J&K News and Discussion - 2016

[Rahul M]

more of a marketing whizkid than a doer. what did he achieve at NATGRID ?

[kumarn]

A case of Sour grapes. He was booted out of natgrid by modi. Had had the displeasure of interacting with raghu raman for an hour. Extremely conceited and repelling character.

[rsangram]

more of a marketing whizkid than a doer. what did he achieve at NATGRID ?

Fair enough.

I think, I saw a post from you on another thread, which said that you were not satisfied with our military responses to the monstrosities by Pakis. You want a ratio of 1:10, meaning 10 heads for one head. I could not agree with you more.

We can also agree on the fact that Modi is a staunch nationalist and would want that ratio of kill, as much as you and I want.

What then, if not the fact that our armed forces' preparedness is hopelessly lagging, not through any fault of Modi or our armed forces, mind you, but nevertheless, it is, would you attribute lukewarm responses from the likes of Modi and Doval ? Surely, they are not peaceniks, aman ki aasha, pseudo secular, anti national crowd, are they ? Far from it.

So, what explains it ?

We need to help spread the awareness of reality to our general population, so that Modi and Doval obtain more support in the form of mass opinion and even mass uprising, demanding filling our preparedness gap on war footing. By concealing the fact, or pussy footing around it, we are actually undermining nationalists such as Modi and Doval. When you think about it, by stealthing reality, we are covering up for decades of misdeeds of the anti-national Congress governments.

[Marten]

if not the fact that our armed forces' preparedness is hopelessly lagging

Could you qualify this opinion with more facts?

[Deans]

^^ His talkson TEDx when he was head of NATGRID related to IA etc were really good.
Wonder what changed with the sudden dhoti-shivering in a short time?

What changed was that NATGRID failed to take off. He had to accept responsibility as its head and was replaced.
That seemed to have led to more anti-establishment views and possibly `envelope journalism'. There are a lot of articles which eventually
suggest that we should be a part of OBOR/CPEC etc, like this one.

[pankajs]

By the way, Observer Research Foundation, which the author belongs to is from all accounts, a highly respected, objective, dispassionate and fact based think tank in India, consisting of senior retire military officers, justices, IAS officers, scholars, all of whom seem to be non political. And Defence One, where this article is published, is a well regarded and again non political journal on international defense issues.

And now, let us start lobbing verbal missiles at the messenger. Lord knows and as this article confirms, we sure as hell are not in a position to lob the real ones at Pakistan.

Observer Research Foundation is headed by Sudheendra Kulkarni, the unofficial envoy of Bakistan in India. So it has its share of pro-baki elements.

[Supratik]

It is funded by Motabhai who said Congress is "apna hi dukan". VIF is Indic.

[sudeepj]

Can't believe some are still stuck on Raghu Raman. Sum total of what can be said about his farticle is that it poses a strawman argument. He has constructed a war scenario in his head and decided in that particular scenario, with that set of end goals, with that specific strategy, with a specific international scenario (Russians have greatly improved bonhomie with the Americans now! didnt you know?) Indian armed forces can not win. He waves his hands and dances away from defining these set of assumptions and the lack of systematic thinking shows up in the sheer stupidity of the OpEd.

As I said before, its not even wrong!

[shravanp]

...... you know?) Indian armed forces can not win. He waves his hands and dances away from defining these set of assumptions and the lack of systematic thinking shows up in the sheer stupidity of the OpEd.

As I said before, its not even wrong!

Position held by "rsangram" is the same. He takes it to a new level by suggesting YET ANOTHER partition of Bharat if Hindus can be left in peace.

[ramana]

Deans I have a question for you in Intelligence thread in Mil Forum.

[sudeepj]

I have a slightly different take. What will be the shape of the subcontinent and the world in 50 years? 100 years?

Pakistan will be an utter basket case as they continue the trend of illiterates breeding yet more illiterates. Oil will either have run out, or replaced by alternative energy source. There will have been raging civil wars in the Arab world as the money dries up and at least a few genocides. India, despite suffering innumerable terror attacks, will be the worlds 2nd or third largest economy and a center for major cultural power producing movies, advertising and all kinds of content. India will also be a major technological power.

