Tracking India's Admission into International Groups & Bodies

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby member_23370 » 17 Jun 2016 22:06

As china's economy crumbles their influence will wane. SA can be made to tow the line or face the consequence.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Gagan » 17 Jun 2016 22:28

The cheenis, for that matter all these nations will relent.
The big powers will prop up their pets for a while, to extract more concessions.
We'll probably learn about those concessions in the future.

For example, 12 reactors for the roosi, and a little something for the Kazakhs, will see the Kazakh resistance melting. Kzakhistan also exports a lot of oil to the cheeni right?

Something similar, some generous gifts for the SAs, maybe some arms purchases, Denel ?

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby member_23370 » 17 Jun 2016 22:36

Don't see Denel coming into play since they wre in bed with pakis, but India shd keep SA as a peripheral in BRIC-S.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 18 Jun 2016 13:51

Mission NSG: S Jaishankar and team to lead India’s charge after US and South Korea's support - Dipanjan Roy Chaudhury, Economic Times
Quiet but intense diplomacy is on to shore up support for India's membership of the Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG).

NSG's plenary session is slated for June 23-24, in Seoul. The group functions as a closed club that restricts access to nuclear hi-tech. Ranking diplomats such as Foreign Secretary S Jaishankar and Secretary (West) in the Ministry of External Affairs, Sujata Mehta, are spearheading India's diplomatic outreach, visiting key foreign capitals and explaining New DELHI's case.

ET spoke to senior diplomats familiar with these high-level engagements. They spoke on the condition of anonymity. China has argued against India's entry while the US has backed it. The US on Friday again urged the 48-member NSG to back India.

South Korea, which will chair NSG now and host the meeting, is a key country. Diplomats say Seoul is playing a big role in spreading the word for India. Jaishankar had paid a quiet visit to Seoul just before the prime minister's trip to the US. And top South Korean and Indian officials are in discussions over the best way to fashion an argument for India.

Discussions are also on with past and current heads of NSG, respectively, Czech Republic and Argentina.

Both favour India's entry. China has been leading the group of countries — including Austria, Ireland, South Africa, Turkey and New Zealand — blocking India's entry into the coveted club.

This group wants a debate on the process within NSG to include new members that are not signatories to the Nuclear Non-proliferation Treaty. New Zealand, which has now softened its stand, had initially demanded a twopronged approach for the entry of new members, informed sources told ET.

First, it wanted a debate within NSG on the process of expansion. Second, it wanted a specific discussion on India's application.

It is learnt the White House will play a key role in securing New Zealand's support. Meanwhile, a close Indian partner among NSG members has expressed optimism in securing Austria's backing.

The India-South Korea agreement on New Delhi's entry is based substantive grounds, diplomats said. The two signed a civil nuclear pact in 2011. Seoul is also looking to enter the emerging Indian nuclear energy market.

South Korean entities will supply components for six nuclear reactors that US-based Westinghouse is setting up in Andhra Pradesh.

Also, Seoul will be partly financing the Westinghouse project. Senior diplomats told ET that US EXIM Bank, lead financier for the Westinghouse project, will approach South Korean funds for support.

This apart, diplomats said, Seoul-New Delhi relations are also informed by South Korean companies' big investments in India. Last year, a South Korea cell was opened in the Department of Industrial Policy & Promotion.

MEA's Secretary (West) Mehta was tasked with visiting European capitals not yet on board. Her brief, diplomats said, was to present India's case to European countries such as Austria and Ireland that are opposed to New Delhi's entry into NSG, as they were in 2008 when the country received a clean waiver from NSG on nuclear commerce.

Mehta looks after India's relations with the EU and European countries barring France and Britain, which fall under the foreign

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 19 Jun 2016 10:32

Foreign Secretary S. Jaishankar visits Beijing to drum up NSG support - IANS
Stepping up its diplomatic outreach to China ahead of the Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG) plenary in Seoul, Foreign Secretary S. Jaishankar made a quiet trip to Beijing this week to try and win over China's backing for India's membership.

China has been leading a group of countries of the 48-member NSG that are holding out against giving India membership.

Confirming Jaishankar's unannounced trip to Beijing, the Ministry of External Affairs spokesperson Vikas Swarup said that the Foreign Secretary was in China from June 16-17 "for bilateral consultations with his Chinese counterpart. All major issues, including India's NSG membership, were discussed."

The NSG, which controls global nuclear trade, is to hold an important plenary from June 23-24 in Seoul when the membership application of India, along with Pakistan, are set to be taken up.

