Terroristan - May 1, 2019

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Anujan
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by Anujan »

Trump said vaccines cause autism, he had the biggest inaugural crowd, his father was born in germany and Modi asked him to mediate on JK
manjgu
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by manjgu »

my question is ..IF modi asked trump to mediate AND trump also wants to mediate AND pakis anyway want mediation THEN how come mediation did not happen ENDIF
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by SSridhar »

Modi would never have asked for Trump's mediation. No Indian ever would, much less Modi. Trump has taken liberty to deliberately misinterpreted any private conversation between him and Modi to suit the occasion.

As I said before, GoTUS/PoTUS have probably decided some rapprochement with Pakistan and an offer to mediate comes handy. Trump, in his usual condescension of others, decided to deliberately play mischief. GoI must take it up strongly with the US.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by CRamS »

SSJi, I am beginning to wonder if there is any connection whatsoever between Rajnath SinghJi's statement the other day that so called "Kashmir solution is round the corner and no power on earth can stop it" and Trump's condescending offer today? Did govt of India know that POTUS was up to some mischief and came out with this statement. But then again, answering my own question, not sure how what Rajnath SinghJi said in any way helps India counter what Trump said. Both TSP and KMs must be salivating while contemptuously dismissing Rajnath Singh.

Kashi, you are right, what Trump said is usual US mischief, nothing new. Only question I have is all this strategic relationship BS that US generously talks about without anything of substance, and Indian elites get orgasms about; do the Indian interlocutors never hold US accountable on this fundamental core Indian interest? Because a fundamental component of any strategic relationship is to have a heart to heart understanding of each other's core concerns. In this case terrorism. It is very clear that not only does US not take TSP terror against India seriously, but actively encourages it through the kind of mischief we saw from Trump today. So no chaddi twist, it is a genuine concern. Our soldiers and people are dying due to this US TSP collusion.

On whether or nor ModiJi and Trump discussed Kashmir, it does seem from Trump's statement that there was some kind of discussion. Now definitely either Trump is outright lying or was pretty lose in his utterance on the mediation part, but I doubt he is just make something up about the discussion itself.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by Kashi »

CRamSJi, Trump is prone to making such statements and it's not just with India. Do see his recent statements on conversations with Shinzo Abe of Japan, Moon of Korea, Merkel of Germany among others. He's either aware or clueless enough to know that none of these leaders will call him out on his utterances, for diplomatic or other reasons.

All Trump's statement says is that HE believes that HE was asked to mediate in an issue that ALL Indian governments have stressed as being bilateral only. He's not beyond making things up, if he feels that it makes him look important and better.

Regarding India's concerns, I believe none of us is naive enough to believe that any US admin has had our backs when it comes to Baki-sponsored terror. In fact it never bothered them till this terror monster started deviating from it's set mandate and terrorising American interests. All they want is for the terror genie to go back to it's bottle and stick to attacking India. Stuff that got Iran and NoKo black-listed, barely even earns Bakis a slap-on-the-wrist from the successive Amreeki governments and it never will. The sooner we fully grasp this fact, the better it is for us.

That the White House statement made no mention of Trump's utterances, suggests that he once again went off the script and his staff had to scarmble around undoing the damage, something they've been doing a lot lately.

At the end of it, actions rather than words is what we should focus on.
chetak
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by chetak »

And they were beating their chests like wild animals after capturing just one PoW, as if it is some very special achievement. Just shows their massive inferiority complex.


twitter

This is a list of top POW Pakistani Generals, Air Marshals, Admirals and Ministers who have likely drank and enjoyed Indian tea as POWs after the 1971 war..

As can be seen, quite a few of them went on to occupy high positions...

Lest we forget...





Image
Amber G.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by Amber G. »

xpost:
Trump’s ignorance was on full display in his meeting with Imran Khan
Monday’s meeting between President Trump and Pakistani Prime Minister Imran Khan was meant to prioritize Afghanistan and the ongoing U.S.-Taliban talks. Instead, Trump’s clumsy handling of the meeting has ended up making it all about relations between India and Pakistan — and left New Delhi with no option but to effectively say what many others have said before: that Trump is a liar.

First, Trump boasted that he could win the 18-year-old war in Afghanistan “in a week,” a comment so absurd and ill-informed that it is unworthy of a rebuttal. Then he waded into the middle of a tenuous relationship between Delhi and Islamabad, governments that are only just emerging from the shadows of heightened tensions. He claimed that Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi had asked him to play the role of mediator between the two countries and offered to get involved in a bid to resolve the long-standing dispute over the Kashmir issue.

These remarks caused an immediate political furor in India, as they upended India’s long-standing position: that there is no room for a third party in the Kashmir conversation between India and Pakistan.

Yes, the United States has been among global powers that have historically intervened to pull back India and Pakistan from the brink of escalated military conflict. This month, India marked the 20-year anniversary of the 1999 Kargil conflict, which was triggered by Pakistani soldiers occupying Indian territory. Back then, as the Indian military pushed back hard, Nawaz Sharif, then-prime minister of Pakistan, came to Washington knocking on President Bill Clinton’s doors. More recently, when India’s air force struck inside Pakistan in the aftermath of a terror strike in Kashmir and friction mounted at the border, Trump tweeted about the possibility of tensions subsiding.