Exiling the muslims of Punjab, Sindh and Khyber into the hands of Urdu speaking Islamist supremacists has not really bought India peace. Recall the words of Bacha Khan when he heard about the partition, he complained to Congress leaders, 'you have thrown me to the wolves..' Exiling muslims out of the Indic fold has merely exchanged one sort of internal violence for another. In fact, it has worsened their state, worsened our state and increased their assimilation into the Arab/Islamic world rather than the Indic world, turning them into permanent enemies who must be defeated at great cost to life and human happiness. Exiling Indian muslims into the dominion of wolves is simply going to make them irreconcilable enemies till such time as they are rescued from their hostage situation under an Arab/Islamist narrative.

We have a moral responsibility to bring these people back to dharma and back to the moral fold of their forefathers. We must not shy away simply because the task is unpleasant or hard. We should not yield the land and we should not yield the people.

[V_Raman]

We need the muslims in India to be the torch bearers for this. Plus we need to security apparatus to not allow any deviations. Without these two in place, any attempt will be a failure. We are not there yet.

[Karan M]

all that stuff from the natgrid person and folks like shooklaw.. these guys dont represent the real military cadre. i met a gurkha regiment officer pre 1999. young captain. he bemoaned the lack of eqpt he had. but said, anything we face, my troops can overcome.

that is how we won kargil. people may say 19999999 shells on the mountain etc, but the reality is peaks won in hand to hand combat by the unit athletes of raj rif or the charge by the gurkhas. in short what i am saying is modi and co will make the IA, IAF, IN funded to the point that they are 70-80% serviceable and give them free reign in matters of operational need.. that is more than enough for the services to wage war.. given their morale is up and their blood is up..

its not necessary that indian army has to be like the USArmy and have three huge plasma screens showing every baddy with a digital tag and the war can only be won then..

the quality of the indian fighting man, his toughness, and the ability of the IA to take casualties and yet keep fighting is incredible. it is this, the veterans with combat experience remember and the josh types who got hosh in service remember. the ones who quit and became "political" or dilli-billies or AAPiyas are not that kind.

take what they say with salt. in 1999, IN ships didnt have missile screens. they blockaded karachi. IAF didnt have AWACs, they locked on PAF aircraft and shot down an atlantique..

indian economy keeps growing the fancy kit into the IA IAF IN will consistently increase.. but its not that will win the war or any war, but the tough veterans who dont need GPS but can do reckoning estimates.. those who will fight no matter what.. and IA, IAF, IN have no shortage of that.

[jagga]

Seems like couple of SSG got their 72's
Army kills 2 BAT attackers in Uri as it foils ambush by Pak troops on LoC

[chetak]

TRS MP, @RaoKavitha exposing terrorist Bitta Karate in 2014



https://youtu.be/mFizcc_T5kU

[Bart S]

^^ His talkson TEDx when he was head of NATGRID related to IA etc were really good.
Wonder what changed with the sudden dhoti-shivering in a short time?

To use an analogy from IT industry, folks who are good at PPTgiri are seldom the engineers/architects most knowledgeable about the subject matter. Some of them genuinely are, most of them are not. This guy is not one of them, or worse still he might have some vested interests behind him.

[anupmisra]

Seems like couple of SSG got their 72's
Army kills 2 BAT attackers in Uri as it foils ambush by Pak troops on LoC

Did the batis take the dead terrorists back with them?

[ramana]

Seems like couple of SSG got their 72's
Army kills 2 BAT attackers in Uri as it foils ambush by Pak troops on LoC

Those two BATs are guano now.

[jagga]

Seems like couple of SSG got their 72's
Army kills 2 BAT attackers in Uri as it foils ambush by Pak troops on LoC

Did the batis take the dead terrorists back with them?

The last I heard bodies are rotting in No Man's Land.

[jagga]

Burning them with flame guns should be looked into. Otherwise rotting corpse will start stinking. We should think about the environment

[Rudradev]

Does TSPA/LeT try to recover the bodies of shaheed terrorists in No Man's Land?

If so, can the bodies be booby-trapped to shaheedize the Pakis trying to recover them?

[brvarsh]

Does TSPA/LeT try to recover the bodies of shaheed terrorists in No Man's Land?

If so, can the bodies be booby-trapped to shaheedize the Pakis trying to recover them?

Using bodies as traps is not in our decorated Army's ethics books. This is what makes us different from mercenary gangs in army uniforms. But we must find ways to send strong message to the families of those killed and abandoned this is how its Government treats them.