India has got the backing of most countries for admission to the NSG, including the us, Britain, Italy, Mexico and Switzerland.

China is opposing India's membership on the grounds that it is not a signatory to the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT) and if the rule is relaxed for India, it should be done so too in the case of Pakistan.

Jaishankar's meeting with Chinese leaders comes ahead of Prime Minister Narendra Modi's visit to Tashkent, Uzbekistan, when he is due to meet Chinese President Xi Jinping on June 23 during the Shanghai Cooperation Organisation (SCO) summit meeting and take up the issue.

India and Pakistan are set to be formally inducted as members of the China-led SCO at the meeting.

Russia has strongly backed India's entry to the NSG and has reportedly offered to take up the matter of India's membership with China.

Jaishankar's meeting also comes after the visit of President Pranab Mukherjee to China in the last week of May when the latter had taken up the issue with the top Chinese leadership.

The Chinese media has said that India's entry to the NSG will "shake the strategic balance in South Asia and even cast a cloud over peace and stability in the entire Asia-Pacific region".

The state-run Global Times daily in an opinion piece this week said that China could support India's inclusion to the elite nuclear club if NEW DELHI "played by the rules".

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby member_27581 » 19 Jun 2016 15:24

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/China-is-not-opposed-to-Indias-NSG-bid-we-will-convince-Beijing-Sushma-Swaraj/articleshow/52819513.cms


NEW DELHI: China is not opposed to India's entry into the Nuclear Suppliers Group, External Affairs Minister Sushma Swaraj has clarified. She said Beijing is only focussed on criteria procedure to India's membership to the elite nuclear club.
Swaraj's comments came at a news conference to outline the foreign policy achievements of the Narendra Modi government over the past two years, as well as about recent developments. Her comments also came just days after External Affairs Secretary S Jaishankar visited Beijing to discuss India's NSG bid.

China has been seen globally as the sole impediment to India's entry into the global nuclear trade regime. While some sources have attributed China's decision to put the brakes on India's bid to concerns over the strategic balance in its own neighbourhood, other have said Beijing is insisting on similar waivers to be extended to its all-weather ally, Pakistan.
Swaraj also fielded questions on the India's attempt to join the NSG in relation to Pakistan's own bid. "As far as our stand on Pakistan's NSG membership is concerned, India is not opposed to the entry of any nation into the NSG. We would want any application to be considered on its own merits," said Swaraj.

She added that she was hopeful of moving India's membership process forward. "We are hopeful. We will be able to convince China as well. We are in touch with 23 nations on this issue. One or two of them had raised concerns, but I think a general consensus is there," she said.
The Modi government would attempt to ensure that India's NSG membership becomes a reality by the end of this year, the External Affairs Minister stressed. "The NSG membership has assumed importance this year in light of the leadership role that India projected on the global stage at the Paris climate talks," she said.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 19 Jun 2016 16:46

The sudden Sushma Swaraj news conference is linked with the NSG moves by GoI and the visit of S.Jaishankar to China. GoI has openly announced its non-opposition as a CBM. Probably, China insisted on that after having realized that it runs the risk of being isolated in the Seoul plenary. The news conference happened immediately upon the return of Jaishankar. This is what China called 'playing by the rules'?

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Vipul » 19 Jun 2016 18:08

If China has been veered towards India position and the NSG meeting in Seoul is next week then why is Sushma Swaraj is playing it safe by hoping that India will get into NSG by year end? If there is no objection to India's membership shouldnt India become a member immediately like it happened for MTCR? Are Turkey and South Africa still holding out?

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 19 Jun 2016 18:30

Vipul, I see two reasons. I always believed that even if isolated in a corner, China may not relent immediately in order to save face and postpone the decision to the next plenery, three months later. Secondly, even if it passes in the Seoul plenary, formal induction will happen later and that might have been what Ms. Swaraj meant. It is the same in MTCR. India is not a member as yet. Only the deadline for objection to membership has passed without any objection by any member state. Formal paperwork wlll start now and it may take its own time at both ends. SCO membership was announced last year but is formally taking place only now.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Vipul » 19 Jun 2016 18:36

Thanks Sridharji.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby member_27581 » 19 Jun 2016 19:36

^^Thanks Sridharsir, also, it seems there might be some softening of stand on Bakistan from Indian side...but it would be very surprising if they make into NSG.
Although they've been long part of another NSG: Nuclear Smugglers group

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby shyamoo » 19 Jun 2016 21:32

ranjan.rao wrote:NSG: Nuclear Smugglers group

Saar, you should copyright this!

