Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby SSridhar » 03 Jan 2019 07:39

Xi Jinping says China 'must be, will be' reunified with Taiwan - Straits Times
China must be and will be reunified with Taiwan, President Xi Jinping said on Wednesday (Jan 2) as he called for the two rivals to work together to realise the "historic task" of complete reunification.

"It is a historical conclusion drawn over 70 years of development of cross-strait relations, and a must for the great rejuvenation of the Chinese nation in the new era," Mr Xi said in a major speech at Beijing's Great Hall of the People to commemorate the 40th anniversary of "Message to Compatriots in Taiwan". {So, with all the headwinds that China is facing now such as slowdown in economy, huge trade war with the US, backlash to CPEC which has taken a lot of sheen off it, and an overall resistance to Chinese Imperialism, Xi needs a new front to turn the attention of the Hans from the existing & upcoming troubles as well as retain his position}

The message was a policy document issued by the National People's Congress - China's Parliament - on Jan 1, 1979, the same day China and the United States formally established relations after Washington broke ties with Taiwan.

It proposed ending military confrontation through dialogue and welcomed exchanges between the two sides, which have been separately governed since Chiang Kai-shek fled with defeated Kuomintang (KMT) or Nationalist forces to Taiwan in 1949 after losing a civil war to the communists.

Up until 1979, China had carried out routine artillery bombardment of Taiwan-controlled offshore islands, like Kinmen, close to the mainland.

But no peace treaty or formal end to hostilities has been signed since the detente, even as business, cultural and personal links have flourished.

Mr Xi sounded a largely conciliatory note in his speech on Wednesday. He called for wide-ranging "democratic consultations" between political parties and other representatives from both sides on cross-strait relations and future, and on establishing an institutionalised mechanism to promote cross-strait ties and peaceful development.

He also pledged to further institutionalise cross-strait economic cooperation and to forge a common market, reported Xinhua news agency. Both sides should enhance the free flow of trade, connectivity in infrastructure, exchange of energy and resources, and shared industrial standards, Mr Xi was quoted as saying.

Unification would be done under a “one country, two systems” approach that would “safeguard the interests and well-being of Taiwanese compatriots”, and Taiwan will be guaranteed lasting peace, Mr Xi said.

Nonetheless, he repeated Beijing's long-held stance that it would not tolerate advocates of Taiwan’s independence, who include supporters of Taiwan President Tsai Ing-wen.

“It’s a legal fact that both sides of the Strait belong to one China, and cannot be changed by anyone or any force,” Mr Xi said.

In her New Year's address, Taiwanese President Tsai Ing-wen said the two sides of the Taiwan Strait needed a pragmatic understanding of the basic differences that existed between them in terms of values and political systems.

Ms Tsai, who has refused to affirm the "one China" consensus reached between Taiwan and China in 1992, said in response to Mr Xi's address that democratically-governed Taiwan will never accept "one country, two systems".

"We have never accepted the '1992 Consensus', because it is defined by Beijing as 'one China', 'one country, two systems. (Mr Xi's speech) today only confirms our suspicions," Ms Tsai said at a press conference.

She was referring to a tacit understanding reached between the then KMT government and Beijing in 1992 that both sides of the Taiwan Strait acknowledge there is “one China”, with each side having its own interpretation of what “China” means. China holds up the 1992 Consensus as the basis for cross-strait engagement.

Ms Tsai told reporters: "Most Taiwanese are resolutely opposed to 'one country, two systems. This is the 'Taiwan Consensus'."

She reiterated her position that dialogue between the two sides could proceed only if Beijing recognised the government in Taiwan as an equal.

Ms Tsai had, in her New Year's Day address, warned against continued threats from China.
Her comments signalled that she was not backing down despite her party's recent municipal election loss to Taiwan’s more Beijing-friendly KMT opposition, and the prospect of a tough campaign for next year's presidential election.

Mr Xi, meanwhile, is under pressure from growing criticism within the party over his handling of foreign affairs – notably strained relations with Washington, whose moves to support Taiwan have drawn China’s ire.

Mr Xi reiterated in his speech that China will not give up the use of military force to ensure Taiwan returns to the fold. Beijing “reserves the option of taking all necessary measures against outside forces that interfere with peaceful reunification and against Taiwan independence separatist activities", he said.

Xi's approach

In power since 2012, when he was named General Secretary of the Chinese Communist Party, Mr Xi has made the "Taiwan issue" one of his priorities.

In November 2015, he held a landmark meeting with then Taiwan President Ma Ying-jeou of the KMT in Singapore, the first between Chinese and Taiwanese leaders since 1949.

Taiwan's semi-official Central News Agency said Mr Xi's speech has replaced former Chinese president Jiang Zemin's 1995 speech on cross-strait reunification as Beijing's guiding principle on further engagement with Taiwan.

The speech laid out five principles for managing cross-strait relations and called for all parties to shape a "Taiwan plan" under the "one country, two systems" policy Beijing applies to Hong Kong and Macau.

The five principles are:

1. China and Taiwan to work together to revitalise the Chinese race and realise reunification

2. Explore a "one country, two systems" approach suitable for Taiwan in order to achieve eventual reunification

3. Insist on the "one China" principle to safeguard the future of peaceful reunification

4. Deepen harmonious cross-strait development to lay the foundation of peaceful reunification

5. Foster a common spirit among the people to increase support for peaceful reunification

Mr Xi's formulation is an attempt at concretising the reunification process, and can be seen as the CCP's guidelines on pushing the process forward, Professor Wang Hsin-hsien of National Chengchi University told Central News Agency.

