Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc)

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 16 Nov 2015 17:58

In have one question. Paris attack happened and France somehow found the right address of ISIS in Syria. That was quick. It means French knew the ISIS headquarter all this time. Why didn't they bombed that place earlier?

Bhurishrava · Post by **Bhurishrava** » 16 Nov 2015 18:06

Wasnt England conquered by a normandy king and all of England divided among 200 norman knights? Does that mean the English have to have inferiority complex vis a vis the french forever?!

vinod · Post by **vinod** » 16 Nov 2015 18:11

rsingh wrote:In have one question. Paris attack happened and France somehow found the right address of ISIS in Syria. That was quick. It means French knew the ISIS headquarter all this time. Why didn't they bombed that place earlier?

Americans knew it and shared it with French. They probably bombed something and said its headquarters. Don't read too much into it. This is for French public consumption to show they are active. Most probably to counter suggestions that French govt wasn't vigilant enough.

vinod · Post by **vinod** » 16 Nov 2015 18:13

IndraD wrote:There are several ghettos like Molenbeek in London, going by how dense and complex London suburb is , UK police has done excellent job of safeguarding their people, what conspires behind curtain we can only speculate, but after 7/7 they have kept the country clean, this morning Cameroon said UK police has prevented 7 major terror attacks. Which means they are far superior in intel collection .

Ahem! I will thank the English channel first, then the border security, and then only the intel guys!

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 16 Nov 2015 18:21

Bhurishrava wrote:Wasnt England conquered by a normandy king and all of England divided among 200 norman knights? Does that mean the English have to have inferiority complex vis a vis the french forever?!

That was log ago. I am talking about things that happened in last 100. years. What ever I am saying is situation on ground. that is how i felt. There is no scientific study that I can refer to. But it is this way. When you speak to a French, speak English,speak bit louder and do not be polite.....you win the game. If you are polite with Germans or French,they take it as your weakness. Most polite in Europe are English.

member_29218 · Post by **member_29218** » 16 Nov 2015 18:26

Alka_P wrote:ISIS is more or less a collaboration between middle western mullas and western munnas. The main question is what the f*ck are these morons trying to do? arming syrian rebels who were also radical muslims with latest western weapons, letting in hordes of syrians, pukies, banglas etc. into europe.. is it all being done just for votes and corporate profits? What's the end game here?

Nothing escapes the BRF Gurus, but just in case, here is a take from the 'other side'. Russian writer Nikolai Starikov. A bit too simplistic, IMHO, but he does have some points. The whole thing stinks like hell. Anybody who has been through the ignominy of 'Lunar House' in Croydon will understand.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 16 Nov 2015 18:32

BRao wrote:
{quote="rsingh"}
this was the polite french for you. racist to the core, even today. Indians are often refused service in many restaurants there.
Where is that. Which restaurant is refusing Indians?

French are openly racists. Multiple experiences about CDG airport as well. Even the French I have had the misfortune of dealing with here in India are quite aloof & supremacists.[/quote]

yes they are but only until you firmly kick their white butts.

@rsingh. It happened both in paris and in toulouse. names of restaurants?? who remembers and who gives a shit??. french food is vastly over rated anyway. prefer good old Indian cuisine any day.

vijaykarthik · Post by **vijaykarthik** » 16 Nov 2015 19:10

http://www.brookings.edu/blogs/markaz/p ... i=23759033

Bruce Riedel compares and contrasts Mumbai and Paris attacks.

vijaykarthik · Post by **vijaykarthik** » 16 Nov 2015 19:14

chetak wrote:
vijaykarthik wrote:^ not just in free societies. What a lot of people might have missed: In China there was some terror attack in Uighur. And 48 died. This was as recent as the last 2/3/4 days. And there have been scores of events like this in the past too.

So, this is a menace that can cut across flavors of societies. As long as the organizational skills are there and men are resourceful, this is a serious problem as for the perpetrator, there is nothing called saving his skin in the process. And therein lies the danger. The person is prepared for all eventualities. That's something that the security orgn in any country will do well to realize and try and eradicate the infrastructure, the supply chain, the supporting pillars. Everything. Just trying to catch hold of 20 useful idiots as a passive laid back after-the-event exercise wont cut it.

