India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

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yensoy
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby yensoy » 26 Sep 2019 14:14

pankajs wrote:https://twitter.com/suhasinih/status/1176580376292134913
Suhasini Haidar @suhasinih

Pakistan PM addresses a press conference at the UN, and spends the entire conference speaking about India says he fears a "massacre" and "bloodbath" in Kashmir, expresses disappointment the intl community is not concerned, but offers no proof of his allegations.


IK doesn't need any proof. Convincing the world is not his aim. It will be a bonus if that happens, but the goal is different.

The real aim is to fan the flames of dissent in Kashmir; it is to persuade the Kashmiri youth to revolt when the remaining curfew and restrictions are lifted. It is to show them the dream of freedom if they are willing to die for it. He is basically instructing the Kashmiris "when the curfew is lifted, you should revolt; because such a revolt will be followed by bloodshed from the forces; and when such bloodshed happens, the world will take notice and bring you freedom".

That's why all this talk about an impending massacre, and the world's expected reaction at every speech and every forum, and by every member of the Paki govt.

The target is not the world leadership. The targets are young impressionable Kashmiri kids.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby pankajs » 26 Sep 2019 15:17

yensoy wrote:IK doesn't need any proof. Convincing the world is not his aim. It will be a bonus if that happens, but the goal is different.

The real aim is to fan the flames of dissent in Kashmir; it is to persuade the Kashmiri youth to revolt when the remaining curfew and restrictions are lifted. It is to show them the dream of freedom if they are willing to die for it. He is basically instructing the Kashmiris "when the curfew is lifted, you should revolt; because such a revolt will be followed by bloodshed from the forces; and when such bloodshed happens, the world will take notice and bring you freedom".

That's why all this talk about an impending massacre, and the world's expected reaction at every speech and every forum, and by every member of the Paki govt.

The target is not the world leadership. The targets are young impressionable Kashmiri kids.

Disagree.

Primary aim was to convince the world to intervene with India and get Kashmir resolved in its favor, or at least get the changes rolled back or at the very least bring India to the negotiating table. The message of "impending massacre" and "noclear exchange" which was part of his every rant was primarily aimed at the world to pull them in BEFORE disaster visited south asia. That was the tone and tenor of his message to the world leadership.

First would be a BIG victory even if it was highly unlikely. The second would be a clear victory inside bakistan, with the Kashmiris and globally. It could then be used to incite Kashmiris to further push against the Indian state with more vigor. The third would be a face saved that could be sold as a victory to the baki mangos without any resonance anywhere else.

Dimran achieved none with the end result that he has to go back and face the aam apduls empty handed. The rest of his bakis agenda of "naya bakistan" is failing too. The halo that he has built around himself is fading and it will likely seal his fate. His lament is about that.

As far as his message to the Kashmiris was concerned, he has been on the job from around 5th August while sitting at home. He did not need to travel to New York for that. There is hardly any curfew in the UT of J&K and while the security forces maintain a tight vigil there has been very little bloodshed.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby UlanBatori » 26 Sep 2019 17:26

A_Gupta wrote:Not sure this is relevant to India-US relations, perhaps fits better in the "understanding the US of A" thread.
Issue to meditate over is: "abuse of power".
Further hint: Dawood Ibrahim is not a potential political rival to Modi.

Sorry, posted in wrong thread.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby CRamS » 26 Sep 2019 22:16

pankajs wrote:
"(I am) Disappointed by the international community...There's no pressure yet on Modi," Imran Khan said, adding, "We'll keep putting the pressure."


Talib Khan is trying to be too clever by half. To see why I am saying so, please see following tweet by Aarti Singh Tikoo who is a KP journo. She has given a lot of insightful dispatches from her trips to valley post Aug 5th.

https://twitter.com/AartiTikoo/status/1 ... 9941248000


Aarti Tikoo Singh
@AartiTikoo
Pakistan Army/ISI strategy in Kashmir since 1989: Islamist jihad, cross-border terrorism, stone-pelting, rioting, campaign for human rights of their foot soldiers when India retaliates.

Clueless media’s focus: “Human rights abuse” by India. No idea about who,what,why,when,how!



You see we all know TSP is a bold-faced liar. They have the lest concerns for human rights, they want to enable a reaction from Indian security forces involving collateral damage, and yet India is at the receiving end of this propaganda.

All this, thx to dumb ass western media and our own characterless filthy sepoys.

I puke every time some idiot from our side mocks the Howdy Modi rally, 370 revocation, "Hindu nationalism" etc in some US rag to show how 'liberal' he/she is. I dare say far from being virtuous introspection, this is a character flaw among some Hindus who do it for attention-seeking personal gain by p!ssing on their own. Even Pakis have more self respect and nationalism in the manner in which they universally sing the Kashmir tune in one one voice.

The above strategy is what TSP wants to continue with and does not want to pay a price for it in the form of sanctions, FATF admonition etc. Now when you look at TSP's above thuggery, don't you think Talib Khan did gain something? Trump bahadur far from admonishing TSP asked India to kiss up to TSP. Trump even alluded to 'nuke flash point' when he said you both are nuke powers, work it out.

