Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby arun » 30 Jan 2019 20:29

X Posted from the India-US Relations News & Discussions thread to the Terroristan, Afghanistan News & Discussion and Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat threads.

Excerpt on dealing with “South Asia” from the WORLDWIDE THREAT ASSESSMENT of the US INTELLIGENCE COMMUNITY, January 29, 2019:

SOUTH ASIA

The challenges facing South Asian states will grow in 2019 because of Afghanistan’s presidential election in mid-July and the Taliban’s large-scale attacks, Pakistan’s recalcitrance in dealing with militant groups, and Indian elections that risk communal violence.
Afghanistan Stalemate
We assess that neither the Afghan Government nor the Taliban will be able to gain a strategic ilitary advantage in the Afghan war in the coming year if coalition support remains at current levels. Afghan forces generally have secured cities and other government strongholds, but the Taliban has increased large-scale attacks, and Afghan security suffers from a large number of forces being tied down in defensive missions, mobility shortfalls, and a lack of reliable forces to hold recaptured territory.
Pakistan Recalcitrance
Militant groups supported by Pakistan will continue to take advantage of their safe haven in Pakistan to plan and conduct attacks in India and Afghanistan, including against US interests. Islamabad’s narrow approach to counterterrorism cooperation—using some groups as policy tools and confronting only the militant groups that directly threaten Pakistan—almost certainly will frustrate US counterterrorism efforts against the Taliban.
Indian Elections and Ethnic Tensions
Parliamentary elections in India increase the possibility of communal violence if Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) stresses Hindu nationalist themes. BJP policies during Modi’s first term have deepened communal tensions in some BJP-governed states, and Hindu nationalist state leaders might view a Hindu-nationalist campaign as a signal to incite low-level violence to animate their supporters. Increasing communal clashes could alienate Indian Muslims and allow Islamist terrorist groups in India to expand their influence.
India-Pakistan Tensions
We judge that cross-border terrorism, firing across the Line of Control (LoC), divisive national elections in India, and Islamabad’s perception of its position with the United States relative to India will contribute to strained India-Pakistan relations at least through May 2019, the deadline for the Indian election, and probably beyond. Despite limited confidence-building measures—such as both countries recommitting in May 2018 to the 2003 cease-fire along the disputed Kashmir border—continued terrorist attacks and cross-border firing in Kashmir have hardened each country’s position and reduced their political will to seek rapprochement. Political maneuvering resulting from the Indian national elections probably will further constrain near-term opportunities for improving ties.
India-China Tensions
We expect relations between India and China to remain tense, despite efforts on both sides to manage tensions since the border standoff in 2017, elevating the risk of unintentional escalation. Chinese President Xi Jinping and Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi held an informal summit in April 2018 to defuse tension and normalize relations, but they did not address border issues. Misperceptions of military movements or construction might result in tensions escalating into armed conflict.


From here:

WORLDWIDE THREAT ASSESSMENT of the US INTELLIGENCE COMMUNITY January 29th 2019

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby SSridhar » 30 Jan 2019 21:12


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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Kati » 31 Jan 2019 06:01

A second Apple employee was charged with stealing self-driving car project secrets
2
He faces up to 10 years in prison and a maximum fine of $250,000
By Sean O'Kane@sokane1 Jan 30, 2019, 12:03pm EST
SHARE

Photo by Drew Anthony Smith/Getty Images
The Federal Bureau of Investigation accused an Apple employee, who is a Chinese citizen, of attempting to steal trade secrets related to the company’s autonomous car project, according to a charging document that was unsealed on Wednesday. It’s the second time the FBI has charged an Apple employee for trying to steal intellectual property related to the project in the last seven months. The news was first reported by NBC’s Bay Area affiliate.

The new charge comes at a time of high tension between the United States and China. The two countries are locked in a trade war, and various US government agencies have accused China of engaging in multiple schemes — some dating back decades — to steal intellectual property from leading technology companies.

Jizhong Chen, a Chinese national, was charged with theft of trade secrets based on actions that allegedly date back to when he was hired last summer as a hardware developer. He was one of 5,000 Apple employees who was looped in on the company’s self-driving car effort, known as “Project Titan,” which has been operating in secret for years. (The company also recently laid off about 200 employees from the project.) Furthermore, he was also one of 1,200 “core” employees who directly work on the project. Chen was on the electrical engineering team, according to the charging document.


Have information about Project Titan? Email the author at sean.okane@theverge.com, or use SecureDrop or Signal to securely send messages and files to The Verge without revealing your identity.

After fellow employees spotted him taking photographs of the workspace where the project takes place, the FBI says Chen told Apple’s global security team that he backed up his work computer to a personal hard drive and computer.

Apple’s team found Chen had “over two thousand files containing confidential and proprietary Apple material, including manuals, schematics, and diagrams,” according to the charging document. They also found “hundreds” of photographs of computer screens with sensitive company information displayed, including some that were clearly of his own laptop — a way to get around the company’s internal monitoring systems, the FBI says. The complaint details specific photographs taken as recently as December, but also as long ago as June 2018, just a few weeks after Chen was hired.


The FBI says that Chen had been placed on a “performance improvement plan” in December and was potentially in danger of being fired. Chen also told Apple he had applied for two new jobs outside the company, including one at an unnamed Chinese autonomous vehicle company.