[KLNMurthy]

Raghu Raman's poorly researched OpEd has gems such as these:

Russia, our traditional all-weather friend, has far greater bonhomie with both the US and China than ever before.

The major reason for the Pakistani Op Gibraltar’s failure in 1965 was the overwhelming loyalty of Kashmiri locals towards India.

Long on assertion, short on analysis, it has bought all kinds of propaganda, including some from the Indian side! There is some value in rebutting an incorrectly made argument, in that a correct argument can be put forward, but the only thing that can be said about Raghu Raman's OpEd is that it is not even wrong! Not even worth engaging with and rebutting! If gents with such analytical skills can find currency on Indian think tank circuit, I can think of at least a few on BR who would do a better job. Unfortunately, they are busy doing real jobs and solving real problems.

When faced with a hostile nuclear-armed enemy, it is trivial to argue that India "will not win" a war against Pakistan. Same way that US "will not win" a war with China or Russia or even UK.

Common prudence on the part of India in these cases can be spun by anyone for the consumption of underdeveloped minds whose concept of waging war is limited to blindly falling upon the enemy with bloodcurdling screams, with no role for strategic planning or patience.

I first came across this article in paki media, which to me is ample proof that it gives aid and comfort to the enemy and wages psywar against the home team.

[KLNMurthy]

more of a marketing whizkid than a doer. what did he achieve at NATGRID ?

Fair enough.

I think, I saw a post from you on another thread, which said that you were not satisfied with our military responses to the monstrosities by Pakis. You want a ratio of 1:10, meaning 10 heads for one head. I could not agree with you more.

We can also agree on the fact that Modi is a staunch nationalist and would want that ratio of kill, as much as you and I want.

What then, if not the fact that our armed forces' preparedness is hopelessly lagging, not through any fault of Modi or our armed forces, mind you, but nevertheless, it is, would you attribute lukewarm responses from the likes of Modi and Doval ? Surely, they are not peaceniks, aman ki aasha, pseudo secular, anti national crowd, are they ? Far from it.

So, what explains it ?

We need to help spread the awareness of reality to our general population, so that Modi and Doval obtain more support in the form of mass opinion and even mass uprising, demanding filling our preparedness gap on war footing. By concealing the fact, or pussy footing around it, we are actually undermining nationalists such as Modi and Doval. When you think about it, by stealthing reality, we are covering up for decades of misdeeds of the anti-national Congress governments.

Bringing up military capability is not something that is done overnight, it is a lengthy process, further subject to politics, bureaucracy etc.

Indian army doesn't exist to satisfy every urge for revenge on the part of civilians. And it is well-known that Indian military doesn't have the capability to wage more than a limited duration war against Pakistan. There is nothing new in this study. At the same time, whenever required, they have shown that they can stretch their capabilities and deliver highly ambitious goals for their country.

Acting like we suddenly woke up and found out that our military has limitations just sets up a strawman and spreads FUD. Classic psyops.

[KLNMurthy]

By the way, Observer Research Foundation, which the author belongs to is from all accounts, a highly respected, objective, dispassionate and fact based think tank in India, consisting of senior retire military officers, justices, IAS officers, scholars, all of whom seem to be non political. And Defence One, where this article is published, is a well regarded and again non political journal on international defense issues.

And now, let us start lobbing verbal missiles at the messenger. Lord knows and as this article confirms, we sure as hell are not in a position to lob the real ones at Pakistan.

Observer Research Foundation is headed by Sudheendra Kulkarni, the unofficial envoy of Bakistan in India. So it has its share of pro-baki elements.

Enough said, then. Zero expectations of honesty and good faith.

[rsangram]

Fair enough.

I think, I saw a post from you on another thread, which said that you were not satisfied with our military responses to the monstrosities by Pakis. You want a ratio of 1:10, meaning 10 heads for one head. I could not agree with you more.

We can also agree on the fact that Modi is a staunch nationalist and would want that ratio of kill, as much as you and I want.

What then, if not the fact that our armed forces' preparedness is hopelessly lagging, not through any fault of Modi or our armed forces, mind you, but nevertheless, it is, would you attribute lukewarm responses from the likes of Modi and Doval ? Surely, they are not peaceniks, aman ki aasha, pseudo secular, anti national crowd, are they ? Far from it.

So, what explains it ?

