India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 25 Feb 2020 18:37

Invited as an ex-PM, MMS should have gone even while the rest of the CON people skipped.

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 25 Feb 2020 18:40

Trump's Presser is done. No major stinker. Theek hai.

There was no Modi/Trump joint press-con, it was to ensure that Modi did not have to face the inevitable question on CAA. Modi will talk on it only when it he is ready.

ArjunPandit · Post by **ArjunPandit** » 25 Feb 2020 18:41

pankajs wrote:Invited as an ex-PM, MMS should have gone even while the rest of the CON people skipped.

he knows he'll be dead the day he crosses madamji

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 25 Feb 2020 19:00

UBCN fly-on-da-wall sources indicate that the visitor got the JKL counter-terror presentation as well as the CAA funding sources presentation - and maybe an Official Protest about the US media noise on the same. After all he is POTUS, so what happens in POTUS is his responsibility. May have been music to his ears as he is thinking of the tweets and talking points for his own followers about how MSM is on terrorists' side. JKL/CAA plainly vindicate his Travel Ban and immigration guidance on the Bissful.

He **MAY*** make some obligatory fa*t on "relijus phreedom" to please his EJ voters but this should be ignored.

Re: Guess Hu Came 2 Dinner. Come on! Its the Nimbu Pani and salad menu. Old folks probably decided to stay home. Besides, Amit Shah's fauj may have applied the IR sensor to them and sent them into 14-din Quarantine.

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 25 Feb 2020 19:17

pankajs wrote:Trump's Presser is done. No major stinker. Theek hai.

There was no Modi/Trump joint press-con, it was to ensure that Modi did not have to face the inevitable question on CAA. Modi will talk on it only when it he is ready.

From the fake news website....

Trump concludes India visit without major agreements
https://www.cnn.com/2020/02/24/politics ... index.html
25 Feb 2020

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 25 Feb 2020 19:28

Meanwhile from the Russians:

'Big trade deal' between US & India on the way, Trump & Modi say. 25 Feb, 2020 13:00 / Updated 27 minutes ago
...pledged to seal a comprehensive trade accord soon as the two sides are engaged in "positive" talks on the matter.
"Our commerce ministers have had positive talks on trade. Both of us have decided that our teams should give legal shape to these trade talks. We also agreed to open negotiations on a big trade deal," said Modi during a joint statement with Trump outside Hyderabad House in New Delhi on Tuesday.

And .. I like this guy's style. 2nd OpEd that I have seen on ArrTeedotcom

Sorry, Western Media: Delhi violence is unlikely to upset Trump or Modi
Ashish Shukla is a senior journalist and geopolitical analyst based in India, author of ‘How United States Shot Humanity.’ He runs the NewsBred website. Follow him on Twitter @ashish40411
25 Feb, 2020 09:44 / Updated 3 hours ago

India feels the sideshow of violence in the capital, even as the United States president Donald Trump wraps up his two-day visit on Tuesday, is nothing but a manufactured tragedy.
Seven people, including a policeman, lost their lives on New Delhi roads, which coincided with the hours of the Trump's visit to India on Monday-Tuesday, eliciting a blunt quip from India's minister-of-state, home affairs, Mr G Kishan Reddy: "This violence is orchestrated with an eye on the US president's visit."
The purported projection is for this to be a clash between protesters and supporters of India's new Citizenship Act, where minorities from three neighboring Islamic states of Pakistan, Afghanistan and Bangladesh are being fast-tracked, but not Muslims, which the Indian government deems not to be a minority in these three Islamic nations. ... an attempt to 'internationalize' the Citizenship Act among the religious and human right groups in the US Congress, bring in European Union parliament, kick-off debates in World Economic Forum — a la Kashmir — and bring India to its knees. It's a time-tested Western modus operandi which the free world has witnessed in countries as diverse as China (Hong Kong), Ukraine, Middle East, Africa and Latin America.
It's a mechanism which is not lost on India, and certainly not on Trump, whose contempt for 'orchestrated' news is well-known. The violence in the Capital is unlikely to sour the taste in his mouth, or upset Modi beyond a degree. Both are self-made leaders.

sooraj · Post by **sooraj** » 25 Feb 2020 19:57

India-U.S. Defence Deal: Bernie Sanders Slams Donald Trump For Selling Weapons To India

“Instead of selling $3 billion in weapons to enrich Raytheon, Boeing and Lockheed, the United States should be partnering with India to fight climate change,” Sanders said in a tweet, the first by a Democratic presidential candidate on Trump's India visit. “We can work together to cut air pollution, create good renewable energy jobs, and save our planet.”

