Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc)

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Prem Kumar
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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby Prem Kumar » 15 Nov 2015 22:43

Shiv Ji: humble suggestion. With new right-wing portals like SwarajyaMag & MyInd.net hungrily looking for erudite pieces, its perhaps time to dust up and submit your BRF/BR-Monitor articles to them - like the one above on poison gas.

There is lack of quality journalism and a lot of amateur enthusiasts are far more knowledge'able than the so called professional ones. Now, there are outlets for aam aadmi to publish quality pieces

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby UlanBatori » 15 Nov 2015 22:57

Now Inspecteure Clouseau wonders eef all ze terroristes have been neutralized

What if the ****s strapped explosives to some innocents and blew them up by cell-phone, then ran out like the French Army from the Maginot Line? Probably giving interviews to See Enn Enn recounting their herrowic escape?

French National Police have issued an arrest warrant for Belgian-born Abdeslam Salah, according to the the official Twitter account of the police. "This individual is dangerous, do not interact with him," the police said in an alert about him.

It's possible that suspects directly involved in Friday's Paris terror attacks remain at large, a French counterterrorism source close to the investigation told CNN on Sunday.

A number of arrests linked to the attacks have been made in Belgium, but it is unclear whether they include the occupant or occupants of an abandoned car with weapons inside found in eastern Paris, the source said. The terror group ISIS has claimed responsibility for the Friday attacks.

But officials are still trying to figure out who the assailants were and how they planned and carried out near-simultaneous massacres at restaurants, bars and a concert hall in the French capital without being detected beforehand by intelligence agencies. :roll:

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby member_29247 » 15 Nov 2015 23:21

So now it's Belgian Waffle?

Waffle meaning from dictionary ( lest it be misunderstood)


fail to make up one's mind.


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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby member_20292 » 15 Nov 2015 23:46

Singha wrote:Home grown terrorist born and brought up in France it seems.

Instead of rattling sabres they need to understand root causes why their minorities are so angry

rising atmosphere of intolerance towards minorities in France

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby rgosain » 15 Nov 2015 23:52

mahadevbhu wrote:
Singha wrote:Home grown terrorist born and brought up in France it seems.

Instead of rattling sabres they need to understand root causes why their minorities are so angry

rising atmosphere of intolerance towards minorities in France


Touche. I wonder if the Anand Patwardhan will be returning his Schengen visa and the rest of his French awards to protest at France's treatment of minorities.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby IndraD » 16 Nov 2015 00:07

Being an anaesthesiologist myself my 2 paisa on Shiv saar post

fentanyl doesn't exist in gaseous form, it has to be given intravenously.
All anaesthetic gases mentioned have to achieve MAC>1.0 to keep a person unconscious , this is very difficult to achieve in open air system.
It exists in liquid form and some amount on top as vapour, this is swept off by mixture of oxygen and air and infused to patients.
I don't know how they can be used in anti terror operations.
While working in India we did many lists involving short cases where we got case done simply by holding mask tightly over face, with significant leak around, even then none of us dropped down.
In all probability what they used in Moscow theatre siege was a nerve gas.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby Karan M » 16 Nov 2015 00:22

^^ Agree, thats the reason they could not get enough trained personnel to deal with its fallout. In all likelihood it was a Soviet era developed "classified" derivative which they deployed in a rush without mapping out the results.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby gakakkad » 16 Nov 2015 00:37

IndraD wrote:Being an anaesthesiologist myself my 2 paisa on Shiv saar post

fentanyl doesn't exist in gaseous form, it has to be given intravenously.
All anaesthetic gases mentioned have to achieve MAC>1.0 to keep a person unconscious , this is very difficult to achieve in open air system.
It exists in liquid form and some amount on top as vapour, this is swept off by mixture of oxygen and air and infused to patients.
I don't know how they can be used in anti terror operations.
While working in India we did many lists involving short cases where we got case done simply by holding mask tightly over face, with significant leak around, even then none of us dropped down.
In all probability what they used in Moscow theatre siege was a nerve gas.


one more thing in addition to above is that low MAC agents like halothane have high blood gas partition coefficient and hence slow onset of action and recovery..not something i d want...

i beg to differed on inhaled fentanyl...inhaled fentanyl has been devised even though it is not used clinically anywhere to the best of my knowledge...

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2382801


but in a nutshell if i want an anesthetic agent to carry out this operation , it would have the potency of halothane with blood gas partition coefficient of nitrous oxide and such an agent would have to be easily reversible...i am certain the said gas is non existent to be best of our knowledge ...

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby member_29247 » 16 Nov 2015 01:13

Small doubt

If Nitrous oxide is used isn't there the hazard of

"Die Laughing"

in a serious hostage situation?