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 19 Jun 2016 22:40

ranjan.rao wrote: Nuclear Smugglers group


:D

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Bhurishrava » 20 Jun 2016 16:26

IMHO, India is spending too much political capital trying to get into these groups.
Whats the logic of massaging Chinese balls to get into NSG.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Singha » 20 Jun 2016 18:09

Goal is to carry tsp into nsg with us as desirable outcome.
It will reduce nsg into a circus like unsc

Degrade and debase all these clubs to tsp std has to a clear goal

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 20 Jun 2016 18:31

India's NSG membership not on Seoul meet agenda: China - PTI
China on Monday said differences remain among NSG members over the inclusion of new countries and the issue was not even on the agenda of the grouping's meeting in Seoul this week, a day after External Affairs Minister Sushma Swaraj asserted that Beijing was not opposing India's entry.

"We have stressed that the Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG) is still divided about non-NPT countries entry into the NSG and under the current circumstances we hope that NSG will make through discussions to make a decision based on consultation," Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesperson Hua Chunying told a media briefing.

Answering questions about Foreign Secretary S Jaishankar 's visit here on June 16-17 and Swaraj's remarks, Hua said India's admission into NSG is not on the agenda of the Seoul meeting of the 48-member elite club to be held on June 24.

"As we understand the annual conference in Seoul this year also has no such topic. We understand that non-NPT countries are concerned about their entry into the NSG. But since NSG is still divided about the issue, so it is still not mature to talk about the entry issue in the annual conference in Seoul," she said.


"I want point out that the NSG agenda has never covered any issue concerning the non-NPT countries joining the NSG," Hua asserted.

Her remarks came even as Swaraj yesterday said India was confident of getting NSG membership this year.

"China is not opposing membership of India in NSG, it is only talking of criteria and procedure. I am hopeful that we would be able to convince China as well to support our entry to the NSG," she told a press conference.

"I think that there is a consensus which is being made and I am sure that India will become the member of the NSG this year," she had said.

Hua said, "China maintains that NSG should have through discussion on the joining of the non-NPT countries in a way agreed by all parties, so as to make a decision based on agreement. This position is not directed against any country and applies to all non-NPT states," she said.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 21 Jun 2016 03:47

NSG will be strengthened if India joins: Canada - Sachin Parashar, The Hindu
At a time when questions are being raised about India's non-proliferation credentials, one of world's leading proponents of the international non-proliferation regime, Canada, has come out openly in support of India saying that the presence of India in the exclusive nuclear club will actually strengthen the Group's export controls.

Ahead of the NSG plenary later this week in Seoul, Canada also said that it was encouraging all NSG members to join in the consensus needed to achieve this objective "at the earliest possible date''.

"India's role in international nuclear commerce is bound to keep growing in strength as the size of India's fleet of nuclear power plant, already one of the world`s largest, rapidly increases,'' Canada's acting high commissioner Jess Dutton Monday told TOI.

"As such, we believe India's membership in the NSG will reinforce the international nuclear non-proliferation regime,'' he added.


Dutton's remarks to TOI came on a day China claimed that the issue of India's NSG membership wasn't even on the agenda for the Seoul meeting of the 48-nation Group. Dutton said Canada was working actively to create a consensus for India's membership.

"The NSG stands to benefit from the active participation of Indian technical specialists in helping the Group strengthen the international control of nuclear goods and technologies and help strengthen domestic controls on nuclear exports,'' said Dutton, adding that India was ready to become an active member of NSG.

Canada entered into a civil nuclear agreement with India based on the 2008 clean waiver to India by the NSG for nuclear trade despite New Delhi not having signed NPT. Canada is now a significant source of uranium for India. Unlike in the case with a few other members of the Group who had supported India in 2008, Canada's support to India and its acknowledgement of India's non-proliferation credentials remain unwavering despite it regarding NPT as the mainstay of its policy to promote disarmament, non-proliferation and peaceful uses of nuclear energy.

"Given its nuclear non-proliferation credentials, we believe India has demonstrated that it is ready to become an active and constructive member of the NSG. We strongly encourage all NSG members to join in the consensus needed to achieve this objective, at the earliest possible date,'' said Dutton.

Canada's voice carries a lot of weight with many other members of NSG who regularly profess commitment to NPT as the cornerstone of their disarmament and non-proliferation policies. Canada was also one of the 7 original members of NSG which itself was formed in 1975 as a reaction to India's nuclear testing the previous year. The plutonium which India used for its 1974 nuclear test was sourced from a reactor supplied by Canada.

