Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10, 2015

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby A_Gupta » 25 Aug 2015 22:55

The press got it right on July 11, 2015, e.g.,
http://thenationleader.com/news/7262-in ... ummit.aspx
In their first bilateral talks in over an year, the two leaders met for nearly an hour in Ufa's Congress Hall here on the sidelines of the Shanghai Cooperation Organization (SCO) summit and decided that National Security Advisers Ajit Doval and Sartaj Aziz will meet in New Delhi either next month or in September to discuss "all issues connected to terrorism".

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby A_Gupta » 25 Aug 2015 23:07

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVhL58ri19M

Sushma Swaraj, July 7, 2014, after the 6th BRICS summit, (the 2015 summit was the 7th BRICS summit) pointing out, in the very beginning, in Hindi, that all the 6 BRICS summits were attended by the Prime Minister only, the Foreign Minister never accompanied him. That the BRICS summit held in Delhi was not attended by the Foreign Minister.

You need to listen to all of her reply prior to reading the statement on BRICS to understand the vile politics behind the "Sushma Swaraj ought to have been there" ex-MEA buzz.

PS: FYI,
Modi and the world - laudatory article on Modi's foreign policy achievements.
http://www.telegraphindia.com/1150825/j ... _38904.jsp
.... ranged against Modi are mediocrity and worse, both in his party and the Opposition, bureaucratic inertia and lack of institutional capacity.


PPS: One would imagine that ex-MEA types are the ones most aware of protocol, so their "Sushma Swaraj should have been there" is malicious, to say the least.

PPPS: The talk of the malicious is to insinuate that there is a schism between the PM and the Minister of External Affairs, as evident in the question in Parliament; and elsewhere in the media.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby A_Gupta » 25 Aug 2015 23:58

Council on Foreign Relations' Alyssa Ayres thought that the Ufa statement was clear:
http://blogs.cfr.org/asia/2015/08/25/pa ... e-one-job/

Over the weekend, Pakistan’s national security advisor, Sartaj Aziz, called off planned talks with India’s national security advisor after a series of public disagreements escalated to the point of no return. Islamabad and New Delhi failed to agree on the scope of the agenda, despite a clear joint statement issued by Prime Ministers Nawaz Sharif and Narendra Modi during their meeting last month in Ufa, Russia, which had set the parameters for India-Pakistan dialogue in coming months.


What is Pakistan's job #1?
It’s Pakistan’s job to restore India’s, and the world’s, confidence in its intentions, and that will not happen with continued terrorist attacks across the border in India, and with blustery rhetoric about using nuclear weapons. Tackling terror, all terror, should be job number one for Islamabad.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby Falijee » 26 Aug 2015 00:14

No militancy in Punjab seminaries: Rana Sanaullah :rotfl:[*]

[*] This Minister was recently named by a Pakistani newspaper as one of the most 'enthusiastic admirer' of the Jihadist movement of Pakiland!

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby MurthyB » 26 Aug 2015 01:17

rajpa wrote:With due deference to troll hunters, I will continue to respond...

If she had clarified all this before all the brouhaha started, perhaps ideally at Ufa itself, things may have turned out way better. Perhaps she could have helped Jaishankar draft those words in a crystal clear manner in Ufa.


In a way it is good that the pakis got confused by this verbiage and used that as a pretext to downhill ski. Had the words been crystal clear, they would have had to use a terrorist attack to derail things, or kill some more people along the LoC.

Anyway, some people who were NOT confused and felt that Kashmir was off the table included Geela-nahi:

http://www.dawn.com/news/1194428

According to ZeeNews , Geelani rejected the invitation on the grounds that the Kashmir issue was "ignored" in the joint statement between India and Pakistan after Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif and Indian premier Modi held their meeting on the sidelines of the Shanghai Cooperation Organisation (SCO) Summit in Ufa, Russia on July 10.


Another Paki who was also not confused (so some Pakis do speak better Inglish than some Indians it looks like :rotfl: ):

http://nation.com.pk/columns/22-Jul-2015/unrealism-and-incompetence-at-ufa

The Pakistan-India joint statement of 10 July, 2015 issued at Ufa carries the process of Pakistan’s capitulation and compliance with India’s one-sided demands a step further without any corresponding concessions from the Indian side. While mentioning the willingness of the two countries to discuss all outstanding issues, the joint statement avoids any reference to Kashmir, obviously to take into account Indian sensitivities. Mumbai case trial is the only issue which is specifically mentioned in the statement. In line with India’s unwillingness to resume a structured bilateral dialogue to discuss all outstanding issues until its demands concerning the Mumbai terrorist attacks are met, there was no agreement to resume the bilateral dialogue. Even in the context of the issue of terrorism, while Mumbai was specifically mentioned, no reference was made to Pakistan’s officially made allegations regarding India’s involvement in terrorist activities in Balochistan, Karachi and FATA. There was a reference in the joint statement to the holding of the meeting of the National Security Advisers of the two countries in New Delhi but only to discuss terrorism.


Another Paki with remarkable comprehension skills:

http://nation.com.pk/columns/18-Jul-2015/the-ufa-restart

Even a cursory look at the five points of the statement leaves little doubt that the text was prepared by the Indian officials to which their Pakistani counterparts willy-nilly agreed. Leaving aside the two points regarding the release of arrested fishermen and religious tourism, the substance of the other two is skewed towards the Indian agenda and the remaining one relates to meetings of military officers essentially for matters pertaining to LOC and the borders. While the preface sentence prior to the listing of the five steps does refer to collective responsibility for peace and development and the need for discussing “all outstanding issues”, the meeting envisaged between the Security Advisors is to be confined to “all issues connected to terrorism”. Add to this the 5th step which specifically speaks of expediting the “Mumbai case trial including additional information like providing voice samples”.


