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India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

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Peregrine
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India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Peregrine » 10 Jan 2018 15:01

Trump suggests two-phase immigration deal for 'Dreamers'

WASHINGTON: President Donald Trump is suggesting that an immigration deal could be tackled in two phases - first by taking care of the so-called Dreamers and border security, then by making comprehensive reforms to the immigration system.

Trump on Tuesday held a lengthy meeting with a bipartisan group of lawmakers on immigration.

The president says he would need construction of a border security wall as part of an agreement involving young immigrants, but he says Congress could then pursue a comprehensive immigration overhaul in the second phase.

During a wide-ranging conversation with lawmakers, Trump stressed he needs funding for a border wall and changes to the immigration system.

He has said those are necessary for a deal to protect hundreds of thousands of young people who had been shielded from deportation.

Cheers Image

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India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Peregrine » 11 Jan 2018 15:25

Working with countries like India a good thing: Trump

WASHINGTON: Working with countries like India, Russia and China is a good not bad thing, US President Donald Trump said on Wednesday.

He was responding to criticism of his desire to improve relationship with Moscow.

"Working with countries, whether it's Russia or China or India, or any of the countries that surround this world and encompass this world, is a very good thing. That's not a bad thing," he told reporters at a joint White House news conference with Prime Minister, Norway, Erna Solberg.

Trump said he was for strongest military, massive oil and gas and a lot of energy. "Putin (Russian President Vladimir Putin) can't love that," he added.

Trump said it was "very much better" having to do with North Korea where the US currently has a problem.

"That should have never been my problem. It should have been a problem solved many years ago when it was much less dangerous. But it was given to him, along with a big mess of other things," he noted.

He blamed former secretary of state Hillary Clinton, his presidential rival in 2016 elections, saying she "was not was not for a strong military".

"Hillary, my opponent, was for windmills, and she was for other types of energy that don't have the same capacities at this moment certainly," he said.

Trump said it was a "lot better" to work with other countries.

"We're working with China on North Korea. We're working with various other countries, and I think we're doing very well. We had a great talk, as you know and as you reported.

"We had a great talk this morning with President Moon (of South Korea), and I think that a lot of good things are happening. We're going to see what happens," the US president said.
Solberg said Norway has a "very good" relationship with Russia.

"As a neighbouring country we do day-to-day work on things that we have to solve for the people and the economic activity that is in that area, which is a fragile area for the whole world," she said.

Norway share border with Russia.

Responding to a question on allegations of Russian interference in elections in European countries, Solberg said her government has found no such evidence in Norway.

"I think that it's up to every political system and countries to scrutinise and discuss their own political agenda in their countries. And I respect that very much and that this is an issue for American politics," she said.

Cheers Image

ramana
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby ramana » 12 Jan 2018 05:14

https://twitter.com/dna/status/951463709670436866

US ambassador on Trump and Terrorism

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby UlanBatori » 12 Jan 2018 07:05

More on Bleat Phalala's coujin

An Outrageous Injustice Against An AsAm Bank
(If you own a business, view the documentary & worry!)

Abacus Bank, a small bank operated by the Sung family in NYC, was the only U.S. bank to be charged after the Great Recession of 2008.
The bank ultimately prevailed, but it took all they had to fight against the unfair accusations.



The story was recorded in a documentary by Steve James, Abacus:
Small Enough to Jail. It was Broadcast on PBS Frontline in 2017. The
prosecutor spent 5 years and reportedly $10 million on prosecuting the bank for larceny. In the end, the bank and all its employees were found not
guilty on all 80 charges. Deservedly, the documentary is now shortlisted
for an Oscar.

Click here to watch it. I was enraged by the injustice but inspired by how one of the daughters, who was a lawyer, quit her job to help her father in his hour of need. It was such a touching illustration of our AsAm family values. I was also elated to learn that, at the end, the good guys won.

This documentary deserves an Oscar to show that justice still
prevails in the U.S., at least in this case. The Oscar will greatly publicize worldwide the immense injustice caused by Manhattan District Attorney Cyrus R. Vance, Jr.

The Misdeeds of Cyrus R. Vance, Jr.

(1) No sense of justice: He accommodates the strong and takes campaign money from their attorneys:

Excerpts from Cyrus Vance Jr. - Wikipedia "Vance also drew controversy for deciding not to press criminal charges against public figures accused of crimes,
including Harvey Weinstein, Ivanka Trump, and Donald Trump Jr., after which he received campaign contributions from their attorneys."

(2) Adding insult to injury to a weak minority:

Another excerpt from Cyrus Vance Jr. - Wikipedia: "In an effort at
grandstanding, Vance's office orchestrated a show by parading ex-employees of the bank in a chain, handcuffed to each other, in front of reporters. Nevertheless, Cyrus Vance stated in an interview that the decision to exhibit the non-violent ex-employees was due to "security issues." Click
here to watch the documentary. How humiliating! Vance was humiliating powerless citizens to advance his political career. How cruel!


Please forward to your friends in NYC so that his constituents will
know about his misdeeds. He was a good D.A. back in 2010, when first elected. However, power corrupts, he seemingly has become callous and careless. Will the people of Manhattan County still want him, if and when "Small Enough to Jail" wins an Oscar? This could exemplify the immense power for good of arts.