Canada is also an important member of the Vienna Group of Ten, a group of 10 "like-minded'' countries who work together on issues related to NPT and all of which are members of NSG. At least 3 members of this Group - New Zealand, Austria and Ireland - are said to have reservations about allowing India as a non NPT signatory into the NSG. In the NSG meeting though in Vienna earlier this month, some of these countries were said to have relented a bit as they sought a process for inclusion of non-NPT states and not a one-time exception for any country.

Dutton said Canada had been a strong supporter of Indian membership in the NSG for many years and had been actively engaged in efforts to create the consensus required to allow India to join the Group. "We welcomed India`s recent application for membership, as well as its formal adherence to the NSG Guidelines in mid-May of this year," he said.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Lisa » 21 Jun 2016 12:58

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 848120.cms

Why China opposes India's NSG membership: Chinese newspaper explains

"It then tried to de-link Pakistan's poor nuclear non-proliferation record by resorting to Islamabad's favourite 'non-state actor' formula. "Actually, the proliferation carried out by Pakistan was done by Abdul Qadeer Khan, Pakistan's chief nuclear scientist, and was not an official policy of the Pakistani government. Khan was punished by the government afterward with several years of house arrest," the Global Times article argued."

Yeah, he hired C130's from the puki air force on his own!

IMHO, THe US has made up its mind. It intends to confront China so as to demonstrated its superiority. NSG event is just one facet of this confrontation in which it intends to demonstrate its power. China can let India in or face a loss of face, excuse the pun when India's admission is forced through. The second and just around the corner is the international case regarding the South China Sea which I personally think China will lose. If that is the case, using that rulings legality, the US intends to shake down China in the South China Sea.

Have already bought popcorn!

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby member_27581 » 21 Jun 2016 13:44

^^ not a bad deal to sell nuke designs, make money and then house arrest. It might amuse global times by investigating how the almighty chinese got their bomb..by begging the soviets and how they generously passed on the designs to Porkies. I wont be surprised if China was the big daddy of NSG(smugglers) just like US is in NSG(suppliers) one

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 21 Jun 2016 16:32

China is as usual tying itself up in knots on the NSG issue. How many times have we seen such a laughable behaviour from PRC! It is dishing out reason after reason for its abnormal and abominable behaviour. It talked of procedures, it said accession to NPT is the sole criterion for admission, when France's case was poined out it dismissed it by saying that France was a founding member and therefore has a right to contravene rules (essentially saying that rules were only for others!), then it expressed concern whether India would play by rules if admitted into NSG, it said the strategic balance in South Asia would be affected if India alone is admitted, it said many countries were opposed to India's admission, claimed that Seoul plenary does not have India's accession on the agenda, and now it says that Pakistan was not a proliferator (of course yes, just like China, the paragon of virtues) !! Later, a day before the start of the Seoul plenary session, China said that the “door is always open for discussions” on NSG memberships and it would play a constructive role but simultaneously also saying that NSG members should consider whether the doors were really open or not !! . In the plenary itself, China emphasized that it had only been eight years since India got the waiver from the NSG and more time should pass before it can even be considered for membership. It also claimed in the plenary that excepting India would lead to the non-resolution of North Korean & Iranian situations (both are signatories of NPT though North Korea withdrew in 2003 after being a member for 18 years while India has never been. In fact, India's consistent stand has been that it was discriminatory.). It thus deliberately and mischievously linked India with a universally-recognized rogue nation, North Korea, while carefully omitting Pakistan from the list but referring to Pakistan's application when it was convenient for it otherwise. Global Times even went to the extent of claiming that proliferation from Pakistan was by an individual and not a government policy !! Unabashedly, China also used the NSG discussion on India to market its nuclear reactors when its Chief Negotiator, Wang Qun, said, “China for its part also stands ready to explore cooperation in this field, so as to help India to address its nuclear energy needs”. In the closing stages of the Seoul plenary, Mexico moved a suggestion for another meeting of NSG to be held before the end of the year to consider the criteria for allowing non-NPT signatories like India into the group. This was also strongly opposed by China but it had to relent in the face of opposition from others.
Last edited by SSridhar on 26 Jun 2016 16:38, edited 10 times in total.
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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby DavidD » 21 Jun 2016 17:05

India joining the NSG is inevitable, China just needs to put up a good fight for Pakistan's interests. It's gotten to the point where China will need to expend real political capital to block India any further, and I really doubt the Chinese is willing to go all out for something that doesn't affect its core interests. It's a bit problematic for Pakistan, as you can imagine, but in the end China will come first for China, and the Indians have successfully made it too costly a battle for the Chinese to continue.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Ashokk » 21 Jun 2016 17:12

In U-turn, China says NSG open to non-NPT nations
NEW DELHI: After months of banging on that India cannot join the Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG) because it hasn't signed the non-proliferation treaty (NPT), China did a huge about-turn on Monday saying the door is open for new members who haven't signed that treaty.