To ensure that this breaking out of an epidemic of comprehension skills was not contained only to the nation, I also checked dawn:

http://www.dawn.com/news/1194294
The joint statement at Ufa was a disaster — Kashmir has not been specifically mentioned.


Sounds like the Injuns pulled a turn around from Sharm-el-Sheikh where it was a gullible My Man Singh who allowed Baloch stuff to be inserted and then had to furiously backpeddle once the shiite hit the fan. This time it was the pakis.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby Tuvaluan » 26 Aug 2015 01:33

Cyril Almeida once again proves that pakjabi belonging to any religion is still a RAPE pakjabi.

Blame Nawaz

First, note similarity in view between this paki and the likes of Praveen Swami and the Ex-MEA types. Specifically, the problem with "the wording of ufa document" was that it does give anything for "the boys", i.e., the paki terrorist army, so they would come to the table. This is the same verbiage as some of the worthies here posting about "imperfect language" in the Ufa document and by the likes of ex-MEA types and Indian Express journos like praveen swami.

First, let us note this paki's feeling of entitlement - apparently India is doing itself a disfavor if Pakis are kept out of Indian regional policy.

There were basically two things Nawaz had to play off each other in Ufa: terrorism and Kashmir.

Modi had made it known that it was terrorism first if talks were going to happen or else it was going to be Indian foreign policy minus Pakistan.

If that sounds stupid and self-defeating, it is. But that’s for India to decide and Modi to realise.

Over here, the boys are not in favour of rapprochement and would never countenance letting Kashmir slip off the agenda.


Why speak to the paki army with Nawaz Sharif as a proxy, if the army is the one controlling the agenda? In fact, why doesn't the army stop hiding behind the "elected government"? Why should India talk to a proxy of the actual power center that runs pakistan, and provide them the facade of a "democracy" so that it can be exploited for PR purposes that only serve the purpose of helping the paki army?

If No 1 had just read “A meeting in New Delhi between the two NSAs to discuss all issues”, Nawaz would have had some wiggle room. It’s the “connected to terrorism” that made it Indian.

Same thing with No 5: the “including additional information like providing voice samples” was too specific and too Indian-ish. Extra clauses can be dangerous things.

After that, the only way Ufa was not going to be vetoed by the boys was if there had been a sixth point about Kashmir — or Balochistan or Samjhota. Some kind of red meat.


Paki wants to do an equal-equal on "Indian" terrorism by including Samjhauta express (which was committed by pakistan) and Blockistan on the agenda, like in sharm-el-sheikh.

"imperfect language" in the Ufa seems like an euphemism for "not enough concessions to the pakis and their army"...though you would not ex-MEA types to push the paki line.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby Falijee » 26 Aug 2015 01:40

Sex Education - Pakistani Style :shock:

Tutor confesses he abused schoolgirls for ‘sex education’

LAHORE - The 50-year-old tutor arrested Wednesday for raping and filming young Lahore schoolgirls last night told The Nation he had abused them for “sex education”.[*] In an exclusive interview at Green Town police station, Hussein Ahmed Khan confessed he had sexually assaulted as many as 20 young girls over a six-year period, – all the victims are under 13.


[*] The concept of 'sex education' is not mentioned in the Book, therefore it is not halal

I think there were some ten to 20 girls, my students with whom I had relationships. I have been teaching students for many years,” he added. He denied, however, that he had raped any of his victims. “I just tried to educate the children about sex. I performed many sexual acts with the students on camera but did not rape them,” he confessed.

His claim was rejected by detectives who said he can be seen raping a young pupil in one of the videos.


The arrest of Hussein Ahmed Khan and the discovery of his large collection of child abuse videos emerged barely two weeks after more than 280 children were found to have been drugged, raped, and beaten by a child ***** gang in Kasur, 60 kilometres from Lahore in north Punjab. Police in Kasur faced nationwide condemnation when it emerged that the abuse had continued for more than eight years without any action taken against the gang.

There is no evidence to link the two scandals but the number of film clips involved and the tutor’s access to “dozens” of young girls at his academy suggests the scale of abuse may be far bigger.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby Falijee » 26 Aug 2015 01:48

U.S. Refuses To Pay 'Rent' To Pakistan

US Set to Suspend Military Aid to Pakistan

The U.S. government will withhold certification of Pakistan’s counter-terrorism operations against the Haqqani network.[*]

[*] 'Lease conditions' not fulfilled :D

The United States government will not certify Pakistan’s counter-terrorism operations in North Waziristan over recent months as adequately damaging to the Haqqani network, a U.S.-designated terror group. The U.S. Department of Defense has reportedly notified the Pakistani embassy in Washington of the development, according to a report by Dawn. The non-certification of the Pakistani counter-terror campaign, known as Operation Zarb-e-Azb, will block the release of a new tranche of U.S. financial assistance for the Pakistani military from the Coalition Support Fund (CSF). CSF support had been extended for a year with a specific stipulation that the U.S. Department of Defense would certify the effectiveness of Pakistani military operations in North Waziristan against the Haqqani network.


Pakistan will have to find a 'new tenant' for their 'property' :mrgreen:

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby A_Gupta » 26 Aug 2015 01:56

MurthyB wrote:...
To ensure that this breaking out of an epidemic of comprehension skills was not contained only to the nation, I also checked dawn

:rotfl:

We can add to that The Friday Times, e.g.,
http://www.thefridaytimes.com/tft/bold-move/
Mr Modi and Mr Sharif, during their meeting – which followed the worst patch in ties for years – agreed on a roadmap of future engagement starting with a meeting of the National Security Advisers in Delhi for discussing terrorism related concerns.


And the Express Tribune, e.g., even on that contentious preamble:
http://tribune.com.pk/story/919703/nawa ... -dialogue/

There was a reference to overall ties in the joint statement; “India and Pakistan have a collective responsibility to ensure peace and promote development. To do so, they are prepared to discuss all outstanding issues.”

