Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 02 Jan 2019 05:04

https://www.opindia.com/2019/01/triple- ... interview/

“Secondly, India believes everyone should get equal rights. Some temples in India have their own customs and traditions. Some temples have banned the entry of men and men do not visit them. In this, Sabarimala, a woman judge in the Supreme Court has made certain observations. It needs to be read minutely. There is no need to attribute those to any political party. As a woman, she has made some suggestions. There should be a debate on that as well sometimes,” PM Modi said.

pretty strong statement. virtually rebelling against SC decision.

mappunni · Post by **mappunni** » 02 Jan 2019 08:31

In Pattambi, Palakkad, the Women Wall fell before it was constructed. The embarrassed organizers seeing only a handful of women asked to wind off the program before people could notice the goof up.

https://twitter.com/jothishnair1010/sta ... 3088659456

Dileep · Post by **Dileep** » 02 Jan 2019 09:36

Breaking News: Gold and Zero claims that they did darshan early this morning. I had suspected this long, since both went 'absconding' after their previous try, and claimed that they are hiding in protection of bolis.

Now waiting for Thantri's decision.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 02 Jan 2019 09:53

Now they will be celebrated like Edmund and Tenzing. Wonder if Gold Hill-ery actually climbed the hill or was carried up there like Edmund bin Hill-ery was carried by Tenzing.

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 02 Jan 2019 10:46

2 women have darshan at Sabarimala under police protection.

. Now it is upto the chief priest to decide the next steps. His credibility is also now at stake. The police had given earlier hints (to the two women & media) that another attempt can be made when the temple reopens. So looks like this was a well coordinated move. I was also surpised to find the temple having only pilgrims who just allowed the women to walk in. Is it that the pilgrims assumed them to be VIP women of older age group whom the police was helping? Such things are common in many temples in India. Surprising was the lack of presence of media channels (including Janam TV, which has been focusing only on this issue).

Purification ritual will be held, says Pandalam palace spokesperson.
If GoKL has its way then such rituals can be done every hour

.

Mean while now it is 'day break time' for Shri Modi

.
Sabarimala issue is about tradition, says Modi.
Sabari mala issue has now moved to the next stage, and Triple Talaq bill may not cross Rajya Sabha. So yes, can do more talking but that is all what he can do.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Jan 2019 10:54

Is this the job of a CM, to dismiss and disregard the rights of lakhs upon lakhs of devotees??

And yet, there will be countless dhimmi Hindus who are out there supporting this man, Hindus in name only, Hindus who are all bereft of brains but chockful of secularitis.

CM Vijayan confirms that two women in early 40s entered Sabarimala temple

CM Vijayan confirms that two women in early 40s entered Sabarimala temple

Kanaga Durga from Malappuram and Bindhu from Kozhikode started their climb around midnight and claim to have reached the temple after 3:45 am.

THIRUVANANTHAPURAM: Two women in early 40s, Bindhu and Kanaga Durgha, have visited the Sabarimala Ayyappa temple and got the darshan of the lord on January 2.

Chief minister Pinarayi Vijayan has confirmed that the women had indeed visited Sabarimala. "It's a fact that women had entered the temple. We have earlier said that police would provide adequate security to anyone who wants to offer darshan at the temple," Vijayan said.

Bindu of Koyilandi and Kanakadurga of Malappuram offered darshan on Wednesday early morning. Both of them had earlier attempted to go to Sabarimala but had to go back after facing heavy protests.

Speaking to the media, Bindu said she went to Sabarimala at around 3.30 am along with Kanakadurga. It is said that the duo offered darshan under police security.

"If women have offered darshan and thus violated the ritualistic practices, necessary measures would be taken by the thanthri," Sasikumara Varma of the Pandalam Royal family, told the media.

The duo's claims of having darshan at the shrine comes a day after Kerala women raised a formidable 'Women's Wall' or Vanitha Mathil, covering the entire length of the state, proclaiming their support to the state government’s resolve to implement the Supreme Court’s verdict allowing women of all ages access to Sabarimala.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Jan 2019 11:35

Visuals of two women (Bindu and Kanaga Durga) at Sabarimala shrine earlier this morning

https://twitter.com/arvindgunasekar/sta ... 0416789504

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 02 Jan 2019 11:52

Sabarimala nada reopened after purification rituals.
The rituals took around 1 hour to complete. But I guess this incident would have more deeper ramifications when the appeals get heard in Supreme Court. The women activists and communists can say that there is no big problem in women of all ages entering the the shrine. All it matters is one hour of extra work (to do the purification ritual). Hon.SC may ask the temple authorities to reschedule the whole Pooja timings.