DONATE

S. B. Woo

President and a volunteer for the past 18 years
80-20 Educational Foundation, Inc, a 501 C-3 organization,
http://www.80-20educationalfoundation.org/index.php

To know more about 80-20, view these videos :
https://youtu.be/dB3eGVqG-wAÂ (Ignore the last 35 secs. The election is over.)
http://youtu.be/h781_ECSJYM
80-20 EF Mission Statement

ramana
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby ramana » 12 Jan 2018 11:09

+108

UlanBatori
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby UlanBatori » 12 Jan 2018 21:52

Wasn't Cyrus Vance Sr one of Jimmy Carter's dumbass cousins in the State Dept or something?
Junior is a classic case of DonaldTrumpHaitiName.

These are dark times for Manhattan district attorney Cyrus Vance, Jr., as two high-profile investigative reports—about Harvey Weinstein and Ivanka and Donald Trump Jr.—have revealed that Vance has a suspicious habit of declining to prosecute some of New York’s most powerful people, while, uh, also accepting campaign donations from their lawyers.

Last week, a joint bombshell by The New Yorker, WNYC, and ProPublica revealed Ivanka and Donald Jr. narrowly avoided criminal fraud charges in 2012 for allegedly misleading potential buyers at the flailing Trump Soho Hotel—because Vance dropped the mounting case after a meeting with Donald Trump Sr.’s personal lawyer, Marc Kasowitz. Kasowitz had donated $25,000 to Vance’s reelection campaign before the meeting (money Vance later returned) and went on to donate and raise a total of more than $50,000 in the months after the case against the Trump kids disappeared. Vance now says that, roughly five years later, he’ll return that money, too—but even a lawyer who was on the Trump defense team said Vance’s intermingling with Kasowitz “didn’t have an air you’d like.”

Now, that fishy air is surrounding Vance for the second time in as many weeks after The New Yorker’s disturbing report on Weinstein revealed that the NYPD had been gathering evidence to charge Weinstein with a misdemeanor sex crime in 2015 for groping model Ambra Battilana Gutierrez, but Vance had declined to charge him. Vance cited a lack of evidence—even as Gutierrez, in a police sting operation, had caught Weinstein on tape apologizing for groping her the day before. In a bit of déjà vu, the International Business Times reports that Weinstein Company lawyer David Boies, a former Vance donor, contributed $10,000 to Vance’s campaign in the months after the district attorney decided not to prosecute Weinstein, and that, during Vance’s political career, Boies, his son, and his law partners have donated more than $182,000 to him.


(sigh!) What a contrast to that paragon of courage, Bleat "Cavity" Bhalala!

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby arun » 13 Jan 2018 10:00

X Posted from the Terroristan thread :wink: on the "lessons" India needs to learn from the US for arm twisting the Mohammadden Terrorism Fomenting Islamic Republic of Pakistan :lol: .

shiv wrote:
arun wrote:Xinhua reports that civilian underling in chief to the Uniformed Jihadi’s of the Punjabi Military Dominated Deep State of the Mohammadden Terrorism Fomenting Islamic Republic of Pakistan fronting fictional façade of civilian control over the Uniformed Jihadi’s , namely Defense Minister Khurram Dastgir Khan, has disclosed that the Islamic Republic has suspended defense and intelligence cooperation with the United States amid growing tensions over U.S. suspension of military aid to Pakistan:

Defense, intelligence cooperation with U.S. suspended: Pakistani defense minister

The Voice of America (VOA) on the other hand reports that the US insists its Major Non-NATO Ally has done no such thing :roll: .

:wink: Appears the US may be pretending that her Major Non-NATO Ally, the Mohammadden Terrorism Fomenting Islamic Republic of Pakistan has not stuck a finger up the US backside and wiggled it vigorously by claiming that that no such thing happened so as to not have to act on the tough guy threats they (the US) have made to the Islamic Republic :lol: :

US Denies Pakistani Claims of Suspension of Military or Intel Cooperation


Where are all the rahrah USA smokegetsinyoureyes people who used to come on this thread to say that the US twirls Pakistan around its little finger and that India should learn from the US. Cat got their tongue? Maun vrat?


Indeed where are all the “rahrah USA smokegetsinyoureyes people who used to come on this thread to say that the US twirls Pakistan around its little finger and that India should learn from the US”.

Meanwhile the US adds more lubrication to ensure they do not have to act on the tough guy threats they (the US) have made to the Islamic Republic :lol: . This time via Steven (Steve) Goldstein, their Under Secretary for Public Diplomacy and Public Affairs, who continues to insist that they, the US, have not been informed by the Mohammadden Terrorism Fomenting Islamic Republic of Pakistan of a cessation in intelligence sharing.

Looks the US continues to lay the groundwork to roll back the scale of their military aid stoppage to the Mohammadden Terrorism Fomenting Islamic Republic of Pakistan as even a week after a formal announcement of a supposed and highly qualified cutback in military aid ie: subject to legal obligations and critical for national security considerations (Clicky BRF). Further Steven (Steve) Goldstein could not name a figure for the actual amount of the alleged military aid cutback:

Special Briefing
I. Steven (Steve) Goldstein
Under Secretary for Public Diplomacy and Public Affairs
2. Brian Hook
Director of Policy Planning
Press Briefing Room
Washington, DC
January 11, 2018 ………………………….