However, there was no mention of either Kashmir or the fate of the composite dialogue suspended following the November 2008 Mumbai attacks.


i.e., the Express Tribune wrote on July 13 what was confirmed by Sushma Swaraj in her press conference of August 22.

One can add Business Recorder to the infected-with-comprehension list:
http://www.brecorder.com/top-stories/0: ... 2015-07-18

In Ufa, the two leaders exchanged views on issues of bilateral and regional interest and agreed that India and Pakistan have a collective responsibility to ensure peace and promote development. It was also decided that national security advisers of the two countries will first meet in New Delhi and then in Islamabad particularly to discuss all issues connected to terrorism.


This unilateral outbreak of outstanding comprehension skills in Pakistan must be dealt with, no doubt, by an emergency Aman-ki-Asha junket and back-channels diplomacy missions by the ex-MEA types who, just as sure as facts remain facts, are totally, incurably and unchangeably confused.
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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby krithivas » 26 Aug 2015 01:57

(Regarding Military Aid suspension) The President, as usual, will issue a waiver and the monies disbursed. There is no need to celebrate nor despair. Just watch the drama repeat itself.
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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby Tuvaluan » 26 Aug 2015 01:58

http://www.dawn.com/news/1202534/no-terrorist-network-left-capable-of-operating-in-pakistan-nisar

So the Paki Nisar's article claiming "all terrorist networks have been eliminated by curb-e-zam-zam" is to con the US to pay up the rent money on time, but looks like that is not working this time around. let us see who fills the paki begging bowl this time around, or how long the US delays this month's rent.

Federal Interior Minister Chaudhry Nisar Ali Khan on Monday laid out an elaborate progress report on the National Action Plan (NAP), saying that terrorism in the country had been brought down by 70 per cent, adding that no militant network could now operate in Pakistan.


don't worry, the above is just high-grade paki heroin talking. :rotfl:
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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby A_Gupta » 26 Aug 2015 02:00

I have absolutely no doubt that Pakistan is busy organizing Chechen rebels, so that "suppressing" them can be its gun-to-the-head and service for its new friend, Russia.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby CRamS » 26 Aug 2015 02:02

TuvaluanJi,

Just like Pakijabis, it seems to me that our side, I mean the likes of Praveen Swami and the Ex-MEA types etc, have all conceded that there is a quid pro between TSP use of terror as an instrument of state policy and Kashmir. All of them make the same case, i.e., there equivalence between India wanting to discuss terrorism first and foremost with TSP wanting to discuss Kashmir, and hence wording must reflect both sentiments. Terror is now just another agenda item. Ending that for any meaningful discussions on other issues is no longer a non negotiable red line for those worthies.

Another bogus claim Almedia makes is that the problem in Kashmir, specifically the valley, are not TSP's doing. Fact of the matter, as even Fair didi mentions several times, is that bereft of TSP terror through proxies there, Kashmir is like any other chaotic Indian state.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby Tuvaluan » 26 Aug 2015 02:16

CRamS, that disease is more widespread among the Indian polity than you think, but thankfully none of them drive policy, including the ex-MEA types or praveen swami -- they can all sip their spirits and bloviate about how hyper-nationalists are stopping peace between India and Pakistan but the army and the rest of the govt. machinery hopefully has learnt from this episode. I hope that the bad move at Ufa by this NDA regime will not be repeated any time soon, because that was a terrible idea, no matter who was responsible for it. What would be worse is repeating the same mistake a second time around.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby Tuvaluan » 26 Aug 2015 02:19

A_Gupta wrote:I have absolutely no doubt that Pakistan is busy organizing Chechen rebels, so that "suppressing" them can be its gun-to-the-head and service for its new friend, Russia.



I am quite sure that the russians are far less boneheaded than the americans, in that they will make pakistan face the music sooner rather than later if the pakis double cross them in that manner. Besides, it is the chinese that the pakis have placed all their love, affection, friendship and trust on, so Xinjiang may heat up long before chechnya if the chinese whack the paki rentboys down the line for failing to deliver.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby A_Gupta » 26 Aug 2015 02:23

http://nation.com.pk/national/25-Aug-20 ... t-orchards
Giant bats devour fruit orchards
Hundreds of horrible and giant bats, weighting up to five kilogramme each, have attacked and devoured fruit orchards in the suburban area of Sahiwal Town, thereby creating financial concerns for the farmers.

Their flying from their abodes presents terrifying scene at the sunset. The heavyweight bats hover in the sky in the daylight. The owners of the orchards said that a few months ago, the bats having more than five kilogrammes of weight each stormed their orchards of mangoes, pear, bananas and dates trees and within days, they eat up all the fruit which they had to sell in the market to earn a living. The famers said that they had become hand to mouth because of the assault of the bats. They are hesitant to cultivate their crops because of presence of the huge number of the bats in the area, they said. They added that the people especially children remain sleepless in the nights due to the bats’ terror.


The world's largest bat is the flying fox bats, the Australian one that weighs upto 1 kilogram, and the Filipino one that can weigh upto 1.2kg.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grey-head ... cteristics
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giant_gol ... flying_fox
The Indian one can be 1.6 kg.
http://www.batrescue.org.au/website/ind ... &Itemid=54

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Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10, 2015

Postby Peregrine » 26 Aug 2015 02:52

Pakistan’s attention span problem
Nawaz Sharif’s problem is that he wants to be his own foreign policy expert which is where he creates problems not only for himself but for the country he is supposed to be leading.

