Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2015

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby ramana » 10 Jan 2016 09:05

one way out for the Sharifs is the US drones Mohd Azhar and Hafeez Saeed.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby SSridhar » 10 Jan 2016 09:34

Thomas Kolarek wrote:US, UK rubbished India’s ‘evidence’ against Pakistan in Mumbai attacks, says Wikileaks - http://www.thenews.com.pk/print/89034-US-UK-rubbished-Indias-evidence-against-Pakistan-in-Mumbai-attacks-says-Wikileaks#sthash.2JcapJOp.dpuf

Why is this coming up now? Is it not coincidental?

There are many ways to rubbish this article. For one, nobody believes Pakistan's words, not even the tallel friend. And, more importantly, everybody knows Pakistan is a terror-sponsoring state. So, no rock-solid evidence is expected by anyone when accusing Pakistan of terrorism. Such is its reputation.

For another, perhaps one has to look at the time period when 'solid clinching evidence' was not 'supposed' to have been presented by India. Obviously, such a complex operation had to be pieced together, even though we had a Kasab in our custody, and loose ends tied up as much as possible (we can never present a foolproof evidence because a significant part of the evidence gathering has to be done by Pakistan which it failed to do) and the FBI was perhaps trying to suppress as much information about their agent, Headly, as possible. So, if the US official in India was told that "the bar could not be set too high for Indian evidence" on the 30th of November 2008, that was natural. As weeks went by, as more evidence trickled in, the case wa indeed as solid as one could get except for the Pakistani part of the evidence which only Pakistan could produce.

About Anne Patterson, the less said the better. She batted for Pakistan till the very end of her career. She was another Robin Raphel. Besides, Ambassadors to a country tend to do that for various reasons just like any Foreign Ministry bats for 'peace' overruling the judgement of the Defence Ministry even when everyone knows that 'peace' was impossible and military solution remains the only alternative.

On what MK Narayanan said, we cannot comment unless one knew exactly when he said that. Even then, he has said the evidence was 'pretty good'. Didn't the evidence become solid later on anyway?

I particularly liked what Shri Brajesh Mishra told the Americans.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby Thomas Kolarek » 10 Jan 2016 09:42

Strange thing is, no one asked for evidence on 9/11 before supporting WoT, not even Russia. But when it comes to Brownian like us, bar will be always set up. That's Hypocrisy. But question is why do we fall for it ? We never learn from history, even though it keeps repeating itself. There lies the problem.
SSridhar wrote:
Thomas Kolarek wrote:US, UK rubbished India’s ‘evidence’ against Pakistan in Mumbai attacks, says Wikileaks - http://www.thenews.com.pk/print/89034-US-UK-rubbished-Indias-evidence-against-Pakistan-in-Mumbai-attacks-says-Wikileaks#sthash.2JcapJOp.dpuf

Why is this coming up now? Is it not coincidental?

There are many ways to rubbish this article. For one, nobody believes Pakistan's words, not even the tallel friend. And, more importantly, everybody knows Pakistan is a terror-sponsoring state. So, no rock-solid evidence is expected by anyone when accusing Pakistan of terrorism. Such is its reputation.

For another, perhaps one has to look at the time period when 'solid clinching evidence' was not 'supposed' to have been presented by India. Obviously, such a complex operation had to be pieced together, even though we had a Kasab in our custody, and loose ends tied up as much as possible (we can never present a foolproof evidence because a significant part of the evidence gathering has to be done by Pakistan which it failed to do) and the FBI was perhaps trying to suppress as much information about their agent, Headly, as possible. So, if the US official in India was told that "the bar could not be set too high for Indian evidence" on the 30th of November 2008, that was natural. As weeks went by, as more evidence trickled in, the case wa indeed as solid as one could get except for the Pakistani part of the evidence which only Pakistan could produce.

About Anne Patterson, the less said the better. She batted for Pakistan till the very end of her career. She was another Robin Raphel. Besides, Ambassadors to a country tend to do that for various reasons just like any Foreign Ministry bats for 'peace' overruling the judgement of the Defence Ministry even when everyone knows that 'peace' was impossible and military solution remains the only alternative.

On what MK Narayanan said, we cannot comment unless one knew exactly when he said that. Even then, he has said the evidence was 'pretty good'. Didn't the evidence become solid later on anyway?

I particularly liked what Shri Brajesh Mishra told the Americans.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby abhishek_sharma » 10 Jan 2016 10:07

Doordarshan News ‏@DDNewsLive 20s21 seconds ago
Indo-Pak Foreign Secretary-level talks are intact: #Pakistan PM’s Advisor on Foreign Affairs Sartaj Aziz

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby arun » 10 Jan 2016 10:08

Thomas Kolarek wrote:US, UK rubbished India’s ‘evidence’ against Pakistan in Mumbai attacks, says Wikileaks - http://www.thenews.com.pk/print/89034-US-UK-rubbished-Indias-evidence-against-Pakistan-in-Mumbai-attacks-says-Wikileaks#sthash.2JcapJOp.dpuf
ISLAMABAD: Following Pathankot attack, the Indian media and government authorities have been referring to Mumbai attack as Pakistan’s work despite the fact that the Wikileaks had shown both the US and the British authorities trashing Indian so-called evidence against Pakistan.