Bottom line: post UNGA meet, I think TSP's bleed India strategy in collusion with KM will not change because they have Trump's attention. Watching Trump's effusive sucking up to TSP, does anybody here think that should TSP execute a major pigLeT attack for which they readying themselves through drone arms delivery into India etc, Trump will hold them accountable? It will be the same puke worthy 'both sides are guilty' spectacle.

This complicates ModiJi's hope to normalize the valley and integrate it seamlessly with rest of India.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby pankajs » 26 Sep 2019 22:25

Cain Marko wrote:
pankajs wrote:"supplies etc from NATO" is Dead on arrival. How will NATO get supplies to India in Afghanistan? via Bakistan?

1. It is unthinkable that bakis will allow India, that is solely in Afghanistan to defeat baki proxy & plan, to be supplied via it territory.
2. NEVER trust a logistic chain that you cannot fully control or replace.
3. Bunnies and others cannot be defeated in Afghanistan, they have to be defeated in Bakistan. US failed because if failed to take the fight to bakistan.


Sorry - I should've made my post more clear.

When I said supplies via NATO, I meant paid for by them or the UN or whatever, "coalition of the willing". India cannot be expected to bear the burden of supplies and costs.

Wrt 1&2 above: The TSP will have no say in this whatsoever. India could do this on its own via Iran while the US looks away. OR
Trump brokers a deal where India gets a corridor via GB. That way he will earn his INternational Nehru Peace Award and Camp David moment all at once.

#3 Bunnies et al., will be defeated by Afghanistan in Pakistan. India's job will be to secure current strongholds and centers of power for present Afghan govt. And of course to provide support to warring Afghanis who want to chase the bunnies in TSP. In the meanwhile, India will consolidate in GB, encourage Baluchis to do the same as the Afghans. All in all a real pinch for the rascals in Islamabad.

1. The issue wrt a Logistic supply chain via Iran is that we will be hostage to the Iranian objectives in Afghanistan and beyond. Iran has its own idea about Afghanistan and Iran is not like other ME countries. It is willing and able to press its views and advantages rather forcefully. Saudi/America/Israel/etc can vouch for Iran's independence and tenacity.

2. Not sure how persuasive Trump can be with Bakistan to hand over GB to India. You realize that it will mean a loss of direct road access to China and India's direct access to Afghanistan and its western border, two of its greatest fears.

For a route to Afghanistan via GB, India will have to fight it out with Bakistan and possibly China. Why China? Because with India in control of GB it will mean a loss of China's land access to the Arabian sea and an direct entry of India into Afghanistan where the Chinese have plans. Kabab me haddi.

3. Assuming India has capture GB after fending off both Bakistan and China, we have to find a workable route to Afghanistan. The thing is GB is highly mountainous with very few viable path through the area. Remember the path has to be cross into Afghanistan across the GB/Wakhan border. It cannot be a India-Bakistan-Wakhan or a India-China-Wakhan crossing.

Roads on paper are no good. I would suggest proponents of this strategy to check the maps and suggest a probable path. It should be a learning experience for sure no matter what the outcome. There are a couple of other question on this very topic that I had jotted down a while back in another post. Linking viewtopic.php?f=1&t=7757&start=1680#p2377907

Now consider other factors.

4. US may not be ready to let go of the bakis. Othewise, they would have taken the fight directly or or encouraged Afghan forces to go after the bunnies in bakistan. This inspite of suffering quite a number of casualties at the hands of baki backed bunnies. That is very suggestive.

IF my reading of the US-Baki relationship is correct, it is likely that the US will apply its heavy thumb to tilt the scale in favor of bakis on our GB plans.

At the very least, the US/NATO simply refuse to bankroll the Indian play in GB and Afghanistan. Then what? Is India willing to build through GB to Afghanistan and defend Afghanistan on its own money?

5. There is another interesting bit (fact/analysis/whatever) on Afghanistan from while back. I heard that Najibulla would have survived but for stoppage of funds from USSR/Russia. While the payment was prompt, the Afghan government forces kept Kabul protected and with that Najibulla regimen.

Perhaps the situation is the same at present. US might pull out but keep funding the Afghan forces and thus keep bunnies out of Kabul. Americans have trained Afghan forces and they should know. Why give money to India and bring it in when the same money could keep Kabul from falling to the bunnies.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby pankajs » 26 Sep 2019 22:54

CRamS wrote:
pankajs wrote:
"(I am) Disappointed by the international community...There's no pressure yet on Modi," Imran Khan said, adding, "We'll keep putting the pressure."


Talib Khan is trying to be too clever by half. To see why I am saying so, please see following tweet by Aarti Singh Tikoo who is a KP journo. She has given a lot of insightful dispatches from her trips to valley post Aug 5th.

https://twitter.com/AartiTikoo/status/1 ... 9941248000


Aarti Tikoo Singh
@AartiTikoo
Pakistan Army/ISI strategy in Kashmir since 1989: Islamist jihad, cross-border terrorism, stone-pelting, rioting, campaign for human rights of their foot soldiers when India retaliates.