The goof-up about the meeting in Delhi between the two national security advisers is a perfect example of this. The PM seemed to have no idea of what he was putting his signature to at Ufa, the Russian city where he met Narendra Modi. Among the steps agreed to were: “a meeting in New Delhi between the two NSAs to discuss all issues connected to terrorism.” Period: nothing about the mountains or the rivers or the climate or Kashmir…all issues connected to terrorism. Does this leave anything to the imagination?

Furthermore, “Both sides agreed to discuss ways and means to expedite the Mumbai case trial, including additional information like providing voice samples.” This is the Indian take on Mumbai and our PM, his own Kissinger, agreed to this.

When the Indians said only terrorism-related issues would be discussed they were quoting Ufa, not making anything up. Good for us that they dragged in the Hurriyat – insisting, foolishly, that no one from the Pakistani side should so much as have a cup of tea with its leaders in Delhi – which gave us the pretext to get out of this mess.

Cheers Image

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby Tuvaluan » 26 Aug 2015 03:04

Ayaz Amir seems to have a short attention span himself

Terrorism has not been eliminated but it is on the run, its force blunted. As a result, the sense of hopelessness defining Pakistan’s state of mind just the middle of last year is no more. There’s hope in the air that Pakistan’s condition is finally on the mend. Leadership has done this, but military leadership not any other kind.


Maybe someone should remind this joker AA that the terrorist attack on the pakistan school was in Dec 2014, so nothing has been blunted except the mind of pakis overall. Looks like the RAPEs are all craving for a military dictatorship to run the government -- more army and more islam is the only correct answer to pakistan's problems, as we all know.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby amit » 26 Aug 2015 05:34

A_Gupta wrote:
rajpa wrote:Folks - We need to look at this Ufa thing from the perspective of NSA vs MEA. The ex-MEA type people (and some other types as well) have expressed that the language of the terms and conditions in Ufa was not clearly specified enough to keep the agenda for the talks confined to terrorism. This let the genie out of the bottle in terms of the K-factor. Now if Doval, his team, Sushma, her team had gotten together and drafted the language, it would have been clearer. That is the argument.


Actually, whoever authored it, the UFA statement was issued by the Foreign Secretaries, Indian Foreign Secretary S. Jaishankar and his Pakistan counterpary Aizaz Ahmad Chaudhry. e.g., see
http://www.thehindu.com/news/resources/ ... 407431.ece

If the Foreign Secretaries read it out, on what basis do the ex-MEA types say that MEA didn't have any input into the language, and imply that it was NSA + Prime Minister that put this together without MEA review?

PS: the news says that the Indian delegation that met Pakistan in Ufa included NSA and Foreign Secretary. e.g., http://www.thehindu.com/news/resources/ ... 407431.ece

Are the ex-MEA types saying that there should have been no Ufa statement without Sushma Swaraj being physically present?


If I may butt into this discussion, even though the thread has moved on quite a bit, I think the main point of why the ex-MEA types are up in arms against what happened is being missed. Golum's non arrival for talks indicates a new phase of a freeze in relations. The government's explicit drawing of red lines, as shown by the First Post article also shows that the GoI has adopted a no nonsense approach - it has finally grown a pair.

Now what does this signify? No don't think about the obvious stuff, think about the less obvious ones. This signifies that all the Track Thoo and Aman ki Tamasha type meetings and junkets which were generously bankrolled by the Pakis will henceforth have a diminishing utility value. The beggars will probably turn down the tap on the number of meetings. Remember the CFair video of a talk in Mumbai posted here many moons ago where she pulled up a stupid Track Thoo type who was arguing with her by saying all this may affect your next free all expenses paid junket to Dubai?

Now look at the folks who are vociferous in calling the NSA all types of names? Ex-MEA and other assorted cretin who are on the roster for a call from the friendly Paki Embassy for the next Track Thoo meeting either in Islamabad, Dubai, Bangkok, whatever. Who likes it if someone takes away your next free junket? Please don't read any (mis)guided intellectual disagreement behind all these "protests". Going by the track record of the Pakis vis a vis US officials which we have gotten hints about in various articles, I wouldn't be surprised that if these "meetings" included "extra type of entertainment" over and above the kebabs and briyanis.

I would also bet that the previous government's apparent "paralysis" over the Pak policy was because all these Track Thoo types had a huge influence on government policy via the High Command which was run like a NGO outfit. And that blithering idiot RaGa can be sold any lemon provided you make your sales pitch in pucca Inglish with a Oxbridge accent.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby disha » 26 Aug 2015 05:46

Amit, long and nice post.

I had tweeted earlier that all the vitriol poured on Modi from within are more concerned about "Loss of free mutton and free wine" at exotic locales.

Given that bakis are bakis, always selling out their bodies - will not be surprised that the loss of free mutton also includes loss of free "baki meat" the walking kind.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby amit » 26 Aug 2015 05:49

JE Menon wrote:>>I am happy to believe it to be part of Modi's design to put Doval as the tip of the spear and use Sushma to deliver the hammer.

This is again your perception. So far as we know, there is nothing to validate this analogy.

>>That may have been the reason why Doval and not Sushma was there at Ufa.

If memory serves, Sushma was elsewhere at the time. Jaishankar (as the link posted above shows) drafted it with his team and his Pak counterpart. In fact, I think it was jointly read out by them after.


The point being missed here is that Jaishankar is a Modi hand picked Foreign Secretary - he sent the previous Foreign Secretary packing (if you ask me that was his single biggest foreign policy blooper, but then that's for a different discussion). To think that the wording would have been different if the Foreign Minister was present would imply that there's a difference in perception with regard to Pakistan between the Minister and Modi. The other would be to imply that Jaishankar is somehow incompetent. The fact remains the he is one of the most competent MEA officials we have had for a long time. Folks seem to forget his diplomatic skills when he negotiated the nuclear deal during which he had to walk through several snake pits. If anyone wants a lesson on "precise wording" of documents they should dig up the deals signed with respect to the nuclear deal to get an idea. Compared to that the UFA document was something that one scribbles during a lazy Sunday afternoon.

