Terroristan - May 1, 2019

The Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum is a venue to discuss issues pertaining to India's security environment, her strategic outlook on global affairs and as well as the effect of international relations in the Indian Subcontinent. We request members to kindly stay within the mandate of this forum and keep their exchanges of views, on a civilised level, however vehemently any disagreement may be felt. All feedback regarding forum usage may be sent to the moderators using the Feedback Form or by clicking the Report Post Icon in any objectionable post for proper action. Please note that the views expressed by the Members and Moderators on these discussion boards are that of the individuals only and do not reflect the official policy or view of the Bharat-Rakshak.com Website. Copyright Violation is strictly prohibited and may result in revocation of your posting rights - please read the FAQ for full details. Users must also abide by the Forum Guidelines at all times.
partha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3998
Joined: 02 Jul 2010 15:25

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby partha » 03 Nov 2019 12:20

mmasand wrote:I'm the Dims request to travel to Saudia was rejected

What? source? Rejected by who? Bajwa?

Rsatchi
BRFite
Posts: 321
Joined: 04 Aug 2019 22:03

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Rsatchi » 03 Nov 2019 14:19

Lower Platelets count in Nawaz Sharif’s body!
A known fact is that ‘Polonium’ (radio active element) is used to eliminate enemies. It acts as slow poison & destroy platelets. Only specialised radioactive laboratory can verify it.
International laboratory must examine it
from Altaf bhai's twitter
'Polonium' scores again!!!
Wonder where the Napaks got it from? Chin???

Peregrine
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7997
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Peregrine » 03 Nov 2019 16:08

LIVE BLOG: As deadline for resignation looms, Imran says NRO for protesters will amount to treachery
ISLAMABAD: Tens of thousands of opposition supporters led by JUI-F’s Maulana Fazlur Rehman have gathered in Islamabad to demand the ouster of Prime Minister Imran Khan, warning of chaos if their demands were not met.
The protest in the capital is the first concerted opposition challenge the cricket star-turned-politician has faced since he won a general election last year promising to end corruption.
Security remains tight in Islamabad with the government and diplomatic sector – just a few kilometres from the rally site – sealed off, and roads blocked from shipping containers.
Cheers Image

mmasand
BRFite
Posts: 587
Joined: 19 May 2009 23:46

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby mmasand » 03 Nov 2019 19:55

partha wrote:
mmasand wrote:I'm the Dims request to travel to Saudia was rejected

What? source? Rejected by who? Bajwa?

The Saudis, this was a day prior to the investment summit where fascist Moody was to cast his spell inviting kuffars to invest in yindoo stan.

Peregrine
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7997
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Peregrine » 03 Nov 2019 20:55

Opinion: Dahrna – then and now – Dr Pervez Tahir
There was a dharna in 2014 and there is the imminent threat of another one now. What are the differences and similarities? Then, the newly-elected PML-N government was in the second year of its term. The same is true now for the PTI government. Both followed a largely peaceful transfer of power. The rallying point in each case was dhandli (rigging) in elections and the charter of demand was topped by the resignation of the prime minister. Coincidentally, Imran Khan had also described his protest as an “Azadi” March. Is it then a case of “as you sow, so shall you reap” or “the chickens have come home to roost”?
Cheers Image

Peregrine
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7997
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Peregrine » 03 Nov 2019 21:15

Image

Cheers Image

Peregrine
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7997
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Peregrine » 03 Nov 2019 22:38

Image

Cheers Image

Peregrine
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7997
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Peregrine » 04 Nov 2019 01:20

Fazl hints at shifting to a ‘more effective ground’

* JUI-F chief says 'mischief' of waving Afghan Taliban flag in rally could be a doing of the government

* Durrani says opposition wants to engage in talks but government's attitude is not appropriate


Ansar-ul-islamJamiat Ulema-e-Islam-Fazl (JUI-F) chief Maulana Fazlur Rehman on Saturday hinted at taking a ‘hard decision’ to ‘maintain the flow of the anti-government movement’, as opposition’s Rehbar Committee discussed different options, including mass resignations from assemblies, lockdown and blocking the highways.

Addressing the participants of the Azadi March in the federal capital, Fazl vowed to topple the ruling regime and run the country himself. “The writ of the incumbent government has ended … now we will run the country,” he told the rally on the second day. “We will provide satisfaction and protection to the country,” he said and asked the ruling regime to step down and don’t test their patience. [“We will remain in the arena until we get rid of the government,” he declared, and also hinted at taking ‘hard decision’ in the next two days. “Our history is full of movements […] We have to take a decision by tomorrow (Sunday) or the day after tomorrow (Monday),” he said, adding that he will be evaluating options to ‘shift from this ground to a more effective ground’. “We don’t want to worsen the situation. Fifteen million marches in nine months are enough for the evidence that how organised we have been and how the participants of the marches maintained the law and order situation,” he noted.