And unless strong qns are asked to the leadership of Pak / KSA / ....
re India, when your own mala and vibhuti wearing yindoo brethren are aiding and abetting the jehadists at every level for their thirty pieces of silver, how can the supply chain and infrastructure be eradicated??

well known nationally celebrated icon cops have vigorously and enthusiastically pushed the idea of saffron terror, above and beyond the call, on the say so of their congi and commie masters. a pox on their houses.

less said about the Pak /KSA /... leadership the better. at least, they have the honesty of their evil purpose and you know where they are coming from.

Why "my" own as if you have washed your hands off the country? A shared effort, I say. I am as much critical of terrorism, *regardless* of which religion employs it, as any other person. Pointing fingers and washing (our) hands away isn't going to solve it.

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 16 Nov 2015 19:15

Dear Saar we can close the restaurant and ask them to pay the legal fee. it is not a joke. that is why I asked which restaurant. There was case server was not polite with the clint.

KJo · Post by **KJo** » 16 Nov 2015 19:18

My Peaceful friends on FB are going on overdrive defending Islam and posting about how some Peaceful fellow saved x number of lives.

These guys think everyone else is a fool.

Also everyone else clearing their conscience by changing their FB profile picture to a temporary French colors and feeling that they have done their bit.

member_29247 · Post by **member_29247** » 16 Nov 2015 19:23

Thanks to GOAT

The following have emerged in lexicon at least

1 Good terrorist Bad terrorist

2 State Actors Non State Actors

3 Right to send drones across to kill / assassinate suspected actor state or other wise

Not limited by sovereignity or state boundaries.

4 United Nations is irrelevant except to clean up the debris

Based on the precedents

India failed to act decisively on number of terror attacks, as a matter of fact routine shelling by state actor and killing/ injuring citizens itself is terror, we have caught terrorists live unlike others yet we have no action forth coming.

OK this is all past but now back to the future

If a terrorist act happens on Indians anywhere then by the above precedents is not GOI required to act?
Or do we still need uncle aunts to grunt Yes?

Can not India introduce a resolution to impose multi nation sanctions for hosting abetting terror attacks?

What do we learn from Paris attacks , from the terrorist modus operandi and the French State response
Such as declaring internal emergency, declaring war on state and non state actors territories?

What changes need to be made to doctrine and also, changes to equipment procurement, training and communication co ordination among agencies?

I think our over emphasis of conventional war, for which we are not really prepared thanks to UPA is not going to be of much help.

Our stores and equipment indicates that we can only wage a weekend conflict no more at least some time to come.

Just some thoughts and I could be completely wrong about our capabilities but he need to change will surely find some concurrence. IMVHO

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 16 Nov 2015 19:24

rsingh wrote:In have one question. Paris attack happened and France somehow found the right address of ISIS in Syria. That was quick. It means French knew the ISIS headquarter all this time. Why didn't they bombed that place earlier?

This might be like the address of Al Qaeda that Bush found in Afghanistan and Iraq.

member_29247 · Post by **member_29247** » 16 Nov 2015 19:28

But could not find the address of Osama right unde musharoughs Musharraf

VKumar · Post by **VKumar** » 16 Nov 2015 19:32

Let us see if India can label TSP a terrorist nation.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 16 Nov 2015 19:35

https://youtu.be/0GNXp0h1G28

Gign op on outskirts during the Charlie hebdo swarm.

The Charlie hebdo site was handled by BRi another ct outfit.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 16 Nov 2015 19:39

Ppl say the rearming and outfit of Mumbai police for pitched fight post 26/11 was a sham and went nowhere.

We better sharpen your game because no better way to embarrass and scar the namo govt. Sickulars are always begging for such things to happen so they can attack the govt

member_20453 · Post by **member_20453** » 16 Nov 2015 19:44

vinod wrote:
IndraD wrote:There are several ghettos like Molenbeek in London, going by how dense and complex London suburb is , UK police has done excellent job of safeguarding their people, what conspires behind curtain we can only speculate, but after 7/7 they have kept the country clean, this morning Cameroon said UK police has prevented 7 major terror attacks. Which means they are far superior in intel collection .
Ahem! I will thank the English channel first, then the border security, and then only the intel guys!

