India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

TSJones · Post by **TSJones** » 14 Jan 2016 07:22

Nandu wrote:
RoyG wrote:This Nikki Haley is irritating coconut. Brown on the outside, white on the inside. Tries too hard with that fake Southern accent just like Jindal.
She was born and brought up in the South. Why would she not have a Southern accent, and why do you think it is fake?

Haley gave a good speech, IMO. She is taking more heat for it from the right-wing white nationalist Trump supporters than from anyone else, left or right. Good for her.

well, you know, the overall shame of having a southern accent.....

hnair · Post by **hnair** » 14 Jan 2016 07:40

That '90s sad clown Cloughley is still alive?

But we learnt a new pak-verb "discommoding Pakistan" from the prick. Eg: My commode was not working when I went to discommode my morning pakistan"

I guess everyone does have a purpose

chanakyaa · Post by **chanakyaa** » 14 Jan 2016 08:02

This was perhaps one of Obama's best speeches, ever..

best indeed...

Full transcript here..
State of the Union Speech

<snip>
What I’m asking for is hard. It’s easier to be cynical; to accept that change isn’t possible, and politics is hopeless, and to believe that our voices and actions don’t matter. But if we give up now, then we forsake a better future. Those with money and power will gain greater control over the decisions that could send a young soldier to war, or allow another economic disaster, or roll back the equal rights and voting rights that generations of Americans have fought, even died, to secure. As frustration grows, there will be voices urging us to fall back into tribes, to scapegoat fellow citizens who don’t look like us, or pray like us, or vote like we do, or share the same background.
</snip>

member_27845 · Post by **member_27845** » 14 Jan 2016 11:38

What exactly has Obama achieved in his 8 year tenure ? Just 3-5 major achievements would suffice ?

I can only think of Obamacare - but I am not sure if this is an achievement !!

For someone who was dubbed THE ONE , like some kinda messiah , it would be interesting to take stock list his major achievements

member_29089 · Post by **member_29089** » 14 Jan 2016 13:16

^^ US prez need not "achieve" anything major.

- he ran the country for 8 years without starting any wars
- he killed OBL
- he handled the beginning years' real estate crisis quiet well
(even amid controversy he injected money into banks and corporations)

by Indian standards he did quiet well for the USA

DexterM · Post by **DexterM** » 14 Jan 2016 13:27

Federal judge tosses Alabama officer's excessive force case
Suresh Patel case...

A federal judge on Wednesday threw out a civil rights case against an Alabama police officer accused of using excessive force on an Indian man.
U.S. District Judge Madeline Haikala granted a motion to acquit Madison police officer Eric Parker after his two previous trials ended in hung juries.
In her 92-page opinion, Haikala said evidence that was presented during Parker's two trials didn't eliminate reasonable doubt that Parker was guilty of a crime.
"The Court has no reason to expect a different result in a subsequent trial given the totality of the evidence that the parties have provided," Haikala wrote.
Parker slammed 58-year-old Sureshbhai Patel down face first during a suspicious person investigation in February. The incident was recorded on cameras inside patrol vehicles and Patel was injured in the takedown.
Parker has testified that Patel tried to pull away from him, indicating he may have been up to no good.
Patel has said through an interpreter that he doesn't speak English and couldn't understand officers' orders.
Parker had testified that Patel's actions and appearance were "in sequence" with those of a burglar. He told jurors Patel tried walking away and wouldn't answer questions when officers approached him. Parker has said he was suspicious when Patel reached for his pockets and when he pulled one of his hands free during a pat-down.
Patel wasn't armed and suffered a spinal injury when he was thrown down face-first on a lawn. During the first trial, Parker said he lost his balance and fell on top of the man.
Jurors watched police video that shows an officer knocking Patel's legs out from under him and pushing him face-first to the ground. Patel said his arms and legs went numb after the impact, and he could not stand on his own. Parker's colleagues had given conflicting testimony on whether the takedown violated department policy or was necessary.
Patel had been in the United States only a few days at the time of the confrontation, which happened as Parker and another officer were checking a citizen's report of a suspicious person in a suburban neighborhood near Huntsville.
Jurors deliberated for days in both trials and Parker's attorney Robert Tuten said after the second mistrial in November that the length of the jury's discussions highlights the complexity of the case. Tuten has called the case an unfortunate escalation of police tactics.

