Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

krithivas · Post by **krithivas** » 02 May 2018 22:23

The Russian solution is perfectly appropriate for economic terrorism.

IndraD wrote:Political Asylum In Mind, Nirav Modi Solicits British Law Firms: Sources NDTV https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/politic ... es-1845612

NEW DELHI: To avoid returning to India, where he is wanted for an 11,000-crore bank scam, Nirav Modi is attempting to hire a lawyer who can help him get political asylum in the UK. Nirav Modi, who flew out of India on January 1, days before the CBI registered a case against him, is believed to be in New York.

The billionaire designer, who is accused of defrauding the state-run Punjab National Bank (PNB), has approached at least two firms in the United Kingdom, sources have told NDTV.

One of them is Boutique Law, a firm linked to Indian-origin lawyer Anand Doobay who specialises in criminal and regulatory matters including fraud, extradition and money laundering. The other company whose services Nirav Modi is learnt to have sought is Mishcon De Reya. Queries sent by NDTV to both these firms went unanswered.

Anand Doobay is among the lawyers that is part of the panel that works with another wanted businessman Vijjay Mallya, who is already a resident in the UK.

Legal experts say the UK is a preferred destination for seeking asylum because of its fair legal system which gives considerable weightage to human rights.

Nirav Modi has apparently sought asylum on the grounds that he faces political persecution in India. India has a poor record of extradition cases filed in courts in the UK -- failing most recently in cricket bookie Sanjeev Chawla and Navy war room-accused Ravi Shankaran's cases.

The Central Bureau of Investigation (CBI) when contacted by NDTV said it had no information of Nirav Modi's latest move. "We have a diffusion notice out with the Interpol which means that if he moves internationally, they will inform us,'' said a CBI spokesperson.

Sources say the billionaire went from India to the UAE, then to Hong Kong and London. He left the UK a couple of months ago and is now believed to be in New York. He is reportedly still travelling on his Indian passport that was cancelled by the government in February.

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 03 May 2018 16:24

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/wor ... 004180.cms
Highly skilled South Asian migrants say they are UK’s new Windrush scandal;
UK is denying ILR (permamnet residency) to many Indians who had tier 1 visa from 2010. Reason quoted by home office is improper tax returns filed but bracketing them under draconinan laws applicable to terrorists & serious criminal offenders paving path for their deportation.

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 03 May 2018 16:27

Deportation targets for Indians, Pakistanis reason for UK home minister's resignation? https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/wor ... 969992.cms

Rudd has been forced to quit after weeks of criticism of the British government's treatment of long-term migrants from the Caribbean, known as the Windrush generation. They were threatened with deportation and some were even denied medical treatment because they didn't have documents to prove that they had been living in the UK for decades.
But ironically, and perhaps unfairly, for Rudd, leaked documents also indicate that the policy of forced removal of illegal immigrants was aimed at recent arrivals, mainly from India and Pakistan, and not for the Windrush generation, though some were affected by it.
The letter she wrote to Prime Minister Theresa May in January last year, which was published in the Guardian on Sunday, mentioned her forthcoming visit to Pakistan to finalise an agreement on biometric returns which would make it easier to deport illegal immigrants to that country. And she did visit Pakistan three months later. A leading think tank, Migration Watch, has estimated that there are about 200,000 Pakistanis living illegally in the UK.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 03 May 2018 21:44

IndraD wrote:https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/wor ... 004180.cms
Highly skilled South Asian migrants say they are UK’s new Windrush scandal;
UK is denying ILR (permamnet residency) to many Indians who had tier 1 visa from 2010. Reason quoted by home office is improper tax returns filed but bracketing them under draconinan laws applicable to terrorists & serious criminal offenders paving path for their deportation.

Don't worry, they'll be very prompt at handing out ILRs and FLRs to actual serious criminal offenders.

kvraghav · Post by **kvraghav** » 03 May 2018 23:47

We should exit all extradition and deportation treaties along with commonwealth.

Vips · Post by **Vips** » 04 May 2018 07:12

Also give asylum and protection to white collar criminals from UK.

Haresh · Post by **Haresh** » 04 May 2018 21:55

Luckily these sort of gruesome murders never happen in the west, especially the UK!!
Check the comments out.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... r-comments

Compare the comments to this:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... itely.html

and of course a quick Google of "decapitation murders usa"

Brings up:

https://www.google.com/search?source=hp ... pPE_6dA3B4

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 05 May 2018 01:14

Poll finds more favourable attitudes towards Indian immigrants than Pakistanis and Bangladeshis – why? http://theconversation.com/poll-finds-m ... -why-96040

In the 1970s, a number of migrants of Indian origin sought refuge in the UK following their expulsion from Uganda. The stream of Indian migration from East Africa also included people fleeing state discrimination in Kenya.

