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Tracking India's Admission into International Groups & Bodies

The Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum is a venue to discuss issues pertaining to India's security environment, her strategic outlook on global affairs and as well as the effect of international relations in the Indian Subcontinent. We request members to kindly stay within the mandate of this forum and keep their exchanges of views, on a civilised level, however vehemently any disagreement may be felt. All feedback regarding forum usage may be sent to the moderators using the Feedback Form or by clicking the Report Post Icon in any objectionable post for proper action. Please note that the views expressed by the Members and Moderators on these discussion boards are that of the individuals only and do not reflect the official policy or view of the Bharat-Rakshak.com Website. Copyright Violation is strictly prohibited and may result in revocation of your posting rights - please read the FAQ for full details. Users must also abide by the Forum Guidelines at all times.
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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Manish_Sharma » 23 Jun 2016 15:45

SSridhar wrote:I was just listening to Ms. Alka Acharya, a totally pro-China person who may not hesitate, it appears to me, to sacrifice India's interests when it comes to China. I have heard her before and she has consistently come out with the same characteristics. That there are people like her, is a bad luck for us.


Like Sh. Rajiv Malhotra said "millions were ready to be part of british army to fight their own countrymen, but british couldn't find even 200 chinese to join their army against fellow chinese"

There are no chinese versions of alka or raghu rajans.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Kashi » 23 Jun 2016 16:14

Dhananjay wrote:Like Sh. Rajiv Malhotra said "millions were ready to be part of british army to fight their own countrymen, but british couldn't find even 200 chinese to join their army against fellow chinese"

There are no chinese versions of alka or raghu rajans.


Funny enough, Japanese had little trouble finding enough Chinese to assist them in lording over their countrymen.


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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 23 Jun 2016 17:14

India's NSG bid to be discussed at a special meeting in Seoul tonight, say sources - PTI
India's bid for NSG membership will come up on Thursday night at a special post-dinner meeting of the 48-nation grouping's plenary, whose two-day deliberations began here today.

Although admission of members like India which are not signatories to the Nuclear non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT) is not on the agenda, Japan and some other countries are understood to have raised the matter in the opening session.

Thereafter, it was agreed to consider a number of unscheduled items including India's application at a special session after dinner, informed sources said.

It was not immediately clear that whether the discussion on India's membership, which is strongly opposed by China, and few other countries will come up informally or in a more formal way.


Indian diplomats, led by foreign secretary S Jaishankar, are here to lobby, although they are not the participants at the plenary in the absence of India's membership.

The Indian team includes Amandeep Gill, head of 'Disarmament and International Security' division in the external affairs ministry.

About 300 participants from 48 member countries are attending the plenary which was preceded by official-level session that began on June 20, according to the South Korean foreign ministry.

While the US and France have issued statements ahead of the plenary strongly supporting India's case and asking members to back New Delhi, China has been unrelenting in its opposition harping on the need to have a criteria for non-NPT countries like India and clubbing India's case with that of Pakistan for which it is batting.

Roughly 20 countries are backing India's case fully :eek: but given that the decisions in NSG are taken by consensus, India faces an uphill task.

India is seeking membership of NSG to enable it to trade in and export nuclear technology.

The access to the NSG, which regulates the global trade of nuclear technology, is expected to open up the international market for energy-starved India, which has an ambitious energy generation programme. India is looking at 63,000 MW energy requirement through nuclear programme by 2030.

The NSG looks after critical issues relating to nuclear sector and its members are allowed to trade in and export nuclear technology. Membership of the grouping will help India significantly expand its atomic energy sector.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 23 Jun 2016 17:48

PM Modi urges China to make fair, objective assessment of India's NSG application - Shailaja Neelakantani, ToI
Prime Minister Narendra Modi urged China on Thursday to make a fair and objective assessment of India's bid for membership to the Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG) on its own merit . The PM also asked China to "join the emerging consensus", which is support from more and more nations for India's membership to the 48-nation atomic trading club.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby abhishek_sharma » 23 Jun 2016 18:14

ANI ‏@ANI_news · 7m7 minutes ago

#FLASH Brazil, Austria, New Zealand opposed India's induction into NSG citing India being non NPT state.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby abhishek_sharma » 23 Jun 2016 18:14

ANI ‏@ANI_news · 9m9 minutes ago

#FLASH No consensus emerged in the NSG meet so far about India's induction in NSG.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby abhishek_sharma » 23 Jun 2016 18:15

ANI ‏@ANI_news · 2m2 minutes ago

#FLASH Ireland and Turkey opposed India's induction into NSG citing India being non NPT state.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby habal » 23 Jun 2016 18:24

all these are USA munnas.

