India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

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chetak
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby chetak » 04 Dec 2017 22:06

Cosmo_R wrote:This sent the BP up a notch:
As Obama Warns Modi, Ivanka Given Lavish Welcome in India

"Obama picked up on India’s main current social issue when he said that, along with other countries, it should ensure that a Muslim population felt integrated. “That is something that should be cherished and nurtured,” he said."

http://www.newsweek.com/obama-warns-mod ... dia-728327

Question: Did Obama say the same thing to his Indonesian hosts (he grew up in Indonesia) about nurturing and cherishing Hindus in Bali?
Or, Latinos in America? Where under his watch more deportations took place than under Bush?

Under that professorial veneer Obama harbors strong likes and a view that Muslims are persecuted everywhere

This article first appeared in
https://ridingtheelephant.wordpress.com ... ays-obama/

Where he changed the header to:

"India’s Muslims should be “cherished and nurtured” says Obama

Elliot is the BritCommie who I think wrote for WAPO. Usual 'White Mughal' stuff

https://ridingtheelephant.wordpress.com/about/



The hosts who paid him to come got their moneys' worth.

lootyens dilli and the congis/commies made their point.

for obama, it was just another day, another dollar.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby ramana » 05 Dec 2017 00:21

KLNMurthy wrote:
ramana wrote:Could be Haley too.

I suppose, but all the MSM is claiming that it won't be Namrata and it will be Mike.

I would expect (hope) Namrata to understand India's perspective. But given current information, we should prepare for Pompeo.



I wouldn't expect that. She has to be loyal to her country interests.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Malayappan » 06 Dec 2017 08:23

U.S.-India Insight: Do Not Give Up on the Bilateral Investment Treaty
Rationale for the BIT for the Indian Side:
U.S. investors (including capital aggregators like pension fund managers and global life insurers) are well aware of many recent cases where investors have seen reversals due to government action. This is a very real threat in India, and a BIT is one “piece of the puzzle” to bring additional security. It may help un-stick capital that sits on the sidelines today.

Some interesting insights into commercial issues.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Vayutuvan » 06 Dec 2017 23:59

mappunni wrote:saavugrakki ghose :rotfl: :rotfl:

Sethalum She will come back as Pisas !!

Translation please, pretty please.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby devesh » 07 Dec 2017 13:41

ramana wrote:
KLNMurthy wrote:I suppose, but all the MSM is claiming that it won't be Namrata and it will be Mike.

I would expect (hope) Namrata to understand India's perspective. But given current information, we should prepare for Pompeo.



I wouldn't expect that. She has to be loyal to her country interests.



something tells me Tillerson shouldn't be counted out just yet. He might yet survive. Some intriguing characters brought him to Trump's attention. For a purpose.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby periaswamy » 07 Dec 2017 19:35

vayutuvan: "Sethalum She will come back as Pisas !!" Translation please, pretty please.


Even after she dies, she will torment us all as a vicious ghost.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby CRamS » 07 Dec 2017 21:15



I simultaneously weep profusely and laugh in contempt at why Bharat mata is cursed with a disgusting elite who control the narrative. In any self respecting country, the elite would have demanded answers from an ex president on why US p!sses on India like this, but instead we have the elite fawning over this Obama like colonial diseased rats falling over each other and celebrating his bogus remark on 'religious tolerance' and using that as a stick to beat BJP and ModiJi. As we have many times discussed, for this elite, India is not their country per se, but rather they consider themselves to be part of westernized slaves interpreting India for the benefit of their slave masters. Ackkk Thoo.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby periaswamy » 07 Dec 2017 21:24

CRamS: I simultaneously weep profusely...etc.


This is not fuel -- this is tar/bitumen for laying roads. Just do a web search on that product and the import/export documents for it. States that pretty clearly. Just because Indian journalists are a bunch of low IQ cretins, doesn't mean we have to explode into a ball of mucus and tears everytime they write some politically motivated BS that is not rooted in reality.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Cosmo_R » 07 Dec 2017 22:53

periaswamy wrote:
CRamS: I simultaneously weep profusely...etc.


This is not fuel -- this is tar/bitumen for laying roads. Just do a web search on that product and the import/export documents for it. States that pretty clearly. Just because Indian journalists are a bunch of low IQ cretins, doesn't mean we have to explode into a ball of mucus and tears everytime they write some politically motivated BS that is not rooted in reality.


Well said. :)

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Bart S » 08 Dec 2017 00:50

periaswamy wrote:
CRamS: I simultaneously weep profusely...etc.


This is not fuel -- this is tar/bitumen for laying roads. Just do a web search on that product and the import/export documents for it. States that pretty clearly. Just because Indian journalists are a bunch of low IQ cretins, doesn't mean we have to explode into a ball of mucus and tears everytime they write some politically motivated BS that is not rooted in reality.


It isn't just the journalists, some self-appointed 'environmentalist' has filed a case in the Supreme Court who banned the import and the govt is pleading for some exceptions to the ban to be allowed!

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby periaswamy » 08 Dec 2017 00:55

Bart S. It isn't just the journalists, some self-appointed 'environmentalist' has filed a case in the Supreme Court who banned the import and the govt is pleading for some exceptions to the ban to be allowed!



