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India-US relations: News and Discussions III

The Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum is a venue to discuss issues pertaining to India's security environment, her strategic outlook on global affairs and as well as the effect of international relations in the Indian Subcontinent. We request members to kindly stay within the mandate of this forum and keep their exchanges of views, on a civilised level, however vehemently any disagreement may be felt. All feedback regarding forum usage may be sent to the moderators using the Feedback Form or by clicking the Report Post Icon in any objectionable post for proper action. Please note that the views expressed by the Members and Moderators on these discussion boards are that of the individuals only and do not reflect the official policy or view of the Bharat-Rakshak.com Website. Copyright Violation is strictly prohibited and may result in revocation of your posting rights - please read the FAQ for full details. Users must also abide by the Forum Guidelines at all times.
disha
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby disha » 08 Mar 2017 07:30

It is interesting to see that Indians are seen taking away the US jobs via H1B but Chinese are not. Hence they are attacked.

Indians are seen as araps and attacked. Now Indians are seen as eyeranians and killed.

The biggest culprit to blame Indians for the job loss is none but Ombaba. He squarely and continuously blamed Indians for the "job loss"! As if Chinese do not show up on H1B visas or manufacturing is not offshored to China or Mexico.

For Indians to be not identified as araps or eyeranians., Indians really need to outreach - become mayors or community leaders and constantly identify themselves as Indians and not as bakistanis or araps or eyeranians or sickulars.

But again Indians are strategically stupid and tactically smart by half. I have seen Indians rejecting well deserved Indians and hire bakistanis to save few hundred dollars or prove themselves sickular. They do not identify with other Indians as if doing that will give them hives or even worse some STD. Worse is when they debate among themselves and to prove to others their superior intellect they bring in somebody totally unconnected preferably a gora as if they will provide an objective outlook!

On this forum itself., there are one or two posters who appear to be crabs in their past life and that gati of crab carried over into this life., who whine when the Indian government speaks up on behalf of safety of NRI.

Destinies of India & US are intertwined., the day Columbus sailed in search of India and discovered Indies that is the day the fate of two nations were conjoined for better or worse. Cornwallis lost his colony but came to Bengal and set in motion the colonization of India. US's national anthem was composed over HMS Minden which sailed from Mumbai. The rockets red glare in the anthem were from Indian armory., weaponized by Indians.

So to undermine and untwine the shared destinies of India and USA is a stupid & quixotic endeavor. Indians are very much in US., both before and after european colonization. In the current time., the present NRIs are the bridge between USA and India. It will be wrong for India not to support its cultural ambassadors and even worse for USA to target its ideal minority.

And it is the responsibility of the NRIs (Indian Americans) to carve their own identity out! They are Indians. Not bakistanis or b'deshis or s'lankans or nepalese or barbarians or eyeranians. Their identity is distinct and enriches & sanitizes the US culture. This is something the Indians need to own up. For so long we have been soothed into complacency by the pseudo-liberal elite into losing our identity that when we are targeted on the very basis of our identity we are running around like headless chickens.

GShankar
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby GShankar » 08 Mar 2017 07:41

Cybaru wrote:Not if you have the label printers which are made in china. They 3d scan and clone objects in seconds better than the replicator on star trek! They produce and then label things based on your geolocation!


I think the labels and the text in them are made in the u s of a.

MLOT.

habal
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby habal » 08 Mar 2017 07:42

When such problems come their way our NRIs need India and Indians with broad shoulders to cry on and for support, otherwise they are totally self-sufficient, proud and in look down upon h1b fob mode much like kashmiri pappus say 'bloody Indian'. You can always deny your identity on a foreign land, if you are a fair skinned Indian NRI, one can always pass off as greek, maltese or italian. But when SHTF you always come running to the Indian embassy.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby NRao » 08 Mar 2017 08:28

CY,

Age.

:)

Should be produced.

Thanks.

ramana
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby ramana » 08 Mar 2017 08:37

OK. Lets get back to thread title and topic.
Thanks,
ramana

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby TKiran » 08 Mar 2017 08:52

Disha sir, I appreciate your prospective, I would like to add some more.

We need not be apologetic, but then we are still apologetic, I was trying to get to analyze such behaviour. I just closed my eyes and I got the answer. It's called "defiance". Despite the whole world thinks that we andhras are crazy, absolutely stupid to pursue our American dream etc., Still we do, all that's envyly despiced by others including fellow Indians. It's called "defiance".

World respects "defiance". We andhras are going to make sure that USA is us of andhra. That's the single minded pursuit, subtle, and the goal. We are going to fill the vacuum of political space in US.

We will not let the sacrifices of 'Srinivas kuchubhotla' or the 'madasani's sufferings in vain. It's going to be another 4years of hardship and then we will win.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby Mort Walker » 08 Mar 2017 08:57

TKiran wrote:
World respects "defiance". We andhras Indians are going to make sure that USA is US of andhraIndia. That's the single minded pursuit, subtle, and the goal. We are going to fill the vacuum of political space in US.

We will not let the sacrifices of 'Srinivas kuchubhotla' or the 'madasani's sufferings in vain. It's going to be another 4years of hardship and then we will win.


There. Corrected.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby amritk » 08 Mar 2017 09:26

I don't think we are confused with anyone, for the most part.

I-As do need to engage more. Several good ideas from gun classes to political activism have been discussed.

Service to the larger community is an almost untapped opportunity. Does not have to be full time enrollment in police, military, etc. If one million Indians (about 1/4 of the population?) spent an hour a week volunteering, can you imagine the impact? We do more than our part for the economy, but we could also contribute to the spiritual needs of the US people. It is sorely needed in these times. There are unlimited opportunities and we don't need any work visas to do this. All ages can participate. This is especially for Indian born folks. ABCDs generally do volunteer work already.

