OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby yensoy » 04 Jul 2018 17:50

pankajs wrote:That is to say China wants India to fund the demographic subjugation of Uyghur and Tibetian locals.


This is an EXCELLENT point! Sinkiang and Tibet are hostile to the extreme, and only the allure of big money can now draw (or in fact retain) the Han populace.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby chetak » 04 Jul 2018 18:31

pankajs wrote:This has been know on this forum from quite a while back. A little thinking was all that was needed.

Ananth Krishnan @ananthkrishnan

India, and not Nepal, may be the real objective of China's Trans-Himalayan railway https://www.indiatoday.in/magazine/up-f ... 2018-06-30 … via @indiatoday

Same is true for CPEC. All the talk of connecting with West Ayesha and beyond is an after through. The real objective was always to get connected to the Indian market via Bakistan.

BTW, notice if we allow CPEC and Trans-Himalayan railways access to the Indian market we will be "helping" China to solidify its control over Xinjiang and Tibet.

Why do I say that?

The Chinese weapon of choice is flooding the region with ethnic Han and overwhelm the locals. BUT such a migration is more readily achieved with economic opportunity than subsidy which is a cost to the state. What if that cost could be offloaded to someone else? Access to the Indian market will provide the "migrant" Han's the economic incentive to shift en-mass to these regions without subsidy.

That is to say China wants India to fund the demographic subjugation of Uyghur and Tibetian locals.


If you notice some of the han maps depicting the BRI/OBOR/CPEC, they are approaching India from various directions including srilanka, beediland and nepal and all initiatives seem to have the same objective. Entry into India is a paramount objective for them.

Initially, they were hoping to leverage the economic ties that India had with each of these countries to piggyback their way into India but the high profile, public and repeated refusal by India to accommodate the hans has left these countries very wary of angering India and thus finding themselves on the wrong side of a strong and nationalist Indian govt.

Their earlier somewhat contempt tinged dealings with India has given way to a much toned down as well as a wary approach to their bilaterals with India.

The open courting of India by the amerikis, big EU countries, japan, australia, russia, etc as well as many of the cash rich gulf countries has left them nonplussed as well as disconcerted.

If India, without any military alliances, can openly confront china then these so called neighbors would be merely roadkill as the Modi juggernaut pushes ahead.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby pankajs » 04 Jul 2018 18:41

^
When I read your prior post I was going to write a version of the last 2 para of this post of yours.

One way to read the many messages/signals coming out by Beijing is their realization, nit new but much stronger than before, that US+India+Japan can prove to be a formidable combination and not just militarily.

US/Japan are still the top dogs as far as cutting edge industrial and military tech. What if these countries helped India leapfrog into the league of China just by being open to tech transfer for a price of course. China has benefited a lot from tech. transfers form US and Japan in the past and hence it knows what that can do for India. Where this to happen just at the industrial level it will help balance China and its expanding influence.

Its is a different matter if the US and Japan will oblige India now or that India will be able to make the most of such an opportunity but just the prospect if that happening will create disquiet in Beijing.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby chetak » 04 Jul 2018 18:58

pankajs wrote:^
When I read your prior post I was going to write a version of the last 2 para of this post of yours.

One way to read the many messages/signals coming out by Beijing is their realization, nit new but much stronger than before, that US+India+Japan can prove to be a formidable combination and not just militarily.

US/Japan are still the top dogs as far as cutting edge industrial and military tech. What if these countries helped India leapfrog into the league of China just by being open to tech transfer for a price of course. China has benefited a lot from tech. transfers form US and Japan in the past and hence it knows what that can do for India. Where this to happen just at the industrial level it will help balance China and its expanding influence.

Its is a different matter if the US and Japan will oblige India now or that India will be able to make the most of such an opportunity but just the prospect if that happening will create disquiet in Beijing.


One is too pacifist and the other too egotist to actively aid in India's rise.

Besides would you sharpen the sword that will one day strike you down economically??