To be frank, I guess this is all a well conceived plan with perhaps all political parties (including BJP) working in unison. The central govt. is still in baashan mode, and would most likely would not intervene. The state government would inform Supreme Court that they have already allowed women inside, and continue to do so further.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Jan 2019 11:55

Sachin wrote:Sabarimala nada reopened after purification rituals.
The rituals took around 1 hour to complete. But I guess this incident would have more deeper ramifications when the appeals get heard in Supreme Court. The women activists and communists can say that there is no big problem in women of all ages entering the the shrine. All it matters is one hour of extra work (to do the purification ritual). Hon.SC may ask the temple authorities to reschedule the whole Pooja timings.

To be frank, I guess this is all a well conceived plan with perhaps all political parties (including BJP) working in unison. The central govt. is still in baashan mode, and would most likely would not intervene. The state government would inform Supreme Court that they have already allowed women inside, and continue to do so further.

and our dhimmies will continue to vote commie as before.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Jan 2019 12:24

Wearing Red Churidar Bindhu and the Blue one Ganagadurga. Bindhu is an advocate and both are members of CPM in #Kerala. A special permission issued by devasom board with a strong influence to police to provide full support till they come out , they entered through north entrance

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 02 Jan 2019 12:29

Give credit where credit is due. They have been up there and done the Darshan.

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 02 Jan 2019 13:53

UlanBatori wrote:Give credit where credit is due. They have been up there and done the Darshan.

Agree with that. If their purpose was to "prove a point", then that has been achieved. What is going to happen is that Hindu religious practises & customs would now be determined by Abrahamics. If every one is fine with that as well; then there is no problem.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 02 Jan 2019 13:59

OTOH I think it is now open season on those who would dictate customs to Malloos. Slowly but surely the tide is turning, and the question is being recognized: why eej the SC etc bothering us? How about showing that u have some intention to actually have uniform standards of law? Watching NaMospeak with deep interest. The story would have remained unfinished if the activists simply gave up - they could play victim indefinitely.

Now, as someone asked, what exactly did they get?

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 02 Jan 2019 14:21

UlanBatori wrote:Watching NaMospeak with deep interest.

NaMoSpeak actually got me even more worried. And people like Dileep may feel the same;
1. It has been nearly three months since the verdict came out. NaMo did not even open his mouth for once.
2. There has been systematic attempts made various activists and GoKL over the last 60 days. NaMo or BJP big-wigs did not open their mouths then as well. Some of the ministers from up North actually wanted Supreme Court verdict to be executed.
3. It was yesterday the great man decided to give his expert thoughts on Sabari Mala and the result was immediate. Two women were taken up by GoKL as VIPs

. And most probably the "expert opinion" would just remain that, and his great anti-Triple Talaq bill may NOT become the law as well.

I am now getting a very strong feeling that BJP is planning to use the Sabari Mala issue like how it did with RJB. The NamoSpeak looks like the first shot on that regard. The idea seems to be to keep religious Hindus constantly worried, and eagerly awaiting the carrot (of religious faith being kept sacrosanct) offered by the BJP. And my personal feeling is that BJP may not be able to make much gains using Sabari Mala issue.

chandrasekaran · Post by **chandrasekaran** » 02 Jan 2019 15:08

What else do you want NaMo or for that matter BJP to do ? Dismiss the state govt. ?

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Jan 2019 15:16

Sachin wrote:
UlanBatori wrote:Watching NaMospeak with deep interest.
NaMoSpeak actually got me even more worried. And people like Dileep may feel the same;
1. It has been nearly three months since the verdict came out. NaMo did not even open his mouth for once.
2. There has been systematic attempts made various activists and GoKL over the last 60 days. NaMo or BJP big-wigs did not open their mouths then as well. Some of the ministers from up North actually wanted Supreme Court verdict to be executed.
3. It was yesterday the great man decided to give his expert thoughts on Sabari Mala and the result was immediate. Two women were taken up by GoKL as VIPs . And most probably the "expert opinion" would just remain that, and his great anti-Triple Talaq bill may NOT become the law as well.