I've been on this forum since 2000 and those are the best of my thoughts on this topic. I think we should have an accountability thread for this :twisted:

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby darshan » 08 Mar 2017 09:42

One thing that I really hope that this forum is paying attention to is that it is not only white americans that can't tell the difference between Hindu/Sikh and muslims. This holds true for african americans and latinos too. I personally can't identify northern chinese from korean or south chinese from vietnamese. Similarly, I can't tell difference between latinos. We should also be wary of non whites like african immigrants, middle easterns, pakis, BDs who can actually tell the difference and identify you as HIndu/Sikh.

Have we thought from the perspective of Indians vs. non whites? Whites have already carved out their piece of pie and they know that and they also know how to keep it safe from non whites (judges, lawyers, politicians, cops, etc.). The competition first starts between non whites. For example, NAACP and LULAC analyze all sorts of stats like hawk to make sure that unofficial affirmative action is carried past education system and into job market. Especially in gov't sector and defense industry jobs. Who is ticked off more at brown people? Whites or non whites? Will USA without whites in power turn into something like Uganda for brown people? Is the hate limited only to so called ignorant whites?

Added later:
We do volunteer and at pretty good opportunities like STEM volunteering etc. Young students do notice our kids. However, where we do loose out is that we are expert at muddying waters and do our best to do equal equal with pakis/bds and take on south asian identity instead of HIndu. So many of our younger kids shy away due to lack of preparation to tackle mud like caste system being thrown our way. Especially when we have lot of introvert and non confrontational kids in our community.
Last edited by darshan on 08 Mar 2017 09:48, edited 1 time in total.

Mort Walker
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby Mort Walker » 08 Mar 2017 09:45

I personally can't identify northern chinese from korean or south chinese from vietnamese.


Yes you can. Listen to them speak. Chinese is different from Vietnamese and Korean.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby darshan » 08 Mar 2017 09:57

Mort Walker wrote:
I personally can't identify northern chinese from korean or south chinese from vietnamese.


Yes you can. Listen to them speak. Chinese is different from Vietnamese and Korean.


Thanks for the tip. However, those genes seem to have skipped me. I can barely tell my South Indians apart from listening them speak.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby amritk » 08 Mar 2017 10:17

Deleted.
Last edited by amritk on 08 Mar 2017 14:13, edited 5 times in total.

habal
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby habal » 08 Mar 2017 10:20

darshan wrote:
Mort Walker wrote:
Yes you can. Listen to them speak. Chinese is different from Vietnamese and Korean.


I can barely tell my South Indians apart from listening them speak.


yeah, but that's not an advantage, you have to sensitize yourself to various subtleties. if you are the type that thinks the world begins with me and ends with me or that the world starts with pathankot and ends with sriganganagar, then living outside India will at some point deliver a few hard knocks.

When Indians are outside India, they become unconscious of their surroundings and behave as if they are in their own hood when they get together with other countrymen esp of their thought ilk. One has to always be conscious in foreign lands as there are always curious eyes watching you even if they are not directly looking. And those may not be friendly eyes either because due to skin colour it taps into local racial undercurrents. Many white americans do not relish non-whites having a good time. They have after all worked so hard at undermining middle-east power structure, got rid of gaddafi and saddam who could look americans in the eye, getting rid of native americans with small pox. Wrecked havoc in Vietnam and thrown a nuke in Japan, kept Africa destabilized and popped up corrupt dictatorships, yet these Asians are swarming all over us. Brain freeze moment.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby Mort Walker » 08 Mar 2017 10:59

darshan wrote:Thanks for the tip. However, those genes seem to have skipped me. I can barely tell my South Indians apart from listening them speak.


I'm a Hindi speaker myself, but I can definitely tell the difference between Telugu, Tamil, and Malayalam. Occasionally picking up on different words. If they're talking about me, I can usually tell. I do have a problem distinguishing the NE languages as those are hard for me to figure out.

Similarly, Castilian Spanish is different from the Spanish spoken by Mexicans and Central Americans. Similarly Portugese is different too. I get weird looks from Cubans and Caribbean people when I'm in South Florida who look at me strange when I tell them I can't speak Spanish. They think I'm lying to them.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby Mort Walker » 08 Mar 2017 11:09

habal wrote:yeah, but that's not an advantage, you have to sensitize yourself to various subtleties. if you are the type that thinks the world begins with me and ends with me or that the world starts with pathankot and ends with sriganganagar, then living outside India will at some point deliver a few hard knocks.

When Indians are outside India, they become unconscious of their surroundings and behave as if they are in their own hood when they get together with other countrymen esp of their thought ilk. One has to always be conscious in foreign lands as there are always curious eyes watching you even if they are not directly looking. And those may not be friendly eyes either because due to skin colour it taps into local racial undercurrents. Many white americans do not relish non-whites having a good time. They have after all worked so hard at undermining middle-east power structure, got rid of gaddafi and saddam who could look americans in the eye, getting rid of native americans with small pox. Wrecked havoc in Vietnam and thrown a nuke in Japan, kept Africa destabilized and popped up corrupt dictatorships, yet these Asians are swarming all over us. Brain freeze moment.