Both are capitalist and are fully prepared to ride the rising Indian markets as well as the abundant opportunity to invest and make money and both seem very focused on the ever increasing tribe of the Indian middle class and its imagined capacity to spend.

Its the low risk, high return play that both have chosen and so far, it is paying off well for them. Unlike the britshits and the EU, still trying to come to terms with the new India and mired in the colonial mindset.

It is the very same low risk, high return play that also governs their military ties with India. Neither of the two is going to gift you with any military assets just because they have the need for you.

Contrast this with the way that both of these countries have treated and continue to treat the pakis.

As with vassals, they both expect their vassals to fight for their cause, vassals who are expected to bring their own dogs to the fight, dogs who are well fed, trained and obedient.

The japs are no less in the belief of their own superiority, no less than the amerikis or the hans.

Whereas India has been seen as a vassal state for centuries now, by the muslims as well as the europeans, hans, japs, muslims and the russians.

High tech is certainly not on their bucket list of things on offer to India.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby TKiran » 04 Jul 2018 20:16

It's bullshit theory propagated by DDM that China is eyeing Indian market through Nepal. ODOR is a geopolitical strategy by Han, with or without India.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby chetak » 04 Jul 2018 21:22

TKiran wrote:It's bullshit theory propagated by DDM that China is eyeing Indian market through Nepal. ODOR is a geopolitical strategy by Han, with or without India.


That's just not the whole story.

Apart from many other things, they are also now eying the Indian market access without reciprocity, and by shady access via India's bordering countries so as to make this part of the OBOR more viable for them. It is a late realization for the hans who now see almost nil returns from the pakis, beedis and nepalis and most of the "goods" flowing to and from gwadar are going to be chinese anyway. Are the hans going to tax their own goods and pay themselves??

Without India, they have a lot of deadbeat muslim countries to carry on their backs for very meager returns.

India already has a very adverse BOP with the chinese.

Indian baboo(n)s are very happy with the chinese because they pay premium bribes and also many Indians, to make a quick buck, smuggle large amounts of chinese goods, in thousands upon thousands of mislabelled containers via the gulf and through Indian ports.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby TKiran » 04 Jul 2018 21:29

Chetak sir, your statement is contradictory, if China is already flooding Indian market with containers, there's no need for trans-himalayan railway, they are already there via sea route.

This article is mainly aimed at people like pankajs whose chest will swell with pride, if anyone says, India is a large market, and China is desperate to enter India via trans-himalayan railway.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby chetak » 04 Jul 2018 21:38

TKiran wrote:Chetak sir, your statement is contradictory, if China is already flooding Indian market with containers, there's no need for trans-himalayan railway, they are already there via sea route.

This article is mainly aimed at people like pankajs whose chest will swell with pride, if anyone says, India is a large market, and China is desperate to enter India via trans-himalayan railway.


what is coming in now is only a small part of what they want to send in.

Check any burma bazzar in India and see the cheap and shoddy goods being sold there. Indian foot paths are flooded with the same stuff.

I wouldn't be complaining if it were things like machine tools at being sold at competitive rates but far from it, it is all junk for which we have paid in dollars, mostly hawala dollars.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby TKiran » 04 Jul 2018 21:48

Chetak sir, again you are saying that China is already flooding Indian market. Tell me which is more economical "trade through sea" or trade through "trans-himalayan railway"?

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby yensoy » 04 Jul 2018 21:54

TKiran wrote:It's bullshit theory propagated by DDM that China is eyeing Indian market through Nepal. ODOR is a geopolitical strategy by Han, with or without India.


You are completely wrong. It is not DDM theory. Go read it at Global Times which is eleven's mouthpiece, for instance this article http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1108025.shtml currently on the front page. China is openly trying to manipulate our smaller neighbours as go-betweens to reach our markets. They need to be reminded that besides a long land border, we also have a decent coast and ports, so they can deal with us directly.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby pankajs » 04 Jul 2018 22:01

TKiran wrote:Chetak sir, your statement is contradictory, if China is already flooding Indian market with containers, there's no need for trans-himalayan railway, they are already there via sea route.