I am now getting a very strong feeling that BJP is planning to use the Sabari Mala issue like how it did with RJB. The NamoSpeak looks like the first shot on that regard. The idea seems to be to keep religious Hindus constantly worried, and eagerly awaiting the carrot (of religious faith being kept sacrosanct) offered by the BJP. And my personal feeling is that BJP may not be able to make much gains using Sabari Mala issue.

The gains of Sabarimala may be restricted only to KER where the BJP does not have even marginal support, so the electoral gains, if any, may be minimal to negligible.

RJB has a much bigger payoff. 3T is not a Hindu vs muslim thing, because many islamic countries including pukiland do not allow 3T and the Indian muslims using it is barbarous and self serving. Many islamic countries even do not encourage more than one wife and are going the social route to get this done.

No pm or govt minister will/should speak on the SC judgments. Modi anyway speaks only of what he wants and has steered clear of the press on most issues. The press dislikes him and he loathes them. It is one way to go.

He was asked a direct interview question and he pointed to the opinion of the single and significantly the only female judge on the bench. Her dissenting views were entirely negated both by the press as well as the SC itself.

BJP is not getting any significant votes in KER any time in the short to medium future, so why expend energies needlessly??.

Modi has made his stand on the SC verdict clear and he does not support it.

He has bigger fish to fry rather than getting diverted or sidetracked into political cul de sacs where a political loss is a foregone conclusion.

Let us see what the hizzoners have to say for themselves now.

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 02 Jan 2019 15:16

chandrasekaran wrote:What else do you want NaMo or for that matter BJP to do ? Dismiss the state govt. ?

A clear declaration on what BJP's stance on Sabari Mala issue given much before would have helped. And now what I hear is Udit Raj is the First BJP MP to Back Women's Entry into Sabarimala. So what is BJP's stance on this whole debacle? Udit Raj says some things while Na.Mo opens his mouth only yesterday to say some thing else.

Dismissing a state government is pretty much impossible and I don't think any sane person would demand that. But BJP as a political party needs to have given a clear statement on its stance much much before. They have not done that, and as I see it they are also now into double speak.

habal · Post by **habal** » 02 Jan 2019 15:28

BJP keeping sabarimala on a boil plays into CPI(M) hands. That is what Sachin is hinting at.

Communal polarisation in Kerala results in BJP taking away the marginal voters from congress for a UDF (cong dominated front) victory.

LDF voters in Kerala never change parties, come what may. It was these marginal hindu votes that helped UDF win.

Mostly hindu youth remain back in kerala, the male of both muslim and xtian below 60 yo is mostly out of kerala in gelf, aus, us/can/uk, asean and in bangalore. So counting total eligible vote bank community wise is not always helpful.

Net Result

Long spell of CPI(M) rule in Kerala which is clearly going to push state to higher levels of lawlessness and anarchy

Last month has seen 5 hartals in state on various issues related to sabarimala.

State is going to financially ruined (even more than now) due to these constant conflicts. Since no jobs are going to be generated in CPI(M) rule the youth are going to be more radicalised.

The above may not matter to a BJP supporter or opponent who belongs outside kerala. But for most middle class keralites, either supporters of BJP or UDF this is a very gloomy scenario. BJP at centre may feel this is a good outcome for keralites who keep voting for LDF or UDF, but keralites know well the outcome of this isn't going to be pleasant.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Jan 2019 15:48

Sachin wrote:
chandrasekaran wrote:What else do you want NaMo or for that matter BJP to do ? Dismiss the state govt. ?
A clear declaration on what BJP's stance on Sabari Mala issue given much before would have helped. And now what I hear is Udit Raj is the First BJP MP to Back Women's Entry into Sabarimala. So what is BJP's stance on this whole debacle? Udit Raj says some things while Na.Mo opens his mouth only yesterday to say some thing else.