Clueless media’s focus: “Human rights abuse” by India. No idea about who,what,why,when,how!



You see we all know TSP is a bold-faced liar. They have the lest concerns for human rights, they want to enable a reaction from Indian security forces involving collateral damage, and yet India is at the receiving end of this propaganda. { True }

All this, thx to dumb ass western media and our own characterless filthy sepoys. { True }

I puke every time some idiot from our side mocks the Howdy Modi rally, 370 revocation, "Hindu nationalism" etc in some US rag to show how 'liberal' he/she is. I dare say far from being virtuous introspection, this is a character flaw among some Hindus who do it for attention-seeking personal gain by p!ssing on their own. Even Pakis have more self respect and nationalism in the manner in which they universally sing the Kashmir tune in one one voice. { True }

The above strategy is what TSP wants to continue with and does not want to pay a price for it in the form of sanctions, FATF admonition etc. Now when you look at TSP's above thuggery, don't you think Talib Khan did gain something? Trump bahadur far from admonishing TSP asked India to kiss up to TSP. Trump even alluded to 'nuke flash point' when he said you both are nuke powers, work it out. {That Dimran has a strategy is understandable. That was to get International pressure to make India back off on its move. DID NOT WORK. 1. No one censured India. 2.No one asked for a rollback to pre-Aug-5 status. 3. Everyone agreed that Kashmir was a bilateral issue between India and Bakistan. Win for Modi/India. Dimran lost that gambit. That is what Dimran acknowledge!

Several other countries expressed "concerns" and everyone including Trump stated something on the lines that "Kashmir is a bilateral issue between India and Bakistan" SURPRISE! that too is the stated Indian position. Trump's "work it out" == "work it out both of you between yourselves" No different.}


Bottom line: post UNGA meet, I think TSP's bleed India strategy in collusion with KM will not change because they have Trump's attention. Watching Trump's effusive sucking up to TSP, does anybody here think that should TSP execute a major pigLeT attack for which they readying themselves through drone arms delivery into India etc, Trump will hold them accountable? It will be the same puke worthy 'both sides are guilty' spectacle. {"TSPA strategy will not change -- True
TSPA readying a attack on India -- True
Trump will hold them accountable? -- Who cares! Did India ask Trump for help after Phulwama? The era of "obaba - omama" is long gone. You need to get out this fascination of a "gora colonizer" savior syndrome.}


This complicates ModiJi's hope to normalize the valley and integrate it seamlessly with rest of India.{Complication is part of life. get used to it.}

FINALLY I get it! You have a "gora colonizer" savior syndrome!! Boy, you expect US/Trump to solve India's problems. :rotfl: Baba, the era of India going "obaba-omana" is well and truly over. Modi has moved beyond and you haven't kept pace it seems with GOI's thinking. Not to say that Modi will not occasionally tell Trump/US to keep its munna under control.

Let me quote myself from a few pages back. This was again in reply to one of your posts.
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=7355&start=2920#p2382836
pankajs wrote:
CRamS wrote:That said, for me at least, unless and until US can see TSP for what it is, an Islamist terror sponsoring entity against India, and is willing to call TSP on that in unequivocal terms and put its teeth behind it by sanctioning TSP, I don't see India US relations going beyond the kind of 'feel good' bonhomie that we saw yesterday. I don't think India has a right to dictate who US should chose as its friends, but when it comes to terror, a powerful friend of TSP is a de-facto indirect supporter of terror against India whether they chose to look at it that way or not.

Note

1. US has its own interest as has India. It is lazy for India to expect US policy to be driven by Indian interest rather than US's. That we agree on.

2. India has to clean its own shit.

3. Even then, Frump did call out "Radical Islamic Terrorism" and the need to protect In-front of a mainly Indo-America crown and the PM of India. Symbolic but significant AND it was not off the cuff but Frump seemed to be reading a prepared statement judging by the flow and discipline of the whole address. Frump/US are essentially endorsing India's right to go after "Radical Islamic Terrorism" to protect its own people. Cannot be a bigger endorsement of Balakot, etc.

4. Last line can be re-stated to "Every country that maintains diplomatic relationship with Bakistan is de-facto indirect supporter of terror against India". While not wrong in essence, if such a position was to drive Indian policy, India would be left friend-less in the world. International relationship and foreign policy therefore are based on pragmatism hence driven by convergence rather than divergence. The push always is to expand the orbit of convergence. Modi understands that.

5. While US-Bakistan relationship has endured through thick and thin BUT India-Us relationship has come a Loo..oog way from the Nixon/Assinger era or the more recently Clinton/Rafool era. What can be stated with confidence is that the trajectory is positive and will continue to be positive.

More generally, when one looks around the world one comes to the same conclusion about India's relationship with the world barring a few. Even the Gulfies relationship have progresses to a point where it causes a lot of discomfort in bakistan.