As usual we as Indians are showing our penchant of being "argumentative" as we try to split a hair into about a thousand pieces. I know he's disliked in these parts but Amartya Sen's "Argumentative Indian" is a must read. :D

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby amit » 26 Aug 2015 05:51

disha wrote:Amit, long and nice post.

I had tweeted earlier that all the vitriol poured on Modi from within are more concerned about "Loss of free mutton and free wine" at exotic locales.

Given that bakis are bakis, always selling out their bodies - will not be surprised that the loss of free mutton also includes loss of free "baki meat" the walking kind.


Thanks Disha. In my professional life I've found that most often than not it's the simple and obvious explanation that is the correct one. We often don't factor in the more base instincts that form a part of us when analysing motive.

BTW nice tweet! :D

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby RamaY » 26 Aug 2015 05:53

We can't absolve Modi from Ufa.

If MMS is guilty of Sharam-e-Shek, Modi is guilty of Ufa. We can't simply blame the MEA babus unless we are accepting that NM & SS aren't in control even after 1Yr. Please remember that they got only 5yrs not life long posts.

We can & will forgive NM of Ufa IFF this is part of a larger game. That we will know in another Yr.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby Falijee » 26 Aug 2015 05:55

Now RAA Blamed In Killing Of Punjab Home Minister :rotfl:

RAW’s involvement in Shuja Khanzada’s killing can’t be ruled out: experts

This is the kind of 'news' that is being 'fed' to the Paki Awam 24-7 by their so-called newspapers. :mrgreen:

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby amit » 26 Aug 2015 06:08

A_Gupta wrote:http://nation.com.pk/national/25-Aug-2015/giant-bats-devour-fruit-orchards
Giant bats devour fruit orchards
Hundreds of horrible and giant bats, weighting up to five kilogramme each, have attacked and devoured fruit orchards in the suburban area of Sahiwal Town, thereby creating financial concerns for the farmers.

Their flying from their abodes presents terrifying scene at the sunset. The heavyweight bats hover in the sky in the daylight. The owners of the orchards said that a few months ago, the bats having more than five kilogrammes of weight each stormed their orchards of mangoes, pear, bananas and dates trees and within days, they eat up all the fruit which they had to sell in the market to earn a living. The famers said that they had become hand to mouth because of the assault of the bats. They are hesitant to cultivate their crops because of presence of the huge number of the bats in the area, they said. They added that the people especially children remain sleepless in the nights due to the bats’ terror.


The world's largest bat is the flying fox bats, the Australian one that weighs upto 1 kilogram, and the Filipino one that can weigh upto 1.2kg.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grey-head ... cteristics
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giant_gol ... flying_fox
The Indian one can be 1.6 kg.
http://www.batrescue.org.au/website/ind ... &Itemid=54


I hope they didn't mistake jinns and houris for bats, despite the resemblance? Surely, considering the amount of service jinns and houris render to the Pak Awam, they are entitled to a free partake of luscious fruits grown in the land created for the Awam?

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby Falijee » 26 Aug 2015 06:16

Afghanistan calls off key meeting on economic issues :eek:


ISLAMABAD:

Afghanistan has refused to participate in a meeting of the Joint Economic Commission (JEC) at the last minute :!: as relations with Pakistan are at the lowest ebb after recent outburst by Afghan President Ashraf Ghani against Islamabad.


Afghan Finance Minister Eklil Hakimi on Sunday told his counterpart Ishaq Dar about his government’s decision to call off the JEC meeting just before his plane was scheduled to take off for Islamabad, said sources in the Ministry of Finance. :mrgreen:


Hakim made the phone call at a time when Pakistani protocol staff was preparing to welcome the delegation at the Benazir Bhutto International Airport, Islamabad.[*] The 10th JEC meeting, which was expected to cover all economic matters, was slated for August 24 and 25.


[*] If, this is correct, then he decided to do away with diplomatic niceties

In what appeared to be an Afghan government-backed move, people last week staged violent protests outside Pakistan’s embassy in Kabul, particularly when a Pakistani delegation was present in the premises. The delegation had been there to discuss the fate of millions of Afghan refugees staying in Pakistan for the last four decades.


According to sources, a stern warning :?: by the head of Pakistan’s delegation for a tit-for-tat response in Islamabad forced the Afghan government to take the step.


Some of the Afghan religious scholars last week called for a ban on the use of Pakistani currency, which has been a common practice for years in parts of Afghanistan especially in border regions.

Regional and international developments of the last two weeks suggest that some forces [*]were joining hands to harm Islamabad’s interests, according to defence analysts. The military’s decision to launch a ground offensive in the restive tribal areas against militants had drawn appreciation from the western and European powers.

[*] Read RAA

However, now questions are being raised over the military operation and the US has hinted at stopping the release of $300 million in Coalition Support Fund on the ground that Pakistan was not taking action against the Haqqani militant network.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby shiv » 26 Aug 2015 06:45

Falijee wrote:[*] The concept of 'sex education' is not mentioned in the Book, therefore it is not halal

Are you suggesting that doing it with 13 years olds is also not mentioned in The Book? I thought that was Halal,

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby partha » 26 Aug 2015 06:54

RamaY wrote:We can't absolve Modi from Ufa.

If MMS is guilty of Sharam-e-Shek, Modi is guilty of Ufa. We can't simply blame the MEA babus unless we are accepting that NM & SS aren't in control even after 1Yr. Please remember that they got only 5yrs not life long posts.

We can & will forgive NM of Ufa IFF this is part of a larger game. That we will know in another Yr.

