J&K News and Discussion - 2016

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby disha » 21 Jun 2018 09:26

Vikas wrote:Anyways BJP leadership in Jammu is a joke (Pop quiz: name top 3 BJP leaders from Jammu).


Pop quiz: Name top 3 BJP leaders from Gujarat other than the CM and the FM. Or top 3 BJP leaders from Goa other than CM. Point is that the above is not a point to prove your point sir!

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby rsingh » 21 Jun 2018 14:49

I may be wrong here but elected govt brings more stability. On international arena it gives solid legitimacy to the state. that is the reason now we will have to wait for normality to be restored so that elections are held. That was our pitch........."regular elections are held are people choose their leaders in free and fair elections". On other hand I have faith in people who recommended central rule.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Supratik » 21 Jun 2018 19:49

Utter goat droppings. Both Rajnath and Doval have practically made rest of India zero Islamist terror and much reduced leftist terror. Do you remember the constant bomb blasts in the last 20 years pre-2014 in various parts of India?

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby chetak » 21 Jun 2018 20:06

Supratik wrote:Utter goat droppings. Both Rajnath and Doval have practically made rest of India zero Islamist terror and much reduced leftist terror. Do you remember the constant bomb blasts in the last 20 years pre-2014 in various parts of India?


And that too by holding up a mirror and saying that if it happens here, it can and will jolly well happen elsewhere too.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby sudeepj » 21 Jun 2018 21:20

ShauryaT wrote:^Shanmukh: I think your data points are correct. What we saw in 2014 was a polarized electorate with the valley voting for soft separatists. The failure of this alliance is also a failure of governance and both parties are responsible for this failure. IMO, along with Mehbooba Mufti, Rajnath Singh (what a complete a$$ he made of himself and India with his failed effort with the Hurriyat) and Ajit Doval need to be held accountable. The question is what happens now? The valley has been and continues to be alienated. If all the BJP manages from here is more strong arm actions, which may be warranted, these actions alone will not result in any meaningful long-term change.

Any long-term change would only be a result of a change in the demographics of the region, is this govt willing and capable to undertake such a project? The valley is about 80*100 km area. I am tempted to say a Grozny style operation will make quick work but that would be Adharmic but short of physical destruction a massive ideological destruction of the TNT is called for.


Asinine ideas like these will mean that no politician or bureaucrat will ever take a positive step. What is termed soft separatism is basically a safety valve that keeps people involved in the political process. I dont like the Muftis and the Sheikhs any more than the next guy, but they are a necessary evil in the situation we find ourselves in. Engagement with the elites of an alienated populace is required, the alternative is way more violence.

By the way, Doval was the brains of the operation that destroyed the insurgency in Mizoram and president of the Mizo National Front, Pu Laldenga became the Chief Minister of Mizoram swearing an oath to serve and protect the Indian constitution. Such a success does not come about because someone was a 'tactical' thinker.

With the exception of the Congress ecosystem, most parts of the countrys national security apparatus, including the unofficial parts such as the press and opinion makers, are playing the right role.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Neshant » 21 Jun 2018 21:28

sudeepj wrote:By the way, Doval was the brains of the operation that destroyed the insurgency in Mizoram and president of the Mizo National Front, Pu Laldenga became the Chief Minister of Mizoram swearing an oath to serve and protect the Indian constitution. Such a success does not come about because someone was a 'tactical' thinker.


That only occurred after Mizoram was declared off limits to Indians from other states.

Effectively, it's like a foreign country where Indians from other states need a permit to visit.

This system and Article 370 is insane. Either there is one country or there is not.

