Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

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ArjunPandit
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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ArjunPandit » 28 Feb 2019 03:31

...

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Ramu » 28 Feb 2019 08:19

We should shutdown pak airspace for a week till it hands over our pilot. Their h&d should fight against their own economy.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby UlanBatori » 28 Feb 2019 08:34

ArjunPandit wrote:seems like paki armymen are bored up with protecting chinese and fighting jihadis. They are up to fight evil yindoos, perhaps in sialkot sector. Are they not going for akhnoor this time around?

There were reports of heavy firing around Chaamb (the traditional armored thrust place) and Akhnoor. This is it: this time NaMo, I hope, orders that never again must we have to defend Chaamb, Akhnoor, Uri, Poonch: The LOC if any should be at the Indus. Sialkot should be in India, and so must Lahore.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Singha » 28 Feb 2019 09:16

PM "leaving it to the forces" is a good move. the forces are above political criticism and are not on twitter or parliament. anyone criticising those who keep their fat bottoms safe looks bad. and forces can decide their own manner and timelines - they have so many plans.

meantime, the PM can just keep a silence indicating his displeasure and let the Pakis sweat and chase shadows and burn up POL marching their tanks all over sialkot bazaar , bahawalpur and holding parades of bandars in the sky.

every night 1 strong indian strike package should take off and "probe" a new area gently before returning. good training for each squadron in co-ordinated attacks murican style. extend this to over the sea also and "probe" gwader, ormara, pasni. this can go on indefinitely...

mysterious cartons and pkgs marked for baluch freedom fighters should be found in makran highway. tauba tauba we did not do it, as all your PAF are in look east and alert 2min scramble mode. who did it? how?

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby syam » 28 Feb 2019 09:22

I wrote this few days back to post in future Indo-pak war strategies thread, but didn't do it. I really didn't expect Pakis to attack our military like that. Guess I am wrong. Here it goes,
I will start with geography. Pak has total 5.5 critical points on their map. How to deal with each of them,

1. Punjab+Jammu -> Air strikes and missiles
2. Karachi -> Naval blockade
3. Free Baluchistan -> Possible air strikes and arming local freedom fighters
4. Afghania -> Emergency exit for those who want to leave pakistan
5. PoK -> Heavy deployment of troops and holding the lands.
5.5 CPEC road -> We should destroy these roads completely.

That's on paper. Behind the scenes, our primary targets should be their secret bases and nuke facilities. We should show absolutely no mercy on any of their terror camps. This is golden opportunity to dismantle their whole terror network.

I bet everyone has similar strategy in their minds. What I would like stress on is- perception management. We seriously lack the basic propaganda machinery to amplify our strategic gains. My plan for pr,

w.r.t Kashmir - Capture existing media there and hammer down the brutal defeat of pakis into their deepest parts of mind. It will help us in long run.
w.r.t Indian pakis - Isolate every pro-paki agent. Don't feed any life to their networks. I would suggest GoI to avoid those journos completely and use DD and friendly media.


I am really happy with GoI so far. They did good with media too.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby UlanBatori » 28 Feb 2019 09:36

Sink a dhow off Karachi and Lloyd's will hike insurance sky-high for Paki-bound or Pak-export shipping. I would LIKE a total blockade of Karachi followed by demolition of the roads and rail from Gwadar, but that may be too steep yet.

Let them bring fuel for PA and PAF along Karakoram or Khyber or Bolan: a few Raaa agints in the mountains can repay the Kargil NH-1 antics and shut those down too.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby williams » 28 Feb 2019 10:37

I think India has the license to do anything now. Why just leave the airspace closed? Why not conduct some SEAD missions? We have Bramos. hit them from air, sea, and land. Once the radars and ground control stations are taken out, our boys will dominate their airspace.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby sanjaykumar » 28 Feb 2019 10:44

No action overnight other than the usual Poonch barrages. Oh well, I think deals are being offered and GOI is asking for guarantees. To ensure eagerness the IN can think of something creative, I am sure.

A good sign is that Pakistan airspace remains closed.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby yensoy » 28 Feb 2019 10:52

I think international pressure will prevent us from going after pakis militarily, notwithstanding all that has happened.

