Understanding the US - Again

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darshan
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by darshan »

It may be incorrect to assume such things. Time and time it has been said that what's good for Hindus on US grounds is of no correlation to Hindus in India. There are no friends of Hindus in the abrahamic world. Their books clearly call for exterminating pagans like Hindus. Though any given day Hindus are better dealing with overt Abrahamics that clearly state what they stand for. Like many learned ones say that Hindus should not hate real islamists like Zakir. They are educating you and being very clear.

I know many Hindus that rather run their small businesses in Alabama than in woke land. And they do know very well where white christians stand on pagans. I rather keep my business and stay under the radar than be able to build a big mandir surrounded by big mosques. Similarly, I rather not get shot by non whites while running my business. I will take racism from red necks any given day.

One needs to learn which enemy is useful when. Hindus need to learn that there are no friends irrespective of colors and laws allowing something over another. 99% of Abrahamics hate pagans. Hindus need to learn to be flexible and play one Abrahamic vs another based on needs and requirements. At least learn from islamists, they fund, support, and use all.

It's up to Hindu leaders to be agile and guide followers to bargain for the most. Comments like Hindus shouldn't be supporting white christians and hating them serves no benefit to Hindus.

Meanwhile, something we all know about the propped up elite educational hubs. This one especially built using blood money.
Yale professor blames Islamist attacks against Hindu temples in Bangladesh on Narendra Modi, backtracks after outrage: All you need to know
https://www.opindia.com/2021/04/yale-pr ... ndra-modi/
darshan
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by darshan »

NJ crowd continues to disappoint with no balls to fight.
Edison BOE Member Apologizes For Anti-Muslim Facebook Posts
https://patch.com/new-jersey/edison-met ... book-posts
...
Mohin Patel apologized to Edison's Muslim community for sharing "controversial and hurtful" Facebook posts back in 2016.
....
"Back then, I used to stir up occasional debates on controversial topics. But my friends and mentors in the Muslim, Jewish, Sikh, Hindu, and other communities have over the years shown me more constructive ways to engage in dialogues, and I thank them for it," Patel said.

"I have learned that the Quran, much like my own holy books, preaches forgiveness. And I humbly ask for your forgiveness."
...
darshan
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by darshan »

US Capitol attack: Black radical Islamist shot dead after killing a cop, injuring another, wanted to target the US govt
https://www.opindia.com/2021/04/black-r ... s-capitol/
On Friday at around 1 pm, a 25-year-old Islamist named Noah Green rammed his car into the security barrier at the Senate side of the US Capitol complex in Washington DC. After ramming his car at the vehicle access point along Constitution Avenue, the man stepped out from his Navy Sedan car and attacked two police officers with a knife, killing one and critically injuring the other.
.....
Rudradev
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by Rudradev »

darshan wrote:NJ crowd continues to disappoint with no balls to fight.
Edison BOE Member Apologizes For Anti-Muslim Facebook Posts
https://patch.com/new-jersey/edison-met ... book-posts
...
Mohin Patel apologized to Edison's Muslim community for sharing "controversial and hurtful" Facebook posts back in 2016.
....
"Back then, I used to stir up occasional debates on controversial topics. But my friends and mentors in the Muslim, Jewish, Sikh, Hindu, and other communities have over the years shown me more constructive ways to engage in dialogues, and I thank them for it," Patel said.

"I have learned that the Quran, much like my own holy books, preaches forgiveness. And I humbly ask for your forgiveness."
...
I would not blame Mohin Patel as having "no balls to fight". He at least had the motivation to forego a much more lucrative career in Wall Street, Lawyering, Tech, Medicine etc (as most Hindus select) and instead attempted a career in local politics. This is a field in which Hindus very much need more representation, and which the Islamists have already wormed their way into at every level. So hats off to him.

Once Mohin has taken the first step and won an election for Board of Education, what is he supposed to do? Everyone else in the Board is either a Leftist, an Islamist, an Evangelical, or a Khalistani. The people who vote in NJ local elections for things like County Commissioner or BOE Member are hardcore Democrats who are politically engaged and very much on the Woke side of the spectrum.

So of course if CAIR types come after Mohin and he wants to continue his political career, the only thing to do is make conciliatory noises and play Taqqiya for the time being. "Fighting" will end his career... to what purpose?

If you look at all the Islamists who have made their way into Town Councils and Education Boards across the United States, they did not succeed by shouting "AoA" or "America Murdabad" in public rallies-- even as America was dropping bombs on their home countries in many instances. They did it by exhibiting Taqqiya, so why shouldn't we?