The formulation does not allow for the existence of the Republic of China, which Taiwan has been calling itself since 1949 and is tolerated by Beijing under the 1992 "one China" consensus, said Prof Wang.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby SSridhar » 03 Jan 2019 07:53

Unification is the goal, force an option, Xi Jinping warns Taiwan - Chris Buckley, NYT
China’s president, Xi Jinping, warned Taiwan that unification must be the ultimate goal of any talks over its future and that efforts to assert full independence could be met by armed force, laying out an unyielding position on Wednesday in his first major speech about the contested island democracy.

Xi outlined his stance one day after Taiwan’s president, Tsai Ing-wen, urged China to peacefully settle disputes over the island, whose 23 million people, she said, want to preserve their self-rule. But Beijing treats Taiwan as an illegitimate breakaway from Chinese rule, and Xi said unification was unstoppable as China rose. “The country is growing strong, the nation is rejuvenating, and unification between the two sides of the strait is the great trend of history,” Xi told officials, military officers and guests in the Great Hall of the People in Beijing.

China would respect the Taiwanese people’s religious and legal freedoms in a unified “one country, two systems” framework, Xi said. But he warned that the profound political differences between Taiwan, a vibrant democracy, and China, a highly authoritarian government, were no excuse to reject unification.

“Different systems are not an obstacle to unification, and even less are they an excuse for separatism. The private property, religious beliefs and legitimate rights and interests of Taiwanese compatriots will be fully assured,” Xi said, calling independence for the self-governing island a dead end.


Xi also accompanied his offer of talks with a warning — one implicitly also aimed at the US, which provides Taiwan with military equipment and the possibility of support in a crisis. “We make no promise to abandon the use of force and retain the option of taking all necessary measures,” Xi said in a section of the speech that drew rousing applause. Those options, he said, could be used against “intervention by external forces.”

On the last day of 2018, Trump signed into law the Asia Reassurance Initiative Act, which tries to counter China’s growing military influence. The section of the law on Taiwan reiterates US commitment “to counter efforts to change the status quo and to support peaceful resolution acceptable to both sides of the Taiwan Strait.”

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Prasad » 03 Jan 2019 14:23

China would respect the Taiwanese people’s religious and legal freedoms in a unified “one country, two systems” framework, Xi said. But he warned that the profound political differences between Taiwan, a vibrant democracy, and China, a highly authoritarian government, were no excuse to reject unification.

:rotfl: :rotfl: Like the HK folks are finding out. onlee

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby SSridhar » 03 Jan 2019 19:10

Here is the full reply of Ms. Tsai to Xi.

President Tsai Ing-wen, on the afternoon of January 2 in the Presidential Office auditorium, explained the Taiwan government's position on a speech delivered by China's President Xi Jinping (習近平) commemorating the 40th anniversary of the so-called "Message to Compatriots in Taiwan."

A translation of the president's full remarks is as follows:

My fellow citizens and friends from the media, good afternoon.

This morning, China's President Xi Jinping delivered a speech commemorating the 40th anniversary of the so-called "Message to Compatriots in Taiwan," proposing further exploration of a "one country, two systems" scenario for Taiwan. As president of the Republic of China, I want to explain our position.

First, I must emphasize that we have never accepted the "1992 Consensus." The fundamental reason is because the Beijing authorities' definition of the "1992 Consensus" is "one China" and "one country, two systems." The speech delivered by China's leader today has confirmed our misgivings. Here, I want to reiterate that Taiwan absolutely will not accept "one country, two systems." The vast majority of Taiwanese also resolutely oppose "one country, two systems," and this opposition is also a "Taiwan consensus."

Next, we are willing to engage in negotiations. But as Taiwan is a democratic country, all political consultations and negotiations between the two sides of the Taiwan Strait must be authorized and monitored by the people of Taiwan, and conducted on a government-to-government basis by both sides. Under this principle, no individual or group has the right to represent the people of Taiwan to conduct political consultations or negotiations.

The development of cross-strait relations, as I said very clearly in my new year's talk yesterday, requires that: China must face the reality of the existence of the Republic of China (Taiwan), and not deny the democratic system that the people of Taiwan have established together; second, must respect the commitment of the 23 million people of Taiwan to freedom and democracy, and not foster divisions and offer inducements to interfere with the choices made by the people of Taiwan; third, must handle cross-strait differences peacefully, on the basis of equality, instead of using suppression and intimidation to get Taiwanese to submit; fourth, it must be governments or government-authorized agencies that engage in negotiations. Any political consultations that are not authorized and monitored by the people cannot be called "democratic consultations." This is Taiwan's position, a democratic position.

We are willing, on the basis of "consolidating democracy" and "strengthening national security," to conduct orderly, healthy cross-strait exchanges. I also want to reiterate that domestically, we need to set up a three-part security network for cross-strait exchanges comprised of security for people's livelihoods, information security, and an institutionalized democracy monitoring mechanism.

