Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

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SaiK
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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby SaiK » 21 Nov 2018 15:23

Just cause another awakening so that these cops have to be diverted. Just do it.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby SaiK » 21 Nov 2018 16:00

Alrighty.. NRI folks get ready to be thrown out of the country itself.. what commie jokers. I can't believe they will exist anymore in malloostan for eternity.

https://www.thenewsminute.com/article/w ... cops-91923

Sabarimala
Will cancel passports of NRIs inciting riots over Sabarimala issue say Kerala cops

The notice has provoked sharp responses on social media

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Sachin » 21 Nov 2018 16:28

chetak wrote:This is a well thought out and a devious plan.
With TDB and mantri in their pockets, they are now boldly aiming to subjugate and control the thantri

This time around the Tantri (chief priest) have stuck to his guns. And one big positive aspect about him is that he only speaks when absolutely neccessary, and that too for what is in his domain. He is also the chief priest for many Ayyappa temples all across India, so this priest family also have outside Kerala connections.

This time's pilgrimage season does give the commies and BIF some advantages;
1. If young women do enter the shrine (so far all attempts have failed), they can severly discredit the temple's belief system. I know that lots of non-Hindus in KL are eagerly awaiting that :evil:.
2. Because of all the L&O problems if less number of pilgrims arrive, it would help GoKL to cover up the pathetic mismanagement of this hill temple. Other than making all plans to discredit the faith, GoKL and TDB have not been able to provide any support to the pilgrims. If more people come and see all this, it is a problem for them. So if they can minimise the foot fall this year, it helps them to regroup for next year.

SaiK wrote:NRI folks get ready to be thrown out of the country itself.. what commie jokers. I can't believe they will exist anymore in malloostan for eternity.

These are all threats meant for NRKs mainly working out of Middle Eastern countries. I don't think such draconian steps will work with any other European countries or the US; and for passport cancellation etc help from MEA is expected. Now if Visa mata allows the K.P to have its way, then not much to say. K.P is actually bluffing liberally these days by using terms like "passport cancellation","charging cases","arrest" etc. Seasoned politicians know all the procedures involved here, but a common Ayyappa devotee may NOT.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Karthik S » 21 Nov 2018 16:49

Sachin wrote:Google maps of Sabari Mala area. The roads which pilgrims take etc. are clearly seen. The view from the helicopter cannot be much different, but perhaps from a very lower level. But along the trek route there are many points which have tin roofing, and many which also has forest cover. A general overview of the pilgrim's movements can be seen, and the police officer sitting in the helo can pass on the message on the police wireless. But beyond that, I don't think they can do much.

The helo patrols are only limited to very few days (and that too it cannot be three times a day). There was a temporary helipad at Nilakkal base camp, but I don't think it is 100% operational. So the helos will have to start from the Naval Air station at Kochi.


Why on earth would MoD provide helo to KP?

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Sachin » 21 Nov 2018 17:27

Janam TV had an interview with ex-DGP of K.P; Sen Kumar IPS.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eil3sm-yoMs

Rough paraphrasing:
  • 0:38-01:34 :- Sec 144 Cr.PC is a law which can be easily misused. The police have powers to allow 100 people, but just stop/detain 6 people based on the "descretion" of the individual officer on the ground. There are enough and more officers in Kerala, who are champions in drafting false cases. And there are also legal experts who are willing to them give advice in that direction.
  • 01:34-01:48 :- The police should never have donned the role of the "chief priest". But they have gone ahead and done that. Other wise, how can they decide to pump water to a huge roofed area, which was meant for pilgrims to rest?
  • 01:58-02:20 :- The pilgrimage to Sabari Mala should not be made a difficult task for the pilgrims. But if the GoKL plan is to reduce the pilgrim foot fall from 1 to 1.5 crores to 15 or 20 lakhs, then we should "appreciate" the government for that. Because the current plans at Sabari Mala will help achieving it.
  • 02:28-03:00 :- When in junior ranks, at the time when people are to learn the job by experience if "people" spend time "carrying the children of others" (i.e baby sitting) then they will never learn the job. In Sabari Mala the biggest problem is that the current bandobust plan is made by officers who have no past experience in handling the pilgrimage. There are still lots of police officers in Kerala who knows the practical difficulties of handling policing duties at Sabari Mala. And if they were involved here, never would be such a "scheme" (a term used for the bandobust plan) put in place.

Karthik S wrote:Why on earth would MoD provide helo to KP?

May be to show that in matters of internal security MoD will not play spoil sport. And K.P is expected to pay them for their services. The Navy pilots also get some flying time to record ;). This move in no way actually means that GoI (i.e BJP) is favouring all police actions in Sabari Mala by GoKL (the commies).