However we can still go after terrorist targets. JEM HQ in Bahawalpur is like a fat cat staring at us, and I am sure there are others. We can even participate in strikes on Tullybunny targets flying in with the coalition from Afg. It's clear international powers including China are sick of this aspect of the pakis (they don't yet understand that this is the only aspect of the pakis), so a repeat action like we did will not be criticized.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby sanjaykumar » 28 Feb 2019 10:58

Yes. I am sure India has received congratulatory messages from every country that has had troops in Afghanistan. Or at least their militaries.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Aditya_V » 28 Feb 2019 11:10

PA Amassed on the border is a tempting target, attack with stand off weapons, draw the PAF in and this time fire IRST shots from SU 30 Mig 29, Upgrade M 2000 within our borders and have a few of thier aircraft crash in our territory

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Singha » 28 Feb 2019 11:45

Pompeo ji has waved off pak complaints with a apathetic wave saying "these are anti terrorist activities" ... same as done 1000s of times on afpak front. Jaitley cleverly slid in behind him for a bvr shot 'musing' why can't india do a zero dark 30?

so we have clearly separated the terror targets for prosecution as we wish with zero international fallout.

the bar has been raised. and paks space compressed.

capturing our pilot is the monkey trap . the issue will not close now and we can claim they dropped bombs on military targets ... else the indian public with a short memory was primed to declare a "victory" and go home to T20 mode.

ab to maamla jari rahega.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Cain Marko » 28 Feb 2019 12:18

Why not give an ultimatum for pilots release. Do it with 24 hours or else.... If tsp turns over it will mean that it does as master bids... If not downing a couple of erieyes and solahs would go down well

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby pankajs » 28 Feb 2019 12:23

They have to follow the Geneva convention so let that be. The bakis will be bakis ultimatum or not. So either he will be returned unharmed or not.

OTOH, we have already called the last PAF raid as a military aggression. No further justification is required if we have a mind to attack.

We must not create more clutter with more IF ...ELSE .. BUT. Keep the path simple and clean.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Cain Marko » 28 Feb 2019 12:38

Wonder what they've got going as the next escalation. I think a brahmos strike is likely considering air war is likely to get too messy. Don't want even one more pilot in those napaki claws.

Plus there is no defence not any answer to it. It maybe a kh series strike from across the border.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby pankajs » 28 Feb 2019 13:01

An Air strike like the one on balakot would be spectacular within the next 2 weeks IF it can be pulled off without too much of a risk. We must seek such opportunities.

Otherwise, Brahmos is there for pinpointed strike form a distance.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ramana » 01 Mar 2019 02:48

UB I used to study how FSU collapsed. The key event was the hardliner coup against Gorbachev. And they coup leaders realised how bankrupt the whole system was and gave up.
To mirror that in TSP I sued to wonder if there would be coup by Jihadis to seize the nukes. This was the US NPA thinking.
I lately realized its the jihadis who have the nukes and hence would not launch a coup for power as they have the power. All the US nonsense about proximate security, PALS etc are just nonsense to fool gullible Indians.
So if there wont be a coup what will it be?
To the TSPA attacking India is almost a coup and if it fails it leads to its won consequences.
Pulwama attack is the jihadi attack and Indian retalation is the failure o the attack.
And attack on balakot witht eh SPICE 2k has tis own message.
Interesting the KSA thinks the same and took away the atmi takhat.

In essence KSA gave 3T (Allah, Mohammed (bin Salman), and atmi takhat) to TSP.
We are seeing the endgame right before our eyes.
The TSPA losing confidence of PAF armed with latest US weapons F-16s/AMRAAM and failing is a sign.
We saw much middle class anger at non-performance of FizzleYa after Balakot raid, and now Rajouri attack is the mango loss of confidence.

Last night PN did not sleep fearing that Commodore Babaruvahan Yadav nephews will come calling at Kranchi.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby vijayk » 01 Mar 2019 05:40

ramana wrote:UB I used to study how FSU collapsed. The key event was the hardliner coup against Gorbachev. And they coup leaders realised how bankrupt the whole system was and gave up.
To mirror that in TSP I sued to wonder if there would be coup by Jihadis to seize the nukes. This was the US NPA thinking.
I lately realized its the jihadis who have the nukes and hence would not launch a coup for power as they have the power. All the US nonsense about proximate security, PALS etc are just nonsense to fool gullible Indians.
So if there wont be a coup what will it be?
To the TSPA attacking India is almost a coup and if it fails it leads to its won consequences.
Pulwama attack is the jihadi attack and Indian retalation is the failure o the attack.
And attack on balakot witht eh SPICE 2k has tis own message.
Interesting the KSA thinks the same and took away the atmi takhat.