It all needs to go.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby ArjunPandit » 21 Jun 2018 23:23

^^ Even if that brings stability I dont think that's bad. If we keep on thinking for the next election or about next UNGA we will never be able to control things. Even the so called champion of human rights didnt hesitate to jump off the boat of islamic agenda pooping agency, china anyways never cared to get them translated into chinese. Article 370 is insane, and we need to get rid of but before sowing weeding out needs to be done. I sincerely hope it is about that only and not the next elections. But now GoI has tried many soft or semi soft/hard options.
1. Tried talking to pakistan if we may call invitation at 2014 swearing in ceremony so
2. Formed a govt with PDP. If you ask me its worse than forming with congress. Though on some occassions MM was resasonable esp after the pellet gun issue. But she couldnt or didnt want to effectively counter the separatist agenda.
3. Semi soft outreach of ceasefire didnt yield anything
4. financial choking through NIA
5. Semi hard approach of pounding pakis at border or surgical strike didnt yield long term solution

Now will we go all out, I dont know.
Ideal scenario accg to me would be
Complete ban on media and internet
1. Hard or precision hits on terrorist leadership in PoK, and traitors here in encounters or mysterious deaths ...ikhwaini might be an overkill in today's environment..anyways many of hurriyat leaders are old ...natural death wouldn't be too difficult ;). This is easiest to accomplish, as GoI doesnt have much to pay, it is army who pays most in blood. Side note much easier to deal with rohingya's and others in such environment
2. Removal of 35A and & 370. The theory that protests can't be sustained for long works can be behind it. How long will the protest, what if GoI stops the money tap? All those pink cheeks will go starving. Remember NDA is about to have majority in RS too. Not sure what is the role of J&K assembly in that
3. Elections: PDP says that BJP cheated us, bjp plays the nationalistic trumpet both get to keep their base, dont lose much may be gain due to polarization. Possibly form govt again, given that they didnt leave like mayawati
4. Hoping Over coming generations demography changes are induced through capitalism .

I know if things were that easy I would have got my "noble" piss prize long back. So brickbats more than welcome

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby sunnyP » 22 Jun 2018 00:01

With Snipers, Radars, NSG Commandos Reach Kashmir For Anti-Terror Ops
The National Security Guards (NSG) commandos will be deputed in anti-terror operations in Kashmir valley on an on-need basis


https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/with-sn ... ns-1871164

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Prem » 22 Jun 2018 00:49


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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby ramana » 22 Jun 2018 00:54

Supratik wrote:Utter goat droppings. Both Rajnath and Doval have practically made rest of India zero Islamist terror and much reduced leftist terror. Do you remember the constant bomb blasts in the last 20 years pre-2014 in various parts of India?


+1008.

I recommend tuning out Indian commentators with tomahawks to grind.

These folks want scalps for imagined insults and ignoring.


On twitter there is Motorham who thinks she can torpedo some governor candidate with nandi droppings being flung at his persona.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby SBajwa » 22 Jun 2018 00:56

Neshant wrote:
sudeepj wrote:By the way, Doval was the brains of the operation that destroyed the insurgency in Mizoram and president of the Mizo National Front, Pu Laldenga became the Chief Minister of Mizoram swearing an oath to serve and protect the Indian constitution. Such a success does not come about because someone was a 'tactical' thinker.


That only occurred after Mizoram was declared off limits to Indians from other states.

Effectively, it's like a foreign country where Indians from other states need a permit to visit.

This system and Article 370 is insane. Either there is one country or there is not.

It all needs to go.


People from other states cannot go there but it is a protected tribal area. Just like many parts of Andaman and nicobar island.
That was their demand that they want to keep their ancient customs and traditions and they still are.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Neshant » 22 Jun 2018 09:24

SBajwa wrote:
Neshant wrote:
That only occurred after Mizoram was declared off limits to Indians from other states.

Effectively, it's like a foreign country where Indians from other states need a permit to visit.

This system and Article 370 is insane. Either there is one country or there is not.

It all needs to go.


People from other states cannot go there but it is a protected tribal area. Just like many parts of Andaman and nicobar island.
That was their demand that they want to keep their ancient customs and traditions and they still are.



Which part of India does not have ancient customs and traditions?

In every state there are all kinds of ethnic groups big and small, tribes, languages, dialects, different religious traditions.. etc.

No one group is more unique or special than another.


