Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby chetak » 19 Nov 2018 20:55

prahaar wrote:Are you suggesting that these things are happening in Sabarimala due to UP police officers? Did the person who was thrown from the clip also UP officer?

I am in full favor of calling out all those (press, police (IPS, state police), IAS, etc.) who have made this horrible torture of Ayyappa swamys in every possible manner. Please note in my post above, I am in no way condoning the IPS officer's behavior. I also recognize that this is harsher, because the devotee also happens to be a Hindu devotee.

My only objection was regarding the fact that these atrocities are happening due to the presence of UP IPS officers. In my opinion, when a government of the state acts in a certain way, it has the means to obtain resources to execute its will. To reduce the problem to non-state officers will only help Pinarayi government, nobody else.


My post is clear.

The Devotees at Sabarimala are not goondas and should never be treated as such by whomsoever it may be. There was no violence so the presumption that it may erupt momentarily is both fallacious and self serving.

These are cultured people protesting peacefully for the restoration of their religious rights and their right to worship in a very special temple bound by age old practices. There is nothing to be gained by any woman of fertile age from this specific temple, hence the taboo.

However, OTOH, sentiments of lakhs of pious devotees are willfully and maliciously being hurt to opportunistically and very selectively serve some imagined sickular constitution as well the unnatural and very strange desire to implement some appealed against SC decision when so many other decisions have been very conveniently sidestepped or ignored out rightly by several state govts including the gokl.

The case is being made out as though it is a matter of grave gender discrimination by people who never did understand the ground realities in Sabarimala and on being apprised of the same refuse to appreciate the facts.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Sachin » 19 Nov 2018 21:15

Updates as of 2100Hrs 19/11/2018
Sabarimala: HC slams Govt over police action. The High Court has asked very critical questions, and directed that pilgrims cannot be held as "hostages" in the GoKL attempt to implement the supreme court verdict. The DGP would also have to file a detailed report before Friday on the police arrangements at Sabari Mala, and also explain why water was pumped in any open area where people could take rest. The most crucial part of the order is no one who have tokens for Ghee Abhishekam, should be pushed away from Sannidhanam. How the police plans to implement this tonight may point on how things would proceed from here on. For the pilgrims it does'nt take much time to take the tokens for Ghee abhiskeham. 95% of the pilgrims any way do this ritual, a few ignorant folks may skip it. So if these people have to be accomodated at the hill top during the night; it means that the police's grand plan to keep the hill top clear of people during the night would not work out.

Sabarimala: Devaswom Board moves SC seeking more time to implement verdict. But the opinion heard is that this is a half-hearted attempt by the Travancore Devaswom Board. And most likely they will have to come back crying after the tongue lashing they may get from the Supreme Court. All this while GoKL and TDB have been bending over backwards and were eager to ensure that the verdict is met. They had nearly a month & half to get back to the Supreme Court if they felt that there are practical difficulties. TDB says due to floods many facilities at Pampa river point and Sabari Mala have been destroyed, and because of this women may not be given comfortable facilities. They sheepishly add another point; L&O issues. Now floods happened in August, and the damages were known even before the verdict was out. Another important event is that now Travancore Devaswom Board is left to fight the case. Kerala Govt, Chief Minister and the Devaswom Minister have neatly handed over this pandora's box to the Travancore Devaswom Board. Kerala Police worthies may also perhaps remember this modus operandi of GoKL. Some major issue happens at Sabari Mala, it would be all these great IPS afsars who will have to be answering. The commies will just drop them as hot potatoes. Police-wallahs can then remember people like K.Karunakaran who stood with the police during be it hell or high seas.

Janam TV (Malayalam) reports that V.Muralidharan & Nalin Kumar Kateel (MP from Karnataka) may be visiting Sabari Mala. The BJP strategy seems to use their leaders to show case the pathetic handling of Sabari Mala by GoKL. Lack of facilities, plus the high handed behaviour of the police may get highlighted again.

Janam TV (Malayalam) also reports that National Commission for Child Welfare and National Human Rights Commission have asked reports from GoKL. But as I see it these are tooth less organisations, so may not be able to make much impact.

prahaar wrote:I am not defending the indefensible actions of the police in Sabarimalai, but it is not UP police acting under the directions of CM of UP.

My only objection was regarding the fact that these atrocities are happening due to the presence of UP IPS officers. In my opinion, when a government of the state acts in a certain way, it has the means to obtain resources to execute its will.