Chen was arrested one day before he was scheduled to fly to China. He had told Apple he planned to visit his sick father, according to the complaint. Chen faces up to 10 years in prison and a maximum fine of $250,000.

“Apple takes confidentiality and the protection of our IP very seriously,” Tom Neumayr, a spokesperson for Apple, said in an email. “We are working with authorities on this matter and are referring all questions to the FBI.” Daniel Olmos, a lawyer for Chen, declined to comment.

APPLE’S SECURITY TEAM FOUND OVER 2,000 FILES CONTAINING CONFIDENTIAL MATERIAL ON HIS DEVICES
The FBI charged a different Chinese national who worked on Apple’s self-driving car project, Xiaolang Zhang, with stealing trade secrets in July 2018. Zhang had worked at Apple for almost three years before his arrest. In May 2018, he similarly told his supervisors he planned to go to China to take care of his ailing mother. He also told them he was resigning to take a job at Chinese EV startup Xiaopeng Motors, Apple’s security team had him turn in his work phones and laptop. They discovered he had, among other things, AirDropped 40GB of sensitive data about the project to his wife’s laptop, 60 percent of which the company described as “highly problematic.”

The US has long suspected, and often accused, the Chinese government of encouraging trade secret theft as a way to build up its own industries. But indictments and further accusations have seen a recent uptick. In October 2018, the Department of Justice charged 10 Chinese nationals of hacking aerospace companies. One month later, the DOJ accused a state-owned company of stealing trade secrets from a US chipmaker called Micron Technologies. In December, the DOJ charged two more Chinese nationals with running a 12-year hacking campaign that compromised at least 45 companies and government agencies.

Most recently, Canadian officials arrested Huawei CFO Meng Wanzhou at the request of the US government. While the arrest originally centered on possible violations of US sanctions against Iran, this week, the Justice Department accused Meng and Huawei of fraud and stealing trade secrets from T-Mobile.

Update, January 30th 1:30PM ET: Added new details from the charging document about Chen’s final months with Apple.


https://www.theverge.com/2019/1/30/1820 ... hina-titan

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Singha » 31 Jan 2019 09:00

one has to wonder whats been stolen from less security conscious cos than Apple, which traditionally has a deep monitoring culture in the workplace.
and these meetoo clones will enjoy a protected home market and legal security even if victim proves the trail of pug marks leads to their door.

till date I am unaware of chinese courts punishing any local co for theft from foreign cos.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby hnair » 31 Jan 2019 09:14

Singha wrote:till date I am unaware of chinese courts punishing any local co for theft from foreign cos.


They will. As soon as someone translates an identical judgement from elsewhere

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby TKiran » 31 Jan 2019 09:51

There are no courts in China.

Many people think that Chinese is society is just like in the west or like in India. It's not true.

The law in China for the Chinese is " haath mein paisa.... Ch@@th mein l@^da...". The people in China are very clever as they can't fight it out in courts post-facto. So they make their decision only when they are sure of the outcome.

Just now got a confirmation from a source that there are some party courts for party disputes, but the General public have no chance of going to courts.

There are no lawyers in China.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby abhik » 31 Jan 2019 10:24

As per the China Uncensored guy, the conviction rate of Chinese courts is 99% - gives you a good idea of their judicial system.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Kati » 31 Jan 2019 20:31

The Failure of the United States’ Chinese-Hacking Indictment Strategy

https://www.lawfareblog.com/failure-uni ... t-strategy

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Kati » 31 Jan 2019 20:38

As per the insiders, all the small and medium sized vital US companies have been hollowed out by Panda of their technical know-hows.
The most egregious of all is, - Panda has been pushing its own people over the last thirty years to infiltrate the DoE, FDA, NIH labs, and then either
making off with all the latest scientific data, and/or handing out research grants to its own people to undertake research, which Panda is interested into, at the US taxpayers' money. :x :x :x :x :x :x :x :x :x

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Kati » 01 Feb 2019 07:32

How Huawei planned international robot espionage via email

https://www.engadget.com/2019/01/30/hua ... yptr=yahoo

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Singha » 01 Feb 2019 16:53

met a cto today who has to deal with the trade war and brexit. he had final assembly of product in cheen.
says they are dealing with no-deal brexit by stockpiling more product in UK warehouses.
wrt china, they have moved final assembly to thailand so that product comes out as made in thailand, using parts from all over as usual.
due to US tariffs he said impact of this move is loss of few 100k USD vs few million USD.
his operations team had to work 24x7 for a while to plan and make this happen.

expressed a lot of surprise why huawei is being allowed to operate 5G trials in india and why some 8/10 top downloaded apps in india are from cheen. said their back end agencies are most certainly doing data mining and snooping using every account worldwide.

being german, he was upset about why bonn was asleep while kuka robotics was purchased by cheen, who has transferred a lot of tech now back to mainland. said the days of large chinese buys like that being allowed to happen in usa or eu are now over. some cos who directly competed with huawei are slowly benefitting from their exit.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Singha » 01 Feb 2019 21:25

Kati wrote:How Huawei planned international robot espionage via email

https://www.engadget.com/2019/01/30/hua ... yptr=yahoo



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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby pankajs » 01 Feb 2019 22:12

IMHO .. too early to write China's Venezuelan investment off but still worth a read ...

https://www.scmp.com/comment/insight-op ... n-win-lose
How China’s aid to Venezuela has gone from a win-win to a lose-lose
China’s massive investment in the developing world is billed as a win-win model for South-South cooperation. But its excursion into bankrupt Venezuela has proved to be a complete failure, economically, politically and diplomatically.
....
Even as other countries have backed off from doing business with Caracas, Beijing has kept up its financial support. Over the past decade, China has pumped US$62 billion into Venezuela, which accounts for 53 per cent of all Chinese money lent to Latin America. But Venezuela, with its brand of “socialism of the 21st century”, has not been saved from economic collapse.