Cross-strait trade and economic relations should be mutually beneficial, and promote mutual prosperity and development. However, we oppose Beijing making "benefitting China" its core focus, using United Front economic means including financial inducements to attract Taiwan technology, capital, and talent to move to mainland China. We will vigorously promote strategies and measures that strengthen Taiwan to consolidate a Taiwan-centric, Taiwan-first path to economic development.

Over the past two years, Taiwan has faithfully fulfilled its duty as a member of the regional community, actively contributing to cross-strait and regional peace and stability. We do not provoke, but uphold our principles. We have suffered many forms of suppression, but have never abandoned our fundamental position and commitments regarding cross-strait relations. I want to remind the Beijing authorities that a superpower must act with the demeanor and take the responsibility of a superpower, and international society is watching China to see if it can make changes and become a trustworthy partner. The "four musts" are the most basic and crucial foundations that will determine whether cross-strait relations develop in a positive direction.

A so-called "spiritual union" should be built on mutual respect and understanding, with governments on both sides of the strait handling issues regarding the people's welfare pragmatically, such as the urgent swine fever epidemic we are now facing. Pressuring international corporations to change their designation for Taiwan won't bring about a spiritual union, nor will buying off Taiwan's diplomatic allies or circling Taiwan with military aircraft and naval vessels.

Lastly, I want to reiterate that the results of the 9-in-1 elections absolutely do not mean that grassroots public opinion in Taiwan favors abandoning our sovereignty, nor do they mean that the people want to make concessions regarding Taiwanese identity.

Democratic values are the values and way of life that Taiwanese cherish, and we call upon China to bravely move towards democracy. This is the only way they can truly understand Taiwanese people's ideas and commitments. Thank you.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby A Nandy » 04 Jan 2019 09:42

Chinese population going down, another Japan in the making...

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/wor ... 365891.cms

This downward trend may be irreversible, he cautioned, due to factors such as a decrease in the number of women of childbearing age and the reluctance of couples ...

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby yensoy » 04 Jan 2019 09:52

A Nandy wrote:Chinese population going down, another Japan in the making...

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/wor ... 365891.cms

This downward trend may be irreversible, he cautioned, due to factors such as a decrease in the number of women of childbearing age and the reluctance of couples ...


Being depopulated internally while emigration of its people happen to Western shores... this is going down like Russia. A land blessed with plenty, but a nasty regime and racist mindset that exploits its own people, and doesn't welcome outsiders to put down roots. Japan looks quite different in this context.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby ArjunPandit » 04 Jan 2019 17:26

^^wouldnt the two kid policy help them with this, of course this will take time but still would be better than china. I mean if required these guys can make 3 or 4 too. After all that's what these regimes do when they need cannon fodder and useful idiots. I am sure CPC would have certainly looked into the Goebbels cookbooks for the receipie of a Proud Chinese father, mother and son. Of course they can also look at American and Soviet templates

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby SSridhar » 05 Jan 2019 07:25

The complete text of the Asia Reassurance Initiative Act, ARIA recently signed by Trump.

Excerpts
SEC. 203. UNITED STATES-CHINA RELATIONSHIP.

Code: Select all

(a) IN GENERAL.—The United States Government—
    (1)  expresses  grave  concerns  with  Chinese  actions  that  seek—
            (A)  to  further  constrain  space  for  civil  society  and  religion within China; and
            (B) to undermine a rules-based order in the Indo-Pacific region;
    (2)  encourages  China  to  play  a  constructive  role  in  world  affairs  by  demonstrating  consistent  respect  for  the  rule  of  law  and                 international norms;
    (3) seeks to build a positive, cooperative, and comprehensive relationship with China—
            (A) by expanding areas of cooperation; and
            (B) by addressing areas of disagreement, including over human  rights,  economic  policies,  and  maritime  security;  and
    (4)  is  committed  to  working  with  China  on  shared  regional  and global challenges, especially—
            (A) upholding and strengthening the rules-based international system; and
            (B) the denuclearization of North Korea.
(b)  SENSE   OF CONGRESS.—It  is  the  sense  of  Congress  that  the United States should—
    (1)  welcome  a  decision  by  China  to  change  course  and pursue a responsible results-oriented relationship with the United States and engagement on global issues;
    (2)  encourage  China  to  play  a  constructive  role  in  the Indo-Pacific region and globally; and
    (3)  continue  to  call  out  Chinese  actions  that  undermine the rules-based international system.

SEC. 204. UNITED STATES-INDIA STRATEGIC PARTNERSHIP.