Fazl strongly criticised the government over its economic policies and declared the ruling regime a ‘security risk’ for the country. He said the government in its first year borrowed more money than all previous governments collectively borrowed during the last 70 years.

He said that inflation increased during the tenure of the incumbent government, adding that value of the local currency has decreased from Rs105 to Rs160 against US dollar during the PTI’s tenure. “Poor people in Pakistan are unable to purchase ration for their children,” he said, adding that the country under the current government will further move down with each passing day.

Fazl said his party is functioning as per the earlier agreement with the government, however the Islamabad administration took certain steps which nullified the pact. He said women are very much part of the march as no one has pushed them aside. “Women are part of this protest, sitting at home and offering prayers,” he said, adding that from overall the situation, it can be imagined how much hatred prevails against the incumbent government.

The JUI-F chief said the government is wrong in its criticism over someone waving an Afghan Taliban flag in the protest. “This government doesn’t know a thing except abusing, hurling accusations and lying,” he said. “Someone waved an Afghan Taliban flag … the one whom you call terrorists were welcomed by Pakistan with presidential protocol … America engaged with them in dialogue … they were also welcomed in Moscow,” he said, adding that the ‘mischief’ could be a doing of the government to find something against the protesters.

Responding to PM Imran’s statement that the protest was getting massive coverage from India, Fazl said he was getting worldwide coverage as media from across the world ‘could not ignore them’.

Meanwhile, addressing a press conference after a meeting of the Rehbar Committee, convener of the committee Akram Khan Durrani said all options, including resignations from assemblies, lockdown and blocking highways are under consideration. He said the opposition parties are standing by the agreement signed with the Islamabad administration but the government is backtracking. He also raised objection over the tone of Prime Minister Imran Khan and Pakistan Tehreek-i-Insaf (PTI) leader Pervez Khattak. He advised them to be polite while maintaining contacts with the opposition. He also announced that the opposition will decide its future course of action till Sunday (today) evening.

Durrani said the opposition is sticking to its demands of Prime Minister Imran Khan’s resignation and the holding of fresh elections in the country. He said the opposition leaders agreed that the Azadi March’s objectives of the prime minister’s resignation and transparent fresh elections without the army’s supervision will remain in place.

Durrani said any irresponsible action by non-democratic forces will be against the national interest. “All opposition parties are unanimous on this point and oppose it,” he added.

Cheers Image

Neela
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3631
Joined: 30 Jul 2004 15:05
Location: Spectator in the dossier diplomacy tennis match

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Neela » 04 Nov 2019 02:39

Image

Amber G.
BRF Oldie
Posts: 6658
Joined: 17 Dec 2002 12:31
Location: Ohio, USA

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Amber G. » 04 Nov 2019 03:08

Rsatchi wrote:Lower Platelets count in Nawaz Sharif’s body!
A known fact is that ‘Polonium’ (radio active element) is used to eliminate enemies. It acts as slow poison & destroy platelets. Only specialised radioactive laboratory can verify it.
International laboratory must examine it
from Altaf bhai's twitter
'Polonium' scores again!!!
Wonder where the Napaks got it from? Chin???

This is a good source for Po poisoning ;https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19492929
It may take weeks/months for person to die -- Po half life is 138 days.. and in body it will remain about 30-60 days before getting out.

Many say it is a "perfect poison" but it has a drawback - it leaves a trail - If investigators are alert enough to detect it has been used, they can follow the radioactive trail it leaves on everything it has come into contact with before the killing to find and identify a suspect. About 100 grams a year (almost all in Russia) is produced, if one wants buy from a known source .... but a a nuclear reactor and some Bi-209 can produce it so US, Israel, China, India, Japan, (and many other countries) and most likely Pakistan can get it but TSPA (and those who keep control over the reactors) has to be involved.

Peregrine
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7997
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Peregrine » 04 Nov 2019 03:26

JUI-F Azadi March

LATEST ITEM : 'We have a Plan B and a Plan C': Maulana vows to continue anti-govt movement"

Cheers Image

mmasand
BRFite
Posts: 587
Joined: 19 May 2009 23:46

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby mmasand » 04 Nov 2019 06:52

Neela wrote:Image


This ISPR funded clown is at it again!

Peregrine
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7997
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Peregrine » 04 Nov 2019 16:19

Pak protest leader convenes all-party meet as deadline for PM Imran's resignation ends – PTI

ISLAMABAD: Pakistan's firebrand cleric-cum-politician Maulana Fazlur Rehman on Monday convened an all-party conference to discuss the future course of action as the 48-hour deadline set by him for Prime Minister Imran Khan's resignation has expired.

