India-France news

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JE Menon
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Re: India-France news

Postby JE Menon » 08 May 2017 19:42

https://swarajyamag.com/world/can-macro ... tion-maybe

Please tweet-share it direct from the website if you like it. (Disclaimer: I have zero financial or other stake in this magazine. Nor do I get paid in any form for the articles I write. It is just to push an Indian point if view out there).

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Re: India-France news

Postby rsingh » 08 May 2017 20:43

“The French are not Islamophobic, but radical Islam is scary.”

I am sure Macron will be tested very soon.

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Re: India-France news

Postby UlanBatori » 08 May 2017 23:16

So now Liberal (relatively speaking) Merkel and liberal (extreme) Macaroni are competing for the Nobel Peace Prize? Poor Belgium caught in the middle as usual and filled with occupying stuffed shirt EU executives. I am betting on a Chechen soosai burkha inflating on steps of Le Palace d' Versailles 2 minutes after Macaroni enters the bldg.

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Re: India-France news

Postby Cosmo_R » 09 May 2017 03:13

JE Menon wrote:https://swarajyamag.com/world/can-macrons-first-term-stop-le-pen-in-the-next-election-maybe

Please tweet-share it direct from the website if you like it. (Disclaimer: I have zero financial or other stake in this magazine. Nor do I get paid in any form for the articles I write. It is just to push an Indian point if view out there).


Really well written. Thanks

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Re: India-France news

Postby SSridhar » 17 Nov 2017 08:40

UN must list Azhar a global terrorist: France - The Hindu
Emphasising the need to designate Pakistani terror mastermind Masood Azhar as a global terrorist under the 1267 counter-terror committee of the UN Security Council, France on Thursday sought international consensus on countering cross-border terrorism.

In a written interview to The Hindu , Foreign Minister Jean-Yves Le Drian said France and India are successfully cooperating in areas like counter-terrorism and defence and highlighted France’s territorial interests in the Indian Ocean region.

“It is deeply regrettable that we could not reach a consensus on such an obvious request for designation,” Mr. Le Drian stated, arguing that as the leader of the banned group Jaish-e-Mohammed, Mr. Azhar too should be designated a global terrorist.

Mr. Le Drian’s comment on terrorism came two days after France marked the first anniversary of the November 13, 2016 terror strike in Paris which left 130 dead and dozens wounded. The Foreign Minister’s visit on Friday is expected to prepare the ground for President Emmanuel Macron’s India visit during which he is expected to participate in the International Solar Alliance Conference.

Mr. Le Drian will meet with his counterpart, External Affairs Minister Sushma Swaraj, and Finance Minister Arun Jaitley during his visit.

He will also hold talks with National Security Adviser Ajit Doval.

For interview, log on to http: //bit.ly/ FrenchForeignMin

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Re: India-France news

Postby Vips » 17 Nov 2017 23:11

India is our strategic partner in Asia: France.

Even as India finds itself the cynosure of quadrilaterals and minilaterals in the Indian Ocean and the freshly minted Indo-Pacific region, New Delhi is keen to keep ties with one of its oldest partners bilateral. "India is our strategic partner in Asia. We are in the process of forging a strong defence and security partnership in the Indian Ocean," said Alexander Ziegler, French ambassador, briefing journalists on the eve of their foreign minister Jean Yves Le Drian's visit.

"He comes two weeks after our defence minister visited Delhi, six weeks after our NSA visited for the strategic dialogue, and ahead of the visit of our President Macron early next year," Ziegler said emphasising the growing momentum in ties between the two countries. Le Drian's main objective will be to prepare the ground for President Emmanuel Macron expected here in early 2018, his visit having been pushed back from December.

Le Drian will have meetings with foreign minister Sushma Swaraj and finance minister Arun Jaitley, besides with power minsister R K Singh, HRD minister Prakash Javadekar and others.

"Our relationship is based on three pillars — defence and strategic partnership; partnership for the future i.e. non-carbon energy, smart cities and green mobility; people to people which includes education; nuclear energy and space."

"India is keen to keep our bilateral relationship the way it is. Varuna, for instance, is the oldest naval exercise that India started with any country in 1983," said French officials.

With the largest exclusive economic zone (EEC) in the Indian Ocean (2 million square kms) and strategic real estate in Mauritius, Seychelles and Madagascar as well as active naval bases in Djibouti, Reunion islands and even the UAE, France is a coveted strategic partner.

There is a great trust factor with India, they said. So expanding the quadrilateral, or expanding this working relationship just for the sake of it would be counterproductive, they felt.

This was also the view of Indian strategists, they indicated. French officials pointed to the depth of India's strategic and security relationship with India, saying other countries could join the India-France group, but going multilateral would dilute the strength of the current cooperation.

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Re: India-France news

Postby ramana » 18 Nov 2017 05:12

Philip, Can you find out about Ind-French Naval exercise Varuna and write up a short piece about what units, where and what exercises are conducted?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Varuna_(Naval_Exercise)

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Re: India-France news

Postby SSridhar » 18 Nov 2017 07:28

Countries supporting terror must be opposed: India, France
Gravely concerned over growing terrorism, India and France on Friday decided to strengthen counter-terror cooperation, and asked the international community to oppose the countries which are financing, sheltering and providing safe havens to terrorists.

External Affairs Minister Sushma Swaraj held wide-ranging talks with her French counterpart Jean-Yves Le Drian, during which they also decided to strengthen cooperation in the Indian Ocean Region+ (IOR), a development which comes barely days after India held quadrilateral talks with Japan, Australia and the US in Manila on the sidelines of India-ASEAN Summit.


The two ministers discussed key regional and international issues as well as the visit of the French President to India next year.

"We expressed grave concern on growing terrorism and decided that we need to fight the evil together. We appealed to all countries to oppose those financing, sheltering and providing safe havens to terrorists," Swaraj said at a joint press event with the French minister.

Though her statement did not name Pakistan, the remarks were in a veiled reference to it.

She said they also discussed concrete measures to expedite operations at the Jaitapur nuclear power project.