Dismissing a state government is pretty much impossible and I don't think any sane person would demand that. But BJP as a political party needs to have given a clear statement on its stance much much before. They have not done that, and as I see it they are also now into double speak.

udit raj is a rank opportunist and he has other fish to fry, now that elections are fast approaching.

No one in the BJP gives a toss for this guy or his views, and neither do a whole lot of other people.

he does not speak for the BJP or even the govt.

Any guy from the south joining the BJP immediately wants to be made a cabinet minister with either HOME, DEFENCE or FINANCE minister's post

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 02 Jan 2019 16:17

I have not posted anything on the Sabarimala temple issue. Because I wanted to clear my head and have a clear understanding of the major issues that are being fought over.

I am disturbed over the non acceptance of the rights of the diety in preserving his celibacy. By preventing the visit of a woman of reproductive age and it's sanction by the highest court of the land.

If one is to take it to the logical conclusion, then non acceptance of the rights of the diety can have precedence in the RJB dispute in the highest court of the land as well. With disastrous consequences for Hindus across the land.

Dileep · Post by **Dileep** » 02 Jan 2019 16:50

chandrasekaran wrote:What else do you want NaMo or for that matter BJP to do ? Dismiss the state govt. ?

No. A simple ordinance granting 'rights to privacy' to 'Deities' of temples would have done.

Kashi · Post by **Kashi** » 02 Jan 2019 16:51

habal wrote:Long spell of CPI(M) rule in Kerala which is clearly going to push state to higher levels of lawlessness and anarchy

And the people in the most literate state of India cannot comprehend that? And if they do, they will not seek to change the situation?

habal · Post by **habal** » 02 Jan 2019 17:07

i have two questions and would be greatful if someone answers it without illwill.

1. Did Ayyapan specifically mention somewhere that he does not want reproductive age female devotees or that he does not want female devotees at all or was he speaking specifically about that demoness who was enticing him ?

2. Does the ban on entry of women of certain age have anything to do with quarrel between kingdom of travancore, which was headed by maharani at one point of time and the raja of pandalam who was reluctant to share the prestige and power of owning sabarimala temple with travancore raja.

jpremnath · Post by **jpremnath** » 02 Jan 2019 17:41

Kashi wrote:
habal wrote:Long spell of CPI(M) rule in Kerala which is clearly going to push state to higher levels of lawlessness and anarchy
And the people in the most literate state of India cannot comprehend that? And if they do, they will not seek to change the situation?

The reason LDF gets almost 80% (just a ballpark figure) of their votes from Hindus is that in general, Hindus in KL dont mix politics and religion. The political conversation for Hindus to date has revolved mainly around governance issues and corruption…Which doesn’t mean that those two issues are given any priority. The Sabarimala issue had shaken the foundation of those 80% which was why the commies were worried in the beginning. I had seen many of my relatives who usually votes for UDF, especially womenfolk strongly voicing their disgust with the commies and talking about voting for BJP in the next elections. But the whole ‘vanitha mathil’ ended up being a decent success and I get a feeling that the frustration was not strong enough for most women to go against political diktat.

LDF, especially the CPM has a long reach in the state. Vast majority of the women in the state is working and regardless of that being in a company, factory or manual labour, they are all members of some trade union. The unions make sure you cannot be fired by the employer regardless of what you do and everyone see it as important to join one as soon they get a job. Attendance of meetings called by these unions are compulsory and they don’t have much of a say in the running. Just listen and obey what the union leaders tell them. If you know how militant the trade unions of KL is, you will know that it is practically impossible to go against them.

We need to wait and see for the next elections to really see the effect of the current change in mood. But then again KL BJP has pathetically inept leaders who are hardly charismatic or influential. Unless they get good leaders, I doubt there will be any major shift..
Just my two cents..

chandrasekaran · Post by **chandrasekaran** » 02 Jan 2019 18:08

Dileep wrote:
chandrasekaran wrote:What else do you want NaMo or for that matter BJP to do ? Dismiss the state govt. ?
No. A simple ordinance granting 'rights to privacy' to 'Deities' of temples would have done.

Saar this concept was eloquently put forth by Shri Sai Deepak and Shri Parasaran when they argued in the SC and yet the majority judgment didn't buy this. So I am not sure if this alone can be the basis of an ordinance. I don't know the law, but am not sure if the central government alone (without the concurrence of the state government) can bring an ordinance on this.