brazil under dilma roussef was perhaps not a munna, but the new usurper is most definitely a munna.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby abhishek_sharma » 23 Jun 2016 18:37

Ashok Malik ‏@MalikAshok · 5m5 minutes ago

My sources in Seoul: It's down to China

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby BharadwajV » 23 Jun 2016 18:56

Try try try again.
OT:
Feel like sharing this, at this moment...
Long years ago we made a tryst with destiny,and now the time comes when we shall redeem our pledge,not wholly or in full measure,but very substantially.At the stroke of the midnight hour,when the world sleeps,India will awake to life and freedom. A moment comes,which comes but rarely in history,when we step out from the old to new,when an age ends,and when the soul of a nation,long suppressed,finds utterance.

It is fitting that at this solemn moment we take the pledge of dedication to the service of India and her people and to the still larger cause of humanity with some pride

At the dawn of history India started on her unending quest, and trackless centuries which are filled with her striving and the grandeur of her success and her failures. Through good and ill fortunes alike she has never lost sight of that quest or forgotten the ideals which gave her strength. We end today a period of ill fortunes and India discovers herself again.

The achievement we celebrate today is but a step, an opening of opportunity, to the greater triumphs and achievements that await us. Are we brave enough and wise enough to grasp this opportunity and accept the challenge of the future?

Freedom and power bring responsibility. The responsibility rests upon this assembly, a sovereign body representing the sovereign people of India. Before the birth of freedom we have endured all the pains of labour and our hearts are heavy with the memory of this sorrow. Some of those pains continue even now. Nevertheless, the past is over and it is the future that beckons to us now.

That future is not one of ease or resting but of incessant striving so that we might fulfill the pledges we have so often taken and the one we shall take today. The service of India means the service of the millions who suffer. It means the ending of poverty and ignorance and disease and inequality of opportunity.

The ambition of the greatest man of our generation has been to wipe every tear from every eye. That may be beyond us, but as long as there are tears and suffering, so long our work will not be over.

And so we have to labour and to work, and work hard, to give reality to our dreams. Those dreams are for India, but they are also for the world, for all the nations and people are too closely knit together today for anyone of them to imagine that it can live apart.



To the people of India, whose representatives we are, we make an appeal to join us with faith and confidence in this great adventure. This is no time for petty and destructive criticism, no time for ill will or blaming others. We have to build the noble mansion of free India where all her children may dwell.

The appointed day has come - the day appointed by destiny - and India stands forth again, after long slumber and struggle, awake, vital, free and independent. The past clings on to us still in some measure and we have to do much before we redeem the pledges we have so often taken. Yet the turning point is past, and history begins anew for us, the history which we shall live and act and others will write about.

. A new star rises, the star of freedom in the east, a new hope comes into being, a vision long cherished materialises. May the star never set and that hope never be betrayed by!



On this day our first thoughts go to the architect of this freedom, the father of our nation, who, embodying the old spirit of India, held aloft the torch of freedom and lighted up the darkness that surrounded us.

We must not forget Netaji though we have often been unworthy followers of his and have strayed from his message,. We shall never allow that torch of freedom to be blown out, however high the wind or stormy the tempest.





We have hard work ahead. There is no resting for any one of us till we redeem our pledge in full, till we make all the people of India what destiny intended them to be.

We are citizens of a great country, on the verge of bold advance, and we have to live up to that high standard. All of us, to whatever religion we may belong, are equally the children of India with equal rights, privileges and obligations.

And to India, our much-loved motherland, the ancient, the eternal and the ever-new, we pay our reverent homage and we bind ourselves afresh to her service. Jai Hind.

-Jawaharlal Nehru.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby abhishek_sharma » 23 Jun 2016 19:31

Geeta Mohan Verified account 
‏@Geeta_Mohan
#IndiaAtNSG
Meeting in Seoul Ends! Details to emerge.
Indian govt Sources :
Consensus getting stronger minus one so far (China).
@NewsX

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Raveen » 23 Jun 2016 20:58

Sounds like China needs more pressure through leaked reports of proliferation to Porkistanis and NoKos

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby devesh » 23 Jun 2016 21:08

The fact that multiple BRICS countries opposed entry to NSG should tell us something. For India, the only relationship that absolutely matters in Eurasia is India-Russia.

all else is hot air. we've seen a practical demonstration of it. hopefully the "analysts" get real from now on.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Screambowl » 23 Jun 2016 21:09

Raveen wrote:Sounds like China needs more pressure through leaked reports of proliferation to Porkistanis and NoKos