QUESTION: Yeah. Another question regarding Pakistan policy. What will be the next step of decision of United State toward Pakistan if Pakistan still keep its old policy toward Afghanistan and United State? Any update?

UNDER SECRETARY GOLDSTEIN: As it relates to the decision that we made?

QUESTION: Yeah.

UNDER SECRETARY GOLDSTEIN: We would hope that Pakistan would come to the table and that they would turn over those terrorists that we have asked be turned over. We’ve indicated very clearly that we are – that we believe that can happen. We’ve only suspended the aid; we have not reallocated the money. So now it is the job of Pakistan to take seriously their commitment to us, and most importantly to the people of Pakistan who would most be hurt by this, by another terrorist – any terrorist activity, and come forward. So our position hasn’t changed. They have not yet come forward, to answer your follow-up question.

QUESTION: One follow-up on this?

UNDER SECRETARY GOLDSTEIN: Yes, sir.

QUESTION: Can you tell us now precisely what is the amount of Foreign Military Financing that the U.S. State Department will suspend pursuant to the President’s decision? You had previously said, I think, or an NSC spokesman said it was about a billion dollars including --

UNDER SECRETARY GOLDSTEIN: Yes.

QUESTION: But it’s a week later, and I wonder if you now have the actual number.

UNDER SECRETARY GOLDSTEIN: I’ll get back to you with the number. You’re correct, though. That is the number that we use – something close to a billion dollars. It’s a series of dollars in different areas that would have to be put together.

QUESTION: Yeah.

UNDER SECRETARY GOLDSTEIN: But again, our hope – and we haven’t reallocated the money. Our hope is that Pakistan will do the right thing for the people of Pakistan because they should want to root out terrorists in their country as much as we want to root out terrorists in their country.

QUESTION: On Pakistan?

UNDER SECRETARY GOLDSTEIN: Yes, sir.

QUESTION: And I brought this up earlier. I don’t know if there’s an answer to it or not. But do you have anything on any kind of recent interaction with the Government of Pakistan on the situation – the case of Dr. Afridi?

UNDER SECRETARY GOLDSTEIN: I don’t, but I will check on that and I will get back to you later today.

QUESTION: Thank you.

UNDER SECRETARY GOLDSTEIN: Yes, ma’am.

QUESTION: Thanks so much. On Pakistan, we understand that officials have said they will stop sharing intelligence and already have stopped sharing intelligence from sources on the ground on the Afghan border with the U.S. What’s your reaction to that? Have they informed you of that? Are you making efforts to see if that’s correct and take action?

UNDER SECRETARY GOLDSTEIN: No, they have not informed us of that. And I checked on that at a quarter to two Eastern Time, and as of that point, that had not occurred.

QUESTION: Do you anticipate that to happen? Do you anticipate the unilaterally cut off the supply?

UNDER SECRETARY GOLDSTEIN: Because, as Matt noted, I have feeling, I am hopeful that Pakistan will do the right thing and turn over the terrorists and honor their commitment.


From the US State Department website:

On-the-Record-Briefing : January 11, 2018

arun
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby arun » 16 Jan 2018 16:29

X Posted from the Terroristan thread.

Peregrine wrote:US trying to convince us that India is not a threat, says Pakistan defence minister

ISLAMABAD: The US has been trying to convince Pakistan that India was not a threat to it and Islamabad should change its strategic stance towards New Delhi, defence minister Khurram Dastagir Khan has said.

…………………..{Snipped}………………

Reading out a policy statement on the government's foreign policy contours and the security situation in Pakistan in the National Assembly yesterday, he regretted that the US played down India's aggressive posturing along the Line of Control (LoC) and Working Boundary, the Dawn reported on Tuesday.

The minister said the perception of India was one of the foundational divergences between Pakistan and the US.

…………………..{Snipped}……………

Khan said that Washington had been trying to convince Pakistan that India was not a threat and, therefore, Islamabad should change its strategic stance.

"But the truism remains true. Both India's capacity and intents are today hostile towards Pakistan," he alleged.

…………………..{Snipped}……………

Khan alleged that "India has amassed men, material and garrisons along the border with Pakistan" and said that 2017 was the deadliest year in terms of LoC violations by India and the killings of civilians.

"India today is a highly militarised and an increasingly belligerent neighbour," he claimed, adding that the unrelentingly hostile and anti-Pakistan stance taken by the current Indian government has reduced drastically the space for any advocacy of peace.

………….{Rest Snipped}………..


As the above article shows, the Mohammadden Terrorism Fomenting Islamic Republic is very clear that India is the enemy.