The Jamiat Ulema-e-Islam Fazl (JUI-F) leader, who is leading a huge protest dubbed as 'Azadi March' comprising tens of thousands of his supporters in the national capital, said the movement to oust the prime minister "will continue to move ahead and will never be on the back foot".

Rehman on Friday gave Khan a two-day ultimatum to resign, saying the "Gorbachev of Pakistan" must step down without testing the patience of peaceful protestors.

The 66-year-old cleric said that the protest would continue until the prime minister steps down.
The JUI-F has convened an all-party conference to discuss the future course of action in consultation with the leaders of other opposition parties, The Express Tribune reported.

Rehman's call for the protest has been supported by Pakistan Muslim League Nawaz (PML-N), Pakistan Peoples Party (PPP), Pakhtunkhwa Milli Awami Party, Qaumi Watan Party, National Party and Awami National Party.

However, Dawn news reported that PPP chief Bilawal Bhutto-Zardari and PML-N head Shehbaz Sharif may not be able to attend the all-party meeting.

“It was highly unlikely for party chiefs Bilawal and Shehbaz to make it to Islamabad on such a short notice,” the report quoted respective party leaders as saying.

Shehbaz was unable to attend due to back pain and other prior engagements, Dawn news quoted PML-N sources as saying.

Bilawal, who is in Bahawalpur city, about 620 kms from here, will not be able to attend the meeting in which final consultations of the Azadi March's future strategy would be held, according to the PPP sources.

Meanwhile, the Lahore High Court has accepted for hearing a petition demanding action against JUI-F chief Rehman for "challenging the writ of government, delivering hate, provocative and seditious speeches against the state", the report said.

Prime Minister Khan has rejected the protestors' demand to resign and said that the demonstration was an effort to get a deal for the release of the PML-N and the PPP top leaders who are currently in jails due to corruption allegations.

Khan has reiterated that he would never give a National Reconciliation Ordinance like concession to leaders of the opposition parties facing corruption cases.

Special Assistant to the Prime Minister on Information Dr Firdous Ashiq Awan has said that "the prime minister is determined to meet the democratic demands of the opposition through dialogue process".

The Imran Khan government has expressed desire to meet all demands of the opposition parties -- except the premier's resignation.

Elaborate security arrangements have been put in place by the government to maintain law and order in the capital. The main roads have been completely or partially blocked by placing shipping containers and barbed wires.

The Red Zone housing key official buildings and diplomatic enclave have already been secured by blocking the entry points. About 700 security personnel were deployed to safeguard the Red Zone.

Rehman has decided to avoid marching towards the sensitive Red Zone or surrounding Prime Minister's House.

The police and paramilitary force held security parades to deal with the marchers if they tried to invade the Red Zone.

The protestors have settled in the sprawling ground near Peshawar Mor area here where different political parties have set up camps to house their workers.

Cheers Image

Peregrine
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7997
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Peregrine » 04 Nov 2019 17:17


Rony
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2563
Joined: 14 Jul 2006 23:29

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Rony » 04 Nov 2019 17:36


ArjunPandit
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2922
Joined: 29 Mar 2017 06:37

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby ArjunPandit » 04 Nov 2019 17:40


sir, that is the most cruel joke in a thread that is named terroristan...

menon s
BRFite
Posts: 698
Joined: 01 May 2010 09:51
Location: Bangalore

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby menon s » 04 Nov 2019 18:11

There is a video out there a jack ass named DR.Danish interviewing Mirza Aslam Beg.
Aslam Beg is full of Islamic piety mixed with duplicity, But what caught my attention was, the talk that INDIA needs to be given,
a fundamental Blow (like what Iran did to Saudi--oil field attack), that will change things fundamentally, in favor of
Pakistan. He says a plan was there during his time, but now a better plan is in place. but only needs PMs approval, to take it forward.

He is on the other side of bajwa,Imran divide.

Anyway, a big attack is in planning....i think we should attack POK, before this happens.

Philip
BRF Oldie
Posts: 20107
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: India

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Philip » 04 Nov 2019 20:06

Imran is going for the head of the anti- Imran bandwagon, charging him with a variety of wrongdoings. His option A, to lock up the bugger and deal with the mob with the lathi. The Paki army is having by supporting both sides
and true to form grooming options when the skipper , Capt.Khan is hit for 6.