99.9% of Hindu Americans do not want to risk their own (or their kids') opportunities to make tons of money and have a good life in the US of A, but when somebody actually sacrifices those things for electoral politics, the same Hindu Americans come up with all kinds of "purity tests" to see if he is uncompromisingly Dharmic-- any outward sign of "dhimmitude" means he is "deracinated" and should be torn down. This is what happened to Sri Kulkarni in Texas. Let's not repeat the mistake with Mohin Patel and others.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by darshan »

I'm aware of NJ situation and my target wasn't Patel as much as Hindus in NJ. Hindus in NJ don't have balls to come out and support him.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by venkat_kv »

darshan wrote:I'm aware of NJ situation and my target wasn't Patel as much as Hindus in NJ. Hindus in NJ don't have balls to come out and support him.
why will the hindus explicitly come out and fight in this instance, there is not much to gain and a whole lot of fighting for a facebook post. This fighting/taking a stand can be done when battle lines are drawn and you have something important to fight for.
People will not endanger their career over fighting for some council mans facebook post that doesn't do anthing for their daily work. Let Hindus get organised in the first place before we can accuse them of anything else here .
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by darshan »

venkat_kv wrote:
darshan wrote:I'm aware of NJ situation and my target wasn't Patel as much as Hindus in NJ. Hindus in NJ don't have balls to come out and support him.
why will the hindus explicitly come out and fight in this instance, there is not much to gain and a whole lot of fighting for a facebook post. This fighting/taking a stand can be done when battle lines are drawn and you have something important to fight for.
People will not endanger their career over fighting for some council mans facebook post that doesn't do anthing for their daily work. Let Hindus get organised in the first place before we can accuse them of anything else here .
I'm scratching my head with your response but you can continue with the thought process. There are lot of Hindus that have no tie in with careers. They run small businesses. Do you seriously think that the majority of people who came and voted for this dude are career people? I practically never expect anything from career people. Certainly not to take them with to fight. Career people can't even figure out how to keep control of HoA and keep it Hindu in NJ area in 99% Hindu community.

And I'm a career person and have no qualms about going after anything islamic or pakistani even when my employers are selling to islamic countries.

Support is support. When you start thinking about it's not worth it for a Facebook post then that poor chap may as well regret his decision to join Education board. I suppose that you have probably never opened up textbooks in NJ to see what they teach to Hindu kids.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by venkat_kv »

darshan wrote:
venkat_kv wrote: why will the hindus explicitly come out and fight in this instance, there is not much to gain and a whole lot of fighting for a facebook post. This fighting/taking a stand can be done when battle lines are drawn and you have something important to fight for.
People will not endanger their career over fighting for some council mans facebook post that doesn't do anthing for their daily work. Let Hindus get organised in the first place before we can accuse them of anything else here .
I'm scratching my head with your response but you can continue with the thought process. There are lot of Hindus that have no tie in with careers. They run small businesses. Do you seriously think that the majority of people who came and voted for this dude are career people? I practically never expect anything from career people. Certainly not to take them with to fight. Career people can't even figure out how to keep control of HoA and keep it Hindu in NJ area in 99% Hindu community.

And I'm a career person and have no qualms about going after anything islamic or pakistani even when my employers are selling to islamic countries.

Support is support. When you start thinking about it's not worth it for a Facebook post then that poor chap may as well regret his decision to join Education board. I suppose that you have probably never opened up textbooks in NJ to see what they teach to Hindu kids.
Actually darshan saar, you are off on a tangent to my post. So i will clarify. Career people just doesn't refer to office going/itivity types. it includes people running their own business also and in general essentially making money. People are more interested in making their own life better than going out of their way to fight this by organizing.
my guess is it generally doesn't affect individuals "on a daily basis" as most of the educated are dhimmified/woke or secular thought process and small business doesn't want to rock the boat, so as to speak, in the communityI if there is existential crisis then you can expect people to fight, otherwise there will be inertia. Once people get organized it might be easy to mobilize them for causes.
Right now folks don't seem to have the thought process that we need to organize for our self interests/ long term growth based on Rudradev Saars posts as well. You could say that India was the same in late 90's with everyone seeing Hindutva as something that shouldn't be associated with. It took 10 years of scam ridden infested UPA 1/2 and blasts in many cities to atleast think about voting for a common cause.
such a scenario, to come together for a cause hasn't materialized for Hindus in NJ is my guess. Once it does, it will be easy to start. People need to be educated constantly about this so that when time comes, it gathers the required critical mass.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by chetak »

Read the article in full if you can.