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby UlanBatori » 16 Nov 2015 01:25

^^
Spinster, that eez exactly what happened in Ze Pink Pantheure.
how they planned and carried out near-simultaneous massacres at restaurants, bars and a concert hall in the French capital without being detected beforehand by intelligence agencies.


Remember?
Your Leesaanz, s'il vous plait? Monsieur, u r planning to conduct ze near-seemooltaneous massacres WITHOUT A LEESANZ?
:eek: :shock:
So its official: See Enn Enn says: MANHUNT
Leave it to the French to find something to celebrate with champagne - oh! we just nabbed this miserable piece of pakistan!

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby member_29247 » 16 Nov 2015 02:18

In Mumbai (& India) which was itself a victim

Image

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby IndraD » 16 Nov 2015 02:23

Spinster wrote:Small doubt

If Nitrous oxide is used isn't there the hazard of

"Die Laughing"

in a serious hostage situation?


no sir.
You need more than 100% concentration of nitrous oxide in air to achieve unconsciousness, which is not possible , it is obsolete in cinical practice and only used to reduce concentration of other inhalational anesthetic agent

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby gakakkad » 16 Nov 2015 02:42

Spinster wrote:Small doubt

If Nitrous oxide is used isn't there the hazard of

"Die Laughing"

in a serious hostage situation?



not really possible ... because N20 is the least potent of anaesthetic agint with MAC of 104%.... that is it needs to be an impossible >100% partial pressure of gases in the lung of the animal to achieve anesthesia...it is among the safest stuff we have...that is why even dentist who have very little experience in resuscitation too use it...

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby vivek.rao » 16 Nov 2015 02:54

Image

ramana
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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby ramana » 16 Nov 2015 03:53

UB what if attackers are Pakistan trained with false Syrian passports. Then modus operandi to 26/11 fits.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby member_29247 » 16 Nov 2015 03:58

Sorry Guru IndraD garu and Guru Gakakkad garu

I meant they hostage taking guys (aka bad guys) could be shot by good guys while the bad guys were laughing away and not per se dying due to Nitrous oxide gas by itself.

I understand that the dentists were the first guys to use Nitrous oxide to make patients show teeth (by laughing) like this :mrgreen:

Please never take me seriously that you take seriously

mafi mangtha haun huzoor log
regards

PS: The phrase Die Laughing comes from the episode of Henry VIII wife Catherine supposed to be very pious was reciting the Bible when the head was chopped when the head rolled into the basket (hence basket case?) she appeared to be smiling laughing head (actually Talking Head?).
so it became die laughing... i am told (read)
Last edited by member_29247 on 16 Nov 2015 04:05, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby UlanBatori » 16 Nov 2015 04:02

Quite possible, and would fit with those who have the Performance Record to take the contract. I do question why Pakistan would burn star performers like Dawood Gilani aka David Headley in a mere concert attack in Paris, when there are so many targets in evil yindoostan. These would have to be at the level of the Hanged One (Kasab?) in IQ to be burned on this mission. Plus if caught (and the French will do DNA tests on the pieces, if not catch the elusive one) it would be rather bad: the French are not like the Americans. They DO retaliate, with no fanfare, and the retaliation is as focused as that of the Israelis and as savage as that of the Russians. ISI HQ would be fried, and they would expel all Pakis from France, constitution or no constitution.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby member_22733 » 16 Nov 2015 04:16

They did not do jack when their Engineers working on scorpene (IIRC) were halaaled. If it is indeed ISI, nothing much will happen, infact I doubt if anything will happen to the jarnails.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby member_29247 » 16 Nov 2015 04:18

It would be nice if TSP/ISI hand was involved even in terms of logistics via UK based Pakis. There are lot of illegal Pakis in UK, Italy France Norway and Germany...

Etoile Du Kashmir, is Paki owned restaurant the owner claims to be Mirpuri from POK, but I am sure he is from Lahore. I was there couple of times
its at Bienvenue Montparnasse Station.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby sum » 16 Nov 2015 04:25

LokeshC wrote:They did not do jack when their Engineers working on scorpene (IIRC) were halaaled. If it is indeed ISI, nothing much will happen, infact I doubt if anything will happen to the jarnails.

Agree.

Though i recall some reports posted on BRF itself a few years later where a few of the PN folks bones were broken in "assaults" by unidentified men and these were later found to be the guys who had ordered the bombing of the French engineers ( because of some bribe deal gone wrong).

Not sure if i remember correctly.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby gandharva » 16 Nov 2015 04:31

Aftermath photo: Inside Bataclan theatre

Image

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby gandharva » 16 Nov 2015 04:32

Amateur video of Bataclan Club Paris
Outside Bataclan Club and inside entry-area

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=16e_1447 ... UCm0O0o.99

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby gakakkad » 16 Nov 2015 04:36

vivek.rao wrote:Image



while this is certainly a possibility , take anything coming off the israeli press with truckloads of salt...some of their media is as bonkers as fox news and will not necessarily be objective...