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 14 Jan 2016 13:31

Obomber created a mess in Syria, Ukraine and Libia. He conducted color revolutions all over the place, particularly in ME. This may be, in the long run, good for the world as any amount of green or green kill is ok for the world. He allowed Russia be comeback strongly and made an enemy of it so that US MI complex can make more new and costly toys. He allowed N.Korea to have nukes, even H.Bomb. He made a friend of mad mullas of Iran and may end up giving Nukes to them also in few years. As Hillary put it so forcefully while her testimony in US congress ( or it Senate?) does it matter now?

Also he made his police fellows to beat hell out of a old Indian man.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 14 Jan 2016 14:45

I used to think only 3-letter agencies and MIC had gone feral beyond control of GOTUS in certain matters. but the ownership of police mostly by states and towns also means their conduct is not under control of GOTUS in D.C...jury system is another advantage to fight against federal control. and just like the "jim crow" and other state laws used to extend racism as long as possible, this is being dragged out.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 14 Jan 2016 18:05

Saurav Jha's

What the strange cases of Snowden and Headley teach us about US-India Relations

g.sarkar · Post by **g.sarkar** » 14 Jan 2016 20:59

"What the strange cases of Snowden and Headley teach us about US-India Relations"
A small anecdote here:
A few years back, when our Austrian Governor was running the show in California and laying off a lot of babus, I tired to look for another job. As I was employed in the LE business (and I mean business it is) for so long, someone told me try the state dept, they employ a lot of useless people. That was encouraging, I can be as useless as the next guy. A good number of my ex-colleagues had gone to Eyerak as security consultants with fabulous pay and what not. To make a long story short, I looked up what they had to offer. Billery was running the show there at that time. There was a competitive exam for embassy jobs for babus. Remarkably, there was a demand for foreign language skills: Mandarin, Eyeraki Arabic fell under Most critical category. Understandable, both Arabic and Mandarin are difficult languages to pickup and in great demand for US activities in the areas where those languages are spoken. Then came the critical category: To my surprise among the languages there were two that I was fluent in, namely Bengali and Hindi. There may have been other Indian languages in the list, but I do not remember anymore. Shows the US was interested in spreading the knowledge of these Indian languages among its embassy/consulate workers even back then. Must be purely for better communication with the natives.
Gautam

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 14 Jan 2016 21:27

udaym wrote:
This was perhaps one of Obama's best speeches, ever..
best indeed...

Full transcript here..
State of the Union Speech

<snip>
What I’m asking for is hard. It’s easier to be cynical; to accept that change isn’t possible, and politics is hopeless, and to believe that our voices and actions don’t matter. But if we give up now, then we forsake a better future. Those with money and power will gain greater control over the decisions that could send a young soldier to war, or allow another economic disaster, or roll back the equal rights and voting rights that generations of Americans have fought, even died, to secure. As frustration grows, there will be voices urging us to fall back into tribes, to scapegoat fellow citizens who don’t look like us, or pray like us, or vote like we do, or share the same background.
</snip>

Are you talking about the speech or the potential state of affairs?

I am talking about his vision, what he said, how he said, etc.

That the US has problems, *absolutely it does*. So, what is so wrong about it?

KJo · Post by **KJo** » 14 Jan 2016 21:35

Looks like it will be Trump vs Clinton.

If Trump wins, how does that impact India? I think he wants to reduce or cut outsourcing.

