Understanding the US - Again

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Karan M
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Karan M » 08 Apr 2019 15:33

I am scratching my head at the original post. I presume when IAF used up a huge chunk of the Su-7 TTL before the 1971 war, just after the aircraft came in, it was because the US told us to do it?
Seems like we have internalized a lot of stereotypes about khan gear - "massa arms kit is a dream". Ermm about that AN/TPQ-37 and our Jalashwa procurements come to mind.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby hnair » 08 Apr 2019 15:41

Not even Pakis say such things about khan gear, after India had to dig out all those AMRAAMS from fields covered in morning dew.....

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby nachiket » 08 Apr 2019 15:42

hnair wrote:Not even Pakis say such things about khan gear, after India had to dig out all those AMRAAMS from fields covered in morning dew.....

They got the idea in 1965 itself when the Patton's came up short against Centurions and in 1971 when the F-104's got smoked by Mig-21's.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby ramana » 09 Apr 2019 00:45

Karan M wrote:I am scratching my head at the original post. I presume when IAF used up a huge chunk of the Su-7 TTL before the 1971 war, just after the aircraft came in, it was because the US told us to do it? :?: :?: :?:
.....

Please elaborate?

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Karan M » 09 Apr 2019 10:20

IAF got Su7s shortly before 71 conflict due to deal struck by IG. They had a couple of years to familiarize themselves etc. Instead of a slow and steady process, they went all out per what I heard. Fighters were flown non stop, pilot, crew proficiency was top aim. Russians shocked, told us total technical life would be used up, utilization was way beyond what they thought we would do, we didnt care. So IAF has been exercising and learning to max. Its training regimen, far before US or anyone started training with us. In 71, after war broke out, Su7s were pulling upto 6 sorties per pilot per day.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby ramana » 09 Apr 2019 23:39

Thanks for the full explanation. And the SU-7s served their purpose very well as the IAF Palam Museum shows.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby ramana » 09 Apr 2019 23:41

There is a PBS show on US post Civil War period Reconstruction hosted by Henry Louis Gates Jr. Prof at Harvard.

Would be good to see.

Later I would like to discuss my theory.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Ravi Karumanchiri » 10 Apr 2019 00:52

ramana wrote:There is a PBS show on US post Civil War period Reconstruction hosted by Henry Louis Gates Jr. Prof at Harvard.

Would be good to see.

Later I would like to discuss my theory.



^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
It premiers tonight on PBS stations broadcasting into the US and Canada (where a lot of PBS donors live).

You can watch the trailer here....
https://www.pbs.org/video/reconstructio ... er-pkhs21/

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Ravi Karumanchiri » 10 Apr 2019 01:07

Karan M wrote:IAF got Su7s shortly before 71 conflict due to deal struck by IG. They had a couple of years to familiarize themselves etc. Instead of a slow and steady process, they went all out per what I heard. Fighters were flown non stop, pilot, crew proficiency was top aim. Russians shocked, told us total technical life would be used up, utilization was way beyond what they thought we would do, we didnt care. So IAF has been exercising and learning to max. Its training regimen, far before US or anyone started training with us. In 71, after war broke out, Su7s were pulling upto 6 sorties per pilot per day.


I had never seen an Su-7 before I went looking for it a moment ago; and I found this GEM of an old film on Youtube... [Folks: This is a fighter-bomber with ski-style landing gears, able to operate off of TURF! Must see!]



The CONOPs of this platform is still relevant today. IMO this ski-style landing gears should find their way onto a renewed Su-7, which includes a big autocannon and at least one load-out option including thousands of rounds for it. JMT

[Before anyone argues that such a gun would melt before it could get through, 3000 rounds per sortie; I'd suggest that 'thermionic converters' be integral to all hot, non-moving parts, especially the gun barrel and engine exhausts; to collect heat energy and transform it directly into electric power. See this also, RE Thermionic Power Converters. This electric power would be used to separate more oxygen from the airflow and feed it directly to the engines, among other advantageous uses of it. Transforming heat into electricity will become an increasingly important part of stealthiness on the battlefield, as this will inherently lower the IR emissions of the aircraft. Try to picture it: Rugged plane with big gun (or two), each belt-fed from ENORMOUS, wing-mounted, under-slung magazines, each carrying 3000 rounds; plus 'internal ammo'.]