The state's DGP (a far more senior officer) is from Orissa, and even his directives have been more placating to his political masters than based on a police man's assessment of the situation on the ground. And this IPS officer (and even the other chap wearing the military fatigues) are very junior officers. They have been given charge of police districts may be 1-2 years ago. And I don't think these officers have understood Kerala, or how Hindu religious establishments like temples work. The state government seems to have deputed them for the present job, considering they are still "culturally" not attached to Kerala. And thus they may not have much second thoughts to hit at the pilgrims.

chetak wrote:Why have experienced senior police officers who regularly and willingly opt and volunteer for the Sabarimala duty gone missing this time?? Maybe, they all knew in advance that unpalatable "verbal" orders may be issued by thugs and other undesirables.

I tend to agree with you. The High Court today have asked for a detailed report on two things;
1. What are the orders now issued at Sabari Mala? Who (the name) exactly have signed off the orders? And what were the reason to issue such an order?
2. Who are the police officers detailed on bandobust at Sabari Mala? What is their experience in crowd management? The court also clearly said that the constabulary should just sit in their barracks.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 19 Nov 2018 21:58

Pooch: If polis say they cannot identify (uniformed?) ppl who stole helmet/ vandalized vehicles, then isn't it possible to sue polis and guvrmand for compensation and punitive damages? Sue Collector/whoever else ordered polis to the area? Sue Polis top aphsars personally? Sue the Polis Mantri who happens to be CM. Give them some incentive to find the perps and produce them in court and PROVE that they are not polis.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 19 Nov 2018 22:07

This High Court makes pompous statements but then? Nothing. When they put a senior polis aphsar/collector behind bars for contempt/ non-bailable offenses we will see some hope.

But as I said, keep off attacking the aam polis pls. We need them to win the war. They seemed to be doing a very difficult and abhorrent task as best they could with professionalism and courtesy. With all respect to the Bhaktas, it seems to be a valid argument that those who were arrested last night were not exactly innocent bhaktas coming there for a Darshan after arduous 41-din vratam and long trip. Few there were black cloth/shirtless etc, these were townwallahs in nice shirt, obviously there to make a point. Not they don't have the right, but not the aam "Ayyappa" coming by bus from far away etc as made out by Janam. I don't take issue with the claim that the usual MSM/commie media are liars so "we" can also lie, but just trying to determine the actual ground reality.

The "Polis Raj" is strictly puppeteered by Pinnarayi gang, in turn by whoever pulls the strings on their cash-stuffed knickers.

IOW, a Polis revolution is the right solution: maybe they can demand protection from High Court and turn "People's Evidence" against the KL govt.?? Enuf is enuf of the KL Polis SNAFU.

EZ for me to suggest that these hard-working ppl sacrifice their careers, their freedom, maybe even their lives.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby chetak » 19 Nov 2018 22:11

Indic Collective @indiccollective

The rule 6(c) which prevents entry of women aged between 10-50 years in #Sabarimala has not been struck down by the Hon'ble SC. Hence TDB is bound to implement the rule 6(c) of its act and prevent the entry of women belonging to the said age group into the temple



Image



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1USkSQwENs

In conversation with T R Ramesh on Sabarimala - the way forward


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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 19 Nov 2018 22:39

Lots of pics!
Sasikala chechi reaches top of 18 steps.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Sachin » 19 Nov 2018 22:42

Update as of 19/11/2018 2230Hrs
The police have once again started pushing pilgrims out of the hill shrine area. There was a group (25-30 people) who have been singing Ayyappa Bhajans, and they have been now moved to a far away area. The police seems to have cleared this group out (and I don't think this group would be the ones to raise up in arms in case the police bring in young women), and kind of complied with the high court order of today. To be frank, the crowd is very thin at the hill shrine today, and it has also been raining. Even the die-hard feminazi may think twice of trying to make an entry now; because only true devotion actually makes people take such efforts.

UlanBatori wrote:Pooch: If polis say they cannot identify (uniformed?) ppl who stole helmet/ vandalized vehicles, then isn't it possible to sue polis and guvrmand for compensation and punitive damages? Sue Collector/whoever else ordered polis to the area?

Sir, the police have NOT said they were unable to trace the rowdies in their ranks. They have actually asked for more time; which is a standard delaying tactic. The police is a very process oriented organisation. Official movement of every police person, right upto a constable is recorded (K.P still have the old police note books and police passport). Even as a lay man, I can say that the riot mongering policemen at Nilakkal were recruit police constables from KAP 5Bn located at Maniyar, very close to Sabari Mala. There would be detailed instructions given in writing to "move" these many RTPCs for action at Nilakkal. The high level order may only say, nnn number of men from KAP 5 Bn should be deployed. But there would be orders issued by Battalion commandant on which companies would get moved here. And every company is going to have a "nominal roll", where details of every RTPC is recorded. And there was a post made by an RTPC (the helmet thief) who tried to justify his theft. If he can be picked up & questioned, the entire details of other RTPCs involved can be easily ascertained. But the khakhi line of silence will of course work here as well. Police is hoping that at some point of time the pilgrims and the court would just ignore the whole incident.

chetak wrote:The rule 6(c) which prevents entry of women aged between 10-50 years in #Sabarimala has not been struck down by the Hon'ble SC.