Given the above and US Acting Assistant Secretary of State Alice Wells reportedly having said to journalist Hamid Mir per the below article that the United States considers the Mohammadden Terrorism Fomenting Islamic Republic Pakistan’s enemy as its own enemy; is the US now saying that India is their (i.e. the US’) Enemy :?:

Pakistan’s enemy is our enemy, says US State Dept official

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Y. Kanan » 17 Jan 2018 13:01

ashish raval wrote:Just one line Good luck to those who suck up to communist regime without any regard for democracy. It will implode it will be when not if..I will say less than 25 years.


Ha! They were saying the same thing 25 years ago. There’s no law of the universe that says you have to have democracy. Indeed, democracy is an historical aberration if you look at the big picture of humanity since the beginning.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Singha » 17 Jan 2018 17:09

the longest lived regimes in world history have been thoroughly mercantile and autocratic, usually a monarchy or oligarchy of some sort.

rome and the ottoman empire come to mind.

the ottomans lasted some 600 years. the western roman empire 500, the eastern roman(byzantine @ constantinople) nearly 1000 years!!

compare that to pax americana of some 70 years, most of which was contested by peer powers and the proposed pax sinica ... ashes and stardust brothers.

the longest lived india empire is the Later Chola around 400 years. the early cholas were said to be 600 years but not as well documented. they were among the more dharmic and hands on monarchs , trade with even faraway rome has been found https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_Cholas

the next longest lived indian empires have been the gupta and mughal around 300 years each. maurya was around 150.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Prasad » 17 Jan 2018 21:10

Wishy washy blah blah as usual about piss progress and mutual help -
https://www.americanprogress.org/issues ... rtnership/

Interesting to see the people involved though.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby ShauryaT » 18 Jan 2018 23:26

Prasad wrote:Wishy washy blah blah as usual about piss progress and mutual help -
https://www.americanprogress.org/issues ... rtnership/

Interesting to see the people involved though.
More on the above. https://www.facebook.com/CentreforPolic ... ign=buffer

Such is the state of what is called "strategic affairs" these days. What a fall! Disappointed with CPR.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby srinebula » 18 Jan 2018 23:34

arun wrote:X Posted from the Indian Foreign Policy thread.

Op Ed by Barkha Dutt in the Washington Post


Sir, sorry if it is OT, and if I am naive, but does BDutt really bring any new insights?
Why to link to her post and drive traffic to the snake pit WaPo.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby ashish raval » 19 Jan 2018 03:03

Y. Kanan wrote:
ashish raval wrote:Just one line Good luck to those who suck up to communist regime without any regard for democracy. It will implode it will be when not if..I will say less than 25 years.


Ha! They were saying the same thing 25 years ago. There’s no law of the universe that says you have to have democracy. Indeed, democracy is an historical aberration if you look at the big picture of humanity since the beginning.


Show me one communist regime apart from Chin that has flourished or is flourishing!! History does not matter it is dynamic and humans evolve so does beliefs and system of governance.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Bart S » 19 Jan 2018 03:33

ashish raval wrote:
Y. Kanan wrote:
Ha! They were saying the same thing 25 years ago. There’s no law of the universe that says you have to have democracy. Indeed, democracy is an historical aberration if you look at the big picture of humanity since the beginning.


Show me one communist regime apart from Chin that has flourished or is flourishing!! History does not matter it is dynamic and humans evolve so does beliefs and system of governance.


China post Deng can hardly be called communist. It might be communist in name, however the only resemblance to other communist states is the authoritarian, single-party rule. Economy-wise it is an odd hybrid of capitalism mercantilism with extremely parochial state backing for local companies to undermine foreign trade partners.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Kashi » 19 Jan 2018 12:36

ashish raval wrote:Show me one communist regime apart from Chin that has flourished or is flourishing!! History does not matter it is dynamic and humans evolve so does beliefs and system of governance.


Communist != Antonym of democracy. That would be dictatorship. Historically, communist regimes have been a subset of Dictatorial regimes.

As far as flourished or flourishing goes. Republic of Korea (SoKo) and Republic of China (Taiwan) were neo-dictatorial for a long time and they flourished.

Taiwan became a representative democracy only in 1990 and RoK became a true democracy only in 1987 with the establishment of the sixth republic, just a year before 1988 Seoul Olympics.

Both these countries were strong and vibrant economies by then.

Singapore is another example.

Even the democracies of the West were not always truly representative for a long long time. At its height, the British empire was hardly democratic in the true sense. Universal suffrage in the UK first happened only in 1918 and that too only for men!! Women had to wait another 10 years for the right to vote. In the US, women were allowed to vote only in 1920 and African-Americans continued to be denied voting rights till 1960s.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby ashish raval » 19 Jan 2018 18:19

Kashi wrote:
ashish raval wrote:Show me one communist regime apart from Chin that has flourished or is flourishing!! History does not matter it is dynamic and humans evolve so does beliefs and system of governance.


Communist != Antonym of democracy. That would be dictatorship. Historically, communist regimes have been a subset of Dictatorial regimes.

As far as flourished or flourishing goes. Republic of Korea (SoKo) and Republic of China (Taiwan) were neo-dictatorial for a long time and they flourished.

Taiwan became a representative democracy only in 1990 and RoK became a true democracy only in 1987 with the establishment of the sixth republic, just a year before 1988 Seoul Olympics.

Both these countries were strong and vibrant economies by then.