Economically, China has suffered huge losses. Many of its 790 projects in Venezuela have failed, the victim of corruption or debt defaults. Caracas has also struggled to repay Beijing in oil shipments, despite debt-for-oil deals.

Politically, Beijing has paid a heavy price for its role in propping up the Maduro regime, which might be the world’s most incompetent and corrupt government. Since Maduro took power in 2013, Venezuela’s gross domestic product has shrunk drastically. Inflation skyrocketed to 1 million per cent last year.

Diplomatically, Beijing’s support of Maduro’s government has also cost it dearly. Almost all members of the Lima Group – a 14-member mostly Latin American bloc – have switched recognition from Maduro to Juan Guaido, the Venezuelan opposition leader who has declared himself interim president.
....
The fiasco in Venezuela has raised serious questions about Chinese policymakers’ sensitivity and credibility when it comes to managing the political risks in investing in Latin America and elsewhere in the developing world.

Beijing sees investing in Caracas as a “natural extension” of its multibillion-dollar “Belt and Road Initiative”, which should raise the alarm about that network of projects to be built in politically unstable regions such as the Middle East and Africa.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby dnivas » 01 Feb 2019 22:54

Kati wrote:How Huawei planned international robot espionage via email

https://www.engadget.com/2019/01/30/hua ... yptr=yahoo


wow, this is just ridiculous. wow..just amazed at the brazeness and repeated infringement. Thanks for posting this

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Singha » 01 Feb 2019 22:59

Global Times

Verified account
@globaltimesnews
Follow Follow @globaltimesnews
More Global Times Retweeted Global Times
Countries that haven't joined the #NPT, including India and North Korea, must join the treaty with the identity of non-nuclear armed state. Otherwise it would cause serious nuclear proliferation: Xu Guangyu, a former PLA major general and participant of the #P5Conference

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby nam » 01 Feb 2019 23:03

The PLA General forgot to mention their rent boy...

Good Chinis openly opposing our entry.. keeps GOI on the toe...

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Singha » 01 Feb 2019 23:42

cheen is using this 58t adapted icbm dubbed long march 11 as a rapid solid fuel SSLV
you can see the black gas generator like our A5
sea launches are planned soon


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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby ArjunPandit » 01 Feb 2019 23:58

Singha wrote:Global Times

Verified account
@globaltimesnews
Follow Follow @globaltimesnews
More Global Times Retweeted Global Times
Countries that haven't joined the #NPT, including India and North Korea, must join the treaty with the identity of non-nuclear armed state. Otherwise it would cause serious nuclear proliferation: Xu Guangyu, a former PLA major general and participant of the #P5Conference

1 What happened to wuhan spirit?
2. So they are doing == by grouping us with noko
3. Very nice of them to talk about proliferation.They are the biggest proliferators, got it from USSR and then proliferated it to pokis

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Singha » 02 Feb 2019 00:15

a small list of major known IP theft cases. they are on it 24x7 using a vast army of hackers, subverted employees and F1 students

https://www.prosperousamerica.org/top_t ... e_ip_theft

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby SSridhar » 02 Feb 2019 08:55

Singha wrote:Countries that haven't joined the #NPT, including India and North Korea, must join the treaty with the identity of non-nuclear armed state. Otherwise it would cause serious nuclear proliferation: Xu Guangyu, a former PLA major general and participant of the #P5Conference

It is very obvious and devious what China is trying to do here.

China has never given up its idea of dismantling the Indian nuclear arsenal and deprive it of the de-facto Nuclear Weapon Status. The Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesperson's assertion a few days back in Beijing that India would not be admitted into NSG without signing the NPT was timed to coincide with this new Chinese equation of India with NoKo in the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons Conference by the P5. The Chinese are thinking far ahead. They know that the powerful and growing economy would sooner than later make India a de-jure NWS as well and it wants to avoid that situation coming to pass. So, at every opportunity it tries to shut every possible door and downgrade India's position.

That apart, there are other reasons as well. On the one hand, it equates India with a rogue, UN-sanctioned NoKo in order to snub India deeply. That's part of the Information warfare of the Chinese, constantly reminding India its position in Chinese eyes. By omitting Pakistan from the statement, China conveys to us that we are not even at the level of Pakistan for them!