As I have stated before and you have validated it again, you keep circling back to the same point time after time. The above quote if from 4-5 pages back. Theek hai.

You have also validate another point of mine about you, stated obliquely before for obvious reasons. Bakis keep spinning victory out of defeat. Your above post comes dangerously close to that kind of logic. Trump did not chastise Dimran publicly, therefore he won and Modi lost. :rotfl:
1. Huston was to dazzle Trump and he was by the standing of Modi with Indian Americans. Reason he compared him to Elvis, a star.
2. Get the world but especially US to keep off Kashmir and Modi was successful, for now. Dirman lost.

Btw, to quote you "this is a character flaw among some Hindus who do it for attention-seeking personal gain by p!ssing on their own". Did you realize you have come dangerously close to doing it yourself? You are plumbing the drains to find a defeat in an otherwise generally accepted victory for Modi/India in this latest episode of the long running India-Bakistan serial?

You of course are doing it from a different angle i.e. a search for a perfect solution/victory for India. Victories are messy but I don't care. For myself a victory is a victory. Food for thought.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby KLNMurthy » 26 Sep 2019 23:25

Manish_Sharma wrote:
Mort Walker wrote:
That means the Democrats have nothing in two years except for rajneeti. India needs Trump in the WH. None of the other candidates except Tulsi will do.


No I don't think Tulsi has any chance, I understand Trump in WH is currently good for us, or at least nowhere as damaging as Biden, Bernie et al.

I was all for Hillary losing and Trump winning, although I thought Trump would turn into enemy very soon but OPEN ENEMY vs Hillary or Bill or John Kerry type STEALTHY ENEMY, I was wrong Trump hasn't turned into enemy, so you are right he is atleast not a major headache for Modi as Hillary would be.

On the other hand Bernie or biden as president would certainly do away with stealthy strategy of Clintons. That will have Modi's Back to the wall who knows what will come out of it? Pokharan 3 Prachand Shakti tests maybe. Suspension of purchase of arms from USA. Maybe good in long run.

But it would certainly be interesting scenario if trump is impeached; what will happen in streets? Right wing vs Left openly fighting in streets? White Whitepower removing the mask. Many white people voted secretly for trump while pretending socially against him. Now they will have THE EXCUSE to side with him openly. Republicans will forget differences and become more integrated as party while as Tulsi showed Democrats will split in fractions.

Bear in mind "impeach"=="framing charges". It doesn't mean removing from office.

Trump will be impeached but he won't be removed from power since that requires 2/3rds majority in Senate. So no question of trumpkins rioting in the streets.

Democrats will pay the political and electoral price for this step without any compensating benefits. It is a deeply self-indulgent and irresponsible act, if they are serious that Trump (actually Trump-ism) is an existential crisis for America & the world.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby KLNMurthy » 26 Sep 2019 23:33

CRamS wrote:A_GuptaJi, thx for posting. Watched the video transcript. Jayshankar was calm, erudite, and to the point. I hope all those dim-wits who scream 'human rights' understood what he was saying about TSP and 370. Only minor nit-pick I have is that towards the end he said one should not look at Kashmir through a communal angle. If not Islamic extremism, WTF else is the problem in Kashmir? Why India shies away from the truism beats me.

He is correct. Should not look at Kashmir with a communal angle. We should focus on the fact that when J&K, which everybody knows just happens to be majority-Muslim, had its "special" status, we had:
- hate crimes & crimes against humanity
- discrimination against women
- criminalization of homosexuality
- disenfranchisement and discrimination against Dalits
- no-growth, no-development rentier low-tier economy

Now we are going to fix all that.

But communal? Heavens no.

This is the difference between a brainy pro like Jaishankar and those of us who jump up & down about Muslims-this, Islam-that, and stare blankly when asked what the end-game of that approach would be.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby KLNMurthy » 26 Sep 2019 23:41

CRamS wrote:A_GuptaJi, thx for posting. Watched the video transcript. Jayshankar was calm, erudite, and to the point. I hope all those dim-wits who scream 'human rights' understood what he was saying about TSP and 370. Only minor nit-pick I have is that towards the end he said one should not look at Kashmir through a communal angle. If not Islamic extremism, WTF else is the problem in Kashmir? Why India shies away from the truism beats me.

From the transcript, a word to the wise:

So I do think that there is a lot that [India and the US] have going for each other, but it needs to be tempered by realistic expectations, by a sense on both sides that neither would automatically and unthinkingly underwrite the position of the other.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby CRamS » 27 Sep 2019 00:19

What is this BS I just read that TSP got UN to clear some funds for Hafeez pig's concubines? What a bloody disgusting joke this is on India. I know India is not on UNSC, and forget "tallel than mountain", but US couldn't block this? UK? France? Russia? At this rate, is there a possibility that not only will TSP not be placed on black list as many have pointed out, but they may even be removed from grey list?
Last edited by CRamS on 27 Sep 2019 00:29, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby CRamS » 27 Sep 2019 00:28

pankajs wrote:
Btw, to quote you "this is a character flaw among some Hindus who do it for attention-seeking personal gain by p!ssing on their own". Did you realize you have come dangerously close to doing it yourself? You are plumbing the drains to find a defeat in an otherwise generally accepted victory for Modi/India in this latest episode of the long running India-Bakistan serial?