Imran has failed on the economic front, no doubt that he inherited a bankrupt Pakistan but he has been to counter India on the Kashmir issue on the global stage, now in full Indian control.by the scrapping of Art.370 , even losing support from some of its traditional Muslim brethren in recent times. That to the Paki army
is an unpardonable sin.Imran is as useful to Pak as a well used piece of toilet paper.He cannot get economic aid despite his western education ( perhaps ditching Jemima the Jew has not been forgotten by thd shite world) and cannot deter India from upping the military ante to the gross discomfiture and loss of face for the Paki military. It is only a matter of time before he is forced to step down in disgrace.Timing is most important for the Paki army.In Imran's case it is not "if" he will be deposed but " when".

Vikas
BRF Oldie
Posts: 6162
Joined: 03 Dec 2005 02:40
Location: Where DST doesn't bother me
Contact:

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Vikas » 04 Nov 2019 21:42

I think this whole Dharna thing will land up in Paki SC. Both the sides have burned all the bridges and Paki Army has taken up the side of Dimran so I don't see him walking back in shame.
Getting a Govt thrown out in 1 year does no favor to Bajwa. As long as politicians are at loggerheads with each other and civil society in taters, Its all roses for Army.

Vikas
BRF Oldie
Posts: 6162
Joined: 03 Dec 2005 02:40
Location: Where DST doesn't bother me
Contact:

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Vikas » 04 Nov 2019 21:49

menon s wrote:There is a video out there a jack ass named DR.Danish interviewing Mirza Aslam Beg.
Aslam Beg is full of Islamic piety mixed with duplicity, But what caught my attention was, the talk that INDIA needs to be given,
a fundamental Blow (like what Iran did to Saudi--oil field attack), that will change things fundamentally, in favor of
Pakistan. He says a plan was there during his time, but now a better plan is in place. but only needs PMs approval, to take it forward.

He is on the other side of bajwa,Imran divide.

Anyway, a big attack is in planning....i think we should attack POK, before this happens.


Menon Ji, As usual, This is Paki bluster. If they had any plan, They would have executed it. You think they need PM's approval to hurt India. That is BS.
Beg was COAS from 1988 until his retirement in 1991. If you remember those days, Pakis were shivering in their pants due to Ops Brasstacks first, completely locked into Afghan mess and later got sucked into Gulf war.
Isn't it hilarious that other than Nuke, They have tried almost everything on India and yet it is Pakis who are drowning. Kargil, 26/11, attack on Parliament, Kashmir terrorism...list is never ending
What can they do that the blowback will not cause permanent destruction of Paki way of life. Every retired Paki General acts and talks as if defeating India and capturing Kashmir was just a step away and bloody civvies spoiled the whole game.

UlanBatori
BRF Oldie
Posts: 12764
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby UlanBatori » 04 Nov 2019 23:07

I am sorry but whose idea was this Katarpur terrorist corridor (KTC)? Imagine the burden on the overstretched intel and security and BSF due to this! Everytime I see these I get pulled more towards the cheen model where they just diss all faith and religion except Eleven-worship, blow up the places of worship and send the worshippers to do "Karma Yoga" breaking rocks.

Then again, I have to remember who is the Nat. Sec. chief. :eek:

pankajs
BRF Oldie
Posts: 12083
Joined: 13 Aug 2009 20:56

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby pankajs » 04 Nov 2019 23:41

Vikas wrote:
menon s wrote:There is a video out there a jack ass named DR.Danish interviewing Mirza Aslam Beg.
Aslam Beg is full of Islamic piety mixed with duplicity, But what caught my attention was, the talk that INDIA needs to be given,
a fundamental Blow (like what Iran did to Saudi--oil field attack), that will change things fundamentally, in favor of
Pakistan. He says a plan was there during his time, but now a better plan is in place. but only needs PMs approval, to take it forward.

He is on the other side of bajwa,Imran divide.

Anyway, a big attack is in planning....i think we should attack POK, before this happens.


Menon Ji, As usual, This is Paki bluster. If they had any plan, They would have executed it. You think they need PM's approval to hurt India. That is BS.
Beg was COAS from 1988 until his retirement in 1991. If you remember those days, Pakis were shivering in their pants due to Ops Brasstacks first, completely locked into Afghan mess and later got sucked into Gulf war.
Isn't it hilarious that other than Nuke, They have tried almost everything on India and yet it is Pakis who are drowning. Kargil, 26/11, attack on Parliament, Kashmir terrorism...list is never ending
What can they do that the blowback will not cause permanent destruction of Paki way of life. Every retired Paki General acts and talks as if defeating India and capturing Kashmir was just a step away and bloody civvies spoiled the whole game.

Correct on the 2nd highlight! Anyone remember why Abhinandan was returned so promptly? or What logic Dimran gave for it in the baki national assembly?