Publicly both Washington and London have been shy to embarrass India and avoided rejecting her allegation against Pakistan but the Wikileaks showed the two trashing Indian claims about the involvement of either Pakistan’s prime intelligence agency- the ISI- or even senior leaders of a proscribed organisation.

Wikileaks, which contained secret State Department wires, had quoted former US ambassador to Pakistan Anne W Patterson as writing to the State Department that India had presented insufficient evidence against the senior leaders of now proscribed Lashkar-e-Taiba.

Anne W Patterson had mentioned in a wire to the Washington that Federal Investigation Agency (FIA) and other investigators had insufficient evidence for prosecution against Lashkar-e-Taiba’s Zaki-ur-Rehman Lakhvi, Zarar Shah and Mazhar Iqbal Alqama.

Patterson had even said that FIA was forced, as a result of political pressure, to arrest and charge the three LeT leaders and that FIA was still without solid evidence to begin a formal trial.

Some of the wires generated by US embassy in India had also made the India’s case on Mumbai attacks doubtful. Charge Geoff Pyatt was quoted to have written to Washington: “Indian officials remain convinced that Pakistan is behind the July 11th Mumbai attacks, and worry that the US is setting the bar too high for “solid evidence” of Pakistani intelligence involvement.”

The leak had even quoted National Security Advisor MK Narayanan as admitting that there are some pieces of the puzzle still missing. “He (Narayanan) said he is hesitant to say the evidence is “clinching”, but it is pretty good. Narayanan used the opportunity to reinforce the popular perception here that Pakistan is to blame for the attacks, while answering criticism that the foreign secretary’s and Mumbai police’s statements about the investigation were not backed by solid proof…”

The wire, generated from New Delhi, had also shown the Indian politicians reminding the Americans that India had sided with US on the issue of 9/11 despite the absence of concrete evidence.

The wire said: “At dinner with CIA Deputy Director of Intelligence Carmen Medina on October 23rd, former National Security Advisor Brajesh Mishra raised the issue of the US response to the Mumbai blasts.

‘We backed you when you decided to take action in Afghanistan after September 11,’ he said. ‘Your evidence after 9/11 was no less circumstantial than our evidence after 7/11 in Mumbai.’

He went on to criticise the US “double standard”, arguing that we treat Hizbollah one way, and the Pakistan-based United Jihad Council very differently. The bottom line, Mishra said, is that there is a widespread perception that the US is doing nothing to help India fight terror.”

Another leak, a wire sent from US New Delhi embassy to Washington, reflects on British doubts about Indian’s evidence against Pakistan.

The leak said, “While Indian press continues to pin blame on Pakistan, observers and diplomats in Delhi are asking the same question: was the ISI behind the Mumbai attacks? While there are clear links between the attacks, perpetrators and the extremist group LeT, and likewise, there are links between LeT and the ISI, there is no clear evidence yet to suggest that ISI directed or facilitated the attacks, according to the British High Commission.”

Now yet again after Pathankot attack, Indians have started blaming Pakistan claiming that they have evidence of Pakistan's involvement.
- See more at: http://www.thenews.com.pk/print/89034-U ... apJOp.dpuf


The cited October 2006 telegram from the US Embassy in New Delhi:

INDIA DEFENDS MUMBAI BLAST EVIDENCE POINTING TO PAKISTAN

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby A_Gupta » 10 Jan 2016 10:23

^^^ Also, whatever trashing might have been there would have been set to rest with Daood Gilani/David Headley.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/o ... or-attacks
Pakistan's powerful intelligence services were heavily involved in preparations for the Mumbai terrorist attacks of November 2008, according to classified Indian government documents obtained by the Guardian.

A 109-page report into the interrogation of key suspect David Headley, a Pakistani-American militant arrested last year and detained in the US, makes detailed claims of ISI support for the bombings.

Under questioning, Headley described dozens of meetings between officers of the main Pakistani military intelligence service, the ISI, and senior militants from the Lashkar-e-Taiba (LeT) group responsible for the Mumbai attacks.


http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/nat ... le2032067/
A middle-aged man born in Philadelphia, Mr. Headley was the linchpin of a 2008 plot that's been called India's 9/11 - when terrorists gunned down 160 people in the country's largest city, Mumbai.

He is now testifying against Pakistani-Canadian Tahawwur Rana, who is charged with conspiracy to provide material support to terrorism in the Mumbai attacks.

The trial of Mr. Rana, who claims he was working for Pakistan's spy agency, will be the first American legal proceeding to publicly probe the inner workings of the secretive service and is a window on U.S.-Pakistani relations.

Speaking without emotion, Mr. Headley described networks of Pakistani agents sponsoring terrorism. He even said he had met some agents who were interested in scoping out Indian nuclear power plants and still others who were not interested in securing the Afghan border at Tora Bora when Osama bin Laden was fleeing U.S. forces.

Through another lens, though, this prosecution is about friends and betrayal.

Part of the terms of a plea deal Mr. Headley signed is that he will give public testimony against alleged co-conspirators, in order to be spared the death penalty.