"The door is open for the admission of the non-NPT members. It is never closed. It is open. But the members of the NSG should stay focussed on whether the criteria should be changed and whether non-NPT members should be admitted into the NSG," Chinese Foreign Ministry Spokesperson Hua Chunying told reporters at a media briefing Tuesday.

Hua was repeating - almost verbatim- what India's External Affairs Minister Sushma Swaraj said on Sunday. The Indian minister said China is not opposed to India's entry into the NSG but is only focussed on criteria procedure to India's membership to the elite nuclear club.

"The Chinese side understood India's need to develop nuclear energy," Hua said. She was referring to Indian Foreign Secretary S. Jaishankar's visit to China last week, where he expressed New Delhi's wish to join the NSG.

"The door is open. The room is there. We never said we are against who (a country). We did not target any country, India or Pakistan," Hua said.

In fact, China and Pakistan have been closely coordinating moves to block India's entry into NSG, the group's sources told ANI in May.

Beijing is using Pakistan's non-starter position with the NSG - as Pakistan, too, hasn't signed the NPT and is a notorious proliferator- to block India's application by saying that it would either support NSG entry for both India and Pakistan, or for none of them.

US sources then told news agency ANI that they are disappointed with China's tactics of "using Pakistan's non credentials with the NSG to settle scores with India".

The US sources said that India's non-proliferation credentials can never be compared with Pakistan's, as the latter has a history of "selling nuclear technology to rogue states like Libya". They point to the father of Pakistan's nuclear bomb, Dr A.Q. Khan, and his global nuclear trade.

The NSG is a body concerned with reducing nuclear proliferation by controlling the export and re-transfer of materials used to make weapons.

The NPT is an international treaty whose objective is to prevent the spread of nuclear weapons and weapons technology.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby habal » 21 Jun 2016 18:45

every 3 months NSG has a meeting.

if not this time, then the next or the time after that. Or the one after.

the pakeezah is running around in vain trying to avoid the unavoidable ..

the only country that has made a clown of itself here is China .. if it keeps opposing this.

not only will they lose all goodwill they have, but they will also reveal themselves to be small minded, cowardly nation since they were given UNSC due to Nehru.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby dada » 21 Jun 2016 18:57

ashokk

China's strategy is to delay the decision
how ?
by making the NSG group discuss general /ambiguous topics rather than make decisions on specific cases.
what does it mean in practical terms ?
discuss the topic of non-npt nations (both india & pk are non npt states)
discuss the criteria /procedure to be adopted for a non-npt state to become a member of the nsg group.

Offcourse this is bound to be an endless discussion (exactly what china wants)

Perhaps what can be done is as follows.
split the non-npt states into 2 categories
1. non-npt states with proven proliferation record (without mentioning pk specifically)
2. non-npt states with nuclear capabilities but with a clean record .

Decide different criteria/procedures (which china wants) for above.
Indian supporters strategy must be to delay deciding the criteria for category1 . This should be preceded by a detailed analysis of the supply chain of these proliferation culprits. If NSG members are involved , a separate series of investigations to follow.
But decide decisively for category2.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby ramana » 21 Jun 2016 19:42

I think India should create a Nuclear Commerce Group (NCG):
Here is the thread to discuss such a group.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=7217

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby dada » 21 Jun 2016 20:12

Whichever international group , India joins , a fundamental change in the basic rules of that group follows with India's joining that group. Isnt that India's contribution to the group at large ?

To extend this logic further , think of other groups which India can join & fundamentally change the basic rules of that group . I have a list as follows
1. UNSC ( obvious next choice to work on )
2. OIC (can we ? should we ? )
3. SAARC+ASEAN ? with railways /roads joining the South China Sea & Arabian Sea

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 22 Jun 2016 04:10

So, when China says that India's admission is not even on the agenda for the Seoul plenary, it means that it is putting its foot down on including this item on the agenda for discussion. It is not as though that the NSG secretariat has taken that decision.

New Delhi feels China has blocked even a discussion on India's entry to the NSG by putting up hurdles on listing the issue in the agenda of the upcoming meeting of the nuclear group in Seoul next week.


China won't let India join NSG unless other NPT countries are also allowed in - Saibal Dasgupta, ToI

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 22 Jun 2016 04:18

NSG: US standing by India, publicly and privately - Chidanand Rajghatta, ToI

Please read the last paragraph below.

