2019 General Elections News and Discussion

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 05 May 2019 21:46

KJo wrote: I was almost an adult back then, but I followed politics. VPS resigned, but he was a crook who soon pulled out Mandal and got kicked out. If Rajiv was corrupt and there was ample proof, then why wasn't it brought out when Modi was PM? The excuse of "he will become a martyr" does not fly. I am talking only about Rajiv, not about Sanjay/Indira/Panditji. He was naive, had bad friends and was for a large part in above his head dealing with Congress stalwarts but taking money himself? That's just conjecture. The others are that Rajiv taunted Sikhs during 1984. I saw the video, it is part of a longer speech and the quote is cherry picked. Also Amitabh Bachchan egging on people to kill Sikhs... his mother was Sikh, and there is no proof that he did anything, it's just gone viral.

VP Singh did Mandal and was deeply flawed in this regard, but was not a crook. He resigned in 1990, but the coalition govt. fell apart due to multiple reasons in 1991. In 1990 he was ready to start a full bore conflict with Pakistan.

Modi had no reason to dig up old wounds in regard to the Nehru/Gandhi dynasty. He's moving the country forward. There is no political gain in doing so, but now pappu is hitting low, so everything will be brought out now.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 05 May 2019 21:46

Modi should not have brought up RG.

1) First of all why is the son being blamed for the crimes of the father? The party could be blamed. Why the son? However odious or idiotic the son is, what did the son do to influence the actions of the father?

2) People rightfully bristle when MSY says "How can India have a tea-seller as PM". If someone's profession cannot define who they are, how can someone's parents define who they are.

3) The third reason why it bothers me is that the statement was Your father died as brashtachari no 1.

Whatever your feelings about RG or Congress, the fact is that a bunch of international terrorists assassinated an ex Indian PM. This will forever be a traumatic event for the country. Why did he have to bring up his death.

You can bring up all the corruption cases against RG. Bofors, Sikh Riots etc etc. That is fair game. Dont bring up his death.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 05 May 2019 21:48

Chowkidar Tejasvi Surya
@Tejasvi_Surya
·
6h
It is okay to label a patriot like Savarkar as traitor even after his death. It passes off as intellectual & classy

But its not okay to call Rajiv Gandhi 'Brashtachari No.1' even in face of insurmountable evidence pointing to his guilt. It is derogatory & crass

Prasad · Post by **Prasad** » 05 May 2019 21:49

Putting shackles on your own self while the other side has no qualms doing whatever is necessary to win. Not a winning strategy.

If modi's living wife can be used, dead father grandmother great grandfather who you claim to have served the country and use to ask for games are fair game to be targetted however one wants.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 05 May 2019 21:50

Anujan wrote:Modi should not have brought up RG.

1) First of all why is the son being blamed for the crimes of the father? The party could be blamed. Why the son? What did the son do to influence the actions of the father?

2) The second reason why it bothers me is that the statement was Your father died as brashtachari no 1.

Whatever your feelings about RG or Congress, the fact is that a bunch of international terrorists assassinated an ex Indian PM. This will forever be a traumatic event for the country. Why did he have to bring up his death.

You can bring up all the corruption cases against RG. Bofors, Sikh Riots etc etc. That is fair game. Dont bring up his death.

No. It is indeed fair game. It shows the narrative that the entire Nehru/Gandhi family was and is corrupt prior to independence to the present day. They have no place in India. I would say a paper needs to be published about Nehru conspiring with the British to keep Netaji out of India post 1945. India didn't get it's George Washington at the time of independence, but instead got it's Benedict Arnold as its leader.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 05 May 2019 21:56

Singha wrote:Chowkidar Tejasvi Surya
@Tejasvi_Surya
·
6h
It is okay to label a patriot like Savarkar as traitor even after his death. It passes off as intellectual & classy

But its not okay to call Rajiv Gandhi 'Brashtachari No.1' even in face of insurmountable evidence pointing to his guilt. It is derogatory & crass

Let's not forget that Rahul's mother slept around and now has cervical cancer getting treatment at Sloan Kettering in NY. Rahul's nana (Sonia's father) was a renowned Italian fascist who conspired with the Nazis and was involved in war crimes.