As part of the nuclear cooperation agreement between India and France signed in 2008, Paris is to help build atomic power reactors for New Delhi under which the French firm EDF will build six atomic reactors of 1650 MW each at Jaitapur, some 500 kms south off Mumbai, with National Power Corporation India Limited (NPCIL) as operator.

The two sides discussed growing cooperation in the Indian Ocean Region and the issue of maritime security, Swaraj said.

"The aim is to ensure free trade on international seas, tackle piracy and maritime terror. We decided to secure sea channels and build capabilities through engagements in bilateral as well as multilateral foras," she said.


On his part, the French minister said he was here to lay the groundwork for the visit of the French president which would take place early next year during the summit of the International Solar Alliance.

Describing his talks "very useful and substantive", he said, "On matters such as combating terrorism, maritime security, cooperation in the Indian Ocean -- where France and India are two countries belonging to the Indian Ocean Rim -- we have a complete commonality of views, which calls for the strengthening of our partnership."

Earlier this year, France, along with the US and the UK, had co-piloted a proposal to ban JeM chief Masood Azhar by the UN. However, the proposal was thwarted by China.

The French minister also termed Indo-French strategic tie-up as "a partnership of trust based on democratic values" and "partnership of heart".

He said France was keenly desire to pursue and further strengthen the exceptional strategic partnership that has united India and France since 1998.

It was France's first strategic partnership in Asia and for 20 years it has been enriched and continues to be concretised from year to year, he added.

"We share not only values but also the same analysis of major international issues. Our bilateral relations must be understood as an expression of this common analysis," he said.


The visiting dignitary also talked about robust defence ties, saying the bilateral defence partnership is well known through the Rafale and Scorpene projects - to mention only the most emblematic ones - but it is far broader than that, similar to our cooperation in the Indian Ocean.

He also said the partnership for the planet was at the core of France's global diplomacy.

Prime Minister Narendra Modi and President Emmanuel Macron have expressed their desire to maintain the momentum created with the Paris Agreement on Climate Change and the founding of the International Solar Alliance.

"They wished to have the State visit coincide with the first summit of the International Solar Alliance here in Delhi. This is very positive and will enable us to enhance the attractiveness of this international organisation, which will play a crucial role in helping developing countries gain access to sustainable energy at lower costs," he said.

The minister also invited Indian students, researchers and artists to visit France.

He will inaugurate 'Bonjour India' festival in Delhi and Jaipur, which will offer the best of this partnership of hearts through 300 events across 33 Indian cities.

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Re: India-France news

Postby krishna_krishna » 18 Nov 2017 19:29

ramana wrote:Philip, Can you find out about Ind-French Naval exercise Varuna and write up a short piece about what units, where and what exercises are conducted?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Varuna_(Naval_Exercise)


Varruna 2017 :

===================
Indian ships -
INS Mumbai (Destroyer)
INS Tarkash (Frigate)
INS Trishaw (Frigate)
INS Aditya (Tanker)

French Ships -
Frigate Auvergne (Multimission Frigate, I believe FERMM Type)
Frigate Aquitaine (Multimission Frigate, I believe FERMM Type)
Frigate Cassard (Anti aircraft frigate)
Frigate Lafayette (Stealth Frigate)

====================

Location : "Helicopters and Rafale fighter jets were also in service for this exercise,Which was held off French shores, first in the Mediterranean, then in the Atlantic.
The first phase of preparations at the quay of Toulon was an opportunity for exchanges on expertise and interactions at all levels of the military hierarchy between the Indian and French navies."

Dates : 24 April to 12 May 2017.


An interesting titbit I was able to find is during exercise many admirals got dekho to some French maal as well I believe precursor to the chief visit :

"Western Naval Command chief, Vice Admiral Girish Luthra is also in France with his visit coinciding with the visit by the ships.

Luthra is scheduled to visit the French frigate FNS Auvergne, a French Nuclear Submarine Unit, as well as an Underwater Weapons Facility. He would also call on senior official in France, including Vice Admiral Charles-Henri du Che, Commander-in-Chief of the Mediterranean Sea Area (CECMED)."

"The Indian three-ship task group is composed of INS Mumbai, Trishul, and Aditya, and is headed by Rear Admiral RB Pandit, the Flag Officer Commanding Western Fleet, who is flying his flag on the guided missile destroyer, INS Mumbai.

Rear Admiral RB Pandit is also scheduled to visit the French frigate FNS Auvergne, a French nuclear submarine, as well as an underwater weapons facility. He would also call on senior official in France, including Vice Admiral Charles-Henri du Che, Commander-in-Chief of the Mediterranean Sea Area (CECMED)."

From Here:
http://www.business-standard.com/articl ... 270_1.html
https://in.ambafrance.org/Indo-French-j ... nch-coasts
http://navaltoday.com/2017/04/25/indian ... se-varuna/

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Re: India-France news

Postby ramana » 19 Nov 2017 03:27

So its surface ships plus visit to French submarines and facilities.

RADM Pandit is the task force commander with flag ship INS Mumbai.

Interesting that IN sent a destroyer and the French had frigates.
Lot of French naval aviation taking part.

Was the tanker used to fuel the French ships at sea also which means they can be replenished at sea by Indian ships too?

So what type of exercises were underway?

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Re: India-France news

Postby krishna_krishna » 19 Nov 2017 03:48

ramana wrote:
Was the tanker used to fuel the French ships at sea also which means they can be replenished at sea by Indian ships too?


So what type of exercises were underway?


1) Anti submarine warfare
2) Conventional training
3) Anti- piracy and anti-terror



I believe yes Indian tanker can refuel French ships, cannot say for sure if it did during exercise

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Re: India-France news

Postby chetak » 19 Nov 2017 20:48

krishna_krishna wrote:
ramana wrote:
Was the tanker used to fuel the French ships at sea also which means they can be replenished at sea by Indian ships too?


So what type of exercises were underway?


1) Anti submarine warfare
2) Conventional training
3) Anti- piracy and anti-terror



I believe yes Indian tanker can refuel French ships, cannot say for sure if it did during exercise


(European) NATO and the US will have the same standards in terms of accepting/dispensing the refuelling hose connections. IN exercise frequently with the USN. Plus, IN tankers can also refuel russian made ships.

