Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

The Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum is a venue to discuss issues pertaining to India's security environment, her strategic outlook on global affairs and as well as the effect of international relations in the Indian Subcontinent. We request members to kindly stay within the mandate of this forum and keep their exchanges of views, on a civilised level, however vehemently any disagreement may be felt. All feedback regarding forum usage may be sent to the moderators using the Feedback Form or by clicking the Report Post Icon in any objectionable post for proper action. Please note that the views expressed by the Members and Moderators on these discussion boards are that of the individuals only and do not reflect the official policy or view of the Bharat-Rakshak.com Website. Copyright Violation is strictly prohibited and may result in revocation of your posting rights - please read the FAQ for full details. Users must also abide by the Forum Guidelines at all times.
LakshmanPST
BRFite
Posts: 673
Joined: 05 Apr 2019 18:23

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by LakshmanPST »

Manish_Sharma wrote:
Utterly disklike this guy but thought it should be dissected here:

https://theprint.in/opinion/on-lac-indi ... nt/611287/
There are a couple of problems I have noticed with this article--->
1) Panag sir never mentions that the so called 'buffer zones' are a temporary arrangement and patrolling will resume after complete disengagement... Not mentioning this point and instead saying "China secured 1959 Claim Line albeit with buffer zones" is basically supporting Chinese propaganda...
2) He claims that India didn't start a war coz. India knows that it can't win... This is really wrong assessment coming from a retired General...
War with any country should always be the last option... Coz. winning or losing depends on a lot of factors... There is difference between "avoiding war just becoz. we believe we can not win" vs. "trying out all other options to resolve issue before war"...
3) Kailash Range Heights are just one of the many leverage points we have against China... We have other points for other areas as confirmed by Army Chief himself recently...
To give an example, at the same time as Kailash range escalation, we also said that we did some 'readjustments' in Pangong North Bank... But no one know the current status of this 'readjustment'...
Only the usual suspects like Chellany, Panag et al are focussing solely on coming down from Kailash heights and terming it variously from 'giving up only leverage' to 'absolute surrender'...
asgkhan
BRFite
Posts: 1834
Joined: 16 Apr 2009 17:19
Location: Helping BRF research how to seduce somali women

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by asgkhan »

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/28/us/p ... icity.html

The investigators who wrote the Recorded Future study, said that “the alleged link between the outage and the discovery of the unspecified malware” in the system “remains unsubstantiated.” But they noted that “additional evidence suggested the coordinated targeting of the Indian load dispatch centers,” which balance the electrical demands across regions of the country.

The discovery is the latest example of how the conspicuous placement of malware in an adversary’s electric grid or other critical infrastructure has become the newest form of both aggression and deterrence — a warning that if things are pushed too far, millions could suffer.

“I think the signaling is being done” by China to indicate “that we can and we have the capability to do this in times of a crisis,” said retired Lt. Gen. D.S. Hooda, a cyberexpert who oversaw India’s borders with Pakistan and China. “It’s like sending a warning to India that this capability exists with us.”

So far, the evidence suggests that the SolarWinds hack, named for the company that made network-management software that was hijacked to insert the code, was chiefly about stealing information. But it also created the capability for far more destructive attacks — and among the companies that downloaded the Russian code were several American utilities. They maintain that the incursions were managed, and that there was no risk to their operations

In the Indian case, Recorded Future sent its findings to India’s Computer Emergency Response Team, or CERT-In, a kind of investigative and early-warning agency most nations maintain to keep track of threats to critical infrastructure. Twice the center has acknowledged receipt of the information, but said nothing about whether it, too, found the code in the electric grid.

By December, security experts at the Cyber Peace Foundation, an Indian nonprofit that follows hacking efforts, reported a new wave of Chinese attacks, in which hackers sent phishing emails to Indians related to the Indian holidays in October and November. Researchers tied the attacks to domains registered in China’s Guangdong and Henan Provinces, to an organization called Fang Xiao Qing. The aim, the foundation said, was to obtain a beachhead in Indians’ devices, possibly for future attacks.

“One of the intentions seems to be power projection,” said Vineet Kumar, the president of the Cyber Peace Foundation.

The foundation has also documented a surge of malware directed at India’s power sector, from petroleum refineries to a nuclear power plant, since last year. Because it is impossible for the foundation or Recorded Future to examine the code, it is unclear whether they are looking at the same attacks, but the timing is the same.

Yet except for the Mumbai blackout, the attacks have not disrupted the provision of energy, officials said.

And even there, officials have gone quiet after initially determining that the code was most likely Chinese. Yashasvi Yadav, a police official in charge of Maharashtra’s cyberintelligence unit, said authorities found “suspicious activity” that suggested the intervention of a state actor.