Mr. Headley surfaced from custody this week to give testimony against Mr. Rana, his boyhood pal from Pakistan who is accused of helping lay the groundwork for the attacks.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby A_Gupta » 10 Jan 2016 10:27

This is one of the Wikileaks items referred to above:
https://wikileaks.org/plusd/cables/09IS ... 024_a.html

As reported in reftel, the FIA investigation into the Mumbai attack has been diligently pursued and the FIA has developed a strong independent case against Sadiq and Riaz. However, the FIA does not/not have enough independent evidence to successfully prosecute the senior LeT leaders, Lakhvi, Shah, and al Qama. Unfortunately, due to political pressure, the FIA was put in the position of arresting and charging the three individuals before it had conducted a complete investigation or collected the proper evidence. Due to the nature of the Pakistani judicial system, the probability that sufficient independent evidence will be uncovered or developed against these three before the trial is small and they will most likely be acquitted due to a lack of evidence as early as May 23. Significantly, if the three LeT leaders are acquitted in the ATC, under Pakistani law they cannot be charged again in Pakistan for the Mumbai attacks.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby SSridhar » 10 Jan 2016 10:57

abhishek_sharma wrote:Doordarshan News ‏@DDNewsLive 20s21 seconds ago
Indo-Pak Foreign Secretary-level talks are intact: #Pakistan PM’s Advisor on Foreign Affairs Sartaj Aziz

Isn't this what Sartaj Aziz told their National Assembly yesterday? I do not see the talks happening unless either Pakistan makes a substantial effort in the issue that satisfies India or the Modi-government suddenly succumbs to a death-wish. Neither is likely and so no talks. But, there will be a lot of pressure on India though.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby Anujan » 10 Jan 2016 11:12

Also that article was written by Ansar Abbasi. He himself is a 50% jihadi. I wouldn't believe anything he writes. He writes only two three types of articles.

1. Pro jihadi
2. Lifafa
3. Pro jihadi and Lifafa.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby vishvak » 10 Jan 2016 11:34

abhishek_sharma wrote:Doordarshan News ‏@DDNewsLive 20s21 seconds ago
Indo-Pak Foreign Secretary-level talks are intact: #Pakistan PM’s Advisor on Foreign Affairs Sartaj Aziz

An apt way to hand over booby trapped dead bodies of jihadis, which is not our problem, must be handed over to Paki side. What is the point in talk when Pakis have openly come out as terrorists. There could also be a way to rationalize and protocols settings, alongwith, about terrorists calling back their handlers in Pakistan. If a terrorist, in his infinitely sane mind, plants an explosive in Pakistan before crossing over but does not tell, how to make sure such a thing does not occur on Paki side?

What if there are big stationary unmoving guns on Indian side of the border pointed to specific locations in Pakistan one way or another, which the terrorists fight to get hold over and happen to let off huge barrage of artillery across the border into Pakistan to settle some old scores, then how to make sure that damage does not happen on Pakistani side, in case the sane terrorists hide this part from their handlers.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby arun » 10 Jan 2016 12:13

X Posted from the Islamism thread.

Times of Israel reports that study by Israel’s Tel Aviv University’s Institute for National Security Studies shows almost all the suicide attacks in 2014 were accounted for by Mohammaddens; by almost all it is meant 450 of the 452 recorded suicide attacks.

Of those 450 suicide attacks accounted for by Mohammaddens, the Mohammadden Terrorist fomenting Islamic Republic of Pakistan recorded 36 demonstrations of the IED Mubarak variant of the IEDology of Pakistan in 2015. With just 36 demonstrations of the IED Mubarak variant of the IEDology of Pakistan, the Islamic Republic of Pakistan cannot aspire to the status of Greenest of Green and Purest of the Pure as they have been pipped by Iraq with 271, Afghanistan with 124 and Syria with 41 suicide attacks:

450 of 452 suicide attacks in 2015 were by Muslim extremists, study shows

The Tel Aviv University study itself is available at the below weblink:

Suicide Attacks in 2014: The Global Picture

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby arun » 10 Jan 2016 12:30

SSridhar wrote:
abhishek_sharma wrote:Doordarshan News ‏@DDNewsLive 20s21 seconds ago

Indo-Pak Foreign Secretary-level talks are intact: #Pakistan PM’s Advisor on Foreign Affairs Sartaj Aziz


Isn't this what Sartaj Aziz told their National Assembly yesterday? I do not see the talks happening unless either Pakistan makes a substantial effort in the issue that satisfies India or the Modi-government suddenly succumbs to a death-wish. Neither is likely and so no talks. But, there will be a lot of pressure on India though.