You of course are doing it from a different angle i.e. a search for a perfect solution/victory for India. Victories are messy but I don't care. For myself a victory is a victory. Food for thought.



Boss, never, I know you didn't, but please don't me in the same league of filthy scum like those who berate India in NYT, WP, New Yorker etc. What I was lamenting is that Trump has definitely complicated our efforts to bring normalcy post 370. And now as I state above the very real possibility of TSP getting out of FATF grey list.

Anyway, as you say, sometimes victory is a like a 5-test match, not a T-20 blitzkrieg which is what I was hoping post Houston when I really thought US and India are on the same page wrt TSP. And this would have made a big difference, call it gora syndrome or whatever.

OK, lets move on. Now I am waiting to see what ModiJi will say at UNGA, we know what what Talib will puke. Hope he delivers a Bumrah-like unplayable yorker by ignoring TSP and more importantly not even saying a word about Kashmir. And I think he has the luxury of doing so because he goes first and doesn't have to respond to some brazen piece of horse manure from Talib.
Last edited by CRamS on 27 Sep 2019 02:05, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Vidur » 27 Sep 2019 00:42

The UNGA has been successful for us. The PM's diplomacy , the diaspora's Howdy Modi have all gone according to plan. Trump has not said anything that impacts our policies. I am pleased with how things have gone.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby saip » 27 Sep 2019 00:50

CRamS wrote:What is this BS I just read that TSP got UN to clear some funds for Hafeez pig's concubines? What a bloody disgusting joke this is on India. I know India is not on UNSC, and forget "tallel than mountain", but US couldn't block this? UK? France? Russia? At this rate, is there a possibility that not only will TSP not be placed on black list as many have pointed out, but they may even be removed from grey list?

Just a $1,000 probably enough to buy enough condoms for his harem and a few donkeys and pigs.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby saip » 27 Sep 2019 00:51

saip wrote:
CRamS wrote:What is this BS I just read that TSP got UN to clear some funds for Hafeez pig's concubines? What a bloody disgusting joke this is on India. I know India is not on UNSC, and forget "tallel than mountain", but US couldn't block this? UK? France? Russia? At this rate, is there a possibility that not only will TSP not be placed on black list as many have pointed out, but they may even be removed from grey list?

Just a $1,000 probably enough to buy enough condoms for a few donkeys and pigs. You don't want too many piglets and donkeylets fathered by him, do you?

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby hgupta » 27 Sep 2019 02:01

KLNMurthy wrote:
Trump will be impeached but he won't be removed from power since that requires 2/3rds majority in Senate. So no question of trumpkins rioting in the streets.

Democrats will pay the political and electoral price for this step without any compensating benefits. It is a deeply self-indulgent and irresponsible act, if they are serious that Trump (actually Trump-ism) is an existential crisis for America & the world.


I doubt that the Democrats will pay a huge price. The lines have already been drawn and minds made up. It is already divided into three camps - hardcore Trump supporters, never Trump & independents, and democrat supporters. I think the independents in addition to never Trump have made up their mind about Trump and waiting to see if the Democrats have the courage or the balls to stand up to Trump before committing votes to the Democrats. The reason why Trump is so popular with his base is that he doesn't care about the status quo or keep norms. He showed a willingness to piss off a lot of people and his base who happen to be hardcore supporters love him for it. He chose that path knowing and gambling that the independents will follow him because he showed "guts". If the Democrats do not show "guts" they will lose politically. So it is a political calculation that the Democrats must take and show that they have "guts" to take on Trump. Everybody knows that there is no way that Trump will be removed from office. What the nation wants to know if the Democrats can stand up and take on Trump during impeachment.

So I disagree with pro Trump posters on this thread that the Democrats will pay a huge price for impeachment. They will pay a bigger price if they are shown not willing to stand up to Trump such as initiating impeachment proceedings. Like Trump played to his base to retain the support, the Democrats must play to their base and appeal to the independents to retain support. Democrats took over the house on the premise that they will stop Trump. They have to show the nation that they are doing that or they will lose the next elections.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby disha » 27 Sep 2019 04:14

This is very much India-US relations. Modi supporting Trump and one talking about a decisive battle against terrorism and another talking about radical islamic terrorism has changed the tone. And Democrats supporting Jihadi terrorists means die is cast and who wins is imperative to India-US relations.

Now coming to the point, democrats are not focusing on the elephant in the room. Corruption and Nepotism.

