class wars in US in next few decades. Every few decades a POTUS like Bernie will do good for the country.

Of the current crop of candidates I will pick Bernie as best for US and neutral for India (as he would be more inward looking President). Trump is probably best for India, but bad for US as he is both a bigot and a clown.

However, both Hillary and Cruz are bad for India. Hillary due to the anti-Indian company that she keeps and her past actions against Modi. Cruz due to his born-again evangelist agenda. He will be playing the tune of EJs against Modi sarkar.

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby member_22733 » 23 Mar 2016 16:07

Hillary is not reasonable. she will be a disaster period.

Trump seems to be what i am left with

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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Vipul » 23 Mar 2016 16:27

If Trump wins and reaches out to Putin (who may reciprocate per their initial comments) it will be very interesting. The geo-political calculus will be turned on its head.

Trump will be the best bet for India. He has business dealings in India with aggressive plans to launch luxury housing projects in different cities. Has said more positive things concerning India and will toe the line of the American Corporates who are bullish on India.

Hillary will be a disaster for India and we may see a Madeline Albright-Robin Raphel redux of the 90s in her India policies.

sanjaykumar
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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby sanjaykumar » 23 Mar 2016 18:30

Why dump on an idealist?

If Bernie gets elected, I will donate $10 000 to the American Red Cross

Vipul
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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Vipul » 23 Mar 2016 19:10

Resolution introduced to bring India on par with NATO allies.

A Congressional resolution aiming to bring India on par with America's NATO allies in terms of trade and technology transfer besides elevating its status in export of defense articles from the US has been introduced ahead of Defense Secretary Ashton Carter's visit to India.

Introduced by Congressman George Holding, Co-Chair of the House India Caucus, the US-India Defense Technology and Partnership Act (HR 4825) proposes to amends the Arms Export Control Action so as to formalise India's status for the purpose of congressional notifications as a major partner of equal status as America's treaty allies and closest partners.

"This legislation will cement the process that has already been made and will lay a foundation for future cooperation and growth," Holding told the US House of Representatives.

"This legislation will elevate India's status by shortening the time required for the notification of sale or export of defense articles from the United States to India. It will encourage more joint contingency planning and require the US government review and assess India's ability to execute military operations of mutual interest," Holding said.

Welcoming the resolution, introduced ahead of US Defense Secretary Carter's visit to India early next month, the US India Business Council (USIBC) said that it sent an important signal to the Indian defense establishment that today's political conditions are different from the past.

"This bill not only puts India on par with other NATO allies in terms of the notification period, it sends a clear signal to Washington and Delhi that defence cooperation should be a top priority for both governments," Holding said.

Defence trade between the US and India is one of the strongest areas of the bilateral economic relationship and has risen from some USD 300 million to over USD 14 billion over the last 10 years, said Mukesh Aghi, USIBC president.

Noting that together the US and India face a range of shared security challenges, Holding underlined the need to encourage deeper bilateral defense ties and closer cooperation.

"The US-India Defense Technology and Partnership Act will build upon the recent progress made to strengthen our strategic partnership by facilitating closer collaboration, promoting greater defense trade, and by elevating India's status," he said.

In his remarks, Holding also questioned the decision of the Obama Administration to sell F-16 fighter jets to Pakistan.

"What, I ask, is the benefit of the sale to our national security and the security of the region and our partners? This is one question, but the request to use taxpayer dollars to finance the sale of these F-16s to Pakistan is entirely another question," he asked.

"What has Pakistan actually done to deserve these fighter jets let alone financing from the United States taxpayers? Certainly not enough, in my view, as I firmly oppose the sale from start to finish," Holding said.

svinayak
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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby svinayak » 23 Mar 2016 19:41

First there should be political agreement is all aspect. (Incomplete IUCNA, UNSC etc.)
Then there should economic/trade agreement ( Incomplete trade and multilateral)

After all these then there should be military agreement.

Everything is backward here....

vishvak
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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby vishvak » 23 Mar 2016 20:00

svinayak wrote:<SNIP>
Everything is backward here....

There was a guy from USA who came to India some time age, If I remember correctly, to point out that Indians do not need Agni-I anymore since we have alternate missiles/Agni-II available, some vague reasons that are difficult to recollect. Prolly its not Mr. Carter but this time it is surely fine tuned - even if it is all backwards.

arshyam
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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby arshyam » 23 Mar 2016 20:19

Vipul wrote:Resolution introduced to bring India on par with NATO allies.
"This legislation will elevate India's status by shortening the time required for the notification of sale or export of defense articles from the United States to India. It will encourage more joint contingency planning and require the US government review and assess India's ability to execute military operations of mutual interest," Holding said.
Any idea what this actually means? Need a powerful magnifying glass to read and understand all this stuff.

svinayak wrote:First there should be political agreement is all aspect. (Incomplete UICNA, UNSC etc.)
Then there should economic/trade agreement ( Incomplete trade and multilateral)

After all these then there should be military agreement.

Everything is backward here....
Agreed. Also, there is no open bilateral support for the idea of engaging with India. Unlike for ties with their allies. I am not saying ignore this or anything, just that we should keep our eyes open and proceed with caution. There are still too many areas where the US policy is ill-disposed to us.

The Pakistani aid should be a litmus test for the US walking the talk. Everything else is they "having the cake and eating it too". Till they demonstrate something positive on this front (and not simply cancel the proposed sale - that announcement could possibly be a red herring to sway us), we should not move on any agreements. This news item is not an agreement per se, but I am referring to the alphabet soups of LSA, CISMOA, etc. Wait and watch, move cautiously. Another factor to take into account: elections round the corner, what will the incumbent do from Feb '17? The US President still retains a lot of executive power, this current drama of F-16 jets to Pakistan is a case in point. Another example: WB and IMF aid to Pakistan does not flow from the Congress, but there is a US imprint on it.

[Added later] Why the heck do we not invest in our jet engine programmes? It is the single largest road block to our moving up the value chain, and the US is naturally trying to exploit it.

vishvak
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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby vishvak » 23 Mar 2016 20:36

LSA, CISMOA etc etc don't work when jihadi non-state actors, "not related to Paki Army", loot NATO Coalition trucks on the way to Afghanistan; and later automatically find way at unexpected places. It is only to browbeat buyers who spend hard cash.

There is similar case in Syria was where a well trained brigade (Brigade 30) crossed border to fight ISIL but very next day surrendered to Al-Nusra with stockpile of arms.

Viv S
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Re: India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

Postby Viv S » 23 Mar 2016 21:10

svinayak wrote:First there should be political agreement is all aspect. (Incomplete UICNA, UNSC etc.)
Then there should economic/trade agreement ( Incomplete trade and multilateral)

After all these then there should be military agreement.

Everything is backward here....


What's so backward about it? This isn't a bilateral agreement; India is not being asked to sign anything. The bill, if passed, will cut the red tape at the US-end, giving India parity with NATO states in matter of defence exports and tech transfer.

India isn't making any concessions, so there can hardly be a downside for us.


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