Why is the govt. bending over to the morons in the Supreme Court and ask them to mind their own business and not interfere in policy making? Who the hell are these unelected and self-electing jokers who have never faced an election to make policy decisions day after day? Is this BJP govt. really that witless to put the brakes on the SC judges?

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby ramana » 08 Dec 2017 00:57

periaswamy, The whole article talks about how this pet coke is being used as a fuel as it burns hotter than normal coal.
And Reliance is ramping up its own production to match the imports.

I think industry should find ways to burn it cleaner and have sulfur scrubbers or else whole of North India will have acid rain.

Maybe burn this in electric generating plants and use the electricity instead of this distributed burning in furnaces.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Dipanker » 08 Dec 2017 01:00

India to ban imports of petcoke as concerns about air pollution grow

DECEMBER 6, 2017 NEW DELHI—India's government says it plans to phase out imports of a dirty fuel known as petroleum coke, or petcoke, after an Associated Press investigation found US oil refineries are exporting vast quantities of the product to India.

But when it comes to domestic use, the Indian government seems to be going in a different direction. The government this week argued in court that restrictions on petcoke around polluted New Delhi should be eased for certain low-impact industries. The move has infuriated environmentalists.

The AP investigation found the US sold about 20 times more petcoke to India last year than it did six years earlier after US refineries struggled to sell the product at home. In 2016, the US sent more than 8.8 million tons of petcoke to India, enough to fill the Empire State Building eight times over.

Petcoke is a bottom-of-the-barrel leftover from the refining of Canadian tar sands crude and other heavy oils. It's cheaper and burns hotter than coal. But laboratory tests on imported petcoke used near New Delhi found it contained 17 times more sulfur than the limit set for coal.

A day after the AP investigation was published, Indian Petroleum and Natural Gas Minister Dharmendra Pradhan said the government was formulating a policy to end imports.
...

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby periaswamy » 08 Dec 2017 01:17

Study of Comparison of coke and petro coke

Utility companies used 3,852 dcd of petroleum coke (less than 5% of annual production) as a
power plant supplemental fuel blending with coal in 1996
, because petroleum coke has advantages
of low price (36% lower at Wst or 46% lower at %/MMBtu), high heating value, and low ash
content [I]. The disadvantages of petroleum coke as a fuel are expense of a dual solid bel
handling and crushing system, high sulfur, high nickel and vanadium content.


US has been running power plants since the 90s with a mix of coke and coal -- does not seem to be used on its own, as the tables on the last two pages of the paper in the link. reduction in coal burning plants in the US and EPA regulations seems to be reason for search for export market.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby arun » 13 Dec 2017 08:54

A reminder that the rhetoric of India and the US having shared interests only goes so far. At the Buenos Ares Ministerial Conference of the World Trade Organisation (WTO) the US attempts to stymie India’s efforts on ensuring food security:

India's Sharp Message To US As WTO Food Security Talks Teeter

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby periaswamy » 13 Dec 2017 09:52

US farm subsidies grow

Two years ago, when the most recent Farm Bill emerged from Congress, the measure's authors proudly announced what sounded like bold cuts in these controversial programs. The Senate Agriculture Committee noted in a press release that the new law would eliminate one big subsidy altogether and save taxpayers a total of $23.3 billion over the following 10 years.

Those projected savings, it turns out, were a mirage. According new estimates for Farm Bill spending over the next few years released by the Congressional Budget Office, total government aid to farmers will swell to $23.9 billion in 2017.


Over the decades, Congress has periodically changed the way these programs work. This latest Farm Bill ditched a politically unpopular subsidy program that wrote checks to farmers simply based on the number of acres they owned. In its place, the law set up new programs that pay farmers when commodity prices fall. And indeed they have been falling since the last Farm Bill.

If prices stay low, or rebound, spending under some of these new programs should decline, but only gradually — and within a few years Congress will once again revise the Farm Bill.

Orden does believe that over the long term, there has been progress in abolishing some of the most wasteful farm subsidies. "We used to do all sorts of things to maintain high market prices for farmers," he says.

For example, the government used to buy up large amounts of agricultural commodities and either store them or export them at much lower prices. It also paid farmers to take vast amounts of land out of production. Those programs, Orden says, were probably more damaging to the overall economy than the payments and crop insurance payouts that farmers get today.


So the US keeps a lot of farming capacity in its back pocket via these subsidies -- maybe this allows them to control commodity prices in the world market. This is related to their objection to "food security" in the WTO, esp. given this Trump admin is all about protecting the local economy.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby arun » 13 Dec 2017 14:20

X Posted from the Terroristan thread.

Palpable frustration oozes from the Secretary of State of the United States of America at the adroit way the US’ Major non NATO Ally aka MUNNA repeatedly sticks a finger up the US’ defecatory orifice and tickles it. One must compliment the finesse with which the Punjabi Military Dominated Deep State of the Mohammadden Terrorism Fomenting Islamic Republic of Pakistan games the United States of America. I trust our Foreign Policy establishment are taking notes on the US can be handled starting with the WTO:

On "Meeting the Foreign Policy Challenges of 2017 and Beyond"
Rex W. Tillerson
Secretary of State
The 2017 Atlantic Council-Korea Foundation Forum
Washington, DC
December 12, 2017 …………………………….