Yet channeling influence to avert full-scale military conflict between two nuclear-armed nations is hardly the same as claiming India asked for an international negotiating role in Kashmir, which is seen across party lines as a strictly bilateral issue. Modi may have well asked Trump to prevail upon Pakistan to rein in terror groups such as the Lashkar-e-Taiba, but it is unimaginable that he or any Indian prime minister would have offered the Americans a seat at the Kashmir dialogue table.

The Modi government, which claims nationalistic pride as its political calling card, will deny Trump’s claim. The first set of rebuttals is already out from the spokesman for India’s Ministry of External Affairs. But it shall probably require denial from even higher levels, perhaps from Modi himself. India’s parliament is in session, and this will undoubtedly be a major issue of domestic debate.

The controversy will only add to the already spiraling trade tensions between the United States and India. Nor will the Modi government be happy at the renewed focus on India and Pakistan together. Successive Indian governments have worked hard at decoupling the India-Pakistan relationship in the Western imagination. In one meeting, Trump has set back the U.S. relationship with India without having gained anything concrete for his country’s endgame in Afghanistan.

But Trump’s ignorance about South Asia — and his administration’s lack of seriousness in actually cracking down on terror groups operating on Pakistani soil — was clear before Khan even landed in Washington.

Last week, Trump tweeted about Hafiz Saeed, the Lashkar-e-Taiba terrorist behind the 2008 Mumbai attacks, in which more than 160 people were killed, including six Americans. Trump wrote: “After a ten year search, the so-called mastermind of the Mumbai Terror attacks has been arrested in Pakistan. Great pressure has been exerted over the last two years to find him!”

The embarrassing statement might have been funny were it not so tragic. Saeed was not “found.” In fact, he has lived and operated with impunity near the city of Lahore. Far from hiding, Saeed launched his own political party in the same national election that voted Khan into office. Trump’s tone-deaf comment about Saeed being the “so-called” brain behind the Mumbai strikes also ruffled feathers — not least because David Headley, a U.S. citizen and co-conspirator in the attacks, has testified in court about Saeed. Saeed has been sanctioned by the United Nations and is on its list of banned terrorists, but has reportedly remained a strategic asset of the Pakistani “deep state” in its war against India. Nor was Trump’s administration the one to apply the “pressure” on Saeed: The United States has had a $10 million bounty for information that would lead to Saeed’s conviction since 2012.

Anyone who believed that Trump’s Pakistan policy would be a bold break from the past needs to admit they were deluded. In 2017, Trump did make a blistering attack on Pakistan and said that Pakistan must “demonstrate its commitment to civilization, order, and to peace.” Speaking at the Fort Myer military base in Arlington, Va., that same year, Trump also pointed out that 20 U.S-designated terror groups were operational in Pakistan and Afghanistan, calling out Pakistan’s schizophrenic policy on terrorism. He even talked of rolling back military aid to Pakistan until it shut down terrorist organizations.

But his recent comments on Saeed — and subsequent gratuitous remarks on Kashmir — have exposed his bluster as a sham. On Monday, he said he is holding out the possibility of revoking the aid cuts. The entire episode reflects his ignorance, lack of focus and lack of consistency. And clearly, either he isn’t briefed well — or simply doesn’t bother to follow the briefing.

While all nations act from self-interest, Trump has shown not just a shortage of conviction and courage, but also a shortage of cogency in his remarks on India. It’s just one more reminder of how lacking in subtlety and stability the world’s most powerful man is.
chetak
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by chetak »

what is the significance of imran khan niazi travelling by the qatar airlines flight to the states.

isn't qatar blacklisted by saudi and its UAE gang members and they have no diplomatic relations with the saudi UAE gang

there is a message buried in here somewhere
chetak
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by chetak »

Amber G. wrote:xpost:
Trump’s ignorance was on full display in his meeting with Imran Khan
Monday’s meeting between President Trump and Pakistani Prime Minister Imran Khan was meant to prioritize Afghanistan and the ongoing U.S.-Taliban talks. Instead, Trump’s clumsy handling of the meeting has ended up making it all about relations between India and Pakistan — and left New Delhi with no option but to effectively say what many others have said before: that Trump is a liar.

First, Trump boasted that he could win the 18-year-old war in Afghanistan “in a week,” a comment so absurd and ill-informed that it is unworthy of a rebuttal. Then he waded into the middle of a tenuous relationship between Delhi and Islamabad, governments that are only just emerging from the shadows of heightened tensions. He claimed that Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi had asked him to play the role of mediator between the two countries and offered to get involved in a bid to resolve the long-standing dispute over the Kashmir issue.

These remarks caused an immediate political furor in India, as they upended India’s long-standing position: that there is no room for a third party in the Kashmir conversation between India and Pakistan.

Yes, the United States has been among global powers that have historically intervened to pull back India and Pakistan from the brink of escalated military conflict. This month, India marked the 20-year anniversary of the 1999 Kargil conflict, which was triggered by Pakistani soldiers occupying Indian territory. Back then, as the Indian military pushed back hard, Nawaz Sharif, then-prime minister of Pakistan, came to Washington knocking on President Bill Clinton’s doors. More recently, when India’s air force struck inside Pakistan in the aftermath of a terror strike in Kashmir and friction mounted at the border, Trump tweeted about the possibility of tensions subsiding.

