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J&K News and Discussion - 2016

The Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum is a venue to discuss issues pertaining to India's security environment, her strategic outlook on global affairs and as well as the effect of international relations in the Indian Subcontinent. We request members to kindly stay within the mandate of this forum and keep their exchanges of views, on a civilised level, however vehemently any disagreement may be felt. All feedback regarding forum usage may be sent to the moderators using the Feedback Form or by clicking the Report Post Icon in any objectionable post for proper action. Please note that the views expressed by the Members and Moderators on these discussion boards are that of the individuals only and do not reflect the official policy or view of the Bharat-Rakshak.com Website. Copyright Violation is strictly prohibited and may result in revocation of your posting rights - please read the FAQ for full details. Users must also abide by the Forum Guidelines at all times.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby ramana » 06 May 2017 12:12

SROY you need to solve what you can easily.
Isolating terror in Kashmir to Pak is top priority.

BTW more CRPF being sent to Kashmir.

Hope with pellet guns.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby manjgu » 06 May 2017 13:03

once a old wag told me..kashmiri is like a rice plant..bends in the way the wind is blowing. the indian danda is not swinging enough...and there is fear of paki danda. One poster said somewhere..go into mosque to listen secretly whats going on...no need they blare the anti india message over loudspeakers !! blood will have to flow...and they should open one "azadi gate.." ..free passage to pakistan.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Deans » 06 May 2017 15:47

ramana wrote:SROY you need to solve what you can easily.
Isolating terror in Kashmir to Pak is top priority.

BTW more CRPF being sent to Kashmir.

Hope with pellet guns.


Not with pellet guns. With real guns,I hope.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Hari Seldon » 06 May 2017 18:04

Chankian spin on so called 'Doval doctrine' in J&K.

Doval's muscle policy: If it worked in Punjab, it would in Kashmir also

Found it less than convincing, somehow.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby vasu raya » 06 May 2017 20:51

Hopefully when the IA is sweeping the countryside for terrorists, they are doing identity checks taking mugshots as well as fingerprints, even relation mapping else somebody could hide their weapons and merge into the crowd.

maybe one can couch it as free facebook drive...
Last edited by vasu raya on 06 May 2017 21:25, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby V_Raman » 06 May 2017 21:09

IMO all this drama is to make GOI go back on pandit relocation and maybe article 370.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby SSridhar » 07 May 2017 08:28

Secret intel papers show how ISI funds Hurriyat: Times Now - ToI
It's a secret that was always spoken in whispers: Hurriyat is on Pakistan's payrolls. Times Now has irrefutable proof of cash paid in Indian currency to top Hurriyat leader Shabir Shah, and to specific individuals at the Hurriyat office in Srinagar.

Secret intel documents that Times Now has accessed say the payment was made to fund those involved in anti-India activities through a known ISI conduit named Mehboob Ahmed Sagar. He also has a well-established connection with Pakistan's high commissioner to India, Abdul Basit.

Sagar was paid by ISI on a monthly basis and he, in turn, funnelled the cash to Shabir Shah, founder and president of the Jammu and Kashmir Democratic Freedom Party. Shah claimed he was paying families of terrorists who were killed in action and to stone-pelters.


One of the annexures of the top secret intel document has proof that cash was channelled to multiple individuals in the Hurriyat office in Srinagar. This is direct proof of a link between funds sent by Pakistan's ISI and Hurriyat.

The "register of treachery" lists out names of Hurriyat men and the money they took under various heads.

The payments made are only for one month, essentially meaning that there is a fixed salary paid to many and that there is a monthly contribution made for Hurriyat's day-to-day expenses.

These are the questions that Hurriyat should answer: Why is ISI funding purchase of computers at Hurriyat office? What are these payments made to Kot Bhalwal and Jammu jails?

Meanwhile, it is reliably learnt that the Prime Minister's Office has taken cognisance of the transaction and will shortly be taking action to shut the tap on Pak terror funding via Hurriyat.