On the other hand, it is also a deep game. Firstly, China might feel that by uttering both countries in one breath, it becomes difficult for those supporting India to leave out NoKo and continue to support India's case alone. IOW, put them in a spot. From now onward, we can expect China to keep doing this. Secondly, it is trying to put pressure on the US and is attempting to save NoKo's arsenal of nuclear weapons. The Chinese formulation, carefully constructed, says that NoKo can retain its weapons but join the NPT as NNWS, along with India. It is trying to project itself as having concern for proliferation, but at the same time surreptitiously allowing its client state off the hook. Also, more worryingly, that could be even taken as a warning that it wouldn't hesitate to horizontally proliferate if its demands aren't met. The saner world is not going to accept NoKo's nuclear weapons. Coming ahead of a possible Trump-Kim Jong Un meeting in February, this sets the precondition for the meet. China is acting on behalf of its cat's paw possibly hoping that tired of over a decade of cat-and-mouse games, NoKo would be recognized as an NNWS. With China accepting NoKo as a defacto NNWS, the implied meaning of this statement, it is asking other members of the P5 to do likewise. If the apex talks fail on the NNWS issue, China can turn around and say that 'double standards' between NoKo's and India's case led to the failure. IOW, India would be the fall guy in the Chinese empire-building dream.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby souravB » 02 Feb 2019 09:38

Singha wrote:Countries that haven't joined the #NPT, including India and North Korea, must join the treaty with the identity of non-nuclear armed state. Otherwise it would cause serious nuclear proliferation: Xu Guangyu, a former PLA major general and participant of the #P5Conference

It is time for us to setup a/two millitary base in Nepal. I still do not understand that we have base in Djibouti but not in Nepal/Bdsh. With bases there we could be in comfortable position wrt to the chicken neck problem. Also it's a strategic message to Cheen that we could make your life very problematic with these countries. With bases in Nepal, China has to deploy forces in some treacherous terrains where now it can get away with posting less. It's a cold war and only way to win it is to being tough.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby pankajs » 02 Feb 2019 11:35

Why do we need a base in Nepal / Bangladesh?

1. We don't need a base inside those countries to defend the chickens neck. We could just walk in at the time of emergency.
2. We don't need a base in those countries to make life very problematic with these countries for China. We could do it from within our borders. A base inside wouldn't add or subtract from our capacity to cause discomfort so close to our own border.

There is no serious threat of invasion for either side from across the Himalayas. Anyways Chinese Han population and economic centers are far away from the Indo-China border to be of much concern to them with our extra deployments.

OTOH, the competition across the IOR is a very real threat for them and us. It is therefore logical for both India and China to reduce the focus on land army while bulking up the naval presence.

Edit: for clarity

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Singha » 02 Feb 2019 14:33

Dont worry abput chumbi valley in between silkim and bhutan. Any chini formations there will get slaughtered in a real war . Its not a defensible place.

They will run north tails between legs but getvtrapped once we take down the one or two major roafs feeding into this death trap

Where banditji erred was in not absorbing these areas in a straight line when cheen invaded tibet and dalai la had to run

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby SSridhar » 02 Feb 2019 15:06

US spies elevate China rivalry to war of ideologies - Straits Times
WASHINGTON (AFP) - In a move that could harden Washington's posture towards Beijing for years, the US intelligence community has characterised relations with China as a global ideological showdown that will not be doused by trade deals or commercial theft crackdowns.

US spy chiefs abruptly shifted their view of the superpower rivalry this week to something much deeper than a contest over markets, technology and geopolitics.

The annual Worldwide Threat Assessment released by Director of National Intelligence Dan Coats instead said China is seeking to propagate "authoritarian capitalism" to counter Western liberal democracy, in an echo of the decades-long Cold War.

"Chinese leaders will increasingly seek to assert China's model of authoritarian capitalism as an alternative - and implicitly superior - development path abroad, exacerbating great-power competition that could threaten international support for democracy, human rights, and the rule of law," it said.

It added the "coming ideological battle" will be marked by "a period of increased Chinese foreign policy activism and a Chinese worldview that links China's domestic vision to its international vision", including the idea that market-oriented authoritarian regimes are superior.


China policy analysts said the assessment marks an important modification of US thinking - and reflects President Xi Jinping's ideological transformation of Chinese foreign policy.

They also say it goes far beyond the views of Mr Trump, who has treated relations with China as more transactional.

'IDEOLOGICAL COMPETITION'


"This is more than just economics," said Mr James McGregor, chairman of China business consultancy APCO Worldwide.

"Now that China is so successful, there is an ideological battle for which system works best," he told AFP.

"There are a lot of poor and developing countries which have looked at what China has accomplished with awe and admiration, and they are wondering if that system will work for them."

Princeton University professor and China expert Aaron Friedberg said the shift is significant but not surprising after Mr Xi last year severed the country's decades-old anchor to a non-ideological foreign policy.

"For a long time, Chinese officials went out of their way to say that they didn't see themselves as presenting an alternative model," he said.

"Now it is an ideological competition because the Chinese see it that way."

But Mr Xi differs from Mao Zedong, the iconic leader who sought to advance his version of Marxism-Leninism throughout the developing world in the 1950s and 1960s, Dr Friedberg said.

Mr Xi's government is, he explained, "doing things that have the effect of weakening democratic institutions in places where they are not perhaps deeply rooted", such as Central Europe and Africa.

"In Africa and elsewhere, their preferred partners are often authoritarian rulers, reducing the chances that those countries will have liberal political systems," he said.