But Mr. Yadav declined to elaborate, saying the investigation’s full report would be released in early March. Nitin Raut, a state government minister quoted in local reports in November blaming sabotage for the Mumbai outage, did not respond to questions about the blackout.
asgkhan
BRFite
Posts: 1834
Joined: 16 Apr 2009 17:19
Location: Helping BRF research how to seduce somali women

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by asgkhan »

Ha!!, dumb sugar-bois, we are used to 12+ hour of power cuts, cyber attacks on power infrastructure and the inconvenience caused will not even register in the minds of mango abduls.
NRao
BRF Oldie
Posts: 19226
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: Illini Nation

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by NRao »

LakshmanPST wrote:
Manish_Sharma wrote:
Utterly disklike this guy but thought it should be dissected here:

https://theprint.in/opinion/on-lac-indi ... nt/611287/
There are a couple of problems I have noticed with this article--->
1) Panag sir never mentions that the so called 'buffer zones' are a temporary arrangement and patrolling will resume after complete disengagement... Not mentioning this point and instead saying "China secured 1959 Claim Line albeit with buffer zones" is basically supporting Chinese propaganda...
2) He claims that India didn't start a war coz. India knows that it can't win... This is really wrong assessment coming from a retired General...
War with any country should always be the last option... Coz. winning or losing depends on a lot of factors... There is difference between "avoiding war just becoz. we believe we can not win" vs. "trying out all other options to resolve issue before war"...
3) Kailash Range Heights are just one of the many leverage points we have against China... We have other points for other areas as confirmed by Army Chief himself recently...
To give an example, at the same time as Kailash range escalation, we also said that we did some 'readjustments' in Pangong North Bank... But no one know the current status of this 'readjustment'...
Only the usual suspects like Chellany, Panag et al are focussing solely on coming down from Kailash heights and terming it variously from 'giving up only leverage' to 'absolute surrender'...
Lt. Gen. Panag has a view point. So does Lt. Gen. Hooda. There is a vid out there (thePrint?) where both - in real time - propose their views.

IMHO, there are two factors from an Indian PoV: India preferred sector-by-sector resolution (since 1959?) and "status quo ante" from Apr/May, 2020. From this angle, India got what she wanted in Pongang Tso - EXCEPT for India patrolling to Finger 8 - which is to be discussed in the future.

The argument that IA had to vacate the Kailash Range or "what about Depsang", for an Indian PoV (IMHO) is a non starter: Depsang is a sector by itself and India always (2013 minus) wanted to deal with it by itself.

The Kailash Range is within Indian LAC line, there is no doubt about that. IA should be ale to boldly and openly go to any point on the Kailash Range - point being it is Indian territory.

Has India lost some tactical advantage? Probably. However, it is far more likely IA can climb the Kailash Range than the PLA can threaten it. Yes, it is a pain in the behind, BUT, who else has stood up to the PLA and Xi/CCP? That is what we need to be discussing and promoting - and not the 1959 line (which is a Chinese narrative)


This is about the defeat of the PLA/Xi, who have a 3/4x GDP over Bharat, who have drones that deliver food and medications to front line troops, who have superior weapons, who has ....... AND yet had to withdraw (granted to fight another day - which is not what we want)


PLA/Xi LOST.

Forget 1959.
darshan
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4018
Joined: 28 Jan 2008 04:16

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by darshan »

Microsoft: Chinese Cyberspies Used 4 Exchange Server Flaws to Plunder Emails
https://krebsonsecurity.com/2021/03/mic ... er-emails/
Microsoft says the flaws are being used by a previously unknown Chinese espionage group that’s been dubbed “Hafnium,” which is known to launch its attacks using hosting companies based in the United States.

“Hafnium primarily targets entities in the United States across a number of industry sectors, including infectious disease researchers, law firms, higher education institutions, defense contractors, policy think tanks, and NGOs,” Microsoft said. “HAFNIUM has previously compromised victims by exploiting vulnerabilities in internet-facing servers. Once they’ve gained access to a victim network, HAFNIUM typically exfiltrates data to file sharing sites like MEGA.”

According to Microsoft, Hafnium attackers have been observed combining all four zero-day flaws to target organizations running vulnerable Exchange Server products.
Rupesh
BRFite
Posts: 967
Joined: 05 Jul 2008 19:14
Location: Somewhere in South Central India

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by Rupesh »

asgkhan wrote:Ha!!, dumb sugar-bois, we are used to 12+ hour of power cuts, cyber attacks on power infrastructure and the inconvenience caused will not even register in the minds of mango abduls.
Mumbaikars are not used to power cuts. It becomes a big inconvenience because no one has any inverter.
Cyrano
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5478
Joined: 28 Mar 2020 01:07

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by Cyrano »

What Delhi must do to make sure it isn’t caught off-guard by China again
Relief at disengagement must be tempered by the fact that it is just the latest act in the ongoing drama being played out by China. - Retd. Admiral Arun Prakash
The nation heaved a collective sigh of relief as the Indian and Chinese armies commenced a process of “synchronised and verifiable disengagement” on banks of the Pangong Tso in eastern Ladakh.
....
and some rona dhona on mil expenditure and equipment wear and tear
This assessment has some serious flaws. In fact, the nation was glad that the Govt stood its ground, took some bold initiatives and compelled China to backoff.