Indeed, UK luckily doesn't have the same open borders like the rest of western Europe. There you could get home delivery of weapons coming from East Europe, cross the border, execute an attack and come back home for supper.

member_20453 · Post by **member_20453** » 16 Nov 2015 19:55

Singha wrote:Ppl say the rearming and outfit of Mumbai police for pitched fight post 26/11 was a sham and went nowhere.

We better sharpen your game because no better way to embarrass and scar the namo govt. Sickulars are always begging for such things to happen so they can attack the govt

Indeed, Force ONE, NSG in Mumbai and other units across the country better keep the drills up. The more one sweats in training, the less one bleeds in war.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 16 Nov 2015 19:57

Singha wrote:https://youtu.be/0GNXp0h1G28

Gign op on outskirts during the Charlie hebdo swarm.

The Charlie hebdo site was handled by BRi another ct outfit.

- its a official interior ministry video with required faces carefully blurred out. there was no media allowed when actual op was own barring their own official cameramen for training and archival. our MSM were camping all over the place and even poking their mikes into the faces of NSG to take interviews, showing ops live ..... 101% out of control!
- they had plans of that printing press building - could plan the ins and outs. in india even if someone had filed the plan honestly, it would not be locatable, eaten by rats, or they built something entirely different.
- they have released this psyops video as a message to future and internal consumption. I doubt our people had such careful embedded recording going on.

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 16 Nov 2015 20:11

personal experience ,ze french are even more racist and suprem-ass-ist that ze germans...i have personally never experienced a racist german , though i know many people who have...but french are a pain i de rierre..i always hope to not get an exchange student or resident to rotate in my unit...i had one back in India when i was an MBBS student ....and he pissed everyone so bad that our ghisa pita SDRE dean wrote to their dean and cancelled the arrangement...

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 16 Nov 2015 20:29

The scary thing in this is that some seem to have escaped after committing the mayhem. Back to my question: Were the "soosai bummer" actually terrorists, or did they strap soosai belts on innocents and blow them up when the police eventually arrived?

If it took a long time for the Surete, Inspecteurs etc to arrive (and I am sure the terrorists would have a VERY good idea of how many seconds they had), surely they had time to commit whatever mayhem and leave the scene, leaving the hostages to be blown up to increase damage when the police came.

What would you do if someone strapped a bomb on you at gunpoint and said, "if you unbuckle this it will go off, just stay calm and u won't get hurt"?

Everyone outside the scene was on a cellphone, no one would notice the ones who seemed to be sending text messages (to the soosai belts).

The Syrian passports etc were too convenient, and show that there was meticulous Pak Army/LET planning, down to the second. Why does anyone assume that any of them were suicidal when they had the E-Z option of simply blending with the panicked survivors?

Meanwhile, I gotta find who makes those cool Balaclava masks. Terrorists use them, ~~Spetsnaz~~ Crimean housewives use them, French Surete uses them and The Late Unlamented Moderate Western-Educated, OxBridge-Accented Freedom Fighter Jihad John (pbuh) used them..

member_29247 · Post by **member_29247** » 16 Nov 2015 20:43

Ulan Batori wrote: Meanwhile, I gotta find who makes those cool Balaclava masks. Terrorists use them, Spetsnaz Crimean housewives use them, French Surete uses them and The Late Unlamented Moderate Western-Educated, OxBridge-Accented Freedom Fighter Jihad John (pbuh) used them..

Simple Chief Inspector Jacques Clouseau tells me that if you see slits in the mask near eyes, then they are made by Gap, he almost chided me and said you need to Mind the Gap in cap

arun · Post by **arun** » 16 Nov 2015 20:50

X Posted from the Islamism Thread.

BRao wrote:How can you miss the key word in all their defence of Islam? The key word is 'innocent'. They always say - I condemn the killing of innocent women & children; or I condemn the killing of innocent people. What is innocent? So they condone the brutal killing of non-innocent people? Nobody asks them this question. In any case, non-Muslims are not innocent as per Shariah & Quran.