In February 2003, the then Pakistani High Commissioner in India, Jalil Abbas Jilani was issued persona non grata and expelled by GoI for funding Hurriyat leaders. I hope GoI does the same to Basit now and simultaneously recalls our HC in Islamabad. Action must happen quickly. Let us downgrade diplomatic representation as a prelude to cutting-off contacts with that terrorist nation.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby JE Menon » 07 May 2017 10:34

>>Just wondering what the endgame is.

This is the endgame. This is the war. Ignore the news headlines. Here's an exercise. Just don't read anything about J&K for two weeks. There will be peace in J&K.

As for the Sunni Muslims of "the valley", fortunately for us the Pakistanis have been successful in persuading them that the Chinese are now in full support mode - which the Chinese have themselves suggested with some strategically placed quotes (that's cheaper). What does one say to this, but "thank you". This is the part where the whore of many paymasters begins to get too many customers at the door. Sooner rather than later, she will have to turn all except one (or two) down. I suspect those two are eventually going to be Allah and America (the devils she knows well), if you get my drift. Both will not pay her only in part. Again.

Meanwhile, we need more Islam in the valley.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Falijee » 07 May 2017 18:44

J&K govt asks dy commissioners to act against 34 channels

The State Home Department, which is headed by Chief Minister Mehbooba Mufti, has listed 34 such channels belonging to Pakistan and Saudi Arabia including Zakir Naik’s banned Peace TV.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby CRamS » 07 May 2017 19:07

>>Just wondering what the endgame is.



There is no end game per se. India is the status quo power, while Pakis and valley Muslims who believe they are Moghul inheritors want a change in status quo. Everything else is hot air. And by far the biggest daylight fraud taking place right in front of our eyes is that what is happening in Kashmir valley aided and abetted by TSP is fight for "self determination", "mis-management by India" and a 1000 other reasons all putting the onus at India's door step, when the one and only one truth and the elephant in the room is: Islamic fascism. So the end game if one wants to call it that is India realizing this self evident truth and acting accordingly.
Last edited by CRamS on 07 May 2017 20:53, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby JE Menon » 07 May 2017 20:24

^^above quote is not mine...

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby manjgu » 07 May 2017 21:05

and to know that all of these KM;s were dharmic hindus ... the toxicity of islam is mind blowing. farooqs abdullahs grandfather was a hindu IMHO.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby SRoy » 07 May 2017 21:32

KM themselves are unfortunate victims of the social order, upheld by Kashmiri Pandits, that prevented their re-entry back in to Hinduism.

Kashmiri Pandit behavior and its aftermath is warning example for self appointed gatekeepers of Hinduism throughout rest of India.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby CRamS » 07 May 2017 21:34

SRoy wrote:
Kashmiri Pandit behavior and its aftermath is warning example for self appointed gatekeepers of Hinduism throughout rest of India.


Too terse for my edification, can you please elaborate?

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby CRamS » 07 May 2017 21:57

To the lexicon of phrases with hidden meanings, I am adding two that are bandied about these days but never articulated overtly by their ardent users:

1. "Initiate political process in valley". Hidden meaning: India bend down on its knees and give Harried rates and other TSP proxies aka KM fascists what they want.

Truth: Holding of election against all odds, instituting a democratically elected govt representative of the will of people across the state (BJP/PDP coalition) with agenda of governance is the ultimate, most pristine form of political process invented by man. India's conduct and statesmanship in J&K is a shining example of that principle.

2. "BJP govt has no TSP strategy". Hidden meaning: India bend down on its knees and beg TSP for peace, allow all and sundry Pakis to come to India, play kirket, Bollywood, and other unfettered pee-pee contact.

Truth: Be it inviting Gaanja for ModiJi's swearing in, or ModiJi holding hands with Gaanja in Lawhore or any other attempts, as also the Doval doctrine of offensive defense, India's attempt to isolate TSP etc, BJP does have a strategy. It has failed no doubt, and if persisted with, may take some time to succeed.

Hidden meaning of 1 and 2 combined in the context of Kashmir: Give Kashmir valley complete pre-1953 autonomy aka quasi independence and to keep TSP happy give them say in the valley (recall MMS/MushRat talks on "joint mechanisms" on "both sides of the LoC").