In essence KSA gave 3T (Allah, Mohammed (bin Salman), and atmi takhat) to TSP.
We are seeing the endgame right before our eyes.
The TSPA losing confidence of PAF armed with latest US weapons F-16s/AMRAAM and failing is a sign.
We saw much middle class anger at non-performance of FizzleYa after Balakot raid, and now Rajouri attack is the mango loss of confidence.

Last night PN did not sleep fearing that Commodore Babaruvahan Yadav nephews will come calling at Kranchi.


are you saying Saudis took away weapons

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ArjunPandit » 01 Mar 2019 06:35

somehow believe balakot saga hasnt ended

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ArjunPandit » 01 Mar 2019 08:02

UlanBatori wrote:Sink a dhow off Karachi and Lloyd's will hike insurance sky-high for Paki-bound or Pak-export shipping. I would LIKE a total blockade of Karachi followed by demolition of the roads and rail from Gwadar, but that may be too steep yet.

I am very intrigued by the geography of balochistan today. My little bit of time study on google maps makes me wonder is it a desolate sand mountain kind of area. I am reminded of Ladakh kind of terrain. Wondering if we need to have an indigenous engine for Arjun

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ArjunPandit » 01 Mar 2019 08:04

or may be perhaps something light, fast, but that does not break that much in sandy environment.
PS: I bumped into this
https://cmsdata.iucn.org/downloads/cc_a ... _study.pdf
Havent gone through it line by line. But makes few things very clear
1. Uneven terrain
2. Lack of vegetation water all through out
3. Limited motorable roads
4. Heights at select places
I wonder what could work best to capture this
1. Helicopter, fast, can subdue pakis, if they're to be found there. Require less water. But very expensive, esp for a solution like Chinook/Apache
2. Mechanised infantry: insertion and support very expensive, both fuel adn food/water scarce
3. Infantry: will anyways be required for BoG, but then how to support the logistics. Trucks.
to me the problem is similar to the tibet area. Things need to be racheted up over time. Perhaps Chabahar may give us that leewaay. If afghanistan remains out of taliban and is open for chabahar trade, then dont think iranis know what goes out of each box.
The wedge to my eyes seems a grotesque thing, but at the same time geographically seems not completely flat.However, what i found interesting is the kharan desert in the mid west of balochistan.
khayali pulao on, Possibly an armoured strike through there. That can cut the entire northwest wedge in iran. Possibly supported by a pincer through afghanistan. Sometimes i wonder, if kashmir is just a ploy to keep india busy and avoid thinking on these lines.
UBji, want to enlighten us

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ArjunPandit » 01 Mar 2019 08:31


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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ArjunPandit » 01 Mar 2019 08:35

Politics of nationalism, federalism, and separatism: The case
of Balochistan in Pakistan

https://westminsterresearch.westminster ... N_2014.pdf

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby UlanBatori » 01 Mar 2019 09:23

UBji, want to enlighten us

Camels. Too hot for yaks or llamas. Helicopter-borne camel force can control Balochistan in a hurry.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ArjunPandit » 01 Mar 2019 09:34

how many two humped camels can we get from bactria? Would be interesting for the story of camel that was just let in and kicked the baddu out of his own tent

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby UlanBatori » 01 Mar 2019 18:07

I think one camel can comfortably carry an ATGM and a few rounds, plus keeper with AK47, a few grenades etc. Given the highway Trip Times on Google maps (av. 4.5kmph), the camel will comfortably beat that speed, and cut across the countryside.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ArjunPandit » 01 Mar 2019 19:56

Ok i add to the story camel with the ATGM and AK47 who kicked the baddu out of the tent that he forcibly took from the camel owner. It's a good idea, but might not be the "indian" way.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Prem » 03 Mar 2019 07:12

https://www.indiatoday.in/india/story/t ... 2019-03-02
There are 5 types of Pakistan, each requires a different approach: Former NSA Shivshankar Menon :(