From India a Mohammadden reaction to the Mohammadden Terrorist attack in Paris is to shift the blame from the Momin to the Kaafirs. Samajwadi Party Azam Khan blames France and Russia for the Paris attack. Seems there are never any Non-Mohammadden Kaafir “ innocents”, innocents number only among the Mohammadden Momin:

Azam Khan blames US and Russia for Paris terror attacks

The BJP and French Ambassador to India condemn Azam Khan’s comment:

BJP demands action against Azam Khan for 'Paris' remark

French Ambassador condemns Azam Khan’s remark

Surprisingly the Nehru-Gandhi Family led Congress Party also condemns Azam Khan’s comment:

Azam Khan sparks fresh row, now on Paris attack, Congress demands sacking

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 16 Nov 2015 20:55

cnn

Belgian special operations forces, clad in balaclavas and with bomb disposal robots at the ready, cordoned off two streets as they raided a property in Molenbeek, a suburb of the Belgian capital, on Monday morning, according to a CNN team at the scene.

Jean-Pascal Thoreau, a spokesman for the Belgian federal prosecutor, later told CNN that no one was arrested in the raid.

Earlier, Belgian state broadcaster RTBF, citing the country's Federal Justice Department, had reported that police had made one arrest during the raid, but had not apprehended Salah Abdeslam, the French citizen at the center of a manhunt for his suspected involvement in the terror attacks.

arun · Post by **arun** » 16 Nov 2015 20:57

A_Gupta wrote:Here is current MSA:
http://www.catchnews.com/world-news/ant ... 88023.html

Reacting to the deadly terrorist attacks in Paris, Congress leader Mani Shankar Aiyar on Saturday said that a possible solution against the growing surge can be the change in the 'Anti-Islam' attitude that exists in western countries.

"The Anti-Islam phobia that is being carried out in the western countries should be stopped immediately. The Muslims living in France should be provided with the assurance that they are also citizens of the country," Aiyar told ANI.

"In addition to expressing remorse, we should also think that why this situation has raised? Whatever the ISIS has done is extremely condemnable and by claiming the responsibility for the attacks, they have shown their ego which will not be accepted by anyone," he added.

He also said that only condemning the incident would not be sufficient.

"We strongly condemn this as but we cannot overlook it by just condemning it. There is need to examine this on fundamental ground, why this happened," said Aiyar.

Nehru-Gandhi family led Congress Party disapproves comment on Paris Mohammadden Terrorist attack by their own party member, Mani Shankar Aiyar aka MSA:

Cong disapproves Mani Shankar Aiyar remarks on Paris attacks

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 16 Nov 2015 21:05

italy and france are tight in most respects - catholics, industrial collaboration.....MSA overstepped his leash and is on bread and water for a week.

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 16 Nov 2015 21:22

If you still have doubts of who funded and created ISIS

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 16 Nov 2015 22:05

People are pointing out some of the biases and prejudices in reporting and attention. Honestly I did not know about the Beirut explosions that killed and wounded scores.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/16/middleeas ... xplosions/

Also, the World paid only cursory attention to Ankara's killings.

I hope India recognizes not just the West, but these as well - to just point out the Western attitude of reporting and attention.

vijaykarthik · Post by **vijaykarthik** » 16 Nov 2015 22:13

Reg balaclavas, I know scores of mates who use them in biking expeditions and treks / mountaineering expeditions (I have mine too). I hear that the French company Decathlon makes good 'uns. Available to one and all in India too!

http://www.decathlon.in/hiking/warm-wea ... p-M8188421

Wouldn't make them sponsors of global terrorism, would it?

Rampy · Post by **Rampy** » 16 Nov 2015 22:35

arun wrote:X Posted from the Islamism Thread.

self deleted

Sid · Post by **Sid** » 16 Nov 2015 22:57

I guess its time to stop demanding attention on problems we face. If their media does not give a damn, so be it. There is zilch followup on bombing in Beirut.

Beirut/Ankara bombings were forgotten in a jiff, but Paris attack?? no mon ami, now its a attack on humanity. Life somehow matters only in Europe and America? Everywhere else its just a number.