JE Menon · Post by **JE Menon** » 14 Jan 2016 22:25

A video made by Chicago police to orient officers on Hinduism... quite sensitively treated.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7ROQ-EcJvU

ArmenT · Post by **ArmenT** » 14 Jan 2016 22:39

disha wrote: TSJones'ji - yes. Gober is also used as organic flying saucers by kids during play. In India it has multi-use - including sealing of packed dirt floors and reinforcing mud walls. Of course used as fuel as well. Some of it goes back into fields.

So when we curse governments across the world and call it Gobernment (the etymology of that word again has a great story!) you sure will understand. In that sense, americans are like indians only

<OT>Gober is now added to the infamous dictionary.</OT>

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 14 Jan 2016 22:42

to China. Once he looks at the savings that accrue to big businesses I think he will not cut outsourcing or if he does he will be more for increasing H1B caps. Trump is against illegal immigration and rightfully so, IMHO, though I don't agree with his solution (of building a wall, deporting second generation, tearing apart close families - parents, siblings).

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 14 Jan 2016 22:44

JE Menon wrote:A video made by Chicago police to orient officers on Hinduism... quite sensitively treated.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7ROQ-EcJvU

Thanks for posting. This video should be required watching for all school kids as well as all police departments, IMHO. I was about to post the link after it was forwarded to me by my better-half.

disha · Post by **disha** » 14 Jan 2016 22:52

KJo wrote:Looks like it will be Trump vs Clinton.

If Trump wins, how does that impact India? I think he wants to reduce or cut outsourcing.

Rooting for Bernie Sanders for democrats., but will still like to see Trump elected.

Trump is a rank outsider and at best he will introduce several uncertainties. In geo-political terms it is a good thing since he can rupture the current convenient setting of President being a figure head and the State Dept. controls the foreign policy (read support to S. Barbaria and Bakistan for playing Great Game Part II). Trump being a businessman and an outsider (something on lines of Reagan, but not quite like him) can upset the apple cart of state department.

Reducing or cutting outsourcing is not necessarily a bad thing for India., body-shops like telwala and most-admired-do-nothing company (wipro/infosys) will have to move up the value chain and actually create some products!!

If Trump goes big on nuclear, all the better. Screw the environment lobbies like Greenpeace and put in some 100GW of nuke power. Being a businessman, he will understand the needs of getting of coal and oil. And falling oil prices and investment in nuke is good for the world. There will be less pressure on India to *not* build nukes. Even Japan will start building nuke plants. So will China. This will screw the petropenny economies a lot.

And I do want Trump to be the 'racist' he is (as some paint him). At least when the SD/USCIRF babus stand up wagging a finger at 'diversity issues in India'., at least the MEA babu will stand up and gently say 'puck you'.

Bernie Sanders will be good for the US middle class., but in the foreign policy, he will toe the SD line. Which is the same old-same old.

At the end, clintoon has to lose the elections.

disha · Post by **disha** » 14 Jan 2016 22:55

ArmenT wrote:<OT>Gober is now added to the infamous dictionary.</OT>

Thanks!

TSJones., as umrikans prepare for electing the next Gobernment for the next four years., do check out the story of "Tauba Tek Singh" by Matoo.

It is time that 'Gobernment' enters the lexicon of Umrika.

member_22733 · Post by **member_22733** » 14 Jan 2016 22:59

The real secret of the US is this:
As far as internal politics and the legislative goes, the Brezident is no more than a figure head as our president is. Thus Obama seems to be "lame" because the Congress and Senate were completely deadlocked over any imaginable legislative action. (not unlike how our CONgoons are deadlocking Modi, but Modi has much much more power in India than Obama in the US).

President is the head of the executive. That means the president is like the COO and not really the CEO (despite the "E" in CEO standing for Executive). There is no CEO of the US. He can direct the Froggy Battam Baboons to jump one way or the other within the confines of the law laid down by the legislative. He cannot go an inch beyond that. He can veto laws, and maybe do a couple of minor things as far as legislative actions go, but he is not supposed to do that under "normal" conditions.

President of the US is more important (because of Fraggy Baboons and See-Aiiiiyeee) OUTSIDE the US than inside.