Overall hidden meaning of 1 and 2 combined in the context of "South Asia" and colonial powers: Most "South Asians" want such a recipe for brotherhood and will happily live ever after playing kirket and watching Bollywood and consuming pizza & coke except for "Hindu extremists".

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Falijee » 07 May 2017 23:53

Kashmir, stop being delusional
VIKRAM SOOD

Let us start with a few clarifications. There is no freedom struggle in Kashmir, but a war foisted on us all these years with ground rules laid down by the Pakistan Army. These ground rules, therefore, must change, where we are no longer reactive but be in charge, literally. This should start with an escalatory response. There is little point in our having our High Commissioner in Pakistan or theirs here when there is no substance in the relationship. At least, their High Commissioner gets prime time on TV and is lionised all over the country. Downgrading would be the first signal.
The MFN status should be withdrawn. There is hardly any trade, let it remain negligible or less. There is no need to offer electric power for onions. This may not amount to much, but, currently, the optics about this are askew.
Many years have elapsed since India and Pakistan signed the Indus Waters Treaty and the time has come to reconsider this to better suit Indian interests and present conditions.
Finally, we should do all this not just out of a sulk but based on political realism which means accepting that Pakistan and India have very little in common with each other and it is best to part ways. (Pakistan Goodbye and Good Luck, Anand Ranganathan). Pakistan has "hitched" its wagon to the new sugar daddy (China ) and also considers itself part of Central Asia and not South Asia. India should give residency to Baloch leaders living abroad and consider recognizing their govt in exile .
Let us also stop being delusional about the nature of the rulers of Pakistan — their Army. Its attitude does not change with the change at the top. Numero Uno is answerable to his all-powerful Khaki Cabal of Corps Commanders. There has been a consistency in this from the beginning. They have also had scant regard for their own elected representatives and make this disdain obvious. They cannot be expected to treat India — both enemy and Hindu, any better. So, those of us who dream of eternal peace would do well to wake up to this eternal reality.
The recent bloody attack in the Krishan Ghati in Poonch was not by a professional army. It would be an insult to the animal kingdom to call this an act of bestiality. It was an act by an army that has now imbibed the values — if one can call them that — of the Islamic State where intolerance in extreme is practised. Kill the enemy with extreme brutality and hatred. Ensure that there is no possibility of a reconciliation.
The British, with their imperial interests still paramount, were smart. They quickly arranged for Gilgit and Baltistan to revolt and claim to join Pakistan. They presumed they needed this to deal with the Soviet bear in the future.
Each time, when some peace and order was restored by the armed forces and paramilitaries after great difficulty and loss of life and property, the politicians failed to take advantage of the reprieve and the gains were dissipated through petty politicking. Each political party only thought of political power for itself and preserving its political patch.
Is there a solution? There has to be and we have to find that by talking with the people of Kashmir.There are three aspects to be considered. In the short term, the effort must be to restore peace, law and order and normalcy of life. This has to be done by the Army and paramilitary without the usual caveats we tend to attach to such activity. The armed forces need to be trusted to do their best. Keep media and its scaremongers out.
In the medium term, the ministries of defence and home need to improve systems, cut through red tapes and provide state-of-the-art equipment to the soldiers. Determination and deployment of adequate force levels should be left to the commanders. All infrastructure development activity should continue.
We should also go ahead with all permissible river and power projects. Each time Pakistan objects to such legitimate schemes, it shows itself up as a country that is not concerned with the well-being of the average Kashmiri. Pakistan only wants the land and the rivers that irrigate their farms in the Punjab province. The Kashmiris fate will be like that of the Baloch or Sindhi or Pashtun
In the long term, the Prime Minister must lead in helping to find a solution through talks with all Kashmiris. These talks could include Hurriyat representatives but cannot be exclusively Hurriyat nor Hurriyat-led.
the allegation that the ‘surrendered’ TTP leader Ehsanullah Ehsan was an India-supported terrorist, in his clumsily tutored interview, were indicators of what was being planned by the new leadership in Rawalpindi. Even the aam paki does not believe that Ehsan was "supported" by India !
Recently, a major general of the Pakistan Army publicly rebuked the office of the Prime Minister of Pakistan; something similar in India is unthinkable. Therein lies the difference between the two countries.
Pakistan and Kashmir thus have to be tackled separately. Pakistan will simply not let peace be restored; it has no reason to help India because it finds the present situation to its advantage. An adversarial stance with India suits the Pakistan army; it keeps the rest of the world concerned about the nuclear dimensions of this problem which it seeks to exaggerate periodically.
Kashmiris must be encouraged to understand that their merger with Pakistan or independence are just not going to happen. Surely, Kashmiris already know there can be no future in a country where the Baloch and Sindhis want independence and the Pushtun are increasingly suspicious of the Punjabi dominance in Pakistan. Pakistan, as usual is playing the "Islam in danger" card in Kashmir !
China and the United States protect Pakistan for their own strategic reasons. Pakistan’s continued belligerence has been because of the support it received from these countries for other reasons. Pakistan serves as a proxy for China, in its dispute with India ; the US knows that peace is not possible in Afghanistan without Pakistan. And it also needs Pakistan for land access to Afghanistan !
Ultimately, we will have to endgame and hit where it hurts the Pakistan army and elite at a time and place of our choosing. And do not worry about the nuclear threat that Pakistan keeps talking about and the West keeps echoing.
Do not also worry too much. Pakistan generals may be adventurous and Islamic but they are not daft. They are not going to start a nuclear war for some territory about the size of all their farms in the fertile Indus basin and Okara farms with a Muslim population smaller than that in Balochistan whom they subjugate ruthlessly. The generals are also not looking at losing all of Pakistan in a mushroom cloud.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby CRamS » 08 May 2017 00:53