American civil rights leader Rev. Jesse Jackson says Britain is the 'mother of racism' and must face up to its role in slavery as he rejects findings of race report which said nation was 'model to the world' on diversity

Influential civil rights leader told Times Radio there is 'pattern of racism' in UK

He rejected the findings of the recent UK report into race and ethnic disparities

Rev Jackson said Britain had a 'responsbility to face up to racism and change it'

Comments come after report by the Commission on Race and Ethnic Disparities

Their report found there was no evidence of instiutionalised racism in Britain

But the report has been criticised by high-profile campaigners and politicians




Civil rights leader the Reverend Jesse Jackson has today weighed into the UK's debate on race, by saying that Britain is the 'mother of racism'.

The influential American, 79, said Britain must face up to its role in slavery, as he flatly rejected the findings of the recent report into race and racism in the UK.

It comes after the Commission on Race and Ethnic Disparities, chaired by Tony Sewell, said it could find no conclusive evidence of institutionalised racism in Britain.

In its report, the commission also declared that the UK was a model to the world of a successful multi-ethnic society - while accepting that 'overt' prejudice still exists.

However, Rev Jackson, who worked closely with civil rights leader Martin Luther King Jr, said there was a 'pattern of racism' in the UK.

Speaking to Times Radio, he said: 'Britain has a certain responsibility to face up to racism and change it.

Civil rights leader the Reverend Jesse Jackson (pictured today speaking to Times Radio) has today weighed into the UK's debate on race, by saying that Britain is the 'mother of racism'

Civil rights leader the Reverend Jesse Jackson (pictured today speaking to Times Radio) has today weighed into the UK's debate on race, by saying that Britain is the 'mother of racism'

For more than 200 hundred years Britain was at the very centre of the transatlantic slave trade (pictured: A drawing showing a slave trader holding a cane as slaves are forced to work) It is believed that English sea captain Sir John Hawkins led the first slaving expedition around 1562 under the commission of Queen Elizabeth I

For more than 200 hundred years Britain was at the very centre of the transatlantic slave trade (pictured: A drawing showing a slave trader holding a cane as slaves are forced to work) It is believed that English sea captain Sir John Hawkins led the first slaving expedition around 1562 under the commission of Queen Elizabeth I

'I've traveled across Britain and clearly there's a pattern of racism.'

He also claimed 'blacks cannot... be part of the Crown' when asked if he thought the Royal Family was racist - in the wake of Meghan Markle's bombshell claims made in her interview with Oprah Winfrey.

The Duchess of Sussex claimed an unnamed member of the royal family had asked what colour skin Archie would be when she was pregnant with Prince Harry's first child.

Reverand Jackson refused to say if he thought the royal family were racist, but instead said the marriage between Harry and Meghan showed 'change is in the air'.

He added: 'In a democracy, everybody has the chance to be everything.

'(There is) no superior race and no inferior race. All of us have royal blood. We're all God's children. Everybody matters.'

Rev Jackson is one of the most influential civil rights campaigners of his generation and was once close with Martin Luther King Jr.

The baptist minister was by the side of the civil rights campaigner when he was assassinated in 1968.

Alongside his civil rights work, Rev Jackson has also been involved in the creation of charities and twice ran to become the presidential candidate for the Democrats in the 1980s.

His criticism comes amid a strong debate over the findings of the report, which were published last week.

The Commission on Race and Ethnic Disparities, set up by Boris Johnson in the wake of the Black Lives Matter protests, concluded that although Britain is not yet a 'post-racial society', its success should be a model for white-majority countries.

Chairman Dr Sewell said the UK had progressed into a 'successful multi-ethnic and multicultural community' which was a 'beacon to the rest of Europe and the world'.

He warned ministers must also consider the needs of the white working class, saying his report had uncovered how 'stuck' some groups were.

Dr Sewell later insisted he was not denying the existence of racism - but railed against people deploying the charge of institutional racism 'willy-nilly'.

But the report has faced a chorus of criticism from campaigners and politicians, including Baroness Doreen Lawrence.

Baroness Lawrence, whose son Stephen was murdered in 1993 in a racially motivated attack in south-east London, said the authors of the report are 'not in touch with reality'.

Speaking at a public event organised by De Montfort University Leicester's Stephen Lawrence Research Centre on Wednesday, she said: 'When I first heard about the report my first thought was it has pushed [the fight against] racism back 20 years or more.

'I think if you were to speak to somebody whose employer speaks to them in a certain way, where do you go with that now?

'If a person is up for promotion and has been denied that, where does he go with that now?