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Re: India-France news

Postby Vips » 06 Mar 2018 06:08

Maritime security, nuclear deal to top agenda of Macron's India talks.

Maritime security and nuclear cooperation will be the staple items on the table when French President Emmanuel Macron holds discussions with Prime Minister Narendra Modi during his visit to India this weekend.

While the "Quad" comprising India, Japan, Australia and the US is pitched as the new political counterpoint to China in the India-Pacific space, India and France have found much to be close about in the Indian Ocean. The two countries have realised that the way forward is closer bilateral cooperation, rather than "rushing" into a multilateral format, significant at a time when pluri-laterals or mini-laterals find favour.

India and France are also hoping to get an agreement between NPCIL (Nuclear Power Corporation of India Limited) and EDF (of France) on six nuclear reactors that could lead to greater indigenisation of components and services for the reactors.

"We have shared concerns in the Indian Ocean. We are more ambitious, more pragmatic and more coherent," a source said. This is a new element in the France-India bilateral relationship, which will require much closer work. During Macron's visit, both countries are expected to sign agreements that will allow India logistics access to French military bases in the Indian Ocean. By itself, this could become a force multiplier for India, especially since New Delhi, despite clear interests in the Indian Ocean, has been a laggard in securing its interests.

France remains the largest resident power in the Indian Ocean with the largest amount of real estate, including about 11 million sq km of exclusive economic zone particularly in the Mozambique channel with over 10 islands as part of French overseas territories. For France's military bases in Djibouti, Abu Dhabi and Reunion Islands, India regards it as an attractive strategic partner here.

Speaking to journalists, French ambassador Alexander Ziegler had said, "We are looking for structured and operational cooperation in defence and security in the Indian Ocean region." He attributed the bilateral nature of the relationship to the high level of trust between France and India.

At some point, the two countries might open this cooperation in a broader format, inviting perhaps Australia, with whom France enjoys a similar relationship, given French assets in the South Pacific. With India and UAE deepening their own defence and security relationship, Abu Dhabi could also become a future partner.

Carnegie India, in a recent report on India-France cooperation in the Indian Ocean, said India should support France's full membership of the Indian Ocean Rim Association (IORA) while France could help India enter the Indian Ocean Commission. But the report, by Darshana Baruah and C Raja Mohan also sounds a cautionary note. "For France, the concern is not only about New Delhi's foreign policy and partnership with Western powers and its grand strategy and ideology, but also the nature of daily decision-making in New Delhi, which France, like so many of India's interlocutors on defence policy, finds frustrating. The well-known complexity of civil-military relations in India, where the dominance of the civilian bureaucracy is total, has been a major obstacle to the reform and rejuvenation of India's defence engagement," it said.

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Re: India-France news

Postby chetak » 06 Mar 2018 16:30

^^^^^^^

In other words, the frogs, as usual, are motivated ONLY by the Indian money and how they can latch on to large loads of it.

It does not matter one little bit how they camouflage the approach.

One is really at a loss to see how and why france is actually so "concerned" with goings on in the Indian Ocean region.

Especially, when any attack on french "properties" in the IOR will, by law, attract a combined NATO response.

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Re: India-France news

Postby Vips » 08 Mar 2018 09:10

An Indo-French maritime partnership.

French President Emmanuel Macron is coming to India, and preparations are afoot to make his visit a memorable one. On top of the agenda for discussions, reportedly, is maritime security. In a series of preparatory visits, French officials have underlined the need for a deeper nautical partnership with India. During a visit to New Delhi in October 2017, defence minister Florence Parly stressed “strategic cooperation in defence”, particularly maritime cooperation in South and South-East Asia. Earlier this year, foreign minister Jean-Yves Le Drian came calling, highlighting the need for stronger security measures in the Indian Ocean Region (IOR).

Official accounts suggest Indo-French naval cooperation is aimed at securing the critical sea lanes. The desire to pool operational resources in littoral Asia is driven ostensibly by the need to effectively combat security threats—piracy, trans-national crime and terrorism—as also to build security capacities in the Indian Ocean. For New Delhi, however, the more substantive pay-off of a nautical pact with France is a potential expansion of the Indian Navy’s operational footprint across the Indo-Pacific region. France, Indian analysts point out, is the only European power with a strong military presence in both the Indian Ocean (Réunion and Mayotte) and the Pacific (French Polynesia and New Caledonia). Its utility as a catalyst for India’s cross-theatre maritime outreach is immense.

Macron’s visit is expected to result in the signing of a reciprocal agreement granting French naval vessels access to Indian ports for repair and resupply, and Indian vessels the right to routinely use France’s Indian Ocean military bases. Besides the French base in the Réunion Islands, Paris is likely to allow Indian warships to utilize its military facilities in Abu Dhabi and Djibouti, where the People’s Liberation Army Navy (PLAN) already operates a logistical base.

For many in the Indian establishment, France’s long-standing political support for New Delhi makes it an ideal partner in the regional commons. Paris, Indian commentators say, has always stood by New Delhi, even in moments of crises. Not only has France routinely assisted India with vital defence equipment, it also played a key role in pulling New Delhi out of its international isolation in the aftermath of the 1998 nuclear tests.

France, of course, won’t be the first to sign a logistical pact with India. Washington concluded a Logistics Exchange Memorandum of Agreement (Lemoa) with New Delhi in August 2016, and Singapore last year allowed Indian naval ships extended access to its port facilities. Muscat too recently entered into a pact with India, granting Indian warships access to the strategically important base of Duqm on Oman’s southern coast. French facilities are likely to add to India’s network of nautical outposts in the IOR, including in the Andaman and Nicobar Islands, and Seychelles, where New Delhi plans to build and operate a military base. Notwithstanding a White Shipping Agreement with France, India’s naval planners know they have been slow to capitalize on France’s Indian Ocean facilities, particularly in the area of maritime domain awareness.