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 14 Jan 2016 23:13

If I remember my Naturalization reading right, President can veto only once or twice. After that the will of Congress prevails. In that sense, upper house and lower house (especially senators who make up the upper house) are very powerful, lot more powerful than MPs of Loka Sabha and Rajya Sabha of India.

Shreeman · Post by **Shreeman** » 14 Jan 2016 23:21

Lokesh,

This isnt a valid analysis.

Consider Cheney. What did he draw his power from? In the end any office is as effective as the individual occupting it. There are less and less capable individuals in any office in succession. Until revolution. Then you start the same cycle again. Like the ice ages, revolutions arent guaranteed and can be interrupted.

The executive is the only visible office outside of the borders. No doubt. But you cant discout the federal executive powers if those in the chair decide to exercise them. For example, the nobel winner has likely deported millions quietly. No one complains in the media and there is no debate. Is there power there or not? Could the legislature or judiciary or states do that? No? The same applies to the random incarceration program known as war on drugs. The states and even the judiciary can do squat. Is there power there? Then there is revenue admunistration. The there is land and resource management in all its forms. You cant properly breathe (environment laws and pollution control) without running afoul of the executives signature.

The priorities -- access to health care, marriage equality, etc -- werent that terrible. Even the original position on immigration, even if driven by vote banks, was at least anti slavery. Its the compromise implementation that has made a total hash of it.

And you think this one was lame? You wait for the next one to make the great W look like an einstein!

edit -- vt, legislation isnt the effective route for doing most things in the government. Not for peace and not for war. All that pape is just that. A show for the masses.

member_22733 · Post by **member_22733** » 14 Jan 2016 23:24

The executive has infinite power to execute, no doubt, but execute only what the legislative sets as the vision for Unkil in the form of the "laws of the laaaand".

Shreeman · Post by **Shreeman** » 14 Jan 2016 23:33

Unfortunately not. Not even in the envisioned form. The legislative power is reign of the purse. And the legislation is considered a check to balance the possibility of the executive running amock with its infinite power.

If you take away the purse, then congress is as powerless as the parliament of somalia. And the budgetary processes are now so lard coated that there is no possibility of an actual check on administrations intent of using any monies.

Legislation is reactive. It can prevent something in the future when it works -- "A law in the name of XYZ who died a horrible death because we didnt officially explicitly say he couldnt be killed by shredding in a trash compacter". Its role is to watch and object. The executive sets its own goals and policies. aThat is the whole point of trying to be the president and not the speaker of the house!

saip · Post by **saip** » 14 Jan 2016 23:44

vayu tuvan wrote:If I remember my Naturalization reading right, President can veto only once or twice. After that the will of Congress prevails. In that sense, upper house and lower house (especially senators who make up the upper house) are very powerful, lot more powerful than MPs of Loka Sabha and Rajya Sabha of India.

I thought both the Houses of Congress must over ride the veto with 2/3rds majority separately. AFAIK they can resend the bill and he can re-Veto it. I do not think there is a limit to how many times he can veto a bill, but I do not believe it ever happened i.e Congress sending the same bill again to the President for signature. If the Veto is overridden it becomes the law without President's signature.

member_22733 · Post by **member_22733** » 15 Jan 2016 00:23

Shreeman wrote:Unfortunately not. Not even in the envisioned form. The legislative power is reign of the purse. And the legislation is considered a check to balance the possibility of the executive running amock with its infinite power.

If you take away the purse, then congress is as powerless as the parliament of somalia. And the budgetary processes are now so lard coated that there is no possibility of an actual check on administrations intent of using any monies.

Legislation is reactive. It can prevent something in the future when it works -- "A law in the name of XYZ who died a horrible death because we didnt officially explicitly say he couldnt be killed by shredding in a trash compacter". Its role is to watch and object. The executive sets its own goals and policies. aThat is the whole point of trying to be the president and not the speaker of the house!