Yet channeling influence to avert full-scale military conflict between two nuclear-armed nations is hardly the same as claiming India asked for an international negotiating role in Kashmir, which is seen across party lines as a strictly bilateral issue. Modi may have well asked Trump to prevail upon Pakistan to rein in terror groups such as the Lashkar-e-Taiba, but it is unimaginable that he or any Indian prime minister would have offered the Americans a seat at the Kashmir dialogue table.

The Modi government, which claims nationalistic pride as its political calling card, will deny Trump’s claim. The first set of rebuttals is already out from the spokesman for India’s Ministry of External Affairs. But it shall probably require denial from even higher levels, perhaps from Modi himself. India’s parliament is in session, and this will undoubtedly be a major issue of domestic debate.

The controversy will only add to the already spiraling trade tensions between the United States and India. Nor will the Modi government be happy at the renewed focus on India and Pakistan together. Successive Indian governments have worked hard at decoupling the India-Pakistan relationship in the Western imagination. In one meeting, Trump has set back the U.S. relationship with India without having gained anything concrete for his country’s endgame in Afghanistan.

But Trump’s ignorance about South Asia — and his administration’s lack of seriousness in actually cracking down on terror groups operating on Pakistani soil — was clear before Khan even landed in Washington.

Last week, Trump tweeted about Hafiz Saeed, the Lashkar-e-Taiba terrorist behind the 2008 Mumbai attacks, in which more than 160 people were killed, including six Americans. Trump wrote: “After a ten year search, the so-called mastermind of the Mumbai Terror attacks has been arrested in Pakistan. Great pressure has been exerted over the last two years to find him!”

The embarrassing statement might have been funny were it not so tragic. Saeed was not “found.” In fact, he has lived and operated with impunity near the city of Lahore. Far from hiding, Saeed launched his own political party in the same national election that voted Khan into office. Trump’s tone-deaf comment about Saeed being the “so-called” brain behind the Mumbai strikes also ruffled feathers — not least because David Headley, a U.S. citizen and co-conspirator in the attacks, has testified in court about Saeed. Saeed has been sanctioned by the United Nations and is on its list of banned terrorists, but has reportedly remained a strategic asset of the Pakistani “deep state” in its war against India. Nor was Trump’s administration the one to apply the “pressure” on Saeed: The United States has had a $10 million bounty for information that would lead to Saeed’s conviction since 2012.

Anyone who believed that Trump’s Pakistan policy would be a bold break from the past needs to admit they were deluded. In 2017, Trump did make a blistering attack on Pakistan and said that Pakistan must “demonstrate its commitment to civilization, order, and to peace.” Speaking at the Fort Myer military base in Arlington, Va., that same year, Trump also pointed out that 20 U.S-designated terror groups were operational in Pakistan and Afghanistan, calling out Pakistan’s schizophrenic policy on terrorism. He even talked of rolling back military aid to Pakistan until it shut down terrorist organizations.

But his recent comments on Saeed — and subsequent gratuitous remarks on Kashmir — have exposed his bluster as a sham. On Monday, he said he is holding out the possibility of revoking the aid cuts. The entire episode reflects his ignorance, lack of focus and lack of consistency. And clearly, either he isn’t briefed well — or simply doesn’t bother to follow the briefing.

While all nations act from self-interest, Trump has shown not just a shortage of conviction and courage, but also a shortage of cogency in his remarks on India. It’s just one more reminder of how lacking in subtlety and stability the world’s most powerful man is.

and they have smartly backtracked pretty damn quick.

State_SCA Verified account @State_SCA

While Kashmir is a bilateral issue for both parties to discuss, the Trump administration welcomes #Pakistan and #India sitting down and the United States stands ready to assist. - AGW

4:17 PM - 22 Jul 2019
Kashi
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by Kashi »

I for one am interested to see how we will respond to this tamasha.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by pankajs »

On some issues the response needs to be forceful, on some it needs bland facts/rebuttal and some need to be ignored/greeted by silence.

This one needs bland fact based rebuttal and nothing more .. BECAUSE the key to the entire episode is in OUR hands i.e. what kind of a "mediation" will it be without India agreeing to it. It can't be foisted on India.
pankajs
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by pankajs »

chetak wrote:and they have smartly backtracked pretty damn quick.

State_SCA Verified account @State_SCA

While Kashmir is a bilateral issue for both parties to discuss, the Trump administration welcomes #Pakistan and #India sitting down and the United States stands ready to assist. - AGW

4:17 PM - 22 Jul 2019
IIRC, It does go beyond the recent US pronouncements on the same issue especially the ending "ready to assist" etc. I don't recall hearing that language is a long time but maybe because I don't follow news enough.

USSD can't totally disown its own President's statements so they took the middle path and went back to a formulation from a while back of "offering their good office" while re-iterating the "bilateral" nature of the issue.

Trying to salvage the situation though it will certainly leave Indians miffed that it was allowed to be made into a talking point in the first place.

While Bakis were able to coax Trump to talk on "Kashmir" and more importantly "internationalize" it per their understanding, any such though was immediately shut down by the USSD via their statement.

So while the Bakis might think they pulled one over India, they really do not have anything much to show for their tactical brilliance except for irritating India/Modi with a quick jab.