This article is mainly aimed at people like pankajs whose chest will swell with pride, if anyone says, India is a large market, and China is desperate to enter India via trans-himalayan railway.

My chest swells with pride on India but yours on Xina?

1. If you had read the article quoted it was quoting a Nepali Journo for that line.
2. Xina itself has been begging India to join OBOR. If it was not for Xina's benefit why are they so pushy?
3. Trans-Himalayan for goods from Tibet/Xinjian to India for shortest and cheapest access to market. India is closer to Tibet than Chinese eastern population center. You don't even read full post.

Please do some basic cross check before shooting the messenger. Why do you do this to yourself every-time. Remember you last post where you tried a colossal con job or do you want me to refresh your memory?
Last edited by pankajs on 04 Jul 2018 22:16, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby pankajs » 04 Jul 2018 22:03

yensoy wrote:
TKiran wrote:It's bullshit theory propagated by DDM that China is eyeing Indian market through Nepal. ODOR is a geopolitical strategy by Han, with or without India.


You are completely wrong. It is not DDM theory. Go read it at Global Times which is eleven's mouthpiece, for instance this article http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1108025.shtml currently on the front page. China is openly trying to manipulate our smaller neighbours as go-betweens to reach our markets. They need to be reminded that besides a long land border, we also have a decent coast and ports, so they can deal with us directly.

You have to understand TKiran's mindset and for that you have to follow all his posts from the beginning.

Just as a sample please read his last post on the main Chinese thread. Pure and transparent spin. China is gleat .... China is gleat ... India has no chance ... Xina is gleat. That has been his whole message on this board.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby chanakyaa » 04 Jul 2018 22:05

chetak wrote:
That's just not the whole story.

Apart from many other things, they are also now eying the Indian market access without reciprocity, and by shady access via India's bordering countries so as to make this part of the OBOR more viable for them. It is a late realization for the hans who now see almost nil returns from the pakis, beedis and nepalis and most of the "goods" flowing to and from gwadar are going to be chinese anyway. Are the hans going to tax their own goods and pay themselves??

Without India, they have a lot of deadbeat muslim countries to carry on their backs for very meager returns.

India already has a very adverse BOP with the chinese.

Indian baboo(n)s are very happy with the chinese because they pay premium bribes and also many Indians, to make a quick buck, smuggle large amounts of chinese goods, in thousands upon thousands of mislabelled containers via the gulf and through Indian ports.

+108

Those who have access to Netflix series Rotten, watch Chinese Honeygate scandal to see how honey was flooded into the western markets using multiple countries. Don’t mean to draw parallel between honey and broad commercial activities, but one simple example.

Disclaimer: i’ve Not independently verified the honeygate scandle (too much going on in life to deeply study every subject) so my views may be biased due to using this series as the only source for the subject.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby pankajs » 04 Jul 2018 22:09

TKiran wrote:Chetak sir, again you are saying that China is already flooding Indian market. Tell me which is more economical "trade through sea" or trade through "trans-himalayan railway"?

Let me try that .....

1. Hope you realize that Tibet is bery bery faar from the Chinese coast. Tibet to the eastern sea board on Railway. Hence on ship to India.
2. Tibet to India on Railway

Which is cheaper saaru? You never fail to entertain me. Pleeze do kalkulate and let us know.

Added later: So much entertainment .. Sheesh! I nearly forgot why I had logged in now ... Off to the China Mil thread.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby pankajs » 04 Jul 2018 23:58

Financial Times @FinancialTimes

Malaysia suspends $22bn China-backed projectshttps://on.ft.com/2Kz6wht

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby chetak » 05 Jul 2018 01:16

He says that the paki army was unable to provide CPEC security in balochistan.

Is the paki army incompetent or simply overwhelmed by the baluch??