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby shiv » 16 Nov 2015 05:38

gandharva wrote:Aftermath photo: Inside Bataclan theatre

Image

Please save this image. Pseudosecularism in Western media will ensure that it simply vanishes after a while.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby shiv » 16 Nov 2015 05:43

Prem Kumar wrote:Shiv Ji: humble suggestion. With new right-wing portals like SwarajyaMag & MyInd.net hungrily looking for erudite pieces, its perhaps time to dust up and submit your BRF/BR-Monitor articles to them - like the one above on poison gas.

There is lack of quality journalism and a lot of amateur enthusiasts are far more knowledge'able than the so called professional ones. Now, there are outlets for aam aadmi to publish quality pieces


For that article I did only part of the work. Dr Jagan helped me - and he is the anaesthesiologist IIRC who is much more qualified than me in this regard. I am not a zero on the subject of course - but I can't call myself an authority. That article has some medical jargon - I tend to make my articles much more easy to read by mango Abdul
.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby pravula » 16 Nov 2015 05:50

quite a few stories like this: This hit seems to have pushed them to hysteria.

http://variety.com/2015/biz/news/paris- ... 201641113/
http://www.expatica.com/fr/news/country ... 33871.html

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby shiv » 16 Nov 2015 05:53

gakakkad wrote:inhaled fentanyl has been devised even though it is not used clinically anywhere to the best of my knowledge...

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2382801
.

I think Fentanyl aerosols have been tried. I have forgotten the slew of articles I read while working on that but going through the list of agents - it seemed likely that aerosolized Fentanyl was the one that was most likely to have met the requirements. None of the others seemed to fit the bill. Of course we still don't know what was used but 20% mortality is a very good outcome in my opinion for a gas that was simply released in unregulated amounts into a theater. Compare that with less than 0.1 % mortality in regular anaesthetic work :shock:

Nowadays Wiki says that a derivative of fentanyl was used. Could be carfentanyl but I don't know the difference between car-fentanyl and truck-fentanyl.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby disha » 16 Nov 2015 05:54

Identified three #******** for their tweets - ones we already knew (Rana Safvi, Rana Ayyub and there is another CONgI pimp).

It is important that some of them are called out for what they are., no need for political correctness here.

Just posting here., mumbai is still fresh on my mind as if it was yesterday.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby shiv » 16 Nov 2015 05:59

Spinster wrote:Small doubt

If Nitrous oxide is used isn't there the hazard of

"Die Laughing"

in a serious hostage situation?

The name laughing gas is unfortunate. Every single one of us as students has tried this gas hoping to laugh and all of us have failed, and shifted to marijuana instead to have that laugh. One guy strapped a mask on to himself on an operating theatre table, turned on the NO2 and was found unconscious but alive. He is now a greatly respected millionaire specialist in America.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby disha » 16 Nov 2015 06:26

TSJones wrote:Not only was France instrumental in the American Revolution. Many of the ideas of the revolution for freedom came from French philosophers. French officers help created the US military (Lafayette) and the Corps of Engineers in particular. Lafayette was loved by America and a national hero. We've been close allies for over 200 years. We fought for the French (as well as Britain) in WWI. (Lafayette, we are here! was the slogan in WWI. Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition! was another slogan/popular song.) We don't have that kind of connection with India. It helps to have a sense of history, you know.......


TSJones'ji., sorry to rain on your parade. You do not have that kind of emotional connection with India since the Indians are short dark rice eating yindoos below your contempt.

Your very national anthem was composed on a USS Minden which was made in Bombay by skill'ed Indian workers. And the rockets red glare in your anthem - again an Indian invention. Your NASA celebrates India's rocketry.

Now now, why do not you go around calling your native-americans as Red-Frenchians? No they are Red-Indians - the very foundation of America was due to India.

Now when you go and drink that milk and eat that beef., know that the "Brahma Bull" and the genes in your "Holstein" cow is from the Indian cow. Yes those cow worshipping heathens provided you their Holy Cow.

So cut this "we do not have that connection with India ..."

And for the record, there was much support from the American public for India during and following Mumbai, with lots of news and interviews about the brutality that happened. Much detail was given about the traps laid for the police by the terrorists and the casualties they took, especially the commanders of the police force.


To be honest, what we only got was "CASHMERE". It was repeated ad-nauseam.

Tons of in-depth expert analysis and opinions were given including a spirited defense of the Mumbai police department and why it was so difficult to do what they had to do.(the traps laid by the terrorists).


And then Hillary Clintoon and your state department goes and state that India does not have robust maritime surveillance and hence it was a policing issue. A very bad one at that.