Interesting. Only catch is to ascertain if the Travancore-Cochin Hindu religious act of 1950 has been superseded by any other act. The sad fact is that there are very many acts and laws, which no one actually has any complete knowledge. But a social media campaign using this data may be helpful for the pilgrimage. Because all said and done; even Kerala Police (and GoKL) I feel is not very sure whether to allow women or not. There are multiple legal points, all which is has to get explored. But for Kerala Police; even if they try to make one attempt to violate the traditions of the temple they are royally s-crewed. To be frank even if one young woman lands up at the shrine, the chief priest would just close down the temple (for some time). And later if the legal luminaries find out that, the actions of GoKL and K.P were not in accordance with the law, the devotees are just going to go bersek. GoKL and K.P will never be able to blame the Supreme Court, or the law books and manage to escape.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Sachin » 19 Nov 2018 22:44

UlanBatori wrote:Sasikala chechi reaches top of 18 steps.

No problems. She is over the age bracket. So she has every right to be at the hill shrine. She is carrying the Irumudi kettu and thus eligible to climb up the 18 holy steps. She also had the choroonu ceremony of her grand child, which also was done. And she also kept her religious vow that she completes the pilgrimage as well.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 20 Nov 2018 02:49

Polis line of silence is what needs to be broken by lawsuit. Habeas Corpus applied to records. Big Chief jailed for contempt in case of undue delay, no tolerance. I am sure THAT will bring the records out, and the worthy polis-rioters will be squealing in no time.

For those (hnarigolisji 4 instance who says that LDF-polis are famous for their kindness, yes thx, you proved my point exactly): my point b4, is that the polis reaction is **NOT**** aggressive at all, by old standards or any standards, so you have to tread carefully in the propaganda about Polis Brew-Talitea. Goad them enough and they may show you what they are capable of. Let's see:
1) Standard Malloostan procedure (sorry Sachin) is that arrested person is provided the Facility to lie down in jeep, with Polis sitting on seats on either side of jeep, all their boots keeping the lying person warm and comfortable. Long ago there was a case where a Naxal suspect (most were innocents but few survived) was in this wonderful position when he got hold of a grenade or something, and blew the jeep up along with himself.

2) Ppls taken to polis station are generally entertained to some boxing and soccer practice by SI etc.

These are all of course PRIOR to any booking/questioning/ charging etc. Just the greeting. I don't think they are doing any of this. In fact so far they are treating the demonstrators as freedom fighters, with deep respect but also, some "getup and go" motivational techniques. So JANAM can scream, but let's not go overboard with it. The message I see is that the polis know very well that regime change is written on the wall, and they have concerns about Higher Authorities getting upset as well. USE that knowledge, is what I am saying. Think ahead to the wonderful din when the Lavalin Case comes up with actual non-bailable arrests. PV marching out with ornaments on wrists and ankles.

Now the UBCN opinion on the "Polis Rioting". From the videos that we have analyzed, what comes about is that some over-enthused Bhaktas threw water bottles at the polis. Some over-enthu polis returned the compliment with stones, because the water had spilled out of the bottles. Some of that was First-class fielding pick-up and throw. Expression was of intense concentration for aim, not anger or fear. One polis grabbed a motorcycle helmet to protect himself/some SC-Bibi anticipating some of the stones returning. I think that was very quick and innovative thinking.

This should be chalked up to good sportsmanlike give-and-take. All in good cheer: the same polis I am sure will happily share a chai-vada-porotta-charayam with the local Bhaktas at the end of the day. And criticize the guvrmand and the SC and the HC.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 20 Nov 2018 03:04

Just on Polis tradition of non-ratting on co-Polis: there was recently a neuj item that after Babri Masjid event in '92, there was rioting in UP by u-no-hu. The relative of a Provincial Armed Constab. officer, was halaled with the usual kindness.

His men (*****ARE ALLEGED TO HAVE*****) come to the village, rounded up 135 loaded them on trucks. 45 did not return. NOW, after all the delays due to misfortunate loss of records etc etc etc, a photo has surfaced which "confirms" (per the claimant) that several of the ppl were lined up and loaded on one truck. Though frankly, from the attitude of the PAC men standing around with rifles at odd angles, they don't look very stressed at all. So I wonder if the photo is fake. But anyway, 26 years is a long time to hold the Wall of Silence, hain?