Immigrants to the US have always done better than the local natives. As immigrants are likely to maintain the family unit, study hard and work hard to achieve success. I see it in my own gora friends and acquaintances who have children in high school and college that are friends of our children. As we emphasize STEM to our children, goras let them pick the social sciences, music and fine arts as suitable college subjects. It isn't that their children aren't smart, they are, but have poor guidance. I can see this causing some resentment. I had a black colleague who once said when immigrants drive nice cars and live in nice houses it isn't fair to the natives, and I thought WTF?

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby Agnimitra » 08 Mar 2017 11:20

Mort Walker wrote:Immigrants to the US have always done better than the local natives. As immigrants are likely to maintain the family unit, study hard and work hard to achieve success. I see it in my own gora friends and acquaintances who have children in high school and college that are friends of our children. As we emphasize STEM to our children, goras let them pick the social sciences, music and fine arts as suitable college subjects. It isn't that their children aren't smart, they are, but have poor guidance. I can see this causing some resentment. I had a black colleague who once said when immigrants drive nice cars and live in nice houses it isn't fair to the natives, and I thought WTF?

It isn't poor guidance, but needs an adjustment of the social value system. Arts, conceived properly, are the highest expression of human civilization, even higher than technology or the amount of money one makes. That was always the view of even the US founding fathers:

John Adams, in a letter to Abigail Adams (12 May 1780) --
"The science of government it is my duty to study, more than all other sciences; the arts of legislation and administration and negotiation ought to take the place of, indeed exclude, in a manner, all other arts. I must study politics and war, that our sons may have liberty to study mathematics and philosophy. Our sons ought to study mathematics and philosophy, geography, natural history and naval architecture, navigation, commerce and agriculture in order to give their children a right to study painting, poetry, music, architecture, statuary, tapestry and porcelain."

But to give social prestige to the brahminical subjects, one needs to have a compatible value system. That is still in the making in the US.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby Mort Walker » 08 Mar 2017 11:26

^^^What was true 70 or 270 years ago isn't true in today's college education system in the US as there use to be well roundness. Today the US college education is a rip-off of the middle class and tax payer by so many students pursuing useless subjects in the humanities and arts. It isn't sustainable and more US kids would be better off learning plumbing, concrete working and electrical work.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby Agnimitra » 08 Mar 2017 11:28

^^^ True, the educational system is not integral and well-rounded anymore. It reflects an inchoate value-system with a lot of good ideas but no integral vision.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby Philip » 08 Mar 2017 14:19

The sad truth is that there are but a few (white) nations which respect Indians.We are merely tolerated. The other native communities like West Indians in Britain,have a chip on their shoulder when they see Indians better off than them.The "flat earth" theory ,reg. economics, globalisation, etc.which was promoted in full measure by the West,has backfired. Trump is trying to reverse -engineer the decision to send US jobs overseas.

What we in India should do is to imagine that we are a planet of only 1B+ Indians ,and we must manage economically ourselves. Of course this is imposs. as energy,etc. comes from abroad,but the broad outlines should be "India First".The news that there is a proposition only Indian steel will be used for infra projects in India is fantastic! Along with the ban on toxic Coke,Pepsi,etc.,we should enforce the highest intl. stds. for our processed foodstuuffs and consumables. This way it will benefit the consumer and make Indians healthier.GM crops too should be banned outright and any int. product which contains GM crops. If this is mandatory in the EU,so should it be in India.

In times of acute eco crisis,tribal,ethnic,religious,linguistic and colour prejudices wikl come to the fore. We are repeating history sadly.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby ricky_v » 08 Mar 2017 14:53

http://www.rediff.com/news/report/us-khalistan-terrorist-gets-15-year-jail-term-for-planning-attack-in-india/20170308.htm
An Indian citizen has been sentenced to 15 years in prison for conspiring to support terrorist attacks in India, including assassination of an Indian government official, as part of the Khalistan movement to create an independent Sikh state.
On Tuesday, US District Judge Larry Hicks sentenced 42-year-old Balwinder Singh in Reno to 180 months in prison for conspiracy to provide material support and resources to terrorists for the movement to create the independent Sikh state, US Attorney Daniel Bogden for the District of Nevada and Special Agent in Charge Aaron C Rouse for the FBI's Las Vegas Division said.
Bogden said, Singh, a Reno resident, was a member of two terrorist groups and provided material support to "intimidate" the Indian government and to harm persons who were not supporting the terrorism groups' cause.
"This case is an example of multi-law enforcement agencies working collaboratively together to protect the United States and our foreign allies from a terrorist act," Bogden added.
Singh, who also went by the alias Jhaji and Baljit Singh is a citizen of India and a permanent US resident. He had pleaded guilty in November last year.
According to court documents, between September and December 2013, Singh conspired with others to support terrorist attacks in India as part of the Khalistan movement to create an independent Sikh state in the Punjab region.
Singh agreed to provide "material support" by helping facilitate a co-conspirator's travel to and within South Asia; to provide necessary funding; and to provide materials necessary to carry out the attack.
On occasions, Singh travelled from Reno to California to meet a co-conspirator in person.
In October 2013, Singh and his co-conspirators agreed that one of them would travel to India and carry out a terror attack -- likely an assassination or maiming of an Indian governmental official. The final target was to be determined after the co-conspirator arrived in South Asia.
In November 2013, Singh purchased two sets of night vision goggles and a laptop computer and provided these items to a co-conspirator who was going to carry out the planned terror attack. The co-conspirator attempted to board a flight from the San Francisco International Airport to Bangkok in December 2013 in order to carry out the terror attack but US law enforcement prevented the co-conspirator from boarding that flight, thwarting the planned terror attack.
After these events, Singh and his co-conspirators continued to discuss and plan the terror attack in India until Singh's arrest in December 2013.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby Singha » 08 Mar 2017 15:01

wise words Philip sir. nobody knows what is the impact of gm crops in a few decades. if history is any guide, some bad side effects might emerge.