TandavBrahmand · Post by **TandavBrahmand** » 05 May 2019 22:02

I am appalled by the past two pages of posts where people are attacking Modi for calling RG Bhrastachari#1.

Where was this outrage when for the past 6 months Modi was being called a "chor"? Why are we so sensitive to RG - cause he is dead? Remember this election is a fight between these dynastic forces vs a strong Rashtra.

This moral high-ground arrogance of Hindus in a war was the reason we keep "pardoning" our enemies at crucial junctures.

Turn now to chapter 2 as some of folks on this forum are stuck on "arjun-vishad-yoga"

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 05 May 2019 22:07

Pratyush wrote:Jetly claiming that he did not know about backops partnership gives him plausible deniability for the prosecution that's coming Rahul's way.

the guy is in the inner circle of the BJP as well as a very senior cabinet minister.

he would have been briefed by various agencies including his own ED and economic offenses guys.

no way he is going to be able to plead plausible deniability

LKA was to investigate rg's foreign citizenship as head of a parliamentary committee, set up many years ago.

what stopped him

lootyens

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 05 May 2019 22:09

Anujan wrote:Modi should not have brought up RG.

1) First of all why is the son being blamed for the crimes of the father? The party could be blamed. Why the son? However odious or idiotic the son is, what did the son do to influence the actions of the father?

2) People rightfully bristle when MSY says "How can India have a tea-seller as PM". If someone's profession cannot define who they are, how can someone's parents define who they are.

3) The third reason why it bothers me is that the statement was Your father died as brashtachari no 1.

Whatever your feelings about RG or Congress, the fact is that a bunch of international terrorists assassinated an ex Indian PM. This will forever be a traumatic event for the country. Why did he have to bring up his death.

You can bring up all the corruption cases against RG. Bofors, Sikh Riots etc etc. That is fair game. Dont bring up his death.

the prithiviraj chauhan syndrome surfaces again.

this is war. anything goes. no mercy.

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 05 May 2019 22:15

I will worry about the bringing of rg after 23rd of May.

If maut ka Saudagar is ok. If khoon ke dalili is ok. If Modi chor hai is ok inspite of zero evidence.

Then rg bhrashtachari no 1 is ok as well.

Winning is everything in this election.

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 05 May 2019 22:24

KJo, Bofors was buried by ABV govt long before Modi came into the picture. Rumors are that it was in exchange for relief on Babri masjid case for BJP leaders.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 05 May 2019 22:30

KJo wrote:I'm not happy with Modiji bring up Rajiv Gandhi either. There is no proof that he was corrupt himself, just like there is no proof that "Modi killed Muslims in Godhra".
Besides, saying this brings him down to Pappu's levels of debate. I hope he does not repeat this.

it would be extremely foolish not to use all the ammo that you have and is it ok with you, if fake news like rafael is cooked up and spread.

this was a trap well sprung and the heavy hammer has come down forcefully.

do you think that this was just a spur of the moment thing.

It has been done before the amethi and the wayanad polls and has enough time to catch fire and be spread in the two constituencies, not to mention rae bareli where the family is fighting again.

this affects most severely, only the mother and son and just before their elections too.

smriti irani will go to beserk about the family's corruption now

BTW, look up chitra subramaniam and her detailed bofors' expose which leaves no one in any doubt about who was responsible and also, there were numerous murders tied to this kickback to protect the guilty.

the guy is guilty as charged and much more besides, and there is not a single iota of doubt left in anyone's mind

she was the one who originally broke the news and was the most dogged in following it up over the years in spite of creeps like n ram who openly tried to sabotage the ongoing investigation by leaking vital documents to the accused

khatvaanga · Post by **khatvaanga** » 05 May 2019 22:34

Pratyush wrote:I will worry about the bringing of rg after 23rd of May.