By launching this impeachment, democrats have scored a massive self goal. There is *nothing* in the transcript that makes Trump impeachable. Yes Trump discussed 'Biden situation'. 'Biden situation' was created by Biden and impacted Ukraine and it impacted US-Ukraine relations in a sensitive part of the world, particularly coming after Crimea fiasco by Obama. So 'Biden Situation' had to be handled. How can you handle a situation if you do not know the situation?

Now if democrats do not talk about 'Biden situation' they will look clueless corrupt sham party.

Check out here: https://twitter.com/NicoleSganga/status/1177004505726107648

Warren is uncharacteristically flustered. The above garnered some 1M views when re-upped by trumpet https://twitter.com/Liz_Wheeler/status/1177034671453945857?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet

Independents are not against Trump. They are not for Democrats either. If Democrats do not produce a leader which can bring independents who are now 60% of the voters to the table, the can as well give up the race.

At this point, DNC is clueless and is just going through the motion of presidential race.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby A_Gupta » 27 Sep 2019 04:47

There is little question that Trump did is corrupt. Impeachable or not? That is a political decision given that a sitting President can't be contained in any other way. Right political decision or wrong one? Only time will tell. Bring out your snack of choice and enjoy the show.

In any case, India has to get past the point where a specific person is crucial to India-US ties. If India-US relations are purely Modi-Trump chemistry then these will be very volatile.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby nachiket » 27 Sep 2019 04:56

A_Gupta wrote:In any case, India has to get past the point where a specific person is crucial to India-US ties. If India-US relations are purely Modi-Trump chemistry then these will be very volatile.

Gupta ji, we are already past that point except in the minds of people who see "equal-equal" everywhere and can't stop yammering about it. Modi knows how the game is played and that national interest trumps (no pun intended) everything. If Bernie Sanders becomes US president tomorrow, Modi will find a way to charm him too completely ignoring whatever statements he made in the past.

India-US relations are based on economic and strategic imperatives for both sides. There will always be areas of agreement and areas of disagreement. The relations are not going to suddenly go into freefall if Sanders becomes president and neither are they going to suddenly improve by leaps and bounds if Tulsi Gabbard wins instead. Which is why I find the discussion about US politics superfluous as far as India's interests are concerned.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Manish_Sharma » 27 Sep 2019 05:15

^ It's never been about anyone being Trump admirer on brf ever. But opposing the long line of american left the Democrat leaders clintons, albright, john kerry, biden & bernie.

Also hillary and biden supporters here give them LICENSE to be corrupt.

Bharat's relationship with usa will never be institutionalized. "There are no permanent friends or enemies but permanent interests..." is usa motto

So yes it is desirable to have someone who is easier to deal with vs bernie sanders OR joe biden type...

Imagine at this time of removal of 35A and 370 instead of trump it was clintons/bernie/biden was president

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Amber G. » 27 Sep 2019 05:41

One of the top adviser to Joe Biden’s presidential campaign is Amit Jani a very well known and vocal NaMo supporter.
He comes to Biden’s campaign from New Jersey Gov. Phil Murphy’s office. He also worked for other democrats campaign ( Murphy’s 2017, Sen. Bob Menendez’s 2018 campaign.). IIRC he (or his father) was one of early supporters of BJP (overseas friends in US) and is very close to NaMo...
(NaMo and Biden have very good relations..was very apparent in 2014 visit of NaMo)

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Amber G. » 27 Sep 2019 05:55

Meanwhile - NaMo's admiration and respect is certainly not = = to Trump ( or democrats vs Repubs) in the eyes of average Indian Americans. After Howdy Modi event, yesterday, Indian Americans had a fund-raiser in Los Angeles - this was organised by Khurana It was attended by many rich Indian Americans.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Manish_Sharma » 27 Sep 2019 06:55

Amber G. wrote:One of the top adviser to Joe Biden’s presidential campaign is Amit Jani a very well known and vocal NaMo supporter.



In trump vs hillary election closest to her was huma abedin pakistani. Huma Mahmood Abedin who was vice chair of Hillary Clinton's 2016 campaign for President of the United States. Prior to that, Abedin was deputy chief of staff to Clinton, who was U.S. Secretary of State from 2009 to 2013.

If it deterred hilary supporters on BRF?

Be it biden or bernie there core leftist ideology makes them hate Hindus and go easy on islam. Like indian commies leftists liberals progressives they want to secede Kashmir from Bharat. Burkha arundhati sagarika ndtv , Muslim Noor RAMADIN (N. Ram of Hindu) will all have greatest support from bernie biden administration.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Manish_Sharma » 27 Sep 2019 07:12

A_Gupta wrote:There is little question that Trump did is corrupt.



Katie Hopkins
@KTHopkins
Have I got this right?

https://twitter.com/KTHopkins/status/11 ... 90304?s=20

VP Jo Biden’s son works for a Ukrainian company trousering 50k a month

Company investigated by Ukrainian prosecutor

Then Vice President Biden holds up $1 Billion in American aid until the Ukrainian prosecutor is fired.

Yet SOMEHOW Trump is to blame?