The vast proportion of these migrants were well-educated and entrepreneurial. Indeed, following their expulsion, the backbone of the Ugandan economy crumbled under Idi Amin’s dictatorship. Ugandan Indians are collectively a British success story.

Indians in the UK are far more likely to work in higher-skilled professional jobs than Bangladeshis and Pakistanis. A recent population survey found that 59% of UK women in a combined Bangladeshi-Pakistani category were economically inactive. The corresponding figure for Indian-origin women was only 32%.

British Bangladeshi and Pakistani communities have historically ranked highly when measuring average fertility rates by ethnicity in the UK. The fertility rate for British Indians is noticeably lower in comparison.

What this data collectively suggests is that due to superior occupational status, a higher proportion of two-income households and substantially lower fertility rates, British Indian households are far less likely to be dependent on welfare.

The religious composition of the ethnic groups cannot be ignored either. A substantial proportion of UK Indians are either Hindu or Sikh. Britain’s Bangladeshis and Pakistanis are nearly all Sunni Muslim. And the 2010 data shows that UK Bangladeshis and Pakistanis are more likely to identify more with their faith (when traded-off against British identification).

Perceptions of homegrown terrorism and Islamic radicalisation could also have played a part in the negative net figures for the Bangladeshi and Pakistani groups. The ethnic background of perpetrators involved in domestic terrorist activities and UK citizens who have joined Daesh “as jihadis” or “jihadi brides” may be implicated in negative group perceptions, even if these people make up a tiny proportion of the population. Major cases of child sexual exploitation in places such as Rochdale and Rotherham are unlikely to have helped.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 05 May 2018 07:58

Bangladeshi wombs have been incredibly fertile despite 200 mil people packed into a tiny area
Perhaps favourable monsoon, water and good alluvial soil means subsistence level farming is still able to feed large families from tiny parcels of land? And fish is abundant

Manish_P · Post by **Manish_P** » 05 May 2018 08:24

^ And there is always so much more room to the west and the east

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 05 May 2018 11:51

https://www.economist.com/news/finance- ... buryeffect
Transparency is being forced on Britain’s overseas territories
Tax havens will have to publish more information about company ownership

Ms Hodge and Andrew Mitchell, a Conservative MP, had tabled an amendment to an anti-money-laundering bill, which was designed to force “overseas territories” in the Caribbean and Atlantic, among them the British Virgin Islands (BVI), Bermuda and the Cayman Islands, to set up public registers, if they had not already done so, by the end of 2020. Faced with defeat in the House of Commons, the government dropped its opposition to the amendment, clearing the way for it to be shoehorned into the legislation. The House of Lords, which rejected it in January, is not expected to do so again.

<snip>

The measure looked a long shot until recently. But that changed with the poisoning in Salisbury, a southern English city, of Sergei Skripal, a Russian ex-spy. The nerve-agent attack sparked intense scrutiny of Russian malfeasance, including oligarchs’ use of Britain and its offshore satellites to wash their dirty money. “It’s all down to the Salisbury effect,” says a lobbyist.

Global Witness, a campaign group, hailed the breakthrough as the “biggest move against corruption in years”. The affected territories—under British sovereignty but not actually part of the United Kingdom—are livid. They say it breaks a long-standing constitutional arrangement, under which they have been left to shape their own policies on finance and much else. Orlando Smith, the BVI’s premier, called it a “ breach of trust” that “calls into question our very relationship with the UK”. His wife, who runs the agency that promotes the islands’ financial sector, described it as “smacking of colonialism”.

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 05 May 2018 18:00

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/bus ... 889543.cms
A trial balloon is being floated around that Raghuram Rajan could be the next governor of Bank of England.
Unless no one is ready to be in the hot seat due to Brexit turmoil this is impossible.
Never in the history of BoE some one has been imported to become governor.

ricky_v · Post by **ricky_v** » 05 May 2018 20:08

Mark Joseph Carney, OC (born March 16, 1965) is a Canadian economist and the Governor of the Bank of England and Chairman of the G20's Financial Stability Board.[2]

On November 26, 2012, UK Chancellor of the Exchequer, George Osborne, announced the appointment of Carney as Governor of the Bank of England. He succeeded Sir Mervyn King on July 1, 2013.[40] He is the first non-Briton to be appointed to the role since the Bank was established in 1694.

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 05 May 2018 20:16

thanks for correction...lets see if the process extends to a non white skin. here is a complete list of candidates in the race.