The global effort to defeat ISIS and the global effort to defeat terrorism is one of the President’s top priorities, and that takes us to the South Asia policy and Afghanistan, Pakistan, and India. And the approach to this policy really was a regional approach. The President made a decision and announced the policy that we would remain in Afghanistan, we would remain engaged in the fight to defeat the Taliban, and that the time and effort would be conditions-based. He didn’t – he said it’s not a blank check. It’s not forever, so the Government of Afghanistan needs to understand they must continue their reform journey and they must continue to create conditions that will be inclusive to all ethnic groups within Afghanistan, including a place for the Taliban to participate in a legitimate government when the Taliban is ready to renounce terrorism, renounce the fight, and come to the table.

So the conditions-based approach is to ensure the Taliban know, you will never win a battlefield victory, and the way forward is going to be by engaging in a reconciliation process and ultimately joining a government in Afghanistan.

An important part of the regional approach is our relationship with Pakistan. The U.S. and Pakistan have had a long history of good relations, but that relationship has really deteriorated over the past decade and so now we’re engaged with Pakistan in a conversation to ensure our expectations of them are clear, that our concern is really about Pakistan’s stability. Pakistan has allowed so many terrorist organizations to find safe haven within its territories, and these organizations are growing in size and influence, that at some point I have said to the leadership of Pakistan, you may be the target, and they turn their attention from Kabul and decide they like Islamabad as a target better.

We want to work with Pakistan to stamp out terrorism within their boundaries as well, but Pakistan has to begin the process of changing its relationship with the Haqqani Network and with others. I understand that this is a relationship that has emerged probably for, in their view, good reasons a decade ago, but now that relationship has to be altered because they – if they’re not careful, Pakistan is going to lose control of their own country. We want to work with them in a positive way. We’re willing to share information with them and we want them to be successful. But we cannot continue with the status quo, where terrorist organizations are allowed to find safe haven inside of Pakistan.


From the US State Department website:

On "Meeting the Foreign Policy Challenges of 2017 and Beyond"

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby arun » 13 Dec 2017 14:59

X Posted from the Terroristan thread.

US Secretary of State Rex Tillerson:

“Pakistan is still an important and valued partner of the United States”:

Townhall
Rex W. Tillerson
Secretary of State
I. Steven (Steve) Goldstein
Under Secretary for Public Diplomacy and Public Affairs
Dean Acheson Auditorium
Washington, DC
December 12, 2017

STAFF: Ladies and Gentlemen, the Secretary of State. (Applause.)

SECRETARY TILLERSON: Good morning. Good morning, all. Please, have a seat. ………………..

……….. So in that region of the world, obviously, a heavy, heavy emphasis on counterterrorism. That’s really the big threat that we’re dealing with there.

Out of that also emerged the new South Asia strategy for Afghanistan, Pakistan, and India. And I think the President took a very bold decision by asserting that we will be in Afghanistan with our military presence and continue to fight terrorism and fight the Taliban on a conditions-based effort. There is no timeline. We’re there until this thing is brought to a conclusion. It’s not a blank check. It’s not a forever. But we’re going to stay on the ground and support the Afghan Government. The Afghan Government has to continue to deliver on the needed reforms and create the conditions to have an inclusive government that allows for participation of all the ethnic groups in Afghanistan, including the Taliban. When the Taliban are ready to come to that negotiating table, there will be a place for them to participate in a future Afghan government.

And so the policy there in Afghanistan and in that region is to deny any safe haven to terrorist organizations, because there are a number of terrorist organizations operating in the Afghan-Pakistan region. Our policy is deny them the ability to have a safe haven where they can organize, they can recruit fighters, they can raise money, they can plan and carry out attacks against our allies, our own homeland, as we know they did in the past. So the entire policy in South Asia is to achieve that. And we achieve that by eliminating the safe havens, having some organizations who today have been fighting decide they don’t want to fight anymore, they’d rather talk about how to live, and create the conditions for a reconciliation process within Afghanistan and ultimately a peace process.

In our efforts with Pakistan, Pakistan is still an important and valued partner of the United States. Over the last decade, the relationship has drifted, and we’ve got to bring this relationship back to one of common interest. Today that’s just not the case. And so we’re engaged in very, very frank discussions with Pakistan over the concerns we have about their own stability and their own future and the threat they’re under by allowing terrorist organizations to operate in their territory, and how we can work together to bring stability and peace to the whole region. And again, we’ve got a great team working in that region as well. A lot of work left to do.


SECRETARY TILLERSON: Well, I’m smiling. (Applause.) I am learning to enjoy it. (Laughter.)

Look, it’s – this is a hard job. I mean – I mean, it’s difficult because of the issues, the complexity of the issues that you deal with. You wake up every morning, and the team that works closely with me in my front office know, because I say this many times to them, I start every morning with the thought, “How can I keep someone from being killed today?” I never had to start my mornings with that thought for 41 and a half years. I did worry about people’s safety in my old career, because there were a lot of risks, and we did lose people, regrettably, due to operation problems. But this is a different – I didn’t have to spend a lot of time worrying about civilians being killed, children being killed, people’s rights, their dignity being violated in unimaginable ways. So I start every day with that simple question: What can I do today to keep someone from being killed? And I’ve had a – I’ve had to really struggle with getting used to that, because I take it very seriously.