There is a big difference between SeS and Ufa.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby partha » 26 Aug 2015 07:02

Remember the reports of Pakistan clinching a better LNG deal with Qatar than India?

http://www.dawn.com/news/1202872/doubts-about-lng-supply-in-winter
Doubts about LNG supply in winter

ISLAMABAD: Amid legal and operational hiccups, the Pakistan State Oil (PSO) officially conceded on Tuesday its inability to ensure smooth supply of 300 million cubic feet of liquefied natural gas (LNG) until October, raising fears of a continued gas shortage in winter.

This comes at a time when a team of the Qatar Gas management, which visited Islamabad on Monday, declined to enter into a long-term agreement with the PSO because of at least five major shortcomings on part of the government.

The PSO said Qatar Gas had also turned down its request to extend validity of offer for LNG supply from four ships a month to two and further reduction in price by 20 cents per MMBTU.

RAW conspiracy onlee.
The shortcomings include non-finalisation of a tripartite agreement among three state-run companies – SSGCL, SNGPL and PSO –, absence of a standby letter of credit (SBLC) to be provided by the PSO, shortfall in dredging at the port to enable Qflex ships and absence of commercial agreements with independent power producers for payment mechanism. On top of that, the Oil and Gas Regulatory Authority (Ogra) has not yet finalised an LNG sale price. A sale-purchase agreement between Qatar Gas and PSO has also not been finalised.

“This means Interstate Gas Company Limited, which originally prepared the LNG transaction, and PSO, which was responsible for importing the commodity, have failed to deliver on one of the most important energy supply projects,” the official said.

So the whole LNG from Qatar will inshallah reduce energy problem was just for public consumption. I bet most of the CPEC projects will go the same way except probably the road itself.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby johneeG » 26 Aug 2015 07:06

After the victory of 1971, Shimla Agreement was signed. Shimla is more or less a repeat of Lahore Agreement. Of course, there is a huge difference between 1965 and 1971. 1965 was considered a stalemate while 1971 was a thumping victory for Bhaarath without a doubt. A public surrender of entire Pakistani armed forces in its eastern sector. After such a great victory, Shimla agreement was a disaster. Anyone reading Shimla would never guess that Bhaarath had won a great war. Such agreement is made after a stalemate not a victory.

Ok, what does Shimla agreement say?
Shimla agreement gives sanctity to LOC and IB. Shimla agreement is hinting that POK will be with Pakistan and J&K will be with Bhaarath because it gives sanctity to LOC just like IB. And Bhaarath and Pakistan agree that they will sort out all issues with talks.

From then on, whenever Pakistan raised the issue of Kashmir in any international fora, then Bhaarath would say,"we have a bilateral Shimla agreement, so don't raise it in international fora."

Then, Pakistan would say," Fine. Then, lets talk bilaterally on Kashmir."

Of course, its a different issue that Pakistan has no point to raise on Kashmir because Pakistan is simply occupier of Kashmir and UN recognizes this occupation & orders Pakistan to get out of Kashmir.

So, now Bhaarath has to talk on Kashmir. Again, even here, Bhaarath didn't raise the point of POK in talks with Pakistan. Bhaarath didn't say,"Ok. When are you going to vacate POK?" Instead, for some unknown reason, it was Pakistan that was pushing for talks and setting the agenda of Kashmir(only the part which was with Bhaarath). The whole talks thing was tilted in favor of Pakistan. No wonder, Pakistan always demanded talks.

But, Pakistan is not foolish enough to believe that Bhaarath would part with its share of Kashmir just by talking. They need an offensive tool to force Bhaarath. Raise the cost for Bhaarath in Kashmir. This is where terrorism comes in. Strictly speaking, its not even a new strategy. They did it as far back as 1965: Op Gibraltar.

So, Pakistan had two tools: talks and terrorism. Both these tools were deployed simultaneously.
Kargil is the culmination of this strategy. After Kargil, talks under the shadow of terrorism became more and more untenable for Bhaarath's leadership.

Now, here is the diplomatic victory of Ufa: Ufa rectifies the mistakes of Shimla.
- Ufa says that we will first discuss and solve terrorism. 26/11 will be a case-study on solving terrorism. The mechanism would be NSA-NSA talks.
- Ufa says that we will then solve LOC and border firing issues.

After these two issues are solved to the satisfaction of both sides, then talks agenda of Shimla agreement can be taken up. And what happened? Pakistan ran away from talks. Earlier, Bhaarath used to run away from talks. Pakistan could always boldly demand talks and accuse Bhaarath of not talking even while doing terrorism. Now, this tool has been taken away from Pakistan. From now on, Bhaarath will insist on talks about terrorism before any other talks.

Shimla agreement was a disaster diplomatically especially after a great victory like 1971. Ideally, Shimla agreement should be done away with because it seems to accept POK as part of Pakistan. And it is in violation of Bhaarath's constitution because Bhaarath's constitution says that POK is part of Bhaarath.

johneeG wrote:The following is Parliament resolution on Jammu and Kashmir.
Parliament Resolution on Jammu and Kashmir
Following increasing terrorist violence and Pakistan’s attempts to highlight the Kashmir dispute, both houses of the Indian Parliament unanimously adopted a resolution on February 22, 1994, emphasizing that Jammu and Kashmir was an integral part of India, and that Pakistan must vacate parts of the State under its occupation. The text of the resolution follows.