France’s proficiency with military manufacturing and defence trade buttresses the logic of a strategic partnership. Not only are French companies, such as Thales Group, Airbus Defence and Space, Dassault Aviation, and Naval Group extremely competitive, the country’s defence industry has a reliable record of production and supply. French firms also have particular expertise in navigating India’s choppy defence market, demonstrated by Paris’ success in securing contracts for the Rafale aircraft and Scorpene submarines (Project-75).

Crucially for New Delhi, a nautical pact with France sends a strong message to India’s geopolitical antagonists in maritime Asia. India will be hoping for a closer engagement in the Western Indian Ocean, where France has one of the most forward-deployed armed forces in the world. India’s naval leadership would be keen to expand the scope and complexity of the Indo-French bilateral naval exercise VARUNA, while also exploring opportunities for French warships to participate in trilateral drills with Quad-partners (Japan, Australia and the US).

Paris’ robust posture in the Pacific represents a similar strategic opportunity for New Delhi. France in 2016 offered to coordinate the navies of fellow European Union nations in conducting joint freedom of navigation operations in the South China Sea, a space where French warships have been deployed regularly since 2015. A partnership with the French navy in littoral South-East Asia would allow the Indian Navy to influence the security-dynamic of the Pacific, even extending operations to the Southern Pacific Islands.

The only reason New Delhi will be a wee bit cautious is because the bilateral relationship has hitherto relied heavily on defence trade. Much of the optics surrounding Paris’ Indian Ocean outreach appears intended at securing new contracts for French defence firms. Indian policymakers would then need to carefully evaluate the real strategic benefits of closer naval ties with Paris. If all France needs is a deal to supply more fighter jets and submarines, a partnership in the nautical commons may not be worth the effort.

Ultimately, however, the true test of Indo-French maritime ties will lie in each side’s ability to meet the other’s expectations. While both parties would want to optimize gains by combating threats jointly, none is likely to be ready for a concession that amounts to a strategic compromise.

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Re: India-France news

Postby Philip » 08 Mar 2018 12:06

A few years ago I warned about the inroads the Chins were makimg in Mauritius despite the lsrhd Indian population there.A report today says that we're hoping for a logistic JV at Reunion.V welcome provided we don' t drop the ball in Port Louis where the Ind. community dominates the population.

Indo-French relations are on an upturn for various reasons.To be welcomed v.much.

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Re: India-France news

Postby Vips » 09 Mar 2018 20:41

France: India's new Russia?

Can France replace Russia as India’s most valuable international partner? For many, this is an outlandish idea. For them, Russia’s place in India’s international relations is unique and unchanging. Some would dismiss the proposition by affirming that the United States has already replaced Russia as India’s privileged partner since the end of the Cold War.

Dig a little deeper, though, and you will discover why France has begun to loom so large in India’s geopolitical calculus. A peep into that future might be visible this weekend when the visiting French President, Emmanuel Macron, sits down with Prime Minister Narendra Modi. They already have some interesting things in store. For example, the two leaders are expected to lay out a vision for bilateral strategic coordination for the Indian Ocean and back it with measures to facilitate operational cooperation between their security forces in the littoral.

These steps are welcome and overdue. But they are just the beginning. Modi and Macron are well-placed to turn India and France into long-term partners in shaping the geopolitics of Eurasia and the Indo-Pacific. But first to our claim that France could be “India’s new Russia”. It begs the question: Why has Russia won India’s political affections for so long?

After India gained independence, it was by no means inevitable that Soviet Russia would become a lasting partner for India. It was Russia’s repeated exercise of the veto to trump the Anglo-American tilt towards Pakistan on the Kashmir dispute that laid the foundation for Delhi’s enduring faith in Moscow.

It is not that the UN or anyone else can take Kashmir away from an India that is so much stronger than in the 1950s. But it is good to have a reliable friend in the UNSC who can block unfriendly moves by other powers. France, like Russia, is a permanent member of the UNSC and has a veto.

Until recently, it was Russia alone that made an unambiguous choice between India and Pakistan in favour of the former. As Russia reaches out to Pakistan, that special position now belongs to France. For example, Paris has foregone the opportunity to sell major weapons systems to Pakistan and has focused on a strong defence partnership with India.

Delhi’s new strategic appreciation of the French connection is also rooted in India’s recent nuclear history. Twenty years ago, when he came to India to announce the strategic partnership, President Jacques Chirac argued that India’s exclusion from the global nuclear order was unacceptable and must be corrected. That was in January 1998, a few months before India conducted its nuclear tests.

Although it was the US that did all the political heavy lifting to generate the international consensus in favour of the nuclear reconciliation with India, Paris does get some credit for thinking through the raison d’être for the nuclear deal. If the Clinton Administration began to erect international sanctions against India immediately after the May 1998 nuclear tests, Yeltsin’s Russia wavered in its support to Delhi. But France did not. Paris did do much to temper the collective great power response to Pokhran II.

But what about India’s extraordinary military relationship with Russia developed over the decades? When Prime Minister Indira Gandhi decided to diversify India’s defence ties in the early 1980s, she turned to Paris. Since then India’s defence relationship with France has steadily grown; but it is yet to reach the full potential. If and when India goes beyond the accountant’s approach to defence modernisation, the natural synergy between France’s strategic capability and the size of the Indian market would come into play.

India’s decision to buy the Mig-21 aircraft in 1961 was a political one forced down the throat of a reluctant defence establishment by Pandit Nehru. Today, with a similar commitment, Modi could begin the construction of a genuine defence industrial base in India in partnership with France.

But can France give India the special strategic assistance of the kind that Russia has delivered? Consider, for example, the Indian lease of Russian nuclear attack submarines and Moscow’s cooperation in the development of an indigenous line. France, too, builds nuclear submarines and it should not be impossible to imagine cooperation between Delhi and Paris on military nuclear propulsion and other sensitive areas.

But these types of decisions are not merely industrial or financial. They come out of shared interests and goals. What bound Russia and India together was the need to construct a regional balance of power system in Southern Asia during the second half of the 20th century.