If maut ka Saudagar is ok. If khoon ke dalili is ok. If Modi chor hai is ok inspite of zero evidence.

Then rg bhrashtachari no 1 is ok as well.

Winning is everything in this election.

absolutely. i have no love lost for any of the congi goons. if skeletons have to be brought into open so be it.

mmasand · Post by **mmasand** » 05 May 2019 22:35

I think BJP would have gained the moral high ground if they did not drag a dead PM into this, Vajpayee would never agree to such language and the party shouldn't either. Two wrongs do not make a right.

The opposition can throw stones at you, but don't stoop yourself to their level. Aam janta has shown us why they are the real kingmakers, a lesson well learnt after 'India Shining'. Instead the party should have gone after the street gunda language RG was using about shredding the image of the PM.

SriKumar · Post by **SriKumar** » 05 May 2019 22:37

Pratyush wrote:I will worry about the bringing of rg after 23rd of May.

If maut ka Saudagar is ok. If khoon ke dalili is ok. If Modi chor hai is ok inspite of zero evidence.

Then rg bhrashtachari no 1 is ok as well.
Winning is everything in this election.

My 2 cents....I agree with the last line bolded. From this angle, though, I am not sure how much the comment helps vs. hurts Modi. I am guessing that Modi/Shah would have known the ambivalence it would have caused among some people- talking ill of dead etc. Afterall, Modi is definitely well aware of bharathiya sanskruti. (Karkare comment by Sadhvi had a similar aspect to it).

Seeing the kind of churn within BRF that the comment has caused, it will definitely cause a bigger churn among the neutral, fence-sitters- no doubt about this. Upto this point, the statement does not seem like a master-stroke (to me anyway), unless it is meant to provoke some severe reaction from the family (much like the second round of Pokhran blasts to get Pakistan to do their own nuclear 'test'). The only thing I can say for sure is that people who plan to vote for Modi based *only* on what he did for them will not be affected by this statement.

added later: just saw chetak's post above about the strategy for waynad and Amethi. Plausible. Hope there is no blowback.

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 05 May 2019 22:40

Moral high ground has no relevance when faced with people who are not moral themselves.

When faced with the dirty tricks of Congress. It is important to me ruthless and efficient. You need a no prisoners approach to this bunch.

A fool covets power without appreciating it's delicate uses.

Modi is no fool. RaGa no smart man.

Choice is clear.

abhijitm · Post by **abhijitm** » 05 May 2019 22:43

No one will change their vote just because Modi said RG was corrupt no. 1. C'mon.

Only thing BJP needs to ensure that if they want to bring up his corruption then do it carefully as not to give unnecessary sympathy to RG Jr and digress from his ineptitude.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 05 May 2019 22:46

Supratik wrote:KJo, Bofors was buried by ABV govt long before Modi came into the picture. Rumors are that it was in exchange for relief on Babri masjid case for BJP leaders.

there are even books on it.

Bofors: The Selling of a Nation by prashant bushan

Bofors: The Story Behind The News By Chitra Subramaniam

SriKumar · Post by **SriKumar** » 05 May 2019 22:48

abhijitm wrote:Only thing BJP needs to ensure that if they want to bring up his corruption then do it carefully as not to give unnecessary sympathy to RG Jr and digress from his ineptitude.

My point exactly! The verbiage though may have given Jr a bit of an opening (just see the past 2 pages). That is the issue.