'You know, all these things we've been working for and showing that structural racism exists - we talk about the pandemic when you look at how many of our people have died, all the nurses, the doctors, the frontline staff, of Covid, and to have this report denying that those people have suffered... they are denying that the likes of my son was murdered through racism and the fact that it took 18 years to get justice for him. The report is denying all those issues.

'Those people who marched for Black Lives Matter? It's denying all of that. The George Floyd stuff? It's denied all of that.

'So those who sit behind this report (saying) that racism doesn't exist or it no longer exists need to speak to the young boys who are stopped and searched constantly on the street. They need to speak to those young people.'

Baroness Lawrence continued: 'They (the report authors) are not in touch with reality basically.

'That's what it boils down to. When you are privileged you do not have those experiences.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by Yagnasri »

Racism may be there in the US. But I refuse to believe it is there to the extent that it is being claimed by the BLM people, SJWs and PC BS gangs. Critical Race theory rubbish is going wild all over the place, which will end the US economy and systems in the long run.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by chetak »

Yagnasri wrote:Racism may be there in the US. But I refuse to believe it is there to the extent that it is being claimed by the BLM people, SJWs and PC BS gangs. Critical Race theory rubbish is going wild all over the place, which will end the US economy and systems in the long run.
BLM is doing in the US what shaheenbagh tried to do in India.

In India there has been a blowback which is possibly playing out in the 5 state elections. We need to wait and see.

It has worked better in the US because of the hyped up white guilt factor which has very cleverly been leveraged by the manipulating wokes who have found supporters even among the elected representatives.

That guilt factor is very largely absent in India except among the few really brainwashed wokes.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by darshan »

There's certainly racism there but it's at sophisticated levels. Something that these groups with vested interest won't talk about or bring up. They are mostly feeding on symptoms of this sophisticated racism that generates poverty. Votebanks culture is what's killing colored people. They either need to start their own political parties or be 50/50 on supporting either party irrespective of whom they believe is overt racist as both sides are full of whites that control all institutions that matter.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by Pratyush »

The George Floyd death trial result will be an interesting event for race relations in United States.

From what I have been able to follow from India, it would appear that the officer in question. On the basis of evidence and prosecution witness statements might not be convicted for murder.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by Skanda »

Pratyush wrote:The George Floyd death trial result will be an interesting event for race relations in United States.

From what I have been able to follow from India, it would appear that the officer in question. On the basis of evidence and prosecution witness statements might not be convicted for murder.
The media narrative is that the Prosecution is winning. Every little comment is being dissected to show victory around the corner. Once the verdict comes out, I won’t be surprised if there are race riots redux. No matter what the outcome at this stage, this trial will further divide the country and ensure that folks on either side of the divide remain more entrenched.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by Yagnasri »

The video evidence is given into media in a highly edited way to support the woke narration. Postmortem report IIRC do not indicate killing by police and in fact from what I read it is drug related (over dose??). Plus police manual or process in police training or something also recommends similar action by police. So very difficult to assume conviction automatically. Even if it is done by jury, there will be appeals and one can be sure that process will be seriously questioned there. But MSM already passed judgement. Will continue the shaming of all whites and police.

If there is no conviction then there will be massive riots and further fracturing of the society.
chetak
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by chetak »

This is the first clear hint that big tech may be getting too big for their boots and need to be cut down to size.

deregulation and downsizing by the breakup of monopolies by big tech companies like twitter and facebook just like it hit and devastated companies like Ma Bell and Edison

a nut case bible thumping commie like jack on crack has no bleddy business to tell people how to vote or even how to run their lives.



USA: In a boost for free speech, Supreme Court Justice suggests Big Tech may not have the right to regulate content on their platforms




USA: In a boost for free speech, Supreme Court Justice suggests Big Tech may not have the right to regulate content on their platforms


USA: In a boost for free speech, Supreme Court Justice suggests Big Tech may not have the right to regulate content on their platforms

Legal journalists believe that this order from Justice Thomas invites the U.S. Congress to ban social media companies from regulating or censoring their own content, and instead be transformed into "common carriers" or "places of public accommodation", as illustrated by Justice Thomas.

6 April, 2021
OpIndia Staff

USA: in a boost for Free Speech, Supreme Court Justice suggests Big Tech may not have the right to regulate content on their platforms

The United States Supreme Court Associate Justice Clarence Thomas in a non-binding order on April 5th, wrote regarding the problem of Big Tech platforms censoring opinions, most famously censoring the then President of the United States Donald Trump himself.

In his order today, Thomas wrote, “If part of the problem is private, concentrated control over online content and platforms available to the public, then part of the solution may be found in doctrines that limit the right of a private company to exclude. Historically, at least two legal doctrines limited a company’s right to exclude.”