We need to help spread the awareness of reality to our general population, so that Modi and Doval obtain more support in the form of mass opinion and even mass uprising, demanding filling our preparedness gap on war footing. By concealing the fact, or pussy footing around it, we are actually undermining nationalists such as Modi and Doval. When you think about it, by stealthing reality, we are covering up for decades of misdeeds of the anti-national Congress governments.

Bringing up military capability is not something that is done overnight, it is a lengthy process, further subject to politics, bureaucracy etc.

Indian army doesn't exist to satisfy every urge for revenge on the part of civilians. And it is well-known that Indian military doesn't have the capability to wage more than a limited duration war against Pakistan. There is nothing new in this study. At the same time, whenever required, they have shown that they can stretch their capabilities and deliver highly ambitious goals for their country.

Acting like we suddenly woke up and found out that our military has limitations just sets up a strawman and spreads FUD. Classic psyops.

To your point about Indian Army not existing to satisfy every urge for revenge on the part of civilians, you are merely throwing out a slur to divert the subject. Whose urges are you referring to there ? Rahul M's urge to get 10 heads for every Indian one ?

So, your main objection seems to be not that Indian army is not as well prepared as we may like, but that it is and has always been a well known fact, that there is nothing new in this and that some of us ignoramus just woke up, which is annoying you somewhat. My response is that while I am not very knowledgeable on military matters at all, I knew this much for a long time. But since everybody has known this for a while, and the issue has still not been fixed, some of us keep bringing it up, in the hopes that our prayers are answered and that sweeping it under the rug serves no other purpose than to give cover to those corrupt politicians and bureaucrats who are responsible for this less than ideal preparedness.

It is this "not allowing" of "let sleeping dogs lie" thinking, that irks some including you, and I understand that. You seem to be perfectly complacent about the state of our preparedness and feel no urgency to have it rapidly improve, as you think that the improved preparedness will only serve the purpose of "satisfying every Indian's urge for revenge", when you alluded to Rahul M's call for 1 is to 10. I will be perfectly happy to hold back my urges of revenge, as long as the Indian army preparedness is sufficient to carry out the stated goals of Indian government and parliament - JK is an integral part of India and POK is ours and needs to be liberated.

It also does not seem to bother you too much that had we just had normal nationalistic governance since 1947, not even good governance, and merely normal level of corruption, as opposed to the pandemic of corruption as we have had, that we would have just in due course, had a stronger Army than China and we would have been, just as a matter of routine, not only retaken POK, but also perhaps severed at least Baluchistan and perhaps even Sindh from Pakistan, and we never would have had this unrest in JK. This needs to be highlighted time and again - what we are as opposed to what we just in normal course, could have been.

Now clearly, it is not the army's fault, except some of the higher army brass who got corrupted and joined hands with babus and politicians, certainly not the fault of any army person at or below the leve of Colonel, and of course, our army at and below the colonel level is second to none in bravery and valor, and the more said about them, the less. So, it is not their fault, but the fault of the corrupt and anti national dispensations that we have had since 1947. It is also not Modi's fault. However, I somewhat disagree with you that improving preparedness is a "lengthy process". Yes, I agree to the extent that real and fundamental changes and changing our procurement and support culture to the armed forces would take time. Also, procuring the exact configuration of weapon systems which integrate and gel with each other and are particularly suited to our conditions and terrain, also takes time.

But I do believe that we can go much faster than we are going, even under Modi, to fill the major gaps and to create better "shorter term" preparedness, enough to provide the nation with confidence to be able to wage any kind of war against the PAki and even hold off China, if it tries to butt in, during any engagement with Paki. But that will require almost an "Emergency" type mobilization, all the way from mobilizing public opinion, to gearing our economy and our budget priorities towards a massive acquisition and induction program on a war footing, which is not being done, and I am a proponent of doing it. Remember, how quickly Hitler was able to do it at a time, when he did not have as many modern means as we have today. And he was able to do it, more or less in stealth.

It is time, we too create a War economy on a War footing, with an "eat grass" mentality.

[Peregrine]

X Posted on STFUP Thread

Terrorists attack Army patrol party in Pulwama, counter-op underway

NEW DELHI: A counter-insurgency operation was launched in Jammu and Kashmir's Pulwama district after terrorists attacked an Army patrol party on Friday.

Security forces cordoned off the area around Saimooh village in Pulwama's Tral and search operations are currently underway.
On Tuesday, security forces called off a similar operation after Lashkar-e-Taiba (LeT) terrorists managed to flee during a gunbattle in the district's Hakripora area.