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 21 Nov 2018 18:09

many points which have tin roofing

Oh! WHAT AN OPPORTUNITY for helicopter-based advertising! Please see the suggested posters to put on roofs (and remove quickly after helo passes).
Don't the media have helicopter access, BTW? 8)

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 21 Nov 2018 18:15

https://www.thenewsminute.com/article/w ... cops-91923
When pressed about the reason for including the warning to foreign nationals about their passports being cancelled :roll: for indulging in such activities, he said, “It is on the basis of the DGP’s circular. We have written like this because the highest number of such posts are coming from abroad, and [it needs to be known] that strict action will be taken against them. Their passports will be cancelled and a case taken up against them.”
He reiterated, “This is a criminal case, it will be taken up in that matter. Hence the circular was given as an advance warning.”
The notice is being circulated on social media, and causing some outrage with those who align themselves to Save Sabarimala protests alleging that this was a intimidatory tactic of the Kerala police.
tvm city police commissioner fb threatens NRI devotees with cancellation of passports & bringing them back to Kerala as a punishment for supporting #SaveSabarimala https://t.co/L97xzuPawd
cc @MEAIndia @SushmaSwaraj @HMOIndia pic.twitter.com/Yf9uuVAYOs
— Anjali George (@Kuvalayamala) November 20, 2018
Even NRIs are threatened by saying that their PP will be cancelled. Utter Chaos.
Govt must enquire and take action against city police Commissioner, Tiruvanathapuram.
#SaveSabarimala https://t.co/ib3n2C4MEF
cc @MEAIndia @SushmaSwaraj @HMOIndia pic.twitter.com/6VNTE4dqAC
— Puushothman Vaikkath (@purushueme) November 20, 2018
Hope MEA will assure safety of NRIs. I cannot afford cancellation of my passport. Should I renounce Indian citizenship for living as an Ayyappa Devotee & stand with my temple Sushma ji @SushmaSwaraj ? https://t.co/uXcSWSbd37
— Anjali George (@Kuvalayamala) November 20, 2018


Perhaps the criminal cases for inciting riots, should be considered against DGP Clouseau of Circular IQ?
I know the Comrades control CHINESE passports, but do they now control passports of other foreign nations as well?

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Karan M » 21 Nov 2018 18:33

LOL, when was the last time the BJP govt took a strong stand on anything? IIRC Modi didn't even want the fake news peddlers in media muzzled, log kya kahenge and all that lol. For all his tough talk pre-election, he has been a damp squib on taking tough action against many vested interests unless he was forced to, as versus harping on vikas, and I don't see any of the above by the KL govt eliciting anything from the center. It will just be ignored. The focus is only on winning elections.
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... 593842.cms

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby mappunni » 21 Nov 2018 18:36

SaiK wrote:Alrighty.. NRI folks get ready to be thrown out of the country itself.. what commie jokers. I can't believe they will exist anymore in malloostan for eternity.

https://www.thenewsminute.com/article/w ... cops-91923

Sabarimala
Will cancel passports of NRIs inciting riots over Sabarimala issue say Kerala cops

The notice has provoked sharp responses on social media


I have reached out to my Congressman and Senators asking how and the Commie MLAs and MPs from Kerala get US Visa when US Visa application explicitly asks a question about Supporting communism.

I will try to find out how the those visas can be cancelled. About a month ago the Commie pmp, Paranari was visiting Mayo Clinic in MN.

The sad part, it is the same scumbag who was shouting against "Imperialist America".

The other scumbag ISucks daughter was the one involved in Commie activities at NYU.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby chetak » 21 Nov 2018 19:16

The Sabarimala Conundrum: It’s A Lose-Lose For Hindus




The Sabarimala Conundrum: It’s A Lose-Lose For Hindus

by Rajeev Srinivasan
Nov 21, 2018,

Snapshot
It is clear that the Kerala government will stop at nothing to force the entry of young women into Sabarimala.


In the first of a two-part article, the writer says how the Supreme Court ruling triggered a disastrous series of events where there were no winners, but many losers, most of all the Hindu women of Kerala.

The Sabarimala issue is one in which there are no winners, but many losers. Most of all, the losers are the faithful, especially Kerala Hindu women, who have had their beliefs trampled underfoot by an uncaring state. Almost nobody comes out of it smelling of roses, and it has been a disastrous series of events, the real import of which we don’t yet understand. However, it feels very much like a tipping point, although which way things will go is not yet clear.

While the proximate cause of the problems is the Supreme Court ruling on 28 September, there is a preponderant cause and a root cause, too. We can also think in terms of three different stakeholders, none of whom exactly covered themselves in glory: the Supreme Court, the communist Kerala government, and the BJP Union government.

The Supreme Court

The proximate cause is the public interest litigation (PIL) that the court unwisely admitted: because those filing the case had no obvious locus standi. None of them were Kerala Hindus, or pious Ayyappa devotee women, who might have had a legitimate desire to visit the temple in their child-bearing years between 10 and 50. Instead, it was filed by several Delhi lawyers (four out of five of them later changed their mind once they understood the situation, but the court would not let them withdraw the petition, perhaps for technical reasons, perhaps because of the virtue-signalling opportunity).

There are plenty of concerns about the entire PIL process, wherein a fashionable cause can be brought to the Supreme Court directly: a situation unique to India. Comparable class-action suits in the US, for instance, have to wend their way for several years through lower courts, courts of appeal, etc, before the Supreme Court accepts it only if it is a constitutional matter. In India, on the other hand, anybody with an axe to grind and lots of money can hire a famous lawyer, get the case listed straight as a PIL in the SC, and have the court rule in their favour in a few months, damn the impact on society at large. It really isn’t in the ‘public interest’ after all, just a pet cause for the litigants.

The simplest thing regarding Sabarimala would have been for the Supreme Court to maintain the status quo ante. However, based on a narrow reading of their ambit, and influenced no doubt by current fads and the media, the courts chose to impose a ruling that is the very opposite of Solomonic: instead of being harsh but even-handed, it is harsh but one-sided, and doesn’t take the ground situation into account.