If that's the case, then people from that state should also require a permit to visit other states.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby sudeepj » 22 Jun 2018 11:08

Every state has rules to protect vulnerable classes. There are similar rules about land ownership in Himachal, in UttaraKhand.. there are laws that prevent sale or transfer of land owned by SC/ST to a non SC/ST. One could argue about the ethics or constitutionality of these laws, but they are preferable to armed conflict. These are very small states both population wise and area wise, so the relative sacrifice by people of other states is minimal. Kashmir of course, is in a league of its own and has made collecting a new Jazia from the rest of India into an art form.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Vikas » 22 Jun 2018 12:13

Anyone who is thinking of Kashmir terror problem getting resolved just by Gov rule and snipers has no grip of the situation.
As long as Bakis have the capacity to send terrorists in Kashmir, The issue will keep festering.
SF can neutralize the terror machinery for some time.

PS: How long these rootless congress workers hang around and how do they last so long.
Ghulam Nabi was there in the inner circle of Sanjay Gandhi and he still is in inner circle of Sonia Gandhi.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby disha » 22 Jun 2018 12:38

Vikas wrote:PS: How long these rootless congress workers hang around and how do they last so long.
Ghulam Nabi was there in the inner circle of Sanjay Gandhi and he still is in inner circle of Sonia Gandhi.


TBH, the rootless wonders like Ghulam hang around because we get frustrated by any new government. We expect the new government to fix things in 6 months which were broken throughout last 60 years.

And then do a rona-dhona all over again. If people like Ghulam are rootless wonders, people like us are faithless wonders.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Supratik » 22 Jun 2018 17:28

IMO all restrictions on movement of people within India should go. However, the restrictions in the north-east have been there since British days. Since they are now peaceful areas beneficial engagement is necessary to overturn those rules. There is already talk of easing ILP rules to ensure more tourism. Kashmir is a different beast with jihad, proxy war and ethnic cleansing. The two cannot be compared.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby abhik » 22 Jun 2018 17:38

The frequent bomb blasts in major cities mostly stopped after yasen bhatkal and gang (Indian mujahideen) we're captured, which happened before 2014. Don't get why RS or Doval should get credit for it.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Supratik » 22 Jun 2018 17:58

It reduced but major decline happened after 2014.

Here is the data till 2016. This is total. Bulk of it will be in J&K and Naxal areas in 2016.

http://www.satp.org/satporgtp/countries ... ph2016.htm

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Supratik » 22 Jun 2018 18:09

Also just like HM, JEM, LET Pak could have revived IM after Bhatkal arrest (2013) under someone else. Now you can argue Pak was kind and tolerant. I will argue RS and AD did a good job.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby disha » 22 Jun 2018 20:35

abhik wrote:The frequent bomb blasts in major cities mostly stopped after yasen bhatkal and gang (Indian mujahideen) we're captured, which happened before 2014. Don't get why RS or Doval should get credit for it.


Really? Data does not prove your point.

Here is another homegrown urban terrorist

https://www.firstpost.com/politics/saifuddin-soz-echoes-pervez-musharraf-says-kashmiris-first-choice-is-independence-bjp-compares-congress-leader-to-let-4568401.html

roaming free with Congoon political patronage.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby SBajwa » 22 Jun 2018 21:22

Neshant wrote:
SBajwa wrote:
People from other states cannot go there but it is a protected tribal area. Just like many parts of Andaman and nicobar island.
That was their demand that they want to keep their ancient customs and traditions and they still are.



Which part of India does not have ancient customs and traditions?

In every state there are all kinds of ethnic groups big and small, tribes, languages, dialects, different religious traditions.. etc.

No one group is more unique or special than another.


If that's the case, then people from that state should also require a permit to visit other states.



All Indians get 15 days pass for Rs 120.00 . You can visit anytime. You pay money for Uttarakhand too if you go to places like Chamoli district.

We should let the legislature of Mizoram to decide itself to let other people in or not (tourism)

Still! Because Kashmir is affected by cross border terrorism there should be no restriction of any Indian to Kashmir.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby ramana » 23 Jun 2018 00:12

Guys lets be factual and not just post opinions.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Neshant » 23 Jun 2018 08:00

SBajwa wrote:All Indians get 15 days pass for Rs 120.00 . You can visit anytime.