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 25 Feb 2020 20:04

who knew that trump could be diplomatic too

twitter

In the end @realDonaldTrump sidestepped the 4 issues journos tried to bait him with:
1) CAA—India’s internal affair
2) Kashmir— India can handle it
3) Delhi violence— No comment
4) Religious freedom—200m Muslims in India enjoy religious freedom as do Christians.

ArjunPandit · Post by **ArjunPandit** » 25 Feb 2020 20:43

sooraj wrote:India-U.S. Defence Deal: Bernie Sanders Slams Donald Trump For Selling Weapons To India

“Instead of selling $3 billion in weapons to enrich Raytheon, Boeing and Lockheed, the United States should be partnering with India to fight climate change,” Sanders said in a tweet, the first by a Democratic presidential candidate on Trump's India visit. “We can work together to cut air pollution, create good renewable energy jobs, and save our planet.”

quoting chinese script..there was a tucker carlson video, in which he quashed bb for wrongly stating that India is the biggest contributor to greenhouse gases by contributing 7% instead of 21% by china..

Rishi_Tri · Post by **Rishi_Tri** » 25 Feb 2020 21:12

From the Dinner:

President Trump said: We shall be back.

Among very limited invitees to Presidential Dinner,

BSY, Sudhir Choudhary (Zee News), and KCR.

This is out of topic but can't help say: Glad to see BSY, Sudhir there as they are finally getting their due. BSY should be sent on circuit of Mumbai, Bhopal, and Ranchi - things shall fall into place themselves.

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » 25 Feb 2020 21:44

sooraj wrote:"We can work together to cut air pollution, create good renewable energy jobs, and save our planet.”

Someone should tweet him a photo of the largest solar facility in the world (2050 MW) in Karnataka

https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/india ... 49171.html

Manish_Sharma · Post by **Manish_Sharma** » 25 Feb 2020 21:49

chetak wrote:who knew that trump could be diplomatic too

twitter

In the end @realDonaldTrump sidestepped the 4 issues journos tried to bait him with:
1) CAA—India’s internal affair
2) Kashmir— India can handle it
3) Delhi violence— No comment
4) Religious freedom—200m Muslims in India enjoy religious freedom as do Christians.

hussein obama , clinton OR any dem would have used this opportunity pile on shame upon Bharat; specifically Hindus....

I am happy Trump defeated huma and porkis lover hillary....

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 25 Feb 2020 21:58

Yes, brilliant step by Trump to not rake up all this BS on an India trip unlike that shameless ingrate Obama.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 25 Feb 2020 22:39

Mort Walker wrote:
ramana wrote:Anyone know what the hold up for the trade deal is?
And whats with the GSP benefits cancellation and subsequent retaliation?
For all the "ahead of th ecurve", I haven't seen much discussion on the commodities affected and whats the story?
On GSP, Suraj discussed it and I mentioned it as well. GSP withdrawal has made no difference to Indian exports, but is a bargaining chip. The US views India as developed, so GSP isn’t coming back.

I don’t think Modi govt. wants to get into a trade deal which will be seen as a political favor to Trump. They would rather wait until Nov., lest India being seen as involved in US elections.

Commodities exports to India must abide by India’s religious customs and food purity laws. No animal byproducts in dairy.

There has been talk of an eventual FTA. That would be something of a marvel, but we will have to wait on it. Let’s see what comes of the talks on Tuesday.

In calendar year 2019, India-US trade in goods and services was $160 billion, or about 5% of India’s GDP. There is no reason why it can’t go up to $200 billion by 2025. I think for 2020, India-US trade in goods will hit the $100 billion mark. It would make India the 7th largest trading partner of the US.

Merchandise trade offers an incomplete picture of total Indo-US trade volume. Most people aren't aware, but India's services exports have grown dramatically in recent years. Merchandise exports total about $330 billion a year now. Services exports are an estimated $220 billion for current fiscal year. We are the 6th biggest services exporter in the world. Almost 60% of those services exports have the US as a destination. We run an approx $70 billion services trade surplus, and the services imports likewise are ~60% from the US. In other words, Indo-US services gross trade volume is approx $220 billion, which is more than 2x current merchandise trade volume.