This is the most glaring proximate cause; on reflection, the court should have rejected this PIL, but it was positioned as a ‘gender-rights’ issue, and presumably in the wake of #MeToo, judges too are eager to show how politically-correct they are with respect to this latest fashion.

The Supreme Court, in a rambling verdict, ruled on 28 September said that all women should be allowed free entry, regardless of consequences. The simple-minded focus on gender equality shows two things: a) the baleful the influence of Western fads and causes on the courts, b) the possibility that the court had made up its mind even before any arguments were heard.

The latter possibility is buttressed by two observations. There was an immediate uproar, and thousands of ordinary Kerala Hindu women, the purported ‘victims’ being given succour by the ruling, took to the streets in massive protests, because they felt their faith and traditions were under attack by outsiders. They were #ReadyToWait till they were 50, they said. The sight of thousands of ordinary middle-class mothers and grandmothers out on the streets should have been instructive.

But the courts choose to ignore them, and set the hearing for the clutch of review petitions on 13 November, aware that the temple would open for Diwali on 5 and 6 November. If the process were fair, the hearing of the review petition should have been before Diwali, because once a single young woman entered, there would be a fait accompli, and the tradition would have been violated, to the chagrin of the faithful.

Indeed, there were startling battle scenes on the days the temple was open in October and earlier this month with large numbers of policemen in riot gear protecting certain female activists who were obviously not pilgrims, or driven by any need to pray. They were there to make a point. This prospect caused serious angst among the devotees, leading to scenes of unprecedented protests. There was chaos.

These law and order problems and the sentiments of the protesting women did not sway the court, and when they accepted the review petitions in camera on 13 November, the court did not stay their earlier judgment, which they could have while analysing the situation on the ground. On the contrary, they postponed the hearing of the review petitions to 22 January, which is after the Sabarimala season is over. They explicitly said there was no stay on the 28 September ruling. In other words, they were signalling the Kerala government that the latter should go ahead with its plans to bring in women activists, and perhaps that the review petitions would be thrown out.

The impartial observer is forced to ask whether there is a pattern in the Supreme Court’s rulings in the recent past, generally in the wake of dubious PILs. There was the jallikattu ban, the dahihandi ban, the Diwali cracker ban – all of which were based on no scientific evidence, but all of which had the result of demeaning Hindu practices. The impression one gets is that court is simply sniping at the Narendra Modi government, possibly with a political agenda. Hindu sentiments are the collateral damage.

Kerala Government

There is a preponderant cause, which is the hostility of successive Kerala governments towards Hindus (and only Hindus) and in particular against the Sabarimala temple. Let us recall how in the 1950’s, the temple (which was then seldom visited) was set on fire by Christians seeking to grab the forest around it. The response of C Kesavan, the then-CM and Congress leader, was instructive: “Good. One more house of superstition burned down”.

Successive Congress and communist governments have continued their step-motherly treatment of the temple. It became a cash cow for them, as the number of pilgrims grew exponentially in the 1980s and later, now reaching some 40 million a year, quite possibly the largest pilgrimage in the world. The governments simply siphoned off the entire revenue of donations by the faithful. And they did nothing to whatsoever improve the facilities.

It is unbelievable how much has been looted from pilgrims – hundreds of crores per year – without a paisa being spent on improving amenities for them. There is absolutely no organisation unlike in Tirupati: pilgrims are not able to purchase passes to enter at a given time and many end up spending 10-12 hours waiting in line for a glimpse of the sanctum; there are far too few toilets and bathrooms; there is not enough shelter from the sun and rain (the November-January season is relatively cold and the northeast monsoon is active).

There are feral pigs rooting in the muck, with fierce fangs; the whole area is a mess with mud, pig droppings, plastic, flowers, and human waste. There were photographs of young children sleeping propped up against garbage bins, others sleeping next to rooting pigs. These are people who have come from far and near, after 41 days of penance, have been overcharged for everything, been forced to walk 20 kilometres from the Nilakkal station to Pamba, then climb steep hills for 4-5 km to arrive at the sanctum. Only in India are pilgrims treated with such contempt.

And indeed, the temple area has exceeded its carrying capacity because of no investment whatsoever for decades. Frankly, the emotion it induces is not bhakti but bibhatsa: the fortitude of the pilgrims who brave all this is astonishing.

None of this is beyond fixing: but it needs money, and more importantly, will. The money is there: the government commingle pilgrim offerings with government funds. The will is missing. It is ironic that this year, when the Pinarayi Vijayan government wanted to control the crowds for their own purposes, they have been able to create some kind of system of reducing the crush at the Sannidhanam. Why couldn’t they do crowd-control all these years?

It’s not just the communists who are hostile, but so are their alter-egos, the Congress. In Kerala, the Congress reflects Christian interests, which include the conversion of Western Ghats forest land to privately-owned Christian assets, especially plantations and resorts. There was the instance where the previous Congress chief minister said that he didn’t support a proposed rail link to Sabarimala because it would mean the loss of Christian land for the project!

The actions of the Kerala government after 17 November, when the shrine reopened for the season, have been nothing short of extraordinary. They ordered the police to wear their boots in the Sannidhanam, hitherto a holy area around the sanctum sanctorum; there were startling photos of the police drying their raincoats on a clothesline erected just in front of the sanctum sanctorum. A Section 144 prohibitory order was issued, which forced all pilgrims to vacate the waiting sheds. They hosed down the entire area so that nobody could lay down a sheet and lie down.