The Obama administration on Monday again put its weight behind India's admission to the Nuclear Suppliers Group, calling on member sates to support New Delhi's application even as China, the main hurdle, appeared to soften its position.

The administration used both its White House and state department pulpits to voice its support for India's membership as the 48-country cartel began its plenary session in Seoul. "India is ready for membership. And the United States calls on participating governments to support India's application," President Barack Obama's spokesman Josh Earnest said at his daily briefing.

"We continue to call — and nothing's changed about our position — on participating governments of NSG to support India's application at the plenary session this week in Seoul," echoed state department spokesperson John Kirby. He said India's application is "something about which we have routinely talked to other NSG members", and it is "not a new topic of discussion that we've had privately with the members," suggesting that Washington had done its spadework and left it to New Delhi to convince Beijing, believed to be the lone, or at least the principle, holdout.

Earnest said the White House has made its views known both publicly and privately, and "we'll continue to do so in advance of the meeting this week," indicating that President Obama might still weigh in if needed. "Participating governments will need to reach a consensus decision in order to admit any applicant into the group. And the US will certainly be advocating for India's membership," he said.

In Beijing, Chinese spokespersons and government proxies went into contortions to explain their opposition to India's bid, sometimes pointing to the "principle" of only signatories of the Non-Proliferation Treaty being entertained as members, and pointing to the US for setting up the rule. "The door is open for the admission of the non-NPT members. It is never closed. But the members of the NSG should stay focused on whether the criteria should be changed and whether non-NPT members should be admitted into the NSG," Chinese foreign ministry spokesperson Hua Chunying told reporters at a media briefing on Tuesday, indicating that Beijing is open to negotiations on the issue.

Some sources have suggested that eventually it will boil down to a modus vivendi between Washington, Beijing and New Delhi to make an accommodation through back channel talks that will include finessing positions about their respective roles in AsiaPacific, South China Sea and the Indian Ocean Region. This is not just about NSG membership; it will be about a lot more, sources said.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 22 Jun 2016 04:27

Will US pull it off for India at NSG meet? - Indrani Bagchi, ToI
The US leadership on non-proliferation ensured India got a waiver from NSG in 2008 to engage in nuclear commerce, but China challenged that openly in 2016.

By pushing Pakistan's case upfront, China is preventing a consensus in India's favour and US might consider where Islamabad's interests -in confluence with China -be allowed to prevail.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 22 Jun 2016 07:51

NSG: Officials head to Seoul, Modi set to meet Xi Jinping - Atul Aneja, The Hindu
Ahead of the closed door meeting of the Nuclear Suppliers Group in Seoul, scheduled to be kick started on Thursday with an address by South Korean Foreign Minister Yung Byun-se, India’s most senior official on disarmament and nuclear issues Amandeep Singh Gill left for Seoul on Tuesday.

He will be assisted by India’s Ambassador to South Korea Vikram Doraiswami in case India is asked for details on its membership application.

Officials would not confirm reports that Foreign Secretary S. Jaishankar will travel to Seoul on Friday, directly after Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s meeting with Chinese President Xi Jinping in Tashkent at the Shanghai Cooperation Organisation summit. The meeting is being seen as the last chance for India to “convince China” to drop its opposition to membership bid.


More than 300 diplomats from the 48-member countries will attend the NSG plenary on June 23-24. Both South Korea and Argentina, whose ambassador Rafael Grossi chairs the Nuclear Suppliers Group this year, have been supportive of India’s bid for a membership. Even so, a “no-vote” from any country in the NSG could scuttle either a discussion on the admission of non-NPT (non-signatories to the Non Proliferation Treaty) member applicants India and Pakistan, or the actual decision.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby kmkraoind » 22 Jun 2016 16:00

US-India are playing a cute game. Had they brought this issue before, China would have raised another issue. Since China is parleying Indian entry with Pakistan entry, now they are boxed.

In either way India will loose nothing significantly if it not enter NSG, but if China plays "Jayadradha" role, it will face huge consequences and it is pushing India more towards US-Japan.

Posting the article in full.

Pakistan continuing to sell nuclear materials to North Korea, reveal U.S. sources (ANI Exclusive)

Washington D C, June 22 (ANI): Pakistan is continuing to sell nuclear materials to North Korea, while at the same time urging the international community to accept its membership to the Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG), according to highly placed U.S. sources who are involved with the tracking of nuclear commerce.