The operation had been disrupted by protesters who pelted stones at security personnel, which helped the terrorists make their escape.

There have been several instances of mobs indulging in stone-pelting on the forces to disrupt anti-militancy operations in Kashmir.

At times, the security forces have suffered casualties because of such incidents.

Some months back, Army chief Gen Bipin Rawat had warned that stone-pelters would be treated as supporters of terrorists and dealt with accordingly.

Despite the warning, such incidents have continued taking place.

Further details awaited...

Cheers

[rsangram]

Bringing up military capability is not something that is done overnight, it is a lengthy process, further subject to politics, bureaucracy etc.

And it is well-known that Indian military doesn't have the capability to wage more than a limited duration war against Pakistan. There is nothing new in this study.

Acting like we suddenly woke up and found out that our military has limitations just sets up a strawman and spreads FUD. Classic psyops.

But if you read this forum, you will find not just so much jingoism and chest thumping, but outright hostility to any attempts to introspect when someone departs from the "party line", that you would think that we are not only already a super power, that we have always been a super power and we can so easily cause the disintegration of Pakistan that we have to worry about how we will handle the aftermath. Our ability to immediately break up PAkistan is not in question, the question we worry about is whether what will come after is worse. We have threads dedicated to this stuff. The Bahubali syndrome.

I guess, it is natural, because indulging in lazy jingoism and chest thumping takes much less effort than serious discussion where one has to apply one's mind.

There are so many actual thinkers on this forum, who apply their minds, and I learn a lot from them. I just with that these are the people who post more and dominate and we try to keep mindless jingoism to a minimum, particularly when as you say, "it is well-known that Indian military doesnt have the capablity to wage more than a limited duration war against Pakistan".

Let us build up that capability and then I would like to indulge in some jingoism myself.

[Bishwa]

As per Daily Excelsior, http://www.dailyexcelsior.com/army-foil ... ts-killed/

The bodies of the two killed (BAT strike) in Uri have been recovered. 4 JAKLI was involved.

[Supratik]

Sazdar Bhatt, new HM commander encountered.

[Falijee]

Sabzar Bhat, Burhan Wani's Successor, Killed in Tral Encounter

Militant outfit’s chief, was among two terrorists gunned down during an hours-long encounter in Tral area of south Kashmir.
Sources told News18.com that the Tral operation was based on specific intelligence inputs of three militants hiding in a house in Soimoh village of Tral district, 36 km from Srinagar. The operation commenced on Friday night and contact with the militants was established at 8:15am, sources said. Para Commandos eventually joined the operation and two terrorists, including Bhat, were killed. While Bhat and another militant were killed, search operations were on for the third militant. Since Friday morning, security forces in J&K have killed eight militants, including Bhat and his associate. Six others were killed in Rampur Sector of Kashmir when security forces thwarted another infiltration bid. The infiltration bid was foiled hours after a similar failed attempt in which two members of Pakistan's Border Action Team were killed.Both Wani and Bhat belonged to the Tral area. Bhat was one of the 11 people in one of the earliest photos of Burhan Wani along with his associates. He was understood to have been the one who was appointed to replace Wani in Hizbul Mujahideen. Sabzar-Ahmad-Bhat-3 Bhat was in March 2017 trapped in a gunfight with security forces at his hometown in Tral. He escaped the following night in the cover of darkness and with help from stone-pelters. Talking about Saturday’s encounter, Director General of Jammu and Kashmir police SP Vaid told News18 over phone: “He is definitely there. His presence has been confirmed. But we will declare him dead only after all the operations are over.” Ever since Burhan Wani’s death at the hands of security forces in July last year, Bhat had been heading the Hizbul Mujahudeen. The militant, also known as ‘Sab Don’, has featured in videos and photos that have been circulated by the group.Bhat, categorised as an A++ militant in Kashmir, reportedly turned to militancy after the family of a girl he loved spurned his marriage proposal and ended the relationship.
A childhood friend of Burhan Wani, Bhat became an important member of the terrorist organisation when he managed to snatch a rifle from an armed forces officer during the protests that erupted when Burhan Wani elder’s brother, Khalid, was killed.Soon after Bhat was reported killed on Saturday, stone pelting started at five different areas of Anantnag district.