RELATED: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermoelectric_generator
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermoelectric_effect
https://www.quora.com/What-are-some-rec ... oelectrics

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby UlanBatori » 11 Apr 2019 08:10

Why was the loss rate of Su-7s so high in the 71 war? Ground attack by brave pilots? Or sheer number of sorties?

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby ramana » 11 Apr 2019 19:24

There was a post on twitter comparing the GDP of the top 20 countries.
US led with $21.5T
China next with $14.7T

....

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Singha » 11 Apr 2019 20:56

UlanBatori wrote:Why was the loss rate of Su-7s so high in the 71 war? Ground attack by brave pilots? Or sheer number of sorties?


Missions like these against dense aa fires
https://youtu.be/I6No-wdhAG4

Dhaka 1971 airport being smashed by su7 in repeated runs

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Peregrine » 14 Apr 2019 03:33

ramana wrote:There was a post on twitter comparing the GDP of the top 20 countries.
US led with $21.5T
China next with $14.7T
....
ramana Ji :

IMF : GDP CURRENT PRICES 2019 :

U S A : 21.34 TRILLION

CHINA 14.22 TRILLION

INDIA US$ 2,970 BILLION

PAKISTAN : USS$ 278.02 BILLION

Cheers Image

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby saip » 14 Apr 2019 05:50

^^^ You missed Bangladesh. Its GDP is $314 Billion. Pakistan must now eat grass to catch up with those short, dark, rice eating people.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby sanjaykumar » 14 Apr 2019 05:56

And Bangladesh has a population less than that of Pakistan. Shameful for Pakistanis...ah well they are winning the battle against India in their own minds, so it's all good.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby VikramA » 14 Apr 2019 09:45

Peregrine wrote:
ramana wrote:There was a post on twitter comparing the GDP of the top 20 countries.
US led with $21.5T
China next with $14.7T
....
ramana Ji :

IMF : GDP CURRENT PRICES 2019 :

U S A : 21.34 TRILLION

CHINA 14.22 TRILLION

INDIA US$ 2,970 BILLION

PAKISTAN : USS$ 278.02 BILLION

Cheers Image


according to IMF india at 2.9 trillion is bigger than uk at 2.8 and even France 2.7 :eek: . did france go through a recession or something? i thought they were around 3.2 range. and nigeria at 444 billion is bigger than bangladesh :shock: . i guess producing oil does have benefits

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Singha » 14 Apr 2019 11:19

Its official that india > uk > france from this year
Their growth rates are low

Uk will be slow this year due to extended brexit

France has been troubled for some time . Gilets jaunes yellow jackets burning luxury stores on champs de elysses is hardly a poster for economic investment

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Singha » 14 Apr 2019 11:20

Modiji has aet germany as target for 2025 and japan for 2030

These two tend to be more sluggish than uk france so 10 years of around 7% growth and stronger rupee may help

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Singha » 14 Apr 2019 11:22

Next 30 years is our opportunity to be a firm member of p3 with global power and economic links

Such chances come once in 1000 years

People need to vote for right guy and make it count

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Rupesh » 14 Apr 2019 16:08

Singha wrote:Modiji has aet germany as target for 2025 and japan for 2030

These two tend to be more sluggish than uk france so 10 years of around 7% growth and stronger rupee may help


India will overtake Japan by 2025. With 8% growth it's easily achievable.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby siqir » 14 Apr 2019 18:15

japan gdp may actually decline over and above yen fluctuations

https://www3.nhk.or.jp/nhkworld/en/news/20190412_32/

they say they will depend on productivity for growth but last two decades saw greatest tech driven productivity with mass adoption of internet and mobiles but their gdp didnt do much

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby gakakkad » 14 Apr 2019 18:33