In comparison, Sino-Indian services trade volume is negligible. The Indo-US gross trade volume therefore far exceeds the Sino-Indian one. At $330 billion or so, Indo-US gross trade volume is larger than the GDPs of most countries. Sino-US services trade was approx $80 billion in 2018, i.e. Indo-US services trade is approx 3x that figure. We run a large merchandise trade surplus with the US. We run an even larger services trade surplus with the US. With China, it's the other way around - the US runs a large services trade surplus against them and a corresponding large merchandise trade deficit that's 2x their services trade surplus. In summary the Indo-US trade has been very beneficial to us.

KLNMurthy · Post by **KLNMurthy** » 25 Feb 2020 23:09

All those upset over the supposedly obsequious welcome to Trump should think about the sneaky, gangsta power play by the Mudi: serving the cows-only eater nothing but veggie food, that too, broccoli samosas, whatthebleddyhellisthat?

Kakkaji · Post by **Kakkaji** » 25 Feb 2020 23:16

No, there was non-veg also. Was reported in TOI I think Standard fare from Rashtrapati Bhavan chef

dnivas · Post by **dnivas** » 25 Feb 2020 23:20

ArjunPandit wrote:
sooraj wrote:India-U.S. Defence Deal: Bernie Sanders Slams Donald Trump For Selling Weapons To India

quoting chinese script..there was a tucker carlson video, in which he quashed bb for wrongly stating that India is the biggest contributor to greenhouse gases by contributing 7% instead of 21% by china..

Good Point. Here is the video. good fact check there by Tucker

Time 4:24

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 25 Feb 2020 23:24

Suraj,

Where are you getting the data of $330 billion/yr for gross India-US trade in goods and services? I’ve only seen $146-160 billion/yr.

The trade in goods is not just merchandise, but trade in steel and machinery. This production is important for India as it involves improving domestic capabilities and large scale employment.

KLNMurthy · Post by **KLNMurthy** » 25 Feb 2020 23:26

Kakkaji wrote:No, there was non-veg also. Was reported in TOI I think Standard fare from Rashtrapati Bhavan chef

Arre just say it was veggie-only yaar. It’s much better Propagandu for our side and it has much more traction.

There is no Big Teacher in the sky giving marks and lollipops for pinpoint accuracy in things like this, at least let’s learn something from our enemies.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 25 Feb 2020 23:37

Mort Walker wrote:Suraj,

Where are you getting the data of $330 billion/yr for gross India-US trade in goods and services? I’ve only seen $146-160 billion/yr.

The trade in goods is not merchandise, but trade in steel and machinery. This production is important for India as it involves improving domestic capabilities and large scale employment.

"Merchandise" is a term used in the econ domain to distinguish physically shipped trade from trade in intangibles (software, IP, etc). So as such I'll continue to use that, so please don't overload the term further.

Merchandise trade figures are what are normally quoted in conversation, since services trade is typically not commonly mentioned. Part of this is because merchandise trade can be tallied based on customs figures, whereas services trade is usually seen in the form of accumulation in deposits with the respective national central banks. In India, the DGFT (directorate general of foreign trade, under Commerce Ministry) reports merchandise trade, while services trade figures are reported only by RBI.

As you mentioned, Indo-US merchandise trade is ~$100 billion. India exports $220 billion of services, and imports approx $150 billion. Of these, the US is the partner of 60% of this services trade, and that has been the historical norm. 60% of the sum is ~$220 billion, add another $100B+ in merchandise trade and you have ~$330B I quoted earlier.

I'm aware that my figures don't line up with USTR data, and I'm not sure what the basis of their figures are. I'm assuming it's partly an accounting issue with the US side, since several US MNCs recognize revenues outside of US for tax purposes. It doesn't change the fact that India's services exports are known (RBI gets to know in the form of actual USD receipts), and that ~60% of services trade is conducted with US entities as India identifies them. That it may be recognized differently at their end is most likely a result of corporate taxation and revenue recognition structure since services trade is not a movement of physical items.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 25 Feb 2020 23:38

It was a celebratory welcome, nothing obsequious. Lack of a trade deal announement - nicely smoothed over by NaMo - shows that it's very much a good relationship of negotiations. Broad parameters no doubt agreed between NaMo and DT. I like the vibes from this vijit.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 26 Feb 2020 00:13