While bakis can and will do mischief, the present establishment knows what will come after that. If they are prepared for the fallout they can try delivering the so called "fatal" blow to India and find out who gets knocked out.

On the 1st highlight, everyone has a plan till they get punched in the face. Mushrat too had a plan in Kargil .. a brilliant plan till it met the resolve of the Indian Army. Btw, the last double highlighted bit is classic baki army maneuver to absolve itself of cowardice by laying all action/inaction at the doors of the civilian leadership.

Rony
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2563
Joined: 14 Jul 2006 23:29

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Rony » 05 Nov 2019 01:29

Protests against Pakistan's Imran Khan: Right-wing vs. right-wing

Some rights activists say that liberals can't sit back and be neutral at this decisive moment. They will lose their relevance even further if they just allow one conservative group to take on another and do not do anything themselves.


Who are these imaginary "liberals" ? I dont see one.

Peregrine
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7997
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Peregrine » 05 Nov 2019 05:18

LIVE BLOG: Imran was earlier ‘selected’, now he’s become ‘rejected’: FazlI
ISLAMABAD: Tens of thousands of opposition supporters led by JUI-F’s Maulana Fazlur Rehman have gathered in Islamabad to demand the ouster of Prime Minister Imran Khan, warning of chaos if their demands were not met.
The protest in the capital is the first concerted opposition challenge the cricket star-turned-politician has faced since he won a general election last year promising to end corruption.
Security remains tight in Islamabad with the government and diplomatic sector – just a few kilometres from the rally site – sealed off, and roads blocked from shipping containers.
Cheers Image

Peregrine
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7997
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Peregrine » 05 Nov 2019 05:21

Image

Cheers Image

yensoy
BRFite
Posts: 1480
Joined: 29 May 2002 11:31
Location: USA

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby yensoy » 05 Nov 2019 07:17

UlanBatori wrote:I am sorry but whose idea was this Katarpur terrorist corridor (KTC)? Imagine the burden on the overstretched intel and security and BSF due to this! Everytime I see these I get pulled more towards the cheen model where they just diss all faith and religion except Eleven-worship, blow up the places of worship and send the worshippers to do "Karma Yoga" breaking rocks.

Then again, I have to remember who is the Nat. Sec. chief. :eek:


Mostly we play on front-foot. Sometimes we need to play on back-foot. Kartarpur is that situation. We won't get out, we may even take a single, it's ok. But we didn't have an option to not play this ball.

Vikas
BRF Oldie
Posts: 6162
Joined: 03 Dec 2005 02:40
Location: Where DST doesn't bother me
Contact:

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Vikas » 05 Nov 2019 10:03

Someone please tell me How is opening of Kartarpur, a bad idea ?

yensoy
BRFite
Posts: 1480
Joined: 29 May 2002 11:31
Location: USA

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby yensoy » 05 Nov 2019 10:15

Vikas wrote:Someone please tell me How is opening of Kartarpur, a bad idea ?


I won't call it a "bad idea" but there are some negatives which have to be dealt with through policing/enforcement:
1. Conduit for money and counterfeit money into India through willing agents.
2. Potential to radicalize a section of the population during the several hours they are in enemy territory.
3. Publicity "win" for Pak in some sections of society.
4. Potential to infiltrate people into India as well (unless 100% biometrics checking is done).
5. Flow of funds into Pak; the $20 entry fee is only one part - donations from devotees to Kartarpur Sahib may also be skimmed off.
6. Potential for backlash if Indian side does heavy enforcement of rules - frisking, denial of permission etc. Needs to be handled with velvet glove.

venug
BRFite
Posts: 200
Joined: 15 Aug 2016 21:39

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby venug » 05 Nov 2019 10:30

Vikas wrote:Someone please tell me How is opening of Kartarpur, a bad idea ?

7. Posters of Khalistan were posted near Gurudwara even before agreement was signed.
8. Khalistani leaders were invited.
9. Recent arms drop using drones into Punjab.
10. Recent tweet by Immy the dim that Hindus are not allowed.