In the changed context of the 21st, India and France have many reasons to draw closer. The prospects of even limited American retrenchment, the rise of China and its power projection into regions as far away as the South Pacific, Africa and the Mediterranean, the tightening embrace between Moscow and Beijing, the breakdown of the detente between Russia and Europe, and the turbulence in the spaces between India and France demand that Delhi and Paris pool their resources and act together.

Like with Russia and the US, India’s relationship with France can’t just be bilateral. Much in the manner that Moscow and Washington brought their other partners into their engagement with India, Paris opens the door for stronger strategic ties between India and Europe as a whole. The unfolding maritime cooperation, joint efforts to counter terrorism, and the building of the solar alliance, underline the emerging globalisation of the India-France partnership and eventually that between Delhi and Brussels.

An alliance with Paris, in pursuit of stability and security in Eurasia and the Indo-Pacific, does not mean Delhi abandons its engagement with Moscow and devalues its strategic partnership with Washington. A recalibration of India’s ties with Russia has been unfolding, slowly but surely, since the end of the Cold War. The US, on its part, can only be pleased that India and France are ready to take larger responsibilities and share the burden for maintaining regional and global order.

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Re: India-France news

Postby Neshant » 10 Mar 2018 12:23

Vips wrote:France: India's new Russia?


Lets not blow this out of proportion.

France is looking to sell very expensive jets to India and other business ventures like selling n-reactors.

Nothing more and nothing less.

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Re: India-France news

Postby Philip » 10 Mar 2018 13:15

....and more Scorpend subs!
Last edited by JayS on 10 Mar 2018 23:56, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Do we really need this kinds of comments here..? I think not.

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Re: India-France news

Postby chetak » 10 Mar 2018 13:48

Vips wrote:France: India's new Russia?

Can France replace Russia as India’s most valuable international partner? For many, this is an outlandish idea. For them, Russia’s place in India’s international relations is unique and unchanging. Some would dismiss the proposition by affirming that the United States has already replaced Russia as India’s privileged partner since the end of the Cold War.

Dig a little deeper, though, and you will discover why France has begun to loom so large in India’s geopolitical calculus. A peep into that future might be visible this weekend when the visiting French President, Emmanuel Macron, sits down with Prime Minister Narendra Modi. They already have some interesting things in store. For example, the two leaders are expected to lay out a vision for bilateral strategic coordination for the Indian Ocean and back it with measures to facilitate operational cooperation between their security forces in the littoral.

These steps are welcome and overdue. But they are just the beginning. Modi and Macron are well-placed to turn India and France into long-term partners in shaping the geopolitics of Eurasia and the Indo-Pacific. But first to our claim that France could be “India’s new Russia”. It begs the question: Why has Russia won India’s political affections for so long?

After India gained independence, it was by no means inevitable that Soviet Russia would become a lasting partner for India. It was Russia’s repeated exercise of the veto to trump the Anglo-American tilt towards Pakistan on the Kashmir dispute that laid the foundation for Delhi’s enduring faith in Moscow.

It is not that the UN or anyone else can take Kashmir away from an India that is so much stronger than in the 1950s. But it is good to have a reliable friend in the UNSC who can block unfriendly moves by other powers. France, like Russia, is a permanent member of the UNSC and has a veto.

Until recently, it was Russia alone that made an unambiguous choice between India and Pakistan in favour of the former. As Russia reaches out to Pakistan, that special position now belongs to France. For example, Paris has foregone the opportunity to sell major weapons systems to Pakistan and has focused on a strong defence partnership with India.

Delhi’s new strategic appreciation of the French connection is also rooted in India’s recent nuclear history. Twenty years ago, when he came to India to announce the strategic partnership, President Jacques Chirac argued that India’s exclusion from the global nuclear order was unacceptable and must be corrected. That was in January 1998, a few months before India conducted its nuclear tests.

Although it was the US that did all the political heavy lifting to generate the international consensus in favour of the nuclear reconciliation with India, Paris does get some credit for thinking through the raison d’être for the nuclear deal. If the Clinton Administration began to erect international sanctions against India immediately after the May 1998 nuclear tests, Yeltsin’s Russia wavered in its support to Delhi. But France did not. Paris did do much to temper the collective great power response to Pokhran II.

But what about India’s extraordinary military relationship with Russia developed over the decades? When Prime Minister Indira Gandhi decided to diversify India’s defence ties in the early 1980s, she turned to Paris. Since then India’s defence relationship with France has steadily grown; but it is yet to reach the full potential. If and when India goes beyond the accountant’s approach to defence modernisation, the natural synergy between France’s strategic capability and the size of the Indian market would come into play.

India’s decision to buy the Mig-21 aircraft in 1961 was a political one forced down the throat of a reluctant defence establishment by Pandit Nehru. Today, with a similar commitment, Modi could begin the construction of a genuine defence industrial base in India in partnership with France.

But can France give India the special strategic assistance of the kind that Russia has delivered? Consider, for example, the Indian lease of Russian nuclear attack submarines and Moscow’s cooperation in the development of an indigenous line. France, too, builds nuclear submarines and it should not be impossible to imagine cooperation between Delhi and Paris on military nuclear propulsion and other sensitive areas.

But these types of decisions are not merely industrial or financial. They come out of shared interests and goals. What bound Russia and India together was the need to construct a regional balance of power system in Southern Asia during the second half of the 20th century.

In the changed context of the 21st, India and France have many reasons to draw closer. The prospects of even limited American retrenchment, the rise of China and its power projection into regions as far away as the South Pacific, Africa and the Mediterranean, the tightening embrace between Moscow and Beijing, the breakdown of the detente between Russia and Europe, and the turbulence in the spaces between India and France demand that Delhi and Paris pool their resources and act together.

Like with Russia and the US, India’s relationship with France can’t just be bilateral. Much in the manner that Moscow and Washington brought their other partners into their engagement with India, Paris opens the door for stronger strategic ties between India and Europe as a whole. The unfolding maritime cooperation, joint efforts to counter terrorism, and the building of the solar alliance, underline the emerging globalisation of the India-France partnership and eventually that between Delhi and Brussels.