Justice Thomas then drew a parallel between Big Tech social media platforms and certain businesses called “common carriers”, writing, “First, our legal system and its British predecessor have long subjected certain businesses, known as common carriers, to special regulations, including a general requirement to serve all comers.”

Justice Thomas also clarified that the Supreme Court believes regulations akin to those placed on “common carriers”, even for companies not historically considered so, maybe justified when, “a business, by circumstances and its nature, . . . rise[s] from private to be of public concern.”

According to Justice Thomas, there is a “clear historical precedent for regulating transportation and communications networks in a similar manner as traditional common carriers.” In the case of Telegraphs, they “resemble[d] railroad companies and other common carriers,” and were “bound to serve all customers alike, without discrimination,” writes Justice Thomas

Justice Thomas further wrote, “Even if digital platforms are not close enough to common carriers, legislatures might still be able to treat digital platforms like places of public accommodation.”

“Once again, a doctrine, such as public accommodation, that reduces the power of a platform to unilaterally remove a government account might strengthen the argument that an account is truly government-controlled and creates a public forum.”, Justice Thomas adds.

Legal journalists believe that this order from Justice Thomas invites the U.S. Congress to ban social media companies from regulating or censoring their own content, and instead be transformed into “common carriers” or “places of public accommodation”, as illustrated by Justice Thomas.

This opinion by Justice Thomas is also seen as an endorsement of the conservative view on Free Speech and the 1st Amendment, that these social media companies violate the spirit of Free Speech and the 1st Amendment through their content regulation, which can often devolve into outright censorship. Recently, Twitter CEO Jack Dorsey admitted that censoring the New York Post’s story regarding Hunter Biden by not letting it spread through Twitter and blocking all links to it, was a “mistake”.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by Rudradev »

Yagnasri wrote:Racism may be there in the US. But I refuse to believe it is there to the extent that it is being claimed by the BLM people, SJWs and PC BS gangs. Critical Race theory rubbish is going wild all over the place, which will end the US economy and systems in the long run.
Racism in the US is actually worse than what is claimed by BLM, SJWs etc. But it manifests itself in different ways from what they claim. Their critique of it is very selective and intended to serve a certain agenda.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by Mort Walker »

For everyone here - don't get caught up in George Floyd, Atlanta All Star Game, BLM, etc. This is all opiate for the masses. With all of the stimulus money out there, Wall Street is making a killing. The "infrastructure" bill getting passed with $2.3T, with only a fraction toward actual infrastructure, is more money to be made by the banksters and party bigwigs on both sides. A few select handful are going to make money for the next couple of years. When all the increased stimulus money runs out, then once again the public will be holding the bag, where the profits are privatized and the losses are public.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by Yagnasri »

Ya. As Billy boy said "it is economy stupid" we all can say it is money making stupid.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by Paul »

In an unusual move, the United States has announced that it conducted patrols in the Indian Exclusive Economic Zone (EEZ) this week, without seeking any prior consent, to assert its `navigational right and freedoms’.

While such patrols are common in the South China Sea where the US Navy consistently challenges China’s claims on maritime boundaries, the public announcement of similar patrols in Indian waters has come as a surprise.
Read more at:
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... aign=cppst

What signal are they sending here?
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Post by Paul »

@TheWolfpackIN
· 3h
The main opposition party of Seychelles (United Seychelles), says it will continue to oppose India's planned military base in Assomption island in the archipelago.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by Pratyush »

Paul wrote:

Snip....

While such patrols are common in the South China Sea where the US Navy consistently challenges China’s claims on maritime boundaries, the public announcement of similar patrols in Indian waters has come as a surprise.
Read more at:
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... aign=cppst

What signal are they sending here?
1) Monkey balancing. If we are being simpletons.

2) India has never told any one that innocent passage through our EEZ is prohibited.

So this action by United States Navy and it's announcement can only be an effort to provide moral and diplomatic support to the Indian opposition. Because it's only a matter of time before the matter gets politicised.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by Jay »

Mort Walker wrote: The "infrastructure" bill getting passed with $2.3T, with only a fraction toward actual infrastructure,are public.
For now, I'm gonna focus on this. How so?

Below numbers are from your favorite "faux news"

https://www.foxbusiness.com/economy/bid ... hats-in-it
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by Mort Walker »

^^^I suggest you use another source. Only $621 billion is for actual infrastructure. The rest are corporate give aways. There is money to be made in the next couple of years.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by Mort Walker »

Paul wrote:
In an unusual move, the United States has announced that it conducted patrols in the Indian Exclusive Economic Zone (EEZ) this week, without seeking any prior consent, to assert its `navigational right and freedoms’.