S Sridhar,

I am not very sanguine about the prospects of talks being called off. Our Prime Minister Narendra Modi seems to have succumbed to the dreaded Nobel Peace Prize cum Leaving behind a peace maker legacy for posterity disease. Thus the vaguest of comment by the terrorist fomenting Islamic Republic Pakistan will be touted as incontrovertible proof of substantial effort having been made by the Islamic Republic by our Prime Minister Narendra Modi and talks will held with them. Here let me also point out major provocations by the Islamic Republic of Pakistan like the attack on our Herat consulate, response to previous LoC firing, attack on Army Camp at Mohra and bailing Zaki ur Rehman Lakhi has not been adequately punished by Modi Sarkar.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby ramana » 10 Jan 2016 12:37

Arun
Talks make them rage. Logic says India should continue that. They will stage a coup ir jihadis will hijack bikes.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby pgbhat » 10 Jan 2016 14:55

More arrests, raids to nab Kamran Kayani in Rs17 bn DHA land scam
According to sources, NAB Lahore has exposed mega corruption scandal of Rs17 billion by Hammad Arshad and Kamran Kayani of Globaco and Elysium in DHA City project.

Raids are being conducted to arrest Kamran Kayani, brother of former Army chief Ashfaq Parvez Kayani. It is said that Kamran Kayani enjoyed support of influential circles.

Amjad Kayani, brother of Kamran Kayani, however said it is plot to defame their family. He said they are plaintiff in this case and Kamran Kayani is out of the country at present.

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Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2015

Postby Peregrine » 10 Jan 2016 15:54

Pathankot attack: India firm on linking foreign secretary-level talks with Pakistan's action on jihadis
NEW DELHI: India remains firm that Pakistan needs to take demonstrable actions like shutting down Jaish-e Mohammad camps and detaining important figures in the jihadi group if the proposed foreign secretary talks are to take place later this month.

Pakistan's decision not to reject out of hand leads given by India and indications of the military supporting the civilian government's commitment are seen as welcome signals but not enough to sustain the Lahore mood.

Prime Minister Narendra Modi's expectation that Pakistan PM Nawaz Sharif should ensure "prompt and decisive" action needs to be met in certain concrete ways to for the peace initiative to get off the ground.

Though the immediate arrest of Jaish-e-Mohammad leader Maulana Masood Azhar may not be on the cards, action against his group, religious proxy organisations and camps is seen as a "deliverable" by the Indian side.

There is a sense that Pakistan is keen to ensure the talks do take place around mid-January as has been suggested and hectic activity like Sharif's carefully publicised meeting with army and ISI is intended to save the engagement. At the same time, subtle hints that evidence provided by India is not "good enough" are not encouraging signs.
Though India would not be happy to see Modi's peace bid of dropping in on a Sharif family wedding to go abegging, the mood seems to have hardened about the need Pakistan to take verifiable action against Jaish.

This might prove an acid test for Sharif especially if reports of army-ISI involvement are true - as would be the case if the Jaish terror squad trained at a Pakistan airbase -- it is not easy to see a convincing investigation unfolding.

Given the Pakistan military's record of closely monitoring terrorist strikes against India, the possibility of an operation involving ISI being investigated and exposed does not seem very likely.

Yet, after the 26/11 attacks, a Lashkar camp was raided and a top operative Zaki-ur-Rehman Lakhvi was held by the Pakistani armed forces.

But the story of Lakhvi's detention did not end well as the anti-terror court trying the 26/11 case made no headway with judges being changed frequently and counsel complaining of being threatened.

In more than one occasion after the 2008 attacks, Pakistan promised action against the 26/11 plotters but in the end the case against Lakhvi collapsed. Despite Sharif's apparent desire to be different, India may await evidence that he can deliver.


Cheers Image

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby Falijee » 10 Jan 2016 16:57

US- UK rubbished India's Evidence Against Pakistan ....; Re: Mumbai Attack

S.S.Ji:
I agree 100% with your views on the above.
Firstly, Pakis are up to their usual tricks and are preparing the ground for official announcement of their non-involvement in Pathankot attack, hence citing the "US-UK rubbished India's evidence ......"
Secondly,with the introduction of the unofficial martial law , all media is closely monitored and therefore only the official line can be published ; so, if India calls off the talks, the blame can easily be passed off!

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby Falijee » 10 Jan 2016 17:25

"I Never Thought Such A Day Would Come When We Wont Be Able To Speak Even The Name Of Pakistan In USA" :rotfl:
Pakistani film director interrogated in USA
LAHORE - Jamshed Mahmood popular called Jami, the director of the Pakistani movie Moor that was nominated for Oscars and many film festivals across the world, was interrogated by police in Palm Springs, California, USA for using the words ‘ISIS’, ‘Afghanistan’ and ‘Pakistan’ in his conversation with a couple of friends, The Nation has learnt.
The Nation was the first to report the story yesterday.
The incident took place after the screening of his movie Moor.
He with his friends, one of whom was an American pilot of a commercial flight, were having conversation about his next film project at Coffee and Beans.
They were discussing the script when people overhearing the mention of words ‘ISIS’, ‘Pakistan’ and ‘Afghanistan’ called the police. (so the six pack Joe of Amreeka is already associating the Paki,- the HQ of world terrorism - with ISIS :mrgreen: )

Talking to The Nation Jami said it was all a misunderstanding.
‘I was with Shah, Hameed Sheikh and an American friend discussing the script for our next movie.
The words ISIS, Pakistan and Afghanistan words were used in the conversation.
I asked everyone to avoid these words before we get in trouble.
But by that time someone had overheard us and called the police,’ the director explained.