According to Mr Tarun Chhabra of the Brookings Institution, the US intelligence community now believes China is deliberately attacking fundamental US values on the world stage.

"Our values are inherently threatening to the Chinese Communist Party by virtue of our fundamental commitment to free speech," said Mr Chhabra.

"A commitment to the idea that the state doesn't have a monopoly on the truth is 'ideological' and profoundly dangerous for the CCP," he said.

He cited two developments driving the decision to brand it an ideological battle.

First is the interment of nearly a million Muslim Uighurs in western China in an effort to "stamp out" their identity, he said.

That "really lays bare a fundamental clash between those who believe in upholding the individual dignity of all people, and those who justify virtually anything in the name of internal security".

Second, Mr Chhabra said, was Beijing's combining massive digital surveillance with a social credit apparatus, which could one day give the CCP social control "to a degree that Mao himself probably never dreamed about".


MESSAGE TO TRUMP

US-China relations have deteriorated steadily over the past five years of Mr Xi's determined projection of China's influence around the globe.

Dr Friedberg said the new stance by US spy chiefs was a message to Mr Trump, who unlike previous presidents speaks little of liberal democratic values, and avoids seeing the Washington-Beijing relationship as a fundamental fight between models of governance.

"I think that this statement by the Director of National Intelligence is drawing attention to something which the administration for various reasons has chosen to downplay. It's their interpretation of reality, that differs somewhat from the people at the top of the administration."

"He seems to be oddly sympathetic to illiberal regimes," Dr Friedberg said of Mr Trump.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Singha » 02 Feb 2019 15:30

Headline in cnn today . They should take the hit but ban cheen students from stem degrees and jobs
Give chance to others

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/01/politics ... index.html

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby SSridhar » 02 Feb 2019 17:33

Sri Lanka seeks $1 billion loan from China amid debt woes - AP
Sri Lanka is negotiating a $1 billion loan from China to construct a highway linking the capital Colombo to the hilly resort city of Kandy, even as the heavily-indebted South Asian island nation makes arrangements to pay down $5.9 billion in foreign loans this year.

Finance Ministry spokesman M.R. Hasan said Saturday that he's waiting to hear whether terms of the loan for the highway project have been approved.

A large chunk of Sri Lanka's foreign debt is from China, which sees Sri Lanka as a key link in its transcontinental Belt and Road infrastructure initiative.

President Maithripala Sirisena's government had criticized the previous administration of strongman Mahinda Rajapaksa for leading the country into a Chinese debt trap. However, the government has turned to China to help relieve economic pressures.{That is the classic example of 'debt trap'. Same in Pakistan where Captain was critical of foreign loans, especially the opaque CPEC, but is seeking alms from the same source these days}

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Kati » 02 Feb 2019 18:00

SSridhar wrote:
Singha wrote:Countries that haven't joined the #NPT, including India and North Korea, must join the treaty with the identity of non-nuclear armed state. Otherwise it would cause serious nuclear proliferation: Xu Guangyu, a former PLA major general and participant of the #P5Conference

It is very obvious and devious what China is trying to do here.

China has never given up its idea of dismantling the Indian nuclear arsenal and deprive it of the de-facto Nuclear Weapon Status. The Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesperson's assertion a few days back in Beijing that India would not be admitted into NSG without signing the NPT was timed to coincide with this new Chinese equation of India with NoKo in the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons Conference by the P5. The Chinese are thinking far ahead. They know that the powerful and growing economy would sooner than later make India a de-jure NWS as well and it wants to avoid that situation coming to pass. So, at every opportunity it tries to shut every possible door and downgrade India's position.

That apart, there are other reasons as well. On the one hand, it equates India with a rogue, UN-sanctioned NoKo in order to snub India deeply. That's part of the Information warfare of the Chinese, constantly reminding India its position in Chinese eyes. By omitting Pakistan from the statement, China conveys to us that we are not even at the level of Pakistan for them!

On the other hand, it is also a deep game. Firstly, China might feel that by uttering both countries in one breath, it becomes difficult for those supporting India to leave out NoKo and continue to support India's case alone. IOW, put them in a spot. From now onward, we can expect China to keep doing this. Secondly, it is trying to put pressure on the US and is attempting to save NoKo's arsenal of nuclear weapons. The Chinese formulation, carefully constructed, says that NoKo can retain its weapons but join the NPT as NNWS, along with India. It is trying to project itself as having concern for proliferation, but at the same time surreptitiously allowing its client state off the hook. Also, more worryingly, that could be even taken as a warning that it wouldn't hesitate to horizontally proliferate if its demands aren't met. The saner world is not going to accept NoKo's nuclear weapons. Coming ahead of a possible Trump-Kim Jong Un meeting in February, this sets the precondition for the meet. China is acting on behalf of its cat's paw possibly hoping that tired of over a decade of cat-and-mouse games, NoKo would be recognized as an NNWS. With China accepting NoKo as a defacto NNWS, the implied meaning of this statement, it is asking other members of the P5 to do likewise. If the apex talks fail on the NNWS issue, China can turn around and say that 'double standards' between NoKo's and India's case led to the failure. IOW, India would be the fall guy in the Chinese empire-building dream.