When I say I’m learning to enjoy it, I am. I’m learning to enjoy it because I’m getting to know all of you better. And one of the things that you get enjoyment from are the people that you have the privilege to work with every day, and that was true for 41 and a half years of my life. And so coming to a place where I didn’t know anybody and I don’t know much about you, that’s why I say I’m learning to enjoy it. Because now, having gone through everything I just described to you and have had great colleagues of yours supporting me and helping me through this year, I am enjoying it more. I enjoy the people. I enjoy you. And that’s why – when you say, “Do you enjoy it?” The actual task at hand of dealing with North Korea? I don’t enjoy that. I mean – (laughter) – but I enjoy working with Susan Thornton on it. Dealing with [b[Pakistan[/b] – I don’t enjoy that. But I enjoy dealing with Alice Wells and Ambassador Hale on it. You’re great people, and I’m – because I’m now making more and more acquaintances and connections, and I have more time with people, I’m beginning to understand them – I enjoy that. That’s what I enjoy, is I enjoy you. And we’ll get some things done. (Applause.) ………………..


From the US State department Website here:

Remarks at Town Hall

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby SSridhar » 14 Dec 2017 07:58

The US and its anti-terrorism narrative - G.Parthasarathy, Business Line
Former US president Barack Obama astounded audiences in New Delhi when he proclaimed that the US had no evidence of Pakistani government complicity in the prolonged stay of Osama bin Laden in Abbotabad. Obama’s statement was particularly [astonishing because bin Laden lived in a huge mansion with a large family barely a kilometre away from the Pakistan Military Academy. It is impossible for any foreigner to live even for a day in Abbotabad cantonment without the knowledge and approval of the Pakistani army.

Obama was fully aware of Pakistani complicity in providing bin Laden safe haven. He also turned a blind eye to Pakistani assistance to the Taliban, which resulted in the killing of over 2000 American soldiers. Obama firmly believed he needed Pakistani cooperation in arranging for an early withdrawal of American forces in Afghanistan. Moreover, he was quite ready to withdraw American forces from Afghanistan at any cost and even consider a significant role for the Taliban in the future governance of Afghanistan.

It was for this reason that he readily agreed to a dialogue involving the US, Pakistan, the Afghan government and the Taliban. Denying Pakistan’s role in bin Laden’s stay was considered imperative to achieving this aim. Obama’s policies also involved the US and Pakistan treating the legitimate government of Afghanistan and the Taliban virtually as sovereign equals, while giving Pakistan a significant say in the future governance of Afghanistan.


Twist in the narrative

Pakistan’s hand was also strengthened by support from Russia and China, who coordinated their efforts with Pakistan to equate the status of a recalcitrant Taliban and an isolated Afghan government. Taking note of Pakistan’s imperatives, China and Russia sought to create a new narrative, averring that the real threat of global terrorism came not from the Taliban, but from the Islamic State (ISIL), whose cadres, it was claimed, were shifting to Afghanistan. Iran, not surprisingly, was helped by Pakistan to establish contacts with Taliban leaders. Taliban supremo Mullah Mansour was killed in an American drone strike in Baluchistan while returning from Iran. This suited Pakistan just fine as it would help it to claim that the Tehriq-e-Taliban, which was fighting against it from Afghan soil, was really nothing but an ally of the ISIL. But, given public and Congressional opinion in the US, Obama could not achieve his cherished objective of bringing back American combat forces from Afghanistan while attempting to virtually hand over Afghanistan to Taliban/Pakistan control, despite having held office for eight years.

Pakistan’s ambitions received a setback with the unexpected election of Donald Trump. Trump had made it clear that he was not going to forget the loss of American lives, nor quietly withdraw from Afghanistan and hand it over to Pakistan-backed Taliban rule. He was determined to listen to his military advisers to make the Afghan military strong enough to resist Taliban depredations by providing it firepower and airpower. The US declined to join the Russia-China-Pakistan initiative to promote dialogue between the Afghan government and the Taliban while ignoring Taliban-sponsored terrorism.

Cue from India

Indian diplomacy persuaded the American establishment and Trump himself that Pakistan-sponsored terrorism had to be tackled not just across Pakistan’s borders with Afghanistan, but also its borders with India. On June 27, the Modi-Trump Declaration proclaimed the will to meet threats from not just the al Qaeda, ISIS and Taliban, but also the Jaish-e-Mohammed, Lashkar-e-Taiba ‘D (Dawood) Company’, and the Hizb-ul-Mujahideen. Naming the Hizb was a categorical American rejection of Pakistan’s claims that it was helping a “freedom struggle” in Jammu and Kashmir.

India should not relent on its campaign against Pakistan-sponsored terrorism. The US Congress had developed a bipartisan consensus to deny American assistance to Pakistan unless it ends its support for the Taliban and India-focused groups such as the Lashkar-e-Taiba. The US Congress had, in fact, also drafted legislation incorporating such conditions on aid to Pakistan. New Delhi was, therefore, surprised when the Trump administration moved legislation to delink aid to Pakistan from its support for India-focused terrorist groups. The focus was entirely on Pakistan support for terrorism in Afghanistan. The White House, however, condemned the release of Hafiz Mohammed Saeed on November 25 stating: “If Pakistan does not take action to lawfully detain Saeed and charge him for his crimes, its inaction will have repercussions for bilateral relations and for Pakistan’s global reputation.”