‘The police looked at our documents, took pictures and asked the purpose of our visit.
We explained the whole scenario after which they let us go.
I know they were just doing their job as things are on high alert in USA.
Thank God I was not in New York otherwise things would have been bad.
Our American friend started crying because he knew that his career would be at stake now because he was sitting with us.
’ Jami said.

‘About eight years ago I had decided to shift my family to US but later I thought no I’ll stay in Pakistan.
Today I feel my decision was right.
Speeches of (Donald) Trump have actually started making an impact,’ he said.
‘I never thought such a day would come when we won’t be able to speak even the name of Pakistan in USA. :rotfl:

Everyone from the family was being very careful of using the word Pakistan.
It is all absurd the way things are going here in USA,’ Jami was of the view.
The event has triggered a mixed reaction in the Pakistan film and entertainment industry with most celebrities and people condemning the incident and sympathizing with Jami while other criticized the way things are changing in USA and resentment against Pakistan and Muslims is increasing.
Academy Award winner Sharmeen Obaid was shocked.
‘My god! America is paranoid!’ she messaged to Jami.
Nadeem Mandviwalla the producer of film Moor said the movie was being screened in a number of festivals.
‘What happened was bad.
The Americans feel insecure and therefore there are overprotected by the state.
I believe the cops must have had a good laugh after investigating the matter,’ he said.

I am now 400% sure, that this is going to be his last US visit! would not be surprised, if his name will be "introduced" in the airport data bases of the world, if not on the US No Fly List!.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby ManishC » 10 Jan 2016 17:40

As for unexploded Jehadis - it should be Standard Practice to employ Flame Throwers on downed Pakis (aka Jehadis)

There is no excuse for losing Indian lives going near these scum, till the Jihadi is Roasted and Well Done, and capable of no further mischief.

As for the talks, they might eventually happen under American pressure/No other option, after the outrage dies down.
But the economic crumbs Sharif and Co were hoping and Modi dangled to lure civil society, will probably take longer to bear fruit, and only if there are no further high profile terror strikes.
Modi's economic integration driven vision in SouthAsia is DOA till Paki Army and Proxies are not neutered.
That brings us to lack of Indian capability developed to punish or deter Pakistan short of a full scale long war. Till we see attempts being made to address this lacuna in a time bound manner and actual implementation of the same, Pakistan Army wil continue to have an upper hand in the proxy war.
Till then every forthhcoming terrorist attack will follow the same cycle of Shock, Outrage, Impotent Hand Wringing and exchange of dossiers.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby A_Gupta » 10 Jan 2016 18:25

x-post from Sri Lanka thread:
The Khaleej Times reports:
http://www.khaleejtimes.com/internation ... m-pakistan
"Sri Lanka drops plan to buy Thunder jets from Pakistan"

The ultimate source of the news is the Indian Express, which has only unnamed Indian and Sri Lankan sources.
http://indianexpress.com/article/india/ ... a-objects/

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby A_Gupta » 10 Jan 2016 18:32

https://www.dailystar.com.lb/News/World ... truth.ashx

SLAMABAD: Pakistan's Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif has told U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry his country is swiftly investigating who was behind last week's attack on an Indian air force base, and that it would "bring out the truth".

The assault on the base near the Pakistan border has thrown into doubt diplomatic talks planned for later this month between the nuclear-armed rivals.

Kerry, speaking to Sharif by telephone, said he hoped the attack would not derail the talks that he said were in the interests of regional security, according to a statement from the Pakistani prime minister's office late Saturday.

"The Prime Minister told Secretary Kerry that we are swiftly carrying out investigations in a transparent manner and will bring out the truth," it said. "The world will see our effectiveness and sincerity in this regard."

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby shiv » 10 Jan 2016 18:41

A_Gupta wrote:x-post from Sri Lanka thread:
The Khaleej Times reports:
http://www.khaleejtimes.com/internation ... m-pakistan
"Sri Lanka drops plan to buy Thunder jets from Pakistan"

The ultimate source of the news is the Indian Express, which has only unnamed Indian and Sri Lankan sources.
http://indianexpress.com/article/india/ ... a-objects/

Let me make a guess here. Pakistan is desperately trying to get at least one customer for JF 17 to prove that in South Asia Pakistan was the first exporter of jet fighters. So we had announcements of Bundaar for Malaysia, Myanmar, Sri Lanka and now Nigeria and even Turkmenistan of some such place

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby A_Gupta » 10 Jan 2016 18:45

^^^ "India is also concerned that the deal, if it goes through, will enable the PAC, and perhaps even the CAC, to set up a facility in Sri Lanka for maintenance and training, and increase and widen contacts between Pakistan and Chinese security forces and Sri Lanka. - See more at: http://indianexpress.com/article/india/ ... CUkW9.dpuf"

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby A_Gupta » 10 Jan 2016 19:01

Supposedly the double railway track from Karachi to Lahore is complete, per this news-item:
http://www.jasarat.org/2016/01/09/shahb ... way-track/

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby Falijee » 10 Jan 2016 19:15

The "Untouchable" Imam Of Lal Masjid :roll:
The Express Tribune > Opinion
The mystery of Lal Masjid
By Ayesha Siddiqa

