Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Prem » 24 Apr 2020 10:35


ArjunPandit
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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ArjunPandit » 24 Apr 2020 16:26

I am aware of that they are in..there was some arty firing in recent duels around a damn or waterbody where red scourge was present. However, after the barrage they didnt return. at least thats what I heard last..
yes you are right that works both for pakis and chinese..what we need is to weaken them so that when the real thing comes they are in a state that they cant sustain long and intense fights..that's why having domestic arty, hepter and fighter jet programs in numbers are essential.. so that we can overwhelm them on multiple fronts in a short span of time ..

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby g.sarkar » 24 Apr 2020 17:19

amar_p wrote:You're right Arjun Pandit. Pak press in English will only give us a very partial picture of whats going on. I hope there are cells at the Ministry of Home affairs & NIA that are constantly reading and monitoring literature in Urdu & Arabic languages (like they would do in all other languages used in India) to scrute for radical ideas being propagated in India.

Sirji,
Once I visited the Polish Military Mission in West Berlin around 1986 for a visa. There I saw that the mission was collecting a copy of every newspaper published in West Germany and these were being packed and sent to Warsaw in big cartons. Another time around 1992 I visited the Hoover Institution Library and Archives, in Stanford. There I saw a huge collection of newspapers from India. I was surprised to see an unknown (to me) communist newspaper from Kerala, which was a part of the collection. I was told that they try to collect every newspaper that is published in India and make them available to the research scholars there. I am sure Indian intelligence are also monitoring the Pak press in a similar way.
Gautam

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ArjunPandit » 24 Apr 2020 20:31

This job has become a lot easier in the post internet world...

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Brad Goodman » 25 Apr 2020 01:16

g.sarkar wrote:
amar_p wrote:You're right Arjun Pandit. Pak press in English will only give us a very partial picture of whats going on. I hope there are cells at the Ministry of Home affairs & NIA that are constantly reading and monitoring literature in Urdu & Arabic languages (like they would do in all other languages used in India) to scrute for radical ideas being propagated in India.

Sirji,
Once I visited the Polish Military Mission in West Berlin around 1986 for a visa. There I saw that the mission was collecting a copy of every newspaper published in West Germany and these were being packed and sent to Warsaw in big cartons. Another time around 1992 I visited the Hoover Institution Library and Archives, in Stanford. There I saw a huge collection of newspapers from India. I was surprised to see an unknown (to me) communist newspaper from Kerala, which was a part of the collection. I was told that they try to collect every newspaper that is published in India and make them available to the research scholars there. I am sure Indian intelligence are also monitoring the Pak press in a similar way.
Gautam


If I remember correctly Madhuri Gupta was posted in Islamabad to scan Pakistani news papers and report summary back to New Delhi. (Wonder why that needed a person inside Pakistan) instead of doing it from Delhi or Dubai. She was honey trapped by ISI and she not only converted to ROP also passed state secrets to her handler.

https://www.dnaindia.com/india/report-w ... ap-2616589

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Avtar Singh » 25 Apr 2020 01:45

The americans have their people and military in many countries/places (far far away) without having any contact with the locals and with none of those locals allowed into the contiguous USA.

If India were ever to secure POK for itself..
I would suggest building that wall and quarantine for 150/200 years..
Let the people already there go about their business but they need not have anything to do with India.
A very long and very slow filtration process is needed.

In the meantime pack it with the required military resources (use it for overflight) all shut off from the population at large. I am sure a look at USA operations around the world may provide a template.

If many reds are already there, well they should be considered a bonus….
As wondrous (sarcasm) as the chinese (military/technology/economic super power, yada yada) are….
Supply lines are supply lines/temperature is temprature/altitude is altitude.