Code: Select all

(a) IN GENERAL.—The United States Government—
    (1)  recognizes the vital role of the strategic partnership between  the  United  States  and India in promoting peace and security in the Indo-Pacific region;
   (2) calls for the strengthening and broadening of diplomatic, economic, and security ties between the United States and India; and
   (3) is committed to—
        (A)  the  New  Framework  for  the  United  States-India Defense  Relationship,  done  at  Arlington,  Virginia  on  June  28, 2005;
        (B)  the  United  States-India  Defense  Technology  and  Trade Initiative, launched in 2012;
        (C)  the  Joint  Strategic  Vision  for  the  Indo-Pacific  and  Indian  Ocean  Region,  announced  on  January  25,  2015; 
        (D)  the  United  States-India  Joint  Statement  on  Prosperity  Through  Partnership,  issued  on  June  26,  2017;  and 
        (E)  all  related  and  subsequent bilateral and security agreements and arrangements concluded as of the date of the enactment of this Act.
(b)  INDIA  AS MAJOR DEFENSE PARTNER.—Congress  makes  the following findings:
    (1) Section 1292(a)(1)(A) of the National Defense Authorization  Act  for  Fiscal  Year  2017  (Public  Law  114–328;  130  Stat. 2559;  22  U.S.C.  2751  note)  requires  the  recognition  of  India as a major defense partner.
   (2)  The  designation  of  India  as a major defense partner which is unique to India—
       (A)  institutionalizes  the  progress  made  to  facilitate defense  trade  and  technology  sharing  between  the  United  States and India;
       (B)  elevates  defense  trade  and  technology  cooperation between  the  United  States  and  India  to  a  level  commensurate  with  the  closest  allies  and  partners  of  the  United States;
      (C)  facilitates  technology  sharing  between the United States and India, including license-free access to a wide range of dual-use technologies,  after taking into account national security concerns; and
      (D)  facilitates  joint  exercises,  coordination  on  defense  strategy  and  policy,  military  exchanges,  and  port  calls  in  support  of  defense 

As fo ASEAN, it states, inter alia,
urge ASEAN member states to develop a common approach to reaffirm the decision of the Permanent Court of Arbitration’s ruling with respect to the case between the Republic of the Philippines and the People’s Republic of China.

SEC. 207. QUADRILATERAL SECURITY DIALOGUE.

Code: Select all

It is the sense of Congress that—
   (1)  the  security  dialogue  between  the  United  States,  Australia,  India,  and  Japan  is  vital  to  address  pressing  security challenges  in  the  Indo-Pacific  region  in  order  to  promote— 
       (A) a rules-based order;
       (B) respect for international law; and
       (C) a free and open Indo-Pacific; and
   (2)  such  a  dialogue  is  intended  to  augment,  rather  than  to replace, current mechanisms.

SEC. 209. COMMITMENT TO TAIWAN.

Code: Select all

(a)  UNITED STATES COMMITMENT  TO TAIWAN.—It  is  the  policy  of the United States—
   (1)  to  support  the  close  economic,  political,  and  security  relationship between Taiwan and the United States;
   (2)  to  faithfully  enforce  all  existing  United  States  Government commitments to Taiwan, consistent with the Taiwan Relations  Act  of  1979  (Public  Law  96–8),  the  3  joint  communiques, and  the  Six  Assurances  agreed  to  by  President  Ronald  Reagan  in July 1982; and
   (3)  to  counter  efforts  to  change  the  status  quo  and  to  support  peaceful  resolution  acceptable  to  both  sides  of  the Taiwan Strait.
(b)  ARMS SALES   TO TAIWAN.—The  President  should  conduct  regular  transfers  of  defense  articles  to  Taiwan  that  are  tailored  to  meet  the  existing  and  likely  future  threats  from  the  People’s Republic  of  China,  including  supporting  the  efforts  of  Taiwan  to  develop   and   integrate   asymmetric   capabilities,   as   appropriate, including  mobile,  survivable,  and  cost-effective  capabilities,  into  its military forces.
(c) TRAVEL.—The President should encourage the travel of high-level  United  States  officials  to  Taiwan,  in  accordance  with  the  Taiwan Travel Act (Public Law 115–135).

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby SSridhar » 05 Jan 2019 12:37


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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby RKumar » 05 Jan 2019 15:26

^ Xi is upto something since 2 years he is harping this song ... get ready for war. Seems like his generals are ignoring this orders :lol:

But jokes apart, it does not bode well for the world!! I hope, India will keep its gun powder dry for any unwanted incidents.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby TKiran » 05 Jan 2019 15:31

^^^it will be good for India, we don't need to do anything, China will become Hanisthan, Tibet, Xinjiang, Hong Kong, Taiwan, a'la Soviet Union.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Singha » 05 Jan 2019 22:59

Image

the core hanistan in the tang dynasty era. losing a major war may shrink cheen back to its former size.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby chetak » 05 Jan 2019 23:06

han is in no position to start a war with anyone.

all their human rights atrocities that have been ignored so far will be raked up and their exports will start to dry up hitting them right in the han coolies.

many are just waiting to gang up on the hans and take them down a notch or two or three.

these guys have created havoc in their meteoric rise using economic muscle power.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Singha » 05 Jan 2019 23:52

the calculated 'leaks' and wails in western MSM about the brutal treatment of the muslim minority is perhaps to create a fait accompli narrative about the coming trade wars.

whatever is told now has been going on for decades may have been harsher earlier.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Prasad » 06 Jan 2019 00:04

But lets not kid ourselves. The prc goons are vulnerable and quite full of bluff but the american public while gungho on trumpist be and buy american slogans, are very used to low priced chinese goods right from very cheap use and throw level to better products that are challenging western products in quality and price. Nobody, certainly not the higher ups, want a war no matter Trumps bluster. Trade is where WE need to stepup, now that we know militarily we have the b@lls to say fu.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby chetak » 06 Jan 2019 01:10

Prasad wrote:But lets not kid ourselves. The prc goons are vulnerable and quite full of bluff but the american public while gungho on trumpist be and buy american slogans, are very used to low priced chinese goods right from very cheap use and throw level to better products that are challenging western products in quality and price. Nobody, certainly not the higher ups, want a war no matter Trumps bluster. Trade is where WE need to stepup, now that we know militarily we have the b@lls to say fu.


the war is not with the US but with its "One country, two systems" mantra on gobbling up taiwan.

any attempt to annex taiwan will result in global chaos and the hans will pay dearly for the attempt.

the hans will never dare take on the US at this stage. it will set them back many decades.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Prem » 06 Jan 2019 02:14

PRC in war with Taiwan should be benefit India?