wanting to take over foreign lands by mass emigration is fine, but none will accept beyond a point . and everyone leaving paves the way for the thieves and hawks to take over at home. a struggling india and small sections of rich NRIs will not help the NRI H&D and social positioning either. brownies will find it hard to get honorary white certificate no matter how much they diss india and those that want to be seen as indians will look poor if india does badly at home. this is why I think a large majority of the 2nd segment support Namo from abroad.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby IndraD » 08 Mar 2017 16:45

2nd & 3rd gen NRIs will face particularly difficult time. As they have been brought up in an 'environment of equality & diversity' but will perceive gradually they are less equal than white . They also can become victim of hate crime. Problem will be complicated by the fact that they are more or less detached from grass root (India) and US is their home. Any suggestion how to handle that?

added later - In UK many schools celebrate Eid & Bakreid but not Diwali even in areas where Indian diaspora is high. Cos council does not recognise later as festival school should recognise.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby UlanBatori » 08 Mar 2017 18:22

Back about 1 year or so back, some ABCDs (from very wealthy families apparently -see this article for an example of ABCD sense of "social work" for Ulan Bataar, brings tears to my nose) got together and decided to form a chapter of a South Asian Fraternity. It was not PC for my Evil 6th coujin to ask WHY (or why South Asian, actually it may have seemed very GOOD to the Evil E6C **NOT** to name it "Indian Greek Organization", or maybe he decided to keep quiet since they were obviously focused on kind Social Work etc. So he bought them dosas at the local desi Mall in lieu of an Official Meeting at Headquarters, and chatted with them about procedures, grand plans, etc. Strongly advised them to seek help of the ABCD/Paki wimmens (that would be a Sorority, yes, thanks) because of their noted abilities in getting things done and their dB levels, but they seemed a bit 404 about such things.

Anyway, they went about their paperwork on their campus, and eventually got to a VOTE at the Inter-Fraternity aka "G(r)eek" Council. They were VOTED DOWN!!!! Why? Well... my guess is blatant racism, but I was too polite to tell E6C that. But E6C asked them to get over it, and join his efforts in doing something more directly for people, starting with India but going on to the world. Many enthusiastic nods of heads, big grins...

...... (months of unsuccessful efforts per E6c, to get them to move their musharrafs)...
Eventually asked them to Move Forward Or Out. Set up weekly thursdin 7:30AM formal meetings. They showed up for a few weeks. They actually put up a WEB PAGE!!!!! (several of these were Computer Science geeks, believe it or not!)
An outline map of India on the front page!!! (again, tears of joy to my nose just hearing about it from E6C)

With the entire State of Jammu-Kashmir and much of Northeast India missing. And E6C was perfectly clear on this: Not a single one of these was a Paki. Or even Other Community. All 400% Yindoos onlee. Probably brought up getting taap marks at Baal Vihaar and reciting SCriptures forward and back at speed. OK, maybe "Agnostics". "Spineless Wunders". "Reptiliean". Certainly not brought up in impoverished homes with no electricity, unable to access news.

E6C pointed out to them that unless they changed that or removed the map pronto, E6C (or they) might get arrested for Non-Bailabal Ophenj next time he (or they) landed in desh. They eventually obliged - improved the map somewhat.

Weeks went by. Still no progress. They lied at every meeting about what they had done/were going to do.

E6C gave next advice: MOVE FORWARD OR OUT. Fire the Computer Science geeks. Hire middle-schoolers. Instead they decided that their tender feelings were hurt (sort of like some seen here) and pouted away. May be joining the next Rally to Patagonia One Small (never mind). To "raise awareness of the need for people in Patagonia for American/ European jalopies". :roll: :roll:

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby bharotshontan » 08 Mar 2017 19:48

darshan wrote:One thing that I really hope that this forum is paying attention to is that it is not only white americans that can't tell the difference between Hindu/Sikh and muslims. This holds true for african americans and latinos too. I personally can't identify northern chinese from korean or south chinese from vietnamese. Similarly, I can't tell difference between latinos. We should also be wary of non whites like african immigrants, middle easterns, pakis, BDs who can actually tell the difference and identify you as HIndu/Sikh.

Have we thought from the perspective of Indians vs. non whites? Whites have already carved out their piece of pie and they know that and they also know how to keep it safe from non whites (judges, lawyers, politicians, cops, etc.). The competition first starts between non whites. For example, NAACP and LULAC analyze all sorts of stats like hawk to make sure that unofficial affirmative action is carried past education system and into job market. Especially in gov't sector and defense industry jobs. Who is ticked off more at brown people? Whites or non whites? Will USA without whites in power turn into something like Uganda for brown people? Is the hate limited only to so called ignorant whites?

Added later:
We do volunteer and at pretty good opportunities like STEM volunteering etc. Young students do notice our kids. However, where we do loose out is that we are expert at muddying waters and do our best to do equal equal with pakis/bds and take on south asian identity instead of HIndu. So many of our younger kids shy away due to lack of preparation to tackle mud like caste system being thrown our way. Especially when we have lot of introvert and non confrontational kids in our community.