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby ramana » 20 Nov 2018 03:25

chetak wrote:Image



chetak, I am having a twitter match with this poster. I asked him why he is bringing in the North-South divide like a Lemurian.
IPS is an All India Police Service started by Sardar Patel.
So far #Sabarimala is an all Indian issue yet this guy and a few Raitas are bringing in this divide. And now they point out this officer might have less training and familiarity.
My point is the IPS is following the bad orders.
They don't have choice

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 20 Nov 2018 07:17

ramana pls check e-pata. Knawligeabal experts agree
Last edited by UlanBatori on 20 Nov 2018 08:49, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby ramana » 20 Nov 2018 07:18

Wonderful...

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 20 Nov 2018 08:52


WTH! THAT seems brutal given that HC has demanded why Sec 144 was declared in the first place. They prayed at a place of worship, prayed all the way to the police buses and prayed all the way to the station. Why does that merit 14 days in jail? None of them were even remotely violent! That is really shocking. They are trying to bury the leadership in the cooler, hain? Old British tactics. Needs the slogan:

Each leader jailed, leads to 1000 new leaders rising.

Protestors are not looking at what is happening to fellow bhakas at high-hands of these judicials?

mantri Alphons roars like a train but acts like a mouse?
"Sabarimala A War Zone, Pilgrims Being Treated Like Dacoits": MinistervAlphons Kannanthanam said Sabarimala is like the Stalin era of the Soviet Union.

What kind of power does this "Central Minister" have other than :(( ??

IMO that 14-day incarceration of citizens exercising their right to worship, calls for a statewide civil disobedience movement.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby vimal » 20 Nov 2018 09:22

Why don't we reopen the politics thread?

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby chetak » 20 Nov 2018 11:34

ramana wrote:
chetak wrote:Image



chetak, I am having a twitter match with this poster. I asked him why he is bringing in the North-South divide like a Lemurian.
IPS is an All India Police Service started by Sardar Patel.
So far #Sabarimala is an all Indian issue yet this guy and a few Raitas are bringing in this divide. And now they point out this officer might have less training and familiarity.
My point is the IPS is following the bad orders.
They don't have choice


whatever the "orders", a humane attitude by the "customer" facing representative of authority is not automatically precluded.

Culture and not crudity is the need of the hour despite the commies being uncultured, educated and responsible cops, especially IPS need not be.

What does he see "confronting" him?? Devotees or goondas??

His conditioned and default crowd control behavior is driven by his perception.

I also saw some unctuously oily subordinate obsequiously holding an umbrella over some senior cops head like the maharajas of yore.

So now, our senior cops melt in the slightest of showers?? Are we to respect such tyrants??

This is entitled and despotic behavior by cops of an oppressive police force very specifically designed to uphold the colonial rule of the britshits. They don't seem to realize that their erstwhile colonial masters have been kicked out and a democratic breeze has been blowing over the Indian landscape since that day in 1947.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Sachin » 20 Nov 2018 11:45

Updates on 20/11/2018 at 1135Hrs IST

Pilgrimage is going on as usual but the foot fall has been quite less. Mathrubhumi's printed edition dated today, has a small news which says that two young women had come to Sabari Mala yesterday. They were from a pilgrim group which came from KA. The women police checked their age at Nilakkal, and appraised them of the situation and religious customs at Sabari Mala. One woman whose age was 48 then decided to stay back, and the other woman said that she any way had no plans to visit the temple. 6 women who also had registered at the Police web site mysteriously popped up at Press Club, Ernakulam and said that they had decided to quit. Again they were more of "activists" than true devotees of Lord Ayyappa.

I think the police has realised that the biggest mistake they did was to take Kavitha Koshi and Rehana Fathima as a big procession to the shrine. That completely exposed the shenanigans of GoKL and their side-kicks in the police force. It was this move which caused severe distrust on the police and the government. Due to this every police deployment is now see with suspicion by the devotees (and the people as well). The police has now changed their tactics. One; they clearly say that police protection can only be given from Nilakkal base camp. It is the individual responsibility for the young women to reach there. Twoo; and when young women reach there, the WPCs are checking their age and also sensitise them about the situation. Like the two ladies from KA, people who are religious generally back off. As for the "activists" (who are crooks), they are now scared of the people's wrath which awaits them when they go back.

Now that aside, politics is over-shadowing the pilgrimage. Understanding that BJP & RSS are getting extra mile-age due to their involvement in Sabari Mala, Congress has also decided to start their own protests. Even Shiv Sena - a non entity in Kerala - talks about sending 7 rallies from various parts of India :). The "party without workers" CPI is lamenting that "Sabarimala: Party families lack clarity." :lol:. Commies cannot convince their own folks at home, now wants to roll out changes across Kerala :roll:.