Suraj,

I would like to see a rapid growth in merchandise trade with the US as it would lead to improved production of metals, drugs, machinery and consumer products. India would be importing complex electro-mechanical merchandise from the US which would help the industries of healthcare, farm production, electronics, aerospace and defense. Additionally, merchandise trade would help considerably toward higher employment rates as it would employ more people in the labor pool.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 26 Feb 2020 00:16

Sure, those are all fine, but the earlier comment was about another topic

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 26 Feb 2020 01:27

UlanBatori wrote:It was a celebratory welcome, nothing obsequious. Lack of a trade deal announement - nicely smoothed over by NaMo - shows that it's very much a good relationship of negotiations. Broad parameters no doubt agreed between NaMo and DT. I like the vibes from this vijit.

Over all good visit.
The trade deal finer points will be negotiated per guidelines agreed to by NaMo and DT.
And after Novemeber elections.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 26 Feb 2020 03:03

I think that the big US-India-Oirope-Korea-Japan response to COVID jollies is what the WSJ said in its "shot heard around the world in Beijing":

XXXX is an unreliable supplier.

All eej Fair N Lovely in sex and war... So this is the likely topic of top-level "trade" discussions: how to hinder a repeat of the mindless out of control invasion of the cheen virus. BEST OPPORTUNITY IN 20 YEARS. DT is coming off a so-so outcome in his trade bissing contest with Eleven. Oirope is nearly de-briefed and on the way to Chapter 13. India is no doubt hurting. Japan is stuck in flat economy for the past 15 years. SoKo, well... is not a threat to anyone yet.

My take is that nations might decide that it is halal to ensure that supplies of any item are not "sole-sourced" involuntarily by dumping practices -

1) by reverse price controls: banning sale below a certain price, by a prohibitive "sales tax".
2) permitting under Dubya-Tee-See, subsidies to indigenous entities or other suppliers using the above tax.

US DoD, for instance, will not permit all but one of suppliers for critical components to go bust. Same may be declared halal in several non-military Critical Items. If the above gang up, there is nothing much that cheen can do about it.

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 26 Feb 2020 08:26

Suraj wrote: ... Ivanka . It’s nothing to do with the leader in question but Ivanka herself - a profusely plastic surgery filled airhead acting as the emissary of a father who’s equally out of place. No one looks good around her because they’ve no idea how to deal with her . She’s not a peer, an intellectual, or even educated

She went to Ivy League and then Georgetown.

Wikipedia wrote: Education
Georgetown University
University of Pennsylvania (BSc)

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 26 Feb 2020 08:31

She went to Georgetown but bought her degree from UPenn?

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 26 Feb 2020 08:35

saip wrote:No it is not. At least I can read it and I am not a subscriber. May be my solution is also illegal and so i deleted it.

One can read up to 5 articles for a certain period - I think 5 per week. That said, please do subscribe. They need our support. I subscribe to both online and print. I asked them to send my print copy to JNU.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 26 Feb 2020 09:28

Vayutuvan wrote:
Suraj wrote: ... Ivanka . It’s nothing to do with the leader in question but Ivanka herself - a profusely plastic surgery filled airhead acting as the emissary of a father who’s equally out of place. No one looks good around her because they’ve no idea how to deal with her . She’s not a peer, an intellectual, or even educated
She went to Ivy League and then Georgetown.

Wikipedia wrote: Education
Georgetown University
University of Pennsylvania (BSc)

A silver spoon legacy admit to the same place as daddy, who also transferred in . What sign of educated competence has she shown ? Her fashion labels gone, just like many of daddy’s businesses .

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 26 Feb 2020 10:00

I find MMS R3 and others think that they are a blessing on the unwashed natives. So where is the question of respect or commitment for the national cause?

mahadevbhu · Post by **mahadevbhu** » 26 Feb 2020 16:19

http://ajaishukla.blogspot.com/2020/02/ ... tegic.html

" “Today, President Trump and I have taken a decision to raise our partnership to the level of a comprehensive global strategic partnership,” said Prime Minister Narendra Modi, addressing the media after bilateral talks in New Delhi on Tuesday.

Modi and Trump agreed to galvanize the Quadrilateral Initiative (Quad), which could become an important element in the Indo-Pacific strategic architecture, bringing together democracies that are wary of a rising China.

“Together, the Prime Minister and I are revitalizing the Quad Initiative with the United States, India, Australia, and Japan. Since I took office, we have held the first Quad ministerial meeting… and expanded cooperation on counterterrorism, cybersecurity, and maritime security to ensure a free and open Indo-Pacific,” stated Trump.