On the contrary, it might make Modi more adamant on his "my way or the highway" path on Kashmir. If there ever was any possibility of a Modi-Dimran path to Kashmir, bakistan can safely forget it now.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by Bart S »

pankajs wrote:
This one needs bland fact based rebuttal and nothing more .. BECAUSE the key to the entire episode is in OUR hands i.e. what kind of a "mediation" will it be without India agreeing to it. It can't be foisted on India.
+400%

In this case a matter of fact rebuttal (already done) combined with ignoring the whole thing would be the best and would serve to irritate the Pakis and pak-pasand SD types no end. In the face of GOI nonchalantly brushing off the whole thing (after categorically stating that it wasn't true), their sheer helplessness despite hearing (in theory) what they have been dreaming of for the last 50 years would be fun to watch.

Absolutely no need to get hysterical about this. Though the Indian opposition and media will probably exert a lot of pressure on the GOI, hope they don't give this more than the minimal response/dismissal that it deserves. Also, privately bring home the serious compromise of Indo-US relations by this press conference to the Americans and use this fiasco to our favour in negotiations with the US.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by pankajs »

pankajs wrote:On some issues the response needs to be forceful, on some it needs bland facts/rebuttal and some need to be ignored/greeted by silence.

This one needs bland fact based rebuttal and nothing more .. BECAUSE the key to the entire episode is in OUR hands i.e. what kind of a "mediation" will it be without India agreeing to it. It can't be foisted on India.
When I wrote this I hadn't read any of the reports yet. My response was simply based on the comments posted on this thread.

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/wor ... 339898.cms
One Pakistani journalist finally managed to ask Trump whether he would play any role in Kashmir “where millions have been dead.” That was cue for Imran Khan to “take advantage Trump's bottomless vanity to drive a wedge between US and India on Kashmir” – as the commentator David Frum would later describe the development.
I tend to agree with this assessment.

So the question is should Indians take the "ridiculous" utterances on a strict "No-no" topic from the US/Trump without firing back? Not at all BUT one must weight the evidence before deciding on the response.
1. There was no reference to Kashmir in the joint communique or something released at the end of the meeting.
2. USSD was quick to "adopt" a middle path while reiterating the "bilateral" nature of Kashmir dispute.
3. Everyone baring a few, in the US "foreign policy circle" seems to be quick to tamp down on the issue.
4. The negotiations cannot happen without India. That clearly remains our point of control.

Given that there is ample evidence to suggest that this was misstep of Trump, India can afford to go easy on this flare-up. Factual rebuttal are in order as has been issued by MEA.

Now we must wait and watch. The US followup on this should be judged in the days and months to follow. There is NO urgency to make this "moment/event/misstep" into THE defining moment of the Trump-Modi / US-India relationship. India must not be suckered into responding forcefully to what is likely be a misstep and allow Bakis to create a rift between India and US.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by CRamS »

As expected, India's opposition thugbandhan has seized on Trump's remarks and launched an all out offensive against ModiJi. Some aggressive questioning of ModIJi is no doubt warranted, but for the opposition thugbandhan, any dog bone to go on an attack orgy against ModIJi, they will pounce on it like starved wild animals. And how ironic, the same arse holes like Derek O'Brien and Co for whom Kashmir is not even sacrosanct, they will gift it to TSP under the guise of 'secularism', are now showing off their fraudulent 'nationalism'. Anyway thats the sad reality of an India in the making which is full of glaring fault lines.

But for genuine nationalists, the real villain here is USA, make no mistake about it. They are calibrating TSP's behavior towards India to suit their interests, and they know TSP is an albatross around India's neck that India will not be able to get rid of that easily as 70+ years have shown. All this strategic BS should be thrown out of the window. I am sure this Trump brazenness will play over. But the lesson to be learnt from this is that we must stick to a strictly transcational relationship with US. I have said it 1000 times, will says so again, the civilizational, racial, cultural, military, and economic disparities between US and India are astronomically huge and stacked in US favor that any talk of strategic relationship is a cruel joke, and Trump is only exploiting that brazenly. Good for him and his people.

My only fault with ModiJi is his excessive sucking up to Trump and making an arse of himself and India. No doubt Indians, left, right, and center suffer from profuse colonial diseases and obsess over being seen as US's "strategic partner", but as a Hindu nationalist, I will hope ModiJi does a course correction and takes a break. Of course, US is too important and powerful to be its enemy or do anything brazen to hurt US interests. That will make the relationship even worse. Just a quiet, transactional, business-as-usual relationship. Something like that will avoid these huge diplomatic embarrassments. Dare I say that so called Kashmir 'dispute' with TSP has been infused with some gas, thx to Trump. Whatever other ignominies Taliban Khan had to endure like this video clip, but for his serendipitous achievement on Kashmir, he will be a hero back home.

https://twitter.com/i/status/1153425911749971975
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by pankajs »

CRamS wrote:My only fault with ModiJi is his excessive sucking up to Trump and making an arse of himself and India. No doubt Indians, left, right, and center suffer from profuse colonial diseases and obsess over being seen as US's "strategic partner", but as a Hindu nationalist, I will hope ModiJi does a course correction and takes a break. Of course, US is too important and powerful to be its enemy or do anything brazen to hurt US interests. That will make the relationship even worse. Just a quiet, transactional, business-as-usual relationship. Something like that will avoid these huge diplomatic embarrassments. Dare I say that so called Kashmir 'dispute' with TSP has been infused with some gas, thx to Trump. Whatever other ignominies Taliban Khan had to endure like this video clip, but for his serendipitous achievement on Kashmir, he will be a hero back home.

https://twitter.com/i/status/1153425911749971975
Modi is a sucker for sure! He has not only sucked up to Trump but also Xi, Abe, May, Merkel, etc. Bhell he even sucked up to Na-awaz of Bakistan in case you have forgotten.