Manish_Sharma · Post by **Manish_Sharma** » 05 May 2019 22:52

Dishonest thief khaandaan

https://www.opindia.com/2017/01/cia-doc ... liticians/

CIA document claims Sweden stopped Bofors inquiry to save Rajiv Gandhi and their own politicians
HEMANT BIJAPURKAR
JANUARY 25, 2017

are put up for automatic declassification after 25 years unless they fall under certain 9 narrow exceptions. So a CIA document dated 4th March 1988 regarding the Sweden’s Bofors Arms scandal was approved for release in 2014, and seems to have ended up in the public domain in December 2016 if one goes by reports. But before going any further:

What exactly was the Bofors scandal?
The Indian Government had finalized a $1.5 Billion deal with Swedish arms manufacturer Bofors in order to acquire 410 field howitzer guns. It was the largest defense deal in Sweden till date and like everything which looks too good to be true, it ran into problems. Allegations of bribery surfaced and it was reported that Indian Politicians and officials received kickbacks for the deal.

Ottavio Quattrocchi, who was a close friend of Rajiv and Sonia Gandhi, was reported as the main middleman in the deal. Its reported that Quattrocchi’s influence in the government was so high that Indian bureaucrats used to stand up when he visited them. This Quattrocchi connection among others ensured that Rajiv Gandhi got directly embroiled in the scam that eventually contributed to him losing the election in 1989.

What does this CIA document [pdf] say?
- Advertisement -

- Article resumes -
In the summary of the document, the CIA claims that investigation into the Bofors bribery was called off by the Swedish authorities in a bid to to prevent future revelations, which might embarrass the then Prime Minister of India Rajiv Gandhi. It also claimed that Swedish politicians cutting across party lines were culpable in some form or the other for the scandal, hence the inquiry was buried.

Also, apart from India there were countries like Iran, Singapore, Thailand, Taiwan among others, with whom the transactions carried out by Bofors were under the scanner for violation of norms and possible bribery.

After investigations had revealed that Bofors might have bribed Indian middlemen and officials, the Swedes carried out a national audit which concluded that as much as $40 Million were paid as commissions to middlemen. Both the Govt and Bofors has claimed that these payments were used to close the contracts with middlemen after Indian govt wished to exclude them from transactions:

After the audit, the Swedish police had initiated a separate investigation into the Bribery to Indian officials which though was terminated after Rajiv Gandhi went on a trip to Sweden in 1988:

The declassified CIA document does raise the question of a possible deal between Rajiv Gandhi and the Swedish authorities and whether the investigation was called off only to spare him of ’embarrassment’ or if it would have led to bigger mess.

Conclusion
Whatever said and done, the CIA felt that payments were almost certainly made to Indian officials either directly or indirectly to secure the $1.2 Billion deal.

After the word leaked causing difficulties for Rajiv Gandhi back home in India. Noble Industries (Bofors’s parent) too wished to avoid a bribery indictment. And to ensure both, the two sides cooperated and the details of payment were kept secret and the investigation was eventually called off.

This above stated CIA document suggests that both the Swede and Indian politicians were neck deep into the scandal, providing a possible explanation to why the matter was hushed up leading to it not being solved till date.

The Congress party keeps claiming that Bofors is a “dead horse” and flogging it won’t achieve anything. The party insists that no one in the Nehru-Gandhi family are guilty of personal corruption.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 05 May 2019 22:56

chetak wrote:
Singha wrote:https://twitter.com/Nitin_Rivaldo

he has good dirt on RG era
don't think that the family ever anticipated this

pappu's traitorous hobnobbing with the hans should have at least taught him this basic lesson

wasn't it was confucius who said: “Before you embark on a journey of revenge, dig two graves.”

‘Bofors ka dalal kaun hai? Rajiv Gandhi,’ How the Opposition back in the late 80s chanted ‘Rajiv Gandhi Chor Hai’

I wonder if anyone has videos from that time - of people, especially JD politiicians or VP Singh's cohorots chanting this publicly

Prasad · Post by **Prasad** » 05 May 2019 23:05

Now you have congoons and their chamchas defending RG. Instead of attacking mudi and calling him chor. Come on guys. Get with the program and understand.

vijayk · Post by **vijayk** » 05 May 2019 23:12

https://indianexpress.com/article/india ... i-5711493/

Anil Ambani responds

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 05 May 2019 23:18

Prasad wrote:Now you have congoons and their chamchas defending RG. Instead of attacking mudi and calling him chor. Come on guys. Get with the program and understand.