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Neshant » 06 Jan 2019 03:05

PRC-Taiwan is nothing more than a dog & pony show.
Ultimately once PRC gets rich, Taiwan will voluntarily unify with them.

Taiwan has been a great conduit of US technology to PRC especially semiconductor manufacturing.
Essentially Taiwan has passed on all it got from US to PRC causing great harm to US strategic interests - even while proclaiming to be an adversary of PRC.
Ditto for South Korea.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Neshant » 06 Jan 2019 03:14



If PRCs economy deleverages badly, the Emperor will need to start hostilities somewhere to distract the mobs looking to unseat him.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby kit » 06 Jan 2019 03:16

Neshant wrote:PRC-Taiwan is nothing more than a dog & pony show.
Ultimately once PRC gets rich, Taiwan will voluntarily unify with them.

Taiwan has been a great conduit of US technology to PRC especially semiconductor manufacturing.
Essentially Taiwan has passed on all it got from US to PRC causing great harm to US strategic interests - even while proclaiming to be an adversary of PRC.
Ditto for South Korea.


precisely the reason why the Khans are not giving their F35 or any super duper tech to Taiwan ..more than any other country they need it and can afford it

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby kit » 06 Jan 2019 03:19

all of this is a matter of time before the world is polarised into 2 ideologies ..assuming there is no war in the immediate future

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Singha » 06 Jan 2019 14:20

yes taiwan is a manchurian candidate for sucking in western tech. not to be trusted with any jewels.
once the PRC gets into position of raw power in the world and can enforce its whims and has closed all tech gaps, then taiwan will do a mock merger but before that it will make bleating noises and remain in the western camp to suck up western tech and feed that to peking.

unfortunately they occupy a very important place in the electronic manufacturing at board and chip level and TSMC is now neck and neck with intel in 7-10nm semi process.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby souravB » 06 Jan 2019 18:58

Singha wrote:unfortunately they occupy a very important place in the electronic manufacturing at board and chip level and TSMC is now neck and neck with intel in 7-10nm semi process.

Singha sir, yes they are neck and neck now but that doesn't mean if they face any US sanction, they will be able to keep up. Without cutting edge manufacturing tools they will be pushed back decades. There are various etching and masking machines which are the actual crown jewels of US R&D which US doesn't share. even ASML from Amsterdam which makes the cutting edge UV-Lithography machines depends on US companies for tech and support for components like high frequency laser and mask materials.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Prasad » 06 Jan 2019 19:58

Neshant wrote:PRC-Taiwan is nothing more than a dog & pony show.
Ultimately once PRC gets rich, Taiwan will voluntarily unify with them.

Taiwan has been a great conduit of US technology to PRC especially semiconductor manufacturing.
Essentially Taiwan has passed on all it got from US to PRC causing great harm to US strategic interests - even while proclaiming to be an adversary of PRC.
Ditto for South Korea.

Even american companies have done so. All for commerical reasons with the big bait of Chinese market access. Just like boeing and airbus move assembly lines to china salivating over the huge market there.

souravB wrote:Singha sir, yes they are neck and neck now but that doesn't mean if they face any US sanction, they will be able to keep up. Without cutting edge manufacturing tools they will be pushed back decades. There are various etching and masking machines which are the actual crown jewels of US R&D which US doesn't share. even ASML from Amsterdam which makes the cutting edge UV-Lithography machines depends on US companies for tech and support for components like high frequency laser and mask materials.

Very true. And not just high tech tools, even certain raw materials are sourced from outside which are very tightly controlled, being niche products. Given enormous amounts of american funding, with most certainly atleast a little bit of defense funding too, the US has a veto over all transactions that such companies, even if entirely european, can do. The americans have their fingers in a lot of these things and can turn off the tap when needed. Which also tells you why said taps are open :)

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Bart S » 06 Jan 2019 20:23

Singha wrote:yes taiwan is a manchurian candidate for sucking in western tech. not to be trusted with any jewels.
once the PRC gets into position of raw power in the world and can enforce its whims and has closed all tech gaps, then taiwan will do a mock merger but before that it will make bleating noises and remain in the western camp to suck up western tech and feed that to peking.

unfortunately they occupy a very important place in the electronic manufacturing at board and chip level and TSMC is now neck and neck with intel in 7-10nm semi process.



TSMC are very advanced, no doubt about it, and neck and neck with Intel on many fronts. However they have been more of a commercial success (due to all of Intel's competitors being virtually forced to use them due to lack of too many alternatives - Samsung is another option), which they have built on, and don't have the same level of deep R&D and patents that Intel has.

However, the above is still largely moot, since the process equipment and technologies are still very much controlled by the US + Euro + JP combine (even the Koreans are dependent on them to a large extent, despite Samsung's massive R&D operations).

