2019 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

[Rony]

[pankajs]

https://twitter.com/TimesNow/status/1199935473050734592

TIMES NOW @TimesNow

#Breaking | STUNNING remark by Solicitor General Tushar Mehta in the Supreme Court. ‘@dir_ed is waiting to arrest @KartiPC’, says Tushar Mehta.

TIMES NOW’s Harish & Bhavatosh with details. Listen in.

ED tells SC - waiting to arrest Karti in INX case after stay lifted

[syam]

my biggest gripe in the whole episode is, why should bjp listen to what these msm and congress slaves saying?
they have next to zero power to shape the nation mood. may be bjp got into delhi and assimilated into those darbari eco chambers? all the jokes modiji played on delhi and now he is becoming subject of the delhi jokes himself. this is not good.

most of the current bjp supporters are born out of upa crisis. bjp not doing anything to gain new supporters. if this continues, i am afraid bjp will turn into another husk got rotted from inside.

[pankajs]

Modi is a Gandhi bhakt. It should have been apparent by now.

[Vikas]

Modi is a Gandhi bhakt. It should have been apparent by now.

That is absolutely true and so was Sardar Patel.

OT: Do we have any quote of Balasaheb on Nathuram Godse or Veer Savarakar ? I could not locate any on Google chahcha.

Updated later:
https://www.outlookindia.com/magazine/s ... eam/201555

For others, any association with the name of Nathuram Godse has created problems. In 1991, Shiv Sena Chief Bal Thackeray drew flak when he declared his admiration for Nathuram Godse at a Pune election rally

[Vikas]

^ ArjunPandit Ji, Who are these people. She won Bhopal against darling of C-cystem.
If C-system doesn't like her, they can suck it.
How would we know when is time and place. Maybe the time and place is now and here.
If not now then when ? If not these battles, then which ones ?
For long C-system has owned the narrative. Its time to reclaim it back.
Like Karthik Ji said, She is one of the reason, Paki world is not celebrating 'Saffron Terror' bogey.

Do 90% of Hindu voters understand the saffron terror plot?

Yes, she won. What's next? Can she win that again and again? What's her plan to win MP for Hindus and get it back from INC?

I don't follow so if you do.
Which Hindu causes relevant to Bhopal has she delivered on or working towards delivering? IIRC, there are lot muslim related issues in this region.

Darshan ji, We are digressing from the issue. What exactly is the objectionable statement she has made ?
Why so much of noise. What is the grief with her ?

[Larry Walker]

UT's demand with BJP was for 2.5 year CMship even when BJP was double of SS - then why would SP allow him 5 yrs CM when SS and NCP are equal size? AP toiled hard and is a mass leader from his region - he has a hardcore following based on his own personal work and connect and not because he is accidental progeny of a mass leader. So why would AP agree to 5 yrs CM for UT ad work as DyCM under him ? with BJP/DF he was clearly junior partner, but with SS he is more than equal to UT. something is not right here.

[darshan]

most of the current bjp supporters are born out of upa crisis. bjp not doing anything to gain new supporters. if this continues, i am afraid bjp will turn into another husk got rotted from inside.

Describe rotted.
Are you saying that BJP won only because UPA was gutting Hindus and not because country would have been bankrupt due to corruption?

[Rishi_Tri]

^ ArjunPandit Ji, Who are these people. She won Bhopal against darling of C-cystem.
If C-system doesn't like her, they can suck it.
How would we know when is time and place. Maybe the time and place is now and here.
If not now then when ? If not these battles, then which ones ?
For long C-system has owned the narrative. Its time to reclaim it back.
Like Karthik Ji said, She is one of the reason, Paki world is not celebrating 'Saffron Terror' bogey.

Do 90% of Hindu voters understand the saffron terror plot?

Yes, she won. What's next? Can she win that again and again? What's her plan to win MP for Hindus and get it back from INC?

I don't follow so if you do.
Which Hindu causes relevant to Bhopal has she delivered on or working towards delivering? IIRC, there are lot muslim related issues in this region.

If the present dispensation is smart she shall be projected as The One, The One who survived and represents the plight and strength of HIndus. Let alone MP, she has the power and charisma to deliver whole of India. She is the next gen - make her campaign across India. Issues are umpteen - resettlement in Kashmir, Kashi and Mathura, Sabarimala, Conversion,..

[Vikas]

most of the current bjp supporters are born out of upa crisis. bjp not doing anything to gain new supporters. if this continues, i am afraid bjp will turn into another husk got rotted from inside.