you really think that congis don't know who all are making money in their own party.

they must have been dreading this very day.

just before their most important elections.

all that info about dalali, jijajee, offset contracts, scorpene, bofors, daddy, shaking trees and ownership of backops is no mere chance. both brother and sister are listed as owners of backops along with the very shady son in law of another crooked congi politico

modi has just taken a sledgehammer to the dynastic congis main hope and the other one has shown that she may be a bigger clown than her sibling

KLNMurthy · Post by **KLNMurthy** » 05 May 2019 23:19

abhijitm wrote:Modi is right about RG Sr. He is speaking truth. People know that. This is nothing compare to the abuse that these opposition parties hurl at him which media do not report.

We know it’s the truth, Rajiv Gandhi was a cold ******** who nevertheless had a professional demeanor that many of us felt comfortable with at that time.

The question is, how does Modi’s statement help him win this election? I must admit I cringed a bit when I saw the clip. But I am not Modi’s target audience, and he is a master of political communication who doesn’t publicly say random things out of emotion or self-indulgence.

So, I’ll just wait and see what happens.

vijayk · Post by **vijayk** » 05 May 2019 23:20

iMac_too
@iMac_too
·
6m
In politics, particularly in election season candidates & parties need to be thick-skinned. BJP, Modi endured tons of "chor" barbs without crying. One retort & Congress ecosystem went into tailspin. And what they got? Ocean of material on their hero Rajiv's shenanigans. Self goal

vsunder · Post by **vsunder** » 05 May 2019 23:21

Suraj wrote:
chetak wrote:
don't think that the family ever anticipated this

pappu's traitorous hobnobbing with the hans should have at least taught him this basic lesson

wasn't it was confucius who said: “Before you embark on a journey of revenge, dig two graves.”

‘Bofors ka dalal kaun hai? Rajiv Gandhi,’ How the Opposition back in the late 80s chanted ‘Rajiv Gandhi Chor Hai’
I wonder if anyone has videos from that time - of people, especially JD politiicians or VP Singh's cohorots chanting this publicly

The exact phrase was

Galli galli men shor hai,

Rajiv Gandhi chor hai

vijayk · Post by **vijayk** » 05 May 2019 23:22

Harsimrat Kaur Badal
@HarsimratBadal_
When #Gandhi family is nostalgic about Sh #RajivGandhi today, do they also think about the thousands of #Sikhs slaughtered under his watch? What do you call a man who gets the Sikhs murdered and justifies it to win the elections?
Hold on
@RahulGandhi
, your Karma awaits you

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 05 May 2019 23:26

at least someone has hairy big brown testimonials

EC rejects plea seeking rescheduling of the commencement of voting from 7 am to 4.30/5.00 am during the month of Ramzan. EC States "Commission does not find it feasible to alter the existing hours of poll for the 5th, 6th & 7th phase of general elections to the Lok Sabha, 2019."

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 05 May 2019 23:29

twitter

In MAHABHARAT

Shishu Pal -

1. Abuse
...
99. Abuse

Krishna - Warning

100.Abuse

Shishu Pal..The End
------
In Real MAHABHARAT,

RG-

1. Modi Chor Hai
...
99. Modi Chor hai

SC & Lekhi- RG Care..Care

100. Modi Chor hai,

Modi : Tera Baap Chor Hai, RG

Manish_Sharma · Post by **Manish_Sharma** » 05 May 2019 23:30

Anujan wrote: Modi should not have brought up RG.

.... Why did he have to bring up his death.

You can bring up all the corruption cases against RG. Bofors, Sikh Riots etc etc. That is fair game. Dont bring up his death.