^^^ agree 108 times SS-saar.
In every forum, from newspapers to social media sites, what is preventing rest of us to mention PRC and ROC in same breath? ...

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Kati » 02 Feb 2019 18:01

Singha wrote:Headline in cnn today . They should take the hit but ban cheen students from stem degrees and jobs
Give chance to others

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/01/politics ... index.html


Have been warning about this for some time ....

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby chola » 02 Feb 2019 18:14

Kati wrote:
Singha wrote:Headline in cnn today . They should take the hit but ban cheen students from stem degrees and jobs
Give chance to others

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/01/politics ... index.html


Have been warning about this for some time ....


The biggest advantage the US (and the West) has over non-goras is their ability to attract and make use of the best human resources from the other races. Blocking chinis from the US STEM and tech job market will solve their braindrain problem overnight.

A veteran once said at one of our Wall Street desi powwows that the best way to make India a developed nation in quickest possible time is to do an Idi Amin in the US and the Anglo-sphere. Amin, for the younger ones, was the dictator who kicked the Indian population out of Uganda.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby TKiran » 02 Feb 2019 19:13

There's secret administration for yellow races for the white Americans. You can see the tone of the article how apolegetic they are that a Chinese Spy has been caught.

When China was stealing the blue collar jobs in 90s almost all the articles in US media were ecstatic that they are uplifting millions of Chinese from poverty, but when it comes to brown Indians, they were putting restrictions.

When Chinese student spies are caught, they are detaining Indian students​.

Han don't mix as well as Indians into their adopted home lands. They have their superiority complex because of their indoctrination.

Because the browns adapt the culture very easily, they are perceived as threat and are easy targets. But the things are going to change once the new generation of browns started asserting.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby souravB » 02 Feb 2019 19:15

pankajs wrote:Why do we need a base in Nepal / Bangladesh?
--snip--

Sir, the bases are needed for Strategic messaging if not for security.
As I said, it is a cold war and it is just prudent for us to take our pound of flesh against the service we have done for these countries till now.
Also Nepal is talking to Cheen about a Rail line, what do you suppose Cheen is doing that for? so that they have a base there in the future.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby pankajs » 02 Feb 2019 19:25

^^
Strategic messaging across Himalayas where the chance of a "All out / major" conflict is nil vs messaging in IOR where the chances are high? I would rather spend it in around IOR i.e Navy, Andaman, Maldives,etc.

I don't get this talk of "take our pound of flesh against the service we have done". Could you elaborate?

One China-Nepal railway line will lead to the invasion of India? And we will not be able to counter it from our side of an open and relatively easy border across 1,700 km of it? I mean what kind of access does India need to create hell both for Nepal and China inside Nepal if it really came to that? And a base inside Nepal will solve the issue raised by the China-Nepal rail link?

I can smell the 10 feet Chinaman syndrome.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)nw

Postby chola » 02 Feb 2019 19:52

TKiran wrote:
Han don't mix as well as Indians into their adopted home lands. They have their superiority complex because of their indoctrination.

Because the browns adapt the culture very easily, they are perceived as threat and are easy targets. But the things are going to change once the new generation of browns started asserting.


Depends on the sex. Han females mix very well with white males. And this includes otherwise very conservative if not racist goras.

Browns are considered a threat at the social level. Goras worry about brown diluting their neighborhood and workplaces. They are less incline to let their sons and daughters associate and mix with browns as opposed to yellows.

But yellows are definitely seen as the main threat on the national level. China was not the first. As late as the 2000s, Japan was still considered a threat.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby souravB » 02 Feb 2019 20:11

pankajs wrote:^^
Strategic messaging across Himalayas where the chance of a "All out / major" conflict is nil vs messaging in IOR where the chances are high? I would rather spend it in around IOR i.e Navy, Andaman, Maldives,etc.

Strategic message as in "These countries are in our backyard and we can make your life difficult here. Oh and while we are at it, we are also a Nuclear power and do not lose sleep over who you compare us to".

don't get this talk of "take our pound of flesh against the service we have done". Could you elaborate?

We provide security, education, infra, relief etc. for these countries, It is time they show us the same reverence as we have shown them.

China-Nepal railway line will lead to the invasion of India? And we will not be able to counter it from our side of an open and relatively easy border across 1,700 km of it? I mean what kind of access does India need to create hell both for Nepal and China inside Nepal if it really came to that? And a base inside Nepal will solve the issue raised by the China-Nepal rail link?

I can smell the 10 feet Chinaman syndrome.

Sir with due respect you can smell whichever syndrome you prefer, I call it pragmatism. The fear of us creating hell during war time didn't stopped them from acquiring a base in SL, nor stopped them from trying the same in Maldives.
Base inside Nepal wouldn't 'solve' the problem but will give us more options and time. We could monitor and act quickly when the time arises.
Also I would request you to please put the patronizing tone down. I never did used the word invasion and never did I used the word war.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby pankajs » 02 Feb 2019 20:52

souravB wrote:
pankajs wrote:^^
Strategic messaging across Himalayas where the chance of a "All out / major" conflict is nil vs messaging in IOR where the chances are high? I would rather spend it in around IOR i.e Navy, Andaman, Maldives,etc.