Furthermore, in an act that could only have been intended to provoke, there were photographs of policemen standing on the hitherto sacrosanct 18 steps, with their back to the deity, hosing down the surroundings. So far as I know, the only person who had ever been entitled to climb the steps without the traditional irumudi is the officiating tantri. These are startling violations of tradition.

They started arresting pilgrims who had come after all the traditional penances: firebrand Hindu Aikya Vedi leader Sasikala teacher, Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) candidate for MLA Surendran. Many pilgrims were arrested and summarily removed, their sentiments ignored. At least one pilgrim has been reportedly injured when police kicked him. The pilgrims who were merely chanting Ayyappa stuthis were set upon by the police.

On the other hand, a local airport was turned into a sea of khakhi to protect a known rabble-rouser woman who had arrived from Mumbai. There was no question where the government’s sympathies lay. Meanwhile, they are treating pilgrims as criminals and terrorists (a communist minister, with a Christian name, actually called the pilgrims, terrorists).

This has all the signs of a simple agenda: desacralisation of the shrine. The Kerala government is planning to remove all sanctity, violate every rule there, and reduce it to an object no longer of reverence, but of disdain. It is as though they would like to turn the temple into an empty shell, devoid of sacredness, and kill off this religious tradition and pilgrimage. It is like a medieval attack of one religion on another: pious communists want to wipe out Hindus.

That would be quite natural for a communist government to do, but it is also a violation of the fundamental right to worship unmolested. The fact is that there appears to be no appeal against this assault: there is nobody the distressed pilgrims can turn to for help, as the courts are hostile. In these circumstances, it is quite possible that a few agents provocateurs can come into the picture. The idea may be to create a Bluestar-like situation, with violence used as an excuse for physically destroying the shrine using, possibly, military equipment.

I have never seen a religious shrine treated with such contempt as Sabarimala. It is unbelievable in a democratic country. The entire might of the state has been brought to bear against an old temple, with its pious, unarmed, peaceable pilgrims being treated inhumanely. It is clear that the Kerala government will stop at nothing to force the entry of young women into the temple, come what may. Their contempt for the Hindu citizens of Kerala, who are protesting peacefully against unjust laws, much like Gandhi did salt Satyagraha, could not be clearer. The words 'apartheid' and 'pogrom' spring to mind.

Rajeev Srinivasan focuses on strategy and innovation, which he worked on at Bell Labs and in Silicon Valley. He has taught innovation at several IIMs. An IIT Madras and Stanford Business School grad, he has also been a conservative columnist for twenty year

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby SaiK » 21 Nov 2018 19:46

This is abject

Is this the same SP ??? https://t.co/zPs7aEuvAr
This SP insulted @PonnaarrBJP, a Union Minister and a politician universally respected by all of us by appearing to imitate Ponnar's english and also asking him if he will take responsibility for traffic blocks.

Clear violation of service rules. https://t.co/YoqMYyBzpH



He beat us! How 7-yr-old stunned Yathish Chandra IPS at rights panel hearing......

Image
https://english.mathrubhumi.com/news/ke ... -1.2154999



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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Karthik S » 21 Nov 2018 21:21

Wish we have Bal Thackeray now.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 21 Nov 2018 23:26

Why don't they take this Y..C to the Sannidhanam and claim victory for having brought an under-50 wimmens? He seems female enough.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 22 Nov 2018 02:53

https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/why-imp ... la-1951153

The Kerala High Court today asked the state government to explain why it had imposed restrictions on the Sabarimala shrine and its surrounding areas, and directed the Pathanamthitta district magistrate to produce documents detailing the reasons that prompted such an action.

The High Court also asked the authorities to allow groups of people to enter the Ayyappa temple, and wondered how the police was able to differentiate between protesters and actual devotees. There was nothing wrong in raising the "Swamiye Sharanam Ayyappa" chant, it held.

while hearing three petitions against alleged excesses committed by the police in their attempts to enforce restrictions in the area ever since the temple reopened on November 16. As many as 69 people were arrested for alleged violations on Monday.

while hearing three petitions against alleged excesses committed by the police in their attempts to enforce restrictions in the area ever since the temple reopened on November 16. As many as 69 people were arrested for alleged violations on Monday.

The hearing in the case has been adjourned to next week.


WHY? Do these Hizzoners ever actually DO anything?