If confirmed , "big win" for India !

[Dipanker]

But if you read this forum, you will find not just so much jingoism and chest thumping, but outright hostility to any attempts to introspect when someone departs from the "party line", that you would think that we are not only already a super power, that we have always been a super power and we can so easily cause the disintegration of Pakistan that we have to worry about how we will handle the aftermath. Our ability to immediately break up PAkistan is not in question, the question we worry about is whether what will come after is worse. We have threads dedicated to this stuff. The Bahubali syndrome.

I guess, it is natural, because indulging in lazy jingoism and chest thumping takes much less effort than serious discussion where one has to apply one's mind.

There are so many actual thinkers on this forum, who apply their minds, and I learn a lot from them. I just with that these are the people who post more and dominate and we try to keep mindless jingoism to a minimum, particularly when as you say, "it is well-known that Indian military doesnt have the capablity to wage more than a limited duration war against Pakistan".

Let us build up that capability and then I would like to indulge in some jingoism myself.

Part of the reasons Indians are gungho w.r.t. Pakistan is India's track record against Pakistan in wars since 1947 and India breaking up Pakistan into 2 in just 2 weeks of war in 1971. So India does have the bragging rights in this case. Also militarily India is much stronger than Pakistan, just look at the numbers.

IMO w.r.t Pakistan a "limited" capability is more than enough as Pakistan capability is far more limited than India's and thus we can beat the crap out of Pakistan, but certainly we are a long way away from militarily challenging the global hegemons!

[SwamyG]

It is confirmed, the guy who had a failed marriage taking over the charge from the felled headmaster's son is no more.

It is the failed marriage that made him take to terrorism.

https://news.google.com/news/amp?caurl= ... pt0-795871

[rsangram]

It is confirmed, the guy who had a failed marriage taking over the charge from the felled headmaster's son is no more.

It is the failed marriage that made him take to terrorism.

https://news.google.com/news/amp?caurl= ... pt0-795871

Good one !

[anupmisra]

As per Daily Excelsior, http://www.dailyexcelsior.com/army-foil ... ts-killed/

The bodies of the two killed (BAT strike) in Uri have been recovered. 4 JAKLI was involved.

Perfect. Put them on display with +ive IDs for the press. Prove them to be residents of pakjab and members of the TSPA. By the way, the article states: "they were wearing black Khan suits" Is that another term for the pathan dress?

[Bhurishravas]

The current lot of Hizbul terrorists Sabzar Bhat or Burhan Wani have chosen guns not only for Islamic Jihad, but also for adventure. Why else would Wani go around using social media. Look at Sabzar Bhat`s clothes in the photos. Full with elbow pads and gloves. Unessential but show-off combat attire. That is to show they are so glamorous and adventurous and rocking.

One look at the stone throwers proves this. They are clad in jeans and fashionable clothes. Compare that with the poor in rest of India.

By pumping money into the valley, India thought it could win over the jihadis. It cant. In fact, when the jihadis have to fight for every next meal, that is when Kashmir militancy will die. But then muslims have first right to resources in India. What a f*cked up state!

[Singha]

Who are these burhan wani group photo gang with names like bhat and pandit but prefaced by a muslim middle or first name?

[Karthik S]

Who are these burhan wani group photo gang with names like bhat and pandit but prefaced by a muslim middle or first name?

Listen to first 10 seconds of this video.

[Cosmo_R]

The current lot of Hizbul terrorists Sabzar Bhat or Burhan Wani have chosen guns not only for Islamic Jihad, but also for adventure. Why else would Wani go around using social media. Look at Sabzar Bhat`s clothes in the photos. Full with elbow pads and gloves. Unessential but show-off combat attire. That is to show they are so glamorous and adventurous and rocking.

One look at the stone throwers proves this. They are clad in jeans and fashionable clothes. Compare that with the poor in rest of India.

By pumping money into the valley, India thought it could win over the jihadis. It cant. In fact, when the jihadis have to fight for every next meal, that is when Kashmir militancy will die. But then muslims have first right to resources in India. What a f*cked up state!

Its the Che aura

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... heHigh.jpg

We are paying the Hurriyat rats and protecting them. They get to go to UKistan for medical treatment at our expense all to be able to fight us.

Time to dump Article 370 and get it over with. What will the UNSC do? Sanctions ? Even the US now won't go along with it.

[vijayk]