Strategic message as in "These countries are in our backyard and we can make your life difficult here. Oh and while we are at it, we are also a Nuclear power and do not lose sleep over who you compare us to".
Why do we need a base in Nepal for that kind of a message? Does anyone doubt India as a nuclear power that will be resolved ONLY when we have a military base in Nepal or doubt our ability to create trouble inside Nepal from across the border.

souravB wrote:
pankajs wrote:don't get this talk of "take our pound of flesh against the service we have done". Could you elaborate?

We provide security, education, infra, relief etc. for these countries, It is time they show us the same reverence as we have shown them.
For *most* stuff our neighbors pay and This is exactly the kind of talk that makes our neighbour seek external balancing.

souravB wrote:
pankajs wrote:China-Nepal railway line will lead to the invasion of India? And we will not be able to counter it from our side of an open and relatively easy border across 1,700 km of it? I mean what kind of access does India need to create hell both for Nepal and China inside Nepal if it really came to that? And a base inside Nepal will solve the issue raised by the China-Nepal rail link?

I can smell the 10 feet Chinaman syndrome.

Sir with due respect you can smell whichever syndrome you prefer, I call it pragmatism. The fear of us creating hell during war time didn't stopped them from acquiring a base in SL, nor stopped them from trying the same in Maldives.
Base inside Nepal wouldn't 'solve' the problem but will give us more options and time. We could monitor and act quickly when the time arises.
Also I would request you to please put the patronizing tone down. I never did used the word invasion and never did I used the word war.
Glad that you brought Sri Lanka and Maldives into the picture. That only underlines my point that focus is more critical in the IOR rather than the Himalayas.

Sir Lanka has assured us that the port is for commercial use only and in Maldives no base was required to get the change desired. The Maldives defense minister made a very interesting observation on her recent visit to India. I fully agree with her.

Base inside Nepal will give us option that base just across the border inside India will not give across a 1,700+ km open border? Highly unlikely. And we did not need a base inside Maldives to monitor and get the desired results.

Lastly, IF China-Nepal rail link is a question of trade/economics/debt then a base is not the answer. Infact, such talk will only create an impression of "loosing sleep". That is how Nepal, China and the world will read it no matter how it sounds to us Indians.

"pragmatism" is to focus limited resources where the risks are most visible i.e. in the IOR and not Himalayas and certainly not from the China-Nepal rail link.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Prasad » 02 Feb 2019 21:27

If you listen closely, you'll see the fear of banning Chinese students from american universities is clear and present amidst the troo deep state fellows. They fear Trump might act rashly and do this exact thing and actually help China in the long run. Remember China kickstarted its efforts in semicon when the us tech-denied China's imports of Xeon-Phi processors. That made them sit up and say eff it, we're going the desi way and they pumped in massive amounts in both legit and non-legit ways to access tech. End result? They stole some tech and have a chapamar processor. And made their own tech and have their own processor.

Please read my latest - On Supercomputing - http://delhidefencereview.com/2019/01/2 ... orting-it/

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Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Peregrine » 03 Feb 2019 02:17

China struggling to keep Communist members in Tibet religion-free - Saibal Dasgupta

BEIJING: Ruling Communist Party of China (CPC) is waging an uphill battle to stop party members from indulging in Tibetan Buddhist practices backed by Dalai Lama’s followers. This is significant in light of the fact that for decades, the party has been running a vicious police and media campaign against such party members and Dalai Lama’s followers.

The local government of Tibet Autonomous Region in Southwest China has produced a video exposing local Communist members violating the party regulations on religion, anti-separatism and anti-corruption. The party has repeatedly described the Tibetan leader as a separatist element.

Investigators have identified 215 party members for rule violations including worshipping gods and observing religious rites. A regional commission of discipline had been established last year to supervise and check such activities.

The CPC remains an atheist organization, party paper Global Times said quoting Xiong Kunxin, an ethnic studies professor at Tibet University in Lhasa. CPC members are barred from religious beliefs, because they can only believe in Marxism. Having religious beliefs is betrayal of the Marxist cause, he said.

There are some "two-faced" people in Tibet, who claim loyalty to the Party while secretly sympathizing and even working for separatists, Xiong said. The local government has already identified these people who will be kicked out of the party, he said.

The 46-minute video has revealed 46 different rule violations by local CPC members, the party’s organ, Global Times, said. One of the rule violations was practising religious beliefs.

The video will be telecast by the state-run Tibet Television along with other programs showing the party’s anticorruption efforts.

“We must wage a tit-for-tat battle with the Dalai Lama and his group. If any CPC member has the wrong attitude on this subject, it would be a serious problem,” the paper quoted an unnamed party member as saying.

But the video blurred the picture of a “politically forbidden object”, which was found in a cave in Nyalam county of Xigaze region in Tibet in 2016. Authorities apparently suspected that the object was being worshipped. The case led to three CPC officials being expelled from the party and 10 others receiving a warning.

An unnamed official from the regional commission for discipline inspection said in the video that "in Tibet, taking a firm political stance is the most important thing in abiding by the Party's political disciplines”

Cheers Image

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby souravB » 03 Feb 2019 02:54

pankajs wrote:
souravB wrote:
Strategic message as in "These countries are in our backyard and we can make your life difficult here. Oh and while we are at it, we are also a Nuclear power and do not lose sleep over who you compare us to".
Why do we need a base in Nepal for that kind of a message? Does anyone doubt India as a nuclear power that will be resolved ONLY when we have a military base in Nepal or doubt our ability to create trouble inside Nepal from across the border.