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 22 Nov 2018 02:57

Getting warmer under Yatish C's musharraf

Pon Radhakrishnan had gone to Sabarimala's Nilackal base to offer prayers and assess facilities
Nilackal (Kerala):
The Bharatiya Janata Party wants the Superintendent of Police Yathish Chandra suspended for his alleged rude behaviour with Union Minister of State for Finance and Shipping Pon Radhakrishnan when he came to pay his obeisance at the Sabarimala temple on Wednesday.
Kerala BJP General Secretary AN Radhakrishnan told reporters that they would take up the matter with the State Police chief.
"Yesterday, we all saw the way this person Chandra was standing with folded hands before the Leader of Opposition Ramesh Chennithala and today he was speaking with his sunglasses on and with utmost arrogance (with Pon Radhakrishnan).
"We wish to know if he behaved rudely because our Minister is dark-complexioned, while he and Chennithala are fair and handsome," Mr Radhakrishnan who was present with the Minister, said.
The Minister arrived at the Nilackal base camp to offer prayers and assess the facilities. When Chandra came before him, the Minister asked him why private vehicles were not allowed towards Pamba.
Mr Chandra said that there was a parking problem, but if he (the Minister) gave the orders, it could be done.
But Mr Radhakrishnan said that he could not give any such order.
"Sir, this is the problem. No one is ready to take any responsibilities," said Mr Chandra.
Upon hearing this, the Minister lost his cool and asked Mr Chandra not to 'show off' and he should not forget that he was misbehaving with a Union Minister.
"Chandra behaved with absolute contempt and arrogance and he has got this from Chief Minister Pinarayi Vijayan, who is his boss. But, we are not going to leave him. We will take this indiscipline with both the state government and the Centre," said Mr Radhakrishnan.
When Mr Chandra later said that the Minister's car could proceed to Pamba as he came under the VIP category, Mr Radhakrishnan refused, and instead travelled by the state-owned bus along with other pilgrims.
"I have been here many times but am experiencing something like this for the first time," said the Minister.
The state unit of the BJP is upset with Mr Chandra because BJP General Secretary K Surendran, Hindu Iyakvedi President and senior BJP leader KP Sasikala and others were arrested by a team led by the young police officer last week for breaking the police guidelines at Sabarimala.


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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 22 Nov 2018 06:51

b careful. Buggers are monitoring and getting nastier as they get more frustrated. OTOH, after watching Y. Chandra's predicament I have lost all ambition to become a KL Polis. The guy shows several features.
1. The guy has a complex because he has the looks of a 13-year old fat boy with specs, in a rowdy playground.
2. So he swaggers and goes around with a smirk and RayBans.
3. He would be a smash hit as the swaggering GESTAPO Major in the Alistair McLean movies.
4. The TN-Central Mantri came there "loaded for bear": HE was the arrogant bully trying his best to provoke anything from the polis.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Dileep » 22 Nov 2018 07:56

The 'prohibitory order' will expire today. I don't think it will be reinstated.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 22 Nov 2018 08:24

Right now guvrmand is in damage control mode and TDB is squealing. Chances are that no under-50 bibis are going to make the trek THIS season. Unfortunately that will destroy the attention span and interest of most yindoo Faithfools before the really important job of breaking the commie-paki-ej hold on TDB is done. So attention should be on permanent solutions. TDB must forfeit the trust of the ppl.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Yagnasri » 22 Nov 2018 09:26

UlanBatori wrote: Unfortunately that will destroy the attention span and interest of most yindoo Faithfools before the really important job of breaking the commie-paki-ej hold on TDB is done. So attention should be on permanent solutions.


Agreed. But this has resulted in people seeing the true status of Hindus in KL and India. Now whenever they see a politico going to Ifthar khana and wears a skull cap or hobnob with Bishops etc they will automatically remember how it was and is for Hindus and how they are treated by the same politicos. From now inwards so called secularism will be under massive and critical examination in the south India like never before..

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby abhijitm » 22 Nov 2018 10:33

UlanBatori wrote:WHY? Do these Hizzoners ever actually DO anything?

If you arrest naxals then it becomes an imp issue. Any delay delays them getting bail.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Sachin » 22 Nov 2018 11:31

Updates at 1124Hrs 22/11/2018.

Pilgrimage goes on with less foot-fall, and now GoKL and TDB praying for more devotees to come (and give them more money). A lot of people have mellowed down after the tongue lashing given by the Kerala High Court to the advocate general and the IGP who is now in charge of Sabari Mala bandobust.

Sabarimala pilgrims must not be troubled: HC. The court first asked the advocate general why the instructions given to him was not passed back to the police and why it was not implemented. He can now give a detailed reply by Friday. The court had taken cognizance of a report which said around 100+ pilgrims from Maharashtra had to go back because of the police imposed restrictions at the shrine, and sought an explanation from the IGP.

The IGP submitted that such measures had to be put in place to provide safety to the pilgrims. He submitted that when the temple opened for the Chithira Atta vilakku there were L&O problems at the temple. He said there were inputs about "possible conflicts" at the hill temple and had to impose such restrictions. The High Court then gave an interim order that real devotees/pilgrims should NOT be harassed. How ever the police has now landed up in a messy situation as there is no way to identify a real and protesting pilgrim. A "real pilgrim" may also become a "protesting pilgrim" if he finds his faith being challenged. The High Court also asked a very scathing question; do the IPS-wallahs know Malayalam and why chanting Ayyappa hymns were taken as an offence.

Mean while Police block union minister’s escort vehicle; tender apology. The same news portal's Malayalam edition says that police did not apologize, but only gave a "vehicle check report". Pon Radhakrishnan made the pilgrimage as a devotee; and he seems to be a very matured man. To be frank, if BJP wanted to cause some disruption by challenging the police, that did NOT happen through Pon Radhakrishnan. How ever the police interaction with him, did led to protest in Kanyakumari-Kerala border; a minor indication that GoKL should not think they are an independent entity.

TDB hopes for a positive SC decision on plea. All the while completely hiding the fact it is they and GoKL who messed up this temple completely :(.

And there is public resentment against the young women who try to act smart to prove a point. News like Criminals attack house of woman who planned to visit Sabarimala. & Woman blocked at Ponkunnam suspecting Sabarimala visit.; all indicate a complete mistrust in the intentions of GoKL and faith in the state machinery. From the Sabari Mala discussions on social media I could also sense a complete polarisation of Kerala people on religious lines on this issue. The biggest fans of police action at Sabari Mala are non-Hindus, and the people most hostile to it are Hindus. The religious divide can now be very clearly felt.