The blacks and Latinos are just as ignorant as the whites. Most of my US life has been in Latino-majority white-negligible-minority area, and I can vouch for this. I used to be asked questions like "Is Hinduism a sect of Islam?" Girls used to ask me if my mom could teach them bellydancing. One of the post 9/11 attacks that resulted in death involved a Nuyorrican woman (established 3rd/4th-generation of Puerto Rican diaspora settled in New York City particularly Bronx burrough) pushing an elderly Indian man into the train tracks in New York

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/30/nyreg ... ueens.html

I have been called by the following illustrious terms: "terorista", "Moro" (meaning Moroccan or Moor), "Arabe", etc. I was in the barbershop (all blacks) the day after the San Bernardino shooting, and as soon as the local news went to cover that story, all the barbers and customers stared at me.

To be honest, all this talk of needing to showcase to these ignorant racists as to how different we are from Muslims sounds a lot like "cooning" behavior. Let me paint a picture of the shit I dealt with in middle/high school post 9/11. Imagine yourself in classroom full of these Latinos that taunt you in lead up to Iraq war "we gone bomb yo uncle Saddam son", and there is a quiet shy introvert Paki Hijabi in the other corner of the classroom being taunted for her mustache and unibrow and then they tell you "hey Apu, why your girlfriend don't shave?" and classroom breaks out in laughter. In that moment this markute bongoshontaan filled with sentiments of placing rakshabandhan between Hindus and Muslims makes the hijabi his sister and throws fists in 5 directions, breaks a few teeth, gets in trouble with school authorities stares down VP straight tells him if you don't check the racial comments I hear daily in school I'm calling the local media they'll have a field day with your school....don't even get in trouble despite throwing first punch and instead get the kids with broken teeth suspended. To top it off, this was the last fight I've had in my life. Since then as I went through high school, a reputation followed me as in don't mess with that guy. My lesson to be extrapolated from that is it helps to back up all the "model minority" business with some baseline threat that I can extract my pound of flesh and half from you if you mess with me. Hence my initial comment about staying strapped. Just like India has a reputation of being a soft state, Indians individually have built a reputation of being docile individuals.

I will treat the fight with peacefuls, particularly brown Mohammedans, as "ghar ka mamla" when in front of those attacking us racially. In massaland we need to be in 1857-1910 mode, in India we need to be in 1947 mode. The two modes can coexist inside a person. If your anti-Islamism makes you a doormat for whites, you're no friend for the Hindus, just like if your secularism makes you a doormat for Islamist aggression.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby Gagan » 08 Mar 2017 19:53

What to do onlee.
You gotta give some share of the blame to the parents for being too MATA.

Everyone around the world is going crazy about heritage, origins, family tree and the like. Just see the popularity of animal husbandry sites like Ancestry dot com, and here there are ABCDs who are taken in by the leftist campus bovine scatology and talking about sooth asian identity onlee. No sense of heritage or identity.
These are poor confused souls, trying desperately and ham handedly trying to create a sense of belonging, but mis-education then kicks in

Hack thoo onlee

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby chetak » 08 Mar 2017 21:28

Image

Gus
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby Gus » 08 Mar 2017 21:48

H4 EADs in scanner...

Sessions opposed it before and might not defend it and let it go

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/worl ... 526131.cms
It has now come to light that the new administration's department of justice (DOJ) has filed a brief in the Washington DC court of appeals seeking a 60-day freeze in a case involving employment authorisation for H-4 visa-holders, who are primarily dependent spouses of H-1B visa-holders.

Thousands of Indian spouses come in this category, and they won a hard-fought permission to work in America+ in February 2015, when the Obama administration issued a rule through the department of homeland security allowing eligible spouses to be employed+ while the H-1B visa-holder awaits the receipt of his/her lawful permanent residency card (green card).
Soon after the rule was issued, a group called Save Jobs USA filed a lawsuit, but a district court ruled that it had no locus standi to sue and upheld the Obama administration's rule.

Taking the case to the appeals court, Save Jobs USA filed its initial brief soon after the Trump administration took charge, and found immediate support from the DOJ, which filed a document on February 1, 2017 titled "Consent motion to hold proceedings in abeyance for 60 days", asking the court to "allow incoming leadership personnel adequate time to consider the issues".

The writing is pretty much on the wall, according to immigration activists, since attorney general Jeff Sessions, when he was a US senator, had called the H-4 rule a "change [in] immigration law in a way that hurts American workers".

Aman Kapoor, co-founder and president of Immigration Voice, which has now filed a motion to intervene in the case on behalf of thousands of H-4 visa-holding spouses, says: "There is nothing for the DoJ attorneys to confer with their leadership about given the district court's clear decision stating that this case had no basis for ever being filed."

"Any failure to provide the strongest possible defence of the district court's decision risks establishing a precedent prohibiting H-4 visa-holders from working under the current statutory regime," Kapoor said.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby Zynda » 08 Mar 2017 22:14

Bharat, I have heard stories from American born Indian folks (those who were born during late 70s to mid 90s era...not the ones who were born mid-2000s), even in CA, where they faced incidents similar to what you have described. One dude told me that he had to go the extra mile to be treated like an American, especially in high school. I dunno if American media exaggerates high school experience, but based on what I've seen, it can turn out to be a harrowing experience.

bharotshontan wrote:Imagine yourself in classroom full of these Latinos that taunt you in lead up to Iraq war "we gone bomb yo uncle Saddam son", and there is a quiet shy introvert Paki Hijabi in the other corner of the classroom being taunted for her mustache and unibrow and then they tell you "hey Apu, why your girlfriend don't shave?" and classroom breaks out in laughter.


Is there no teacher to control/restrict such insensitive comments? Or do they passively acquiesce? Even during high school in India, our teachers would not hesitate to use carnal punishment.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby gakakkad » 08 Mar 2017 22:41

NRao wrote:* NPR reporting that there have been 120 incidents reported against Jewish institutions. School closed in Chicago, two places in Milwaukee, bomb threats in upper New York, etc

* Visited my Mexican store. Everything is now Made in the USA or Product of the USA.