India is a member of MTCR and China is not as it's entry was refused in 2004. India can block Chinese entry in MTCR in future. India should play some business.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby devesh » 23 Jun 2016 21:10

Also, Austria, Ireland, Newzealand: all of them are US munnas. if US really wanted, they could have easily gotten these munnas to fall in line.

my take: US is playing games. and PRC is in on it.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby member_23370 » 23 Jun 2016 21:15

BRICS is dead with brazilian, russian and chinese economy heading downwards. south africa never had any potential. There was and is only I.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby malushahi » 23 Jun 2016 21:21

devesh wrote:my take: US is playing games. and PRC is in on it.


alternate theory - the munnas are pirouetting to set an end-game where the PRiC gets strung along.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Gus » 23 Jun 2016 21:26

Dd news was showing a clip of Modi getting on the plane to Tashkent. He was practically sprinting up the stairs. I thought he will slow down after a few steps...nope, he went all the way without thighs buckling or slowing. Dude is in good shape.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby RajeshA » 23 Jun 2016 21:27

devesh wrote:The fact that multiple BRICS countries opposed entry to NSG should tell us something. For India, the only relationship that absolutely matters in Eurasia is India-Russia.

all else is hot air. we've seen a practical demonstration of it. hopefully the "analysts" get real from now on.


India-Japan relationship has some potential as well, as has Indo-Israel relationship.

More importantly we just found out something about BRICS and G4.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Prem » 23 Jun 2016 21:37

Bheeshma wrote:BRICS is dead with brazilian, russian and chinese economy heading downwards. south africa never had any potential. There was and is only I.

Future with JAI= Japan America India not with BRICS.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby member_23370 » 23 Jun 2016 21:38

Needs to be seen over time...

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Raveen » 23 Jun 2016 21:48

Jhujar wrote:
Bheeshma wrote:BRICS is dead with brazilian, russian and chinese economy heading downwards. south africa never had any potential. There was and is only I.

Future with JAI= Japan America India not with BRICS.



JAI Ho economics!

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby ShauryaT » 23 Jun 2016 21:57

Kashi wrote:
Dhananjay wrote:Like Sh. Rajiv Malhotra said "millions were ready to be part of british army to fight their own countrymen, but british couldn't find even 200 chinese to join their army against fellow chinese"

There are no chinese versions of alka or raghu rajans.


Funny enough, Japanese had little trouble finding enough Chinese to assist them in lording over their countrymen.
Rajiv is mistaken on this score and he can be forgiven for he is not a historian. It was the same British led army of Indian soldiers (made up of the peasantry and elite of the nation alike) that helped India to attain its freedom from colonial powers, by turning the gun in a different direction. Much of this history is not talked about but some works coming out. Read Srinath Raghavan's India's war. Churchill dreaded this outcome and part of his reason for resistance to FDR's pressure to ensure that Indian resources were fully utilized in the campaign leading to 2.5 million Indian soldiers participating in the war.

What made modern PRC was the will of the CPC to marshall its resources and fight the Kuomintang and the Japanese together and then go on to take Tibet, Xinjiang and resist the Americans in Korea. With great costs to itself but creating the underpinnings for great power that many dread today.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby nvishal » 23 Jun 2016 22:01

India will either be voted into NSG or it won't. Full stop.

We already have a nuclear program for power generation(thorium). Clearly they're cooking that shit on candles Image

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby member_27581 » 23 Jun 2016 22:08

TimesNow reporting no consensus on India. Members divided on India's Induction. Nations cite Non NPT status. Pak's induction was not even discussed.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby habal » 23 Jun 2016 22:11

China cannot hold out all on it's own. It has to cave in tomorrow, or else it will create a strategic blunder.

USA gains both ways. If China makes the mistake of opposing INdia, it cements anti-China alliance with India. If China caves in tomorrow, USA gets to rub China's face in dirt.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby habal » 23 Jun 2016 22:29

Gabbbar ‏@GabbbarSingh 7h7 hours ago Gurgaon, India
Pakistan trying to enter NSG is like Shakti Kapoor trying to board the ladies coach.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby gakakkad » 23 Jun 2016 22:44

was it Australia that opposed India or Austria ?