The restrictions at Sabari Mala are also now getting lifted and even night time travel/climb is now being permitted by the police. And I did see lots of sharing of information happening on Sabari Mala and its unique religious traditions in social media. That is cutting across state & country boundaries. And hope that this also sensitise people from other parts of India on why Sabari Mala is Sabari Mala (and not a "public place" like a bar or bus stand).

Dileep wrote:The 'prohibitory order' will expire today. I don't think it will be reinstated.

Most likely yes. The "prohibitory order" has done more harm than good. Congress-wallahs have approached the governor, and the state police will have to submit a detailed report in High Court tomorrow.

UlanBatori wrote:WHY? Do these Hizzoners ever actually DO anything?

The 69 people who were sent on judicial remand have all been granted bail yesterday (21/11/2018) late evening. The cases would remain, but the men are out on bail. And they were given a heroes' welcome, which was also shared Live on social media. They all now have an image as martyrs for the cause. Again, this became another stick which the commies gave others to get beaten up with :lol:.

Yagnasri wrote:Agreed. But this has resulted in people seeing the true status of Hindus in KL and India. Now whenever they see a politico going to Ifthar khana and wears a skull cap or hobnob with Bishops etc they will automatically remember how it was and is for Hindus and how they are treated by the same politicos.

If you notice pretty much every political group (other than CPI(M) and the cadre-less CPI) are now pro-Hindu in the case of Sabari Mala. Being political bodies they may *not* be able to take a strong stance against the Supreme Court verdict. But all of them have realised that Hindus and their faith systems cannot be ignored. The Kerala Police is now on a damage control mode on social media trying depserately to prove that they are Ayyappa friendly. And polarisation on religious lines is pretty much complete in Kerala. Non-Hindus support the police actions and officials like Yathish Chandra, while Hindus say that police has been playing a partisan role. IPS Officers Associated themselves feel worried that their integrity is questioned; especially due to religion & caste ;).

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Karthik S » 22 Nov 2018 11:49

Sachin wrote:Pilgrimage goes on with less foot-fall, and now GoKL and TDB praying for more devotees to come (and give them more money).


So can we assume that GoKL won't be escorting more women in the bracket? Have they realized it can't be done now? Because praying for more devotees means more difficult to escort women.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby chetak » 22 Nov 2018 13:24

See linked video


Lilly Mary Pinto @LillyMaryPinto Nov 18

This is not Kerala.
#TruptiDesai feels the heat in Pune Airport too.
#SaveSabarimalaTradition


https://twitter.com/LillyMaryPinto/status/1064067065424818182

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Sachin » 22 Nov 2018 13:52

Karthik S wrote:So can we assume that GoKL won't be escorting more women in the bracket? Have they realized it can't be done now? Because praying for more devotees means more difficult to escort women.

Standard disclaimer: The pilgrims needs to understand the belief system at Sabari Mala themselves, and plan for eventualities. GoKL has now realised that a near-riot situation is now prevalent in Kerala. As I said vigilante squads are now active on the streets. The CPI(M) also has changed the tactic, that they are not going aggressive in Sabari Mala, but trying to show all this as minor events in the CPI(M)'s attempt to "reform" the state. The CPI(M) is now scouting for Renaissance group to spread the (anti)Sabari Mala message around.

Came back to say: As per this online portal in Malayalam, police plans to book three BJP & RSS leaders under Sec. 120B IPC (Criminal conspiracy). And for their bail; put a condition that they would not come to Sabari Mala for the next 2 months. Surendran (of BJP), VV Rajesh & Valsan Thillankery (of RSS) are the three leaders, who the police have identified as dangerous and daring to openly defy the police. So it is not yet time to say that the police and GoKL will sit quite. And this would also be a real test for the Sangh's second line of leadership. BJP leaders like Sreedharan Pillai will not be able to do much.

With pretty much all restrictions lifted at Sabari Mala, the pilgrim inflow should increase. And more the number of people, more would be practical difficulties to take up women. Police last said that around 1000 odd women have registered, and some of them could be people above the age bracket also. 4 in the list of 1000 had decided to scoot from the scene, once they knew that their goose was cooked. So there could be many more similar cases in the remaining list as well.

The Rehna Fatima incident and the last time's siege of Sannidhanam have kind of made the police realise that their manouverability (and scope of work) is limited in the hill temple. And with the Travancore Devaswom Board also filing a petition requesting a stay; the GoKL and K.P have reasons to now pull out. Unofficially they have resorted to last year's practice. WPCs are checking the ages of women; and "appraising" them of the situation.The media also may go hand in hand with GoKL and do NOT report incidents of women being turned away by the police.