I have a feeling a lot of those reportings are fake.. Jews continue to feign persecutionand invoke holocaust in order to get political mileage. We need to do the same ..

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby bharotshontan » 08 Mar 2017 22:54

Zynda wrote:Bharat, I have heard stories from American born Indian folks (those who were born during late 70s to mid 90s era...not the ones who were born mid-2000s), even in CA, where they faced incidents similar to what you have described. One dude told me that he had to go the extra mile to be treated like an American, especially in high school. I dunno if American media exaggerates high school experience, but based on what I've seen, it can turn out to be a harrowing experience.

bharotshontan wrote:Imagine yourself in classroom full of these Latinos that taunt you in lead up to Iraq war "we gone bomb yo uncle Saddam son", and there is a quiet shy introvert Paki Hijabi in the other corner of the classroom being taunted for her mustache and unibrow and then they tell you "hey Apu, why your girlfriend don't shave?" and classroom breaks out in laughter.


Is there no teacher to control/restrict such insensitive comments? Or do they passively acquiesce? Even during high school in India, our teachers would not hesitate to use carnal punishment.


Zyndaji, the teachers are passively acquiescent. Another thing is that the culture in the US is such that actual fists-flying is tremendously frowned upon, while comments regarding one's family/looks/accent/ethnicity etc are all tolerated (minus maybe calling a black the n-word by a white). The game is for the kids on the receiving end to learn to respond in kind as well. In normal circumstances the kid that starts a fight is the one that is in trouble no matter what the provocative statements are. In India I remember it being the opposite. I remember we had a pair of non-identical twins in our class, one fat boy and one skinny, and another guy was saying something stupid like your parents only feed one of you and starve the other. The two brothers began beating on that guy, the teacher saw everything that happened, asked for the back-story, and himself gave two more slaps on the guy that was bothering the twins. Ethnic-based smart comments were extremely rare compared to what I faced in 4-5 years of schooling in US, but they did happen. There was a kid in our school that got pissed after a dismissal during a cricket match and went around writing on the school walls in crayons "Sab Bangali log chor hain". Some of us caught him one day and picked him up on with his 4 limbs and dropped his whole body into an open sewer :lol: Principal found out and asked what was the issue, called in the parents and never heard a squeak from that kid again. So Indian schooling administration, from my experience, is way more competent at handling ethnically diverse population pressures.

I think complete taboo on impulsive fighting (especially for young boys) is bad on mental health. There are quite a lot of these mass shootings resulting from pent-up frustrations of once-bullied boys. Better to allow boys to be boys and satisfy own egos of having done something about their own situation, and then dish out justice as necessary.

In my case, I'm not US-born and had habit of being feisty from schoolyard in India, so it was a foregone case that I'd get physical at some point. I didn't even know how much taboo it actually was, but I can imagine for someone US-born and especially if they don't develop that ability to verbally fire back, it can just feel like there is no outlet.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby LokeshC » 08 Mar 2017 23:33

All those school shootings are done by either psychopathic kids (Columbine) or wierd outcast like kids (almost all of the rest).

What would push those normal but "wierd"(aka "socially unacceptable or untouchable") kids to go apesheet? Pretty easy to guess, no easy solutions though.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby gakakkad » 09 Mar 2017 00:52

LokeshC wrote:All those school shootings are done by either psychopathic kids (Columbine) or wierd outcast like kids (almost all of the rest).

What would push those normal but "wierd"(aka "socially unacceptable or untouchable") kids to go apesheet? Pretty easy to guess, no easy solutions though.


From the indic perspective ,never label a white mass murderer as apeshit or weird or psychopath even if they actually are... Our narrative for white murderers should be no different from pissfull terrorists... We should label them as white terrorists or x-tian terrorists.. Especially if the victims were indians ... Any attack on indian should be labeled as attempted ethnic cleansing or genocide... Just the way the Jews do it.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby Sumeet » 09 Mar 2017 01:14

Not sure where else I can post this:

There was an amendment today to ACT: 264 - Requirement to Carry Immigration Documents with the below change(s)

(e) Every alien, eighteen years of age and over, shall at all times carry with him and have in his personal possession any certificate of alien registration or alien registration receipt card issued to him pursuant to subsection (d). Any alien who fails to comply with the provisions of this subsection shall be guilty of a misdemeanor and shall upon conviction for each offense be fined not to exceed $100 or be imprisoned not more than thirty days, or both.


Source: https://www.uscis.gov/ilink/docView/SLB ... -8289.html

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby Rudradev » 09 Mar 2017 01:28

^^ Sorry, that's not the case. Provision (e) is not the result of an amendment today, and in fact, it isn't even the most recent amendment to Section 264 of the Immigration and Nationality Act . It has always been there.

Here is an advisory on the subject from 2010 which shows that the concerned provision has been in effect for "decades"...

https://www.nafsa.org/uploadedFiles/I94 ... visory.pdf

According to the USCIS site, the only amendment to Section 264 of the Immigration and Nationality Act since its passing (in 1965) was implemented in the Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act of 1996, when Provision (f) was added: "Notwithstanding any other provision of law, the Attorney General is authorized to require any alien to provide the alien's social security account number for purposes of inclusion in any record of the alien maintained by the Attorney General or the Service."


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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby UlanBatori » 09 Mar 2017 02:55

What is Indian law w.r.t. companies hiring foreigners to work in India, and about their spouses working?