The Travancore Devaswom Board has submitted a petition asking for a "stay" on the verdict, but they are not pressing for a quick hearing. And don't know if this move is a too clever by half. TDB has said that it does NOT have the infrastructure readied for women. It also then says an expert committee appointed by Supreme Court has also not allowed more construction at Sabari Mala and Pampa river point.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby mappunni » 20 Nov 2018 12:00

And now this police raiding rest houses near Sannidhanam around midnight in gross violation.

https://youtu.be/kToRZ5yNroc

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Sachin » 20 Nov 2018 12:05

UlanBatori wrote: Long ago there was a case where a Naxal suspect (most were innocents but few survived) was in this wonderful position when he got hold of a grenade or something, and blew the jeep up along with himself.

The incident you mentioned happened in 1976 when a naxal A. Balakrishnan managed to put light to the kerosene can kept inside the police jeep. He also held tight to the Dy.SP sitting on the front seat. Both Balakrishnan & Dy.SP Balasubramanian perished in the fire. The dead Dy.SP's son too joined the police and is now an IPS officer in the state.

They prayed at a place of worship, prayed all the way to the police buses and prayed all the way to the station. Why does that merit 14 days in jail? None of them were even remotely violent! That is really shocking. They are trying to bury the leadership in the cooler, hain? Old British tactics

This move is now only make the arrested appear as martyrs for the Sabari Mala cause. They were given a hero's welcome by the Ayyappa Bhakths with some one even getting a priest to do Aarthi in front of the police van carrying them. The commies are actually giving the BJP some good sticks to beat them :lol:. These men did not indulge in any violence, and were only praying at a place of worship.

IMO that 14-day incarceration of citizens exercising their right to worship, calls for a statewide civil disobedience movement.

It is quickly going on that way. The Congress folks have demanded that prohibitory orders be lifted, or else they are also going to protest. There are also reports that out-of-the-state pilgrims are finding the police control at Nilakkal base camp too much, and even deciding to go back.

ramana wrote:My point is the IPS is following the bad orders.

To be frank, I guess the rot is there on the highest echelons of Kerala Police. The first thing the CPI(M) did when they got into power was to sack the then DGP (who had another year of service) Senkumar IPS stating that he was not competent. Senkumar was a very tough nut to crack, and a very sensible police man. He actually approached the Supreme Court, got reappointed with the GoKL also getting a fine of Rs. 25,000. There was a famous case of Senkumar actually reprimanding a police constable who went bersek during a lathi charge. One of the officers involved in the fracas at Sabari Mala, was involved here as well.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby SaiK » 20 Nov 2018 12:17

#HuntingHindus Arrested for namajapam in front of his ishta devatha!!

Can the supreme court tell me how section 144 can be implemented in a temple where 6-10 members of a family -elders & kids included, go together for darshan. Are they supposed to break up into teams? https://t.co/BZveui7Ks1


Section 144 is it?

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby SaiK » 20 Nov 2018 12:20

#Outrageous
Have you ever seen, anywhere in the world a #PoliceForce encouraging #MobLynching?

Welcome to #Kerala

This is an FB post by @TheKeralaPolice, encouraging people to take law into their hands &attack those who spread #FakeNews!

CC: @HMOIndia @PMOIndia @KeralaGovernor https://t.co/nWN3DgtucC

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby mappunni » 20 Nov 2018 13:27

Just now Janam reports that police have been threatening devotees of dire consequences if perform Sharana gosham, talk to media, Etc. They managed to get a copy of the printed dictats issued by the cops.

Why isn't any approaching Kerala high court ? This is blantant violation of everything the Constitution provides for.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby SaiK » 20 Nov 2018 14:11

#SaveSabarimalaTradition For confirmation of @AmitShah ji who wondered "If reports are true" Exhibit 8
A devotee pushed and kicked down by no less than an IPS Officer, SP Prateesh Kumar. Irumudi trampled. https://t.co/ISkfUWIQam

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby shuuro » 20 Nov 2018 20:48

http://www.newindianexpress.com/states/ ... 00523.html

In an attempt to curb the raging protest against the entry of young women to the hill shrine, a Navy helicopter has been deployed for aerial surveillance at Sabarimala on Monday.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Sachin » 20 Nov 2018 21:08

Sabarimala: 8 BJP activists in preventive detention. Main stream media is tom-tomming this incident as a "victory" to the police. It seems the police made the detention based on the inputs in the circular which was to have been prepared by BJP. The detention was because they exceeded the 6 hour staying limit at the shrine - even when they had tokens to do the Ghee Abhisheka tomorrow. I am just wondering; are K.P so foolish to think that BJP or RSS would just send in their cadre based on a "now out in the open" list? For every such "baits", they could very well push in 20-30 folks completely undetected. Mean while Rajya Sabha K. Muralidharan has also reached the police station where they were detained and seeks explanation from the S.P.

shuuro wrote:In an attempt to curb the raging protest against the entry of young women to the hill shrine, a Navy helicopter has been deployed for aerial surveillance at Sabarimala on Monday.