Post Wuhan and Mamallapuram bonhomie between NaMo and XI, GoI chose to disregard China's propensity to exercise domination as a means to consolidate relationships and attempted to steer the relationship into a new direction. India tried something a bit bold and different that didn't work out. Was it an error? May be, and only in hindsight.

China made more and bigger errors, one after the other. Beijing misread India's proffered hand of friendship as India trying to dominate the relationship by steering its direction and reacted with an insecure, defensive mindset. Beijing also miscalculated India's response options and misjudged GoI's resolve to fight back. PLA misunderestimated the challenges of high altitude mobilisation and IA's mountain warfare experience. Irony, China ended up legitimising India's efforts to strengthen border infrastructure, made Indian military planners reorient their doctrines more sharply to counter it in the future, and accelerate modernisation plans. Moreover, it didn't see coming India's counter moves to riposte beyond military on trade, tech and geo-strategic dimensions. Lastly, it visibly painted itself into a corner as an untrustworthy partner at best and a thick headed bully at the worst.

Military equipment are not showcase toys and forces are not for jolly parades down Janpath. They are for making a show of strength on the ground where it matters, to defend our soverignity and beat back aggressors. They are intended exactly for the usage that has occurred. Uniforms are worn to be soiled even bloodied when necessary, not for staying immaculate with sharp creases until end of the day.

Is there a price to pay for it? Sure. But the cost of freedom is anything but free.
Cyrano
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5478
Joined: 28 Mar 2020 01:07

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by Cyrano »

Thankfully here are two opinion pieces in the Hindustan Times that get it right:

Why 2021 political rhetoric is no match for 1962 fighting in Ladakh by Shishir Gupta

and

Disengagement will not lead to friendship by Jayadeva Ranade
Haresh
BRFite
Posts: 1497
Joined: 30 Jun 2009 17:27

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by Haresh »

How India Played into China's Hands on the Border Dispute

https://thewire.in/security/how-india-p ... er-dispute
morem
BRFite
Posts: 227
Joined: 26 Jul 2009 15:52

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by morem »

with greatest respect, we know where field marshal sawheinsteins's loyalties lie
Raveen
BRFite
Posts: 841
Joined: 18 Jun 2008 00:51
Location: 1/2 way between the gutter and the stars
Contact:

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by Raveen »

asgkhan wrote:https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/28/us/p ... icity.html

retired Lt. Gen. D.S. Hooda, a cyberexpert

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
Haresh
BRFite
Posts: 1497
Joined: 30 Jun 2009 17:27

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by Haresh »

morem wrote:with greatest respect, we know where field marshal sawheinsteins's loyalties lie
I know nothing abt him.
Just posting the story
NRao
BRF Oldie
Posts: 19226
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: Illini Nation

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by NRao »

China row opens export opportunities for India
India is moving to fill the Chinese vacuum for Australian resources and wine, as a free-trade agreement between Canberra and New Delhi gains momentum under a Morrison government push to unlock new markets.

The Australian understands Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi is eyeing off greater access to Australian resources, including coal and rare earths, ahead of Adani’s Carmichael mine in Queensland producing its first coal load this year.

As part of India’s COVID-19 economic response, the Modi government has eased mining regulations to attract foreign investment in India and permitted the commercial mining of coal. There is also a push to access Australian coal, iron ore, copper, steel aluminium, cobalt, rare earths and nickel.

Companies including Coal India Limited are actively engaging with the Australian miners. The Confederation of Indian ­Industry’s Australia economic strategy is encouraging Indian companies to invest in exploration and mining of key minerals such as coal, iron ore and critical minerals.

Bravus Mining and Resource chief executive David Boshoff, who took control of the rebadged Adani Australia last July, said the company had “secured the market for 10 million tonnes” a year from the central Queensland mine. “The demand for thermal electricity is still growing in India and Southeast Asia and both coal and renewables are needed to provide safe, affordable and reliable power,” Mr Boshoff said.

“Furthermore, due to the high quality of our coal and the low strip ratio, Carmichael coal is in the lowest-cost quartile, which means the economics are good and we can be profitable through the ­cycles. The coal will be sold at index pricing and we will not be engaging in transfer pricing practices, which means that all of our taxes and royalties will be paid here in Australia.”

Scott Morrison, who was forced twice last year to delay official visits to India, regularly speaks with Mr Modi, including last month. The Australian understands that while India’s protectionist policies and tariffs on Australian resources and wine remain a hurdle, there is growing optimism a deal could be reached.

Image

Trade Minister Dan Tehan said that, although patience would be required in working with the ­Indian bureaucracy, there was significant “willingness” to strike a deal, first floated during the ­Abbott government.

“There’s a solid foundation of will and really wanting to cement the advancements that have been made in the economic relationship,” Mr Tehan said.

He said the government would consider early harvest agreements, addressing concerns on both sides around agriculture, as well as unlocking opportunities for miners after China banned Australian coal.

“We want to get a very constructive dialogue happening, one which puts ambition back into the free trade agreement,” he said.

The government has commissioned analysis showing how a deal could work in India’s interests. “Investment flows are ­something that India are very keen on, so how we can … encourage Australian investment into India is going to be a key to unlocking progress on the deal,” Mr Tehan said.