By your logic this bleedy Mudi has made an "arse of himself and India" not only with Trump but also with Xi, Nepal, Bhutan, Sri Lanka, Bakistan ,etc. Hell he was shown up even by the piddis of Maldives. Where were you CRS saaru that you failed to notice this bleddy Mudi's track record?

I don't know if "Indians, left, right, and center suffer from profuse colonial diseases" ONLY b'cos if you see the list above you will notice a lot of yellow (Xi) and brown (Sirisena of Sri Lanka) folks too kicking that bleddy Mudi/Indians.

BTW, saaru nothing that bleddy Mudi can do will avoid such "huge diplomatic embarrassments". Afterall, US has the megaphone that makes Indians very very very sensitive and Trump would have embarrassed India/Modi even if we have ZERO relationship with it.

I don't care about Dimran being a hero or zero with *his* people. Perhaps he was a hero after Abhinandan episode too but I will console myself with Balakot.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by Bart S »

CRamS wrote: Whatever other ignominies Taliban Khan had to endure like this video clip, but for his serendipitous achievement on Kashmir, he will be a hero back home.
What achievement? Maybe a boost to their own bluster and delusions but zilch in any real terms or on the ground. Not only has US SD statement disowned that statement but the whole topic is missing from the WH statement as well. In fact this is likely to backfire on Pakis by hardening the stance on the Indian side and reducing the room available for any kind of opening to Pakistan by the Modi govt (the opposition plays a useful role here, though it might be annoying you). Rest assured that this stunt of 'tactical brilliance' will be considered a slight by MAD and our MEA babus and hurt Pakis in the long term.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by disha »

CRamS wrote:As expected, India's opposition thugbandhan has seized on Trump's remarks ...
I do not know what you watch, but it was hilarious to see all our #mediapimps talking about Trump being honest, truthful, not vain and humble! :rotfl:

The opposition with its rona-dhona actually strengthened Mudi's hands. Of course if you want to still do #Blow2Mudi #MudiMustRezine, it is a free country.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by MeshaVishwas »

Comment:I am thoroughly impressed by the selection of Baki Fauj.The mask is very very convincing.

FWIW:

chetak
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by chetak »

we seem to forget that every international jobless joker and his uncle seem very keen to mediate between India and pakistan to "resolve" cashmere, perhaps seeing for themselves a nobel peace prize in the bargain.

there wasn't any brouhaha about the offer at the time and it was simply passed off as a routine matter.

xi may have also made the offer to Modi again at the recent SCO meeting if I understood correctly.

the pakis and the cheeni are both desperate that pakis get out of the FATF trap that is looming large on the horizon


SCO Summit: Xi Jinping offers support for improvement of Indo-Pak ties in meeting with Imran Khan
Jun 14, 2019 - SCO Summit: Xi Jinping offers support for improvement of Indo-Pak ties ... SCO Summit, Xi told Khan that China "supports Pakistan and India in improving their relations".




India snubs China's offer to mediate on Kashmir, says will talk to Pakistan


India snubs China's offer to mediate on Kashmir, says will talk to Pakistan

July 13, 2017

Rebuffing China's offer, India made it clear that they are ready to talk to Pakistan only bilaterally without the intervention of any other nation including China.

day after China today they are willing to play a "constructive role" in improving relations between India and Pakistan, the Ministry of External Affairs today rejected any third party mediation on the Kashmir issue.

"We are ready to have a dialogue with Pakistan on Kashmir under a bilateral framework," Ministry of External Affairs spokesperson Gopal Baglay. "We are ready to talk Kashmir with Pakistan, but no third party mediation."

Rebuffing China's offer, India made it clear that they are ready to talk to Pakistan only bilaterally without the intervention of any other nation including China.

ALL YOU NEED TO KNOW ABOUT INDIA'S STAND:

MEA spokesperson Gopal Baglay said, "Our stand is absolutely clear. You are aware that the heart of the matter is cross-border terrorism emanating from a particular country that threatens peace and stability in the country, region, and the world".

Chinese foreign ministry spokesman Geng Shuang had yesterday said India and Pakistan are important South Asian countries but the "situation in Kashmir has attracted the attention of the international community."

India has maintained that the Kashmir issue is a bilateral matter with Pakistan, and that there is no scope for a third party mediation. India today stuck to its position.

The Chinese comments on Kashmir aimed at getting involved in Indo-Pak tensions come at a time the armies of India and China are locked in a standoff in Doklam area in the Sikkim section.

Beijing has previously refrained from commenting on the situation in Kashmir, saying the dispute was a "leftover from history" and should be resolved by India and Pakistan.

Expressing concern over the tension between India and Pakistan, Geng said "the conflict occurred near the Line of Control of Kashmir. This will not only harm the peace and stability of the two countries but also the peace and tranquillity of the region."