I hope everybody wakes up and just "STOP" all proxy wars world-wide for at least a year, let things cool down. Enough bloodshed to serve my memory. Sad part is no one is winning.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 16 Nov 2015 23:02

incidentally the greens have also killed very large numbers in africa with barely a mention in the press

Sid · Post by **Sid** » 16 Nov 2015 23:25

I was in Europe at the time Mumbai attack happened. Operation was still going on and during lunch this gent asks the most insinuating and insulting question even our dumb media was not asking. Instead of saying "sorry I heard a lot of your people got killed, its an attack on all of us", he said "your Gov says attackers came from boat, how can that be. They are lying. Its internal elements and blah blah" at which point I simply shut him up (of-course politely). And that was not just his opinion, everyone in foreign media was preaching how they could have handled such a case with much more success and GOI is incompetent.

But the same thing happened in London, Paris, Ankara, Beirut, Spain, etc. They got really lucky during that attack on Eurostar train attack.

I just wish everyone grows some conscious and stop for a while. Give it a break. Do whatever in this period, re-arm/entrench/have a party/move to a different planet/etc. Anything but fight. Enough of it.

BRao · Post by **BRao** » 16 Nov 2015 23:56

Not that I want to insult Europeans or to rub salt in their wounds, but this is just the start. There will be dozens of such attacks. They (Euro countries) are in a bad place. They ride to hunt with the Americans but they do not realise that there is no Pacific to shield them when the shit hits the fan.

They thought they can keep the barbarians happy with killing pagans. Not anymore. They have played both sides for too long. Didn't France supply Pakistan with Augusta submarines? And they have been constantly pumping Pakistan with military gear for way too long. ISIS doesn't want to kill Indians, nobody except Pakis want to kill Indians. Who in the big league cares if 300 Indians die? Some SDREs do a candle march & raise slogans but nothing happens - nobody in the first world takes note. Nobody in NYC feels scared, nobody in London, nobody in Paris. The mujahideen have no time & ammo to waste in killing Indians, they want to defeat the West, scare the western civilization. India has no dog in this fight.

member_22733 · Post by **member_22733** » 16 Nov 2015 23:59

Europeans are the original barbarians.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 17 Nov 2015 00:22

Singha wrote:italy and france are tight in most respects - catholics, industrial collaboration.....MSA overstepped his leash and is on bread and water for a week.

Maybe there are fault lines in Congress that can be exploited. Crusades very much an option.

Satya_anveshi · Post by **Satya_anveshi** » 17 Nov 2015 00:24

India has dog in this fight. Its about keeping a nice, clean, big, and decorated dresser mirror handy and making everyone see themselves in it every so often and then showing them how they appeared before terror events hit them.
Being passive people with infinite tolerance we don't openly express schadenfreude but not using opportunities when people can hear/listen best is also not our trite.

When critical mass in India lose patience and tolerance we can set aside the mirror and get physical to teach the same lessons.

rohitvats · Post by **rohitvats** » 17 Nov 2015 00:50

chetak wrote:<SNIP> yes, their response was faster and coordinated but that comes from learning bitter lessons.

And because the target city was Paris...Had 26/11 happened in Delhi, Delhi Police itself would've done a much better job than Mumbai police. It is equipped much better and my guess is that it has more well established Command and Control system - courtesy its role as being the first line of defense for securing so many high value targets.

Apart from that, the NSG is located next door and would've reacted in an hour or two max - even with the traffic situation on NH-24. Airlift using the Mi-8/17 capability would've ensured much faster response time.

One needs to remember that 7 out of 8 terrorists in Paris died due to suicide vest and not exactly police encounter...they got only one chap. In our case, the planning from Pakistan side was always to hold out and stretch the siege as much as possible...to ensure it becomes as big a spectacle as possible. And you cannot compare the spray-and-pray tactics in Paris to the near SF level training which LeT module had with superb firing discipline and CQB tactics.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 17 Nov 2015 00:57

Available to one and all in India too!

I had one when I was little - a tattered hand-me-down of course, but it was soo awesome! Comfortable too. One of the best inventions to come out of Oirope (I presume). All the great mass-murderer-rapists in Oiropean History wore those. Plus now it goes well with a Pakistan Army Regulation Issue Burkha. Soooo much more stylish than the stocking masks worn by US and British muggers and bank robbers.