As Bubette Salam always says; Let Trump be Trump

https://twitter.com/BubetteS


temperature is temperature, from Barbarossa by Alan Clark
the “intestinal disorders” of which Bayerlain had been complaining in November were now rampant throughout the army: yet on days like 10th december, when Guderian recorded the temperature as falling to minus 63 dgrees, it was death to squat in the open and “many men died while performing their natural functions, as a result of congelation of the anus”

But on Indias part preparing for a measly 2 weeks of war WILL NEVER CUT IT…….
The opposition is never as invincible as the propaganda makes it out to be.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ArjunPandit » 25 Apr 2020 14:04

avtar ji i am against wall mentality..i doubt we can wish away papis after the collapse..the thing would be to neuteralize the mentality which would take a long period of time..the way i think is that keeping the PoK region under military control for a long period of time....remaining parts would have to be splintered..our intelligence agencies need to do the groundwork beforehand to identify rough contours of governance and people management ...in 62 the chinese had planned to the no. of PoWs they planned to take...

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby SRoy » 25 Apr 2020 17:47

^^
The "mentality" is there for a reason.
The entire RoP crowd lives in a bubble.

We and the world have not allowed them to fail. Reasons are many, West's Great Game, our own misplaced sense of morality.
We, collectively, keep propping them up, financially, morally. We pardon them without any counter guarantee of good behaviour.

Our behaviour has led them believe that they are invincible, they are the chosen one.

This is no different from typical human behaviour. Lot's of people carry on with arrogant attitude until life changing unfortunate events brings them down to their knees. This is where people introspect and change.

Same has to happen to RoP in general and Porkis in particular.

They needed to be handed out a comprehensive military defeat ... no quarters given ... no prisoners.
Defeated, humiliated ... just make sure that they bear no further illusion.

Unless it is shown to the common Abduls ... mullahs and nukes cannot protect them ... a 7th century life style that they prescribe for others will only bring miseries to themselves ...

Force them to evaluate their priorities. Basic survival instincts will trigger internal reforms.

As always said on BRF ... being Paki is a state of mind ... cure that disease.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ArjunPandit » 25 Apr 2020 20:40

SRoyji
very valid points I completely agree to all of your supporting points. Where i differ is on the 'wall'. Let me cross question you, with utmost respect and agreement to your points. How much do you think a wall will cost? How effective it will be? Before being judged sarcastic, let me share what I think
1. It will cost way more than the current fence costs. It will take time and money to build. For them it will be to break teh wall, dig tunnels. By the time we create a wall, few million pakistanis could be in India
2. It's cost effectiveness in Kashmir region will be highly debatable.
What i think we should do, it may not be the right or best thing, is to manage the flow of people the way we do now. We take admin and political control fo these areas in a way different from rest of the india. What also would be required is to seal the new border that will emerge between revised India and with the new erstwhile pakistan's entities.
Please carry on the discussion, even I, who think about this everyday, get to hear new thoughts from you people.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby SRoy » 25 Apr 2020 21:28

^^
I left the "wall" part. That requires a separate thought.

"Wall" will not work. You cannot wish away people. They are there. And they are there in big number.

No wall is needed.

A common Abdul is never a problem.

Let me repeat. All we need is a demonstration of two things to the common Abduls, one that the world outside their bubble is not what they think it is and two that the dalliance with the 7th century regressive practices and its imposition upon public life will have severe consequences.

Beyond a point, even a brainwashed zombie have their survival instincts.

I would pose a question here. How many in BRF interact with Muslims on daily basis. Friends? Colleagues? Helping hands like drivers, maids? GFs or ex-GFs? May I emphasise ... on daily basis.

They are not bomb vest wielding suicidal nuts. They don't harbour the idea of universal Ummah and Dar-Ul-Islam either. They partake in our festivals wholeheartedly, accounting for the fakers and Taqiyya which is easy to find out.

But at the same time, these people will be killed by their own if they raise their voices. And most importantly they don't have any access to any alternative narrative either.

Common Abduls are the easy part.

Difficult ones are (our?) own.

A truly secular narrative needs to come from academia and media. Coming from RSS and RW eco-system will not cut it in terms of credibility.

What have we done to clean up the British legacies of Judiciary and Civil Services?
These twin pillars feed the toxic left/liberal ecosystem, sabotaging a nationalistic government at every turn.

What have we done to clean up the vested interests (despite ample documented evidences) present in academia , media and police forces? Let's understand an upright police force would have contained the radical Islam menace themselves without any help for central agencies. They are capable, if the will and direction is there.

Most importantly.