"We hope the relevant sides can do more things that are conducive for peace and stability in the region and avoiding escalating the tensions and China is willing to play constructive role in improving relations between India and Pakistan," he told reporters.

The rare Chinese comments on the Kashmir issue also come two days after a Chinese analyst wrote in the state-run Global Times that a "third country's" Army could enter Kashmir at Pakistan's request, using the "logic" the Indian Army used to stop the Chinese military from constructing the road in Doklam area.

Geng's comments were in reply to a question on the tension between India and Pakistan, Organisation of Islamic Cooperation (OIC) expressing concern over the situation in Kashmir, and whether China can play role to defuse the hostility between the two countries.

According to Pakistan Foreign Ministry, the OIC Council of Foreign Ministers, who met in Abidjan, Republic of Cote d'Ivoire, passed a resolution on Kashmir.

Indian security forces have been carrying out combing operations in parts of Kashmir to clear the areas of militants supported by Pakistan who launch attacks against them.
Anujan
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by Anujan »

Why get chaddis in a twist. Trump has the memory of a goldfish and attention span of a squirrel. He's just going to say things. Like mediation in JK.

MEA posting a rebuttal is good enough. The days of appointing Robin Raphael are all long gone. If someone like that gets appointed just let it be known that no Massa defence maal will ever get procured. Everything will fall in line.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by KLNMurthy »

CRamS wrote:Well, well, Trump bahadur strikes. Here was this meeting between Taliban Khan and Trump, but real fireworks will be on the airwaves in India with both US and TSP laughing. I am of course referring to Trump's claim or DDM's characterization of Trump's claim that ModiJi bent down on his knees and asked Trump for 'help' on Kashmir. And to this, Trump says he is ready to mediate. Leaving aside the absurdity of this, tells you the level of nonchalance and condescension Trump has for SDRE India knowing fully well how sensitive this issue is to India. Almost showing the middle finger to India's Lakshamn Rekha. Anyway, now you will see Congoons and an array of thugbandhan ass holes go berserk in an orgy of attack and mockery of ModiJi for this Trump claim. More sinister, it will energize TSPA/ISI/pigLeTs/KMs to keep up the pressure on India knowing that US is on their side.
Wow. So the world as we know it has ended for TheMudi and India, because Trump told one more of his habitual lies.

Whatever shall we do, CRamS?
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by CalvinH »

MeshaVishwas wrote:Comment:I am thoroughly impressed by the selection of Baki Fauj.The mask is very very convincing.

FWIW:

At 29:00 did he referred to IRS as Indian Revenue System?
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by KLNMurthy »

SSridhar wrote:Modi would never have asked for Trump's mediation. No Indian ever would, much less Modi. Trump has taken liberty to deliberately misinterpreted any private conversation between him and Modi to suit the occasion.

As I said before, GoTUS/PoTUS have probably decided some rapprochement with Pakistan and an offer to mediate comes handy. Trump, in his usual condescension of others, decided to deliberately play mischief. GoI must take it up strongly with the US.
I think it's even a lot simpler than US / trump playing mischief, or deliberately tweaking India on Kargil Vijaya Diwas because India is not buying their crap or whatever.

Trump's whole operational style is to conclude a meeting successfully by saying whatever it takes to be able to claim success. I believe it is there in his Art of the Deal book. Dim asked for mediation in Kashmir in exchange for bringing Taliban to the table, and Trump said ok fine, and made up some BS to give some substance to the assurance.

So, he had a great meeting with Imran Khan, a great guy from a great country.

It doesn't mean anything and there is no justification for Indians tearing out their hair.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by KLNMurthy »

CRamS wrote:SSJi, I am beginning to wonder if there is any connection whatsoever between Rajnath SinghJi's statement the other day that so called "Kashmir solution is round the corner and no power on earth can stop it" and Trump's condescending offer today? Did govt of India know that POTUS was up to some mischief and came out with this statement. But then again, answering my own question, not sure how what Rajnath SinghJi said in any way helps India counter what Trump said. Both TSP and KMs must be salivating while contemptuously dismissing Rajnath Singh.

Kashi, you are right, what Trump said is usual US mischief, nothing new. Only question I have is all this strategic relationship BS that US generously talks about without anything of substance, and Indian elites get orgasms about; do the Indian interlocutors never hold US accountable on this fundamental core Indian interest? Because a fundamental component of any strategic relationship is to have a heart to heart understanding of each other's core concerns. In this case terrorism. It is very clear that not only does US not take TSP terror against India seriously, but actively encourages it through the kind of mischief we saw from Trump today. So no chaddi twist, it is a genuine concern. Our soldiers and people are dying due to this US TSP collusion.

On whether or nor ModiJi and Trump discussed Kashmir, it does seem from Trump's statement that there was some kind of discussion. Now definitely either Trump is outright lying or was pretty lose in his utterance on the mediation part, but I doubt he is just make something up about the discussion itself.
Seriously, why do you doubt that Trump was making up some BS? He does that all the time.

On the other hand, you are worried that Modi or Rajnath Singh said something that made Trump say what he did. How is it that you have so much faith in Trump's truthfulness and so little in that of the Indian leaders?
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by KLNMurthy »

So, do we like barkha dutt now?
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Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by Peregrine »

X Posted on the P E S W Thread

Over 50% families can’t have two meals a day - Tufail Ahmed

KARACHI: Nearly half of all households in Pakistan are unable to meet their nutritional needs, the first ever survey of its kind in the country has revealed.