This point aside, even for an argument sake that the BJP could have passed such an ordinance, so the commie govt gets away scott free on this ? Just within 2 days after the longest human chain, the commie govt manages to get another such big chain for the "rights of women" organized ? What are the Hindu's of Kerala doing about the blatant trampling of their traditions and beliefs ? If this forum is any measure, all of them seem to blame Modi and BJP for being "opportunistic" here. Sorry if this is the general sentiment, good luck to you all.

Leaders don't emerge and get para dropped into an organization. That's possible only for the Gandhi clan. The rest work hard through the organizations for years... If BJP doesn't have a leader worth his name in kerala (or for that matter TN) its definitely due to the attitude of the common folks towards that party, in spite of what they have witnessed under the commie + congi rule all these years. I refuse to see it as a one sided issue that the party needs to take all the blame for this. The commie govt doing all this is also due to their own reading of the pulse of the situation that such blatant acts will have zero effect on Kerala electoral politics. And for that its the kerala voters who have to take the blame.

Dileep · Post by **Dileep** » 02 Jan 2019 18:25

To answer the questions:

1. The legend of Ayyappa is between 500 to 1000 years old. There is no way we can determine whether he actually said that or not. FWIW, there is no way we can determine if any of the legend really happened.

2. It is unlikely that the custom has any relation to the ruling of maharani. The visit by the monarch was not at all significant with any temple.

Now, there is no need to look for the origin, reason or logic for the custom, because the whole concept of worshiping a bronze statue as god is devoid of reason and logic. The custom is ancient, as written evidence by the British surveyors is available from 1820s.

habal wrote:i have two questions and would be greatful if someone answers it without illwill.

1. Did Ayyapan specifically mention somewhere that he does not want reproductive age female devotees or that he does not want female devotees at all or was he speaking specifically about that demoness who was enticing him ?

2. Does the ban on entry of women of certain age have anything to do with quarrel between kingdom of travancore, which was headed by maharani at one point of time and the raja of pandalam who was reluctant to share the prestige and power of owning sabarimala temple with travancore raja.

Dileep · Post by **Dileep** » 02 Jan 2019 18:32

Once the Temple is declared "private residence" of the Deity, and not a "public place" hence out of the purview of the "equality" clause. A lawyer arguing at Sc that it is not public place doesn't make it admissible by the judges. A legislation does.

You are forgetting that BJP (and all other parties) were supporting the SC verdict till the point everyone got blown away by the people getting into streets. Much of BJP are still in Taquiyya mode on this. That is a basic problem.

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 02 Jan 2019 19:17

I don't want to sound parochial or bring in politics but Kerala Hindus blaming BJP for Sabarimala is like me blaming Aishwaria Rai for not sleeping with me. What have the parties that you vote i.e. LDF and UDF have done for Sabarimala? First ask yourself that question. All the lawyers and activists who went to court on Sabarimala are associated with the Cong-Left.

Prasad · Post by **Prasad** » 02 Jan 2019 19:57

Supratik wrote:I don't want to sound parochial or bring in politics but Kerala Hindus blaming BJP for Sabarimala is like me blaming Aishwaria Rai for not sleeping with me. What have the parties that you vote i.e. LDF and UDF have done for Sabarimala? First ask yourself that question. All the lawyers and activists who went to court on Sabarimala are associated with the Cong-Left.

By that logic MP, Raj and Ch'gah can be thrown to the wolves? All temples desecrated cos Con won? What logic is this?
BJP needs to realise that this isn't a malloostan-only attack. There is a broadbased attack on all yindoo practices - makes EJ-fication easy once people get deracinated/de-yindooised. That the bjp doesn't get it or the fact that others don't seem to and keep asking 'but but whyfor bjp shuold do it onlee? are they giong to form govt onlee' is shwoing a remarkable lack of big-picture thinking. Yindoos are a myriad and diverse bunch easy to pick-off at the smaller level if there is no cross-denominational support. Worked for the brits. Will work for the EJs (whats the diff anyway). If bjp doesn't see it, and if people here cannot see it, I dunno what else to say.

chandrasekaran · Post by **chandrasekaran** » 02 Jan 2019 20:00

Dileep wrote:Once the Temple is declared "private residence" of the Deity, and not a "public place" hence out of the purview of the "equality" clause. A lawyer arguing at Sc that it is not public place doesn't make it admissible by the judges. A legislation does.