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby A_Gupta » 09 Mar 2017 03:59



This is the claim:
Hillary Clinton says she was not involved in the decision to approve the sale of Uranium One. As proof, the Clinton campaign in 2015 trotted out her former aide, Assistant Secretary of State Fernandez, to say publicly that we should take his word for it that she was not involved in approving that deal. But as we now know from the leaked Podesta emails, Fernandez was all too eager to help Podesta kill the story, while getting other favors from Podesta. That raises questions about the veracity of his comments.


Let's look at this one sentence:
But as we now know from the leaked Podesta emails, Fernandez was all too eager to help Podesta kill the story, while getting other favors from Podesta.

That sentence contains a URL: https://wikileaks.org/podesta-emails/emailid/2053

Did anybody bother to follow the URL? Can anyone point to the "Fernandez was all too eager to help Podesta kill the Uranium story" in this email?
Here is the text:
From:JFernandez@gibsondunn.com
To: john.podesta@gmail.com
CC: esepp@equitablegrowth.org
Date: 2015-04-17 21:12
Subject: Helping with the Campaign



John,

It was good to talk to you this afternoon, and I appreciate your taking the time to call. As I mentioned, I would like to do all I can to support Secretary Clinton, and would welcome your advice and help in steering me to the right persons in the campaign.

Below is a summary of the issues I have been working on since I left State nearly 18 months ago, and suggestions for a couple of areas where I could perhaps be of use.

ISSUES

Since coming back from Washington, I have focused my public policy work on the following three issues:

(a) Foreign Policy: My professional career has mostly involved the emerging markets, and while in DC most of my work had to do with Latin America, MENA and Africa. Since coming back I have written and spoken at many conferences involving foreign policy, with an emphasis on the intersection of business and development. For example, I published an article in Foreign Affairs on the global infrastructure boom and why it is important for strategic reasons that US companies become more active in helping countries build roads, energy plants, water systems, etc. The article was well received and think tanks such as CSIS had me speak on the subject. Foreign Affairs recently published another of my articles, this time on the Cuba opening. Americas Quarterly, the publication of the Council of the Americas, ran a long piece that suggested an approach to Latin America based on economic development, poverty reduction and social inclusion. I was also invited by the State Department to speak on Middle East issues, and was the keynote speaker on the Arab Spring at the NUSACC annual forum. In the next couple of weeks I will be the keynote speaker at a US-Spain business forum in Madrid, and at the inauguration of the UC San Diego School of Public Policy and Strategy, and in both cases will speak on business and foreign policy topics. I am also on the board of directors of Iberdrola SA, a Spanish utility which is the largest electricity provider in the Northeastern United States, and the largest renewable energy company in the world (2nd largest in the US), so I can talk energy security.

(b) Immigration. I have worked and spoken on this issue since before the Obama Administration and have continued to do since coming back from DC, both at conferences and in the media. The point I try to make is that all sides recognize that any solution must include a combination of border security and a path to regularization, but that the political noise is keeping us from reaching a common-sense compromise. Demonizing immigrants cuts against our values. I have also pointed out that there is plenty of research from both the left and the right showing the economic benefits of immigration reform. As an immigrant myself, this issue is personal to me.

(c) Latino Voting. During the 2014 elections I was a regular guest on Spanish-language TV and radio on the subject of voting restrictions imposed by some states, and also -importantly-on the need for Latinos to vote. Using some of the materials prepared by CAP, I pointed out that while the achievements of this Administration in the areas of health care, immigration relief and job growth have benefited Latinos more than any other demographic, by voting less than just about any other group Hispanics abandon those who have fought for our rights and leave the door open for opponents who would roll back these gains. Sometimes I have summarized my point by concluding with the slogan "Vota o Calla" ("Vote or Shut Up"), which (somewhat to my surprise) often works.

MEDIA

Almost every week, I am interviewed on the above subjects on radio and TV, mostly in Spanish-language media.

(a) Radio: In Miami I appear every two weeks on the most conservative and "Cuban" of the radio stations ("La Cubanisima", owned by Univision) to speak about Latin America, most recently on the Cuba sanctions liberalization. I am told I am the only Democrat regularly featured. I have also made many appearances on another Miami station, Radio Actualidad, which is geared to non-Cuban Latinos. I have also gone on many other radio stations around the U.S., both English (including NPR) and Spanish-speaking, to talk about economics and international trade topics.

(b) Television: I am a regular guest on issues of immigration, voting rights and foreign policy on NTN24, a Colombian-owned TV station that targets both US Latinos and Latin America. Jorge Ramos has invited me to both his Sunday talk show Al Punto and in the new station Fusion, to speak about Latino voting as well as foreign policy. I have also spoken on these topics on Telemundo, Bloomberg and CNN. And starting next month, I will become a weekly commentator for TV Azteca, which is a network geared to Mexican-American communities in California and the Southwest.

I have clips for most of these appearances and can forward them to the person you suggest.

SUPPORTING THE CAMPAIGN

If the campaign feels that I can be useful, I would offer to contribute by:

(a) Formulating policy and position papers: In 2008 I helped to prepare position papers and daily responses to potential press questions for candidate Obama. This time I would again be willing to write on issues of foreign policy (with an emphasis on Latin America and MENA), economics, energy and business.

(b) Outreach to the business community: My professional career has been as a business lawyer. At the State Department one of my tasks was to advocate for US companies abroad and to encourage foreign investment in the US. I think I could be a credible interlocutor to help with Secretary Clinton's outreach to business.