I wish someone explains me how it is a good idea when It is very clear from the start the intention is to restart Khalistan movement given that Khalistani terrorists were being felicitated in Canada, US, UK and now Kartarpur.and as already pointed out, 20$ per pilgrim means 100000$ per day, we are giving a life line and axing our legs. This is very similar to IWT, sacrifice for ur enemy so he can stab you deep yet another time.

rrao
BRFite
Posts: 122
Joined: 13 Feb 2007 22:17

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby rrao » 05 Nov 2019 12:17

Pakistan has ‘ulterior motive’ in opening Kartarpur corridor: Amarinder Singh

rrao
BRFite
Posts: 122
Joined: 13 Feb 2007 22:17

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby rrao » 05 Nov 2019 12:20

rrao wrote:Pakistan has ‘ulterior motive’ in opening Kartarpur corridor: Amarinder Singh


In another 2 -3 years we may have to do another op blue star...in Kartarpur corridor!! Knowingly why we fall into a trap?? :shock:

sanjaykumar
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4083
Joined: 16 Oct 2005 05:51

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby sanjaykumar » 05 Nov 2019 12:23

How many of the pilgrims will be RAW agents? Funnelling money to Baluch, calling for freedom of religion and democracy in Pakistan?

habal
BRF Oldie
Posts: 6690
Joined: 24 Dec 2009 18:46

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby habal » 05 Nov 2019 12:24

difference between 2014 dharna and 2019 azadi march as per Hamid Mir.


Vikas
BRF Oldie
Posts: 6162
Joined: 03 Dec 2005 02:40
Location: Where DST doesn't bother me
Contact:

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Vikas » 05 Nov 2019 15:48

yensoy wrote:
Vikas wrote:Someone please tell me How is opening of Kartarpur, a bad idea ?


I won't call it a "bad idea" but there are some negatives which have to be dealt with through policing/enforcement:
1. Conduit for money and counterfeit money into India through willing agents.
2. Potential to radicalize a section of the population during the several hours they are in enemy territory.
3. Publicity "win" for Pak in some sections of society.
4. Potential to infiltrate people into India as well (unless 100% biometrics checking is done).
5. Flow of funds into Pak; the $20 entry fee is only one part - donations from devotees to Kartarpur Sahib may also be skimmed off.
6. Potential for backlash if Indian side does heavy enforcement of rules - frisking, denial of permission etc. Needs to be handled with velvet glove.


Yensoy Ji, Of all the points, What is already not happening right now by wily Pakis ?
Why would GoI not check those returning from Kartarpur properly for narcotics, FICN or even banned literature ?
Rest all are operational risk which are same as Sikh Jatha traveling to Nankana sahib. It isn't like Sikhs from Indian side would just walk into Kartarpur with no monitoring by Indian agencies. All that is needed is monitoring.
Good PR for Pakis would last few days and then it would become normal till Pakis abduct another girl or Jehadis lynch some Sikh gentleman in Peshawar.
If all the above points are really reason of worry for GoI, then we should stop letting Sikh jatha goto Pakistan every year.
Anyways We have enough material in Indian side of the Gurudwars to radicalize someone.

heavy enforcement of rules - frisking, denial of permission etc.

Indian state apparatus anyways is rude, Maha-corrupt and heavy handed with general Public. We have made our peace with them. It is our normal.

venug wrote:
Vikas wrote:Someone please tell me How is opening of Kartarpur, a bad idea ?

7. Posters of Khalistan were posted near Gurudwara even before agreement was signed.
8. Khalistani leaders were invited.
9. Recent arms drop using drones into Punjab.
10. Recent tweet by Immy the dim that Hindus are not allowed.

I wish someone explains me how it is a good idea when It is very clear from the start the intention is to restart Khalistan movement given that Khalistani terrorists were being felicitated in Canada, US, UK and now Kartarpur.and as already pointed out, 20$ per pilgrim means 100000$ per day, we are giving a life line and axing our legs. This is very similar to IWT, sacrifice for ur enemy so he can stab you deep yet another time.


Venug Ji, It is a good idea because it lets Sikh devotees visit the last resting place of Baba Nanak which is dear to many from Sikh Faith.
Point # 7,8,9,10 were there even before Kartarpur happened. As far money part, I think it is very little assuming there will be 2000 devotees every day of the year.

My biggest problem with the 'Bad Idea' narrative is that all the points above make it sound like Sikhs are not patriotic and would fall for Paki tactics and carry narcotics, FICN and come back as Khalistani terrorists.
No one has ever spoken about Hindus getting radicalized ever when they visit Pakistan.
Last edited by Vikas on 05 Nov 2019 15:58, edited 1 time in total.