This is veering OT. I have my disagreements. Here is an instance: COngress/Senate was able to defund the executive arm of the federal govt. for about a month in 2012 or 2013. Lot of employees were either laid off or given upaid holidays.

As far as India goes, we just have to remember that we will have no friends in the US. Not for a long time to come.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 15 Jan 2016 01:19

VijayR wrote:What exactly has Obama achieved in his 8 year tenure ? Just 3-5 major achievements would suffice ?

If really interested try <this>
(for more see this
or may be this..

Falijee · Post by **Falijee** » 15 Jan 2016 06:25

Five Star Foreign Medical Care For Paki Legislatures

Millions spent on treatment of Pakistani legislators abroad

SLAMABAD (Online) – Millions of rupees have been spent from the national kitty on the treatment of parliamentarians in foreign countries while poor have to struggle to get cheapest medicines in government hospitals.
According to documents available with Online, 51,000 UK pounds were spent on the treatment of senator Mushahid Ullah Khan, Rs4.6 million were released for treatment of former minister for religious affairs Hamid Saeed Kazmi in Britain after a life attempt on him.
Over $1565 were released for treatment of Makhdoom Shahabud Din in the US for treatment of fever; 30,000 US dollars were provided for treatment of Haji Adeel in the UK; and Rs423,000 were released for treatment of Ilyas Balore.
When contacted, former senator Syed Zafar Ali Shah said that it was sheer injustice as most people in the country were deprived of cheap medical treatment while on the other hand billion of rupees were being spent on treatment of parliamentarians abroad.

During a survey of different hospitals in Islamabad, it transpired that no medicines except for cough syrups, and a few generic medicines were available for the poor and the people purchase most medicines from private medical stores.

IMO, if Immy (AKA Taliban Khan) can give quality medical treatment to a Taliban Commander for free, there is no reason why the Shaukat Khanum Haspital cannot open its doors for similar treatment to the sick Aam Abduls of Pakiland

chanakyaa · Post by **chanakyaa** » 15 Jan 2016 07:21

NRao, I'm referring to the current state of affairs.

Can you please tell me which institution or individuals is he referring to in this sentence? "...Those with money and power will gain greater control over the decisions that could send a young soldier to war, or allow another economic disaster...".

If you don't mind briefly, what part of his speech you find visionary?

disha · Post by **disha** » 15 Jan 2016 08:16

Amber G. wrote:
VijayR wrote:What exactly has Obama achieved in his 8 year tenure ? Just 3-5 major achievements would suffice ?
If really interested try <this>
(for more see this
or may be this..

Seriously Amber G.? Killing M. Gaddhafi is one of the accomplishment of Obama? Draw dawn from Afghanistan an accomplishment? And the financial reforms had to come after the economic collapse. Great that those reforms passed, but the banks were not even given a slap on the wrist!

Only 50 accomplishments (barely) reached after 8 years in the office? And most of his reforms were in the first term.

Yes., Obama did bring in the Health Care act and ended war in Iraq. But the sustained recession and his 'class warfare' has tar'ed and feathered his reputation domestically. And internationally, the loss of crimea and the sustained genocide in Syria and the rise of ISIS.

If he had not disturbed crimea and syria and stopped his rhetoric on 'class warfare' and really worked on getting the US out of the current funk (hint opening up the immigration tap) would have really worked wonders for US and his presidency.

The very fact that ordinary Americans are turning to Trump is a testament to the failures of Obama. Trump - who would have thunk it!