Vikram Sood's and others' prescription to revoke Indus treaty and recognizing Baluchistan sound good in theory, but must be gamed carefully to understand how TSP and its 3.5 and its 5th column in India will respond and nature of the escalation must be controlled by India.

For e.g., ModiJi invoked Baluchistan in his independence day address, and then went silent. At least nothing overt. Even Balunchis must be upset at not following through. Note Tarek Fateh has also been silent of late, perhaps dejected (my speculation) at the KLPD post ModiJi's independence day gambit. Likewise, one surgical strike, lots of hype and then back to normal. None of this is going to scare TSP. In fact, they have more than avenged the surgical strike and are laughing after so many other attacks culminating in the mutilation and be-heading of our soldiers.

Thus, as Vikram Sood recommends, if India ups the ante on Baluchistan, TSP will respond by recognizing Arunachal Pradesh or some other state in India. Now if at that point the elected representatives in Arunachal pradesh, along with rest of India come out and rubbish TSP's stunt, but India continues with its Baluchi recognition and DDM shows TSP atrocities, it will be good. Of course, TSP will respond with "Indian atrocities" in Kashmir valley, "atrocities" against Daleets, tribals, gau rakshaks etc. White Pakis in their rags will follow with their equal equal, while traitors like Adhothi, Pankaj Misra , Tavleen Singh's half Paki son etc will do the "Hindu extremism angle" in white rags like NYT.

Now all of this can be gamed, but if BJP can stay the course, it will be awesome. But if we are back to the eunuch spectacle of ModiJi huffing and puffing and then going to LaWhore and holding Gannga's hand, everything will be frittered away, and TSP along with its 3.5 will laughing their arses off to the bank.

Likewise, Indus water treaty. I am not an expert, but according to the erudite Brahma Chellaney (whose book I need to read in totality), there are provisions in the treaty for India to use more water than it is currently allotted. TSP will of course squirm, and its 3.5 will demonize "Hindus extremist" led BJP govt for depriving water to TSP, its an act of war, nuke flash-point yada yada. Then at that point, when the bar has been set so high, India can then say, if you (meaning white Pakis) are so concerned about nuke flash-point, here are a list of demands from India, chief of them being complete stoppage of TSP terror and instigating violence in the valley for a period of at least 2+ years and then talks on restoring status quo ante etc etc (and India can do an equal equal of its own and will be on firm ground: TSP sponsored pigLeTs == Al Queda, Hamas, ISIS).