Peregrine
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7997
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Peregrine » 05 Nov 2019 15:57

PM Imran ready to accept all 'valid' demands except resignation - Rizwan Ghilzai
ISLAMABAD: Prime Minister Imran Khan said on Tuesday that he was prepared to accept all ‘valid’ demands put forth by opposition parties except the Jamaat-e-Ulema-Islami Fazl’s (JUI-F) demand for the premier’s resignation, said sources.
The premier reportedly made the remarks in a meeting with the Pervez Khattak-led team tasked to negotiate with opposition parties taking part in the ‘Azadi March’.
During the meeting, Khattak apprised the premier of last night’s meeting with the opposition’s Rahbar Committee, headed by Akram Khan Durrani of the JUI-F, in Islamabad.
PM Imran emphasised that the Khattak-led team was fully empowered to negotiate and instructed them to respond in a positive manner if the opposition displays seriousness towards reaching a consensus.
“The government is ready to accept all valid demands except the demand for resignation.”
The negotiating team, which includes National Assembly Speaker Asad Qaiser, Education Minister Shafqat Mehmood, Religious Affairs Minister Noorul Haq Qadri and former finance minister Asad Umar, is scheduled to meet Rehman committee later today.
The development comes on the fifth day of the ongoing anti-government sit-in led by JUI-F chief Maulana Fazlur Rehman.
Cheers Image

yensoy
BRFite
Posts: 1480
Joined: 29 May 2002 11:31
Location: USA

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby yensoy » 05 Nov 2019 17:34

Vikas wrote:
yensoy wrote:
I won't call it a "bad idea" but there are some negatives which have to be dealt with through policing/enforcement:


My biggest problem with the 'Bad Idea' narrative is that all the points above make it sound like Sikhs are not patriotic and would fall for Paki tactics and carry narcotics, FICN and come back as Khalistani terrorists.


Sir, the "bad idea" terminology was yours :eek: and I called it out in my previous reply.

I don't think the issue here is about patriotism of Sikhs; rather about opening yet another avenue for infiltration, ideology, FICN etc. People are impressionable, and there are some pretty bad memories which can be raked up and negative sentiments can be developed & weaponized. At least there is the possibility, and it is our duty to guard against it. No point complaining that the Pakis used an opportunity, which is why I said that we have to play the ball whether we like it or not, and we have to play it defensively and render their gambit fruitless.

Yes, the security apparatus handling Kartarpur corridor has to be extremely humane. I think that overall immigration and security officials at airports are pretty ok; of course mine might be a biased view and may not reflect what the yatrees will encounter. We can't have the kind of shake down officials manning the Thar express checkpoint or B'desh border that we read about in the papers.

Peregrine
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7997
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Peregrine » 05 Nov 2019 17:54

X Posted on the J&K Union Territory-2019Thread

Kashmiris and Indian Muslims - Jawed Naqvi

the aftermath of the anti-Ahmadi violence in the 1950s, Maulana Abul Hasanat Sayyed Muhammad Ahmad Qadri, President of Jamiatul Ulema-i-Pakistan, demanded an Islamic state in Pakistan. And deposed before the Justice Munir Commission that looked into the violence.

Q: You will admit for the Hindus, who are in a majority in India, (a similar) right to have a Hindu religious state?

A: Yes.

Q: Will you have any objection if the Muslims are treated under that form of government as Malishes (Mlechhas) or Shudras under the law of Manu?

A: No.


Maulana Fazlur Rehman heads a faction of the Jamiat today. I gained a nodding acquaintance with the maulana when, for a reason difficult to fathom at the time, he became a regular interlocutor with Indian journalists visiting Pakistan. The maulana’s portly bearing and merry laughter had a likeness to Friar Tuck whose Robin Hood, albeit too briefly, Musharraf had become. A version of the English legend has the monk fording the river in Sherwood Forest with Robin Hood on his back when, in midstream, for no apparent reason, he hurled his friend into the freezing waters. That’s more or less what the maulana is said to have done with Musharraf.

In recent days, the cleric from the doctrinaire Deoband school of Muslim theology has been raging at Imran Khan, accusing the prime minister of insincerity towards the Kashmiri people facing Indian high-handedness since Aug 5. The stance is double-edged.

Fazlur Rehman has friends in high places with the Indian government. Besides, he has the entire Jamiatul Ulema-i-Hind (JUH) and the Deoband seminary eating out of his hands. Atal Behari Vajpayee embraced him and Manmohan Singh welcomed him to the prime ministerial residence. This was around the time when Benazir Bhutto was struggling to get an appointment with Vajpayee in New Delhi, when, as the grapevine had it, she was seeking his intervention to iron things out with Gen Musharraf.

Important Pakistani visitors from the left and liberal corner have not had the ease of access to the prime minister’s office in recent years as the maulana did. His equation with the Modi establishment is not clear, but given the Indian prime minister’s chummy relationship with the rulers of Saudi Arabia — a common link between Rehman and the JUH — it’s not difficult to imagine an agreeable prospect.

The fact that the maulana would routinely drive off to the Deoband seminary, not far from the Indian capital, following his official sojourns, suggests a link between the two stops. That P. Chidambaram made a much-publicised visit to the seminary as home minister further indicates a strong political interest between the Indian government and the orthodox clerics of Deoband. And perhaps it also delivers a handy vote bank that the clerics control.