You are forgetting that BJP (and all other parties) were supporting the SC verdict till the point everyone got blown away by the people getting into streets. Much of BJP are still in Taquiyya mode on this. That is a basic problem.

Who can bring forth such a legislation ? This I don't know. If you unequivocally know that only the central govt can do this (in spite of the state govt. opposing any such move tooth and nail, with a majority judgement from the highest court backing them), please, all hindu's of Kerala unite and put pressure on your local MP's to ask for such a legislation on the floor of the parliament. That's the least you can do!

Among all the parties, its the BJP that has been the most vocal with actions on the ground, supporting the cause of Sabarimala till date. So this act of bracketing BJP with the other parties and call their actions "Taquiya" itself is a travesty of the first order. And I am of the firm opinion that this attitude itself is what I called out in a post a few days back.

For all the "Kerala is different, the minorities here are different" arguments posed by the vast group of Keralite Hindus, let me say that its the BJP which stands besides them today. Where is the so called keralite identity among the minorities in kerala in this episode ? Do they stand with their brethren ? No, they were officially on record just yesterday arguing for women's rights.

The saddest part is that this realization has still hasn't dawned and you continue to berate the only support you are getting arguing if its notional or taquiya etc.

vinod · Post by **vinod** » 02 Jan 2019 20:21

Sachin wrote:
UlanBatori wrote:Give credit where credit is due. They have been up there and done the Darshan.
Agree with that. If their purpose was to "prove a point", then that has been achieved. What is going to happen is that Hindu religious practises & customs would now be determined by Abrahamics. If every one is fine with that as well; then there is no problem.

It seems the women didn't actually get any darshan.. they just walked past sreekovil. They can be seen in the video saying to the police that they didn't see anything and officer saying we got the video, that is enough.
So,
proving the point - check.
darshan - NO

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 02 Jan 2019 20:33

Prasad, no one wants to throw Kerala Hindus under the bus. But no one can arise a person who is in Kumbhakarna mode. This is how interests work. It is not about elections. If you want someone to represent your community interests you have to find or found an organization that does it. If you think BJP is not good enough or don't like it find a local Hindu party or a party or an organization who will do it. If you think UDF or LDF will do it I will sell you the Ganges for ten rupees. And yes politics in India determines who welds power and ground situation. That is the harsh reality. Even in the uber secular US every community and ethnicity has groups which represents their interests. Only in India we hear this nonsense that their cannot be majority interests.

Dileep · Post by **Dileep** » 02 Jan 2019 20:37

>>please, all hindu's of Kerala unite and put pressure on your local MP's to ask for such a legislation on the floor of the parliament. That's the least you can do!

That works in USA. Not in India. The Indian system works differently.

If BJP feel that the KL Yindoos need to change their policy about them, they are welcome to try any tactics whatsoever to achieve that. As a KL Yindoo, I am simply making some suggestions on how to do that to my liking. You may like that or not. That is upto you.

Let me repeat. My 'alliance' with BJP is totally "issue based", and I don't believe I am alone on this. It was "Modi Magic of clean govt and development focus" originally (which lost its sheen to some extent, but I still root for him 100%). Now "Sabarimala" became a much bigger deal.

Dileep · Post by **Dileep** » 02 Jan 2019 20:43

Supratik, that may happen. We may see a KL based yindoo party that serve the KL Yindoo interest soon. They may have an issue based alliance with NDA. It is unlikely for that party to be powerful enough to be a seat winning power, so it may do under the table deals to make sure that the KL Yindoo interests are taken care of.

BJP used to do that (under the table deal with UDF) throughout, till the last two elections. They can no longer do this because they are in power. But the new Yindoo party can.

jpremnath · Post by **jpremnath** » 02 Jan 2019 20:45

chandrasekaran wrote:
For all the "Kerala is different, the minorities here are different" arguments posed by the vast group of Keralite Hindus, let me say that its the BJP which stands besides them today. Where is the so called keralite identity among the minorities in kerala in this episode ? Do they stand with their brethren ? No, they were officially on record just yesterday arguing for women's rights.