I don't get why i need to pay money. Its not some national park I'm visiting.

Its a state - supposedly in India.

People from there are not paying Rs 120 every 15 days when they visit/work in other states.


There was agitation in Manipur some time back to be declared an ILP state to block other Indians from migrating there.

The question they put forth is a valid one - why are some states allowed to have this status, but not others?


We are all equal.

But some are more equal than others.


If I became PM, I'd scrap it all.

I would not care what turmoil it caused.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby brvarsh » 23 Jun 2018 11:13

Neshant wrote:
SBajwa wrote:All Indians get 15 days pass for Rs 120.00 . You can visit anytime.


I don't get why i need to pay money. Its not some national park I'm visiting.

The question they put forth is a valid one - why are some states allowed to have this status, but not others?

We are all equal.

But some are more equal than others.

If I became PM, I'd scrap it all.

I would not care what turmoil it caused.

You don't have to wait for you to become PM to get rid of any special status to any state. In most cases this was granted as a carrot not that state wanted to. When things get too complex for the government to solve such deals are made to appease the force. Realistically if we believe we can remove Article 370 and the rest of India will flood into the Valley and buy properties and open businesses - its not going to happen, will not happen in the valley any time soon. This was to be done done in '60s. What is logical today is to separate Jammu from the Kashmir valley and remove this article in Jammu and flood this new state with so much opportunities and growth that article 370 tangibly becomes a reason to integrate. Nine ladies can not produce a baby in one Month - some things take their usual time and the time is to clearly separate the hard from the soft elements in this movement so that award the softer elements so much that dissolves the other in coming years organically. If we leave all apples in one basket with the rotten ones - believe me in a few days they will all rot. Separate them so that the good ones become envy of the other. Lots of cliches but that is the strategic truth and only viable option for lasting peace.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Supratik » 23 Jun 2018 14:19

As long as Art 370 is there you cannot separate Jammu and Ladakh from Kashmir.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby dinesha » 23 Jun 2018 17:30

IEDs a new threat to Jammu and Kashmir, says CRPF DG
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... 706206.cms

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby ShauryaT » 23 Jun 2018 19:38

Supratik wrote:As long as Art 370 is there you cannot separate Jammu and Ladakh from Kashmir.
Any talk of separation of Kashmir from Jammu or Ladakh is directly playing into the hands of Pakistan and the 2NT. Jinnah would be smiling in his grave.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby ShauryaT » 23 Jun 2018 19:43

An old Kashmir-Jammu dilemma - Sandeep Bhardwaj

Code: Select all

The Bharatiya Janata Party’s decision to break its alliance with the Peoples Democratic Party (PDP) and plunge Jammu and Kashmir into political chaos comes as a climax to a dilemma that the party’s government at the Centre had been facing since the State elections in 2014. On the one hand, it needed political stability and a friendly government in J&K to find a political solution to the growing insurgency and unrest in the Valley. On the other hand, the BJP needed to placate its Hindu constituency in Jammu by appearing to stand tough against Srinagar. In the end, the party chose short-term electoral gains over long-term necessities of finding peace in Kashmir.

Sadly, this dilemma is something that successive Indian governments have struggled with for many decades. Jammu politics has always cast a long shadow over national politics and complicated the Srinagar-Delhi relationship. The demographic reality of Jammu — as a Hindu majority region within a Muslim majority State, in a Hindu majority nation — makes it an irresistible magnet for religious and identity politics, which inevitably hinders attempts to bring stability in the State as a whole.

An early brush

India was first confronted with this problem in the early days of the republic when a mixture of Jammu unrest and religious politics brought down one of the strongest attempts to bring a permanent resolution to the Kashmir problem. This was the Jammu Praja Parishad (JPP) agitation which went on for nearly a year in 1952-53.