Singha wrote:Modiji has aet germany as target for 2025 and japan for 2030

These two tend to be more sluggish than uk france so 10 years of around 7% growth and stronger rupee may help


It's most likely going to be much faster than that. At a 10% cagr India will touch 10t by 2030 . Unless people goof up elections it ll be all good.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Cain Marko » 16 Apr 2019 14:28

I've been hearing of this mythical 10% figure for a long time. I'll believe it when i see it.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby kit » 16 Apr 2019 14:34

Singha wrote:Next 30 years is our opportunity to be a firm member of p3 with global power and economic links

Such chances come once in 1000 years

People need to vote for right guy and make it count


+1001

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Gus » 16 Apr 2019 16:56

Singha wrote:Next 30 years is our opportunity to be a firm member of p3 with global power and economic links

Such chances come once in 1000 years

People need to vote for right guy and make it count


More importantly, the trump admin has left the state dept-pentagon-wasp types disoriented

their normal response mechanism to challenges to the entrenched world order is not working like before

this is the best time for india to break the hegemony and leapfrog into better position on many things

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Suraj » 16 Apr 2019 20:17

Cain Marko wrote:I've been hearing of this mythical 10% figure for a long time. I'll believe it when i see it.

You’re post reflects a lack of understanding of the math. The growth rate numbers reported in the news are real GDP growth rates . The rate at which the economy actually grows is the nominal growth rate.

To grow from $3 trillion to $10 trillion in 12 years requires a CAGR of 10.55% . What’s the current nominal GDP growth rate ? Between 11-14% . This is not a blip - this has been the rate we have managed sustained growth at.

In other words we are already growing at the required rate and have been doing so for a long time - we have more than quadrupled GDP in the last decade and half. We hit the trillion mark towards the end of the 2000s and are at the $3 trillion mark now, and that’s thru half of that during UPA2.

I’m not going to explain real and nominal growths here, as it’s a thread diversion, but this has been rehashed many times in the economy thread and is also described online .

In summary though, $10 trillion by fiscal 2030-31 would be the result of growth somewhat below current growth rate. If we sustain growth, we’d end up with more, and we should aim for that. $10 trillion is a nice big number to state today but ultimately it’s not a difficult target.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Karthik S » 16 Apr 2019 20:25

Singha wrote:Next 30 years is our opportunity to be a firm member of p3 with global power and economic links

Such chances come once in 1000 years

People need to vote for right guy and make it count


One thing, cheen doesn't have any internal demographic issue, US may be, but just a bit. We don't have our house in order. We can only be a global power if we are internally strong.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby siqir » 16 Apr 2019 22:27

americans are looking at the prospect of losing white majority next 20 to 40 years

once that happens it wont really be america anymore

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Manish_Sharma » 16 Apr 2019 23:26

^its a myth which I have been reading/ hearing about for last 35 years. Around 1985 in TOI paper there was a news in foreign section that whites will be minority in USA in 30 years; that's 2015.

Now again 2019 I am hearing 20 to 40 years.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby siqir » 16 Apr 2019 23:44

they have a guilty conscience and karma to pay

once they start allowing in the caravans it will go much faster

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Cain Marko » 17 Apr 2019 07:53

Suraj wrote:
Cain Marko wrote:I've been hearing of this mythical 10% figure for a long time. I'll believe it when i see it.

You’re post reflects a lack of understanding of the math. The growth rate numbers reported in the news are real GDP growth rates . The rate at which the economy actually grows is the nominal growth rate.

To grow from $3 trillion to $10 trillion in 12 years requires a CAGR of 10.55% . What’s the current nominal GDP growth rate ? Between 11-14% . This is not a blip - this has been the rate we have managed sustained growth at.

In other words we are already growing at the required rate and have been doing so for a long time - we have more than quadrupled GDP in the last decade and half. We hit the trillion mark towards the end of the 2000s and are at the $3 trillion mark now, and that’s thru half of that during UPA2.