To use an analogy, for example, a few years ago GM put Opel up for sale. Some people where claiming that it would be a great chance to pick up German technology and expertise on the cheap, for a manufacturer from India or China, that they could then re-use in their own cars. However, while there would obviously be some expertise and technologies inherent to Opel (especially system integration and assembly), Opel is still just an assembly line and a brand. The real crown jewels are Robert Bosch, Continental, ZF Friedrichshafen, Kuka Robotics, ThyssenKrupp etc.

Nevertheless, TSMC is very impressive and nobody can deny that Taiwan has been the main conduit for electronics technology into China. And who knows, with Huawei etc making 100B+ a year in revenue, they might be able to catch up to the process technologies as well through stealing combined with sheer brute force effort.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Prasad » 06 Jan 2019 20:25

And guess who bought Kuka and is milking them now.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Singha » 06 Jan 2019 20:44

also poaching top sinic people to return back with stolen IP and stealing IP using university students & hackers from the loosely guarded univ system is another line of attack. chains are only strong as weakest link.

a while back a fruitco munna was arrested for stealing IP using his laptop. apple takes it security very seriously vs other SV cos. when arista was a young co, in some rented office - professional team broke in one night and stole all the hard disks off their code repository server.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/mor ... 8cb903d936

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby TKiran » 06 Jan 2019 22:11

China can't win a military war even with Taiwan. War is not an option for China.

China is very good at coercion, that's the only option for them.

I sincerely hope that China is going to go for war, and gets cut to size, and Xi is the Gorbachev of China.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby kit » 07 Jan 2019 01:30

TKiran wrote:China can't win a military war even with Taiwan. War is not an option for China.

China is very good at coercion, that's the only option for them.

I sincerely hope that China is going to go for war, and gets cut to size, and Xi is the Gorbachev of China.


war is best won when it's not fought. I expect proxy wars including regime changes in key countries like India as a part of their offensive

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby TKiran » 07 Jan 2019 11:20

China’s unconventional war is inflicting greater damage on India
Unlike the other states negotiating RCEP, India is not an export-driven economy; rather it is an import-dependent economy whose growth is largely driven by domestic consumption
Updated: Jan 05, 2019 16:36:22
By Brahma Chellaney

China is emphasising public diplomacy to help soften Indian public opinion and mute Indian concerns over an increasingly asymmetrical trade relationship. Foreign Minister Wang Yi said in New Delhi the new people-to-people mechanism will “help consolidate the public-opinion foundation” for bilateral ties. China’s public diplomacy aims to underpin its “win-win” policy toward India — engagement with containment.

New Delhi, however inadvertently, is lending a helping hand to Beijing’s strategy of engagement as a façade for containment. India has done little more than implore China to rein in its spiralling trade surplus. The lopsided trade relationship makes India essentially a colonial-style raw-material appendage of the state-led Chinese economy, which increasingly dumps manufactured goods there.

Worse still, New Delhi effectively is funding China’s India containment strategy. India’s defence budget for the current financial year, at Rs 2,95,512 crore ($42.2 billion), is 65% less than China’s estimated trade surplus of $65.1 billion in the calendar year 2018. This means India practically is underwriting Beijing’s hostile actions against it — from its military build-up in Tibet and growing Indian Ocean encroachments to the China-Pakistan Economic Corridor (CPEC).

Pakistan recently revealed to the International Monetary Fund (IMF) that China’s CPEC investments will total $26.5 billion. From just one year’s trade surplus with India, Beijing can fully fund two CPEC-type multi-year projects and still have billions of dollars for other activities to contain India.




In the list of countries with which China has the highest trade surpluses, India now ranks No. 2 behind the US. China’s surplus with the US, of course, is massive. But as a percentage of total bilateral trade, India’s trade deficit with China is greater than America’s. And in terms of what it exports to and imports from China, India is little different from any African economy.

Consider another troubling fact: Total Chinese foreign direct investment in India remains insignificant. Cumulatively aggregating to $1.9 billion, it is just a fraction of China’s yearly trade surplus. India’s 2015 removal of China as a “country of concern”, instead of encouraging major Chinese FDI flow, has only spurred greater dumping.

Consequently, China’s trade surplus has spiralled from less than $2.5 billion a month when Narendra Modi took office to over $5 billion a month since more than a year. China’s trade malfeasance is undermining Indian manufacturing and competitiveness, with the result that Modi’s “Make in India” initiative has yet to seriously take off. Many firms in India have turned from manufacturers to traders by marketing low-end products from China — from tube lights to fans — under their brand names. Is it thus any surprise that manufacturing’s share of India’s GDP has actually contracted? Instead of “Make in India”, “Made in China” has gained a stronger foothold in India.


India’s China problem will only exacerbate when the planned 16-nation Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership (RCEP) accord takes effect, thereby creating a free-trade zone between the world’s two most-populous countries. Unlike the other states negotiating RCEP, India is not an export-driven economy; rather it is an import-dependent economy whose growth is largely driven by domestic consumption.

RCEP’s main impact on India will come from China, which Harvard’s Graham Allison has called “the most protectionist, mercantilist and predatory major economy in the world”. China, while exploiting India’s rule of law for dumping, keeps whole sectors of its economy off-limits to Indian businesses. It has dragged its feet on dismantling regulatory barriers to the import of Indian agricultural and pharmaceutical products and IT services.