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 15 Jan 2016 08:43

^^^Disha,

The biggest problem with Obama has been the erosion of the American middle class in the last 6 years. There are more people today in the US that are on government assistance, higher poverty rates for lower income groups, a higher percentage of people living paycheck to paycheck, stagnant wages, and declining family savings. This CAN NOT be blamed on the previous administration.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 15 Jan 2016 08:50

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 15 Jan 2016 11:08

President Obama is insincere and is being kicked out just like Bill Clinton. In both their presidencies Silicon Valley blew a bubble of gigantic proportions. Clinton era bubble burst during dubya - Obama bubble will burst during Trump/ms. Clinton's term - guaranteed.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 15 Jan 2016 11:22

well to be fair the purchasing power and savings of american middle class has been eroding since 1960s...which was a golden era except for plight of blacks browns and reds

share of wealth in hands of top 20% has surely increased.
economic mobility via solid union manufacturing jobs has gone to be replaced by less secure service industry jobs like say logistics

KLNMurthy · Post by **KLNMurthy** » 15 Jan 2016 14:14

hnair wrote:That '90s sad clown Cloughley is still alive?

But we learnt a new pak-verb "discommoding Pakistan" from the prick. Eg: My commode was not working when I went to discommode my morning pakistan"

I guess everyone does have a purpose

Please to add coffee spill alert.

TSJones · Post by **TSJones** » 15 Jan 2016 15:53

vayu tuvan wrote:President Obama is insincere and is being kicked out just like Bill Clinton. In both their presidencies Silicon Valley blew a bubble of gigantic proportions. Clinton era bubble burst during dubya - Obama bubble will burst during Trump/ms. Clinton's term - guaranteed.

hmmmmm.......guaranteed? Such savant powers......you must be very rich indeed.

I remember the '60's quit well....

1. houses were smaller back then and less insulated against weather.

2. long distance telephone usage was extremely expensive.

3. cars had fewer amenities, a radio cost extra, engines lasted only 100,000 miles, tires lasted 20,000 miles, mufflers, 50,000 miles, motor exhaust produced clouds of smog, there were no three point seat belts or crash bags or side bars inside car doors to protect from side crashes, no collaspsible steering wheel to keep from spearing you like a fish in a head on collison, no anti rupture gas tanks, etc., etc., engine needed a tune up every 3,999 miles or so.....

4. medicare, medicaid, voting rights act and civil rights act all became a reality in 1960's, something we take for granted now days.

5.far more people are now covered by medical insurance.

6. No more military draft, head shave and sent to a far off war unless you volunteer. half my platoon in the Marines were draftees. warfare has been transformed by computers and machines.

7. Italian food was considered foreign. I never had a slice of pizza until 1967. I thought canned chow mein was Chinese food. never had a burrito until 1971.

8. there were three TV channels, maybe.. a lot of towns only had one or two.

9. You got cancer, usually you died.

10, heart by pass surgery was rare for most of America, as was hip replacement.

11. I learned to program by using punch cards. batch computers worked on one job at a time, there was very little real time on line computing. printers had to wait and take its turn, no spooling of printing while waiting for printer to finish..

I cud go on nad on.......

but generally the good old days weren't so good........

also hard to get a stock brokerage account, no stock firm wanted odd lotters.......and very hard to get up to the minute stock quotes, generally odd lotters had to use mutual funds.....

oh, and you could get arrested for buying ***** and commedians got arrested for using for using foul language in their acts.

New York City you could not perform w/o a caberet card which ruled out guys like Thelonious Monk who used drugs. so you could hear Thelonius play jazz on radio and records but not see him in NYC. In New Orleans Louis Armstrong after he was famous was not allowed to have a white musician play with him on stage. Louis never went back to his home town again.

there were no black people on tv until Bill Cosby broke the color barrier on the tv show ISpy.

I never met an Asian until a Japanese girl came to our high school as a foreign exchange student. As evil and racist as Alabama was, she fought like hell going back to Japan and resisted her parents and went to college in Alabama. She really dug it in the US.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 15 Jan 2016 19:33