He said the government was looking at ways for wine exporters, hit by China’s trade restrictions, to get into the Indian market.

“The biggest issue there is that there is a 150 per cent tariff,” he said. “But obviously any discussions we would be looking at seeing what we could do there.

Image

Mr Varghese — whose brother Peter is the University of Queensland chancellor, a former DFAT secretary and author of the India-Australia economic strategy — said Mr Modi would not drop the “economic reform ball” but faced domestic challenges, particularly in agriculture. He said he was contacted by two wine suppliers last week asking if AIBC could help connect them with the Indian market.

“The Indian drinking habits are starting to embrace wine in areas where you can drink it,” he said. “There’s also a large domestic market. I do believe that there is an opportunity to explore the wine market.”

Confederation of Indian Industry chief representative Abhay Mehta said India’s decision not to participate in the regional comprehensive economic partnership last year, despite Australia’s urging, had shifted the focus towards New Delhi and Canberra securing a two-way agreement.

Queensland Nationals senator Matt Canavan, who strongly backed the Adani coalmine before the 2019 election, said that even if China did not take another tonne of coal from Australia, the growth in India’s coal demands would be greater than Australia’s previous coal exports to China.

Senator Canavan, who visited the Carmichael mine on Thursday, said the International Energy Agency had forecast that India’s coal demands would grow over the next 10 years by an amount that is more than half of Australia’s total coal production.

“Even before China’s coal ban, it was clear that India was a massive growth opportunity for Australian coal,” Senator Canavan said.

“After China’s coal ban, it ­becomes more important that we seek to negotiate a trade agreement that puts Aussie coal on a level playing field with Indonesian coal in the Indian market.”

With India having a geology similar to Western Australia and untapped resources potential, Mr Varghese said there were significant opportunities for the Australian mining equipment, technology and services industry to support India’s burgeoning ­resources and rare earths sectors.
NRao
BRF Oldie
Posts: 19226
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: Illini Nation

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by NRao »

darshan
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4018
Joined: 28 Jan 2008 04:16

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by darshan »

At Least 30,000 U.S. Organizations Newly Hacked Via Holes in Microsoft’s Email Software
https://krebsonsecurity.com/2021/03/at- ... -software/
At least 30,000 organizations across the United States — including a significant number of small businesses, towns, cities and local governments — have over the past few days been hacked by an unusually aggressive Chinese cyber espionage unit that’s focused on stealing email from victim organizations, multiple sources tell KrebsOnSecurity. The espionage group is exploiting four newly-discovered flaws in Microsoft Exchange Server email software, and has seeded hundreds of thousands of victim organizations worldwide with tools that give the attackers total, remote control over affected systems.
Speaking on condition of anonymity, two cybersecurity experts who’ve briefed U.S. national security advisors on the attack told KrebsOnSecurity the Chinese hacking group thought to be responsible has seized control over “hundreds of thousands” of Microsoft Exchange Servers worldwide — with each victim system representing approximately one organization that uses Exchange to process email.
Microsoft’s initial advisory about the Exchange flaws credited Reston, Va. based Volexity for reporting the vulnerabilities. Volexity President Steven Adair said the company first saw attackers quietly exploiting the Exchange bugs on Jan. 6, 2021, a day when most of the world was glued to television coverage of the riot at the U.S. Capitol.
White House press secretary Jen Psaki told reporters today the vulnerabilities found in Microsoft’s widely used Exchange servers were “significant,” and “could have far-reaching impacts.”
KrebsOnSecurity has seen portions of a victim list compiled by running such a tool, and it is not a pretty picture. The backdoor web shell is verifiably present on the networks of thousands of U.S. organizations, including banks, credit unions, non-profits, telecommunications providers, public utilities and police, fire and rescue units.
NRao
BRF Oldie
Posts: 19226
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: Illini Nation

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by NRao »

g.sarkar
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4382
Joined: 09 Jul 2005 12:22
Location: MERCED, California

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by g.sarkar »

https://www.rediff.com/news/report/us-p ... 210310.htm
US provided info, equipment to India during China standoff
By Lalit K Jha, March 10, 2021
The United States provided some information, cold-weather clothing and some other equipment to India during its recent border crisis with China, which has adopted an increasingly assertive military posture to exert pressure and expand its influence across the region, a top Pentagon commander has told American lawmakers.