These are just gimmicks :). Think about it. What can a Navy helicopter do at Sabari Mala? The area has small hills (surrounded by bigger hills), and is also is a thick reserve forest. How much of a visibility does a Navy helicopter have? Whom are they going to look for? Young women coming up through otherwise unknown forest trek paths? Or RSS activists coming up through similar paths? The Navy helicopter can at the best give a very high level movement of the pilgrims, and also see if there are any points where there is huge crowd of pilgrims. They cannot make low level passes and some how spot RSS activists using some device.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby chetak » 20 Nov 2018 21:09

This is a very clear case of discrimination



News18 Verified account @CNNnews18 Nov 19

#JustIn -- Kerala government files affidavit and seeks more time from Supreme Court to implement its judgment on church factions’ row. The state government said it was exploring amicable resolutions.







News18 Verified account @CNNnews18

#JustIn -- The state government cited ‘sensitive’ nature of the dispute and has requested Supreme Court not to give time bound orders for implementation of the judgment in Malankara Orthodox Syrian church case.


1:49 AM - 19 Nov 2018

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby chetak » 20 Nov 2018 21:12

Sachin wrote:Sabarimala: 8 BJP activists in preventive detention. Main stream media is tom-tomming this incident as a "victory" to the police. It seems the police made the detention based on the inputs in the circular which was to have been prepared by BJP. The detention was because they exceeded the 6 hour staying limit at the shrine. I am just wondering; are K.P so foolish to think that BJP or RSS would just send in their cadre based on a "now out in the open" list? For every such "baits", they could very well push in 20-30 folks completely undetected. Mean while Rajya Sabha K. Muralidharan has also reached the police station where they were detained and seeks explanation from the S.P.

shuuro wrote:In an attempt to curb the raging protest against the entry of young women to the hill shrine, a Navy helicopter has been deployed for aerial surveillance at Sabarimala on Monday.

These are just gimmicks :). Think about it. What can a Navy helicopter do at Sabari Mala? The area has small hills (surrounded by bigger hills), and is also is a thick reserve forest. How much of a visibility does a Navy helicopter have? Whom are they going to look for? Young women coming up through otherwise unknown forest trek paths? Or RSS activists coming up through similar paths? The Navy helicopter can at the best give a very high level movement of the pilgrims, and also see if there are any points where there is huge crowd of pilgrims. They cannot make low level passes and some how spot RSS activists using some device.



There will be a representative(s) of the GoKL, with binoculars, in the helo who will report by radio any movements, gatherings of people and movements of crowds.

The cops will investigate these reports to verify.

People in the help cannot be doing much more than this.

It is more of a deterrence, something to show the flag and warn folks that they are under surveillance and to prevent misadventure.

Also, photographs can be taken in low passes, if required.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 20 Nov 2018 21:30

There you go! Very reasonable, Strong Leader Acts To Protect Rights!
That woman blowing a wolf whistle was clearly bent on violence.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 20 Nov 2018 21:30

There will be a representative(s) of the GoKL, with binoculars, in the helo who will report by radio any movements, gatherings of people and movements of crowds.


Is the Navy helo working for GOI or GoKL I wonder. The difference is that they can take video and maybe even capture conversations, without permission from polis, hain?

They can't operate 24 hrs a day, the cost is waaaaaay too much. So this is a spot-check, maybe 3 times day.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Dileep » 20 Nov 2018 21:38

Yup! one can take nice clear photus that can do face detection from a helo using your hand held eye-phone onlee. You need special equipment with gyro stabilization to get photos from the heavy vibration environment of a helo. Of cpurse, the navy may have the equipment, but would that be used for the benefit of the KP?

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby chetak » 20 Nov 2018 21:46

UlanBatori wrote:
There will be a representative(s) of the GoKL, with binoculars, in the helo who will report by radio any movements, gatherings of people and movements of crowds.


Is the Navy helo working for GOI or GoKL I wonder. The difference is that they can take video and maybe even capture conversations, without permission from polis, hain?

They can't operate 24 hrs a day, the cost is waaaaaay too much. So this is a spot-check, maybe 3 times day.


this is NOT an initiative of the IN.

The IN helo has been requisitioned by the GoKL and they have to pay for the use of this asset.