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bc3awmN_n2I

we have no friends |now next is black list | we cant fool world


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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby anupmisra » 05 Jul 2018 02:04

chetak wrote:Is the paki army incompetent or simply overwhelmed by the baluch??


Both.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby chetak » 05 Jul 2018 02:21

anupmisra wrote:
chetak wrote:Is the paki army incompetent or simply overwhelmed by the baluch??


Both.


In return, the pakis as a country got bushwhacked by the hans in the FATF grey listings. It is a bitter lesson for the pakis to be learning from the hans, their "taller than the mountains, deeper than the valleys and sweeter than honey" friends.

Well and truly buggered.

Next stop is the black list which the hans may not allow their partner in crime to be honored with.

On their own, the hans may not be willing to invest much more in a FATF blacklisted pakiland, especially with all the others boycotting the pakis so that the entire momin burden falls on the hans.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby Philip » 05 Jul 2018 10:42

Even China is now on amber signal reg. its mega masterplan of OBOR due to the debt trap that client states are falling into, unable to repay heavy loans and not always " recoverable".Its own banks are concerned.Therefore with the current trade war simmering led by the squaking duck called Donald, China has to conserve much of its resources for its own core programmes. It cannot bankroll a multitude of smaller nations whose own economies are in poor shape and may even have to write off some of its bad loans.I expect a considerable slowdown in the progress of OBOR and as in the case of Pak and Afghanistan exacerbated by internal conflict.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby dinesha » 05 Jul 2018 16:47

Malaysia's Belt and Road railway project suspended
https://www.straitstimes.com/asia/se-as ... -suspended

Malaysia suspends $US22 billion in China-backed projects
https://www.afr.com/news/world/malaysia ... 705-h12afh

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby dinesha » 05 Jul 2018 16:50

Myanmar will ask China to downsize project, minister says
https://asia.nikkei.com/Politics/Myanma ... ister-says
"lessons that we learned from our neighboring countries, that overinvestment is not good sometimes."

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby Aditya_V » 05 Jul 2018 16:52

The Chinese Don't seem to have the Miltary- political power the US had to enforce its Debt. So Debtors can shaft them when they want. Lets now see everyone from Pakistan to Sri Lanka to start defaulting on Chinese Debt.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby pankajs » 05 Jul 2018 18:05

For TKiran. Sujeev Shakya is certainly not DDM nor is the Nepalese PM. Ideally this post should have been in the Nepal thread.

https://www.thehindu.com/opinion/op-ed/ ... 333421.ece
Freedom from being ‘India-locked’: on Nepal-India relations [By Sujeev Shakya - Sujeev Shakya is the author of ‘Unleashing Nepal’ and Secretary General of the Himalayan Consensus Institute]
With India opting out of the BRI, Nepal continues to remain the best conduit for Indian markets for China. Mr. Oli understands this well and has played his cards accordingly.


Now that point is made, here comes the Nepalese spin
Therefore, now the onus is on India to rethink on a long-term basis how to recalibrate its relationship with Nepal. Nepal is a place of opportunity for people from the border towns of India. The impact of the Nepal blockade in Indian border towns was so intense that it forced Indian traders to tap their own channels to end it. The perspective has to change in New Delhi to factor in Nepal’s concerns on the open border.

India needs to also realise the new reality that its monopoly over geopolitics in Nepal is over, and there is another relationship that Nepal is nurturing. This comes at a time when there is a sense of hope among the Nepali people, who are experiencing a semblance of political stability after years of insurgency and then of political transition. It is time for India to be proactive and redefine its engagement rather than continue to be reactive. The way India has been flexible with the Eminent Persons Group (EPG) meetings is a good signal. India needs to continue to understand that there is another opportunity to rewrite bilateral and geopolitical history. It should not be squandered.

Basically Nepal wants a free pass from India by flashing the China card. We must let them re-route their trade through China.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby yensoy » 05 Jul 2018 18:28

pankajs wrote:Basically Nepal wants a free pass from India by flashing the China card. We must let them re-route their trade through China.