No one doubts it, but comes a time when it becomes imperative to assert it. And having a base does give us other benefits security wise too.

For *most* stuff our neighbors pay and This is exactly the kind of talk that makes our neighbour seek external balancing.

But this is the truth. And external balancing could be sought for economic dependency not the security umbrella.
Glad that you brought Sri Lanka and Maldives into the picture. That only underlines my point that focus is more critical in the IOR rather than the Himalayas.

Sir Lanka has assured us that the port is for commercial use only and in Maldives no base was required to get the change desired. The Maldives defense minister made a very interesting observation on her recent visit to India. I fully agree with her.
--snip--
"pragmatism" is to focus limited resources where the risks are most visible i.e. in the IOR and not Himalayas and certainly not from the China-Nepal rail link.

These were crises averted. Maldives has agreed for the radar station which in future could be expanded into something else. In SL we already took over a nonviable airport but still reasons are there.
'pragmatism' is also thinking ahead and plan accordingly. Just as IOR, neighbours are ought to be taken into consideration. The problem lies with thinking these are separate issues but they are not. The immediate implications for us might be different but in the long run these have similar goals.
Base inside Nepal will give us option that base just across the border inside India will not give across a 1,700+ km open border? Highly unlikely. And we did not need a base inside Maldives to monitor and get the desired results.

Lastly, IF China-Nepal rail link is a question of trade/economics/debt then a base is not the answer. Infact, such talk will only create an impression of "loosing sleep". That is how Nepal, China and the world will read it no matter how it sounds to us Indians.


But it is never about trade/economics, it is about debt. Do we pay off the debt when Nepal cannot pay it back? How many debts we pay back? How about we think in future tense for once and send the message that trade/economics is okay, but security provider can only be moi.
Also a base inside Nepal is crucial, not only for messaging but for our internal security as well. Think Type56s, drugs, Jihadis coming through the porous border. Our intelligence agencies could work well with a proper base.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby souravB » 03 Feb 2019 03:05

Prasad wrote:If you listen closely, you'll see the fear of banning Chinese students from american universities is clear and present amidst the troo deep state fellows. They fear Trump might act rashly and do this exact thing and actually help China in the long run. Remember China kickstarted its efforts in semicon when the us tech-denied China's imports of Xeon-Phi processors. That made them sit up and say eff it, we're going the desi way and they pumped in massive amounts in both legit and non-legit ways to access tech. End result? They stole some tech and have a chapamar processor. And made their own tech and have their own processor.

Please read my latest - On Supercomputing - http://delhidefencereview.com/2019/01/2 ... orting-it/

OT
Sir excellent article but to add, the Microprocessor development program has three entities working concurrently namely C-DAC, IIT-M and IIT-B, all following different program. Only C-DAC is specifically targeting the HPC sector. The parallel processor from IIT-M is an off shoot from their research, they are mainly focusing on consumer grade chips. So in all probability, the HPC chips would come from C-DAC.

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Re: Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (15-11-2017)

Postby Kati » 03 Feb 2019 10:58

Exclusive: Mobile network operator's body GSMA considers crisis meeting over Huawei
Reuters Reuters•February 2, 2019
FILE PHOTO: A woman walks past a Huawei shop in Beijing
FILE PHOTO: A woman walks past a Huawei shop in Beijing, China, January 29, 2019. REUTERS/Thomas Peter/File Photo
More
PARIS/FRANKFURT (Reuters) - Mobile communications industry body GSMA has proposed its members discuss the possibility that Chinese network vendor Huawei [HWT.UL] is excluded from key markets, amid concerns such a development could set operators back by years.

The European Commission is weighing a de facto ban on Huawei's 5G network equipment for next-generation mobile networks in the European Union due to security concerns, sources in Brussels have told Reuters.

GSMA Director General Mats Granryd has written to members proposing to put the debate around Huawei onto the agenda of its next board meeting, a spokesman for the federation told Reuters on Saturday.

The meeting will be held in late February on the sidelines of the Mobile World Congress, the industry's biggest annual gathering, in Barcelona.

"It is to be confirmed for now," he said.

Some Western countries, including the United States and Australia, have restricted Huawei from building next-generation mobile networks, citing concerns that its equipment may contain 'back doors' opening it up to cyber-espionage.

Western governments are also concerned that China's National Intelligence Law requires its companies and people to collaborate in espionage efforts.

Huawei, the global market leader with annual sales of more than $100 billion, denies the existence of any back doors. The company and its founder Ren Zhengfei have repeatedly denied they would spy for China.

Many operators rely on Huawei to build out 5G networks, and a de-facto ban would be a considerable setback for Europe's efforts to stay competitive in communications, with implications for connected factories, self-driving cars and medical technology.

Deutsche Telekom , Europe's largest telecoms company, has said that, if it had to rip out Huawei equipment from its existing networks, this could delay its plans to roll out new services by two to three years.

(Reporting by Douglas Busvine in Frankfurt, Gwenaelle Barzic in Paris, writing by Kirsti Knolle, editing by Louise Heavens, William Maclean)


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