There are Indian Muslim groups as well as non-Muslims who harbour sympathy for the Kashmiri people, it is mostly with regard to their claim on Jammu and Kashmir’s autonomy within the Indian arrangement. Such groups also speak up against perennially violated human rights endured by the mainly Muslim people of the disputed area. To that extent the JUH has stood with the Kashmiri people, but only from the perspective that their interests were not separate from those of Indian Muslims.

In 2010, during Congress rule there was a surge in India’s stand-off with Kashmiri Muslims, and the J U H, a close cross-border comrade of Maulana Fazlur Rehman, did express its formulaic sympathy. A recent statement was, however, more assertive in its pro-government stance, effectively endorsing the abrogation of Kashmir’s autonomy.

“It is our belief that the welfare of the people of Kashmir lies in getting integrated with India. The inimical forces and the neighbouring country are bent upon destroying Kashmir. The oppressed and beleaguered people of Kashmir are stuck between opposing forces,” the JUH argued, virtually ad-libbing the official view on the abrogation of Kashmir’s autonomy. “The JUH stands steadfastly for the unity and integrity of the country and has accorded it paramount importance. As such it can never support any separatist movement rather it considers such movements not only harmful for India but also for the people of Kashmir.”

The irony is stark. Both the JUH and its Pakistani counterpart headed by Fazlur Rehman are or should be at loggerheads on Kashmir. And they are also tethered to the Saudi establishment for inspiration and sustenance. However, Saudi Arabia has veered close to the Indian stand and even felicitated Modi with its highest civilian award. Imran Khan has chosen to swallow the disappointment and has signalled that it’s business as usual by choosing to fly to the UN General Assembly session in New York on the Saudi crown prince’s private plane. The Kashmiris must be watching the denouement with awe and trepidation.

The JUH leverages Indian Muslims in what is clearly a rather self-serving relationship it has with any government of the day. But this is also how the Hindu right prefers to project the equation. Addressing the media in the aftermath of the derailed Agra summit, then senior minister Jaswant Singh obliquely described the link between Indian Muslims and the Kashmir issue. The gist of his comment was this: if India gives away Kashmir to comply with the two-nation theory, should Indian Muslims not be put in trains to Pakistan?

A different answer to the question came from a senior leader of the Jammu and Kashmir Liberation Front in 1992. Javed Mir had dodged the security dragnet when practically every Hurriyat leader was put behind the bars. I asked Mir to comment on the demolition of the Babri Masjid in Ayodhya, which had just taken place. He said he couldn’t care less what became of it or the dispute, because it concerned Indian Muslims who had shown scant interest in the struggles of the Kashmiris.

Cheers Image

manjgu
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2099
Joined: 11 Aug 2006 10:33

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby manjgu » 05 Nov 2019 20:58

i stay in punjab and can tell u kartarpur is a v bad idea... it will have implication maybe not in short term but surely in medioum to long term. Pakis have no sympathies with sikhs, indians and will use it to subvert punjab/india.

Rsatchi
BRFite
Posts: 321
Joined: 04 Aug 2019 22:03

Re: Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Rsatchi » 05 Nov 2019 21:19

yensoy » 01 Nov 2019 09:45




Rsatchi wrote:
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/wor ... 846971.cms
Is this only for sikh pilgrims!!
What about non-patkadharis
Is this some form segregation/division being attempted
Also what would be security implication from our side of the border yani ki is it possible for 'Gusbhaiti' of the Khalistani types!!

No need for passport to visit Pakistan.

But passport will be enforced for re-entry into India, of course. Otherwise who knows what kind of people the Pakis will sneak in along with the yatris?

I was actually very happy to see that the MEA site to register to visit Kartarpur doesn't ask for your religion. In theory, non-sikhs could visit. However in practice, Pakis will probably not give non-sikhs pre-authorization which is required.
Manjguji
Security risk is there but I hope as per yensoy post there is adequate 'Bandobast' to stop any future problems!! :roll:

Peregrine
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7997
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Terroristan - May 1, 2019

Postby Peregrine » 05 Nov 2019 21:34

manjgu wrote:i stay in punjab and can tell u kartarpur is a v bad idea... it will have implication maybe not in short term but surely in medioum to long term. Pakis have no sympathies with sikhs, indians and will use it to subvert punjab/india.
manjgu Ji :

My sentiments entirely. But - bhai meray - Who will Bell the Cat? Who will provide the healing Balm to sooth the Pain caused due to the Deep Chasm created by the Colonizing Power and then the Khangress? :cry:

Cheers Image


Return to “Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: asbchakri, SBajwa and 36 guests