It is clear that while the Trump administration is determined to strengthen the Afghan armed forces adequately to deal with Pakistan support for the Taliban, it will have to be reminded continuously that India looks forward to its abiding by its word during Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s visit to Washington and act against Pakistan-sponsored terrorism across South Asia. While the White House staff and large sections of the Pentagon deeply distrust Pakistan, there are sections of the State Department and “liberals’ in the American think tanks and mainstream “liberal media” which have historically resorted to India-bashing. It is, therefore, crucial that India strengthens the bipartisan consensus in the US Congress to condition aid to Pakistan on its ending terrorism not just in Afghanistan, but across the entire South Asian region.

Regional concerns

It should also be made clear to Washington that our participation in the US, Japan, Australia, India ‘Quad’ cannot be confined just to the security of sea lanes in the Indian and Pacific oceans. Washington should also deal firmly with issues of terrorism across the Indian Ocean. Trump’s visits to Japan, South Korea, China, Vietnam and the Philippines clearly established that the US needs partners if it is to get the Chinese to respect international conventions and treaties, in the Indo-Pacific Region. The Quad partnership, however, cannot be selectively confined to issues of US interest alone. Trump could well consider diluting his emphasis on strong action against Pakistan-sponsored terrorism in his Afghanistan policies also while yielding to his domestic “compulsions”.

The writer is a former High Commissioner to Pakistan

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby KLNMurthy » 14 Dec 2017 08:38

ramana wrote:
KLNMurthy wrote:I suppose, but all the MSM is claiming that it won't be Namrata and it will be Mike.

I would expect (hope) Namrata to understand India's perspective. But given current information, we should prepare for Pompeo.



I wouldn't expect that. She has to be loyal to her country interests.

Of course she has to be. I meant having a more intuitive understanding of (if not sympathy for ) India's pov, contrasted with say, Hillary or Kerry.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby disha » 14 Dec 2017 10:18

^Namrata Nikki Haley will be more holier than pope. Do not expect any quarters from her.

—-

Ombaba’s perfidy is exposed, at the very least it is fun to watch the state dept constertations due to agent orange LoL

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Dipanker » 14 Dec 2017 10:25

Posting it here because it affects India indirectly, $700 million is lot of money Pakistan can use against India.

Trump signs bill that includes $700m reimbursement for Pakistan

WASHINGTON: US President Donald Trump has signed into law a $700 billion defence bill that includes up to $700 million to reimburse Pakistan for supporting US military operations in Afghanistan.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby SSridhar » 14 Dec 2017 11:40

The release of the Coalition Support Fund, the removal of LeT's name from the aid bill after pressure from Pakistan, the inclusion of India in the portfolio of the US Special Representative to Afghanistan, the renewed interest the US is showing in mediating between India & Pakistan are all continuation of the same Obama policy, which in turn was a continuum of the US policy over the previous five decades.

The US State Department has institutionalized its belief that peace in Afghanistan is impossible without peace between India & Pakistan. The South Asia policy review by Trump is therefore doing more of the same.

The US has a clear policy with respect to India-China-Pakistan. The India-US relationship would see positive movement when it comes to China especially if India makes more concessions like CISMOA, BECA et al. The India-US relationship wouldn't see any change in the fundamental US position when it comes to Pakistan. Thus, the US pursues a twin-track in its policy prerogative with us. Again, the same as during the Obama regime.

Those who expected no change in the US policy with Trump so far as India-US-Pakistan relationship was concerned stand vindicated.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby disha » 14 Dec 2017 13:19

^In nutshell, the deep state strikes back

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Gus » 15 Dec 2017 19:10


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India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Peregrine » 19 Dec 2017 03:33

India a leading global power, says new US security policy

WASHINGTON: Describing India as a "leading global power", the US today unveiled its new National Security Strategy (NSS) that said it will "deepen" America's strategic partnership with India and support its leadership role in Indian Ocean security and throughout the broader region.

With an eye on China's One Belt One Road (OBOR) and the China-Pakistan Economic Corridor (CPEC), the US administration said it will help South Asian countries "maintain their sovereignty" as China increases its influence in the region.

The NSS also seeks Pakistan to take decisive action against terrorists.

"We welcome India's emergence as a leading global power and stronger strategic and defence partner," said the National Security Strategy unveiled by President Donald Trump.

The 68-page document said the US will seek to increase quadrilateral cooperation with Japan, Australia, and India.

"We will expand our defence and security cooperation with India, a Major Defence Partner of the United States, and support India's growing relationships throughout the region," the NSS said, noting that its vision for Indo-Pacific excludes no nation.

India-US defence relationship was mentioned in the context of Indo-Pacific region, whereas it gave a very prominent role to India in South and Central Asia.

"We will deepen our strategic partnership with India and support its leadership role in Indian Ocean security and throughout the broader region," according to the NSS which the White House said sets a positive strategic direction for the US that will restore America's advantages in the world and build upon our country's great strengths.

The NSS said it will press Pakistan to intensify its counter-terrorism efforts, since no partnership can survive a country's support for militants and terrorists who target a partner's own service members and officials.

"The United States will also encourage Pakistan to continue demonstrating that it is a responsible steward of its nuclear assets," it said adding the US will continue to partner with Afghanistan to promote peace and security in the region.