Describe rotted.
Are you saying that BJP won only because UPA was gutting Hindus and not because country would have been bankrupt due to corruption?

Most of the current BJP support base is basically Narendra Modi supporters. Has nothing to do with UPA.
If BJP wasn't getting new supporters, They would not have gone from 272 to 303 so I disagree.

Smaller nuisances like Sadhavis statement should not make us forget the bigger picture. #Namo4ever

[darshan]

Darshan ji, We are digressing from the issue. What exactly is the objectionable statement she has made ?
Why so much of noise. What is the grief with her ?

Please no ji.
In some sense we are getting to the issue that there will be noise so she needs to be one step ahead if wanting to win for Hindu causes. On BRF, we're going back and forth. Now think about normal 10% of voters that can swing election. All they will remember is that she keeps generating lot of noise for something that I don't even care about to look it up while I don't recall what she's done for me. If her voters want her to generate such noises then she should certainly do that. While I certainly want all of them to start their day talking about muslim atrocities and end their day talking about muslim atrocities, I know that that's not how they will win next election.

[Rony]

If the present dispensation is smart she shall be projected as The One, The One who survived and represents the plight and strength of HIndus. Let alone MP, she has the power and charisma to deliver whole of India. She is the next gen - make her campaign across India. Issues are umpteen - resettlement in Kashmir, Kashi and Mathura, Sabarimala, Conversion,..

+1 . Its a shame BJP caved in so easily. It will confuse their Hindutva supporters on what BJP stands for . If Bible and Koran with so much hateful messages towards kafir Hindus and heathen Hindus are allowed in this country, if Owaisi is considered as secular and invited to panel discussions, then why are Pragya's words so offensive ? And what exactly she said which is offensive ? Pragya is a symbol of Hindu resistance and perseverance. She should be celebrated by so called Hindutva party and not shamed and shunted off because anti-Hindutva people (who anyway wont be appeased by any amount of BJP appeasement) have a meltdown.

[SRajesh]

If the present dispensation is smart she shall be projected as The One, The One who survived and represents the plight and strength of HIndus. Let alone MP, she has the power and charisma to deliver whole of India. She is the next gen - make her campaign across India. Issues are umpteen - resettlement in Kashmir, Kashi and Mathura, Sabarimala, Conversion,..

+1 . Its a shame BJP caved in so easily. It will confuse their Hindutva supporters on what BJP stands for . If Bible and Koran with so much hateful messages towards kafir Hindus and heathen Hindus are allowed in this country, if Owaisi is considered as secular and invited to panel discussions, then why are Pragya's words so offensive ? Pragys is a symbol of Hindu resistance and perseverance. She should be celebrated by so called Hindutva party and not shamed and shunted off because anti-Hindutva people have a meltdown.

Ronyji
He always says he abides by the constitution!!!
Now whether that is true or E-Taqqiya who knows
In today's world sirji swear by the constitution but rest to 'Goli Maaro!!!' is the mantra

[Rishi_Tri]

Mods can delete this post if it is too much..

Godse is deeply revered across India and across the world. People see through the fake propaganda that is carried out. Recently had this experience.

One of my superiors was congratulating after the general elections. Somehow the conversation meandered to Godse. I presented my position on Godse and the fact that kids in North India celebrated him. Also that, Godse survives in legend of India. Legends are stronger than any propaganda and in 100 years or so he shall become Mythical Hero.

My superior, coming from deepest south, responded by saying that the day Godse did what he did his grand mom, celebrated by lighting Diyas and distributing sweets in the whole village. Everyone rejoiced.

Godse lives in the hearts of people across length and breadth of the country. They know why he did what he did. What Godse stood for can only be harnessed by someone like Sadhvi who went through an experience that almost none has gone through. It remains to be seen if she can harness unbound energy that he represents and get propelled to unthought of places.

[Rony]

+1 . Its a shame BJP caved in so easily. It will confuse their Hindutva supporters on what BJP stands for . If Bible and Koran with so much hateful messages towards kafir Hindus and heathen Hindus are allowed in this country, if Owaisi is considered as secular and invited to panel discussions, then why are Pragya's words so offensive ? Pragys is a symbol of Hindu resistance and perseverance. She should be celebrated by so called Hindutva party and not shamed and shunted off because anti-Hindutva people have a meltdown.