Any further negotiation with Nepal should only happen with the removal of Freedom of Movement within a time frame. It cannot happen overnight without violence - there are Indian traders in Nepal, and Nepali workers, including soldiers, in India. Basically the free movement has to be replaced with long term visas, with the accompanying paperwork and scrutiny. We need a well thought out and executed plan like the border rationalization plan with BD.

This should have been done yesterday, since Nepal has on-arrival visas for Pakistan and it doesn't take a genius to figure out the kind of havoc which is being played across the border.

They want respect? Fair enough, they should have it. They need to give up special privileges we have given them.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby pankajs » 05 Jul 2018 19:24

Velvet glove and Iron first.

1. Velvet glove i.e. Free movement of people on producing Passport/Visa Nepalese ID card followed by Registration and Bio-metrics at the border. Doesn't disrupt the cross-border ties. Just streamlines entry and exits. Same would apply to Indian citizens when they cross over to Nepal. Fair to both sides.

2. Iron first i.e. No free movement of goods but proper import/export mechanism setup at the border. That will take care of the Nepal as a conduit for Chinese dumping of goods, the main goal of the Trans-Himalayan railways. This is after-all the game Mr. Oli and China are after.

People to people contact will not be affected but the goods flow can be regulated. That is good enough as a start. In 20-30 years time frame we can shift to a Passport/Visa regime.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby yensoy » 05 Jul 2018 21:52

pankajs wrote:Velvet glove and Iron first.
...
People to people contact will not be affected but the goods flow can be regulated. That is good enough as a start. In 20-30 years time frame we can shift to a Passport/Visa regime.


Very correct, there is no hurry to get there but the rule book needs to be read now, and the yellow card shown in 10 years time (earlier if the administration gets hostile).

However we need a credible border between the countries. It looks to me that there really isn't any physical demarcation or barriers between the countries. I may be wrong and hope I am wrong here.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby chetak » 05 Jul 2018 23:19

yensoy wrote:
pankajs wrote:Velvet glove and Iron first.
...
People to people contact will not be affected but the goods flow can be regulated. That is good enough as a start. In 20-30 years time frame we can shift to a Passport/Visa regime.


Very correct, there is no hurry to get there but the rule book needs to be read now, and the yellow card shown in 10 years time (earlier if the administration gets hostile).

However we need a credible border between the countries. It looks to me that there really isn't any physical demarcation or barriers between the countries. I may be wrong and hope I am wrong here.


We need credible and strict border controls.

The commies in nepal will aid and abet the chinese in their efforts to penetrate into India. Oli is just a catspaw. People to people contacts cannot be at the cost of our national security.

It is not always possible to distinguish between an ethinic nepali from some chinese people. With an open border system, it will become a security hazard for us because some of these hans will easily enter and may settle illegally in India and kolkata may become one place of refuge for them before they acclimatize and spread out just like the beedis do.

What happens if they head for the northeast and aurnachal in larger numbers??

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby pankajs » 05 Jul 2018 23:27

^
You must read my prior the post in full.

Nepalese ID + Registration @ Border + Aadhar like Biometric. After that free movement within India to the Nepalese just like now. Once anyone entering from Nepal is tagged and slotted it would be easy to track them back to the border entry point.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby pankajs » 05 Jul 2018 23:33

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/wor ... 872543.cms
China pledges more 'selfless' loans to Sri Lanka

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby chetak » 11 Jul 2018 09:48

TKiran wrote:It's bullshit theory propagated by DDM that China is eyeing Indian market through Nepal. ODOR is a geopolitical strategy by Han, with or without India.


Farmers hit by slump in pepper prices


If SL can push through 2500 tons of vietnamese pepper into India under some bullshit trade agreement that is obviously devoid of economic safeguards for India, then just imagine what the hans will do to India via nepal, beediland and SL, or even via pakiland, if we were so foolish to sign on to the OBOR/BRI/CPEC.