"This House note with deep concern Pakistan's role in imparting training to the terrorists in camps located in Pakistan and Pakistan Occupied Kashmir, the supply of weapons and funds, assistance in infiltration of trained militants, including foreign mercenaries into Jammu and Kashmir with the avowed purpose of creating disorder, disharmony and subversion:

reiterates that the militants trained in Pakistan are indulging in murder, loot and other heinous crimes against the people, taking them hostage and creating an atmosphere of terror;

Condemns strongly the continued support and encouragement Pakistan is extending to subversive and terrorist activities in the Indian state of Jammu & Kashmir;

Calls upon Pakistan to stop forthwith its support to terrorism, which is in violation of the Simla Agreement and the internationally accepted norms of inter-State conduct and is the root cause of tension between the two countries reiterates that the Indian political and democratic structures and the Constitution provide for firm guarantees for the promotion and protection of human rights of all its citizens;

regard Pakistan's anti-India campaign of calumny and falsehood as unacceptable and deplorable.

notes with deep concern the highly provocative statements emanating from Pakistan urges Pakistan to refrain from making statements which vitiate the atmosphere and incite public opinion;

expresses regret and concern at the pitiable conditions and violations of human rights and denial of demoractic freedoms of the people in those areas of the Indian State of Jammu and Kashmir, which are under the illegal occupation of Pakistan;

On behalf of the People of India,

Firmly declares that-

(a) The State of Jammu & Kashmir has been, is and shall be an integral part of India and any attempts to separate it from the rest of the country will be resisted by all necessary means;

(b) India has the will and capacity to firmly counter all designs against its unity, sovereignty and territorial integrity;

and demands that -

(c) Pakistan must vacate the areas of the Indian State of Jammu and Kashmir, which they have occupied through aggression; and resolves that -

(d) all attempts to interfere in the internal affairs of India will be met resolutely."

The Resolution was unanimously adopted. Mr. Speaker: The Resolution is unanimously passed.

February 22, 1994


Link

I think the Parliament resolution actually supersedes Shimla agreement because Parliament says that Pakistan has violated Shimla agreement. If Pakistan has violated Shimla agreement, then what is the validity of Shimla agreement anymore?

It seems to me that Parliament resolution and UN resolution are much more in sync while Shimla agreement seems to be an attempt to accept LOC as de-facto international border in J&K.


Link to post


BTW, Kargil completely violates Shimla agreement. Bhaarath has been insisting on Shimla for so long(even though it is against Bhaarath's interests). Ufa makes the lemonade of lemon called Shimla agreement.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby shaun » 26 Aug 2015 07:16

Guptaji , deejaji ,Murty Saab and all...there will be always a class of people who will always remain blind ( it is another fact that, they want to remain blind) to the facts because of their perpetual hate for one man, like with porkis you can not reason with them using logic and raw facts.

To Admin and Mods : If you find my troll alert as nuisance here , please alert me before giving me danda !!

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby A_Gupta » 26 Aug 2015 08:48

amit wrote:Now look at the folks who are vociferous in calling the NSA all types of names? Ex-MEA and other assorted cretin who are on the roster for a call from the friendly Paki Embassy for the next Track Thoo meeting either in Islamabad, Dubai, Bangkok, whatever. Who likes it if someone takes away your next free junket? Please don't read any (mis)guided intellectual disagreement behind all these "protests". Going by the track record of the Pakis vis a vis US officials which we have gotten hints about in various articles, I wouldn't be surprised that if these "meetings" included "extra type of entertainment" over and above the kebabs and briyanis.


Yes, that angle had not escaped me. :)

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby CRamS » 26 Aug 2015 08:52

While many anal-yst punks in India whose ModiJi hatred prevents them from calling TSP a terrorist spade that it is for the NSA talks fiasco, here is Alyssa Ayres who nails it (except for a few minor quibbles here and there)

http://www.defenseone.com/ideas/2015/08 ... ns/119468/

I am sure Fair didi is going to ink some hard hitting piece as well in the coming days.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby KLNMurthy » 26 Aug 2015 08:58

disha wrote:Amit, long and nice post.

I had tweeted earlier that all the vitriol poured on Modi from within are more concerned about "Loss of free mutton and free wine" at exotic locales.

Given that bakis are bakis, always selling out their bodies - will not be surprised that the loss of free mutton also includes loss of free "baki meat" the walking kind.

+1

Simple & elegant, so probably correct:-)

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby A_Gupta » 26 Aug 2015 08:59

Shaun wrote:Guptaji , deejaji ,Murty Saab and all...there will be always a class of people who will always remain blind ( it is another fact that, they want to remain blind) to the facts because of their perpetual hate for one man, like with porkis you can not reason with them using logic and raw facts.


I'll also go off-topic and agree with you.
Someone sent me this article about Modi's visit to the UAE.
http://wap.business-standard.com/articl ... 453_1.html

No government whose citizens need dirty, poorly paid jobs in foreign countries where every tin-pot despot and dictator kicks them around can claim a place at the world's high table. If India were strong enough to persuade the UAE government, it wouldn't need to export manpower. That will continue for as long as slogans such as 'Make in India', 'Sabka Saath, Sabka Vikas' and 'Start up India, Stand up India' remain slogans that don't translate into minimum prosperity for all. The only gain from Modi's jaunt seems to be a temple in the UAE.


The point is correct, that if India was prosperous, it would not have to export manpower. But in what way is it Modi's failure that one has to lash out at him? And there are gains beyond anything material from this UAE diplomacy. For one, it has delivered a solid kick to Pakistan.

Anyway, I told this person that he had Lahori logic for sending me such an enormously stupid article.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby Pulikeshi » 26 Aug 2015 09:41

^^^ It is more than a stupid article, it is self loathing insidiousness manifest in a Pakjabi.
What 'idiot failed state' cannot create its own skilled manpower imports them? <asked tongue in cheek>

Ironically, people in high funda capitalist bs talks forget that the essence of capitalism is the human one!
The traditional arguments of export of manpower from weaker states etc. just show the shallowness of the author.
The ability to harness those far from shore to the cause of a nation-state is a dangerous force when harness correctly.
Many developed countries would do well to learn from their less fortunate brethren - Greece could have done better for eg.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby JE Menon » 26 Aug 2015 10:06

>>We can't absolve Modi from Ufa. If MMS is guilty of Sharam-e-Shek, Modi is guilty of Ufa.