Ronyji
He always says he abides by the constitution!!!
Now whether that is true or E-Taqqiya who knows
In today's world sirji swear by the constitution but rest to 'Goli Maaro!!!' is the mantra

Did Pragya said anything against Constitution ? No. How many times did Congis said 'Its his personal view' and skirted the issue when Mani Iyer went to pakiland and asked pakis to remove the constitutionally elected PM modi or when Diggie Raja blamed Hindus for 26/11 ? The whole BIF opposition supported the JNU tukde tukde gang which continue glorifying terrorists and wanting to break up India in opposition to the constitution in the name of "freedom of expression". If you have a will to support Pragya, there are many arguments one can bring in support of her.

Now that BJP has caved in, the usual suspects are not impressed and want more. This is the price you pay for appeasement.

barkha dutt
@BDUTT
Removing Pragya Thakur from the parliamentary panel on Defence is hardly enough. Remove her from the party. She blotted the memory of Gandhi. Slandered the reputation of 26/11 hero Hemant Karkare. In the age of muscular Nationalism, if this ain't anti national, what is

[sanjayc]

^^ I admire Congress for the art of brazening it out and shrugging off all criticism for its anti-national, anti-Hindu actions. BJP is still ultra-sensitive of any criticism from those in the opposite camp (Whites / Congies / Lutyens / Church etc.) This shows weakness and lack of ruthlessness. They could have just ignored the whole thing and acted as if it never happened, or they could have just said "This is free speech protected by Sadhvi's parliamentary privilege and she is free to speak her views on the floor of the house. Everything should be up for debate -- there are no gods on earth."

[vishvak]

If Bible and Koran with so much hateful messages towards kafir Hindus and heathen Hindus are allowed in this country, if Owaisi is considered as secular and invited to panel discussions, then why are Pragya's words so offensive ? And what exactly she said which is offensive ? Pragya is a symbol of Hindu resistance and perseverance. She should be celebrated by so called Hindutva party and not shamed and shunted off because anti-Hindutva people (who anyway wont be appeased by any amount of BJP appeasement) have a meltdown.

Gandhi had nothing to do with
* Riots
* Total breakdown of law and order by religious forces
* Partition factors, like date and boundaries that were decided suddenly
Etc

Those going emotional about things will never uncover anything, never help future plans and propaganda will make this look ugly. Sadhvi should keep her religious powers to temple methinks and contribute more after considering what is needed to be done.

Godse lives in the hearts of people across length and breadth of the country.

Such emotional things are okay but did UP CM need all that to do what he is doing well. He is doing what he is without lecturing or hectoring and just being politician he has become once he went to become CM. He is popular too without faults and mutch needed cleaning up goondaraj without much ado.

She blotted the memory of Gandhi.

The radicals should have helped the home minister then for way forward. Gandhi had a different way of politics with a lot of efforts there: marches, literature, arguments, etc and had much more elaborate and clear movement that are good to projection for democracy.

[arshyam]

Today's BJP wants to occupy the political centre with a slight pro-Hindu tilt (never mind that people who hate them will continue to do so), and positive views about Godse is not centrist. If they want to be a true Hindu 'RW' party, then such statements would be more palatable. But they aren't, not anymore. To that extent, one may say the Sadhvi is in the wrong party, and the BJP itself erred in giving her a ticket. Maybe there will be a righter-than-BJP party in the future, but till then, such statements can serve to widen the Overton window. That's all is there to it.

Personally, as long as she didn't justify killing Gandhi, I don't see what the fuss about. She is not some gudiya to mouth platitudes, but a real person with real experiences and thoughts, not to mention having her own rights to free speech. BJP, on its part, should start acting like they are here to stay, even if they want to stay only in the political centre - a more self-assured party (eg Congress) would have simply disassociated itself from her statement saying it's her personal view and closing the matter then and there. But they just went overboard in their zeal to stay in the centre. Irony is, people who oppose them will oppose them anyway.

[Rony]

Nupur Sharma's uvacha in OpIndia

I dont agree with all she says regarding Pragya. BJP could have simply ignored it or called it her personal view and moved on but she does bring some interesting points.

Three questions that should be asked and debated around Sadhvi Pragya calling Godse a deshbhakt

It has long been the established norm in India that any honest debate about the policies of MK Gandhi and the motivation of Godse for committing the murder of Gandhi is taboo. While defending the act of murder is unconscionable, not evaluating and having an honest debate on the subject is equally, problematic. While all of that is true, one must also evaluate what purpose do statements like that one made by Sadhvi Pragya serve and whether the reaction by the Congress and even the BJP is justified.

There are three questions that must be asked to understand the crux of the issue.