According to the National Nutrition Survey 2018 – a copy of which is available with The Express Tribune – poverty keeps more than 50 per cent of Pakistani families from having two meals a day, leading to severe dietary deficiencies.

As a result, as many as 40.2 per cent of all children in the country are affected by chronic malnutrition and stunted growth, which inhibits both their cognitive and physical development, the exercise carried out by the Ministry of National Health Services (NHS) revealed.

The survey also discovered that 36.9 per cent of Pakistani households remain food insecure and lack reliable access to affordable nutritious food in sufficient amounts.

To counter the nutritional emergency as quickly as possible, the federal government has already drafted a food fortification bill for the first time in Pakistan’s history, Pakistan Pediatric Association (PPA) Secretary General Dr Khalid Shafi said. The bill, among other things, will make the addition of micronutrients in items like flour and ghee mandatory, he told The Express Tribune.

The objective of the survey, which will be released publicly today in a ceremony in Karachi, is to draw the attention of policymaking institutes towards the ever growing problem of malnutrition among Pakistani children.

One of the biggest ever

The survey is one of the biggest in Pakistan’s history and covers both the rural and urban population of all four provinces, Gilgit-Baltistan and Azad Jammu and Kashmir. As many as 115,600 families, including 145,324 women, 76,742 children under five years of age and 145,847 minors aged between 10 and 19 years were studied during the course of the survey.

Teams conducting the research took blood and urine samples from participants and investigated water quality and sewerage situation in and around their homes to determine their natural body development and whether it was hindered by diseases or lack of nutrients.

Participants were also interviewed to ascertain their industrial independence, level of education and in the case of women and infants, breastfeeding ratios.

Startling revelations

Among the key findings of the survey is that only 48.4 per cent of women in Pakistan breastfeed their children during infancy. It also found malnutrition to be at least partially a hereditary issue as women who lacked necessary nutrients in their diet gave birth to weak children.

The study pointed out that the early years of child are extremely important in terms of nourishment and malnutrition at this stage hinders cognitive and physical development, affecting both growth and immunities in the long run.

Four out of every 10 children under the age of five in Pakistan were discovered to be affected by stunted growth and lack of education[/b ]and awareness was found to be a significant factor behind this. The study also discovered dietary discrimination in the favour of boys over girls in a significant number of families in the country.

Speaking to The Express Tribune, National Institute of Child Health Chairman Prof Jamal Raza noted that it is alarming that the percentage of children suffering from malnutrition in Pakistan is the same as 24 years ago. He stressed the importance of a proper diet during pregnancy, urging expecting mothers to realise that what they eat is transferred directly to their children.

Dr Shafi, meanwhile, pointed out that being underweight in children often result in both underdeveloped cognitive capacities and a history of recurring medical problems.

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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by vnms »

KLNMurthy wrote:
CRamS wrote:....

Now definitely either Trump is outright lying or was pretty lose in his utterance on the mediation part, but I doubt he is just make something up about the discussion itself.
Seriously, why do you doubt that Trump was making up some BS? He does that all the time.

On the other hand, you are worried that Modi or Rajnath Singh said something that made Trump say what he did. How is it that you have so much faith in Trump's truthfulness and so little in that of the Indian leaders?
Saar, please do what I do. Ignore CRamS. There is a trend and a narrative about his posts. Going back years.
He only posts stuff that either makes him miserable or that he thinks makes us miserable.

I believe, someone else also noticed that trend.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by CRamS »

KLNM, I do believe our guys. Trump was just mouthing stuff thinking he is a grand kingmaker among two naughty boys. As I say in US thread, he doesn't take India or Indian concerns seriously enough, and in this, he is in line with general US policy. But so far no damage.

But I do think his statement may have the deleterious effect of energizing Paki ISI/A and their pigLeTs. Thats the only thing that matters in terms of harm done to India. In the short term, TSP might even more visibly GUBO to Trump in AfPak while unleashing pigLeTs in Kashmir and remind Trump of his desire to mediate. Lets wait and see.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by CRamS »

Kashi
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by Kashi »

KLNMurthy wrote:On the other hand, you are worried that Modi or Rajnath Singh said something that made Trump say what he did. How is it that you have so much faith in Trump's truthfulness and so little in that of the Indian leaders?
Because Murica...eff yeh..reading all of CRamS's posts, this is the impression I get. Everything Murican leader does is deeply woven in Chankianess and Indian leaders are all doofuses in comparison.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by SSridhar »

How Trump sold Kabul and New Delhi down the river - Chidanand Rajghatta - ToI
He loves deals and thinks he has mastered the “Art of the Deal.” And the deal Pakistan sucked in him into on a hot and muggy Washington afternoon was “Afghanistan exit-for-Kashmir mediation.” . . . US President Donald Trump on Monday restored Islamabad’s primacy over Kabul, saying “Pakistan is going to help us out to extricate ourselves (from Afghanistan).”