In making this dramatic revelation, the sources said that entities of the Pakistan Energy Commission (PAEC) have been continuing to supply restricted items such as ' Monel ' and ' Inconel ' material to North Korea in violation of U.N. sanctions.

The sources said that nuclear materials supplied to the PAEC by Chinese entities have also found their way to North Korea, with the China Atomic Energy Authority (CAEA) recently receiving a written complaint that supplies of a Chinese company, Beijing Suntech Technology Company Limited, to Pakistan were being diverted to North Korea by the Pakistani authorities.

The Chinese Government hushed up the matter as it could have consequences for Beijing's bid to support Pakistan at the NSG. But this information leaked out of North Korea and came to the knowledge Of Western Governments who are members of the NSG.


In another alarming revelation, informed sources said Pakistan has been giving North Korea equipment which has a direct bearing On producing nuclear weapons. Sources said the Beijing Suntech Technology Company Limited manufactures Vacuum Induction Melting (VIM) furnaces which find application in refining hard metals such as uranium and plutonium, which are used in making nuclear warhead cores. Pakistan is known to have procured these items from China and has passed them along to North Korea.

When asked if this evidence of Pakistan's illicit nuclear trade with North Korea has been brought to the notice of NSG nations, U.S. sources said all proof and evidence which confirms the violation of sanctions against North Korea and more so the ongoing dangerous nuclear trade has been brought to the notice of "those who need to be informed at the NSG level."


Behind the scenes Pakistan is aware that it's nuclear trade with North Korea has been uncovered, but is counting on China to keep the global pressure at bay, said sources.

Giving details of North Korea's nuclear commerce links with Pakistan, informed sources mentioned that two North Korean diplomats - Kim Yong Choi and Jang Yong Son --posted in the North Korean Embassy in Tehran visited Pakistan eight times between 2012 and 2015. They were associated With the Korea Mining Development Trading Corporation ( KOMID ) - an entity sanctioned several times by the United Nations Security Council since 2005 for its involvement in North Korea's Weapons of Mass Destruction ( WMD ) programme.

These diplomats met with Pakistani officers involved in the nuclear program. They were tracked and investigated by the Western authorities as yet another proof of Pakistan's continuing nuclear links with North Korea.

Based on Western inputs on these links, the United Nations Security Council (UNSC) 1718 Committee, which is monitoring the implementation of sanctions against North Korea, sought information from Pakistan in November 2015 regarding the frequent visits of the two North Korean diplomats from Tehran to Islamabad and Karachi.

At first, say informed sources, Pakistan denied it, but when confronted with photographs and other recorded evidence, Pakistan acknowledged that the two North Korean officials under investigation had indeed visited Islamabad and Karachi.


Highly placed sources said that the West has so far kept this information under wraps in recognition of Pakistan's value in the war against terror.

But now, when Pakistan has gone into overdrive to upset the equilibrium of the NSG, Western nations of the grouping are saying that Islamabad needs to "look at itself in the mirror " and ask "how can it run with the hare and hunt with the foxes", meaning it can't claim to fulfill the NSG's requirements, and at the same time, sell nuclear weapons materials to North Korea. (ANI)

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 22 Jun 2016 16:47

kmkraoind wrote:Pakistan continuing to sell nuclear materials to North Korea, reveal U.S. sources (ANI Exclusive)

Washington D C, June 22 (ANI): Pakistan is continuing to sell nuclear materials to North Korea . . . The sources said that nuclear materials supplied to the PAEC by Chinese entities have also found their way to North Korea


It is both China & Pakistan who are proliferating to North Korea. China is using Pakistan as a conduit to avoid being caught with its pants down. Pakistan has no option other than to submit to Chinese diktats.

What is this bit about "China Atomic Energy Authority (CAEA) recently receiving a written complaint that supplies of a Chinese company, Beijing Suntech Technology Company Limited, to Pakistan were being diverted to North Korea by the Pakistani authorities" ? Who is complaining ? China is a member of NSG and it is supplying a dual-use item to Pakistan? Did it get NSG's concurrence? Or, is this part of the (in)famous grandfathering? In any case, this exposes China as well.

It is high time that NSG expels China from its membership.

India's NSG application has set the cat among the pigeons. Positions are hardening and closely held hands have been exposed. This will give further impetus to an alliance against China, IMO, notwithstanding skepticism among some here that somehow the US is secretly aligned with China.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby abhijitm » 22 Jun 2016 17:31

And then suddenly this has cropped up. This is a notorious article. The lady Nilanjana Bhowmick writes for usual anti-india, pro-paki suspects like The Guardian.