Q1. Is Sadhvi Pragya right in calling Nathuram Godse a Deshbhakt ?

The question can be assessed independent of Sadhvi Pragya as well and that’s how it should be assessed. Whether or not Godse was a patriot doesn’t depend on what one Member of Parliament, such as Sadhvi Pragya, says. Also, the parliament is not the ideal place to discuss such ideas, however controversial. Ideally, it should take place in the media and academia. Ironically, our media and academia, say universities like JNU, have no issues hosting and debating extreme ideas that advocate the eradication of Hinduism, but they want to censor such debates.

Nonetheless, coming back to the original questions and to Sadhvi Pragya, the BJP MP was already chastised and even publicly humiliated for having called Nathuram Godse a patriot earlier. Prime Minister Narendra Modi, who is the tallest BJP leader in the current era, said that he can’t forgive Sadhvi Pragya ever for her comment on Godse earlier. With such a background, it was silly of her to repeat it. It was indiscipline and BJP taking punitive action against her internally can be justified, though it is debatable as to why she should be removed from any parliamentary committee.

Q2. Can Nathruram Godse be called a patriot after having killed Mahatma Gandhi ?

Nathuram Godse was the killer, the assassin who took MK Gandhi’s life. There is no debate there. However, the debate arises when one is to assess that can Godse be called a patriot or not, and that debate has been sparked by Sadhvi Pragya.

To evaluate whether Godse can be called a patriot, we need to understand a couple of things. First, what MK Gandhi’s policies were doing to the country at the time and secondly, what Godse’s motivations were.

Dr BR Ambedkar once wrote to Laxmi Kabir, who he subsequently married, “My own view is that great men are of great service to their country, but they are also at certain times a great hindrance to the progress of the country. Mr Gandhi had become a positive danger to this country. He had choked all the thoughts. He was holding together the Congress which is a combination of all the bad and self-seeking elements in society who agreed on no social or moral principle governing the life of society except the one of praising and flattering Mr Gandhi. Such a body is unfit to govern a country. As the Bible says that sometimes good cometh out of evil, so also I think good will come out of the death of Mr Gandhi. It will release people from bondage to supermen, it will make them think for themselves and compel them to stand on their own merits.”

Beyond the words of Dr BR Ambedkar, one need not say much to evaluate the first contention – what Gandhi’s policies were doing to the country at the time.

The only source of knowledge we do have of his motivations comes from a book by G.D. Khosla, one of the Judges who passed the judgment of his death. The book is reproduced on a website dedicated to celebrating the life of Mahatma Gandhi.

From the accounts produced by Khosla in his book, it becomes abundantly clear that Godse’s grouse is with Gandhi and Gandhi alone and no one else. It’s also quite evident that Godse is a product of his times, a time in history that witnessed immense bloodshed, millions of Hindus were slaughtered and millions of others were displaced. And he held Gandhi to be responsible for it and thus, set out to eliminate him.

Khosla recalls Godse as saying, “Gandhiji began to hold his prayers meetings in a Hindu temple in Bhangi Colony and persisted in reading passages from the Koran as a part of the prayer in that Hindu temple, in spite of the protest of the Hindu worshippers there. Of course, he dared not read Geeta in a mosque in the teeth of Muslim opposition. He knew what a terrible Muslim reaction there would have been if he had done so. But he could safely trample over the feelings of the tolerant Hindu. To belie this belief I determined to prove to Gandhiji that the Hindu too could be intolerant when his honour was insulted.”

At another point, Godse says, “Gandhiji in fact succeeded in doing what the British always wanted to do in pursuance of their policy of ‘Divide and Rule’. He helped them in dividing India and it is not yet certain whether their rule has ceased.”

Godse was also fully aware of the consequences of his action. He knew that his name and reputation would be tarnished beyond recognition for all eternity. But he did it anyway because of his personal conviction.

Since Gandhi’s action, in Ambedkar’s words, were detrimental to India, can Godse be called a patriot ? To answer that question, one must ask – if one commits a crime, however condemnable, is he precluded from being a patriot ? The answer is certainly – no. Whether he was a patriot or not depends on which side of the spectrum one belongs to and there should certainly be a debate that surrounds it, however, to say that because Godse committed murder, he cannot be a patriot is fallacious causation that is furthered for political gains.

It is thus clear that murder is a crime, and patriots can also commit a crime when overpowered with emotions. Just as the aspect of being a patriot doesn’t justify the murder, the act of murder doesn’t’ invalidate the patriotism.