Singapore is another example.

Even the democracies of the West were not always truly representative for a long long time. At its height, the British empire was hardly democratic in the true sense. Universal suffrage in the UK first happened only in 1918 and that too only for men!! Women had to wait another 10 years for the right to vote. In the US, women were allowed to vote only in 1920 and African-Americans continued to be denied voting rights till 1960s.

Dont talk about history here!! Historically Napoleon was sleeping on a golden bed means nothing in modern days. South Korea, Taiwan, Japan had massive help from United States and its allies like UK in the past. UK has actually built both Hongkong and Singapore and there is hardly any chini contribution apart from Manpower there.
West has democratic regimes since Greek times however weaker form it has been or intermittent. Americans have democracy since 18th century with nation having hardly 500 years history. World War changed everything in western world so let's keep argument to 20th century once communism arrived on the scene. Anything before that to be compared is beating around the Bush and distraction.
The countries you said were mildly dictatorship because Americans wanted it that way to be strong US ally and build those countries to have spine to stand in region against Chin. Not otherwise..

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby KrishnaK » 20 Jan 2018 00:37

Singha wrote:the longest lived regimes in world history have been thoroughly mercantile and autocratic, usually a monarchy or oligarchy of some sort.

rome and the ottoman empire come to mind.

the ottomans lasted some 600 years. the western roman empire 500, the eastern roman(byzantine @ constantinople) nearly 1000 years!!

compare that to pax americana of some 70 years, most of which was contested by peer powers and the proposed pax sinica ... ashes and stardust brothers.

the longest lived india empire is the Later Chola around 400 years. the early cholas were said to be 600 years but not as well documented. they were among the more dharmic and hands on monarchs , trade with even faraway rome has been found https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_Cholas

the next longest lived indian empires have been the gupta and mughal around 300 years each. maurya was around 150.

Time is a bad comparator of democracies and autocracies - India has been a democracy for 70 odd years and has had 16 elections. The US in its 200 years of democracy has had 56 presedential elections ? How many times has power changed in the Ottman, Roman, Chola, Mughal empires ?

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby ShauryaT » 20 Jan 2018 08:42

Indo-US relations, India and Indian interests as Indira Gandhi saw it in 1972.

India and the World By Indira Gandhi

To our grave concern, U.S. policy as it developed impinged seriously on our vital interests. The admission of Pakistan into the U.S.-controlled system of alliances and the massive supply of arms to Pakistan were ostensibly part of the U.S. grand design against communism, but we cannot believe that the U.S. administration was unaware that these weapons could be and would be used only against India. We took considerable pains to point this out but our protests went unheeded.

Should not the people of the United States ask their government what they have gained from America's activities in Europe and in Asia? Has the United States succeeded in containing communism? On the contrary, has not the U.S. government been compelled to build bridges with the nonaligned and to woo the opposite bloc-the hated Communists? I have no doubt that if we had followed the advice of the Western bloc, conditions in India would have deteriorated and the extremists would have been strengthened.

In regard to Bangladesh and during the December war, the United States openly backed Pakistan at the cost of basic human values. This further strained our relations. I do not wish to analyze the U.S. role at that time or go into the misrepresentations which were circulated. But it is necessary to take note of the dispatch of the warship Enterprise to support a ruthless military dictatorship and to intimidate a democracy, and the extraordinary similarity of the attitudes adopted by the United States and China. Imagine our feelings. The original misunderstanding with the United States had arisen because of our contacts with China, the Soviet Union and Eastern Europe. We find it difficult to understand why, when the U.S. policy toward these countries changed, the resentment against us increased.

But, we have some here, who claim history does not matter, well..

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Dipanker » 20 Jan 2018 09:44

^Apropos the last paragraph, the answer has to be "racism", even much more so back then. For the white supremacists Republicans and the non-liberal types the hybrid Indians figure much lower on the proverbial racial totem pole, lower than the orientals, may be marginally higher than the "shithole" continent dwellers.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Pulikeshi » 20 Jan 2018 12:16

^^^ Your argument falls into the gap of Paki (Aryan TFTA) and Bangladeshi (SDRE) - India was just a spectator :mrgreen:
There is no difference between Republican and Democrats on all these things...
Them both have adorned the hood and the wood of lesser than Übermensch when they so desired... :oops:

Progressive US attitude has evolved along these lines -
India is a basket case and will not feed itself, Them Nehru/IG folks piss us off as they seem to speak British Inglish, but preach Indian morals! Prevent India from becoming a sub-continental power, Prevent India from becoming a regional power in Asia, Prevent India from having any influence in West Asia but maybe economic activity in East Asia is ok, rinse repeate... wait till end of presidency or second term to solve the Cashmere issue! Rinse! Some Repeate!
Prevent India from.... wait, what China is dominating all of Asia. Hey India, can we Quad? But only in the Act East please! :P
I conclude that the US does not know what to do with India ~ just like India does not know what to do with US - democrazy confunds each other!

"Hanlon's razor - "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."