India's embarrassing North Korean connection

This is not Hong's first stint in India. In 1996, he stayed in the country for nine months, studying a course in remote sensing technology at the Centre for Space Science and Technology Education in Asia and the Pacific (CSSTEAP).

The research centre is located in Dehradun, a small town in the foothills of the Himalayas, about 235km from the Indian capital New Delhi.

"Dehradun is a very quiet town," Hong said in an interview with Al Jazeera. "The course was very informative, the teachers were very good."

Hong was, in fact, one of the first students North Korea sent to train at the centre, a school set up in 1995 by the United Nations, to ensure that "in years to come, no country in the region will have to look abroad for expertise in space science & technology application".

Since then, North Korea has sent at least 30 students to train at the institute.

Two are currently studying there, one of whom is affiliated with the National Aerospace Development Administration, which, the report says, plays a key role in the country's nuclear development programme.

And it kept sending scientists and space employees, even after the UN issued the first set of nuclear sanctions in 2006, prohibiting member countries from providing technical training to North Korea.

The lapse was exposed only in March 2016 in an annual report to the UN Security Council.
According to the report, North Korea tried to send at least one student to the institute in 2015 to attend a global navigation satellite systems course, although his application along with those of four others was rejected.
India is due to present a detailed report to an UN advisory committee on the issue.

"It doesn't take a rocket scientist to realise how extraordinarily unwise, and indeed irresponsible, it is nowadays to train North Korean operatives in technologies that can be used to improve and perfect their ballistic missile programme," Nicholas Eberstadt, a political economist at the American Enterprise Institute think-tank, said in an email.

"The government of India needs to acknowledge the seriousness of this error, take accountability for it, and publicly commit that it will not be an enabler of North Korean WMD programmes thenceforth."
India justified the content of the courses, saying that the topics covered are "very general" and the basic principles of these courses "are available from open-source".

It also said that topics covered "would certainly not contribute to acquiring expertise in those specific areas by the participants".

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Supratik » 22 Jun 2016 17:57

Tactical nukes are sophisticated devices. I doubt Pak has the capability and won't be surprised if news comes out that China is still supplying designs. The NK connection is probably to perfect H-bomb design with Chinese connivance.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 22 Jun 2016 18:31

France backs India's NSG bid, urges members to take 'positive decision' - ToI
France has asked members of the Nuclear Suppliers Group to take a "positive decision" on India's membership bid.

"India's entry into NSG will bolster global efforts for combating proliferation," France said backing India's claim.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Gus » 23 Jun 2016 00:09

Modi is in Uzbek ? For the sco?

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 23 Jun 2016 07:11

India seeks immediate NSG membership - Atul Aneja, The Hindu
Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesperson Hua Chunying said in a written response to The Hindu on Wednesday: “Although parties are yet to see eye to eye on this issue [entry of non-NPT countries in Nuclear Suppliers Group], such discussions help them better understand each other. China hopes to further discuss this issue and will play a constructive role in the discussions.”

While Indian officials say there have been several such rounds, not just “three” since 2011, Ms. Hua’s remarks indicate a shift from China’s previous stand ruling out any discussions on the subject until a “criteria-based” process was put into place to allow all non-NPT members in, including Pakistan.
But an unofficial discussion is not enough, according to government sources and India is seeking “immediate membership to the NSG, not long-drawn discussions.”

In a late-night development, Foreign Secretary Jaishankar cancelled his trip to Tashkent for the SCO meeting and headed instead to Seoul to lead India’s diplomatic push on the ground.

“This is a delicate and complex process. At this point let us not speculate,” the sources said. At around the same time that Thursday’s NSG plenary gets under way, Prime Minister Narendra Modi and President Xi Jinping will sit down for a “full review” of bilateral ties (approximately 3.40 p.m. IST).

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 23 Jun 2016 14:57

India Today reports that India's case will be taken up at Seoul. Japan raised the issue of Indian membership.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 23 Jun 2016 15:05

I was just listening to Ms. Alka Acharya, a totally pro-China person who may not hesitate, it appears to me, to sacrifice India's interests when it comes to China. I have heard her before and she has consistently come out with the same characteristics. That there are people like her, is a bad luck for us.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Yagnasri » 23 Jun 2016 15:26

SSridhar wrote:I was just listening to Ms. Alka Acharya, a totally pro-China person who may not hesitate, it appears to me, to sacrifice India's interests when it comes to China. I have heard her before, and she has consistently come out with the same characteristics. That there are people like her, is a bad luck for us.


At least they are open about it. Others like M S Ayar and CPM fellows are more dangerous to the nation.


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