What does the majority community has to offer in terms of spiritual, social and philosophical sustenance, physical protection to those that are willing to risk and turn back to the ancient faith of their fore fathers? Nothing. Zilch. All we have to show case is the caste ridden cow-belt. Indo-Gangetic plains for good or worse is our civilisational and political centre of gravity (notwithstanding stellar cultural contribution from South, East and West).

The Modi govt. has wasted the last term and if the current one is any indicator they are on to waste the current terms.

In a nutshell, we aren't ready to handle a disintegrating Pakistan yet, unless we prepare internally. A dissolving Pakistan has ramification all over the Indian Sub-Continent. It will be a Ghar Wapasi. Lekin abhi ghar hi tayyar nahi hai.

In words of another BRF oldie our existential crisis is an reflection of our internal blemishes.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Cyrano » 25 Apr 2020 22:46

My sentiments are very similar SRoy !

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Cyrano » 25 Apr 2020 22:50

Instead of fixating on the wall, we should fix the other side.

The only Wall mankind really needs was made in 1979, by Pink Floyd :wink: :P

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby g.sarkar » 25 Apr 2020 23:43

Brad Goodman wrote:If I remember correctly Madhuri Gupta was posted in Islamabad to scan Pakistani news papers and report summary back to New Delhi. (Wonder why that needed a person inside Pakistan) instead of doing it from Delhi or Dubai. She was honey trapped by ISI and she not only converted to ROP also passed state secrets to her handler.
https://www.dnaindia.com/india/report-w ... ap-2616589

Bradji, Somehow I had missed the Madhuri Gupta affair. But I looked it up. Call me biased, but her picture reminded me of our very own Madam Jelebi! As per reports, she may have been turned outside Pakistan.
Gautam

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Brad Goodman » 26 Apr 2020 01:35

g.sarkar wrote:Bradji, Somehow I had missed the Madhuri Gupta affair. But I looked it up. Call me biased, but her picture reminded me of our very own Madam Jelebi! As per reports, she may have been turned outside Pakistan.
Gautam


Gautam Saheb, Some how when you mentioned someone needs to monitor news papers I just remembered some Indian consulate staffer was honeytrapped needed google chacha's help to get to Madhuri Gupta, there were enough redflags that should have stopped her from getting posted in Paki lands. She had developed interest in Sufism, She trying to get PhD in Rumi's poetry. Her outlandish behavior. I think MEA and babudom is so saturated with liberal arts people that there is no room for critical thinking, data analysis, behavior science. These entrance exams should have different weights for different subjects. Else too many Geography Urdu wala make it through the written tests than Physics or Mathematics

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby g.sarkar » 26 Apr 2020 02:10

Bradji, you are right, after 27 lonely years in MEA she asked for a posting in Pakistan. That should have set off alarm bells, who wants to go there? My last comment on Madhuri.
Gautam

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby sanjaykumar » 26 Apr 2020 03:24

Brad Goodman wrote:
g.sarkar wrote:Bradji, Somehow I had missed the Madhuri Gupta affair. But I looked it up. Call me biased, but her picture reminded me of our very own Madam Jelebi! As per reports, she may have been turned outside Pakistan.
Gautam


Gautam Saheb, Some how when you mentioned someone needs to monitor news papers I just remembered some Indian consulate staffer was honeytrapped needed google chacha's help to get to Madhuri Gupta, there were enough redflags that should have stopped her from getting posted in Paki lands. She had developed interest in Sufism, She trying to get PhD in Rumi's poetry. Her outlandish behavior. I think MEA and babudom is so saturated with liberal arts people that there is no room for critical thinking, data analysis, behavior science. These entrance exams should have different weights for different subjects. Else too many Geography Urdu wala make it through the written tests than Physics or Mathematics



I am interested in this assumption that physicists or mathematicians would make better MEA officers.