Admiral Philips Davidson, Commander of the US Indo-Pacific Command, also told the powerful Senate Armed Services Committee on Tuesday that China's recent activities along the Line of Actual Control have opened India's eyes to what cooperative effort with others might mean for their own defensive needs as he observed that New Delhi, in the very near term, will deepen its engagement with the Quad.
"India has long had an approach called strategic autonomy, you know, a nonaligned approach with others, but I think certainly the activities along the Line of Actual Control with China has opened their eyes to what cooperative effort with others might mean for their own defensive needs," Admiral Davidson told lawmakers during the Congressional hearing.
"We have provided some information to India in that crisis, cold-weather closing, clothing, some other equipment, some things like that, and over the last several years, we have been deepening our maritime cooperation," he said.
China moved over 60,000 well-armed troops who were mobilised for annual exercises, to contentious areas like Pangong Lake in eastern Ladakh in May last year, prompting India to match the PLA's mobilisation which led to an over eight-month long standoff.
After lengthy rounds of talks, the two sides simultaneously withdrew troops from Pangong Lake area last month while talks are on for the withdrawal of soldiers from the rest of the areas along the Line of Actual Control (LAC) in eastern Ladakh.
"I think you will see India in the very near term, you know, remain committed to their non-aligned approach, but I think they will deepen their engagement with the Quad, and I think that's a key strategic opportunity for us, Australia, and Japan," Davidson said, ahead of the maiden Quad Leaders' Summit involving the top leaders from Australia, India, Japan and the United States on Friday. US President Joe Biden and Prime Minister Narendra Modi will attend the first Leaders' Summit of Quad in a virtual format on Friday along with Prime Minister of Australia Scott Morrison and Prime Minister of Japan Yoshihide Suga. During the summit, the Quad leaders will discuss regional and global issues of shared interest, and exchange views on practical areas of cooperation towards maintaining a free, open and inclusive Indo-Pacific region.
The Admiral was responding to a question from Senator Angus King. "That would be a geopolitical major development if India more closely aligned with those other countries," King said responding to the answer from the admiral. "India has always been a neutral country, if you will. Are we developing a stronger alliance with them? You mentioned them as part of the Quad. Do they consider themselves a member of something of that nature?" King asked.
......
Gautam
KLNMurthy
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4826
Joined: 17 Aug 2005 13:06

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by KLNMurthy »

g.sarkar wrote:https://www.rediff.com/news/report/us-p ... 210310.htm
US provided info, equipment to India during China standoff
By Lalit K Jha, March 10, 2021

...

"India has long had an approach called strategic autonomy, you know, a nonaligned approach with others, but I think certainly the activities along the Line of Actual Control with China has opened their eyes to what cooperative effort with others might mean for their own defensive needs," Admiral Davidson told lawmakers during the Congressional hearing.

...


This sounds like the Pentagon believes or hopes that India can be bought by a few units of thermal underwear and some satellite pics. Maybe that carrot plus some good old-fashioned browbeating over freedom & democracy and color revolution threats to serve as the stick.

Look for China to take note and use it in their doctrine & propaganda war against India,

From what I recall, India bought the thermal clothing from a US private company.

Nice reminder that India continues to have to manage tradeoff of multiple factors in its pursuit of national security and growth.
darshan
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4018
Joined: 28 Jan 2008 04:16

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by darshan »

The Microsoft Exchange Hack and the Great Email Robbery
https://www.lawfareblog.com/microsoft-e ... il-robbery
How did the attackers breach the companies? The Chinese actors developed a way to hack Microsoft Exchange and then attacked the organizations from there. And many of those attacked are still vulnerable to follow-on attacks not just by the Chinese but numerous criminals. The impact of the Exchange hack will certainly be greater than SolarWinds and researchers aren’t even close to the end of the story. But it’s a complicated story, with a lot to untangle.
Somehow, the threat actor either knew that the exploits would soon become worthless or simply guessed that they would. So, in late February, the attacker changed strategy. Instead of simply exploiting targeted Exchange servers, the attackers stepped up their pace considerably by targeting tens of thousands of servers to install the web shell, an exploit that allows attackers to have remote access to a system.
And now the Biden administration has a real hard policy problem: What now? The SolarWinds hack may have been significant, but this will affect far more institutions. The SolarWinds hackers stayed subtle. They targeted traditional intelligence targets and never transitioned to a “pillage everything” model, which made that attack more of a “Spies Gonna Spy” operation. The Exchange attack showed complete disregard for possible consequences on behalf of those responsible for the breach.

Without consequences, such broad attacks will simply continue. There are currently no reasons why an attacker who has access to a zero-day shouldn’t simply press a button and exploit every possible target at the moment when they know their exploit is about to lose value. I don’t know how to change this calculus, but the U.S. must do so somehow.
nam
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4712
Joined: 05 Jan 2017 20:48

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by nam »

CCP hacker groups have been targeting our energy grids in the past few weeks. Thank goodness, I was worried, the Chinis will keep quiet and allow GoI to brush things under the carpet.

I hope there are more such attacks and CCP is constantly in the Indian press.
NRao
BRF Oldie
Posts: 19226
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: Illini Nation

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by NRao »

Projected 2025 for SCS:


Image
Cyrano
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5478
Joined: 28 Mar 2020 01:07

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by Cyrano »

We need to watch this again and again. The most cogent explanation of why the Chinese have been aggressive in Ladakh by Ambassador Stobdan (a Ladhaki) and wisest advice on how to counter it not just by military means, but with narrative based on history, and with culture based on a fine understanding of the entire Himalayan region's peoples.

Cyrano
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5478
Joined: 28 Mar 2020 01:07

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by Cyrano »

With eye on China, Quad nations to tie up in rare earths: Report
TOKYO: The United States, Japan, India and Australia will work together to secure rare earth metals that are essential to the production of electric car motors and other products, the Nikkei newspaper reported on Thursday.