He was speaking at the India Today Conclave 2019 in New Delhi on Saturday.Shivshankar Menon, who also served as India's foreign secretary, said India can't have just focus on only one approach-military, diplomatic or economic."In my view, there are at least Pakistan that exist. They are: the civil society, Pakistan's business community, civilian politicians, the Pakistan military and the Jihadi elements. We do not have any problem with the first three. The problem rests with the remaining two."Menon said India cannot have one policy to engage with all of them. "If you have just one policy for all, you end up throwing the first three into the arms of the other two," he said.Asked about the options that India has in the aftermath of the Pulwama terror attack and the airstrikes in Balakot, Pakistan by the Indian Air Force, Shivshankar Menon said, "What you do next depends on what you want. Military or diplomacy alone can't work." He said the leadership has to be clear whether it wants to change Pakistan's behaviour, degrade terror groups like Jaish-e-Mohammed and Lashkar or win an election."Unless we have clarity on what we want to do, we can't decide the options and not much will change," he said.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Philip » 03 Mar 2019 09:57

The goal of the Pakis with their latest round of terror outrage and obvious Indian response must be analysed in detail.The Q that beggars everyone is why Pak apparently embarked upon this " suicide mission", pun intended?

First, given the scale of attack against the CRPF forces, 44 killed, it was bound to invite a massive Indian response from the GOI led by a tough PM Mr.Modi.
His green light to the armed forces to "do the biz",
has been a massive success and universally welcomed across the country , something that will in the opinion of most analysts pay rich dividends at election time. Why on earth therefore would the Pakis want Modi back to lead India?

The answer is complex but visible.Pak today is in such sh*t economically, that it is running round the globe like
an aging rent-boy begging to be buggered for a few farthings. It's military leaders must survive somehow.They need their cushy life and raisond'etre, required at all times to protect Pak from " Hindusthan".
The first step was to oust sheriff Nawaz and get Capt. Imran the cricketing hero elected as PM.Imran's western connections and background would they hoped swing the ball in Pak's favour in the western corridors of power and halls of filthy lucre like the IMF, etc.

Sadly for Pak there's a new maverick sheriff in town in the US of A, the Donald who has openly abused Pak for its decades of duplicity and wants it to kneel and deliver in AFG. where he wants to withdraw US troops.The Paki/ ISI strategy of hunting with the hounds and hiding with the hare no longer holds good with the Donald. He has cut off the supply of moolah keeping the Paki forces alive, and the flow of money from western banking institutions has dried up.Pak has turned in desperation to its old brother Muslim patrons the Saudis and Gulfies and the Chins.
However, even these entities face serious e
co. problems themselves.The Saudi/ UAE combine over their very expensive war in Yemen and the Chins from theif eco. downturn plus problems with the grand OBOR global venture.

Pak is up the creek without a paddle in a leaky boat heading for a veritable economic Niagra.Therefore, in the minds of its leadership in uniform, its population have to bite the bullet and attention diverted via a crisis created with " Hindu India" to protect the faithful Pakis, while quashing the designs of the kafirs.This crisis they hoped would get the population behind the armed forces , forget their eco woes, and much support from their Muslim brethren and more military and eco. help from China.They also hoped that some small military success could be trumped up as a great victory over Hindusthan.Both the Paki army and Capt.Imran would be hailed as heroes and Pak would survive yet another crisis.

The miscalculation by the Pakis who were expecting a lesser military spanking , perhaps more " surgical strikes", never anticipating deep penetration air attacks into Paki territory beyond POK. They have clearly come off second best in the encounters and lie flat on their backs biting the dust.India and PM Modi have given Pak the " bum's rush".As Pak lies bloodied in the dust, the Q remains whether it will either further rush back into the saloon guns blazing and receive more stick or slink off in the dark, tail between its legs to lick its wounds.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby UlanBatori » 03 Mar 2019 17:45

Prem wrote:https://www.indiatoday.in/india/story/there-are-5-types-of-pakistan-each-requires-a-different-approach-former-nsa-shivshankar-menon-1468797-2019-03-02
There are 5 types of Pakistan, each requires a different approach that he and his ilk have no clue about: Former NSA and present Methane Source Shivshankar Menon :(

The problem rests with the remaining two."Menon said India cannot have one policy to engage with all of them. "If you have just one policy for all, you end up throwing the first three into the arms of the other two," he said.Asked about the options that India has in the aftermath of the Pulwama terror attack and the airstrikes in Balakot, Pakistan by the Indian Air Force, Shivshankar Menon said, "What you do next depends on what you want. Military or diplomacy alone can't work." He said the leadership has to be clear whether it wants to change Pakistan's behaviour, degrade terror groups like Jaish-e-Mohammed and Lashkar or win an election."Unless we have clarity on what we want to do, we can't decide the options and not much will change," he said.