TSJ,

The 1960s were a very different time in the US. The people who were in charge of the government (federal, state, & municipal), business/industries, and academia were in large part WWII veterans aged 40s-50s. They had a very different view of the US. Many were flat out racists and hated blacks, but had a strong work and family ethic. Indians started arriving from 1964 onwards in graduate school engineering and science programs, and many who graduated went to industry and academia with plenty jobs as there was a skilled labor shortage. Getting a Green Card was no big deal if you were educationally qualified. Most white people didn't go on to graduate school, similar to what we see today, but it was compounded by the draft and Vietnam war where if you didn't make passing grades, you wouldn't get a draft deferment. This also compounded the skilled labor shortage. Blacks didn't enter into college in large numbers because they were generally not admitted, those who did were rare like the Sydney Poitier type. Engineering managers would rather hire an Indian or another Asian as these people were well qualified and would work without complaint. At that time you had over 90% of students from India stay remain in the US. India was still getting over its colonial era. Japan and east Asia were in the process of building up and still recovering from WWII. Life was getting better there, but quality of life was still better in the US, hence your Yoko Ono friend didn't want to go back.

member_29218 · Post by **member_29218** » 15 Jan 2016 21:20

TSJones wrote: I remember the '60's quit well....

1. houses were smaller back then and less insulated against weather.

2. long distance telephone usage was extremely expensive.

3. cars had fewer amenities, a radio cost extra, engines lasted only 100,000 miles, tires lasted 20,000 miles, mufflers, 50,000 miles, motor exhaust produced clouds of smog, there were no three point seat belts or crash bags or side bars inside car doors to protect from side crashes, no collaspsible steering wheel to keep from spearing you like a fish in a head on collison, no anti rupture gas tanks, etc., etc., engine needed a tune up every 3,999 miles or so.....

4. medicare, medicaid, voting rights act and civil rights act all became a reality in 1960's, something we take for granted now days.

5.far more people are now covered by medical insurance.

6. No more military draft, head shave and sent to a far off war unless you volunteer. half my platoon in the Marines were draftees. warfare has been transformed by computers and machines.

7. Italian food was considered foreign. I never had a slice of pizza until 1967. I thought canned chow mein was Chinese food. never had a burrito until 1971.

8. there were three TV channels, maybe.. a lot of towns only had one or two.

9. You got cancer, usually you died.

10, heart by pass surgery was rare for most of America, as was hip replacement.

11. I learned to program by using punch cards. batch computers worked on one job at a time, there was very little real time on line computing. printers had to wait and take its turn, no spooling of printing while waiting for printer to finish..

I cud go on nad on.......

but generally the good old days weren't so good........

also hard to get a stock brokerage account, no stock firm wanted odd lotters.......and very hard to get up to the minute stock quotes, generally odd lotters had to use mutual funds.....

oh, and you could get arrested for buying ***** and commedians got arrested for using for using foul language in their acts.

New York City you could not perform w/o a caberet card which ruled out guys like Thelonious Monk who used drugs. so you could hear Thelonius play jazz on radio and records but not see him in NYC. In New Orleans Louis Armstrong after he was famous was not allowed to have a white musician play with him on stage. Louis never went back to his home town again.

there were no black people on tv until Bill Cosby broke the color barrier on the tv show ISpy.

I never met an Asian until a Japanese girl came to our high school as a foreign exchange student. As evil and racist as Alabama was, she fought like hell going back to Japan and resisted her parents and went to college in Alabama. She really dug it in the US.

Ah, the Wonder Years!

I grew up in India at the time, but knew enough about life in the US even then.

1. You could walk out in the middle of the night with your girl without fear of being mugged in the street
(unless you lived in a really bad part of town). In India we kids could ride around on our bicycles all day around the neighborhood without worries of being run over by a rampaging bus or lorry.

Plenty of homeless still on the streets

2. Cars were few and didn't work well, but you didn't have to sit in traffic for two hours every morning to get to work

3. If you got cancer, sure you probably died then and not that much has changed, you still die but you do that on a ventilator for weeks while your relatives decided who gets the life-insurance. Today nursing homes are nothing but ventilator-farms. Millions are still uninsured or under-insured.

4. Sure, you have civil rights and a Black President, but white policemen still shoot unarmed black people in the back and rampaging white youth decapitate black men while dragging their bodies behind their pickups - just for fun.