An alliance with Paris, in pursuit of stability and security in Eurasia and the Indo-Pacific, does not mean Delhi abandons its engagement with Moscow and devalues its strategic partnership with Washington. A recalibration of India’s ties with Russia has been unfolding, slowly but surely, since the end of the Cold War. The US, on its part, can only be pleased that India and France are ready to take larger responsibilities and share the burden for maintaining regional and global order.


India’s decision to buy the Mig-21 aircraft in 1961 was a political one forced down the throat of a reluctant defence establishment by Pandit Nehru.


be that as it may, we did not have any options at that stage. The brits and the amrekis were playing their own dirty games, hoping to bamboozle India into some unpleasant decisions as also to push India down some very unpleasant paths with obligations aplenty.

the way nehru panicked and went running to the US after the cheeni attack shows that the US had already given him "options" and he either had already said no or was mulling them over when the cheeni went for his throat.

I sometimes wonder if the US had some hidden hand in the cheeni decision to attack.

Nehru was never a brain, he was normally more comfortable thinking with other parts and extraneous considerations very often influenced him, to India's everlasting loss.

The malignant influence of the brits on him should never be underestimated or overlooked. In cahoots with the US and sometimes in competition, these countries acted interchangeably like a hunter and his drumbeater to drive India into their net.

Until, the soviets invited themselves to the poker game.

State department, as well as whitehall assessments of India at that time would be a revelation to read.

the frenchies worship no god but money.

Europe is not our friend, never has been and never will be. There are too many countries there that have cloaked themselves with ecclesiastical robes that are not visible to the casual Indian glance. They have a different and already predetermined drumbeat for India and their ploy of using "trade" agreements to leverage that drumbeat has really come adrift.

Are we not to learn lessons from the ltte fiasco and how it played out in srilanka, with many european dramatis personae, and dare I say, even some ugly european éminences grises.

If moscow can simply get it's supply chain disaster under control and focus on dependable customer service, a factor which by it's absence has undermined its high tech products and also the Indian market for the same.

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Re: India-France news

Postby Philip » 10 Mar 2018 17:06

Watching the show.Ties on a big-time rise.Modi said: France " closest friend".Was prev.used only for Russia!
Logistics naval agreement huge deal in the IOR.At one shot sev. locations give us full naval base facilities.
This may mean more subs, Raffys.rench eqpt., etc.France wants us to be India's " No. 1 wife", of the West, as the Chins would say! Britain and US dumped!
N- plants, 6 at Jaitapur.Indo- French relations on a roll.

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Re: India-France news

Postby nash » 10 Mar 2018 19:16

List of MoUs/Agreements signed during the State Visit of President of France to India (March 10, 2018)

http://mea.gov.in/bilateral-documents.h ... ch_10_2018

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Re: India-France news

Postby anupmisra » 10 Mar 2018 19:28

chetak wrote:^^^^^^^

In other words, the frogs, as usual, are motivated ONLY by the Indian money and how they can latch on to large loads of it.


Or, anyone's money. To be in bed with France is a transaction not a commitment. Here's how France is in bed with the pakis.

France-Pakistan cooperation: Expert favours civil-nuclear agreement

Director of premier French think tank, the Institute for International and Strategic Affairs, Dr Pascal Boniface, said France should have a civil-nuclear accord with Pakistan on the pattern of the US-India nuclear deal.
Boniface said Pakistan was a nuclear-armed nation of 200 million people and had a pivotal role to play in the strategically important part of the world.


https://tribune.com.pk/story/960511/str ... -pakistan/

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Re: India-France news

Postby anupmisra » 10 Mar 2018 22:18

India gets access to French bases in Indian and southern Pacific oceans

France and India on Saturday sealed a maritime cooperation agreement which would allow the Indian Navy ships to use France’s naval facilities in the Indian Ocean and the southern Pacific Ocean.
While France is the biggest maritime power in the Indian Ocean, with bases in Reunion and Mayotte, it also has a presence in southern Pacific, with bases in French Polynesia and New Caledonia.
“This agreement with France will send a message to China that we are preparing to expand our own presence in our own backyard, which is the Indian Ocean, as well as near the South China Sea, which is considered as China’s sphere of influence”
The logistics sharing agreement between France and India also entails trilateral naval exercises, with Australia as the third participant.
Besides France, India has similar logistics sharing agreements with the US, Singapore and most recently, Oman.


https://www.nationalheraldindia.com/int ... rn-pacific

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Re: India-France news

Postby Philip » 11 Mar 2018 04:13

One poss. unmentioned deal is for French N-tech, for reactors, not civvy ones but N-reactors for subs and surface warships.The CDG is N- powered.The IN would be very interested in an N-powered carrier for the future, N- reactors for subs too,France is helping Brazil with its N- sub programme, but since we already have access to Ru designs, perhaps looking at alternatives for the future surface fleet.I hazard a guess though that the deal for Jaitapur includes mil. reactors too.

Of course the bottom line is moolah! But the French do have a genuine great love and admiration of India for its spiritual, cultural and tolerant ethos spanning centuries.Auroville is a great example of Indo- French melding of cultural traditions and spiritual values.India's tech prowess since independence has been keenly watched and admired. An Indo- French partnership in the IOR very intriguing.A pity it has come late.We could've obtained with pleasure from both sides the 2 Mistral amphibs meant for Russia which the US forced France not to deliver, sold lock, stock and barrel to Egypt along with the full complement of KA-52 attack helos. Perhaps the new " strat relationship" will also favour the yard that has linked up with DCNS, now Naval Group for Mistrals for the Indian tender.

No guesses as to which Ind. co stands to benefit from Mistrals if chosen as it will be built in its yard! The co.also is prime beneficiary in the Raffy deal!

PS: Latest media news is no deal for extras until the first 36 arrive.Signing a deal now for extras is too "hot" as the NDA is under extensive criticism in parliament.In an election year it could be used as Bofors was .

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Re: India-France news

Postby ramana » 12 Mar 2018 22:51

Philip think of it this way.

France is negotiating for Europe with India to ensure they are not left out once Brexit and Trump start carving up spheres of influence based on English affinity.