Any empirical evidence that you can offer would be helpful.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ArjunPandit » 26 Apr 2020 04:16

Brad Goodman wrote:
g.sarkar wrote:Bradji, Somehow I had missed the Madhuri Gupta affair. But I looked it up. Call me biased, but her picture reminded me of our very own Madam Jelebi! As per reports, she may have been turned outside Pakistan.
Gautam


Gautam Saheb, Some how when you mentioned someone needs to monitor news papers I just remembered some Indian consulate staffer was honeytrapped needed google chacha's help to get to Madhuri Gupta, there were enough redflags that should have stopped her from getting posted in Paki lands. She had developed interest in Sufism, She trying to get PhD in Rumi's poetry. Her outlandish behavior. I think MEA and babudom is so saturated with liberal arts people that there is no room for critical thinking, data analysis, behavior science. These entrance exams should have different weights for different subjects. Else too many Geography Urdu wala make it through the written tests than Physics or Mathematics

while urdu/liberal arts wallah would be more likely to be on the other side..my fear is that physics maths wala will not cut ice in the land where 22 positive cases come out from 15 tests.
Ok i remember about her..but never bothered to look her photo..and who's madam jalebi? do you folks mean maleeha lodhi or Dr Firdous Ashiq Awan?
coming back to miss madhuri..all this is not unusual in a section of lutyens delhi..coz thats cool..many are infected with this disease ..

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Gerard » 26 Apr 2020 04:48

and who's madam jalebi?


Shireen Mazari, former Director of the Pakistan Insitute of Strategic Studies (PISS), now called ISSI (Institute of Strategic Studies, Islamabad) whose bevy of female 'researchers' included one Maria Kiani allegedly involved in the honeytrapping of British Brigadier Andrew Durcan, UK Defense Attache. It is unknown which other foreign officials were also 'researching' in Madam's Institute.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Brad Goodman » 26 Apr 2020 06:21

sanjaykumar wrote:I am interested in this assumption that physicists or mathematicians would make better MEA officers.

Any empirical evidence that you can offer would be helpful.


Well Urdu, Political Sciences, Literature majors have shown us their worth from 1947 to date. Worth trying others. May work maynot work

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby sudeepj » 26 Apr 2020 06:24

ramana wrote:I have been thinking of the long view of Radical Indian Islam. Islam came to India via the Arabs to Sind in 711 AD and to Kerala around same time from traders and locals selling /giving their daughters. It stayed benign after defeat of Arabs in Sind but Hindus did or could not impose Reconquista on them. Then Afghanistan fell to Muslim Turks 1000 AD who brought Sufi Islam and made deep inroads till decline of Mughals. 1200 to 1750. Then Marathas and later Sikhs expanded and imposed ther rule over those areas. Political Islam retreated to Afghanistan which became Turkic version of Islam and culture.

To revive political Islam there were many revert to Arabic Islam in India and abroad. Barelvi is an example of a UP born Muslim who espoused revionist Islam and got driven out to the frontier or modern Pakistan. But could not revive political Islam. Only the Partition gave power to political Islam that was lost for at least 250 years since Mughal decline. They promptly promoted an overthrow of Afghanistan starting from 1975 which led the Soviet intervention. To reclaim that area, Pakistan promoted Wahabism in basically Turkish culture. So far it has failed in all places which tried to Arabaise the Turks. So how long will this contradiction of Arabised Turks last as Taliban?
It has to break up if external threats are removed.


I like the formulation 'Radical Indian Islam'. There is the moderate faction of Radical Indian Islam, and there is the militant faction of RII. The moderate faction consists of fence sitters, 'lance makers' and the trouble makers. The fence sitters goal is to end up on the winning side, while the lance makers goal is to make a longer and a heavier lance in times of peace so as to enable a death blow whenever the peace or truce ends. The trouble makers keep the conflict alive by positing RII as an alternative conceptual sovereign. It doesnt matter who the current occupant of the throne is - marathas, sikhs, brits, nehrus, modis - the intellectual and political challenge to the sovereign will continue.

Today, the role of the trouble maker goes to the state of Pakistan among other ideological players, e.g. Deoband, PFI, SFI etc. Even if this state is finished, the challenge of RII will only be quelled for a few decades before it unfolds before Indians again. Even so, finishing the Pakistani state and army does buy India a few decades in which its own preparations can be planned in relative peace.