The four-nation group, referred to as the "Quad" countries, are on Friday due to hold an online summit meeting seen as part of efforts to counterbalance China's growing military and economic power.
This is a very important measure. Gobar Times has reacted and published its response. Which itself means Qaud is getting ready to hit where it hurts.
Quad may pose some challenge to China-produced rare earths, but too costly and unsustainable: analysts
According to the US Geological Survey, China accounted for 58 percent of rare-earth production worldwide in 2020, down from around 90 percent some four years ago as the US and Australia have gradually boosted their own production.
China has no intention to use rare earths as a countermeasure against any country, which would only accelerate development of rare earths in other markets, said experts.
Well, China already made some threats to that effect which Gobar Times has conveniently forgotten, and the result is here, its already happening. Moving high tech mfg out of China will become easier as the rate earth dependency is reduced.

More articles on this topic below:
China targets rare earth export curbs to hobble US defence industry

China continues dominance of rare earths markets to 2030, says Roskill
kit
BRF Oldie
Posts: 6278
Joined: 13 Jul 2006 18:16

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by kit »

https://www.flightglobal.com/defence/uk ... 70.article

Ukraine’s government has decided to nationalise aircraft engine maker Motor Sich, weeks after effectively scotching a bid from Chinese firm Skyrizon to buy the company.

In December, the Chinese investors behind Skyrizon filed a $3.5 billion arbitration case against Ukraine, accusing Kyiv of expropriating its investment in Motor Sich after the government froze its shares in the company in 2018.

Motor Sich makes engines for helicopters and aircraft. It also makes engines that can be used for cruise missiles and drones.
g.sarkar
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4382
Joined: 09 Jul 2005 12:22
Location: MERCED, California

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by g.sarkar »

https://www.rediff.com/news/column/chin ... 210312.htm
China or Pakistan? Who should Modi make peace with?
By Shekhar Gupta, March 12, 2021
India must break out of this strategic triangulation between China and Pakistan.
We need to settle our issues with one of the two, notes Shekhar Gupta.

The disengagement at Pangong Tso has been completed in quick time. As new rounds of the corps commanders' talks begin, you could also guardedly hope that the larger de-escalation is now a possibility. It's a good moment to pause to reflect on who's won and/or lost what as relative peace becomes a more likely prospect than war.
Our Northern Army Commander Lieutenant General Y K Joshi has already told us how close India and China were to a war during those fateful 48 hours when his troops climbed the dominating heights and key passes in the Pangong south bank and Kailash Range stretch west of Pangong-Moldo-Chushul. A less reported event then was also the mountaineering-style climbs Indian units made on the higher reaches of the 'fingers' or the spurs on the north bank from where they looked down at the Chinese on the more comfortable lower ground. It is also the oldest truism in mountain warfare that while lower may be more comfortable, it isn't preferable. Not used to being taken by surprise, the Chinese tried to 'persuade' India to climb down. The moves on the nights of 29 and 30 August last year, as part of the Indian Army's 'Operation Snow Leopard', had restored the tactical balance. We had known more about what happened on the Rechin la, Mukhpari and Rezang la features on the southern bank and west of it.
But the even sharper exchanges higher up on the fingers, remained unreported for some time. The viral picture of Chinese PLA soldiers armed with medieval spears and 'guandaos' -- traditional Chinese pole weapon, like a pole with a machete welded at the top - up, close and threatening Indian troops was from Mukhpari.
Three things had become clear by this time. First, that Indian troops were not about to go away. They were as well-clothed, fed and armed as the Chinese and the heavier equipment was very well-maintained. Second, that neither side wanted to escalate it into a skirmish. Even at the narrow passes -- Rechin La is no more than a couple of hundred metres wide, the two sides deployed tanks within feet of each other.
Like India-Pakistan sentries at the Wagah Border outpost. Tanks don't fight that close. Even horse cavalries never got that close before the beginning of fighting. It was a mere show of strength and a traffic block at my end, just in case you chose to come for a drive.
When -- and if -- all this is over, we will look back at these pictures and laugh at the ridiculous spectacle of the world's two largest nations loaded with nuclear arsenals, confronting each other with tanks so close as if poised for head-butting. And third, that it was now a battle of attrition, fought with the weather, altitude, terrain and logistics. And the hardiness of the soldier on rival sides. The question was, let's see who can last the winter in large numbers here. The fact is, both did. It is then that the Chinese became amenable to de-escalation.
Of course, the international and economic moves, rise of the Quad, Joe Biden's ringing endorsement of it, India dumping its hesitations of its strategic history and a strengthening grouping of China's victims, which I sometimes describe as "Cheen Peedit Samaj", also played a role.
......
Gautam
NRao
BRF Oldie
Posts: 19226
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: Illini Nation

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by NRao »

^^^^^

I think SK's video on YT came out much earlier. And, if we were to include what Jaishankar said at the India Today Conclave, SK's suggestion is a non starter (rightly so, IMHO). In fact DrSJ went beyond the Indo-Sino relations and called out the West.
NRao
BRF Oldie
Posts: 19226
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: Illini Nation