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Re: India-France news

Postby Rudradev » 14 Mar 2018 01:05

To Ramana's point:

Not sure if anyone noticed this.

http://www.newsweek.com/us-israel-saudi ... ays-770728

January 4 2018

French President Emmanuel Macron has accused the U.S., Israel and Saudi Arabia of instigating a war as their mutual foe, Iran, was rocked by a week of protests.

Macron on Wednesday joined several other world leaders to weigh in on protests that began as demonstrations against austerity measures under Iranian President Hassan Rouhani and later spilled into isolated, deadly clashes between civilians and security forces. The French leader called for dialogue with Tehran and criticized three of his international partners for pursuing what he considered bellicose policies toward a country the trio have increasingly sought to isolate and undermine in recent years.


“The official line pursued by the United States, Israel and Saudi Arabia, who are our allies in many ways, is almost one that would lead us to war,” Macron told reporters, according to Reuters.


It was “a deliberate strategy for some,” he added.


So Macron's regime is a major departure from the Socialist govt. of Francois Hollande, a Tony-Blairesque poodle of Washington who happily went to war on America's behalf in Libya, Syria and elsewhere.

Macron, by contrast, has been advancing a France-First policy of strategic autonomy for some time. It is rare to see what we typically view as a Western-alliance government openly taking on the US, Saudi Arabia, and Israel (!) and favouring Iran, especially at a time when (during the January '18 protests) the entire transatlantic Wilsonian-globalist brigade had seized the opportunity to bash Iran on "human rights" grounds.

As further context, the EU itself is in disarray following (1) Brexit (2) Angela Merkel's open-door policy to Syrian "refugees", which has turned German politics on its head and also greatly undermined Germany's credibility as de-facto leader of the Holy European Empire (3) a populist wave in France that nearly brought Marine Le Pen to the Presidency.

All of these things have surely alerted Macron to the fact that (a) there is a resurgent nationalism brewing across Europe, especially among a large constituency in his own country, that cannot be ignored in favour of the old globalist catechisms (b) the decline of Germany opens up the opportunity to seize a predominant position for France in Europe... whether as the leader of a reformed EU, or in a post-EU continent that may very well be emerging.

And just months later we see a determined effort by Macron at reaching out to India for a strategic partnership. Very interesting.

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Re: India-France news

Postby Philip » 14 Mar 2018 10:34

Macron is also less anti- Ru than the perfidious English, for that is what Britain has shrunk too.Scotland is an independent nation on the assembly line, Welsh nationalism is gently stirring and the Irish have a power- sharing arrangement in N.Ireland/ Ulster that could come a cropper with the demand for open borders even after Brexit.

So Little Englanders are being isolated not just in Europe but in their former colonies also.The French have their own historical connections with us and like Russia are open for biz without strings, ropes and chains typical oc doing biz with the Yanquis.

There are huge opportunities to work with the French in the Francophone nations, former French colonies.India with its French links should also join the French equiv. of their Commonwealth! MEA, are you listening?

French influence in India was spread far and wide, from Chsndernagore in Bengal to Mahe , Pondicherry and Yanam.

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Re: India-France news

Postby eklavya » 24 Mar 2018 22:22

Arnaud Beltrame: France lauds policeman who swapped with hostage

Tributes are pouring in for a French police officer who died saving the lives of hostages in a supermarket siege by an Islamist gunman on Friday.

Lt-Col Arnaud Beltrame, 44, was shot and stabbed after he traded places with one of the captives following a shooting spree in southern France.

Flags are being flown at half-mast at gendarmerie bases across France.

His brother Cedric said Col Arnaud "didn't have a chance", adding that his actions were "beyond the call of duty".

"He gave his life for strangers. He must have known that he didn't really have a chance. If that doesn't make him a hero, I don't know what would," Col Arnaud's brother Cedric told a French radio station on Saturday.

Speaking to the BBC, Col Arnaud's cousin Florence Nicolic described the officer as a person who was "so good at his job".

"Even though we were surprised and shocked when we heard what happened we were not surprised in the sense that that's the thing he would do without hesitation," Ms Nicolic said.

French President Emmanuel Macron also paid tribute to the officer, saying that Col Arnaud "fell as a hero" after showing "exceptional courage and selflessness", adding that he deserved "the respect and admiration of the whole nation".

UK PM Theresa May said the "sacrifice and courage" of the police officer would not be forgotten.

His actions helped bring an end to the siege that left three people dead.

The radical Islamist gunman, 25-year-old Redouane Lakdim, was eventually shot and killed by police.

Sixteen people were injured, two seriously, in what Mr Macron called an act of "Islamist terrorism".


RIP brave soul.

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Re: India-France news

Postby Neshant » 24 Mar 2018 22:33

One thing about France that is not kosher is they spearheaded the invasion of Libya to grab that country's assets along with a band of EU thieves.

India should be cautious with any tie ups that do not represent our values.

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Re: India-France news

Postby Viv S » 24 Mar 2018 22:52

Rudradev wrote:So Macron's regime is a major departure from the Socialist govt. of Francois Hollande, a Tony-Blairesque poodle of Washington who happily went to war on America's behalf in Libya, Syria and elsewhere.

You’ve got that backwards. The Libyan operation was championed by the (Republican/UMP) Sarkozy and Cameron, as a proving ground for a new UK-France strategic initiative, with Obama reluctantly coming along, all while being harangued by his domestic critics for his policy of “leading from behind”. Even during the Iran negotiations, the US was more conciliatory than the French, hoping to have a deal wrapped up and packaged as a FP success before election season began.

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Re: India-France news

Postby Viv S » 24 Mar 2018 23:01

Philip wrote:One poss. unmentioned deal is for French N-tech, for reactors, not civvy ones but N-reactors for subs and surface warships.The CDG is N- powered.The IN would be very interested in an N-powered carrier for the future, N- reactors for subs too,France is helping Brazil with its N- sub programme, but since we already have access to Ru designs, perhaps looking at alternatives for the future surface fleet.I hazard a guess though that the deal for Jaitapur includes mil. reactors too.