IOW the gasbag has not a ***** clue on what "needs to be done" - except that he needs to quit the methane emission.
This has been GOI "policy" :roll: for the past 35 years:
"If you have just one policy for all, you end up throwing the first three into the arms of the other two,"

The present is to break the arms of the other two, and to heck with anyone who wants to be getting hugged by them.

ShivShankar Menon, sad to say, was an utter failure - except maybe from pov of certain foreign interests.

The other error is the "we have no problems with the rest of them". This is same as Paki claim that they have no problem with Indians - except for 80% that support the government, and the 19.99% who think Pakistan should be wiped out.

To paraphrase the twitter comment on NDTV:
The 99.99% of Pakis who are terrorists/terrorist-lovers have given the other 0.01% a bad name - and bombs coming on their heads

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby UlanBatori » 03 Mar 2019 18:05

Getting back to the EndGame: Time for some Clear Statement of Goals
The EndGame cannot be a Pakistan as it exists today. Some believe that only minor behavioral change by the present entities is worth striving for. We believe that the present entities will not change behavior, and therefore must be removed.
1. Not just the present "government". ANY entity that claims to "govern" all Pakistan.
2. However we cannot have a totally government-less Pakistan next door to India. All sorts of entities such as ISIS would rush to fill the crater.
3. So we argue for Pakistan to be broken into 5 entities, with their own governments: Balochistan, Pakhtoonistan, Balwaristan, Sindh, Pakjab.
4. Each will be prohibited by their neighbors (India and Iran) from ever possessing WMD of any sort. Like in Lebanon, possession of a gun or explosives - or NBC weapons of course - will be grounds for the death penalty.
5. How one can keep Pakjabis from breeding is another issue, but not to be dealt with here. In the long term, the desirable outcome is reforestation of the entire Pakjab as an area for Carbon Sequestration. A sort of Global Forest (like National Forest). To honor the millions killed or maimed or otherwise traumatized by nearly a century of terrorism and hate.

Now that we have "clarity" on the Goal, maybe we can move forward to its swiftest accomplishment.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Karan M » 03 Mar 2019 18:58

I dont care about any of the types of Pakistanis. In fact I dont even care about some types of Indians, the clueless WKK types either.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby jpremnath » 03 Mar 2019 19:26

Philip wrote:The Q that beggars everyone is why Pak apparently embarked upon this " suicide mission", pun intended?



The pakis probably hoped that the Pulwama attack would capture the imagination of Kashmiri youth and inspire them to climb the suicide ladder. This they might have thought would lead to a situation which will cascade a situation where the entire valley will rise up against India in a year or two. Which would have been pretty shitty and much like what the US faced in Iraq. The DDM and the pseudo intellectuals of the country will then create a narrative that we should leave the valley and give them independence.
Even if we tried another Surgical strikes, the pakis thought they will be ready. Not even in wildest dreams it could have occurred to them that the thappad would come through air!

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby UlanBatori » 03 Mar 2019 20:38

They were too "successful". Which shook up GOI: the stark reality is that J&K would turn into another Iraq/Syria if VBIEDs are allowed to go un-deterred. Use of a soosai "Indigenous" creep was even more alarming.

So finally GOI woke up to the need to Solve The Pakistan Problem. Finally. Something we have been pointing out with logic and facts for over 20 years.
To Give Peace A Chance, one must Destroy Pakistan as an entity. Period.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Rana » 03 Mar 2019 23:36

Why is there no talk of using the Brahmos cruise missile? Aren't cruise missiles what US used to bring Iraq to its knees before a single aircraft was used for air superiority? A couple of them dispatched to Bahawalpur would do a world of good.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Pulikeshi » 04 Mar 2019 00:53

UlanBatori wrote:So finally GOI woke up to the need to Solve The Pakistan Problem.


The timing was right... the Paki is bankrupt and does not have the wherewithall to escalate.
GOI still thinks economic growth is the prime directive, solving “the Paki Problem” is a long term initiative!

UlanBatori wrote:To Give Peace A Chance, one must Destroy Pakistan as an entity. Period.