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby BharadwajV » 23 Jun 2016 22:50

Austria.
Along with Brazil, New Zealand, Turkey and China.
New Zealand has to be shown its place in the international fora.
Cannot have these wannabe nations play "hard to get" with India.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Lisa » 23 Jun 2016 22:59

India bags all but China’s vote, decision on NSG bid likely on Friday

http://www.hindustantimes.com/india-new ... sjTOI.html

China’s great wall appeared to be crumbling before Indian diplomacy on Thursday. Beijing was left isolated as every other government of the 48-member Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG) spoke at the opening of the Seoul plenary in favour of accepting India into the elite international nuclear technology club. At the end of the first tense session of the two-day meeting, China found itself isolated over its call for a criteria-based membership that would allow Pakistan to also join the NSG, official sources told Hindustan Times.
China has been trying to block India’s membership by saying entry into the NSG should be limited to countries that have signed the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT), a global nuclear arms control pact. India and China’s “all-weather ally”, Pakistan, which too is seeking membership of the NSG, have not signed the NPT. As the NSG works by consensus, China has the ability to veto India’s entry.

Even as the Seoul meeting was taking place, on the other side of Asia in Uzbekistan, Prime Minister Narendra Modi was making a direct appeal to Chinese President Xi Jinping to support India’s entry to the NSG, saying China should make a “fair and objective” assessment of India’s candidature. Modi’s message was described as “very direct.”

At the Seoul meeting, Japan led the way by first raising India’s membership at the NSG meeting. It was seconded by Argentina which presented a report praising India’s nuclear nonproliferation record.
China found itself left high and dry as, one by one, more than 30 NSG members declared their support for India’s joining the group. Contrary to initial reports, Brazil and South Africa were strong backers of India’s membership. Austria, Ireland, Switzerland and a few others said they supported Indian membership but wanted to know how the induction process would take place. Turkey, seen as Pakistan’s closest friend in the NSG after China, said it supported membership for both countries. However, Pakistan’s application was not even taken up by the other members.

Beijing used a procedural block to hold up the meeting for five hours in the morning. It conceded after an additional clause, separate from the one about India, that the NSG should consider the “political, technical and legal issues” regarding non-NPT members was added. This is seen as a possible fig-leaf for Beijing to take back to Islamabad.

The representatives, after another post-dinner round, broke for the night and contacted their respective governments for further instructions. The formal plenary begins on Friday. In Tashkent, during his 45-minute meeting with Xi, Modi said China should “join and contribute” to the emerging consensus among NSG members on India’s candidature, according to the external affairs ministry. Sources said Modi spoke about how India’s entry into the NSG will strengthen the global non-proliferation regime. His meeting with Xi was his first engagement in Tashkent.

There was no official word on the response from Xi, who assured Pakistan President Mamnoon Hussain shortly before the meeting with Modi that China will adopt a “criteria-based approach” for NSG membership that will support Islamabad’s application. Continued Chinese opposition to India’s membership in the NSG could threaten bilateral relations between the two Asian giants, especially in fora like BRICS, the Russia-India-China triangle and even the climate change bloc BASIC.
But officially Beijing has sought to de-link its position on NSG membership from its ties with India.

“We believe that with regard to the admission of new members a decision shall be made with through discussion within the group,” Chinese foreign ministry spokesperson Hua Chunying said ahead of Modi’s meeting with Xi. “We do not believe that it (Beijing’s position on admitting new members to the NSG) is an issue concerning the bilateral relationship between China and India.”

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby devesh » 24 Jun 2016 00:12

Interesting. so the little munnas finally acquiesced?

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Vipul » 24 Jun 2016 00:27

India should give an ultimatum to the pipsqueak countries (Austria and New Zealand) to behave or it will be cut off from the Indian Economic sweepstakes forever. The same message should go to Brazil and South Africa. Regarding China, we should let them know that starting immediately it should buy more from India or say goodbye to the Plus $54 Billion yearly surplus it enjoys. With the slowdown and impending challenging adjustments ahead for its economy it can ill afford to loose the Indian market.

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby kit » 24 Jun 2016 02:58

China can most certainly be squeezed on the economic front ... there doesn't seem to be any tangible gains on finances either ..except for those they bank roll. . Time to start .. make in India to replace Chinese stuff

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby SSridhar » 24 Jun 2016 03:43

India's NSG bid stops at China wall - Indrani Bagchi, ToI
China remained the last major obstacle in the way of India's membership bid in the Nuclear Suppliers Group as 47 of 48 members supported New Delhi's application at the group's special plenary session in Seoul on Thursday.

The session debated until midnight but failed to come to a conclusion after hours of discussions, with China adamant in its opposition. Questions and doubts by other fence-sitting countries dissolved in the course of the evening, leaving China as the last man standing against India.
Officials in Seoul said the meeting would restart on Friday. After Thursday's NSG meeting, delegations were asked to revert to their headquarters for fresh instructions.