Bottom line: to date India has not shown the stamina to respond to TSP in a sustained manner and has always buckled under pressure. Even in the current scenario, after a day or two's outrage at the mutilation of our soldiers, the familiar useless debates on DDM, and worse, if reports are to be believed, ModiJi dispatching some steel baron to suck up to Gaanja. This kind of flip flop only perpetuates TSP and valley KM delusions, and makes India a laughing stock.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby nam » 08 May 2017 02:09

We need to convert the LoC in to a PA meat grinder. Artillery & constant air attacks, every time there is an incident in Kashmir. Force PA to relocate forces from Afghan, Iran, Balouch & Waristan in to LoC. More the troops, more the grinding. We don't have to cross the LoC, just carry out standoff attacks. Make 10-15 km, a no-mans land. Invest in tech which allows us dominance in this attrition war.

This will in turn cause increased attacks in Balouchistan, waristan & afghan, fundamentally stretching the PA to a breaking point. Strain on their economy as defence spending will spike, paying pension for the dead ones and salary for the live ones. Every 10 killed, means compensation and pension for 10 and salary for 1 more who takes his place.

One of the prime reason PA uses proxies against is they don't need pension or monthly salary. Just a holy book & get high. Hit their uniformed soldiers and increase the cost.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby sanjaykumar » 08 May 2017 03:33

The above should be obvious to GoI x30 years. So the question is why have these measures not been implemented? What inhibits india's response?

India's economy and strategic salience have in fact insulated it from the sanctimonious sermons that used to emanate much like the westerly monsoon winds.

It is certainly the possibility of civil disorder on a massive scale within India. Is the intelligence apparatus efficient enough to preempt activation of sleeper cells, rogue mullahs, starry eyed ghazi wannabes and unemployable Muslim lumpen?

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby ManSingh » 08 May 2017 04:11

My guess is capability vs intent.
1) We do not have 3:1 force ratio(plains) to dominate PA. In mountains, it would be (12:1).
2) We have to pay for defense capital expenditure. PA gets CSF, assistance from cheen, no R&D cost etc.
3) Indian army has to deploy in hinterland also. PA has no such requirement.
4) PA has one neighbor to match( Levies + rangers is who patrol Iranian, afghan borders with some army elements ). IA has two fronts. What happens if China opens a front in Ladakh?
5) Very low defence expenditure on our side( 1.65% ).
6) Mountainous terrain is not the most conducive for stand-off attacks. What happens if you launch a smerch/pinaka salvo? These are supposed to flatten all structures+forces in a square area. No such areas in mountains. Line of sight is required and that is why so many paki posts become targets vs built-up structures.

What I think will work:
1) Abrogation of article 370. An absolute must.
2) Threat of IWT - This will take time. We don't seem to have necessary infrastructure in place yet.
3) Absolute Naval domination
4) Targeted attacks on high value targets within pak.
5) Technological domination viz huge improvements in ELINT, SIGINT.
6) Boots on the ground + air force bases( not a single medical hospital base ) in Afghanistan?
7) Complete control of narrative in J&K ( no internet + no vitriolic KM newspapers + no hurriyat. Equal rights to Jammu and Ladakh. Expenditure in Kashmir per population should be equivalent to expenditure in rest of India )
8 Massive increase in force capabilities( i.e. Heli + artillery capabilities at lower than division level ).

Just my humble opinion...

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby sanjaykumar » 08 May 2017 04:18

Just how much do Indian dogs subsidise these saintly KMs? Why are they not at the level of Gonds? Are the Gonds and Bhils any less deserving of Indian largesse? Perhaps it's time to leave them to their devices and the jihadi dogs they worship?