Sometimes I think India mistakes America as Britain and assumes we have some kind of intense connection (Britain == USA) with India. Generally, we don't. At least not like we do with the French anyway. There is no Indian Lafayette in US school books other than Gandhi. And he didn't care for the US much anyway by what I have heard.


There is nothing much of India in US schools and that is because of the inherent racism in US. You may not want to admit it, but by and large US is a very racist society and hence precludes learning about the true nature of the very birth of US., and anything about India is learnt with a great degree of contempt.

US == fUK since US has inherited the mantle of both UK and France continuing it forward., getting involved into vietnam and carrying the great game forward are only some of the facets.

Beyond mere words., US has NOT stood with India. Trust me, there were many Indians who died in 9/11 and 26/11 and for 26/11., all US has done is pay lip service.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby member_29247 » 16 Nov 2015 06:34

Thanks Shiv ji
But failing to laugh is a serious matter in itself, that is where the coma millionaire succeeded?

I now remember the story of coma killed man

The telegram read from the judge to jailer

" Hang him not, Leave him"
Where as the morse code guy was DOO like me ( Desi Oracle Operator) and shifted the coma by one bit and it took byte

The message to the jailer read

" HANG HIM, NOT LEAVE HIM "

The jailer became Jailed the story ends.
Some times dereliction of duty can save lives

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby shiv » 16 Nov 2015 06:50

Spinster wrote:Some times dereliction of duty can save lives

And the opposite - "duty of dereliction" which MMS govt did lost lives. Hate to compare but Hollande was seething and promising revenge. MMS was weeping and phoning America after 26/11

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby Singha » 16 Nov 2015 06:51

USA main trading and ppl to ppl contact has been western Europe and China. Japan has some fascination. Mehico ppl to ppl contact is not really voluntary as mehicans walk across in.droves.

It's a European country with European values and some wild west plus diversity mods..but lets not kid ourselves on the nature of the core value and culture its euro. So naturally they will find common causes like NATO kabila.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby jash_p » 16 Nov 2015 06:55

gakakkad
while this is certainly a possibility , take anything coming off the israeli press with truckloads of salt...some of their media is as bonkers as fox news and will not necessarily be objective...


even CIA also reported that some terrorist were from Syrian refuges. It is possible as ramana said that pakis and ISI may have arranged false papers as Syrian refuges and send as slipper cells. By the way on one talk show in America one of the ex-CIA guy told that some of pakis are training IS guys in Afghanistan.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby Singha » 16 Nov 2015 06:59

^^ I had already posted yesterday both the passport fragments found were fake, procured in turkey. they could be syrian or from anywhere else.

I would want to propose the model that NATO in its post-war avatar is a modern day Kabila, a warlike "golden horde" on the march, searching for resources for its industries and wealth for its banks.
just as in a kabila, the promise of a share of the spoils keeps all lesser khans together.

there is no threat from horizon to horizon before its vast cavalry armies as they march in wide formations on the steppe.

the Qa Khan answers only to his own drummer and the rest fall in line. a Council of Elders back in wall street in trans-urals forms the permanent advisory body...an oracle of sorts who propose the abstract higher directives which the Qa Khan translates into wartime goals.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby UlanBatori » 16 Nov 2015 07:06

Beloveds:

Ur news is rather olds.

It is possible as ramana said that pakis and ISI may have arranged false papers as Syrian refuges and send as slipper cells. By the way on one talk show in America one of the ex-CIA guy told that some of pakis are training IS guys in Afghanistan.


1. Some weeks back CNN or someone interviewed a happy Paki in Germany. Said freely that he had bought false papers to come across as "refugee". So I think about 50% or 75% of the "refugees" are Pakis. There is a thriving refugee papers industry in the Caliphate.

2. ISIS is very happily ensconced in Afghanistan. They just massacred a whole lot of Hazara Shia.

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby Singha » 16 Nov 2015 07:10

true. all the paks, afghans, bD's in the refugee swarm would know all bearing non-syrian papers would be sent back.
the govt run refugee camps in germany etc are not internment camps, people can stay if they want but none stops from leaving.

so they must all have decamped and dispersed by know into the cash economy and small business back ends.

only the africans by virtue of looks got short end of stick in wanting to be syrians :(

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby vijaykarthik » 16 Nov 2015 07:17

there is rumor doing the rounds that France could consider article 5. Wait and watch...

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby member_22733 » 16 Nov 2015 07:42

Going by the last time "war" happened. My bet is they will invade Tunisia and Algeria for democracy and freedom.

Mission Accomplished (for the jeehardies).

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Re: Terrorist Attack in Paris

Postby Singha » 16 Nov 2015 07:43

damn..that would mean another 50 planes in the fight .... will scare IS into surrender for sure.


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