5. No more draft, but it is till the poor and underprivileged who volunteer for the armed forces. How many rich lawyer/doctor/wallstreet families send their kinds into the force?

6. Morbid obesity is an epidemic in the US, I ought to know, I deal with these people on a daily basis. Too much variety of food still does not mean GOOD food, it is the same McD junk people eat.

7. Too much television still does not mean they tell the truth. Reality shows, shopping channels and game shows actually mean there is little of value. Unfortunately this malady has afflicted the rest of the world as well.

8. Now we have people with smartphones, constantly glued to them even while crossing the street, no people-to-people interaction, texting each other even when standing in the same line, sexting in high school.....

I could go on and on too.

The point I am making is that advancements in technology, computer science, food choices, healthcare, societal mores and legislation have not necessarily brought us greater happiness or a better quality of life.

Greater life expectancy is not from treatment of cancers but from better public health, vaccinations, control of infections and in some cases better nutrition.

Ethnic and racial biases still exist, religion is an even bigger problem in the world today than it was in the '60s.

The biggest difference, IMHO is in the perception of America (and by extension the West in general) in the world. In the 60s, the United States was considered the leader in academics, research, technology, science, quality of life, fairness and justice. A place that everyone wanted to come to to pursue a higher level of education. The Universities were considered the best, the power of the USA was palpable at every level of life everywhere in the world.

Today that reputation has been tarnished badly, decline of research and academia, inadequate funding for basic sciences, continued belligerence in an increasingly polarized world, stubborn pursuit of partisan international politics and a blunderbuss approach to problems that require great subtlety and tact has made the US of A, a place people across the world love to hate. Economic refugees still stream across the borders, but then they also do that into India. A very sad fact and partly our own doing. No longer a shining beacon of light to lead the world and yet a power that everyone expects to fix everything that is wrong with the world puts it in an unenviable place.

As with so many other nations, inept and often handicapped leadership has just made matters that much worse.

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 15 Jan 2016 21:50

Tsj: ok guaranteed was strong. Let me modify that to "very good chance". Difficult to keep on churning out same old same old smartphones when every has one. Enormous feature creep is not going to sell more. The social networking is a passing fad as much as the reality show genre was. So yes, SV is in a bubble. I am not saying that the entire U.S. Economy is in a bubble. BTW, how can I become very rich/an abject pauper overnight if I invest long term, hain?

Primus: good post. One nit though - I think US education system at all levels is still better than lots of countries including China. Higher education is still the best in the world, if we are talking about averages.

Decline of the U.S. Is not going to happen while I am alive. It will take a long time - hundreds of years - unless there is a black swan event Jihadi delivered nuc or biological weapon or natural calamity. India is on the rise. Only two countries worth living in the near future for the next seven generations. But we are all going to be dead anyway.

sanjaykumar · Post by **sanjaykumar** » 15 Jan 2016 23:56

I never met an Asian until a Japanese girl came to our high school as a foreign exchange student. As evil and racist as Alabama was, she fought like hell going back to Japan and resisted her parents and went to college in Alabama. She really dug it in the US.

I don't think you mean that as irony, it is one of the things evident in UK, Canada, US and India. To have that insight is not common but is evidence of social evolution.

cars had fewer amenities, a radio cost extra, engines lasted only 100,000 miles, tires lasted 20,000 miles, mufflers, 50,000 miles, motor exhaust .....

I don't know what you were driving, no such car lasted 100,000 miles in the 60s. I drove a Chevrolet Vega not long afterwards. I remember being in that POS and think 'these people put a man on the moon'.

TSJones · Post by **TSJones** » 16 Jan 2016 00:18

as a kid I saw the bloody sunday march at edmund pettus bridge in Selma on local news when I lived in Huntsville.

I was stunned at the sheer stupidity and brutality of local and state officials. People don't have a right to peaceably march?

However nobody was killed unlike in northern Ireland in 1972 bloody sunday march where 26 people were shot.

Europe gets serious, buddy.

red neck rampage like recently in Leipzig, germany? No way!