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby ManSingh » 08 May 2017 04:38

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/jammu-and-kashmir-most-pampered-state-in-india/1/218463.html

A Kashmiri gets eight times more money from the Centre than citizens from other states. While per capita Central assistance to other states moved from Rs 576.24 in 1992-93 to Rs 1,137 in 2000-1, that of the Kashmiri spiralled from Rs 3,197 to Rs 8,092.
To get a perspective, translate the numbers: if this cash, managed by the state Government, were to be despatched by money order, each Kashmiri family (with five members on an average) would get Rs 40,460 every year.

For all that talk of autonomy or azadi, the fact is that Jammu and Kashmir cannot sustain itself without the Centre's support. In 2001-2, the state spent Rs 7,516.6 crore of which Rs 4,577 crore-or 60 paise of every rupee spent-came from the Centre.
The state's non-development expenditure was Rs 2,829 crore including a salary bill of Rs 1,193 crore while its own revenues were barely Rs 1,095 crore. The state could not have paid even the wages of its employees without the Centre's help.


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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby sanjaykumar » 08 May 2017 04:54

The day may not be too far when hard working Jaats of Haryana and Jats of Panjab obstruct transport of their grain to the valley.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Prem » 08 May 2017 06:38

sanjaykumar wrote:The day may not be too far when hard working Jaats of Haryana and Jats of Panjab obstruct transport of their grain to the valley.

I like the idea of 10 Million Bachelors from whole India go on hugging March to Valley and bring permanent peace to these wretched souls in Valley .

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby hanumadu » 08 May 2017 10:46

https://twitter.com/NaIna0806/status/861445633022078976

Watch the video in this tweet. Paki bunkers blown to pieces. You can see paki bodies flying in the air. The first shot looks like that of a guided missile and not artillery shell as it homed in on an entrance to the bunker.

The soldier is reporting to some one that bunker has been hit, the missile went inside to his higher up. Can't the higher up see with a pair of binoculars? Is he not present there? Who is he reporting to?

Very gratifying visuals.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby hanumadu » 08 May 2017 10:49

^^So it is true that after the beheading of the soldiers, Indian army did destroy paki bunkers and killed their soldiers. Why did the Indian army deny the reports?

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Bart S » 08 May 2017 11:52

nam wrote:We need to convert the LoC in to a PA meat grinder. Artillery & constant air attacks, every time there is an incident in Kashmir. Force PA to relocate forces from Afghan, Iran, Balouch & Waristan in to LoC. More the troops, more the grinding. We don't have to cross the LoC, just carry out standoff attacks. Make 10-15 km, a no-mans land. Invest in tech which allows us dominance in this attrition war.


That is the biggest problem with our approach. We sit around like civilized folk (that we are) waiting for the Porks to attack us at the time and place of their choosing, and attack us they do. Following which there is the usual round of nonsense that we are witnessing now from all quarters and then people forget about it till they attack us again whereupon the whole cycle repeats. This stupidity seems to be embedded in our DNA from since the days of Prithviraj Chauhan.

What we need is to throw off our self-applied constraints, realize that their only goal is our destruction by whatever means and that we are already at war and that the next attack is not a matter of if but when, and just attack them randomly and proactively. Keep analyzing for anything that might be vulnerable on their side, attack them with deadly force, fortify ourselves against retaliation and bring in better and bigger firepower. Say that we are responding to unprovoked firing from their end. Who says that only they can use plausible deniability.

Let them be on the defensive for once instead of us. Let their army explain the casualties/failure to their media and people (of course its all ISPR controlled and many of the casualties will be denied, but they will creat some pressure after a point, they can deny only so much). Let their media self-flagellate on how their relationships with neigbors has gone wrong.

CRamS wrote:TSP will of course squirm, and its 3.5 will demonize "Hindus extremist" led BJP govt for depriving water to TSP, its an act of war, nuke flash-point yada yada. Then at that point, when the bar has been set so high, India can then say, if you (meaning white Pakis) are so concerned about nuke flash-point, here are a list of demands from India, chief of them being complete stoppage of TSP terror and instigating violence in the valley for a period of at least 2+ years and then talks on restoring status quo ante etc etc (and India can do an equal equal of its own and will be on firm ground: TSP sponsored pigLeTs == Al Queda, Hamas, ISIS).