In an apparent reference to the OBOR and CPEC, the NSS said, "We will help South Asian nations maintain their sovereignty as China increases its influence in the region".

The recent Chinese move in Sri Lanka and Maldives is seen as an effort on their part to encroach eat on their sovereignty with similar fears in Pakistan.

India has objected to CPEC as it passes through Pakistan-occupied Kashmir.

The US, it said, continues to face threats from trans-national terrorists and militants operating from within Pakistan.

"The prospect for an Indo-Pakistani military conflict that could lead to a nuclear exchange remains a key concern requiring consistent diplomatic attention," NSS said.

US interests in the region include countering terrorist threats that impact the security of the US homeland and its allies, preventing cross-border terrorism that raises the prospect of military and nuclear tensions, and preventing nuclear weapons, technology, and materials from falling into the hands of terrorists, it said.

"We seek an American presence in the region proportionate to threats to the homeland and our allies. We seek a Pakistan that is not engaged in destabilising behaviour and a stable and self-reliant Afghanistan," the NSS said.

Insisting that it is committed to supporting the Afghan government and security forces in their fight against the Taliban, al-Qaeda, ISIS, and other terrorists, the NSS said the US will bolster the fighting strength of the Afghan security forces to convince the Taliban that they cannot win on the battlefield and to set conditions for diplomatic efforts to achieve enduring peace.

"We will insist that Pakistan take decisive action against militant and terrorist groups operating from its soil," it said.

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ramana
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby ramana » 19 Dec 2017 04:47

Quite a difference from Condoleezza Rice proclaiming India a 'rising power' and how US will help.
All the while they had David Headley their double agent plotting with LeT terrorists to attack India and spark of a war in 2008 just before Bush term is over..

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Rudradev » 19 Dec 2017 10:26

I don't see any genuine difference at all.

Obama administration at least went through the formality of declaring LeT a terrorist organization and made US aid to Pakistan contingent on action against LeT among other groups.

Trump has removed that stricture and now it's back to the days of a Republican administration in Washington writing blank cheques to Pakistan while paying lip service to India's concerns (and blowing rhetorical smoke for good measure). The only difference from the Condoleezza Rice/David Headley days is that we now have a real government in India.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Rudradev » 19 Dec 2017 10:36

As far as PRC goes, mark my words, US' priority is to secure its influence in the northern Pacific (Japan/Korea), South China Sea (Taiwan/Philippines) and ASEAN littoral in that order. India's concerns on our own PRC front are going to be given lip service and nothing more, just as our concerns on Paki terrorism are explained away in soothing tones as something we just have to put up with in exchange for the Greater Good of regional stability in AfPak.

The US would greatly prefer that PRC expands its influence South and West into the subcontinent and India's near-abroad, while giving America at least the appearance of dominion over the Pacific. They will not get what they want, in fact it is already being denied to them via NoKo shenanigans, but if they thought they could make a deal for it with PRC by throwing India under the bus they would be all too willing.

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India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Peregrine » 19 Dec 2017 16:49

X Posted on the Islamism & Islamophobia Abroad Thread

U.S. vetoes UN call for withdrawal of Trump Jerusalem decision Watch the Video of President Trump's Speech.

UNITED NATIONS (Reuters) - The United States was further isolated on Monday over President Donald Trump's decision to recognise Jerusalem as Israel's capital when it blocked a United Nations Security Council call for the declaration to be withdrawn.

The remaining 14 council members voted in favour of the Egyptian-drafted resolution, which did not specifically mention the United States or Trump but which expressed "deep regret at recent decisions concerning the status of Jerusalem."

"What we witnessed here in the Security Council is an insult. It won't be forgotten," U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations Nikki Haley said after the vote, adding that it was the first veto cast by the United States in more than six years.

"The fact that this veto is being done in defence of American sovereignty and in defence of America's role in the Middle East peace process is not a source of embarrassment for us; it should be an embarrassment to the remainder of the Security Council," Haley said.

The U.N. draft resolution affirmed "that any decisions and actions which purport to have altered the character, status or demographic composition of the Holy City of Jerusalem have no legal effect, are null and void and must be rescinded in compliance with relevant resolutions of the Security Council."

Trump abruptly reversed decades of U.S. policy this month when he recognised Jerusalem as Israel's capital, generating outrage from Palestinians and the Arab world and concern among Washington's western allies.

"In the wake of the decision of the United States ... the situation has become more tense with an increase in incidents, notably rockets fired from Gaza and clashes between Palestinians and Israeli security forces," U.N. Middle East peace envoy Nickolay Mladenov told the Security Council ahead of the vote.

EMERGENCY GENERAL ASSEMBLY SESSION

Trump also plans to move the U.S. embassy to Jerusalem from Tel Aviv. The draft U.N. resolution had called upon all countries to refrain from establishing diplomatic missions in Jerusalem.

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu thanked Haley and Trump for the veto in a video clip posted on his Facebook page.

Israel considers Jerusalem its eternal and indivisible capital and wants all embassies based there. Palestinians want the capital of an independent Palestinian state to be in the city's eastern sector, which Israel captured in a 1967 war and annexed in a move never recognised internationally.

Following the U.S. veto, Egypt's Foreign Ministry said Arab states, which had agreed earlier this month to seek a Security Council resolution, would meet to evaluate the situation to determine what their next steps might be.