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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Bart S » 24 Jan 2018 18:51

<Deleted Off Topic post>
Last edited by nachiket on 06 Feb 2018 06:03, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Off-topic


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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Dipanker » 05 Feb 2018 13:07


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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby A_Gupta » 06 Feb 2018 02:37

Review of Steve Coll's book "Directorate S: The C.I.A. and America’s Secret Wars in Afghanistan and Pakistan"
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/ ... 95644f67f2
"America’s slow-motion military and policy disaster in Afghanistan and Pakistan"

Coll himself is, in the venerable tradition of newspaper reporting, absent from the narrative, although his harsh judgment of U.S. policymakers is pervasive. Absolutely nothing works; “the United States and Europe,” Coll writes, “have remade Afghanistan with billions of dollars in humanitarian and construction aid while simultaneously contributing to its violence, corruption, and instability.” “Directorate S” is one of the most unrelentingly bleak assessments of U.S. policy of recent years, and it shows, regrettably, that American errors have accumulated beyond recovery. The question is less whether Afghanistan can be saved than how its failure will affect the region. The billion-plus citizens of Pakistan and India have now enjoyed a generation without war, and the fall of Afghanistan could contribute to a premature end to that holiday.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Rudradev » 06 Feb 2018 05:01

A_Gupta wrote:Review of Steve Coll's book "Directorate S: The C.I.A. and America’s Secret Wars in Afghanistan and Pakistan"
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/ ... 95644f67f2
"America’s slow-motion military and policy disaster in Afghanistan and Pakistan"

Coll himself is, in the venerable tradition of newspaper reporting, absent from the narrative, although his harsh judgment of U.S. policymakers is pervasive. Absolutely nothing works; “the United States and Europe,” Coll writes, “have remade Afghanistan with billions of dollars in humanitarian and construction aid while simultaneously contributing to its violence, corruption, and instability.” “Directorate S” is one of the most unrelentingly bleak assessments of U.S. policy of recent years, and it shows, regrettably, that American errors have accumulated beyond recovery. The question is less whether Afghanistan can be saved than how its failure will affect the region. The billion-plus citizens of Pakistan and India have now enjoyed a generation without war, and the fall of Afghanistan could contribute to a premature end to that holiday.


A_Gupta,

Have you seen this video of Abhijit Iyer-Mitra speaking at an Israeli strategic affairs conclave?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Q_yxmvOBiY

Worth a watch for many reasons.

One of the minor interesting things he refers to is a "Track II" meeting between Indian military and strategic community officials and their Pakistani counterparts, somewhere in Gulf... organized by, of all people, so-called counterterrorism expert Peter Bergen and journalist Steve Coll.

Bergen can be seen displaying great hostility towards C. Christine Fair (in her latest, anti-TSPA/ISI avatar) in videos of panel discussions following the release of her book "The Pakistan Army's Way of War". He dismisses Fair's conclusions and bats aggressively for the Pakistanis.

Steve Coll has been known to accuse India (on the record) of human-rights violations and worse in J&K.

Bergen and Coll seem to belong to a new class of clandestine Paki lobbyists in the US. They know the climate in DC policymaking circles has changed unalterably from the pre-9/11 days (especially since 2007 when the full extent of the TSPA/ISI/Taliban nexus became appallingly clear, and 2011's dispatch of OBL in Abbottabad). Terrorism IS the Pakistan story now. They also see that the India story has changed irreversibly since the 1990s.

This new class of Paki lobbyists, therefore, recognizes that it cannot go back to the overt pro-Pakiness of Robin Raphel/Barbara Crossette/Eric Margolis days in the 1990s, there's just no appetite for that. Nor can they pretend a more equivocating position like Uneven Cohen, George Perkovitch, Robert Einhorn etc. were compelled to adopt in the early 2000s.

So they set themselves up as field scholars of terrorism in the Islamic world. They appear on CNN (Bergen) every time there is a terrorist attack in the West, spouting facts and figures, looking stern and thoughtful, warning about radicalization and the impact of "non-state" groups on ordinary Muslims.

They write racy tomes of supposedly "investigative" journalism after spending periods embedded in US diplomatic and military institutions in AfPak (Coll and Steve Inskeep among others)... published in glossy hardback with rear-cover photos of themselves looking serious in flak jacket and aviator sunglasses in some forbidding and dusty place.

They purport to be focusing on the terrorism problem in South Asia. They know that terrorism and Pakistan are now an inseparable story, so they tell it front-and-center... even to the extent of spilling headline-worthy, damningly tasty innuendos about Pak politicians and generals from time-to-time... probably in accordance with leaks from both the US intelligence apparatus and the Pak Army/ISI itself. However, they have seized control of the narrative to shape it in a different way.

The thrust of that narrative is subtly, but invariably, to assert that the US has gone about the war on terror all wrong; that it has chosen the wrong friends and proxies in Afghanistan (like Karzai and now Ghani, both of whom happen to be clearly hostile to Pakistan); that America is somehow entirely responsible for the effects of that war upon Pakistan, and should receive the most blame for the horrific slaughter that Pakistan ("compelled to defend its regional interests through the only means it has, poor thing") visits upon Afghanistan; and that the only way out is to place Pakistan's claimed insecurities (the VERY IDEA of which Christine Fair decimates in her book) at the highest level of priority and use that as a non-negotiable starting point for any solution under consideration.