China raised a procedural block early in the day, refusing to admit the India membership issue to be discussed in the meeting. This, diplomats in the room said, caused a delay of over five hours, as the members wrestled with an agenda item. Finally, it was decided to discuss a heavily worded agenda on "political, legal and technical issues of non-NPT countries' membership. The discussions began at 9pm and ended around midnight, but remained in a deadlock.

Indian officials will be lobbying hard with the members before the meeting begins on Friday morning. The US is also expected to be working the phones on India's behalf.

Earlier Thursday afternoon, PM Narendra Modi delivered a candid message to Chinese President Xi Jinping who he met for a bilateral on the sidelines of the SCO summit in Tashkent. Sources said Modi conveyed to Xi New Delhi's expectation that China would support India in the NSG, a position that suggests that continued opposition will impact ties.

The 45-minute Modi-Xi meeting was almost entirely devoted to the NSG issue and China's opposition
. A readout of the meeting was given by official spokesperson Vikas Swarup who said, "PM Modi urged China to make a fair and objective assessment of India's application and judge it on its own merit. He said China should contribute to the emerging consensus in Seoul."

Until late Thursday evening however, Chinese diplomats in Seoul held on to their tough stand against India. Brazil and South Africa, two other members of BRICS, stood behind India, as did Russia. The consensus emerged through the evening's discussions, with countries like Ireland, Switzerland and Austria, even Brazil raising questions on process - but these whittled down to supporting India's candidature. Turkey stuck to its position of supporting India and Pakistan. However, Pakistan's NSG bid was not discussed at length, however the presence of the application was the reason for a lot of discussion on non-NPT countries.

China's continued obduracy raises serious questions in the Indian government about the value of organisations like BRICS, RIC or even BASIC, where India and China are believed to be working together. If China continues with its opposition, sources said there could be consequences for bilateral relations with Beijing, because it would be a direct refusal to an Indian head of the government.

The meeting in Seoul began with the outgoing Argentine chair Rafael Grossi presenting a positive report on India's commitments and compliance. South Korea, which took over the chairmanship of the nuclear cartel steered the discussion on India's membership, said sources.China's stand might wreck India's chances this time if Beijing continues to hold out. But the fact that India has mounted such a huge diplomatic exercise will play to India's advantage going forward. All eyes now will be on the last minute role that the US and other big supporters of India play on Friday to help bring China around.

Meanwhile, Xi met Pakistan President Mamnoon Hussain in Tashkent, where the two sides reaffirmed their strong bonds, describing themselves as "iron brothers". A Pakistan foreign ministry statement quoted Pak president as saying, "exception given for NSG membership could disturb strategic stability in South Asia."

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby malushahi » 24 Jun 2016 04:16

the 5th column strikes again.

NSG ‘concern’ over pressure for India’s entry

Narayan Lakshman


Meanwhile NSG members, many of whom are smaller economic powers than India and the U.S., for example, Belarus, Iceland, and Luxembourg are said to be worried that such concerns would be brushed aside by various heads of state focussed on their bilateral relationships with India and the U.S. in the interest of geostrategic aims, commerce, and domestic political pressure.


If the very nation whose nuclear trade was the core target of the Group were to be admitted into the NSG, then existing members would have to be prepared to make a range of adjustments and revisions, including in its rules, guidelines, and assumptions, including for example on the link between the NPT and NSG membership.

The irony, given the “suddenly accelerated the drive toward Indian membership,” is that unless this adjustment process is similarly pushed into fourth gear and completed, it may never move forward in the future, not least because “once India is inside the tent making changes will be more difficult in part because India will have a veto.”

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby sum » 24 Jun 2016 04:24

^^ High level and high stakes poker game this.

I feel that Amriki and US babus really did their job well and CHina has been left the last man standing and shown up for what it is. Overall, a win-win either way for India and hopefully,no more wooly-eyed China bhai-bhai atleast in future among the MEA class too

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby gakakkad » 24 Jun 2016 04:54

>>Xi met Pakistan President Mamnoon Hussain in Tashkent, where the two sides reaffirmed their strong bonds, describing themselves as "iron brothers". :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Gus » 24 Jun 2016 05:42

Lol...the iron born?

What is dead may not die!!!

Prem
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Re: Tracking India's Admission into International Groups

Postby Prem » 24 Jun 2016 05:51

It's Lonely Xi At NSG For Paki Pee making Political ***** play .

Call it a display of Chinese stupidity on global stage. IMHO, Chinese dream of Asian leadership will end with this behavior in NSG. The 60 Billion Dollar annual trade deficit with China must be priority now for GOI . Solution to cut import from China must be found on war footing so PRC must lose 1/2 Trillion Dollar surplus with India within decade. We should not be that naive to let them finance,arm paki with money earned from us.


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