(c) Surrogate Work with Latinos: My experience with the Hispanic community and appearances on Spanish and English-language media geared to Hispanics, outlined above, could help communicate the message to Latino voters and provide feedback to the campaign.

(d) Help with campaign in Florida, Southwestern US, and New Hampshire: I am familiar with the Hispanic communities that will be critical in South Florida, California and the Southwest. I also know New Hampshire well: I went to Dartmouth, served on its Board of Trustees for 8 years (then-governor Shaheen was ex officio), and helped a bit with the recent campaigns for Sen. Shaheen and Congresswoman (and classmate) Annie Kuster.

Of course, I am also prepared to help with fundraising by tapping my network, and participating in the outreach to business, lawyers, Hispanics, and other potential contributors.

John, thanks again for taking the time to speak during what must be a very hectic period. Please count on me for full support within the confines of my day job. I look forward to your suggestions on what I can do to help. In addition to the office number below, please feel free to call my cell number (917-648-4951) at any time.

All the best, Jose

Jose W. Fernandez

GIBSON DUNN

Gibson, Dunn & Crutcher LLP
200 Park Avenue, New York, NY 10166-0193
Tel +1 212.351.2376 * Fax +1 212.351.6276
JFernandez@gibsondunn.com<mailto:JFernandez@gibsondunn.com> * http://www.gibsondunn.com<http://www.gibsondunn.com/>

________________________________
This message may contain confidential and privileged information. If it has been sent to you in error, please reply to advise the sender of the error and then immediately delete this message.
________________________________

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby KJo » 09 Mar 2017 04:06

Trump govt puts H1B workers' spouses on thin ice; H4 work authorisation in limbo
The H4 visa nightmare is happening.

It doesn’t take a Trump executive order to make the H1B community run for cover - a series of measures by the United States Citizenship and Immigration Services and other government arms to tighten the screws is good enough.
US President Donald Trump signing a revised executive order. PTI

Trump's team puts H4 visa holders in a difficult spot/ PTI

Take the latest whiplash on Women’s Day which skewers the one bright spot in the H4 visa - The US Department of Justice is seeking a 60-day freeze over issuance of new work authorisations for H4 visa holders as a follow up of an ongoing case filed by Save Jobs USA which has found new resolve after the Trump win last November. For more on the case details, this press release by Immigration Voice is a useful resource. Note that the DoJ move is limited to the EAD or Employment Authorization Document given to certain H4 visa holders depending upon the status of the H1B principal and this latest move is not about the visa itself, which is safe for now.

H1B workers’ dependant spouses on the H4 visa ( under certain conditions, explained below) were allowed to find paid work in the fag end of the Obama rule.

The new US Attorney general Jeff Sessions has said emphatically that the H4 rule ( to allow work authorisation) “hurts American workers.”

Considering that Trump’s spate of executive orders that has created chaos worldwide is anti-Obama at its core, the H4 backlash is no surprise at all.

By clamping down on premium processing of H1B visas and now upping the difficulty level for H4 visas, the Trump government is showing that it does not take executive orders to spread panic and confusion among immigrant labour force. Starting April 3, 2017, the USCIS will temporarily suspend premium processing for all H1B petitions. This suspension may last up to six months. Premium Processing is basically a fast track option that gets your H1B visa or extension the USCIS nod swiftly if you pony up the extra cash.

A Times of India report quotes three examples of people who have contributed positively to the US while benefitting from the rule and explains how the H4 rule to allow work authorisation is not all about “bored spouses” potentially taking away an American’s job.

Here’s what has been making the H4 community uneasy over the last few weeks - Trump’s press secretary Sean Spicer’s pointed remarks during what is clearly honeymoon season for Trump staffers: “With respect to H-1Bs and other visas, it’s part of a larger immigration reform effort that the president will continue to talk about through executive order and through working with Congress.”

There has already been “a lot of action on immigration,”Spicer said, and “whether it’s that or the spousal visas or other types of visas I think there’s an overall need to look at all these programs.”

Up until the summer of 2015, H4 visa holders could not legally hold paid employment in the United States.

The fag end of the Obama years changed all that and was met with wild celebrations among Indians in the US. With Trump in office and the prospect of benign neglect to immigration red flags that marked the Obama presidency now gone, H-4s have a lot to be edgy about even if nothing eventually changes.

Although the H-4 is not applicable to all H1-B workers’ dependants, it covers a lot of ground.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby UlanBatori » 09 Mar 2017 04:12

The link does not prove "Fernandez was all too eager to kill the story". It does support "Fernandez was all too eager to get favors from Podesta" In fact it reads like
Puhleeeeze Puhleeeeze Puhleeeeze Puhleeeeze! Give me ANYTHING and I'll kiss your mush!

The key term before "was eager to kill the story" is "as we well know", so that may refer to some other story. He does sound like a mush-kisser all right.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions III

Postby A_Gupta » 09 Mar 2017 04:22

^^^ What favors? Participating in a campaign, raising money for it is not "favors from the head of the campaign" it is hard work.

And in case you missed it, here is the claim, it is not about any story, it is about the uranium story: "Hillary Clinton says she was not involved in the decision to approve the sale of Uranium One. As proof, the Clinton campaign in 2015 trotted out her former aide, Assistant Secretary of State Fernandez, to say publicly that we should take his word for it that she was not involved in approving that deal. But as we now know from the leaked Podesta emails, Fernandez was all too eager to help Podesta kill the story, while getting other favors from Podesta. That raises questions about the veracity of his comments. "
------
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/20 ... andal.html
"What We Know About the Investigations Into Trump’s Russia Scandal"


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