+100

Along the lines of what I mentioned about others besides Porks being able to use plausible deniability as well. Claiming nuclear flashpoint is a game that not just TSP but even we can play. We have just boxed ourselves in and limited our options. I'd say that we are suffering from 'log kya kahege' syndrome but that is too mild/charitable....we are more like a well-trained dog who gets physical and emotional pleasure from getting a patronizing pat on the head from the 'international community' (a nebulous concept if there ever was one).
Last edited by Bart S on 08 May 2017 12:26, edited 1 time in total.

Bart S
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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Bart S » 08 May 2017 12:22

hanumadu wrote:^^So it is true that after the beheading of the soldiers, Indian army did destroy paki bunkers and killed their soldiers. Why did the Indian army deny the reports?


Please don't believe stuff that you see on social media. Unless it comes from a reputable source like retired officers or defence reporters take it with a pinch of salt. Most of these are at the level of clickbait and whatsapp forwards, i.e attention seeking people spamming/making stuff up/regurgitating old pics or videos that they ripped off from wherever and blatantly misrepresented to get clicks.

There was a picture posted here earlier of 'massive artillery response lighting up the night sky' or something to that effect, a simple google picture search showed that it was a stock photo of US M777 being tested with some new artillery round, from 4 years ago.

sanjaykumar wrote:Just how much do Indian dogs subsidise these saintly KMs? Why are they not at the level of Gonds? Are the Gonds and Bhils any less deserving of Indian largesse? Perhaps it's time to leave them to their devices and the jihadi dogs they worship?


Please do not insult dogs.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby madhu » 08 May 2017 15:10

Doc allegedly refuses to treat Kashmiri, saying: You throw stones at our security forces!: "You throw stones at our security forces and then come here for treatment" was a doctor's response when he was approached by a Kashmiri patient at the Post Graduate Institute of Medical Education and Research in Chandigarh.
The authorities at the PGIMER have ordered a probe into the alleged misbehaviour of the doctor.
Nasreena Malik, a resident of Kashmir who is suffering from internal carotid artery aneurysm, was brought to the to the neurosurgery department at the PGIMER by her son Javaid Ahmad Malik. The doctor allegedly told them, "You throw stones at our security forces there (Kashmir) and come here for treatment." Malik said he did not know the name of the doctor.
"He was fine until he saw the prescription card of hospitals in Kashmir ... He threw them away," Malik alleged.
The patient was advised to undergo angiography and told that the treatment would cost Rs 15 lakh.
Taking a serious note of the incident, PGIMER director Prof Jagat Ram has ordered a probe into it. "We have sought a report from the head of department. If the doctor is found guilty, action will be taken against him," he said


I completely agree with this. B***** wants all sops and good treatment from us and backstab us only... I don't know why action should be taken on the doctor?

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Bart S » 08 May 2017 16:10

madhu wrote:
Doc allegedly refuses to treat Kashmiri, saying: You throw stones at our security forces!: "You throw stones at our security forces and then come here for treatment" was a doctor's response when he was approached by a Kashmiri patient at the Post Graduate Institute of Medical Education and Research in Chandigarh.
The authorities at the PGIMER have ordered a probe into the alleged misbehaviour of the doctor.
Nasreena Malik, a resident of Kashmir who is suffering from internal carotid artery aneurysm, was brought to the to the neurosurgery department at the PGIMER by her son Javaid Ahmad Malik. The doctor allegedly told them, "You throw stones at our security forces there (Kashmir) and come here for treatment." Malik said he did not know the name of the doctor.
"He was fine until he saw the prescription card of hospitals in Kashmir ... He threw them away," Malik alleged.
The patient was advised to undergo angiography and told that the treatment would cost Rs 15 lakh.
Taking a serious note of the incident, PGIMER director Prof Jagat Ram has ordered a probe into it. "We have sought a report from the head of department. If the doctor is found guilty, action will be taken against him," he said


I completely agree with this. B***** wants all sops and good treatment from us and backstab us only... I don't know why action should be taken on the doctor?