The liberal civil society in Islamabad and the rest of Pakistan, and even the Pakistani diaspora abroad, tend to get very upset with the continued presence of Abdul Aziz in the heart of the capital. There are some activists who have even made a career out of flagging the Lal Masjid issue. The emphasis of the argument is that Aziz survives due to protection of the political government. This may not be entirely incorrect as the interior minister recently claimed to have known the cleric and that he has personal terms with him.
(So, the maulana is playing on the "sifarash" card ) : :mrgreen:
It is indeed odd that a government whose prime minister recently claimed to be personally liberal would then turn a blind eye to someone creating anxiety in the heart of the capital. (But, Ganja is PM in name only !)This is not just about protection of the capital or the diplomats who live here, but also sending a message around the world that the state is unwilling to discipline a group or an individual who created such chaos in 2007 and probably has the capacity to incite people into bloody action against the rest of society.
But Aziz is an old mystery, not a new one. In fact, there is a history of the state turning a blind eye towards him and his family despite reports about their action or involvement in activities punishable under different provisions of the Pakistan Penal Code. From 2001 up until July 2007, 39 FIRs were filed against Lal Masjid’s management and students. Out of these, the initial four reports were filed in 2001, followed by two in 2004, three in 2005 and the remaining in 2007. From illegal possession of weapons and the unlawful use of loudspeakers to the illegal intimidation of people, kidnapping, wrongful confinement, harbouring of offenders and homicide or attempted homicide, the state had sufficient reasons to proceed against the Lal Masjid brigade. However, no decisive action was ever taken except for the 2007 military operation that may have been initiated to placate the Chinese or the Americans.
So, with the "behind the scenes" support of his powerful patrons (Home Minister, ISI, Saudi ), this radical Isamist is back in business,after lying low, because of the fallout from the Tafseen Malik affair ?
...Strangely, the Lal Masjid brigade was not even punished for the loss of life of around seven military officials.
For those surprised by the civilian government’s lack of action, it is a fact that no one has ever seriously brought the Lal Masjid brigade to book. In fact, a couple of senior police officials, who tried to take some strict action in 2007, were removed from their positions
...The Lal Masjid clan continued to operate freely even when the police discovered intimate conversations between the female leadership of the mosque and people involved in, for example, the killing of a Polish engineer.

And at no point did Aziz demonstrate that he was not a rational actor. He chose to escape during the 2007 operation clad in a burqa, indicating his flexibility, which means that he is not the kind who would sacrifice his life for his ideology. He did not even object to dealing with a female business and marketing executive, who was made responsible for overseeing the rebuilding of the mosque. This was not a burqa-clad female, but a modern person with moderate beliefs who was just performing a task assigned to her. According to some sources, his recent anxiety about implementation of sharia in the country was probably linked with the personal issue of rescuing a family member rather than anything else.
So, all this Islamism (as also practised by all the other Sarkari Mullahs ) is a sham to feed his own "ego" and keep the Moolah coming from his powerful patrons ? :twisted:
Aziz will probably continue living in the capital city. He is a beneficiary of some secret decision — not to take action against him — at some critical levels of the state.
The real threat to the powerful and to the establishment can only really come from a potent socioeconomic narrative, which is still missing. Aziz will certainly not stand for the disempowered. After all, he is a project of capitalism and will continue to thrive.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby shiv » 10 Jan 2016 20:42

A_Gupta wrote:^^^ "India is also concerned that the deal, if it goes through, will enable the PAC, and perhaps even the CAC, to set up a facility in Sri Lanka for maintenance and training, and increase and widen contacts between Pakistan and Chinese security forces and Sri Lanka. - See more at: http://indianexpress.com/article/india/ ... CUkW9.dpuf"

Huh? This news is so different from one I posted in the Mil Forum
No fighter jet deal with Pakistan’ : Sri Lanka
The Sri Lankan government has denied reports that it has struck a deal with Pakistan for the purchase of JF-17 Thunder fighter jets.

The matter did not even come up for discussion during the talks [with the Pakistani government],” Karunasena Hettiarachchi, Defence Secretary, told The Hindu, adding that his government was still considering the purchase of fighter jets.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby KLNMurthy » 10 Jan 2016 22:50

abhishek_sharma wrote:Doordarshan News ‏@DDNewsLive 20s21 seconds ago
Indo-Pak Foreign Secretary-level talks are intact: #Pakistan PM’s Advisor on Foreign Affairs Sartaj Aziz

The old spotty scoundrel Sartaj Aziz is being clever--again.

By repeatedly asserting that FS meeting will proceed, with no confirmation from India's side, he is setting the stage for blaming India when, not if, India is forced to postpone the meeting because Pakistan will do nothing at all about the information provided to it by India.

Pakis are always asking India for "evidence " taking advantage of most lay persons ' ignorance of the distinction between information and evidence. India can only provide information, it is up to pakis to investigate based on that information and develop evidence (which can then be used in court). The only way India can provide evidence is if Pakistan gives up its sovereignty and Indian agencies are able to interrogate suspects and witnesses in Pakistan itself.