In the process, Trump threw Kabul and New Delhi under the bus while retreating from his own charges of Pakistan’s deceit and double dealing on sponsoring terrorism in the region, identifying Iran as his principal enemy and declaring (that unlike Iran) “Pakistan does not lie.” . . . “I don’t think Pakistan respected the United States. I don’t think Pakistan respected its presidents. I think Pakistan can do tremendous amount against -- with respect to Afghanistan. They didn’t do it and I don’t’ blame them because they were dealing with the wrong President. Who knows? But… they’re helping us a lot now,” the US President rambled, openly displaying pique about his predecessors and bringing it into the foreign policy sphere.

“I think they could have helped us a lot in the past. But it doesn’t matter. We have a new leader; he’s doing to be a great leader of Pakistan. And we have a new leader here. Sort of new; I’m two and half years now -- getting to be three years, can you believe it? You’re going to find time flies,” Trump rambled on. “But, no, I think Pakistan could have done a lot but they chose not to. And that’s because they did not respect US leadership.

In fact, Trump went to far as to say Pakistan was “subversive” despite taking $ 1.3 billion in aid that he had ended, but because of him, “I think we have a better relationship with Pakistan right now than we did when we were paying that money” All that (aid) can come back depending on what we work out, he added, before he segued into the possibility of his mediation role in the Kashmir issue.
The architect of what experts reckon will be Trump’s Faustian bargain to return to power in Kabul the very forces that nurtured terrorists who attacked the US on 9/11 is said to be Senator Linsday Graham, who visited Pakistan earlier this year and appears to have persuaded Trump to change policy.

“Peace with honor and dignity in Afghanistan is only possible with the complete buy in of Pakistan. It is now time for the United States to have a strategic relationship with Pakistan, which is best achieved by a free trade agreement tied to security performance,” Graham tweeted on Monday after meeting Imran Khan ahead of the Pakistani prime minister’s White House meeting with Trump.
On Tuesday, Pakistan’s prime minister Imran Khan was all gratitude for Trump’s turnaround. “I want to thank President Trump for his warm & gracious hospitality, his understanding of Pakistan's point of view & his wonderful way of putting our entire delegation at ease. Appreciate the President taking out time to show us the historic White House private quarters,” he tweeted. The man referred to as "Taliban Khan" even in Pakistan then added: “I want to assure President Trump Pakistan will do everything within its power to facilitate the Afghan peace process. The world owes it to the long-suffering Afghan people to bring about peace after 4 decades of conflict.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by SSridhar »

So, is this the sixth marriage after the fifth divorce between the same partners?
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by Kashi »

Either Amreekis are dimwitted enough to believe that Bakis will keep their side of the bargain or they are dimwitted enough to believe that repeating the mistakes of the past will lead to different outcomes this time.

What exactly is the game plan of these dimwits?
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by SSridhar »

The American system operates on extremely short cycles and on realpolitik. Has always been so. They have been supremely confident that they could handle blowbacks as a result of their tactical approach, through various means - economic, political, military & diplomatic. Very seldom have they been strategic in their approach. Trump has taken this several notches above.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by Anujan »

People, relax. Two days ago Trump claimed that Pakistan was hunting Hafiz Saeed for ten years. And then you expect the JK mediation statement was some kind of chunkian plan. He just heard JK, Modi, mediation and then formed the first intelligible sentence that came to his mind
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by CRamS »

In all the brouhaha on Trump's Kashmir remark, we forgot another of his brazen utterance. He said if he wants to, he can wipe out Afghanistan in 10 days by killing 10 million people. And I sense no outrage, nada, zilch in US media on this. Now, at the expense of a bad analogy, just imagine ModiJi had said something similar: He can easily solve Kashmir in 10 days by wiping out the 3 million valley Muslims. Can you imagine the ruckus this would have caused in India, in TSP, and in US and around the world. I guess different strokes for different folks.

Anujan, I agree no need to lose sleep. But what Trump has done is to bring re-hyphenation of India and TSP back to center stage. Apart from Kashmir, Taliban Khan was also asked if TSP would give up nukes if India did. So once again India TSP, India TSP. Back to square one however slowly we were trying to drift away from the hyphenation.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by SSridhar »

Anujan wrote:. . . and then formed the first intelligible sentence that came to his mind
:rotfl:
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by partha »

https://www.thenews.com.pk/print/502734 ... r-pakistan
US may release CSF funding for Pakistan
ISLAMABAD: Ruling out possibility of any rescheduling of foreign debt under Paris Club arrangement with the blessings of USA, Pakistan might see positive movement on release of pending funds of $9 billion from USA in shape of Coalition Support Fund (CSF). But this could only happen if truce in Afghanistan struck successfully as Washington is expecting some ‘positive outcome’ by September 2019.
If this is true, we can expect increase in cross border terror attacks. Modi Govt should start preparing plans on how to respond. Something bigger than Balakot will be needed. Also, surprised at the de-escalation post Balakot. When Pakistan was at its weakest we let them off. Now US is again courting Pakistan. In 2008, US put pressure on India to not respond militarily to 26/11 because it would affect their so called war on terror in Afghanistan. Now, with US courting Pakistan again for help with pull out from Afghanistan, Pakistan may calculate that it will get away with a large terror attack on India just like in 2008.
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Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Post by chetak »

twitter
Interesting sidebar. PM Imran Khan’s spouse did not accompany him to Washington DC but the Army Chief Qamar Bajwa’s wife did.

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