For the next 5-10 years, a head on conflict will likely yield unsatisfactory results. While imposing crushing defeats, It wont be the wholesale destruction of Pakjabi army and muhajir political class and thereafter the destruction of the political challenge of IRI that we need. I can only hope that Indian officialdom and the generals are preparing along these lines.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby sanjaykumar » 26 Apr 2020 08:55

Muslims in India prefer a voluntary apartheid. With Muslim personal law, hopefully sharia, waqf boards, seminaries and colleges. Along with ghettos and with burka, low female literacy, low science and technology ambitions.

Why would not the Indian state accept this. India lives simultaneously in many eras. Perhaps they have a right to live in the seventh century.

I am reconciled to this world view. As long as Hindus try to drag themselves into the 21st century, why would anyone object?

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby sudeepj » 26 Apr 2020 09:17

sanjaykumar wrote:Muslims in India prefer a voluntary apartheid. With Muslim personal law, hopefully sharia, waqf boards, seminaries and colleges. Along with ghettos and with burka, low female literacy, low science and technology ambitions.

Why would not the Indian state accept this. India lives simultaneously in many eras. Perhaps they have a right to live in the seventh century.

I am reconciled to this world view. As long as Hindus try to drag themselves into the 21st century, why would anyone object?


If you are reconciled to this, you are basically reconciled to a few hundred Pakistani enclaves in India. Along with the things you mentioned, comes really high fertility, constant levels of amorphous religiously motivated violence, and a fifth column within India. No constitution can be a suicide pact. India will need a new constitution if this is to be our state.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby sanjaykumar » 26 Apr 2020 09:30

They will be as successful as Pakistan. Or perhaps the native reservations in Canada. Again is this the Hindu’s problem? They will have azaadi. The population will be controlled by themselves- see Shia Sunni relations in Pakistan X 10.

The Indian state does not apply Machiavellian principles to their sectarian schisms.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby vishvak » 26 Apr 2020 11:58

When the Portuguese first came to India they were all about trade and finding way to markets because Arabs closed that routes.

Now we are talking about little little paki lands when there is also Pakistan. Is paki just another country.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Rsatchi » 26 Apr 2020 14:05

^^
Sir whether overtly/openly/covertly acknowledged that 'Peacefuls' are a different nation, we are self deluding and living in a LaLa land.
This cycle of street fights/show of strength will go on and the liberals/BIF's within in India will implore the rest of world to create a Dafur or Chechniya.
The West/Liberal world have not fully understood the game but its already in the making in places like 'Bradfordistan' and inner ghettoes of France/Holland
And the question of having 'Enclaves' a La, West Bank types, We will have everyday rockets flying!!!
When they had the Jinnahwali Azaadi instead of clean break we ended up and 'unfinished business'

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby sudeepj » 26 Apr 2020 20:07

sanjaykumar wrote:They will be as successful as Pakistan. Or perhaps the native reservations in Canada. Again is this the Hindu’s problem? They will have azaadi. The population will be controlled by themselves- see Shia Sunni relations in Pakistan X 10.

The Indian state does not apply Machiavellian principles to their sectarian schisms.


It is certainly a problem for Hindus because these enclaves shall be a fifth column, these enclaves will becomes centers of crime and violence directed outwards, they will be constantly expanding squeezing other Indians, there will be mini-ethnic cleansings of Hindus in these enclaves and in the absence of law and order, they will have a second class status. Once all of this happens, its only a matter of time before the secession is formalized.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby sanjaykumar » 26 Apr 2020 21:58

I doubt they’ll be much trouble. Hindus can be nasty. I will say no more.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ArjunPandit » 26 Apr 2020 22:03

Guys what we have been discussing is not completely unrelated..pursuing this track may attract unwanted attention..and anyways it is more related to strategic thought...i have been watching for some time....after bans and warnings i am extra cautious here will focus on the topic, that is endgame of pakistan..
i would go by the thinking of Sroy that humiliation of pakistan will solve many things...that also needs to be done before the demographics become a problem for india

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby sanjaykumar » 26 Apr 2020 22:32

Okay I will say more :mrgreen:

Tarek Fatah has also obliquely warned of Hindus' patience being stretched.