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby UlanBatori » 27 Sep 2019 07:17

saip wrote:
CRamS wrote:What is this BS I just read that TSP got UN to clear some funds for Hafeez pig's concubines? What a bloody disgusting joke this is on India. I know India is not on UNSC, and forget "tallel than mountain", but US couldn't block this? UK? France? Russia? At this rate, is there a possibility that not only will TSP not be placed on black list as many have pointed out, but they may even be removed from grey list?

Just a $1,000 probably enough to buy enough condoms for his harem and a few donkeys and pigs.


Have a heart. Those are young women who made the mistake of marrying (or being forced into marriage, ore likely) terrorists, last seen floating headless down the Sutlej courtesy of IA/BSF. Hafeez has a standard program to "marry" any such widows as part of the Life Insurance policy. If the woman is particularly good-looking, Hafeez sends the hubby ASAP on a mission to Houristan. I know, I know, no need for sympathy for terrorists or their relatives, but...

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby UlanBatori » 27 Sep 2019 07:21

Just occurred to me: :idea: Like Pakistan is Biggest Victim of Terrorism, guess who are the Biggest Victims of TrumpBilaryism:
BRF postors drawn by the latest donkey-elephant dance to the Standing Under the United States or the India-US Relations dhagas and get banned. :shock: :eek:
Time to exit.
Just note as I do so, that there is/was a guy last name Jani who went to a US prof of international relations and security, to ask how to get US govt to overthrow NaMo's govt. Pissikist IIRC.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby UlanBatori » 27 Sep 2019 07:29

UBCN prediction is that Biden will drop out of race citing health reasons. Sanders will drop, period, from sheer weight of stupidity. Warren, given an open goal to shoot for the nomination, will do something or other really stupid, she has that pakiness about her. Eventual Democrat candidate is likely to be a late-comer, maybe southerner, who survives by virtue of complete nobodyness and know-nothing-ness. Probably a Southern Baptist EJ.
Trump will be 78 come election time, hain? Wonder what keeps him going, except to continue Executive Immunity. Promise him immunity and he may quit in a flash.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby A_Gupta » 27 Sep 2019 07:45

SEPTEMBER 26, 2019 / 8:09 PM / UPDATED 2 HOURS AGO
U.S. hopes to see rapid action on lifting Kashmir curbs: official

NEW YORK (Reuters) - The United States hopes to see rapid action by India to lift restrictions it has imposed in Kashmir and the release of detainees there, the senior U.S. diplomat for South Asia said on Thursday.

Alice Wells, the acting assistant secretary of state for South Asia, referred to a plan laid out by Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi for restoring political life in Jammu and Kashmir after India last month removed the decades-old autonomy it had enjoyed under India’s constitution.

“I think we are interested in knowing the next steps,” she told reporters. “We hope to see rapid action in the lifting of restrictions and the release of those who have been detained.”
...
Trump this week reiterated that he would be willing to mediate between India and Pakistan over Kashmir. Wells said Modi had made clear he was not seeking mediation.

Wells added that “a lowering of rhetoric would be welcome, particularly between two nuclear powers.”

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby A_Gupta » 27 Sep 2019 07:50

Manish_Sharma wrote:
A_Gupta wrote:There is little question that Trump did is corrupt.



Katie Hopkins
@KTHopkins
Have I got this right?

https://twitter.com/KTHopkins/status/11 ... 90304?s=20

VP Jo Biden’s son works for a Ukrainian company trousering 50k a month

Company investigated by Ukrainian prosecutor

Then Vice President Biden holds up $1 Billion in American aid until the Ukrainian prosecutor is fired.

Yet SOMEHOW Trump is to blame?


No, you've got it quite wrong.
But you won't understand that from a tweet.
You gotta read.
https://www.justsecurity.org/66271/time ... rainegate/

Since it is like to be TL;DR, here's a few sentence summary.
Ukrainian prosecutor Shokin was dragging his feet on investigating Mykola Zlochevsky, owner of Burisma. In particular in 2015, the US ambassador to Ukraine Geoffrey Pyatt criticized Shokin for not cooperating with a British investigation started in 2014, so that Zlochevsky was let off by a British court in Jan 2015 " finding that none of the evidence “establishes reasonable grounds for a belief that his assets were unlawfully acquired as a result of misconduct in public office.” The ambassador criticized '“officials at the PGO’s office” for not providing documents that were needed for the British investigation of Burisma owner Zlochevskiy and effectively allowing Zlochevskiy to transfer $23 million of what Pyatt says were Ukrainian taxpayer assets to Cyprus.'

Shokin was the prosecutor that Joe Biden wanted and caused to be fired. The next prosecutor, Yuriy Lutsenko, uncovered evidence of wrong-doing by Paul Manafort. etc., etc.