Something like this:

"Pakistan is first and foremost a victim of terrorism. Pakistan has lost many civilians and soldiers fighting against terrorists who might strike at the US homeland, and this has kept the US homeland safe. And since 2014... India is now controlled by a Hindu nationalist government that has stridently pursued a belligerent approach to Islamabad, rejecting peace talks, ratcheting up tensions on the LoC, and shooting innocent Kashmiri protestors in the eyes with pellet guns. Not to mention spending more on weapons, creating a climate of intolerance, silencing the media, and all kinds of other things which make Pakistan more insecure, more reliant on proxy militias as the only subconventional weapons it has to defend itself from being encircled in Afghanistan. And don't forget, China is making inroads there, so the US must maintain whatever leverage it has by keeping the aid pipeline open no matter how badly Islamabad behaves on the War on Terror or nuclear proliferation fronts."

So it goes with this book. It has the titillating title "Directorate S", which is of course the principal ISI department in charge of liaison with jihadi groups. Thus, it places Coll above suspicion as a Pakistani stooge. But look at the content, at least as reported in the Washington Post review.

it shows, regrettably, that American errors have accumulated beyond recovery. The question is less whether Afghanistan can be saved than how its failure will affect the region.


In effect, it is really America's fault: a narrative designed to play on Clintonista Globalists' affectations of white guilt and shrill hype-rreactionary animus regarding any hint of "Islamophobia".

Also, Afghanistan is GOING to fail and nothing can save it. Implying, of course, withdraw and leave the vacuum to the Pakistanis who will fill it naturally.

The billion-plus citizens of Pakistan and India have now enjoyed a generation without war, and the fall of Afghanistan could contribute to a premature end to that holiday.


In other words, "equal-equal" lives on.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby ramana » 06 Feb 2018 05:20

RD, Can you write this as an op-ed? Am sure Swarajya would like to publish it.

Something Like new faces of US experts on Pak terrorism.

World has been educated about Uneven Cohen etc. but not these duo.

And Unfair Didi is not too liked.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Rudradev » 06 Feb 2018 05:44

Ramana garu, I just pre-ordered the book on Amazon. Would be great to read it and see what further evidence I can come up with from his representation of events.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Mort Walker » 06 Feb 2018 07:37

^^^You would be better off finding the bit-torrent digital copy of this book. There is no reason to line the pockets of terrorist sympathizers like Steve Coll.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Yagnasri » 06 Feb 2018 08:28

Did they not jailed that Torrent fellow and nothing like that available now? I am buying my books now. Evil times.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby ramana » 20 Feb 2018 05:24

X-Post from SEF thread in Mil Forum:
Rakesh wrote:Enabling Indo-U.S. dialogue on the F-35
https://www.stratpost.com/enabling-indo ... ogue-f-35/

There are four broad issues that will need to be discussed between the two countries as part of any conversation on approval for the F-35 Lightning II Joint Strike Fighter for the Indian Air Force (IAF).

1. Fifth Generation Fighter Aircraft (FGFA)
2. U.S. Export Controls
3. Foundational Agreements and Security
4. Lowered Expectations for Make in India



and

Cosmo_R wrote:^^^

1. The FGFA is a science project we cannot afford. What's the number tossed around—$25-30Bn? The IAF does not want it: deliverables aside, it will kill CAPEX needed for ops for the next decade.

"No doubt, the Russians wouldn’t be happy about this, but India has substantial existing and future plans for cooperation with their defence industry that would offset the impact of a withdrawal from the FGFA and could placate their old strategic partners."

Why do we the buyers always have to 'placate' the seller? Besides, we can collaborate with them on stuff we can't get elsewhere and they cant sell to others. Such as SSNs, SSBNs and cruise missiles.

2. Quoting the Dick Verma: "Part of the question is why should we give the technology? What kind of burden sharing or information sharing will India do or provide in the context of this advanced technology?”

Lah di dah! You've been imposing the Pakistan burden on us by giving them stuff. You want an 'Indo-Pacific' strategy? that's burden sharing.

3. Foundational agreements. The LSA was a no brainer. I have no clue on CISMOA or BECA. India has to voice its objection to specifics and get resolution. It has to be India-specific not a boilerplate agreement.

4. Lowered MII expectations. The FACO approach is more than adequate. What we should stress is MII for the F-35 expendables and munitions. Local supply chain for all the MRO items and SDBs, Indian Missile integration etc much like what is referenced here for Israel

http://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/10 ... -any-other

The price of our cooperation on the Indo-Pacific and interoperability has to be (in part) the same F-35 relationship that Israel has.

From our POV, If the AMCA is projected for IOC/FOC by 2035, then assume 2040+. In the interim, we need to learn 5G a/c tactics and supporting tech. There's nothing on the horizon except the F-35. Maybe that is the SEF

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Dipanker » 02 Mar 2018 10:29


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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Arjun » 02 Mar 2018 10:49

Dipanker wrote:American dream becoming more elusive?

This is why Indian immigrants won’t benefit from Trump’s immigration plan

An article that reads on completely expected lines given the newspaper where it appears.