The only solution I can visualise is where Hindus have a standard of living, public cleanliness, and orderliness of Japan whilst in the Muslim areas life goes on as in Pakistan. Their own young people and females will put a stop to dreams of any desert paradise.

But first Hindus need to demonstrate egalitarianism and equality of opportunity amongst themselves. Until then I'm not even sure India is a worthwhile project.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Karan M » 26 Apr 2020 22:42

I am not even sure the western countries are a worthwhile project as they have not demonstrated a fraction of the egalitarianism and equality of opportunity India has. I hope they too demonstrate the hygiene and discipline of the Japanese etc etc. Blah blah.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ArjunPandit » 26 Apr 2020 22:48

sanjaykumar ji,
request you to please stop making it an Intra india affair. The thread has a topic and title. For the benefit of everyone, lets stick to that only. A friendly request to you. You're a veteran here, I dont need to tell that to you.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby sanjaykumar » 26 Apr 2020 23:01

No problem.

We are dealing with a worldview that needs to be recognised for what it is. Whether it is people in India, Pakistan or Arabia, this is the irreducible issue.

Here is an article from what is very likely a sympathetic and decent Arab female:https://gulfnews.com/opinion/op-eds/i-pray-for-an-india-without-hate-and-islamophobia-1.71169436


It is a shock for those of us who were familiar with India to see a rise in animosity, Islamophobia and a regular bloodbath happening, and now a pandemic that is called the ‘Qurano-Virus’. I feel that I brought back the essence of peace with me from that giant lotus hall.

World doesn’t need another Hitler
Don’t these successful so-called powerful millionaires know that hate speech is the prelude to genocide? Nazism wasn’t born in a day. It was allowed to grow like a weed that went wild because people chose to look the other side and it thrived on that specific weakness called silence. Hate is being preached openly in India against Muslims, in a nation of 182 million Muslims. BJP [India’s ruling Bharatiya Janata Party] and RSS [Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh] leader Rajeshwar Singh, have, in an example of intimidation and hate speech, said that “Muslims and Christians will be wiped out of India by December 31, 2021”.

The world doesn’t need another Hitler, but it needs another hero like Martin Luther, Nelson Mandela, or Gandhi. Killing your brethren doesn’t make you a hero, it makes you a dictator and murderer. A snowballing movement has been started, which has reverberated across the Arab world. People have taken note and with the start of Ramadan the Muslim hearts are deep in prayer and will not allow the sparks to burn a country down. The hate must stop now as it is simply not welcome.



It's time to stop being polite and acknowledge the elephant in the room. It is Kafirophobia-the urgent drive to convert or kill non Muslims. The hag Arundhati Roy has posited a 'near genocide' is occuring in India-whatever that is.
Her argument is that Kristallnacht like conditions are being generated by a relentless propaganda against Muslims CAA, Shaheen Bagh, Tablighi Jamaat etc.

I am not sure how it would escape a Christian that the desert books inculcate a relentless hate against non-believers, idolaters, heretics, atheists. Death, expropriation, banishment, stoning, enslavement, discrimination all are required by the desert books. Comparative eschatology demonstates that the victimisation of the non-believer ends not with death-their gods pursue you in the grave.

sanjaykumar
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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby sanjaykumar » 26 Apr 2020 23:47

Anyhoo, here is the end game in Minneapolis:

https://www.startribune.com/loudspeaker ... 569903742/

I believe that this is a moment when we are called to our democratic principles. I encourage all of us to not be distracted by fearmongering or hate speech. The call to prayer is no more a sign of a religion taking over than those beautiful church bells I have heard for years.

Our nation is strong enough to value and include our diversity. Our people are strong enough to ensure that all can live with dignity. Accepting that this is a year that challenges our sense of community, I hope that in the end, this time results a greater and more inclusive nation.

CAIR-MN, Mayor Frey and the Dar Al-Hijrah Mosque have given us all some direction toward that outcome.



We can all learn principles of tolerance and diversity from the people of the book.

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby mappunni » 27 Apr 2020 00:11

sanjaykumar wrote:Anyhoo, here is the end game in Minneapolis:

https://www.startribune.com/loudspeaker ... 569903742/

I believe that this is a moment when we are called to our democratic principles. I encourage all of us to not be distracted by fearmongering or hate speech. The call to prayer is no more a sign of a religion taking over than those beautiful church bells I have heard for years.