Attracting Raghuram Rajan, the highly respected Chicago-based economist and former Reserve Bank of India governor, would be a coup

https://www.ft.com/content/62377e60-45a ... e73aab7ccb

Andrew Bailey — chief executive of the Financial Conduct Authority

Pros: Previously a deputy governor of the BoE, he remains the domestic favourite with huge loyalty and respect among BoE staff. A safe pair of hands

Cons: Might be seen as the dull choice. Lack of international experience and monetary policy experience

Ben Broadbent — deputy governor for monetary policy

Pros: A lively mind on monetary policy and an internationally respected economist

Cons: A reputation for disorganisation. Goldman Sachs background makes him hard to sell as a man of the people

Shriti Vadera — chair of Santander UK

Pros: Lived through the financial crisis and a dynamic manager who gets things done

Cons: Dogged by criticisms of her abrasive working style. Lack of monetary policy experience

Andy Haldane — BoE chief economist

Pros: One of the world’s most exciting thinkers on economics. Substantial financial stability experience

Cons: One of the BoE’s least disciplined speakers could undermine the delicate task of central bank communication

Minouche Shafik — director of the London School of Economics

Pros: BoE and international experience having held the deputy managing director job at the IMF

Cons: Left the BoE deputy governor job after only three years to go to the LSE with limited achievements to her name

Raghuram Rajan — University of Chicago professor

Pros: Impeccable international economics and central banking experience. Significant achievements at the Reserve Bank of India

Cons: No indication that he would want the job at the BoE

JE Menon · Post by **JE Menon** » 05 May 2018 20:33

If Rajan should become BoE Gov, wait for the collective orgasmic shriek from the female twatterati of India, not to mention seminal journalists - "Modi kicked him out unfairly, and now BoE has grabbed our superstar Rajan"...

nam · Post by **nam** » 05 May 2018 20:41

His single weapon for any issue is to increase interest rates.

There are no takers for increasing interest rates in UK. People like the low rates.

ashish raval · Post by **ashish raval** » 05 May 2018 21:32

Given the contacts, Rajan could indeed become a governor of BoE. If UK managed to strike a deal with EU which is attractive even after being outside the customs union then the life will be smooth for any governor as financial services will keep growing in the continent for next decade. If not it will be thorny job as the economy will venture into unknown world of striking deals with rest of the world and EU too and could lead to bumpy ride for short term. The job in no deal scenario will be to make Singapore at EU doorstep with low tax rates.

ashish raval · Post by **ashish raval** » 05 May 2018 21:35

nam wrote:His single weapon for any issue is to increase interest rates.

There are no takers for increasing interest rates in UK. People like the low rates.

The whole generation is used to 2% mortgage rates. This is a dangerous thing. It is like doping and artificially inflates the asset prices as people chase yields by taking more risks than they could actually sustain.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 05 May 2018 21:38

The brits are not going to hire a "sammy" as the BoE. In any case, who outside of the UK would want to go to such a turd world place like the UK?

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 05 May 2018 23:05

The other way to look at it the Empire is rewarding him for his services of letting the loot in India go on?

eklavya · Post by **eklavya** » 06 May 2018 00:22

Flamebait deleted

Karan M

panduranghari · Post by **panduranghari** » 06 May 2018 02:04

Vips wrote:Also give asylum and protection to white collar criminals from UK.

Won’t it be better if our economic dealings with UQ involve a extradition of known criminals. If UQ using GCHQ has done rendition deals with USA then their is precedence. Though legally the UK Government had to pay fines to families of those who were rendered.

One of the main reasons Farage was pushing for Brexit was the power ECHR had over even the Supreme Court and Privy council.

India kicking out Britain from ICJ was the first strike against the cabal. Next logically would be moving commonwealth head office to some 2nd tiered city in India And make leadership of CW an elected position- why should Charlieboy automatically inherit the position. I truly would be disappointed if India permits this. As the largest economy in both Gross GDP and PPP GDP, we should stop bowing to London.

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 06 May 2018 13:31

Poor jail conditions, violence cited to avoid extradition from UK to India
Poor jail conditions and alleged threat to human rights are among the grounds cited to oppose extradition of businessman Vijay Mallya

https://www.hindustantimes.com/world-ne ... Xd6XP.html

the (UK) high court also raised questions about India’s second sovereign assurance in Chawla’s case on prison conditions. It was seen as providing a guarantee about space, but attached photographs were not considered clear enough to identify whether what was shown was a cell or a ward.