Palestinian Foreign Minister Riyad al-Maliki said the Palestinians would seek a rare emergency special session of the 193-member U.N. General Assembly on Trump's decision.

Under a 1950 resolution, an emergency special session can be called for the General Assembly to consider a matter "with a view to making appropriate recommendations to members for collective measures" if the Security Council fails to act.

Only 10 such sessions have been convened, and the last time the General Assembly met in such a session was in 2009 on Israeli actions in occupied Palestinian territories. Any outcome of such a session is non-binding, but carries political weight.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby anupmisra » 19 Dec 2017 19:19

National Security Strategy of the United States of America
DECEMBER 2017

Download here.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/wp-content/u ... 7-0905.pdf

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby anupmisra » 19 Dec 2017 19:31

In the Security Strategy document (a major foreign policy document for the next three to seven years), India (& Indo-Pacific region) is named as a key partner in several places. Here are a few mentions:

Indo-Pacific
A geopolitical competition between free and repressive visions of world order is taking place in the Indo-Pacific region which stretches from the west coast of India to the western shores of the United States, represents the most populous and economically dynamic part of the world. The U.S. interest in a free and open Indo-Pacific extends back to the earliest days of our republic.
U.S. allies are critical to responding to mutual threats, such as North Korea, and preserving our mutual interests in the Indo-Pacific region.
We welcome India’s emergence as a leading global power and stronger strategic and defense partner. We will seek to increase quadrilateral cooperation with Japan, Australia, and India.
We will expand our defense and security cooperation with India, a Major Defense Partner of the United States, and support India’s growing relationships throughout the region.
Priority Actions POLITICAL: We will deepen our strategic partnership with India and support its leadership role in Indian Ocean security and throughout the broader region.
ECONOMIC: We will encourage the economic integration of Central and South Asia to promote prosperity and economic linkages that will bolster connectivity and trade. And we will encourage India to increase its economic assistance in the region.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby chola » 19 Dec 2017 21:16

anupmisra wrote:In the Security Strategy document (a major foreign policy document for the next three to seven years), India (& Indo-Pacific region) is named as a key partner in several places. Here are a few mentions:

Indo-Pacific
A geopolitical competition between free and repressive visions of world order is taking place in the Indo-Pacific region which stretches from the west coast of India to the western shores of the United States, represents the most populous and economically dynamic part of the world. The U.S. interest in a free and open Indo-Pacific extends back to the earliest days of our republic.
U.S. allies are critical to responding to mutual threats, such as North Korea, and preserving our mutual interests in the Indo-Pacific region.
We welcome India’s emergence as a leading global power and stronger strategic and defense partner. We will seek to increase quadrilateral cooperation with Japan, Australia, and India.
We will expand our defense and security cooperation with India, a Major Defense Partner of the United States, and support India’s growing relationships throughout the region.
Priority Actions POLITICAL: We will deepen our strategic partnership with India and support its leadership role in Indian Ocean security and throughout the broader region.
ECONOMIC: We will encourage the economic integration of Central and South Asia to promote prosperity and economic linkages that will bolster connectivity and trade. And we will encourage India to increase its economic assistance in the region.



Great news! The US POV is in lockstep with ours over the PRC and Islam.

The KEY though is Russia. If we stick to our so-called “special” with Russia then we’ll be in the the US camp half-way and then that’ll no different than what we have now.

This security document has named Cheen and Roos as twin pillars of evil. We have to chose forcefully and deliberately. We dilly dally with half-hearted conviction because of some romantic socialist attachment to Russia then we’ll be stuck as we are now.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby anupmisra » 19 Dec 2017 21:54

Al bakistan is also mentioned in dispatches. Pakis are going ape-$hit because of the honorable mentions.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Rudradev » 19 Dec 2017 22:09

https://www.politico.com/story/2017/12/ ... hts-304118

Three months into his tenure as secretary of state, Rex Tillerson alarmed veteran diplomats with remarks that sounded like a potential shift in American foreign policy: The U.S., he said, should be careful not to let values like human rights create "obstacles" to the pursuit of its interests.

The comment, at a gathering of State Department employees, provoked an outcry among former U.S. officials and human rights activists who feared America was abandoning a vital mission. Two weeks later, a top Tillerson adviser wrote up a short tutorial, in the form of a confidential memo to his boss, recapping “the debate over how far to emphasize human rights, democracy promotion, and liberal values in American foreign policy.”

The May 17 memo reads like a crash course for a businessman-turned-diplomat, and its conclusion offers a starkly realist vision: that the U.S. should use human rights as a club against its adversaries, like Iran, China and North Korea, while giving a pass to repressive allies like the Philippines, Egypt and Saudi Arabia.


“Allies should be treated differently—and better—than adversaries. Otherwise, we end up with more adversaries, and fewer allies,” argued the memo, written by Tillerson’s influential policy aide, Brian Hook.



And here is a link to the leaked memo itself:

https://www.politico.com/f/?id=00000160 ... 3f13380001

MUST READ to understand what the thinking really is.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby nachiket » 20 Dec 2017 01:24

Three months into his tenure as secretary of state, Rex Tillerson alarmed veteran diplomats with remarks that sounded like a potential shift in American foreign policy: The U.S., he said, should be careful not to let values like human rights create "obstacles" to the pursuit of its interests.