Unless there are some landing/ refueling facilities close by, the time on task will be limited.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 20 Nov 2018 22:27

All u have to do is wear a cap with a visor and
VOTE PINNARAYI OUT!!

on the top. in English and Malloo. Or the same message as what is in the Notices?
See how long they run the helo after that comes on JANAM TV. :mrgreen:

1000 Bhaktas with that on top of the IruMudi. Add
PUNISH LAVELIN CRIMINAL!!
Amme jnangal marannalum Floriye jnangal marakoolla!
PINNARAYI== Panni-Nari

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 21 Nov 2018 03:18

Aiyyooo!!! The Faithful have disappeared or what? :shock: Here are some more suggestions to post on Cap-top: Give the Helo-borne commies something to focus their zoom lenses on.
4 a gud time call 1-800-PIN-RAYI

Rehana Fat-Ma for CPI(M) Party Secretary

Rehana has Melons. Pinnarayi has a Payaru.

OK I better stop b4 Bredators come this way. :eek:

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby SSridhar » 21 Nov 2018 07:43

Wanted to post a particular comment from the recent The Hindu article

Malayarayans were hereditary "Oracles" of Sabarimala temple (at best translated as “Velichappadu's”), and not priests. This fact has been firmly established in “Native Life in Travancore” (1881, Author - Samuel Mateer) & “Castes and tribes of Southern India” (1909, Author - Edgar Thurston). The former also talk about the manner in which the tribe lost its oracle-ship; due to a mass conversion to Christianity {Doesn't this also tally with the motives for the 1950 burning down of the temple as established by the detailed Kerala Police investigation report?}. There is no indication of this tribe being priests of the temple.

Bringing Malayaranyans to the spotlight has been a leftist ploy to create a caste-divide in the Hindu society.

Take for instance, the claim that the first step of the "Pathinettam padi" has the name of Karimala Arayan is etched. Before the steps were gold-plated, it was clearly established that all 18 steps were carved out from a single rock. Given this, how could one person's name be etched under a single rock? {What is this story?}

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby SaiK » 21 Nov 2018 07:56

DySP Rafeeq on behalf of Kerala police informed the High Court that they couldn't identify police men who indulged in attacking devotees & damaging their vehicles!

Joke is, at least 3-4 policemen are easily identifiable from the below pic itself!
https://t.co/G768ZIohum

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 21 Nov 2018 08:44

https://www.ndtv.com/kerala-news/8-saba ... ex-1950753

police said the eight were taken into preventive custody by police from 'Sannidhanam' on Tuesday night based on intelligence report that they were at the shrine to create trouble.
Kerala | Press Trust of India | Updated: November 21, 2018 03:06 IST

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby mappunni » 21 Nov 2018 11:19

UlanBatori wrote:Aiyyooo!!! The Faithful have disappeared or what? :shock: Here are some more suggestions to post on Cap-top: Give the Helo-borne commies something to focus their zoom lenses on.
4 a gud time call 1-800-PIN-RAYI

Rehana Fat-Ma for CPI(M) Party Secretary

Rehana has Melons. Pinnarayi has a Payaru.

OK I better stop b4 Bredators come this way. :eek:


Battoriji, Used your choicest descriptions above to shoo away the commies infesting Janam TV live. :rotfl: :rotfl:

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Sachin » 21 Nov 2018 11:22

Updates 21/11/2018 1100Hrs

Pilgrimage going on smoothly, but with much less foot-fall. This fact and with the drubbing of Kerala High Court; Restriction lifted; Pilgrims can rest at Valiya Nadapanthal {an area found sensitive by the police}. 8 BJP activists in preventive detention; and they have also been released with no charges leveled. BJP MPs V.Muralidharan and Nalin Kumar Kateel ensured that no charges goes against them. There were two instances where police forcibly evicted the pilgrims who were chanting "Ayyappa bhajans". Yesterday that new "tradition" also got broken, when the BJP MPs sat along side the pilgrims and chanted "Ayyappa bhajans". The police had to stand by. So brick by brick police is now asked to take back any draconian steps they have during the last week.

Added later: Looks like the police is back to its old policies after the two MPs left the hill temple. Today Pon Radhakrishnan is making a visit and he too may stay up at the hill till the temple closes for the day. I saw the visuals at Janam TV; foot-fall at the shrine is very very less. In fact it is much lower than the crowd which comes every month during the first few days when the temple opens for darshan. Sabari Mala is now pretty much a temple for Kerala Police.

Union minister Pon Radhakrishnan heads to Sabarimala. And he is going to visit as an pilgrim, since he has completed all the mandatory rituals and have the Irumudi kettu etc. And when he makes a pilgrimage at least the Tamil media would have to give some coverage of the Sabari Mala issues.

The Kerala High Court is hearing another set of petitions regarding Sabari Mala today. The petitions challenge the imposition of Cr.PC 144 in the shrine and surrounding areas, and how police is taking suo-moto decisions, when ideally the Travancore Devaswom Board has to requisition help. The Kerala Police has now realised that they have received a mighty hit on their H&D. They are now trying to recoup that by putting up posters showcasing their "help" to the pilgrims. A sample can be seen at the Facebook page of Thrissur City Police of which Yathish Chandra was the Police Commissioner :lol:.