Guilty of what, exactly? Please read above posts by various people, and say exactly what Modi has "lost" and what he is "guilty" of?

The only thing I can think of is that he did not satisfy the junket-monkeys and the unreformable presstitutes. More of that is required.

And, contrary to most, I don't even think adding Balochistan in the Sharm el Shaikh document was a mistake, long-term, and I said so then. Should it have been in the document? One can argue either way, inconclusively. At the time I would have thought no, it was called a "drafting error" in a silly comment by then foreign secretary SS Menon - how that came about is another issue. But now that it is in, and we have a BJP government for a while to come, who does not want to talk about Balochistan to Pakistan, and why? They make a hue and cry about it, but if the Indian government says it wants to include Baluchistan in talks as was agreed in Sharm Al Shaikh, watch the Pak military backtracking.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby SSridhar » 26 Aug 2015 10:27

Today, Suhasini Haidar has written an article in The Hindu along the same lines that NSA is taking precedence over the MEA in the scheme of things currently. They are all crawling out of the woodworks for a few reasons:

  • Insidious political agenda
  • To satisfy foreign masters who forced Aman-ki-Asha on us
  • To appear 'fair, neutral and detached', sometimes an obsessive disease with many Indians
  • To feel comfortable when they meet their Pakistani counterparts in future Track-II meets

The fact that Ms. Swaraj brilliantly demolished the Pakistani perfidy in a breathtaking attack with an ease that belied the savagery underneath shows that she was on-board all along. It would be simply impossible for someone on the periphery to marshall the arguments with such confidence and clarity.

This could also be an attempt to drive a wedge in the Cabinet.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby SSridhar » 26 Aug 2015 10:36

“LeT may benefit from Indo-Pak. tensions” - Suhasini Haidar, The Hindu
Sounding a warning over the Lashkar-e-Taiba’s plans to “indigenise” its operations in Jammu and Kashmir, a U.S. expert on the LeT says the group responsible for the Mumbai 26/11 attacks could benefit from tensions between India and Pakistan. “Even when I had spoken to members of the LeT earlier, they had confirmed that they were looking to “get things going”.

“I do not believe we are going to see a return to the levels of violence we saw in Kashmir during the 1990s or post-2000. What we might see and what we are seeing is a rise from a few years ago,” says Professor Stephen Tankel, who has written a book on the LeT’s rise, and was appointed senior adviser at the U.S. Department of Defence for 2014.

Significantly, Dr. Tankel says he has seen “no evidence” of a “strategic shift” in the Pakistani establishment’s support for the LeT and its leader Hafiz Saeed after the Peshawar massacre in December.

In the aftermath of the brutal attack that saw the death of more than 140 schoolchildren, Islamabad had drawn up a “National Action Plan” vowing to crack down on all terror groups.

“LeT has uses for the Pakistani state both externally and internally,” Dr. Tankel told The Hindu in an interview, explaining why no crackdown has occurred on the LeT.

LeT doesn’t support attacks on Pakistan, it provides intelligence about the other militant groups, it has been used to attack other groups such as the TTP [Tehrik-i-Taliban Pakistan]. It has internal utility as a result.However, he does feel there is a “debate within the establishment” over whether groups such as the LeT should be cut off by the state, while the Army was clearly going after groups such as the TTP and the LeJ [Lashkar-e-Jhangvi] in recent months. The Pakistani government has always denied that it provides any support to the LeT and its off-shoot, Jamaat-ud-Dawa, claiming that it had banned the organisations on several occasions.

“U.S. can’t wave a magic wand”

Dr. Tankel rejects the idea held by many in India that the U.S. has focussed more on Pakistani action against the Haqqani network that attacks its troops in Afghanistan than it does the LeT that targets India. “The U.S. can’t wave a magic wand and get Pakistan to take certain actions,” Dr. Tankel replied to a specific question about the ease of mobility for Hafiz Saeed and Zaki-ur-Rahman Lakhvi, and a lenient plea bargain to 26/11 conspirator David Headley in the U.S.

“The Haqqanis have attacked the U.S. primarily; so they do get more focus. But the U.S. has pressured Pakistan to prosecute the LeT, restrain them from further attacks, and to take actions against their leaders,” he says.

Based on his study of the group in Pakistan and operatives in Europe and other countries, Dr. Tankel says there are growing divisions within the LeT, including on the succession plan for Hafiz Saeed.

“I think there are divisions in the LeT between those who want to push for political influence in Pakistani society, and those who want to stick to militancy. Also those who want to globalise, and those who don’t. There are those more willing to abide by state diktats, and some who want to fight the state. And then there is the generational shift,” he says explaining that the group could face pressure from those such as the Islamic State.

He says that as a result, an “Osama-style” operation against Hafiz Saeed may not actually shut down the LeT’s operations against India.

“Any plan of Indian operatives targeting Hafiz Saeed would have a very destabilising effect on the region. So I can’t suggest it. I would just say the costs and benefits have to be weighed,” Dr. Tankel, who is writing a second book about the U.S.’s counter-terrorism partners, said.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-July 10,

Postby JE Menon » 26 Aug 2015 10:40

>>This could also be an attempt to drive a wedge in the Cabinet.

Certainly, this is the case - and not without political backing and probably even guidance. There are ongoing attempts to drive wedges between, between Jaitley and Modi, between Sushma and Doval, between Jaitley and RBI's Rajan, and much more subtly - between Modi and Doval. At the same time there are efforts to undermine the key players: Sushma, Jaitley, Doval.

Some of us on BRF have fallen victim to this soap-operization of politics by the pressitutes and play along either unwittingly, or wittingly.

Are there no differences among cabinet members? Of course there are. But if one thinks that they will undermine the political strength of the party currently with public infighting, then one underestimates their political acumen.


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