In 1952, India seemed close to solving the Kashmir question. The J&K Premier, Sheikh Abdullah, had succeeded in establishing a stable government in Srinagar. He had also developed a good working relationship with Delhi, underpinned by his personal friendship with Prime Minister Jawaharlal Nehru. In July, both sides signed the 1952 Delhi Agreement establishing the federal framework for India and J&K. Soon thereafter, the new Prime Minister of Pakistan, Mohammad Ali, committed to finding a peaceful solution to Kashmir “within one year” and began a series of talks with Nehru.

Unfortunately, this moment of bonhomie was mired by the widespread unrest that flared up in Jammu in late 1952. The JPP, a local Hindu party founded by RSS leader Balraj Madhok in 1947, took to the streets protesting against the State government. The initial agitation was over Abdullah’s land reforms, which had adversely affected the landowners in Jammu. However, soon the agitation took on hues of hypernationalism. “Ek Vidhan, Ek Nishan, Ek Pradhan (One constitution, one flag and one Premier)” became the rallying cry.

Soon afterwards, the national Hindu right-wing parties rallied around the issue. They included the then-powerful Hindu Mahasabha, the BJP’s predecessor Bharatiya Jan Sangh, and a little-known party called the All India Ram Rajya Parishad. Under the leadership of S.P. Mookerjee, these parties launched a nationwide campaign in support of the Jammu agitators in February 1953. In May, Mookerjee travelled to Kashmir where he was arrested. He died of a heart attack a month later under detention.

Meanwhile, Nehru found himself facing the Kashmir-Jammu dilemma. He continued to believe that the Abdullah government represented the best hope of finding a political solution to Kashmir. But he also had to find a way to put the Jammu agitation and its accompanying Hindu right-wing campaign to rest. For several months he continued to resist any compromise with the agitators, attacking the Hindu right-wing parties and giving full-throated support to Abdullah. However, after Mookerjee’s death, he had to give in, issuing an appeal to the agitators in July. The protests were suspended shortly thereafter.

But the damage was done. Abdullah had been severely weakened politically and his relations with Nehru were frayed. A month later, he was removed from power and put under arrest. With government records still a secret, it is not yet known who exactly ordered the arrest. However, the Jammu agitation certainly paved the way for it. A deeper legacy of the agitation was that it turned Kashmiris against Delhi. Years of efforts by the Indian government to generate goodwill in Kashmir had been “washed away by this movement,” Nehru lamented. “Nothing more harmful to our cause in the State could have been done even by our enemies.”

The only real victors of the agitation were the Hindu right-wing parties. Many within their own camp saw the potential dangers of such a divisive campaign but the political opportunity it offered was irresistible. At the time they were seen as somewhat outside the realm of mainstream national politics. The protest campaign allowed them to expand their base and gain legitimacy in the eyes of the Indian public. Nehru’s direct appeal to them was also interpreted as a boost to their political stature.

A wasted opportunity

Today, while the Kashmir-Jammu dilemma remains, the political landscape has completely changed. The BJP is not only the ruling party in New Delhi, it is also the biggest political force in the country. It can no longer afford to play the spoiler as before because of the national responsibilities that weigh on its shoulders. The myopic decision to withdraw support from the Srinagar government betrays its old mode of thinking. It needs to take the long-term view. In fact, given its dominant position in Jammu, it is arguably better positioned to manage the dilemma than previous governments. Instead of pursuing superficial political gains, the BJP’s government at the Centre should use its unique position to find a permanent political solution for the entire State.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Kashi » 23 Jun 2018 20:07

ShauryaT wrote:Any talk of separation of Kashmir from Jammu or Ladakh is directly playing into the hands of Pakistan and the 2NT. Jinnah would be smiling in his grave.