This news report in Malayalam (from Mathrubhumi.com), pretty much confirms what we had said in this thread :). CPI(M) feared that Sangh Parivar would completely take over Sabari Mala :lol:. That fear naturally was also passed onto K.P who too took many draconian steps so that they would not lose their H&D. The Kerala CM now officially confirmed that his assurance to women pilgrims would only be a safe journey from Nilakkal Base camp. Till they reach that point, their safety & well being remains with them. Kerala Govt. is NOT having the enthusiasam which they showed two months back; when the government and police were desperately trying to send some woman up the shrine. Media's women crew, activists, fake-Hindus and even mentally challenged women were encouraged to go.

My gut feeling is that Cr.PC 144 would be lifted, and the pilgrim flow would be normalised. Kerala Govt. is now on the path of reconciliation. For all you know there may have been back room negotiations with BJP and Congress; and every one agreeing upon that the pilgrimage should go as smooth as possible. With this "no security till base camp" and K.P detailing (unofficially) WPCs to check the ages of women pilgrims; I don't think so any more feminazis would make an attempt to go up the shrine.

chetak wrote:It is more of a deterrence, something to show the flag and warn folks that they are under surveillance and to prevent misadventure.

UlanBatori wrote:They can't operate 24 hrs a day, the cost is waaaaaay too much. So this is a spot-check, maybe 3 times day.

Google maps of Sabari Mala area. The roads which pilgrims take etc. are clearly seen. The view from the helicopter cannot be much different, but perhaps from a very lower level. But along the trek route there are many points which have tin roofing, and many which also has forest cover. A general overview of the pilgrim's movements can be seen, and the police officer sitting in the helo can pass on the message on the police wireless. But beyond that, I don't think they can do much.

The helo patrols are only limited to very few days (and that too it cannot be three times a day). There was a temporary helipad at Nilakkal base camp, but I don't think it is 100% operational. So the helos will have to start from the Naval Air station at Kochi.

UlanBatori wrote:police said the eight were taken into preventive custody by police from 'Sannidhanam' on Tuesday night based on intelligence report that they were at the shrine to create trouble.

The "intelligence report" they cite is a leaked letter from BJP state officials in which they instruct BJP units to send in cadre to the shrine on specific days. Looks like some police officer recognized these people as the ones listed in the letter and detained them. But they cannot do this always and every time as there is no order which says that BJP or RSS workers should NOT enter this shrine (though CPI(M) would love to get such an order).

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby disha » 21 Nov 2018 11:57

Commies have blinked and they have blinked hard. This is like the famous downhill skiing by kamandu musharaf.

Kangrez'is were cutting a sorry figure. The mindshare was being lost to BJP/RSS. And they needed to jump back wily-nily into the fray.

Bolis got isolated in the HC and had to cut a sorry figure there. Now no Bolis will be interested in listening to the Commies. So in essence, Commies lost their influence on Bolis. In fact, Kerala Bolis is back to helping the swamis.

Commies also saw the mass support this is gaining. They particularly lost the game when they sent the nekid woman and the jakal "journo" in riot gear to Sannidhanam. After that downhill skiing, the next battle was launched by Trupti who remained a-Trupt. Shani has really got to her and she will remain a-Trupt for the rest of her life. She is now radio-active.

Swamis and the BJP-RSS strategy to keep up the pressure actually helped. The mano-vaigyanik (psychological) atyachaar (torture) visited on Pee Wee Mao must have been immense and he needed a way out. And a cease-fire was granted.

The issue is still not dead. Commies have tasted a massive defeat and Pee Wee Mao should be made the scapegoat here (rightly so) by the commies and forced to retirement.

BJP+RSS should now aim for all Devaswom board control. Control the mind and the money supply to the GOKL and make them dance to their tunes. At this point the Travancore Devaswom board does not enjoy the faith of the people or the pandalam royals. Heads must roll there (willy-nilly). I hope BJP+RSS is targeting take over of all devaswom board by mid-next year.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby chetak » 21 Nov 2018 14:31

The sheer importance of sickular control over Sabarimala for the BIF cannot be overemphasized.

This is a well thought out and a devious plan.

With TDB and mantri in their pockets, they are now boldly aiming to subjugate and control the thantri

twitter

Friends, before going for a peaceful sleep, think about this picture. Ask yourself why so much police is needed in temple where devotees come to pray. Why is #Kerala govt making it into a warzone? @rajnathsingh @KirenRijiju
#SabarimalaTemple #SaveSabarimalaTradition


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