PS: Why Burisma took on Hunter Biden as a member of Board of Directors when the US & UK governments were going after Zlochevsky, Burisma's majority shareholder, deserves as much scrutiny as the Trump children get.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Deans » 27 Sep 2019 10:38

Both Biden and Kerry's sons work for the same private equity company. It is partly funded by the Chinese. They have done deals with countries just after either parent visited. The $ 2.5 Billion they raised is unusual for a new PE firm. That's nepotism which seems as bad as anything in India. What the actual facts are, may not be as relevant as perception. I think this will damage Biden more than Trump, because most of those who feel Trump's actions were wrong wouldn't vote for him anyway.
Last edited by Deans on 27 Sep 2019 16:19, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby chetak » 27 Sep 2019 11:21

Deans wrote:Both Biden and Kerry's sons work for the same private equity company. It is partly funded by the Chinese. They have done deals with countries just after either parent visited. That's nepotism which seems as bad as anything in India. What the actual facts are may not be as relevant as perception. I think this will damage Biden more than Trump, because most of those who feel Trump's actions were wrong wouldn't vote for him anyway.


sirji,

This refines the meaning of the word "incestuous". :mrgreen:

just like the clinton cash scam.

are we sure that biden is an ameriki politician and not an Indian one.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby sooraj » 27 Sep 2019 11:34

Trump Throws Mike Pence Under the Bus: ‘I Think You Should Ask for VP Pence’s Conversations’ :lol:

Trump urged an investigation of his own vice president.

“And I think you should ask for VP Pence’s conversation, because he had a couple of conversations also,” Trump suggested.

He then said he would release the transcripts of Pence’s communications.

“But the word is that they’re going to ask for the first phone conversation. You can have it any time you need it. And also Mike Pence’s conversations, which were I think one or two of them,” Trump offered. “They were perfect. They were all perfect.”

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby pankajs » 27 Sep 2019 15:43

Most western countries can now spot BS being bakis love for Kashmir. They have realized that it is not their love for human rights or Muslims of Kashmir. Rather is a naked lust for more territory and an urge to break India starting with Kashmir.

https://twitter.com/shauntandon/status/ ... 1372297218
Shaun Tandon @shauntandon

Alice Wells, the top US diplomat for South Asia, says of Imran Khan's outspoken criticism of India on #Kashmir: "I would like to see the same level of concern expressed about Muslims who have been detained in western China, literally in concentration-like conditions" #Uighurs

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby CRamS » 27 Sep 2019 20:03

ModiJi speech going on now. So far steady opening. He quotes a Tamil poet in Tamil.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby CRamS » 27 Sep 2019 20:07

I can bet my last penny that ISI is writing Talib's speech that will copy many of ModiJi's talking points including plastic ban, UN peacekeeping etc :-).

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby nachiket » 28 Sep 2019 01:26

Mod-Note: How many times do people have to be told not to discuss US politics on the India-US relations thread? What does India have to do with the Trump-Biden-Ukraine cesspool? I am going to start handing out warnings and bans now. Don't complain later if you refuse to heed now.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Mort Walker » 28 Sep 2019 03:45

When does Modiji go home? It seems he’s been in the US since Sunday Sep. 22.

The PMs activities in the US were important including Howdy Modi and meeting with business leaders, but there’s a lot of stuff going on at home.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby salaam » 28 Sep 2019 03:56

Mort Walker wrote:When does Modiji go home? It seems he’s been in the US since Sunday Sep. 22.

The PMs activities in the US were important including Howdy Modi and meeting with business leaders, but there’s a lot of stuff going on at home.


Flying back right now:
https://twitter.com/meaindia/status/117 ... 28544?s=21

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby Mort Walker » 28 Sep 2019 04:23

nachiket wrote:Mod-Note: How many times do people have to be told not to discuss US politics on the India-US relations thread? What does India have to do with the Trump-Biden-Ukraine cesspool? I am going to start handing out warnings and bans now. Don't complain later if you refuse to heed now.


Not directly, but some right wing nuts will start shooting people of color if Trump is impeached. As in the past, Indians and Indian origin people have been easy targets. I think the MEA needs to issue a travel warning for late October, when impeachment process starts due to the cesspool, updated weekly to Indians who are in the US or traveling to the US. The Indian consulates and embassy should be prepared with a help hotline.

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby A_Gupta » 28 Sep 2019 20:09

Lockheed to begin supplying F-16 wings from Indian plant in 2020

Read more at:
//economictimes.indiatimes.com/articleshow/71323403.cms?utm_source=contentofinterest&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=cppst

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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Postby A_Gupta » 28 Sep 2019 20:29

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/09/27/white-h ... china.html
The White House is weighing some curbs on U.S. investments in China, a source familiar with the matter told CNBC. This discussion includes possibly blocking all U.S. financial investments in Chinese companies, the source said.

It’s in the preliminary stages and nothing has been decided, the source said. There’s also no time frame for their implementation, the source added.

Restricting financial investments in Chinese entities would be meant to protect U.S. investors from excessive risk due to lack of regulatory supervision, the source said.


Bloomberg News first reported earlier on Friday that Trump administration officials are considering ways to limit U.S. investors’ portfolio flows into China, including delisting Chinese companies from American stock exchanges and preventing U.S. government pension funds from investing in the Chinese market.


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