If he has stopped rolling over the loss of Bangladesh that is.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Supratik » 23 Jun 2018 21:51

The Hindu article is wrong on various counts. Jammu and Ladakh giving an overwhelming majority to BJP is a recent phenomenon. Both regions have long complained about various types of discriminations but have also voted largely for the Congress with BJP making incremental gains in Jammu. So Jammu and Ladakh (which the article doesn't mention) is not casting a long shadow over anything. Mufti decision of clemency for stone pelters and persisting with ceasefire even after Ramzan and doing nothing about Rohingyas in Jammu finally broke the camels back. The Hindu belongs to the "talk to Pak' brigade.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby CRamS » 23 Jun 2018 22:59

Guys, if you look at the micro strategy of TSP, its very clear that they are after the Sunni Muslim dominated valley. Thats why their separatist puppets like Mehbooba, Harried rats etc are always focused on the valley. Thus, any separation of Jammu from valley will only fulfill TSP's wet dreams.

Thus, however much despicable KMs are and tough to live with them, the much dreaded words and phrases like 'secularism', 'Kashmiriyat', 'composite culture' etc that have no substantial meaning, but are important political tools in India's arsenal. In fact, even as frauds like Adhothi etc who are votaries of such exalted notions bat for Pais and Islamic terrorists, such notions can be used to hang them by their own petard. So IMO, lets not even think of any separation. Finally, if and when Indian army can completely destroy terror in the valley, make LoC impregnable (tough to do no doubt), then these very same notions can be invoked to revoke article 370. But not until then.

In the short term, there will definitely be a cold war of attrition between TSP and India in the coming months. TSP will surely be provoking India with its pigLeTs. I maybe wrong, but TSP might not conduct any spectacular attacks during Amarnath yatra that will hurt Hindu pilgrims. Because by doing so, they may not be able to openly garner the support of PDP, NC, Pappu's Congoon slaves, Human rights activists etc, I mean the usual cabal of urban naxals and half Maoists and Islamic Jihadis in Mufti; aka Hindu haters. But who knows, any attack by TSP, this cabal will blame ModiJi. But at least among TSP's 3.5, they won't be able to get overt support by attacking Hindu pilgrims. But who knows.

But IMO, what TSP will do 100% (ISI/TSPA in Rawalpindi are plotting as we speak) is try and conduct spectacular attacks against Indian army in the valley as the run up to 2019. If they don't succeed, nothing is lost, except scores of expenadbale pigLeTs. But if they succeed in attacking Indian army, they can claim they claim 'freedom fighting', they will make ModiJi and DovalJi and Indian army look weak, they will give impetus to the Hindu haters to do equal equal between Indian army and pigLeTs. In other words, everybody arrayed against India will be satisfied. UnDy types, Burk bibi types will say "I told you so', 'muscular policy' does not work. And last but not the least, this will be a God sent political gift for opposition thugbandhan to pummel ModiJi and BJP.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby manjgu » 24 Jun 2018 07:11

But attacking hindu pilgrims makes Modi ji look weak and will be a good instrument in opposition hands. such an attack will be advertised as a consequence/ reaction of a failed policy ..no easy options here... I am surprised nobody from Hurrirats family has been attacked ( i mean their kids, chachas, chachis etc etc). this issue will have to be settled at the border IMHO..we have to bite the bullet and grab some territory by force...

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby ramana » 24 Jun 2018 08:46

CRS, Keep going. Think Kargil playbook.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby Kashi » 24 Jun 2018 10:01

Agree with CRS, the scenario seems ready to play out. I wonder if BJP's move to dissolve the coalition was a pre-emptive move in this regard.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby CRamS » 24 Jun 2018 11:58

Kashi, who knows, ISI is so entrenched in the valley that they were probably plotting something which RAW got hold of and hence the dissolution. But I think BJP genuinely tried to get some talks going, however, Mehbooba and her gang of separatists betrayed in going along with TSP with her talks with TSP BS. Or charitable explanation might be that Mehbooba had no control over her own pigLeTs.