External Affairs Minister Sushma Swaraj rightly reminded Wang that “a solution to the continuously increasing trade deficit” is a must. Seeking to rebalance trade is not a dollar-for-dollar matter. Rather, it is about ensuring fair trade and fair competition. China rose through fair access to world markets that it now denies India. Indeed, Beijing is abusing trade rules to pursue unfair trade and undercut India’s manufacturing base.


What stops India from taking a leaf out of US President Donald Trump’s playbook and giving China a taste of its own bad medicine? WTO rules permit punitive tariffs on foreign subsidised goods that harm domestic industries. India can also emulate Beijing’s non-tariff barriers and other market restrictions.

India focuses on Pakistan’s unconventional war by terror but forgets that China is also waging an unconventional war, though by economic means. Indeed, China’s economic war is inflicting greater damage, including by killing Indian manufacturing and fostering rising joblessness among the Indian youth.

Just as the British — as American historian Will Durant noted — financed their colonisation of India with Indian wealth, the Chinese are financing their encirclement of India with the profits from their predatory trade with it.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Singha » 08 Jan 2019 10:32

CNN

(CNN)China will face an "unstoppable" population decline over the coming decades, with fewer and fewer workers struggling to support an increasingly aging society, according to a report by a leading state-sponsored Chinese thinktank.
The report, which comes more than three years since China officially ended its controversial decades-long one-child policy, warns that the "the era of negative population growth is almost here," forecasting that the country's population will peak at 1.44 billion in 2029.
The Chinese Academy of Social Sciences report suggests that the decline in fertility rates will lead to a decrease in overall population to 1990-era levels of 1.172 billion by 2065. World Bank data from 2017 showed a Chinese population of 1.386 billion.

Forget the trade war, China's economy has other big problems
Forget the trade war, China's economy has other big problems
The country's working-age population has stagnated, the report states, while its dependency ratio -- the number of working people in relation to non-working, largely children and retired people -- continues to skew.
"In theory, long-term population decline, especially accompanied with the increasing escalation of aging of population, is bound to bring very negative social and economic consequences," the report states, without elaborating on what these consequences could entail.
Experts have warned that as China's working age population shrinks so too will domestic consumption, which could have unintended consequences for the global economy, which has relied on China as a growth engine.
The report says that the country should start preparing and crafting policy to meet the challenges of the impending decline.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby chetak » 08 Jan 2019 12:51

India, Iran, Russia look for new trade corridor



India, Iran, Russia look for new trade corridor

7 Nov 2018

Image
India, Russia and Iran explore new route

India, Russia and Iran are meeting next month to work out the details of a massive project to open a new sea-land transport corridor that would be a cheaper and shorter alternative to shipping oil and other goods through the Suez Canal.

According to RT, the North-South Transport Corridor (INSTC), the name for the new transit route, will connect India to Russia and Europe via a combination of sea routes and an overland passage through Iran, according to Iranian state-owned news outlet Press TV. The 7,200-kilometers long corridor will reduce the time and costs of shipping by up to 40%. Transport time between Mumbai and Moscow will fall to 20 days. The annual capacity of the transport artery is expected to reach 30 million tons.

Indian logistics companies presently need to route shipments through China, Europe or Iran to access Central Asian markets. Already, routing shipments through Iran is the least time-consuming option. But the INSTC will have the ancillary benefit of allowing Indian companies to forge a new trade route to Afghanistan without having to travel through Pakistan, as tensions over Kashmir are once again on the rise. The passage corridor through the Persian Gulf will mean billions of dollars in trade for Afghanistan, cutting its dependence on foreign logistics.

Already, India has committed $500 million for developing the Iranian port of Chabahar, which will be a crucial trans-shipment point for transitioning cargo from sea to land. What's more, the arrangement has the blessing of China, which could potentially incorporate the passage into its multi-trillion-dollar 'One Belt, One Road' initiative to build new trade routes connecting China to Europe, Asia and Africa.

Indian officials said they're hoping to start building out the infrastructure required for the route to function as swiftly as possible.

"All issues may be resolved in order to operationalize the (INSTC) route as early as possible," according to Indian Commerce Minister Suresh Prabhu, as quoted by the media.

The alliance of these four countries should unnerve the US. As it stands, the rise in bilateral trade denominated in rubles, yuan and rupees, while modest so far, is set to grow, with plans to eventually undermine the dollar's hegemonic grip on global trade settlement. And with US sanctions on Iran set to take effect on Nov. 4, the Iranian regime only stands to benefit by encouraging the blooming economic partnership between Russia and India, as Russia implements its plan to circumvent the dollar, and, by extension, Treasury Department sanctions.

Russia and India have recently announced that they had sealed a long-discussed $6 billion arms deal despite threats of economic sanctions from Washington.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby souravB » 08 Jan 2019 19:23

Singha wrote:CNN

(CNN)China will face an "unstoppable" population decline over the coming decades, with fewer and fewer workers struggling to support an increasingly aging society, according to a report by a leading state-sponsored Chinese thinktank.