I am reminded of "Maut Ka Saudagar" comment never did media-intellectuals etc demanded apology from barbaric sonia, few years back Sh. Giriraj Singh made statement against sonia, so media channels STARTED DEMANDING APOLOGY. ONE ANCHOR ANJANA KASHYAP WENT TO PROTEST "Giriraj Singh has only offered REGRET but not APOLOGY, he has to APOLOGIZE"

I like what Modi has done it shows agression, that was missing in brahmins Vajpayee, lalji tandon & kalraj mishra types..."

Why did priyanka and sonia help Christian terrorist murderers of rajiv gandhi?

priyanka hugged and cried one in jail ...

Why is that generosity missing for Hindus?

In 2014 election Modi was asked about priyanka attacking him. Modi said its natural a daughter protects her family, I have no complaints against her she is like daughter yo us too.

To this Snakewoman Priyanka Vadra reacted even more nastily.

Ranarasika · Post by **Ranarasika** » 05 May 2019 23:35

Twitter :
You can Question:
1. Savarkar
2. Atal Bihari
3. M Parrikar

4. Make conspiracy theory on Justice Loya's death.

5. Compare Bhagat Singh to Burhan Wani.

But if you question Rajiv Gandhi on Bofors, Shah Bano case, Bhopal tragedy, 1984 riots etc then you become a blot on Democracy.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 05 May 2019 23:36

this is telling it like it is.

Harsimrat Kaur Badal Verified account @HarsimratBadal_

When #Gandhi family is nostalgic about Sh #RajivGandhi today, do they also think about the thousands of #Sikhs slaughtered under his watch? What do you call a man who gets the Sikhs murdered and justifies it to win the elections?
Hold on @RahulGandhi, your Karma awaits you.

3:06 am - 5 May 2019 From भटिंडा, भारत
2,195 Retweets 4,175 Likes
139 replies . 2,195 retweets 4,175 likes
Reply 139 Retweet 2.2K Like 4.2K

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 05 May 2019 23:38

After the election it will be time to prosecute the Nehru/Gandhi clan to the fullest extent of the law. Lock them up!

vijayk · Post by **vijayk** » 05 May 2019 23:39

Reactions of most people here are result of outrage generated by scam media.

Ravinar
@RavinarIN
·
5h
For almost a year...
@RahulGandhi
has been calling Modi "Chor Chor Chor"... Not one Sickular or media crook objected.. One slap from
@NarendraModi
.. and they are all laying brick-size eggs>>
@Bdutt

@ShekharGupta

@SardesaiRajdeep
.. Hahahaa..
@Timesnow

@Republic

@Indiatoday

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 05 May 2019 23:41

twitter

Replying to @HarsimratBadal_ @RahulGandhi
Guilty as and when proven is guilty & this is applicable to Dead or, Alive

Bofors still fires..

There is no reason to be emotional once the offence is proven or, offender is called out, just because someone is dead

Death can't be an entitlement to being INNOCENT

Law prevails

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 05 May 2019 23:43

twitter

When Gandhi was killed,Brahmin localities in Pune were attacked;overnight scores of Brahmin families fled their homes with only their clothes on their back!They were targeted coz Godse was a Brahmin!This is d culture of violence perfected by Cong; worst part is,news is suppressed

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 05 May 2019 23:53

any explanation for this, only ABA and brajesh mishra know/knew and, of course, the Indian ambassador to the US at the time

जो खुद ड्रग्ज के मामले मे अंदर गया हे उसकी औकात क्या हे इसीसे स्पष्ट होती हे.

VKumar · Post by **VKumar** » 06 May 2019 00:05

Rumoured to be carrying huge amount of cash

SriKumar · Post by **SriKumar** » 06 May 2019 00:06

^^^The date on the paper is interesting. It is within 3 weeks after the world trade center attacks and within 10 days of opening of the US airpsace after the 9/11 attaks. This is probably the reason why RaGa got caught. Very likely he had done it before. Security was really really tight then, and any foreign-looking person was searched 2-3 times before he could board a plane.

If RaGa was a strudent at HArvard at that time, he was traveling to India during the semester. (Studies?....who cares).