Take action against this, but then also against all the doctors in J&K who refuse to treat soldiers and policemen.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby chetak » 08 May 2017 16:50

in cashmere military hospitals, injured soldiers and terrorists are often operated upon on adjacent tables without the doctors questioning who did what. The injured receive the same quality care irrespective of who they are but this is however not the norm in cashmeree hospitals where policemen and paramilitary forces are routinely refused treatment. Those effing doctors have studied in Indian medical colleges and their salaries are now being paid by the Indian taxpayer as are all the other medical facilities that the ungrateful locals enjoy at no cost to themselves.

However, I appreciate the doctor in chandigarh. No nonsense about the hippocratic oath or some such BS. This cashmeree family has got a jolt and with the attendant publicity, others cashmerees will also get a jolt.

The effing cashmere's should know that they are hated by the rest of India. There should be no free pass for these b@st@rds.

I consciously use the spelling cashmere, because these anti national jokers are into it only for the cash they get from India.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Varoon Shekhar » 08 May 2017 17:18

It's a serious idea and i had no idea( I should have sensed) that there are Kashmir hospitals that refuse Indian soldiers/paramilitary treatment. But "Cashmere" because they take Indian cash, that warrants a :lol: Annoyingly true,but very funny.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Varoon Shekhar » 08 May 2017 17:20

Btw, wouldn't surprise me if some non-Indian news outlet picks up the story of Kashmiris being refused, and gives it a huge anti-India, pro-Kashmiri slant, without any counter balancing information.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby hanumadu » 08 May 2017 19:00

Bart S wrote:
hanumadu wrote:^^So it is true that after the beheading of the soldiers, Indian army did destroy paki bunkers and killed their soldiers. Why did the Indian army deny the reports?


Please don't believe stuff that you see on social media. Unless it comes from a reputable source like retired officers or defence reporters take it with a pinch of salt.


The paki soldiers killed in our firing was also tweeted by a defence reporter. But it is just a surmise on my part that the video in question was after the beheading of two of our soldiers. The date of the paki bunker busting is not known for sure yet.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby sanjaykumar » 08 May 2017 19:05

Do we want Indian doctors sinking to the level of those in Cashmore?

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Bart S » 09 May 2017 01:59

sanjaykumar wrote:Do we want Indian doctors sinking to the level of those in Cashmore?


No, it is against all human values, and is an own goal of sorts as it gives people a propaganda tool. GOI must warn and if needed take action against such doctors, and that is what is being done, if the news item is to be believed.

However there is absolutely no excuse for allowing doctors in Srinagar to violate the same laws, they need to be jailed if they continue with that.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby sunnyP » 10 May 2017 12:02

SRINAGAR: An army officer was today found killed in Shopian district of south Kashmir, police sources said.

The body of the Lieutenant rank officer was found with bullet wounds in Hermain area of the district, they said.

The body was identified to be of an Army Lieutenant Umar Fayaz.

"The officer had been kidnapped by militants late on Tuesday evening from Kulgam town where he had gone to attend a family function," a police officer said.


http://m.economictimes.com/news/defence ... 605109.cms


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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby wig » 12 May 2017 23:26

Hizbul threatens to behead Hurriyat leaders over Kashmir statement
A top Hizbul Mujahideen leader has threatened to behead separatist Hurriyat leaders for calling Kashmir a political struggle instead of a religious war for the creation of an “Islamic state”.

and
“We just want to ask these hypocrites if Kashmir is a political issue (then) why are you raising slogans like ‘Azadi ka matlab kya (What is the meaning of freedom). La Illaha Ilallah’, ‘Pakistan say rishta kya (With is the relation with Pakistan). La Illaha Ilallah’,” the militant said, referring to the Hurriyat leaders’ frequent use of the phrase, “There is no one but Allah”.

“Why do you come and address people in mosques?”, the leader said in the clip which first surfaced on social media and has been circulated throughout the valley and beyond.


http://www.hindustantimes.com/india-new ... 802wK.html


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