“The second assurance does not identify whether any of the wards are high security wards, where the evidence shows that there is a real risk of violence. Further, the assurance does not identify whether the toilet facilities will be shared, and if so what those facilities will be,” it said.

“The apparent under recruitment of medical officers is a cause for concern, given the reported difficulties with medical treatment of other extradited persons and the permissible findings of the district judge, but we have noted the assurance that Chawla will have speedy access to prison medical facilities if needed.”

The court gave India 42 days to submit further assurances on the personal space that will be available to Chawla; on toilet facilities; identifying the ways in which he will be kept free from the risk of intra-prisoner violence in the high security wards; and repeating the guarantee of medical treatment.

In Mallya’s case, India has submitted detailed information about the Arthur Road jail in Mumbai, where he is to be lodged, if extradited. New Delhi has also agreed to his accessing private medical healthcare, if needed.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 06 May 2018 13:36

Desist from pointless flamebaits. Thanks.

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 06 May 2018 18:48

British actress Emma Wattson has tweeted in favour of Kathua victim lawyer

All power to Deepika Singh Rajawat

https://www.geo.tv/latest/194213-emma-w ... ims-lawyer
https://twitter.com/EmmaWatson/status/9 ... 1406982145

panduranghari · Post by **panduranghari** » 08 May 2018 18:49

https://www.strategic-culture.org/news/ ... ntury.html

Recent moves by the British government to require its Caribbean and other territories to adopt public ownership registers prior to the end of 2020 or risk having their financial affairs taken over directly from London has resulted in a revolt among the British colonies, especially those in the Caribbean. London maintains that the public ownership registers are necessary to stem the flow of “dirty money” and secret corporate ownership in the wake of the “Panama and Paradise Papers” offshore tax haven financial records’ disclosures. The British territories argued that after the imposition of public ownership records, offshore firms and their money will simply move to other locations where corporate secrecy will continue to be maintained.

Of course, to avoid dictates from London, some British territories are already floating the idea of independence. BVI Premier Orlando Smith said London’s move to infringe on BVI’s self-government calls into question the constitutional relationship between the United Kingdom and the people of the BVI. BVI has moved to establish direct links with the Caribbean Community (CARICOM) of independent nations, without the interference of the London colonial authorities. BVI is now represented at CARICOM and Association of Caribbean States meetings by its own External Affairs Secretary. Likewise, Cayman Islands Premier Alden McLaughlin has demanded more control over his islands’ affairs, including national security and membership in the World Trade Organization. British authorities have not only refused but are making moves to impose British financial regulations on the popular offshore business haven.

Caribbean territorial leaders point out that the requirements imposed on them do not apply to the Isle of Man or the Bailiwicks of Jersey and Guernsey, which, as crown dependencies of Queen Elizabeth, are not subject to the whims of the British Parliament. If London attempts to impose its will on the crown dependencies, they have let it be known that they will move to cut their links with the British Crown and opt for independence.

Vips · Post by **Vips** » 08 May 2018 19:01

panduranghari wrote:
Vips wrote:Also give asylum and protection to white collar criminals from UK.

Won’t it be better if our economic dealings with UQ involve a extradition of known criminals.

We would only be encouraging UK to use this leverage for continued (advantageous to them) economic dealings. Just give asylum to their wanted nationals and see how quickly the nonsense about "due process" and "freedom" and "human rights" and "condition of indian jails" stops.

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 08 May 2018 21:39

Mallya has lost a lawsuit in UK.

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... 080899.cms

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 08 May 2018 21:42

Supratik wrote:Mallya has lost a lawsuit in UK.

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... 080899.cms

Judge Andrew Henshaw in London Tuesday said the lenders, including IDBI Bank Ltd., can enforce an Indian court ruling that relates to allegations that Mallya willfully defaulted on about $1.4 billion in debt for his now-defunct Kingfisher Airlines Ltd. Henshaw also refused to overturn a worldwide order freezing Mallya’s assets.
ToI

ashish raval · Post by **ashish raval** » 09 May 2018 02:27

Supratik wrote:Mallya has lost a lawsuit in UK.

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... 080899.cms

This should open can of worms for all economic fugitives of India to UK. This will serve as precedent to decide many such cases deserving similar merit. Good first step.

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 09 May 2018 03:07

Theresa May is mocked by Russian Embassy with 'Three Billboards Outside Salisbury, Wiltshire' tweet over Skripal nerve agent attack

Kashi · Post by **Kashi** » 09 May 2018 05:29

IndraD wrote:

Theresa May is mocked by Russian Embassy with 'Three Billboards Outside Salisbury, Wiltshire' tweet over Skripal nerve agent attack

Seems like a Photoshop job to me.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 09 May 2018 08:04

Supratik wrote:Mallya has lost a lawsuit in UK.