Our nation is strong enough to value and include our diversity. Our people are strong enough to ensure that all can live with dignity. Accepting that this is a year that challenges our sense of community, I hope that in the end, this time results a greater and more inclusive nation.

CAIR-MN, Mayor Frey and the Dar Al-Hijrah Mosque have given us all some direction toward that outcome.



We can all learn principles of tolerance and diversity from the people of the book.


Next in line Columbus OH.

sanjaykumar
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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby sanjaykumar » 27 Apr 2020 00:11

And also liberal Canada is catching up to illiberal India, both in the race to be as liberal as Pakistan.

https://twitter.com/TarekFatah

Cyrano
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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby Cyrano » 09 May 2020 00:37

A sign of things to come ?

DD, AIR news bulletins broadcast weather report of PoK cities ..

Read more at:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/arti ... aign=cppst

VKumar
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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby VKumar » 09 May 2020 01:18

Temperature of Lhasa also required

ArjunPandit
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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ArjunPandit » 09 May 2020 01:49

amar thanks for this..i think this govt is steadily tightening things up ...what surprises me is the set of levers we have at our hand..there's so much that we didnt do so far..like taking actions against firms that dont display india's correct maps. Remember the famed one china policy. Can impose some costs to them...
next logical step would be to fill in the parliamentary seats from there and use these people to highlight the atrocities in that part of India. Now the next thing would be to counter the annexation of Balochistan and KPK if the agreement between India and state of J&K is questioned

from a military perspective..india needs a way to either bye pass or cross it head on the bunds and canal they have created..this is a very high level view
I am sure with sattelite imagery multiple paths would have been charted out so far...
Image

bypassing means ..either an massive landing through sea..alternative ingresses through afghanistan and iran may be another routes...

here's a post from one of our own rohit vats..who used to be very active here in past...
http://vatsrohit.blogspot.com/2012/08/p ... south.html

but their feasibility and effectiveness would be highly questionable. My viewpoint is that India should maintain a token force to complicate their calculus. I am sure they would go into a fit of fear with a few thousand troops there and a squadron..even if it doesn't make a huge impact it would complicate their war efforts and increase pressure on them...basically making them face two front war..and for that either we kiss US goodbye or see Iran disintegrate...cant think of a middle ground ..for some reason I do not see any US iran rapprochement..theoretically with Su 30/brahmos and refuellers we can hit pakis from rear with a wink and nudge from iran..they can always claim violation of their virginity...but dont think that these are beyond my wet dreams..
Last edited by ArjunPandit on 09 May 2020 01:53, edited 1 time in total.

ArjunPandit
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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby ArjunPandit » 09 May 2020 01:51

VKumar wrote:Temperature of Lhasa also required

lets be realistic....not too soon..

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Re: Endgame of NaPakistan: How and what afterwards

Postby banrjeer » 09 May 2020 03:13

Rsatchi wrote:^^
Sir whether overtly/openly/covertly acknowledged that 'Peacefuls' are a different nation, we are self deluding and living in a LaLa land.
This cycle of street fights/show of strength will go on and the liberals/BIF's within in India will implore the rest of world to create a Dafur or Chechniya.
The West/Liberal world have not fully understood the game but its already in the making in places like 'Bradfordistan' and inner ghettoes of France/Holland
And the question of having 'Enclaves' a La, West Bank types, We will have everyday rockets flying!!!
When they had the Jinnahwali Azaadi instead of clean break we ended up and 'unfinished business'


enclaves are OK as far as they don't elevate to the size of the valley in Kashmir. some social redistribution experimentation is needed to be done within India itself before any model can be proposed for porks. Balkanization is key breakup of critical mass is key.

thheres a diff between ghettoized muslims of Europe vs those in the US. Altough the latter are slowly nucleating and there are pockets of radicalization, the problem is nowhere as acute as in Europe. Tarek Fatah has said education is not enough for muslims, but perhaps education + balkanization/thinner spread makes it more manageable and contain the chain reaction.

Social media makes tis harder but similar analogs need to be come up with


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