While such patrols are common in the South China Sea where the US Navy consistently challenges China’s claims on maritime boundaries, the public announcement of similar patrols in Indian waters has come as a surprise.
Read more at:
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... aign=cppst

What signal are they sending here?
The Xiden administration is trying to create a political issue through media. Perhaps change the political media narrative as 5 Indian states are going through elections.

The USN and IN have a communications protocol established through treaty. It seems odd they wouldn’t be communicating while going through. The reason each side informs the other is to avoid accidents with commercial shipping.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by vera_k »

Mort Walker wrote:Only $621 billion is for actual infrastructure.
Indeed. What's more puzzling is that this amount is proposed to be distributed to many projects just to cover a small fraction of existing cost overruns. It's looking unlikely that any new infrastructure gets built.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by Mort Walker »

There was a nice graphic in the print edition of WSJ last week that had the “Infrastructure” bill breakdown. Secretary of Transportation Alfred E. Neumann seems to indicate that elder care is part of infrastructure, which may be leading to confusion for some of the enlightened on this forum.
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by kit »

https://www.thequint.com/news/india/don ... lakshadwep



Earlier on Friday, the US had announced Freedom of Navigation Operation in Indian waters off Lakshadweep Islands. The US Navy said that it carried out a Freedom of Navigation Operation inside India's Exclusive Economic Zone without prior consent, in accordance with international laws.



Conveyed Concerns: India as US Navy Sends Warship Near Lakshadweep
India said no country can carry out military exercises in its Exclusive Economic Zone (EEZ) without permission.
Earlier on Friday, the US had announced Freedom of Navigation Operation in Indian waters off Lakshadweep Islands. The US Navy said that it carried out a Freedom of Navigation Operation inside India's Exclusive Economic Zone without prior consent, in accordance with international laws.
RKumar

Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by RKumar »

^ I don't know what USA DoD is trying to prove with its latest actions. We have an elephant's memory, it is your habit to give a knock to your allies. It is not the first and it will not be the last. Maybe the Pundits of USA Govt, don't know how to approach India - intimidate with power, request for support or run like a headless chicken? Irrespective of the cause, USA has a problem - there are different powers pulling strings in different directions.

Lets wait - for the next move, it will take some time to clear the air. No point of shooting in the dark. USA's such stupid actions remind us, keep guards up, powder dry and don't trust anyone.
m_saini
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by m_saini »

Global Trends 2040: A More Contested World

Pg 75
In India, social media and mobile messaging platforms have become a key force behind viral falsehoods, such as rumors that quickly spread among some Hindus regarding Muslims’ alleged slaughter of cows or posses-sion of beef, which led to the “cow vigilante” lynching of Muslims.
Pg 76
Some government regimes seek to use religious and ethnic themes in other countries to mobilize foreign popular support for their foreign policy objec-tives. India’s attempts to export Hindu nationalism, Turkey’s effort to mobi-lize the Turkish diaspora in Europe to amplify Turkey’s influence, and Russia’s support of Russian Orthodox minori-ties outside Russia demonstrate ways in which leaders exploit identities to achieve foreign policy goals.
No mention of muslim genocide by our north-northeast neighbours, the chinni "Confucius" institutues or the jebus soul-harvesters. Who needs enemies when you have "friends" like US :mrgreen:
chetak
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by chetak »

Mort Walker wrote:There was a nice graphic in the print edition of WSJ last week that had the “Infrastructure” bill breakdown. Secretary of Transportation Alfred E. Neumann seems to indicate that elder care is part of infrastructure, which may be leading to confusion for some of the enlightened on this forum.
Alfred E. Neumann........really

must have seriously enlightened parents to have been so creative
Manish_Sharma
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by Manish_Sharma »

USA sees itself as Anglo club member, hence never does FONOPs against Anglo nations like Australia Canada new Zealand....

https://twitter.com/resplinodell/status ... 32996?s=19

TWITTER Thread

Rachel Esplin Odell
@resplinodell

The US dismisses India's objections to US Freedom of Navigation operations against India's maritime claims by saying the US does FONOPs against 'excessive' maritime claims of nations round the world, friend & foe.

This is both misleading & revealing. 1/17

First, though the US does conduct FONOPs against not only rivals but also allies & partners, it still picks & chooses. Most notably, the US has never conducted formal Freedom of Navigation operations against Australia or Canada, despite objecting to their 'excessive' claims. 2/17

E.g. Australia's historic bay claims in Anxious Bay, Encounter Bay, Lacepede Bay, & Rivoli Bay and its straight baselines around the Abrolhos Islands.