Lets wait to see how the immigration reform actually pans out and the winners and losers. I put my money on merit-based immigration benefiting Indians.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Rudradev » 02 Mar 2018 11:11

Dipanker wrote:American dream becoming more elusive?

This is why Indian immigrants won’t benefit from Trump’s immigration plan


Well-argued, factually based piece that makes perfect sense.

Indian Americans who vote Republican betray the exact same Ambhi Raja-Jaichand- Mir Jafar - Rammohun Roy - Jawaharlal Nehru mentality that has kept our people subjugated by foreigners for millennia.

They are more than happy to support a party whose policies throw vast numbers of fellow Indian H1Bs under the bus (not to mention their own non-citizen family members)... just to gain the approval of conservative white Americans (who will always despise them anyway). Hack thoo.

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India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Peregrine » 06 Mar 2018 23:32

X Posted on the Terroristan Thread

India seeks global power status: Pentagon

WASHINGTON: India seeks status as a global power, the Pentagon's top intelligence chief told US lawmakers on Tuesday, adding that as such New Delhi perceives its strategic forces as necessary elements to achieve that goal.

India has put its first domestically-built nuclear submarine, the INS Arihant, into service, and is set to take delivery of its second nuclear sub, the INS Arighat, in 2018, Lt Gen Robert Ashley, Director, Defense Intelligence Agency told members of the Senate Armed Services Committee.

"New Delhi seeks status as a global power and perceives its strategic forces as necessary elements to achieve that goal," Ashley said.

He said India continues to modernise its military to better posture itself to defend its interests at home and in the broader Indian Ocean region while reinforcing its diplomatic and economic outreach across Asia.

"Continued exchange of heavy fire between Indian and Pakistani forces along the Line of Control poses a risk of inadvertent or gradual escalation of hostilities," he said.

In 2017, the lengthy Doklam stand-off between Indian and Chinese forces along the Bhutan-China border heightened tension between India and China and prompted both sides to increase their forces near the Line of Actual Control, he added.

"We expect that both sides will maintain this elevated force posture along disputed border areas through the remainder of 2018," Ashley said.

On Pakistan, he said Islamabad is likely to proceed with its counterinsurgency operations and border management efforts along its western border while sustaining counterterrorism and paramilitary operations throughout the country.

These efforts have had some success in reducing violence from militant, sectarian, terrorist, and separatist groups, but Pakistan will look to the US and the Afghan government for support against anti-Pakistan fighters in Afghanistan, he added.

"Pakistan is increasing its nuclear stockpile and developing tactical nuclear weapons and new ballistic missile systems. In January 2017, Pakistan conducted the first test launch of its nuclear-capable Ababeel ballistic missile, demonstrating South Asia's first MIRV payload, and in early July, Pakistan demonstrated an expanded-range Nasr CRBM," Ashley said.

He said Chinese military forces continue to develop capabilities to dissuade, deter, or defeat potential third party intervention during a large-scale theatre campaign, such as a Taiwan contingency.

China's military modernisation plan includes the development of capabilities to conduct long-range attacks against adversary forces that might deploy or operate in the western Pacific Ocean.

These capabilities, spanning the air, maritime, space, electromagnetic, and information domains, are most robust within the first island chain, but China is rapidly extending capabilities farther into the Pacific Ocean.

According to Ashley, China's expanding global footprint and international interests are reflected in its Belt and Road Initiative of economic, commercial, and infrastructure projects in Asia, Africa, the Middle East, and Europe.

"Beijing's military modernisation programme is expanding in concert with this initiative to include investments and infrastructure to support a range of missions beyond China's periphery, including power projection, sea lane security, counterpiracy, peacekeeping, and humanitarian assistance and disaster relief," he said.

China's most recent white papers and doctrinal writings emphasise the requirement for an army to be able to secure expanding Chinese national interests overseas, including a growing emphasis on the importance of the maritime domain, offensive air operations, long-distance mobility operations, space operations, and cyber-operations.

"In August, following more than a year of construction, China officially opened a military base in Djibouti and deployed a company of marines and equipment to the facility. China probably will seek to establish additional military logistics facilities in countries with which it has longstanding, friendly relationships and similar strategic interests," he said.

Cheers Image

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby arshyam » 07 Mar 2018 06:18

What is this "global power"? Sounds like we want someone to give us a B Tech degree or something. :lol:

All this to make us sign up for stuff we have no interest in, like fighting the Chinese to the last Indian, while uncle amreeka benignly looks on.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Cain Marko » 07 Mar 2018 08:33

I have a feeling that things might have soured a bit of late between big head and big chest...
1. H1b issue
2. Trade and wto disagreements
3. SEF cancellation
4. JSF cold shoulder
5. Sithsrsmans visit to retrack fgfa

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Rudradev » 07 Mar 2018 13:18

What JSF cold shoulder? Any specific documentation showing that we expressed interest but were spurned on this?

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Cain Marko » 07 Mar 2018 17:49

Rudradev wrote:What JSF cold shoulder? Any specific documentation showing that we expressed interest but were spurned on this?

The other way around... IAF denied interest in the fighter . NS is also off to roos for some chit chat about important acquisitions.


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