Has anybody noticed, suddenly stone pelting has stopped. It was Sajjad Lone who said that nothing happens in the valley that is not scripted. And what is the script? Somebody was instigating the stone pelters knowing that BJP will be coy to go all out against the pelters post Burhan valley given the # of civilians killed and injured in cross fire then. Now that there is no coalition to worry about, I am pretty sure Indian security forces are given orders to maintain law and order should the pelters come out, and this message has been drilled to down to the Paki puppets in charge of planning stone pelting and wiring subsequent news reports to AP, Reuters etc.It still boggles my mind with Paki maneuverings in the valley that they would even eliminate someone like Sujaat Bukhari who was doing invaluable PR service to them.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby UlanBatori » 24 Jun 2018 13:26

Time (for GOI ) to stop the whining and scrap 370. Subramanian Swamy says there is no 2/3 majority or Both Houses resolution needed, that's all hogwash. That the administration of the din can scrap it. If they can face the ro-dho and fridin bus-burning.

The "disenchanted Kashmiri youth" should be given the option to either get educated and get jobs or emigrate. Maybe to friendly Kandahar or Xinjiang.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby chetak » 24 Jun 2018 17:56

UlanBatori wrote:Time (for GOI ) to stop the whining and scrap 370. Subramanian Swamy says there is no 2/3 majority or Both Houses resolution needed, that's all hogwash. That the administration of the din can scrap it. If they can face the ro-dho and fridin bus-burning.

The "disenchanted Kashmiri youth" should be given the option to either get educated and get jobs or emigrate. Maybe to friendly Kandahar or Xinjiang.


There is no let up as far as the hostility towards Indian citizens in J&K goes but mehabooba is very particular about KMs being very safe and protected in the rest of India.

Why should this be?? Everyone should be equally safe or equally at risk.

may be its about time for some sauce for the goose being sauce for the gander logic.

Safety should be something that either cuts or does not cut both ways.

If some are privileged to be "state" subjects there, aren't the rest not equally privileged to be "state" subjects in the rest of the country??

Such rights should be reciprocal.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby brvarsh » 24 Jun 2018 23:32

Bringing in lasting peace does not necessarily mean only option is to remove Article 370. Do we not think it is very possible under very control that our forces take a hugely upper hand on those who unsettle the peace? Pick and eliminate each one who has a gun raised against the state. Every Palestine inspired stone pelter to be assured of getting to hell if they do. Does that require removal of Article 370? Its like caste based reservation - Many believe it should be removed, with all practicality a must have for fairness and equality in today's India but if you remove it, will invite more disturbances from people who live off of it. Such mistakes can only be diluted when they are seen as burden load on those who are availing it rather forcing it to be removed to give it an undue value that it does not deserve. What the priority here is to just wipe any and all armed resistance, break the back bone of ISI and their elements entrenched in Kashmir, iron clad the borders. All of this does not need Article 370 to be even touched.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby ShauryaT » 25 Jun 2018 04:01

UlanBatori wrote:Time (for GOI ) to stop the whining and scrap 370. Subramanian Swamy says there is no 2/3 majority or Both Houses resolution needed, that's all hogwash. That the administration of the din can scrap it. If they can face the ro-dho and fridin bus-burning.
Subramanian Swamy is often wrong on legal matters and is so on this one too. He rests his case on the following provision
Notwithstanding anything in the foregoing provisions of this article, the President may, by public notification, declare that this article shall cease to be operative or shall be operative only with such exceptions and modifications and from such date as he may specify: Provided that the recommendation of the Constituent Assembly of the State referred to in clause ( 2 ) shall be necessary before the President issues such a notification


He argues that since the constituent assembly of the state does not exist, the power to cease article 370 rests with the President alone. I do not know of ANY serious legal mind of the country, who reads the provision in the way Swamy does. The most correct way is for Parliament to move a constitutional amendment bill of repeal as done by IG for article 291 (Privy Purse case). The power of the Parliament is supreme and even the SC shall not be able to do anything on the matter.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion - 2016

Postby CRamS » 25 Jun 2018 05:16

One of the most sane and honest debate on Kashmir situation hosted by none other than Sir General G.D.Bakshi. Look how Shabnam Lone obfuscates and rambles around when the General asks her to spell out details on what she means by 'political solution' a phrase that is bandied about by everyone. Sambit Patra was crisp

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c3GuO-5y42k


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