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by NRao »

Pivot has a new direction - to the other end of the world!!
Mark Ames @MarkAmesExiled wrote: Bezos Post: "Actually, NATO was created to protect European civilization from the Yellow Peril"

Perspective | China's rise is exactly the kind of threat NATO exists to stop
The alliance has been adrift for years, Countering China would give it focus
NRao
BRF Oldie
Posts: 19226
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: Illini Nation

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by NRao »

America Will Only Win When China’s Regime Fails
Competition between the United States and China has begun, but how will it end? There is a bipartisan consensus that Sino-American relations will be defined primarily by rivalry across multiple regions and dimensions of statecraft for years to come. Yet there is little clarity on what U.S. leaders hope will happen after that. Washington has accepted the reality of competition without identifying a theory of victory. There is no lack of suggestions, but U.S. leaders have yet to articulate how this competition will lead to something other than unending tension and danger.

...................
Igorr
BRFite
Posts: 697
Joined: 01 Feb 2005 18:13
Contact:

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by Igorr »

NRao wrote:America Will Only Win When China’s Regime Fails
Competition between the United States and China has begun, but how will it end? There is a bipartisan consensus that Sino-American relations will be defined primarily by rivalry across multiple regions and dimensions of statecraft for years to come. Yet there is little clarity on what U.S. leaders hope will happen after that. Washington has accepted the reality of competition without identifying a theory of victory. There is no lack of suggestions, but U.S. leaders have yet to articulate how this competition will lead to something other than unending tension and danger....................
The US clearly would like to entrust India with the dirty work of containing China and keep the clean part for itself. The Americans have a lot of experience in this, from their delayed participation in two world wars, to the sacrifice of their allies in Southeast Asia during the war in Indo-China. They tried to play China against USSR too. The current attempts to fight with Russia by the hands of Ukrainians are from the same series. In parallel with the ostentatious hysteria of the last two presidents, they continue to actively trade with China, capitalizing on the low cost of labor in the 'communist country.' They still think the rest of the World is stupid.
Roop
BRFite
Posts: 670
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by Roop »

NRao wrote:I think SK's video on YT came out much earlier. And, if we were to include what Jaishankar said at the India Today Conclave, SK's suggestion is a non starter ...
Who is SK?
kit
BRF Oldie
Posts: 6278
Joined: 13 Jul 2006 18:16

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by kit »

Igorr wrote:
The US clearly would like to entrust India with the dirty work of containing China and keep the clean part for itself. The Americans have a lot of experience in this, from their delayed participation in two world wars, to the sacrifice of their allies in Southeast Asia during the war in Indo-China. They tried to play China against USSR too. The current attempts to fight with Russia by the hands of Ukrainians are from the same series. In parallel with the ostentatious hysteria of the last two presidents, they continue to actively trade with China, capitalizing on the low cost of labor in the 'communist country.' They still think the rest of the World is stupid.
I would agree., since China is next door and America is on the other side of the globe. But it takes two to tango and the Chinese seem to be all gungho with being arrogant., a proven penchant for flouting any sort of rules based order., definitely NOT reliable to their word. Their wolf warrior diplomacy is not helping either.

They are asking for trouble where there was scope of adjustment, but now they have it. Russia might help by advising them but then they are a junior partner now with hardly much say and listing to wherever the wind blows.

India ( and its neighbours) would likely face the fall out of a messy regime change in China., but that looks unavoidable., and will need to be contained
nandakumar
BRFite
Posts: 1638
Joined: 10 May 2010 13:37

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by nandakumar »

Roop wrote:
NRao wrote:I think SK's video on YT came out much earlier. And, if we were to include what Jaishankar said at the India Today Conclave, SK's suggestion is a non starter ...
Who is SK?
A typo for SG or Shekhar Gupta?
nam
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4712
Joined: 05 Jan 2017 20:48

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by nam »

It is not our concern, if US or China will win at the end. Our sole concern is making gains in their fight. The value of China for us : 15B dollars. that's all.

The value of US for us is more than 150B. If we include it's allies in Europe, Japan, SK & Taiwan it becomes even more. Our job is to be on the right side of the money.

Not one the side of Morality.

The only way China can stop us is by waging war and taking over India. How many think this can happen?

Regarding Russia, I would suggest they also think about making money out of India - China fight, rather than take one side. Russia didn't apply morality during Crimea & Eastern Ukraine, so they shouldn't expect morality and "non-alignment" from us.

US is using us or China is using doesn't matter. What matters is 10T GDP.
hnair
Forum Moderator
Posts: 4635
Joined: 03 May 2006 01:31
Location: Trivandrum

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by hnair »

Igorr wrote:
The US clearly would like to entrust India with the dirty work of containing China and keep the clean part for itself. The Americans have a lot of experience in this, from their delayed participation in two world wars, to the sacrifice of their allies in Southeast Asia during the war in Indo-China. They tried to play China against USSR too. The current attempts to fight with Russia by the hands of Ukrainians are from the same series. In parallel with the ostentatious hysteria of the last two presidents, they continue to actively trade with China, capitalizing on the low cost of labor in the 'communist country.' They still think the rest of the World is stupid.
Igorr, time and again, India has shown zero interest in any alliance with US. Even after all sorts of incentives including advanced weapon sales and NSG entry, India never went against China and even had good summits like Wuhan and Mahabalipuram.