I’m not going to explain real and nominal growths here, as it’s a thread diversion, but this has been rehashed many times in the economy thread and is also described online .

In summary though, $10 trillion by fiscal 2030-31 would be the result of growth somewhat below current growth rate. If we sustain growth, we’d end up with more, and we should aim for that. $10 trillion is a nice big number to state today but ultimately it’s not a difficult target.


thanks for the context saar, that helps and is great news

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby UlanBatori » 18 Apr 2019 20:55

UBCN is FIRST to release FULL (Redacted) Report - e- Mullah Mueller. c blo

****************

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Mort Walker » 19 Apr 2019 19:33

The Herr Mueller report is a big nothing.
Every POTUS has done the same and unkil has interfered with elections in every major country.

The donkey urban naxal judiciary committee members sound a lot like Kapil Sibal of the INC.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby UlanBatori » 20 Apr 2019 19:19

Now they will appoint a Special Prosecutor to investigate obstruction of Justice by the Attorney-Jarnail. Trouble is that unlike in Mongolia the citjens are not coming out with the lassos and pitchforks to motivate the lawmakers to do something useful. Think about the record of the COTUS since about 1992 elections:
1. Gingrich campaigned on platform with one agenda: IMPEACH CLINTON. (ignore growing threat from Paki terror post-Soviet-Afghanistan)
2. HiC provided distraction with Boss-Of-POTUS Healthcare scam. So COTUS was occupied in destroying that.
3. Clinton impeachment.
*****Clinton served out 8 years. Gore was clueless, having spent past 8 years Attending Official Funerals.****
4. Oppose Bush tax-cut and largess (only time one can remember a cheque coming from GOTUS to every family).
5. SUPPORT (mindlessly!) the Dubyan Invasion of Eyerak (minimal thinking at that time would have saved millions of lives and stopped the ISIS carnage).
6. Generally mill around . (ignore ecomomic crisis blossoming from mere thunderstorm into full-blown Cat6 Hurricane).
****** Elephants got wiped out *******
4. OPPOSE ObamaCare.
5. Repeal ObamaCare
6. OPPOSE Obama $$-printing enterprise to pull out of economic crisis.
7. IMPEACH Obama
****** Donkeys got wiped out, well.. despite Popular Vote etc *******
8. OPPOSE Trump. Single-point agenda.
9. IMPEACH Trump.
10. Subpoena Comey
11. Subpoena Mueller
12. IMPEACH Attorney-General

WTH else has COTUS done? Pitchfork time.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby komal » 20 Apr 2019 21:11

Besides look at all he has accomplished:

1) Wall built on border being paid by Mexico

2) Record low budget deficits

3) Record high economic growth in excess of 3%

4) Coal mining jobs created by the millions

5) North Korea denuked

6) Tarrifs on Chinese goods being paid by Chinese

7) USA feared by all nations

8 ) Carried interest tax repealed

9) Silicon Valley relocating to Wisconsin

10) Obamacare repealed with new law that delivers more benefits for those with pre-existing conditions

11) Infrastructure projects by the trillions are underway

12) Automakers relocating from Asia to Missisippi and Alabama

13) Boeing the envy of the aerospace industry

14) Interest rates much lower than under the Kenyan Muslim Terrorist

15) Morality and Christianity returned to the Oval Office



He has delivered on all that he promised and more. Donkeys bad.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby A_Gupta » 24 Apr 2019 16:09

From the Sri Lanka thread:
Kashi wrote:
A_Gupta wrote:In today's US, the fact that Russia attacked the 2016 US elections is the single clearest fact there is


Not to go off topic, but is it really?


1. The US Intelligence Agencies concluded so in 2016 itself.

2. The Republicans controlled the US House of Representatives 2016-2018, and thus led all the committees (had the chairmanship and had a +1 majority in each of the committees). Their House Intelligence Committee issued its report end of April 2018, and it said
https://www.businessinsider.com/house-i ... ion-2018-4

The House Intelligence Committee, led by its Republican chairman, Rep. Devin Nunes, on Friday released a report detailing its findings in its Russia investigation, ending the panel's politically charged probe.