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... 080899.cms

Whether Mallya, Nirav Modi go to jail less important than recovery of dues from them. 1 actual cash infusion in Banks who can lend credit and 2 those who looted know they cannot get rid of the booty. The whole system in place with rich people taking loans taking cash abroad while loans are written off in India and fresh loan in a new entity collapses

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 09 May 2018 10:55

The Fugutive Economic Offenders Bill will enable actual confiscation of Mallya's assets. On the other hand, I'm pretty sure him and Nirav Modi will use the 'poor conditions of Indian jail' card to try and avoid or delay actual deportation to India. GoI will need to be careful to maximize the 'justice must both be practically done (money confiscated back) but seen to be done (they pay for their crimes within Indian penal system)' view.

JTull · Post by **JTull** » 09 May 2018 11:09

Aditya, recovery of dues is less important than making the lives of absconders and their immediate families miserable. That's the only deterrent.

Kashi · Post by **Kashi** » 09 May 2018 11:36

JTull wrote:Aditya, recovery of dues is less important than making the lives of absconders and their immediate families miserable. That's the only deterrent.

I would say recovery of dues is equally important as bringing them to justice. These absconders are absconding because they are banking on the fact that their dues will never be recovered and in due course they will tide over the events and enjoy the spoils of their ill gotten riches.

Once the stolen riches are taken back, what is left? All of crookedness and thievery coming to a naught. Wouldn't that make them sufficiently miserable?

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 10 May 2018 00:46

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/bus ... 099556.cms Grounds to regard Vijay Mallya a 'fugitive from justice': UK high court

Liquor baron Vijay Mallya, wanted in India to face charges of fraud and money laundering amounting to around Rs 9,000 crore, can be regarded as a "fugitive from justice", the UK high court has concluded.

"In all these circumstances, and even taking account of the fact that Dr Mallya is contesting the alleged grounds for extradition, there are grounds for regarding Dr Mallya as a fugitive from justice," the judge said as part of his ruling.
The high court remained unconvinced by Mallya's claim that he has been a non-resident Indian (NRI) since 1988 and has lived in England since 1992, a country where he has indefinite leave to remain (ILR).
"The evidence indicates that prior to March 2016, Dr Mallya travelled fairly regularly between India and England for business and political reasons. Most of his business interests were in or closely connected with India, most notably United Breweries Group and Kingfisher Airlines ... Whilst Dr Mallya has indefinite leave to stay in the UK, he is said to be a non-resident taxpayer," the court observed.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 10 May 2018 02:18

ILR is conditional permanent residency in UK (unlike Right of Above, which is unconditional). To retain it, one must not stay outside UK continuously for 2 years. Mallya is arguing using immigration technicalities, because his businesses were Indian based and registered, and he was a politician in India. He probably just visited UK regularly enough to 'reset the clock' on his ILR expiry. But UK foreign office may take a dim view of that and revoke his ILR for not showing sufficiently settled status in UK .

Two adverse judgments against him in such a short time makes his options much fewer. First judgment makes it clear the Indian creditors can go after his assets in India and UK. The one above is dicier - by being formally regarded as a fugitive, he risks losing his ILR and subject to deportation proceedings.

GoI needs to push through the Fugitive Economic Offenders Bill asap and confiscate assets of these rogues immediately. They're only able to sit on a high perch abroad because they still have access to their wealth. Take that away and then target their deportation.

nam · Post by **nam** » 10 May 2018 03:14

Didn't GoI revoke his passport? He cannot have ILR without a valid passport. Unless he has ilr on some other country's passport or he has claimed asylum.

UK government can revoke his ilr as he does not have a valid identity document.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 10 May 2018 03:42

ILR can be maintained without a valid passport provided the person entered on a valid passport. India revoked his passport after he absconded. This also means he can't travel out of UK since he has no valid travel document. There are two possible ways here:
a) Deportation: for breaking immigration rules there. This may happen if his 'fugitive from justice' status threatens his ILR. India prefers this since it's faster. However, since UK immigration law allows someone to maintain ILR without a valid passport, he can't be deported solely because we revoked his passport. This approach also doesn't protect him from 'hyooman rites violations' since he's no longer an active permanent resident to request residence there.
b) Extradition: Under the terms of the 1992-93 treaty. More complex, timeconsuming. Could try to use the hyooman rites angle to prevent extradition since he continues to have valid ILR and can stay. Squeezing his assets away and basically making him a mounting liability to them would make this faster.