These twin tactical goals--setting the stage for excusing their inaction as due to poor "evidence" from India and for blaming India /Modi for "suddenly " reversing its stance on the Jan 15 FS meeting are also why the "wikileaks" nonsense is brought out at this point. Pakis don't stop being pakis just because Modi-saar has graced Badmash's house with a visit.

I wish we would hold the meeting and put on the agenda "joint control " of Bahawalpur to pursue soothasia's shared goal of ending terrorism.

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Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2015

Postby Peregrine » 10 Jan 2016 23:14

China urges Pakistani parties to settle CPEC differences
ISLAMABAD: With the government, its allies and opposition parties at loggerheads over alleged changes in the route of the multibillion-dollar China-Pakistan Economic Corridor (CPEC), the Chinese Embassy in Islamabad broke its silence on the project on Saturday and urged all quarters to resolve their differences.

“China hopes that the relevant parties in Pakistan could strengthen communication and coordination on the CPEC to create favourable conditions for the project,” the embassy said in a statement.

Qureshi said both opposition parties and PML-N allies were opposing the government’s approach on the CPEC. “We have doubts on the transparency. The government is not sharing with us details. We want to know the names of the companies involved with this project,” he said.

Cheers Image

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby A_Gupta » 11 Jan 2016 00:28

Bidding irregularities for CPEC projects?
http://www.dawn.com/news/1230586
Two of the four highway projects in Balochistan recently inaugurated by Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif as part of the China-Pakistan Economic Corridor (CPEC) have been awarded to the second lowest bidders instead of the lowest ones, causing a loss of over Rs650 million to the exchequer.

Interestingly enough, the prime minister inaugurated the western route projects on Dec 30 even though no formal letter of acceptance (LoA) had been issued (for formal award of contracts) to the successful bidders/construction firms.

According to the National Highway Authority (NHA), four contracts — two for N-50 and two for N-70 — were awarded to two separate joint ventures (JVs) and a single firm. The lowest bidder was not considered in two of the contracts and the second lowest firms have not been asked to match the lowest bids.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby A_Gupta » 11 Jan 2016 00:37

http://english.cscec.com/art/2015/12/23 ... 51101.html
CSCEC Signs Biggest Infrastructure Project of CPEC in Pakistan

[ Date:2015-12-23 Visits:61 ]

  On December 22, 2015, China State Construction Engineering Corporation Ltd (CSCEC) signed the EPC Contract on Peshawar-Karachi Motorway Project (Sukkur-Multan Section) in Pakistan, with the contract value of US$2.89 billion. The successful signing of the Contract signifies the official launching of the biggest infrastructure project in China-Pakistan Economic Corridor and an important and substantial breakthrough of CSCEC in following national strategy of “One Belt One Road” Initiative.

  Based on the Contract, CSCEC shall build, in 36 months, a bi-directional 6-lane motorway with the overall length of 392km and at the design speed of 120km/h. Upon its completion, it will greatly improve local transport conditions of the most populous and developed regions in Pakistan, promote local economic development and play a positive role in the interconnection between China and Pakistan. (from Overseas Operations)

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby Prem » 11 Jan 2016 02:26

On GB

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby member_29240 » 11 Jan 2016 02:37

ramana wrote:one way out for the Sharifs is the US drones Mohd Azhar and Hafeez Saeed.


Ramana Sir, It would be a great way out, but I doubt it will happen.
This would mark a concrete US policy shift in India's favor. But if that happens it will come with a price. A price which I don't think Indian foreign policy which insists on remaining independent will be willing to pay.

What i do think will happen is Pak (under US pressure) will arrest some JeM folks (maybe even azhar??) with much media fanfare and talks will proceed since this is "historic". If we are "lucky" the case will go through Mil courts and severe/life sentences doled out. The culprits will enjoy 5-star comforts in Pak jails while we will celebrate "first time in history Pak has responded to our concerns". :evil:

Personally, I think the minimum response that India should accept is handing over of Azhar and other identified handlers.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby Prem » 11 Jan 2016 03:14

rudrak wrote:
ramana wrote:one way out for the Sharifs is the US drones Mohd Azhar and Hafeez Saeed.hat i do think will happen is Pak (under US pressure) will arrest some JeM folks (maybe even azhar??) with much media fanfare and talks will proceed since this is "historic". If we are "lucky" the case will go through Mil courts and severe/life sentences doled out. The culprits will enjoy 5-star comforts in Pak jails while we will celebrate "first time in history Pak has responded to our concerns". :evil: Personally, I think the minimum response that India should accept is handing over of Azhar and other identified handlers.


We will be entering the decisive era in next 4-5 years when the current flux i geopolitics get settled .
Since this great game will be in Asia, Indian interests have to be taken in account by all major players (including DIE India within). We can avenge this many overt or covert ways but in medium/immediate terms , Paki have no choice but to accept Indian leadership of the SA and beyond.

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby SSridhar » 11 Jan 2016 05:31

"There is a fairly prevalent but fundamentally false idea: that the art of war ought always to begin with the development of the means, and where the means at hands be inadequate, there remains nothing for the art of war to do but to advice peace. This is an art of war for speculators, not Generals".