The saddest part is that this realization has still hasn't dawned and you continue to berate the only support you are getting arguing if its notional or taquiya etc.

The leaders from different churches and the semi-terrorist outfit SDPI had actually came in support of the demonstrations against court order. If i remember correctly, even the IUML leaders voiced their support to the agitating Hindus in the earlier days. I dont have any belief this was in solidarity with Hindus. More from the fear that this might lead to future court diktats interfering in their own religious activities.

The reason why BJP in KL is not having the desired connection is that KL BJP leaders supported Women entry in the beginning and even welcomed the Supreme Court ruling in the first few days. Only when they realised public mood was against the women entry they took a U-turn. And this is often highlighted by the commies saying this is BJPs duplicity...

If one wants to see the actual mood of the KL Hindus, I guess we will have to wait till the Loksabha Elections and see where BJPs vote share goes..

chandrasekaran · Post by **chandrasekaran** » 02 Jan 2019 20:46

It can work in the Indian context too. There are many instances including Jallikattu, where TN MP's across party lines have stalled the parliament. What have the MP's from kerala done so far on Sabarimala ?

Let me also repeat. Its high time that Kerala Hindu's realize that unless they unite as Hindu's and understand the ground realities around them, there is no "vimochanam". Blaming BJP as a narthie party and treating them with contempt will only make matters worse for them - unfortunately.

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 02 Jan 2019 20:56

Dileep, we had the same problem in Bengal for more than 40 years. No one to represent our interests. We have dumped both parties. Now we have three parties/orgs to look after Bengali Hindu interests - TMC, BJP, HS. Yes, even the TMC is basically a Hindu party which does some vote banking. Many Hindu temples/sites in Bengal were in derelict condition. The TMC has done some work on that. Community interests does not mean you have to start riots. You need something similar in KL.

Javee · Post by **Javee** » 02 Jan 2019 21:04

Supratik wrote:Prasad, no one wants to throw Kerala Hindus under the bus. But no one can arise a person who is in Kumbhakarna mode. This is how interests work. It is not about elections. If you want someone to represent your community interests you have to find or found an organization that does it. If you think BJP is not good enough or don't like it find a local Hindu party or a party or an organization who will do it. If you think UDF or LDF will do it I will sell you the Ganges for ten rupees. And yes politics in India determines who welds power and ground situation. That is the harsh reality. Even in the uber secular US every community and ethnicity has groups which represents their interests. Only in India we hear this nonsense that their cannot be majority interests.

In that case, you have just excluded all Southern states barring KA. Look at the coastline starting from Bengal, it is all non BJP ruling states, if this is the way that the chief strategist of BJP thinks and acts, then the horizon doesn't look so Rosy.

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 02 Jan 2019 21:26

Why do you need a single party/org in such a huge diverse country. There can be more than one to look after community interests. KCR, CBN, Jayalalitha under Periyarist conditions, Rajni are all doing quiet good. KL does not have a single one. Only two parties in India have no idea that India is home to 1.1 billion Hindus.

Srutayus · Post by **Srutayus** » 02 Jan 2019 21:26

This is not a good time to bicker among ourselves which is how we have lost every civilizational battle for the last 1000 years.

Amit Shah has spent a considerable amount of his time in Kerala. And BJP and RSS cadres have given up their lives for the cause. How many tears were shed for them? Not too long ago Shah was attempted to be fixed by sending him to jail on trumped up charges for the killing of a dreaded gangster. They are still in the fight.

Also we have a tendency to give credit to those who want to destroy us whenever they score a victory. Why should we do that any more than a Jew would want to give credit to the Nazis for how efficiently the murder machinery in the concentration camps and the railways that fed them operated?
The 3 organized religions, i.e. the 2 Abrahamic faiths and Communism are always going to be more organized and ruthless than us because of their nature.
But we must maintain our character and win. Our ancestors endured more. Even the Sri Rangam and Meenakshi temples were not just desecrated, they were pulled down by Khilji's Terrorists in the 13th century. But we came back and built what is now the world's largest religious complex at Sri Rangam.