Singha sir, if need be nothing's stopping Shri W.T. Pooh to put cameras in every bedroom of the country and "politely ask" all citizens to start humping like bunnies. :lol: :lol:

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Prasad » 08 Jan 2019 20:16

I don't think any country has reversed a declining population. Japan and Germany are projected to decline too. Southern indian states have a below replacement tfr too. It is very difficult to reverse it.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby ArjunPandit » 08 Jan 2019 20:27

Prasad wrote:I don't think any country has reversed a declining population. Japan and Germany are projected to decline too. Southern indian states have a below replacement tfr too. It is very difficult to reverse it.


what saar you assumed china is just any other country?? they are unshackling chains of century of humiliation. For them, ain't no mountain too high. If required master xi will ban pawn. BTW didnt you hear of chinese designer babies, they will produce copies of master xi and et all like pancakes or in their case (my fav too|) dimsums

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby kit » 09 Jan 2019 00:52

maybe clone babies as well ??? shh ! China could be the very first country to produce human clones

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby ArjunPandit » 09 Jan 2019 00:53

kit wrote:maybe clone babies as well ??? shh ! China could be the very first country to produce human clones

reverse engineered xi/mao would be great fun to have. It would be great fun to have mao xi combo facing namo

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Philip » 09 Jan 2019 08:24

The fangs are getting sharper.New light tanks and SP arty with a 50km range introduced in Tibet, while the yellow-faced slit-eyed Chin Hitler pretends to make peace with the PM.

Pakistan is not India's greayest threat but those principal nations who sustain its eviltude with cash injections namely China and Soothi Barbaria.The latter led by Mad Butcher Salmaan, has just announced a $ 15B package of aid for the terrorist entity.

India has no other option but to hugely increase defence spending and devise a new strategy to improve domestic defence production in both public and pvt. sectors, along with critically needed outright purchases of weapon systems and tech. from trusted friends abroad. While our MEA deceive themselves into believing China's handshake of peace, the harsh reality is after Doklam where we stood firm, it is increasing its capability and plugging its weaknesses on a war footing.That indicates that aggression is on its mind not peace, which would've seen troop reductions if it really meant it.

I am fearful of the GOI being deceived by the " Yellow peril", the Asian Commie fuhrer, who tepeatedly exhorts his countrymen to denounce God and prepare for total war.In actual fact the " War with China" has already begun.It's already started moving its pawns on the board
with its OBOR in the IOR and the virtual takeover take over of the Indo- China Sea pushing out ASEAN littorals and challenging the USN tool.Before the 2019 hustings the GOI should clear as many new otders as possible.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby SSridhar » 09 Jan 2019 20:14

China's new naval radar can monitor areas size of India: Report
China has developed an advanced compact size maritime radar which can maintain constant surveillance over an area of the size of India, media reported Wednesday.

The domestically-developed radar system will enable the Chinese navy to fully monitor China's seas and spot incoming threats from enemy ships, aircraft and missiles much earlier than the existing technology, the Hong Kong-based South China Morning Post reported, quoting the scientist who took part in China's Over-the-Horizon (OTH) radar programme.

Liu Yongtan, an academician of the Chinese Academy of Sciences (CAS) and the Chinese Academy of Engineering (CAE) from the Harbin Institute of Technology, is credited to have upgraded the China's radar technology and developing an advanced compact size radar for the PLA Navy's carrier fleet to "maintain constant surveillance over an area the size of India," the Post reported.

President Xi Jinping conferred the country's top science award, carrying a prize money of USD 1.116 million, to Liu and another military scientist, Qian Qihu at an event in the Great Hall of the People in Beijing on Tuesday for their contributions.

Qian was felicitated for setting up the theoretical system for China's modern defence engineering and contributions in creating underground nuclear shelter facilities, the state-run Xinhua news agency reported.

According to Liu, the ship-based OTH radar had greatly increased the range of area that the Peoples' Liberation Army (PLA) could monitor.


"Relying on traditional technologies, our surveillance and monitoring could only cover about 20 per cent of our maritime territory. With the new system, we can cover the whole area," he said.

A senior member of Liu's team told the Post that the new system would be a ship-based OTH radar system.

The floating radar "will increase our navy's information gathering capabilities in critical areas" including the South China Sea, Indian Ocean and Pacific Ocean, he was quoted as saying in the Post.

China is not the only nation developing the technology.

A major US defence contractor, Raytheon, was granted a patent in 2016 for a similar system.

The Raytheon design involves a transmitting vessel and several receiving ships with antennae mounted on the deck.

Radio waves are directed into the sky by the transmitter to be collected by the receiving ships, which then pass on the signals to aircraft carriers via satellite or airborne relays.

According to a recent report China had built an antenna five times the size of New York.

The Chinese military, which now has over USD 175 billion annual defence budget, is focussing on developing heavy military equipment to compete with the US for global strategic influence.

China is investing heavily especially in the development of the navy to extend its influence beyond to shores.

China has developed two aircraft carriers with third in the pipeline.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby yensoy » 09 Jan 2019 20:40

Semiconductor gurus, what do you think of the recently announced Huawei's 7nm process server CPU? https://venturebeat.com/2019/01/06/huawei-claims-its-kunpeng-920-arm-based-risc-processor-is-the-industrys-fastest/

Intel hasn't even produced 10nm chips in numbers, leave alone 7nm. Huawei, Apple and Qualcomm appear to be at the leading edge in this round.

How has Huawei managed to leapfrog Intel? What kind of a threat is this to the western world's dominance in semiconductor process?


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