It was china who made what we are seeing India doing today possible. It is entirely China’s fault, not the US’ and most definitely not India’s. So please don’t absolve China of any wrong doing, by laying it on US alone. Of course the US is happy that China is helping it convince India what decades of US Presidents cannot do - sign treaties to ward off China.

There is a big difference with Ukraine picture and India - for long, Ukraine willingly allowed itself to be ruled by west-appointed leaders and was actively hostile to Russia’s interest. India did not do any of that with China.

Implying China is not to be blamed is not cool for an old friend! China is the only reason India started this drift to US side. No ruler of India will want to risk losing even an inch of territory to China and will do what they can.
NRao
BRF Oldie
Posts: 19226
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: Illini Nation

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by NRao »

A typo for SG or Shekhar Gupta?
Yes, sorry.


Igorr wrote:
The US clearly would like to entrust India with the dirty work of containing China and keep the clean part for itself. The Americans have a lot of experience in this, from their delayed participation in two world wars, to the sacrifice of their allies in Southeast Asia during the war in Indo-China. They tried to play China against USSR too. The current attempts to fight with Russia by the hands of Ukrainians are from the same series. In parallel with the ostentatious hysteria of the last two presidents, they continue to actively trade with China, capitalizing on the low cost of labor in the 'communist country.' They still think the rest of the World is stupid.
Playing one against another is an ancient game plan.

ALL members of the UNSC are very good at it - the Soviets were too. At some point in time all of them have attempted to derail or stop India's progress (space, nuclear, MIC, etc).

The current GoI is navigating these dynamics. The goal: a seat the high table. DrSJ, in the past few days, has echoed the same: China has to accept India's rise and the West cannot by hypocritical. Given India's position today (granted the economy could be in a better place), it is a very, very reasonable expectation - to say the very least.

This clearly goes against the "dirty work of containing China" thinking. "containing China" from an India PoV is up to China - India is the only nation to have stood up to China in the past year and continuing to do so, the US has taken a step or two back *even during the Trump era* (the Harris-Biden is a joke). But then India also stood up to Russia, when Russia did not come out on the right side in the Ladakh situation.
srikandan
BRFite
Posts: 590
Joined: 20 Nov 2020 02:51

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by srikandan »

NRao: DrSJ, in the past few days, has echoed the same: China has to accept India's rise and the West cannot by hypocritical. Given India's position today (granted the economy could be in a better place), it is a very, very reasonable expectation - to say the very least.
I am not sure there is any reason behind how power politics is being played against India, other than not relinquishing power willingly, like the UNSC, where outside of using the UNSC to veto bills, the UNSC powers treat the UN with utter contempt (and quite rightly so, going by the current composition of the UNHCR or the functioning of the WHO).

IMO, "accepting India's rise" "without being hypocritical" might be an exercise in futility, if we think competitors will do any such thing...both "the west" and china view India as their future competitor. After their 30-year old kissinger/china plan was shot in the knee by Eleven DingDing and his CCP, this current US regime seems to have decided to keep low-end manufacturing in China and stop selling strategic tech to the chinese and do their usual "off-shore balancing" act with china with the "QUAD" as one instrument.

From their POV, having supported the rise of China to challenge them directly, their best option is to play China and India against each other over time, if it helps retain their supremacy, and I would think hypocrisy would be a mandatory plank for such an India stance.

India is on its own, which the current GoI seems more than aware.
Last edited by srikandan on 15 Mar 2021 07:26, edited 1 time in total.
NRao
BRF Oldie
Posts: 19226
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: Illini Nation

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by NRao »

Julian Ku 古舉倫 @julianku wrote: Impressed that this Chinese scholar went on the record saying Xi has a 5 year timeline to annex Taiwan, although I guess that's also a bad sign for Taiwan that Chinese scholars are willing to go on the record saying this.
China's Xi Jinping Tells People's Liberation Army to Get Ready For Combat
Wu Qiang, a former politics lecturer at Beijing's Tsinghua University, said Xi is likely planning to make a definite move to annex, or, in the CCP's terminology, "unify with," the democratic island of Taiwan in the next five years.

"Beijing is looking at speeding up a resolution of the Taiwan issue during Xi's third term as president," Wu said. "This means that, over the next few years, the Taiwan issue will become the most important story in the Western Pacific."

"It is a focal issue that will trigger changes in Sino-U.S. relations sooner rather than later, and will be a flashpoint for Sino-U.S. conflict," he said.
sanjaykumar
BRF Oldie
Posts: 6094
Joined: 16 Oct 2005 05:51

Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Post by sanjaykumar »

What’s new? The red menace will be fought to the last gook.
Locked