You know I have no disagreements with this statement... but there is no evidence to suggest GOI has switched policy to make this the end goal.
I suspect predominantly because India does not have the capabilities nor the wherewithall to take on this post victory rebuild that will be needed... Even if the said rump of a country is broken into four pieces. Once the capabilities and differential is sufficiently acheieved, I have no doubt this option will have to be pursued.

Rana wrote:Why is there no talk of using the Brahmos cruise missile? Aren't cruise missiles what US used to bring Iraq to its knees before a single aircraft was used for air superiority? A couple of them dispatched to Bahawalpur would do a world of good.


In the game of gladiators one walks up the strategic matrix carefully, but there are multiple options before one has to get to using Brahmos.
The key is to understand what the terminal conditions are for success in any prosecution of `politics by other means` aka war.
The goal here is not to defeat Paki (even if you disagree with it) - GOI wanted to achieve surgical strike 2.0 and they did!
The Paki response was WEAK! :mrgreen:

——- Meanwhile in the land of exploding debt - the great Chinese media CGTN hopes to mediate between India and Pakistan:



^^^
While Prof. means well - he needs to be careful to not fail for the Chinese ‘bling blother` meadiating via silly CGTN media between India and TSP! :evil:

UlanBatori
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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby UlanBatori » 04 Mar 2019 03:45

rd: Economic/strength differential will never give the capability to handle the instability next door: Witness US/Mexico. Mexico has been pakistanizing via drug and other crooks for decades, and is now a total mess. Only a Wall can help that, unfortunately. But were Mexico a real Pakistan sending soosai VBIEDs into Texas and Arizona, protected say by a new clear detergent with Chinese nuke umbrella as well Chinese destabilization on the West Coast and East Coast, US would have a far, far worse problem.

Economic might/disparity has little to do with it. The Iron Curtain kept exchanges to a trickle both ways for 45 years.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Y. Kanan » 06 Mar 2019 12:47

UlanBatori wrote:rd: Economic/strength differential will never give the capability to handle the instability next door: Witness US/Mexico. Mexico has been pakistanizing via drug and other crooks for decades, and is now a total mess. Only a Wall can help that, unfortunately. But were Mexico a real Pakistan sending soosai VBIEDs into Texas and Arizona, protected say by a new clear detergent with Chinese nuke umbrella as well Chinese destabilization on the West Coast and East Coast, US would have a far, far worse problem.

Economic might/disparity has little to do with it. The Iron Curtain kept exchanges to a trickle both ways for 45 years.


If Mexico or any other country were openly, defiantly terrorizing the US on its own soil the way the Pakis do to us, they would be attacked by the US whether backed by China or not. And if China actually deployed nukes, that US attack would probably come in the form of a nuclear preemptive strike. The US military industrial complex, and the public who grew up on generations of US military superiority, could not even conceive, much less accept, an Indian-style response. For better or worse, it would be WWIII. Remember the Cuban Missile Crisis? That was nothing, not really a threat to the US at all, and still they were ready to attack and quite possibly start a nuclear war over it.

This known military superiority and propensity to use it creates a strong deterrent effect. It's why you'll never see the US suffer a Pakistan situation with Mexico or anyone else. But I don't think you need to be the world's #1 superpower to achieve that kind of deterrent effect. I can't imagine China or Russia getting openly terrorized by anyone either. In the case of Russia, they'll take pinpricks but there are clear limits as Russians are known for being prideful and a little crazy. China has such tight internal security that any terror campaign would probably be ineffective.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby UlanBatori » 06 Mar 2019 22:21

Which is why a strong response completely changes the conversation. Witness Dimran shivering in his Parliament of crooks that "Modi is considering using missiles". For now there will still be chest-thumping Pakis and their jarnails who will try to keep up the bluster, so another 2 jhapads of increasing intensity will be required, IMO. THEN the message will get through that they need to bring their own cretins under control, and basically stomp out the military's power.

Will NaMo/ new govt in May continue with the present strength and administer those jhapads? History is not on our side..... sorry to say. Long record of self-goals. Which will be terribly sad because next time the desperate need for jhapads comes around the cost will be much more.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Singha » 06 Mar 2019 22:44

indian ship INS Khanjar provides medical assistance to iranian fishing vessel in "north arabian sea"

https://twitter.com/indiannavy/status/1 ... 8068885504


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