What now needs a constant push to ensure that GoKL and TDB ensures a smooth pilgrimage; by providing at least bare comfortable places to camp and some clean toilets etc. The BJP has done a good job in spreading on social media, the actual situation on the ground. Pilgrims have really nothing comfortable, and this year's pilgrimage is becoming harrowing experience (especially to young children, who may even refuse to come here further) :(.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby chetak » 22 Nov 2018 13:53

The most circulated image on twitter and whatsapp



Image

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Sachin » 22 Nov 2018 14:05

chetak wrote:The most circulated image on twitter and whatsapp

The 2017 image can be really used for a "spot a cop" contest ;). And 2018 picture can be used for "Identify the Sabari Mala pilgrim" game as well :(.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby SaiK » 22 Nov 2018 18:29

#SaveSabarimalaTradition Oh God! This is totally disastrous. 110 Devotees from #Mumbai including Women and Children return back without going #Sabarimala. These Malikappurams come all the way with Vratam only to go back. Curse be on this Pinarayi Government
Part 2 of Video https://t.co/CVgMuxKr6A


This ia what #ShariahCollegium wanted. No PIL no SHILL nothing from Hindus. I honestly say Hindus are the weakest dumbos on the planet at large. (Collective Wisdom Speak)

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 22 Nov 2018 18:55

chetak wrote:The most circulated image on twitter and whatsapp
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dsg5QqlWoAAghU3.jpg:large

Classic.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Karthik S » 22 Nov 2018 18:59

Grand ‘Hindu Samajotsav’ In Kasaragod: Yogi Adityanath To Give Clarion Call Supporting Sabarimala Devotees


https://swarajyamag.com/insta/grand-hin ... AxJ1bZ0m2k

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby UlanBatori » 22 Nov 2018 20:14

The Faithful might want to consider the strategies for a north-south-east-west convergence towards May 2019 and beyond. St. TruptiD has kindly helped by raising awareness in Maharashtra: apparently they have a few kind memories of her efforts re: MH temples.
I have adopted the Prophet Rehana Fatima as my (never mind): did a wonderful job of putting a face to the commie-paki-ej roots of the scam.
Andhra/Tenagana Hindus we hope will be both irritated by KL Marx-Mullah-Missionary-Macaulay gang, and may choose to relate to their own plight.
Field Marshal YC has kindly got publicity for the issue in TN.

We believe there are friendly ppl in Manipur etc, need to increase efforts in Assom/Tripura/Mizoram/Naga territory.
The North Sentinelese have shown themselves to be true Bharatavarsha patriots. So we hope will tribal ppl all over: say MP/Chattisgarh/Jharkhand.
Bihar is Bihar. I have no clue what they think there. Same of Bengal, Mother of Ramakrishna and Vivekananda.

But at least in MH, people are pointing to the independent-minded (in Mongolia we may call it something else) Malloo and their kind attitude towards #ShariahCollegium (I love that term). Inspiring, apparently.
Rajeev Srinivasan has pushed all the right buttons on that, carefully treading the narrow path.

Remember that KP are an extremely depressed lot: IIRC as recently as this summer there was lots of noise about this problem. Caught between the Criminal Mantri who is the Polis Mantri, and their goon gangs and the taxpayers.

Perhaps that is the other aspect of the strategic campaign needed: the Kerala Polis NEED "Vimochanam". Think PV getting the prone massage inside a real Polis Van (the dark blue things with few, and anti-stone-grilled) windows, not these commandeered KSRTC buses).

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Dileep » 23 Nov 2018 07:03

The prohibitory order is extended by four days by the clueless collector. Let us see what the HC has to say about it today.

The footfalls have increased slightly it seems.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Sachin » 23 Nov 2018 11:39

Updates 23/11/2018 1130Hrs

Pilgrim foot fall seems to be still low, as the restrictions have been found too inconveniencing for the pilgrims. The Travancore Devaswom Board is now in a whining mode as donations have dried up :lol:. The TDB president is said to have made an appeal that lack of donations would mess up the lives of 12000 Hindu families (i.e taff of TDB). Their stock of the Prasadam items are still lying there; and being food items they would soon cross their expiry dates.There should be a campaign to sensitise pilgrims on the expiry date as well.

The police seems to have been given a free hand, and even High Court interim orders seems to be getting flouted. Cases have been slapped against pilgrims who conducted a Ayyappa mantra chanting session yesterday evening at the hill temple. These sessions are all considered to be protests; some thing which Cr.PC Sec 144 allows as "discretion" of the police officer on the spot. Sec 144 Cr.PC has been extended at the hill temple for another four days, and police actually recommended its extension till the end of this pilgrim season :roll:. Kerala High Court is to hear many petitions regarding Sabari Mala today.

Yathish Chandra IPS, the SP who had an stand-off with Lok Sabha MP Pon Radhakrishnan most likely would NOT face any punitive action from GoKL. Central agencies are said to have given their adverse report against the officer, citing his past handling of isues and adverse remarks from the courts. The BJP says that they & the MP have given complaints to the central government as well. But GoKL may would try not to go hard on this officer, not because of the love for him or the police force; but at the present moment GoKL does not want to antagonize the force or bring down their morale. As per the "online news portal", lots of IPS officers have also started evading Sabari Mala duty, some even citing "training & courses" to attend.

DGP to submit affidavit in Kerala HC on Sabarimala restrictions.; and today's hearing at Kerala High Court is going to be crucial for every one around. Governor seeks answers from CM on Sabarimala.; which again does not really mean any thing. The governor has not hinted on reporting any thing to the central government.

SaiK wrote:This ia what #ShariahCollegium wanted. No PIL no SHILL nothing from Hindus. I honestly say Hindus are the weakest dumbos on the planet at large. (Collective Wisdom Speak)

I was surprised that the pilgrims who could not take the darshan just walked away. They did not even consider the wastage of efforts and money :(. Not even a single case has been filed against TDB and GoKL for "hurting religious sentiments". GoKL seems to be just getting away with one section of Cr.PC (Sec 144). The peacefool M.F Hussein finally ran way from the country only due to one reason; multiple court cases all over India.