(On the former, see https://t.co/eCeePHoy3A; and on the latter, see https://t.co/vfiZTCblfk) 3/17

Or e.g. Canada's straight baselines around the Arctic Archipelago & treatment of the waters therein (aka the Northwest Passage) as internal waters. https://t.co/3YDI0BKqTq

The US & Canada have instead struck private deals to manage this dispute.
https://t.co/DLezZ3ZkZd 4/17

Though not against Australia & Canada, the US has indeed conducted FONOPs against most other countries in the Indian & Pacific oceans that make what the US govt deems to be 'excessive' maritime claims -- (see Appendix 2 in this paper I wrote: https://t.co/AU4PHW7NPq) 5/17

a group that includes virtually all littoral Asian countries, including Japan, South Korea, North Korea, China, Taiwan, the Philippines, Vietnam, Cambodia, Malaysia, Indonesia, Thailand, Myanmar, India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, and Sri Lanka. 6/17

Using unilateral military operations to accuse Asian countries of violating the law of the sea (when the US has not even ratified the most relevant convention, the UN Convention on the Law of the Sea) is probably not the best way to win friends & influence people in Asia. 7/17

(Especially when there appears to be a double standard when it comes to the US pursuing diplomacy instead of military FONOPs against the 'excessive' claims of white-European-descended/'Western' governments in Canberra and Ottawa.) 8/17

I would submit that instead of using military operations to try to impose our version of the so-called 'liberal rules-based international order' on a world of (mostly formerly colonized nations), the US should adopt a less militarized approach toward freedom of navigation. 9/17

The US should discontinue operational assertions & rely instead on the diplomacy & training tracks of the Freedom of Navigation Program to protect its rights to freedom of navigation. (For more info on the different tracks of the FON Program, see my SSRN paper linked above) 10/17

Indeed, the very fact the US deems as "excessive" the maritime claims of such a broad swath of states in Asia suggests that perhaps we would do well to adopt a more compromise-oriented approach that does not deliberately disregard the security concerns of littoral states, 11/17

especially non-Western formerly colonized nations, who have legitimate reason to fear foreign naval power given the history of its use in their subjugation. 12/17

The maritime security concerns of nations in South Asia, Southeast Asia, & Northeast Asia that lead them to restrict foreign military navigation are not going away, especially as China's navy emulates the US Navy in operating more frequently in other countries' waters. 13/17

The US should instead work together with Asian nations to identify balanced compromises that can help them to feel more secure, while enabling the major maritime powers like the US & China to navigate their navies in ways that adequately protect their overseas interests. 14/17

The good news is Track II efforts by the EEZ Group 21, convened by the OPRI @SPF_PR with experts from several countries—Japan, the US, China, South Korea, Indonesia, the Philippines, Vietnam, Australia, India & Russia—have already crafted an initial set of guidelines. 15/17

As I wrote in a recent report published by @CarterCenter, the US should use these guidelines as the basis for negotiating an inclusive agreement with Asian states to clarify key contentious issues related to foreign military activities in the EEZ. https://t.co/zDXh285tIi 16/17

Rather than acting entitled to conduct military operations wherever we want regardless of other countries' laws & security concerns, the US should instead treat other countries as partners in crafting shared solutions to promote mutual security. 17/17
nvishal
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by nvishal »

The US has already revealed in the past that it won't let India impose a blockade in the Indian ocean, in case of a major indo-china war.

The blockade is a tool that prevents China from engaging in major mischief with india. The American policy makers see it an hindrance that prevents an india-china war.
darshan
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by darshan »

Not having infrastructure, local MIC, strategies, etc. are hindrances to prevent any war. The rest is all maya.
kit
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by kit »

nvishal wrote:
The US has already revealed in the past that it won't let India impose a blockade in the Indian ocean, in case of a major indo-china war.

The blockade is a tool that prevents China from engaging in major mischief with india. The American policy makers see it an hindrance that prevents an india-china war.
This needs to be understood properly and i mean in no way can their words taken towards an agreement regarding blockade of the straits in event of an IndoChina war which India would need to do.

I think America is signalling it would do whatever is in "their interests" which increasingly looks like is "NOT in Indias interests"

QUAD might well be a toothless namesake for an occasional "war of words" wrt to China.