Carl von Clausewitz, 'On War'


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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby abhishek_sharma » 11 Jan 2016 06:43

ANI ‏@ANI_news 13s14 seconds ago
India has cancelled the 15 January Indo-Pak Foreign Secretary level talks: NSA Ajit Doval in an interview to Dainik Bhaskar

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby Hari Seldon » 11 Jan 2016 06:48

^^ haha, Doval breaking news to Dainik bhaskar rather than to Dilli media...

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby abhishek_sharma » 11 Jan 2016 06:49

ANI ‏@ANI_news 53s54 seconds ago
No peace talks now till Pakistan takes action against #Pathankot terrorists and India is satisfied with Pakistan's efforts: NSA Ajit Doval

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby UlanBatori » 11 Jan 2016 07:12

News Flash! PAKISTAN THREATENS ENEMIES OF SAUDI ARABIA

What a relief! Now KSA need worry no more. :mrgreen:

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby abhishek_sharma » 11 Jan 2016 08:04

हम भारत के लोग ‏@India_Policy 3m3 minutes ago
Ok, Ajit Doval says no such interview goven to Dainik Bhaskar. Such a big screw up? What was DB thinking?

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Re: Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan-Nov 21, 2

Postby SSridhar » 11 Jan 2016 08:39

CPEC Controversy - Edit, DT
The sharp political divide between the government and the multifaceted opposition parties regarding the progress, allocation of resources and timetable of the ongoing construction of the China-Pakistan Economic Corridor (CPEC) has begun to alarm the Chinese government. The Chinese embassy in Islamabad has urged all the political parties to resolve their differences and create favourable conditions for the completion of the CPEC project. To do so, the statement held that the political parties need to improve their communication and coordination. Furthermore, the Chinese affirmed that they are “ready to work with Pakistanis, to actively promote construction of CPEC projects, and bring tangible benefits to the people of the two countries” since the CPEC was the outcome of consensus between the two countries. The raging controversy over the CPEC understandably worries China since they are set to invest heavily and have engaged with the federal government on a bilateral, state-to-state level. Seeing a house divided in Pakistan is likely to be a cause of concern about the future viability of the project. Given the fact that this crisis and conflict has been brewing for months and has only worsened with no resolution in sight, the optimistic timetables and projected costs regarding the completion of the project can begin to appear tentative at best. To understand why a project that has been recognised and hailed as beneficial to the developmental future of Pakistan with near unanimity by all political stakeholders of Pakistan is causing so much controversy, it is instructive to give a fair hearing to the complaints being raised and determine how the federal government is failing to address those concerns.

At the heart of the controversy surrounding CPEC is the province-biased history of development in Pakistan, with Punjab getting the lion’s share of resources at the expense of the other three provinces. The experience of decades of lopsided development thus feeds the charge that the Nawaz government, with its stronghold in Punjab, is going to manipulate the planning of the CPEC so that the other provinces are frozen out of the benefits gained. The federal government has been trying to dispel this perception but to no avail as the rounds made by Minister for Planning and Development Ahsan Iqbal have proved so far to be ineffective. In an All Parties Conference (APC) convened by Balochistan National Party-Mengal (BNP-M) meant to air the grievances regarding CPEC and redevelop political consensus around it, the opposition parties contend that Prime Minister (PM) Nawaz Sharif, in order to win support of the entire political class of Pakistan, promised on May 28th of last year in an All Parties Conference that developmental work associated with the CPEC in the underdeveloped western half of Pakistan (i.e. Balochistan and Khyber Pakhtunkhwa) will be prioritised. However the PM seemingly reneged on this promise when work on the eastern route of CPEC started first. This alarmed the representatives of the two provinces, who now contend that even if the western route is made it will only be a series of roads rather than being a bona fide economic corridor. Concerns about failure to reveal a set timeline and finer details of proposed plans aside, the Baloch representatives are also worried about the status of Gwadar, the end point of the CPEC. There are fears that once the construction is over, the beneficiaries of Gwadar will be outsiders and the influx of non-Baloch people will dramatically alter the demographic makeup of the thinly populated province, putting the locals at a disadvantage politically. Though Ahsan Iqbal tried to quell the fears by stressing how the project is to be completed in 15 years and in multiple phases and that the bulk of the CPEC’s $ 46 billion was allocated to the much needed energy projects that will benefit the country at large, the opposition is not satisfied and wants the PM himself to engage with them and give concrete answers to their concerns. Making matters complicated for the PM and his government, it seems that the Chinese, equally important stakeholders, themselves insisted that work on the eastern corridor begin earlier as they want to see results on projects that can be completed quickly first. The two positions (i.e. efficient result oriented versus historical grievances) seem dangerously irreconcilable. The challenge therefore is for the PM to take the opposition parties into confidence and share the finer details of the project rather than keeping them at arm’s length and hoping that they will oblige. This strategy is demonstrably unworkable and unreasonable. At the same time, the Chinese government should also be kept in the loop about the intricate regional politics of Pakistan. The only way to find a solution to this quandary is if all parties come together and reiterate a mutually acceptable modus operandi. Open and transparent communication, as the Chinese statement suggests, is the only way forward.*


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