From Agent Orange to Bangladesh genocide to Gitmo, when have "human rights" ever been an obstacle to the US' pursuit of its interests?

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Rudradev » 20 Dec 2017 03:22

That's not the point. They have never been an obstacle. The leaked memo, however, is the first time we have verifiable evidence that the selective deployment of "human rights violation" allegations is a deliberate and targeted policy instrument of the US State Dept.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby arun » 20 Dec 2017 20:33

Excerpts from the National Security Strategy of the United States of America December 2017.


A geopolitical competition between free and repressive visions of world order is taking place in the Indo-Pacificregion. The region, which stretches from the west coast of India to the western shores of the United States, represents the most populous and economically dynamic part of the world. The U.S. interest in a free and open Indo-Pacificextends back to the earliest days of our republic.

Although the United States seeks to continue to cooperate with China, China is using economic inducements and penalties, influence operations, and implied military threats to persuade other states to heed its political and security agenda. China’s infrastructure investments and trade strategies reinforce its geopolitical aspirations. Its efforts to build and militarize outposts in the South China Sea endanger the free fl ow of trade, threaten the sovereignty of other nations, and undermine regional stability.

China has mounted a rapid military modernization campaign designed to limit U.S. access to the region and provide China a freer hand there. China presents its ambitions as mutually beneficial, but Chinese dominance risks diminishing the sovereignty of many states in the Indo-Pacific. States throughout the region are calling for sustained U.S. leadership in a collective response that upholds a regional order respectful of sovereignty and independence.


India’s emergence as a leading global power and stronger strategic and defense partner. We will seek to increase quadrilateral cooperation with Japan, Australia, and India.


We will expand our defense and security cooperation with India, a Major Defense Partner of the United States, and support India’s growing relationships throughout the region.



South and Central Asia

With over a quarter of the world’s population, a fifth of all U.S.-designated terrorist groups, several fast-growing economies, and two nuclear-armed states, South and Central Asia present some of the most complicated national security challenges and opportunities. The region spans the terrorist threats emanating from the Middle East and the competition for power unfolding in Europe and the Indo-Pacific. The United States continues to face threats from transnational terrorists and militants operating from within Pakistan. The prospect for an Indo-Pakistani military conflict that could lead to a nuclear exchange remains a key concern requiring consistent diplomatic attention.

U.S. interests in the region include countering terrorist threats that impact the security of the U.S. homeland and our allies, preventing cross-border terrorism that raises the prospect of military and nuclear tensions, and preventing nuclear weapons, technology, and materials from falling into the hands of terrorists. We seek an American presence in the region proportionate to threats to the homeland and our allies. We seek a Pakistan that is not engaged in destabilizing behavior and a stable and self-reliant Afghanistan. And we seek Central Asian states that are resilient against domination by rival powers, are resistant to becoming jihadist safe havens, and prioritize reforms.

Priority Actions

POLITICAL: We will deepen our strategic partnership with India and support its leadership role in Indian Ocean security and throughout the broader region. We will press Pakistan to intensify its counterterrorism efforts, since no partnership can survive a country’s support for militants and terrorists who target a partner’s own service members and officials. The United States will also encourage Pakistan to continue demonstrating that it is a responsible steward of its nuclear assets. We will continue to partner with Afghanistan to promote peace and security in the region. We will continue to promote anti-corruption reform in Afghanistan to increase the legitimacy of its government and reduce the appeal of violent extremist organizations. We will help South Asian nations maintain their sovereign as China increases its influence in the region.

ECONOMIC: We will encourage the economic integration of Central and South Asia to promote prosperity and economic linkages that will bolster connectivity and trade. And we will encourage India to increase its economic assistance in the region. In Pakistan, we will build trade and investment ties as security improves and as Pakistan demonstrates that it will assist the United States in our counterterrorism goals.

MILITARY AND SECURITY: We are committed to supporting the Afghan government and security forces in their fi ght against the Taliban, al-Qa’ida, ISIS, and other terrorists. We will bolster the fighting strength of the Afghan security forces to convince the Taliban that they cannot win on the battlefield and to set the conditions for diplomatic efforts to achieve enduring peace. We will insist that Pakistan take decisive action against militant and terrorist groups operating from its soil. We will work with the Central Asian states to guarantee access to the region to support our counterterrorism efforts.


From the US Whitehouse website:

Clicky

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Cain Marko » 20 Dec 2017 21:44

Can we please stop posting the US NSS policy with mention of India highlighted in it over and over again? Does India really crave US approval soo much?

All such noises are fine but what about the fact that tsp was just given a blank check of $700 million?

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Dipanker » 20 Dec 2017 22:31

Rudradev wrote:That's not the point. They have never been an obstacle. The leaked memo, however, is the first time we have verifiable evidence that the selective deployment of "human rights violation" allegations is a deliberate and targeted policy instrument of the US State Dept.



I would tend to think that the verifiable evidence has always been present in terms of the gap in their talk and their deed for a very long time. It is never been hard to see that America preaches one thing and practices entirely opposite of what preaches. One reason as a nation we have been wary of American double standard and perfidy for a long time. Most recent examples of perfidy being the delinking LeT from Haqqani group so that the Paki could be provided with CSF money to the tune of $700 million.


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