It said Russia was responsible for carrying out cyberattacks against the US, disseminating hacked emails stolen from the Democratic National Committee, and launching a social media disinformation campaign — findings that mostly echo parts of the US intelligence community's assessment of Russia's interference in the 2016 election.


3. We have the Mueller Report also now, with a wealth of detal, and including Mueller's indictment of 13 Russian nationals and 3 Russian companies.

As I said, the fact that Russia attacked the 2016 US elections is the single clearest fact there is. What the squabbling was/is about is to what extent Trump was involved.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Skanda » 25 Apr 2019 01:42

Witness: Driver mumbling ‘I love you Jesus’ after injuring 8 in horrific Sunnyvale crash
A driver suspected of plowing into a crowd of pedestrians in a busy Sunnyvale intersection Tuesday, injuring eight people including a 13-year-old girl, stumbled out of his car afterward mumbling, “Jesus, I love you,” according to a man who watched the horrific crash unfold in front of him.

The FBI is assisting the Sunnyvale Department of Public Safety in investigating the incident, which Sunnyvale Capt. Jim Choi said could have been an intentional act, based on the lack of skid marks that would indicate the driver tried to slow down or stop before hitting the victims.


Wow, literally next door in El Camino Real.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby nachiket » 25 Apr 2019 01:45

Wow! Is that the Christian version of Allahu Akbar?

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby UlanBatori » 25 Apr 2019 02:00

Guptaji, on this whole Tamasha-e-Mueller: I am trying to understand the ground rules.
Suppose, the Pakistanis sent out a whole lot of fB posts and emails attacking Indian-American and Jewish candidates in US elections.
Plus, the ISI happened to have a laptop stolen from a visiting US senator, and they sent out info from that, damaging one party's interests.
And the opposing party/candidate won... just before he ordered sanctions and bombing raids on Pakistan.
Are there grounds for concluding that "Pakistan Interfered in US Elections"?

Don't Englanders and West Oiropeans, and Israelis and of course, Chinese, "interfere" in US elections? Don't Pakis and Ayrabs interfere by supporting Dem candidates in Illinois? Chinese in California? Mexicans in Texas and California and Florida?

I don't see any crime in the revelation of Dem. Natl. Goon-Boss Donna Brazile's hanky-panky that sank Bernie Sanders' candidacy. If it was the Russians who revealed it the US public owes a vote of Thanks! to Putin. It exposed blatant wrong-doing.

Now for the "disinformation". WHAT disinformation? Hilary Clinton howls and eats newborn babies under the full Moon? Was it any worse than what comes in National Enquirer, Fox or CNN every day?

Beyond that, IIRC there was a huge investigation, recounts etc etc citing Russian Meddling With Voting Machines. All of that proved to be BS. Now why is there no Special Counsel investigating THAT disinformation and false allegations? It cost $$M and wasted a lot of time.

Then there is the thing about "XYZ WHO WAS A PQR SUPPORTER MET WITH A RUSSIAN NATIONAL IN A CAFE"
What is illegal about that please? When you get on an airplane, you may well be sitting next to a Russian Agint or a Tanzanian Agint. So what? It is a free country. There is a thing called "Freedom of Association" in the Bill of Rights, hain?

So we have all been very patient through 2+ years of this garbage, but at this point, I would say that the aam-yankee is very justified in saying "Enough of this sh1t!" There was far less Russian Interference in American politics than there is Israeli, British, Chinese, French, German and Mexican interference. Of course the revelation of HiC's sheer crookedness in the Dem national convention, ISIS support and beyond, was pure gold as far as solid info for the voter. It has saved millions of lives in Syria and maybe Libya and Iraq.

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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Postby Mort Walker » 25 Apr 2019 06:59

Orange-Utan has interfered with Indian elections by removing all oil purchase waivers from Iran. What this has done is to increase the market price of oil. Why now instead of after Memorial Day holiday in US? It was designed to impact Indian elections right in the middle to give Pappu maximum political advantage.


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