The French are providing Brazil support ONLY with the non-nuclear sections of its SSN project. The same is true for India i.e. the Arihant class’s reactors are entirely indigenous.

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Re: India-France news

Postby Rudradev » 25 Mar 2018 09:29

Viv S wrote:
Rudradev wrote:So Macron's regime is a major departure from the Socialist govt. of Francois Hollande, a Tony-Blairesque poodle of Washington who happily went to war on America's behalf in Libya, Syria and elsewhere.

You’ve got that backwards. The Libyan operation was championed by the (Republican/UMP) Sarkozy and Cameron, as a proving ground for a new UK-France strategic initiative, with Obama reluctantly coming along, all while being harangued by his domestic critics for his policy of “leading from behind”. Even during the Iran negotiations, the US was more conciliatory than the French, hoping to have a deal wrapped up and packaged as a FP success before election season began.


Not quite.

Since the retirement of Chirac in 2007, the two principal political parties in France (the UMP, later renamed "Republicans", and the Socialists) have been virtually 6-of-one, half-dozen-of-the-other in terms of major foreign policy initiatives. Much like the Clintonista Wilsonian Democrats and Bush-era Neocon Republicans, their aims were indistinguishable and only the specifics of their preferred modes of intervention were at all different.

So similar were they in many ways that both Republican and Socialist candidates were rejected in last year's elections by an exasperated French polity... leaving the field clear for relative outsiders Macron (with his brand new En Marche party) and Marine Le Pen of Front Nacionale.

Sarkozy may have begun the Libya business but Hollande was involved with the Syria machinations since the beginning of his term in 2012. The fact remains that Macron represents a policy departure from what either of the old guard parties were following (poodledom).

Meanwhile it is tiresome to read the same old excuses being trotted out regarding poor reluctant Obama going along for the ride. When America had a President who actually took responsibility for foreign policy, the UK and France were told where to get off... by the Eisenhower White House during the Suez Crisis, for example. Obama was content to let the Clintonista State Dept formulate a viciously interventonist foreign policy that he never paid enough attention to, and (in the event) was made to look like an indecisive bumbler when he failed to back up a Syria redline he had previously declared while never quite believing in it. He ended up in the embarrassing position of a post-Parakram Vajpayee. Surely he shares some of the blame for that.

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Re: India-France news

Postby RoyG » 26 Mar 2018 09:40

Neshant wrote:One thing about France that is not kosher is they spearheaded the invasion of Libya to grab that country's assets along with a band of EU thieves.

India should be cautious with any tie ups that do not represent our values.


This is how the world works. We are like this also.

France can't pull this sh*t with us so they are happy taking our $.

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Re: India-France news

Postby Neshant » 26 Mar 2018 10:18

RoyG wrote:
Neshant wrote:One thing about France that is not kosher is they spearheaded the invasion of Libya to grab that country's assets along with a band of EU thieves.

India should be cautious with any tie ups that do not represent our values.


This is how the world works. We are like this also.

France can't pull this sh*t with us so they are happy taking our $.


No we are not like that.
We did not go rob Iraq nor Libya for riches.
That's they way THEY work, not us.
That's why we have to be careful who we are signing up as friends.

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Re: India-France news

Postby Kashi » 26 Mar 2018 11:30

Neshant wrote:No we are not like that.
We did not go rob Iraq nor Libya for riches.
That's they way THEY work, not us.
That's why we have to be careful who we are signing up as friends.


All our so-called friends and potential friends WORK exactly like that. They have WORKED like that in the past and they continue to do so now. For those who don't anymore, it's truly difficult to say why, apart from the fact that they lack the means of doing so, regardless of whether they want to or not.

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Re: India-France news

Postby eklavya » 26 Mar 2018 19:34

Philip wrote:Macron is also less anti- Ru than the perfidious English .....


La France va expulser quatre diplomates russes « dans un délai d’une semaine », a fait savoir le Quai d’Orsay. De son côté, l’Allemagne va également en expulser quatre, a précisé le ministère des affaires étrangères allemand. « Nous avons expulsé aujourd’hui quatre diplomates russes. Car la Russie n’a toujours pas contribué à éclaircir l’empoisonnement de Salisbury » a-t-il ajouté.


http://www.lemonde.fr/international/art ... qw7UbZD.99

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Re: India-France news

Postby chetak » 26 Mar 2018 20:15

Viv S wrote:
Philip wrote:One poss. unmentioned deal is for French N-tech, for reactors, not civvy ones but N-reactors for subs and surface warships.The CDG is N- powered.The IN would be very interested in an N-powered carrier for the future, N- reactors for subs too,France is helping Brazil with its N- sub programme, but since we already have access to Ru designs, perhaps looking at alternatives for the future surface fleet.I hazard a guess though that the deal for Jaitapur includes mil. reactors too.

The French are providing Brazil support ONLY with the non-nuclear sections of its SSN project. The same is true for India i.e. the Arihant class’s reactors are entirely indigenous.


The frenchies were in the forefront of the anti nuke protests at Kudankulam, run by dark anti India forces. Indian intelligence has irrefutable proof of their shenanigans as well as the identities of the dramatis personae.

Russia was very very angry at the turn of events at Kudankulam and vowed to retaliate, against the frenchies in particular.

They have also shown great interest in the Jaitapur project, which is why the frenchies are in a panic as well as in over drive.

Interesting to see how things unfold in the days ahead.

Any previous discussions with the frenchies regarding Jaitapur would be completely muddied due to ownership changes in the original frenchy primary contractors who, IIRC, went bust. They are now a weak consortium, risen again but a pale copy of the original.

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Re: India-France news

Postby Philip » 29 Mar 2018 19:53

Tx for the update.With KKNPP going ahead smoothly with the future 3 reactors, 6 I think totally, weak attempts at resuming protests are being revived by firang interests .However, the GOI is now well aware of the games being played and the high cost of both western reactors as well as electricity produced is dawning upon the govt. as an unsustainable cost to the consumer.With ghe govt's major push towards an Electric India with e- cars, etc., the OEM who can provide us with cost- effdctive plants will score.


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