The hans are much more venal than even the SLs.

Farmers hit by slump in pepper prices

Farmers hit by slump in pepper prices

E. M. Manoj KALPETTA, JULY 10

‘Cheaper imports from Vietnam, via Sri Lanka, benefiting from duty pacts; southern producers in a fix’

A sharp fall in the price of black pepper, coupled with low production of the spice, has put farmers in Kerala, Tamil Nadu and Karnataka — the three major pepper producing States in the country — in a fix.

Black pepper prices crashed from ₹760 a kg in 2017 to ₹600 a kg and then to ₹500 a kg. The spot price of pepper in Wayanad, a major pepper-producing region in Kerala, on Tuesday, was ₹300-₹310 as against ₹500 during the corresponding period last year, said M.C. Abdu of Ideal Spices, a pepper dealer in Wayanad.

“The influx of imported pepper from Vietnam via Sri Lanka was the major reason for the fall in prices in the Indian market,” Mr. Abdu said.

The cheaper pepper from Vietnam continues to flood the market through Sri Lanka, aided by a low-duty structure under South Asian Free Trade Area (SAFTA) pact and Indo-Sri Lanka Free Trade Agreement (ISFTA).

Under ISFTA, India could import 2,500 tonnes of pepper a year from Sri Lanka without duty, and above the quota, a duty of 8% would be imposed as per the SAFTA, Mr. Abdu said. But direct pepper imports from Vietnam attract a duty of 52% under the ASEAN trade agreement.

According to data with the Spices Board, the total production of pepper in the country during the last fiscal was about 55,000 tonnes, including 20,000 tonnes from Kerala, 10,000 tonnes from Tamil Nadu, and the remaining from Karnataka.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby yensoy » 11 Jul 2018 10:36

chetak wrote:The hans are much more venal than even the SLs.


I am sure if you dig deep into this, you will find some venal Indian sitting in a one room office in Colombo making the trade. :rotfl: We are like that only...

Clearly we need foolproof safeguards.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby chetak » 11 Jul 2018 17:57

yensoy wrote:
chetak wrote:The hans are much more venal than even the SLs.


I am sure if you dig deep into this, you will find some venal Indian sitting in a one room office in Colombo making the trade. :rotfl: We are like that only...

Clearly we need foolproof safeguards.


The SAARC region trade agreements sees India as the huge target market and everybody is allowed to pile on.

We must quickly execute a trump like manoeuvre to make sure that trade is equally balanced and no charitable rubbish is contaminating such agreements. Anyone becoming part of OBOR/BRI/CPEC should be delinked from the SAARC trade agreements with India and be dealt with in an exclusive bilateral trade agreement with India.

All movements of people including media personnel should be controlled by India thru a case by case short term visa issue regime.

aman ki tamasha type of ISI initiatives should be cornholed and junked. We seem to be suckers for such blatant nonsense.

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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby Neshant » 12 Jul 2018 13:32

chetak wrote:
The SAARC region trade agreements sees India as the huge target market and everybody is allowed to pile on.

We must quickly execute a trump like manoeuvre to make sure that trade is equally balanced and no charitable rubbish is contaminating such agreements. Anyone becoming part of OBOR/BRI/CPEC should be delinked from the SAARC trade agreements with India and be dealt with in an exclusive bilateral trade agreement with India.

All movements of people including media personnel should be controlled by India thru a case by case short term visa issue regime.

aman ki tamasha type of ISI initiatives should be cornholed and junked. We seem to be suckers for such blatant nonsense.



+100%

There should be no "free" access to our markets - especially with regards to goods that China is trying to trans-ship through whatever country to dump on India.

But when 40,000+ Rohingyas from Myanmar can simply waltz in and settle in J&K of all places, it makes one wonder what border policing exists to begin with.