America and China looks to carve the world into their spheres of influence
chetak
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by chetak »

m_saini wrote:Global Trends 2040: A More Contested World

Pg 75
In India, social media and mobile messaging platforms have become a key force behind viral falsehoods, such as rumors that quickly spread among some Hindus regarding Muslims’ alleged slaughter of cows or posses-sion of beef, which led to the “cow vigilante” lynching of Muslims.
Pg 76
Some government regimes seek to use religious and ethnic themes in other countries to mobilize foreign popular support for their foreign policy objec-tives. India’s attempts to export Hindu nationalism, Turkey’s effort to mobi-lize the Turkish diaspora in Europe to amplify Turkey’s influence, and Russia’s support of Russian Orthodox minori-ties outside Russia demonstrate ways in which leaders exploit identities to achieve foreign policy goals.
No mention of muslim genocide by our north-northeast neighbours, the chinni "Confucius" institutues or the jebus soul-harvesters. Who needs enemies when you have "friends" like US :mrgreen:
IIRC, we too have some cheeni "Confucius" institutues in India.

time to boot these छक्काs out, if not already done.


The Confucius Institutes in India are at:

University of Mumbai;

Vellore Institute of Technology;

Lovely Professional University,

Jalandhar; OP Jindal Global University,

Sonepat; School of Chinese Language, Kolkata;

Bharathiar University, Coimbatore; and

KR Mangalam University, Gurugram.
darshan
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by darshan »

Onus isn't on US to act in India's interests. US should and would do what's in US interests.

India isn't doing what's necessary in India's interests. That's not US's problem.

As Suraj said, strength respects strength. US just reminded India of the same thing overtly. It has nothing to do with chinese. India still has not shown any seriousness about chinese so why extrapolate to next orbit and go towards xyz scenarios? someone just posted the long list of confucius institutes. chinese phones and apps are still in Indian market. Nepal link is still open. Lot of trade is still on. There's hardly any big news about next steps being taken to get china out of India.

And then there's a chronic problem of not having MIC and infrastructure to fight wars.

If India is so oftended then it would have gone all in with developing local MIC to send the response back. Tejas flies on American engine and Apaches and Reapers and whatnot.

Cry about depending on American weapons if you have to instead of FONOPs. Get real. You can't keep chinese out of Indian waters and crying about Americans. Come tomorrow let's say Malaysia did that or Sri Lanka did that. Does India have resolve to send a punitive message at that very instant? Or will India resort to dossiers and soft measures instead of destroying the ship?

As expected Americans reverted back to china. However even if they hadn't, it's irrelevant to why India is not cleaning it's own house. There are many baby steps to take before getting worked up about actions of big guys. One can also say that India has reverted back to China with trade being allowed to settle down. You can't fire arrows that you don't have.
Rony
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by Rony »

https://twitter.com/JulianCastro/status ... 87715?s=20 - Army Lt. Nazario was driving his new car home. He was pulled over, pepper sprayed, and arrested without explanation. This is racism. It’s about the domination and humiliation of a Black man because he asked questions and “didn’t comply.”

https://twitter.com/hukum2082/status/13 ... 65604?s=20 - To the 2.7 million Indian Americans who are content being second grade citizens in the US and preach about growing intolerance in their country back home. Have a nice sunday !
g.sarkar
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by g.sarkar »

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/202 ... affic-stop
Protests near Minneapolis after fatal police shooting at traffic stop
Oliver Laughland in Minneapolis, Mon 12 Apr 2021

Twenty-year-old Minnesota man Daunte Wright was shot by police in state already on edge over Chauvin trial
Police in the Minneapolis area shot and killed a man in the city of Brooklyn Center on Sunday afternoon, sparking clashes between hundreds of protesters and police officers in an area already on edge during the murder trial of former officer Derek Chauvin.
Family members at the scene of the shooting identified the victim as 20-year-old Daunte Wright, who is Black. According to Brooklyn Center police, the incident occurred shortly before 2pm when an officer pulled over a vehicle due to an alleged traffic violation. Police stated that the driver re-entered the vehicle as officers attempted to take him into custody and one officer opened fire. “The vehicle traveled several blocks before striking another vehicle,” a statement said. A female passenger sustained non-life threatening injuries during the crash, and a police officer was also reportedly taken to hospital.
Daunte Wright’s mother, Katie Wright, told reporters on Sunday afternoon she had been on the phone with her son as the encounter with police occurred. According to her account, reported by local TV news, her son had called her as he was being pulled over to get car insurance for the vehicle, which she had recently given him. She said she heard officers instruct her son to get out of the car and then “scuffling” shortly before the phone hung up. “A minute later, I called and his girlfriend answered, who was the passenger in the car, and said that he’d been shot and she put it on the driver’s side, and my son was laying there lifeless,” she said.
......
Gautam
Paul
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Re: Understanding the US - Again

Post by Paul »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfHJvcjReFI

Dine and Dashing.....I thought this only happened in IIIrd world countries.
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