Over the preceding 15 years, New Delhi has avoided alienating China by walking a delicate line on initiatives like the Quad, and on exercises and operations with US military forces in the Indo-Pacific.

Modi abandoned some of that restraint on Tuesday, declaring: “In the last few years, there has been an unprecedented increase in interoperability between our armies.”"

This is fantastic news.
1. Better interoperability
2. BECA in the works.
3. More inter-company JV's and thus, in the long run, more ToT given in a friendly manner.
Better attitude of DoD and State Dept to GoI. More joint ops - like the recently concluded one in which a Chinese ship was caught smuggling goods to SUPARCO.

I would like to see
1. A US MMRCA -- Chini folks don't like it when they see US arms being sold to India.
2. More "strategic" deals - nuclear engine designs for subs.

In case of Kargil - it was one thing to get a few bombs from Israel and France, but in the case of a larger war against China / I would like India to be hooked into the US supply chain.

nam · Post by **nam** » 26 Feb 2020 18:47

Given that Trump babu is generally faced with hostile reception, I think he very much liked the show we put up.. He could not stop talking about the "crowd".

When you are constantly been targeted and mocked, meeting friendly people for a change, creates a different type of impression..

He took no nonsense from the reporters... He definitely was in no mood to agonize a country, where he probably feels people like him..

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 27 Feb 2020 03:15

UlanBatori wrote:She went to Georgetown but bought her degree from UPenn?

Yes, good catch. Wharton, Haavaad, etc. have seats set aside for business family nanha munna.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 27 Feb 2020 03:33

Vayutuvan wrote:
UlanBatori wrote:She went to Georgetown but bought her degree from UPenn?
Yes, good catch. Wharton, Haavaad, etc. have seats set aside for business family nanha munna.

They’re called legacy admissions. Rahul Gandhi and Abhishek Bachhan were admitted Harvard and left promising not to return for poor scholarship and cheating. They were basically rusticated, but not on paper as it looks bad for university.

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 27 Feb 2020 03:45

Not vouching for the lady but Trump won close race and held four years and now running as likely candidate. Though Trump has that acumen from business and has been insider iirc.

Vamsee · Post by **Vamsee** » 27 Feb 2020 03:57

Bernie Sanders
@BernieSanders
Over 200 million Muslims call India home. Widespread anti-Muslim mob violence has killed at least 27 and injured many more. Trump responds by saying, "That's up to India." This is a failure of leadership on human rights.

========================

Bernie's (& his paxi campaign chief) is doubling down on his anti-India rhetoric.

Kati · Post by **Kati** » 27 Feb 2020 04:03

UlanBatori wrote:She went to Georgetown but bought her degree from UPenn?

She eventually got her degree from Wharton Business School where she also met Kushner.

Manish_Sharma · Post by **Manish_Sharma** » 27 Feb 2020 13:06

Vamsee wrote:Bernie Sanders
@BernieSanders
Over 200 million Muslims call India home. Widespread anti-Muslim mob violence has killed at least 27 and injured many more. Trump responds by saying, "That's up to India." This is a failure of leadership on human rights.

========================

Bernie's (& his paxi campaign chief) is doubling down on his anti-India rhetoric.

Hopefully Trump wins again. In case Dems like Bernie, Biden or Clinton wins.... they will create big trouble

OmkarC · Post by **OmkarC** » 27 Feb 2020 14:11

Manish_Sharma wrote:
Vamsee wrote:Bernie Sanders
@BernieSanders
Over 200 million Muslims call India home. Widespread anti-Muslim mob violence has killed at least 27 and injured many more. Trump responds by saying, "That's up to India." This is a failure of leadership on human rights.

========================

Bernie's (& his paxi campaign chief) is doubling down on his anti-India rhetoric.
Hopefully Trump wins again. In case Dems like Bernie, Biden or Clinton wins.... they will create big trouble

Buttigieg has been neutral in the Indo-Pak discussion AFAIK, unlike Bernie, Biden or Warren..

Manish_P · Post by **Manish_P** » 27 Feb 2020 17:35

OmkarC wrote: Buttigieg has been neutral in the Indo-Pak discussion AFAIK, unlike Bernie, Biden or Warren..

What is the status of gays, gay marriage, LGBTs etc in Pakistan? Not that it matters to slithery politicians..