Neshant
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Posts: 4362
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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby Neshant » 15 Jul 2018 06:31



At the SCO meeting, India did not back China's OBOR project because it goes through Indian territory of Gilgit & Baltistan.

To be clear, India attended an SCO meeting.

India did not attend an OBOR endorsement meeting.


SCO and OBOR are 2 separate things - even though China is trying to make it sound like one and the same.

SCO is a grouping of countries looking for common interests - which India supports.

The other (OBOR) is a specific China led project violating India's sovereignty - which India does not support.

chetak
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Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby chetak » 15 Jul 2018 21:18

Neshant wrote:


At the SCO meeting, India did not back China's OBOR project because it goes through Indian territory of Gilgit & Baltistan.

To be clear, India attended an SCO meeting.

India did not attend an OBOR endorsement meeting.


SCO and OBOR are 2 separate things - even though China is trying to make it sound like one and the same.

SCO is a grouping of countries looking for common interests - which India supports.

The other (OBOR) is a specific China led project violating India's sovereignty - which India does not support.


Whatever the grouping or the forum, china never loses focus of its core interests. OBOR is a world wide military initiative and strategy, a wolf in sheep's clothing as it were, and its cleverly couched in benign economic and goodwill terms so as to allay the local country fears before the steel trap springs shut and the new prey is trapped and the dragon begins to devour and engulf once again the newest victim.

Ask SL, nepal, pakis and a few others if you don't believe this.

Also, its intention to interfere and enter the cashmere issue is a very long standing one and we may ignore it at our peril. Among other things, our missile programs in particular have complicated life for them and honestly, do we even need these long range delivery systems, if at some level, we were not long aware of chinese intentions??

With china nothing is separate, its all one big smorgasbord, an interlinked web of deceit aimed at world domination and ultimately chinese primacy, seen in the totality of economic, military, cultural, strategic and finally, an unassailable civilizational dominance.

Its a long term goal and they are working to a longstanding plan.

chetak
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Posts: 16965
Joined: 16 May 2008 12:00

Re: OBOR, Chinese Strategy and Implications

Postby chetak » 15 Jul 2018 22:08

chetak wrote:
Neshant wrote:
At the SCO meeting, India did not back China's OBOR project because it goes through Indian territory of Gilgit & Baltistan.

To be clear, India attended an SCO meeting.

India did not attend an OBOR endorsement meeting.


SCO and OBOR are 2 separate things - even though China is trying to make it sound like one and the same.

SCO is a grouping of countries looking for common interests - which India supports.

The other (OBOR) is a specific China led project violating India's sovereignty - which India does not support.


Neshant ji,

Whatever the grouping or the forum, china never loses focus of its core interests. OBOR is a world wide military initiative and strategy, a wolf in sheep's clothing as it were, and its cleverly couched in benign economic and goodwill terms so as to allay the local country fears before the steel trap springs shut and the new prey is trapped and the dragon begins to devour and engulf once again the newest victim.

Ask SL, nepal, pakis and a few others in africa and central asia if you don't believe this.

Also, its intention to interfere and enter the cashmere issue is a very long standing one and we may ignore it at our peril. Among other things, our missile programs in particular have complicated life for them and honestly, do we even need these long range delivery systems, unless, if at some high level, we were not already long aware of the multifarious evil chinese intentions??

With china nothing is separate, its all one big smorgasbord, an interlinked web of deceit aimed at world domination and ultimately chinese primacy, seen in the totality of economic, military, cultural, strategic implications and objectives, total control over global resources markets, geography and polity leading finally to an unassailable civilizational dominance.

Its a long term goal and they are working to a longstanding plan.

The ameriki trade war is not merely a grumpy trump generated simplistic play. It has wider connotations and a well thought out end game. It may well be the first counter move in the new Great game.

It's one way to try and sink the OBOR initiative by strangulating the chinese economy and also reap some dividends in the SCS by forcing the hans to divert some of their attention and attend to their more urgent and pressing internal difficulties if things go according to the ameriki plan.


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