Dileep wrote:The prohibitory order is extended by four days by the clueless collector. Let us see what the HC has to say about it today.

The district administration & police have found the easy way out. That is blatant mis-use of Sec. 144 Cr.PC. That makes life simpler especially for the police. The GoKL and TDB is any way only interested in donation money.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Sachin » 23 Nov 2018 11:49

Let us not forget the main reason for the creation of this thread. Kerala Floods. Due to the Sabari Mala fiasco, a lot many things about the floods are actually getting side lined; which was another agenda of GoKL.

Kerala floods: Environmentalist Gadgil says it is also a man-made disaster. This was on Aug 20,2018.
Kerala Govt was ‘Very ill-Prepared’ to Handle Kerala Floods, Ignored Safety Regulations: JNU Researchers. Please make special note on who are the researchers. Commies from JNU themselves. And even they had to say - "government has been very ill-prepared to encounter a disaster. Dam safety regulations assisted by flood inundation maps and early action plan were ignored. The O&M Manuals of 61 completed dams were not prepared. Such a casual handling of people’s lives and an irresponsible release of water led to devastating deluge."

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Sachin » 23 Nov 2018 16:03

Big dip in the revenue from Sabari Mala. First six days sees a loss of 14.34 crores! (Malayala Manorama - Malayalam)

During the pilgrimage season last time by yesterday's date (i.e 22/11/2017) TDB and GoKL had managed to extract Rs. 22.82 crores from the pilgrims. This time as of yesterday (22/11/2018) after the latest "progressive actions" the revenue has come to 8.48 crores. The Travancore Devaswom Board has told its employees to maintain complete silence on the revenue inflow.

Perhaps a "scorched earth" policy may also work at Sabari Mala. There was a time (and that is not really long back; perhaps around 90 years back) when this pilgrimage only was done by the really devoted pilgrims. And as a friend of mine (a priest who has some connections with the temple) said; Lord Ayyappa was still there at Sabari Mala when the temple was in a dense forest and on a hill top. And HE would still be there if the present Sabari Mala goes back to the very same condition. Now who would be affected by Sabari Mala going back to the Sabari Mala of the old;
1. GoKL who has been using this temple as a "cash cow".
2. Lots of local business folks (majority non-Hindus) who also latched on to the cash cow, and considered the temple as a revenue source.
3. Feminazis and other attention seekers who only tried their stunts here; because of their urge to prove a point.

Remove all these groups of people, Lord Ayyappa can still be at the hill temple (perhaps enjoying it more). The chief priest and royal family would any have to do the rituals; just like the way they were doing it for the last 200+ years.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby hnair » 23 Nov 2018 16:07

Substitute Alex Chau with Supreme Court/Kerala Govt and Sentinelese with Ayyappas, we got a parallel situation, where a western-influenced bunch of people believe they have the right and authority to impose their ideas on a native belief system (be it "leave us alone!" or "swamiye sharanam ayyappa")

All based on a few words written by other men

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby hnair » 23 Nov 2018 16:16

Yagnasri wrote:Agreed. But this has resulted in people seeing the true status of Hindus in KL and India. Now whenever they see a politico going to Ifthar khana and wears a skull cap or hobnob with Bishops etc they will automatically remember how it was and is for Hindus and how they are treated by the same politicos. From now inwards so called secularism will be under massive and critical examination in the south India like never before..


This condescending type of "I feel pity for the Kerala Hindus" has been a thing with BRF poster after poster, over years. Doubtless fed on stories of the preponderance of "secularism" in Kerala. My posit has been that by showing Kerala Hindus are obedient and got subdued by secularism is good PR for the national secularists. "Kerala Model" is an offshoot to explain the HDI etc, which had its really high base thanks to Maharajas who ruled the place, not lefties or secularists.

I have posted very vigorously against this over years in BRF, since I do work among various milieu around here and never found the Kerala Hindu to be anything less than militantly defiant about their beliefs. The devout Kerala Hindu was never a victim as you want the world to believe by your post.

The Kerala Hindu really dont need this kind of pity - the ayyapas fought and fought well this time, which as a side effect, diminished even something hailed as undiminishable by all anglophones of India, the "Supreme" in Supreme Court. The Kerala Hindu wants you, to come join on the ground, if you can. If not possible, at least change this attitude of pity, which we really dont want!

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Karthik S » 23 Nov 2018 16:24

hnair wrote:the ayyapas fought and fought well this time


Calling it a 'fight' is bit of a tall claim.

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby hnair » 23 Nov 2018 16:26

Karthik S wrote:Calling it a 'fight' is bit of a tall claim.


yes, if you meant there was a lack of AK47s and deaths\

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Re: Kerala Floods - Aftermath and Save Sabarimala

Postby Karthik S » 23 Nov 2018 16:34

hnair wrote:
Karthik S wrote:Calling it a 'fight' is bit of a tall claim.


yes, if you meant there was a lack of AK47s and deaths\


Not talking about AKs etc. Let me put it this way, what's the end result of the fight? We won or we lost? Try to recall defense and offensive defense talk of Doval. The other side has to get victory just once and then all this 'fight' you mention will mean nothing, even if we have defended 100 times, PV has to sit back and keep trying to get lucky once. Right now it may just be a matter of time before PV gets what he wants. What 'fight' is being taken to him so that he'll think twice thrice before trying his stunts again is what matters?


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