Q3. If Rahul Gandhi can forgive his father’s killers, why does he hate Gandhiji’s killer so much ?

Not just Rahul Gandhi, even the Congress party has forgiven those who assassinated Rajiv Gandhi, the former Prime Minister of India and father of Rahul Gandhi, the former president of Congress party. They want to move on. They think people should be full of love and one shouldn’t hate even assassins. After all, Mahatma Gandhi himself said that ‘hate the sin, love the sinner’. Then why do they fail to show the same love towards Nathuram Godse ?

It is pure politics. Congress has no hope in Tamil Nadu and they need DMK support. Further, the uber-liberal Rahul Gandhi has supported extremist Dravidian ideologies in name of ‘dissent’, the same ideology that killed his father. But realpolitik demands that he must forget and forgive Rajiv Gandhi’s killers if he has to have any hope on 40 Lok Sabha seats. Forgiving Godse has not such an advantage.

The left-liberal ecosystem has no love or respect for Mahatma Gandhi and his ideas. He has been called a racist, casteist, upper-caste Hindu who denied people like Ambedkar his due. Scroll, a left-leaning website published an interview of Wendy Doniger where she virtually blamed partition of India on Mahatma Gandhi. Arundhati Roy similarly has poured scorn and contempt on Gandhiji on more than one occasion. They hate Mahatma Gandhi with more intensity than Nathuram Godse ever hated. In fact, Godse didn’t hate Gandhi. He was angered and frustrated with Mahatma’s extreme pacifism and Muslim appeasement. And in extreme frustration and anger, he committed a crime that became a political weapon for the left to malign the right.

[Karthik S]

Gandhi had nothing to do with
* Riots
* Total breakdown of law and order by religious forces
* Partition factors, like date and boundaries that were decided suddenly
Etc

What was his reaction to all three is more of a question, was he hypocritical in his stance is the question. Importantly, who benefited from his stance and who suffered is the question.

[pankajs]

Today's BJP wants to occupy the political centre with a slight pro-Hindu tilt (never mind that people who hate them will continue to do so), and positive views about Godse is not centrist. If they want to be a true Hindu 'RW' party, then such statements would be more palatable. But they aren't, not anymore. To that extent, one may say the Sadhvi is in the wrong party, and the BJP itself erred in giving her a ticket. Maybe there will be a righter-than-BJP party in the future, but till then, such statements can serve to widen the Overton window. That's all is there to it.

Personally, as long as she didn't justify killing Gandhi, I don't see what the fuss about. She is not some gudiya to mouth platitudes, but a real person with real experiences and thoughts, not to mention having her own rights to free speech. BJP, on its part, should start acting like they are here to stay, even if they want to stay only in the political centre - a more self-assured party (eg Congress) would have simply disassociated itself from her statement saying it's her personal view and closing the matter then and there. But they just went overboard in their zeal to stay in the centre. Irony is, people who oppose them will oppose them anyway.

That is the crux .. BJP will become centerist after it is done with the 3 core issues now that Sena has moved to the left. Praising Gandhi too is centrist hence anyone who is criticizing him is off center.

Secondly, Modi has done quite a lot to appropriate Gandhi for BJP. Sadhvi's view of Ghandi and Godse simply does not serve that objective. BJP will sideline her is she does not change her vocabulary. This is the 2nd such instance.

Thirdly, most of Hindus are centrist. So a centrist BJP with a sprinkling of Hindutva will do the trick is the bet of Modi/BJP. Expect more Ganga aartis and more Teertha upgrades, etc BUT no more "core" issues. More focus on Saab ka Vikas and vishwash.

The last highlight is true BOTH for the uber-right and the left. BJP, with it centrist makeover, doesn't care for either for different reasons. BJP can never win the left over. OTOH, can never please the uber-right.

Hindutvavadi, should not focus on the government to change the narrative on this but should do their bit locally. If the Hindus at the center get educated about the issue the top will notice and correct.

[A_Gupta]

Nobody would have heard of Godse and his deshbhakti had he not assassinated Mahatma Gandhi, and so most people hear an implied approval of the act of assassination in the statement "Godse was a deshbhakt", i.e., the act that made him a known figure is an act of deshbhakti.

Call him duratma or whatever you like, you cannot reverse the historical fact that Mahatma Gandhi was the most revered political figure of 1920s-1940s, and innumerable people flocked to his banner. Then, someone like Sardar Patel always stuck with him. His answer to you would be "you think you know Gandhi better than we who have lived with Gandhi?" (this is a paraphrase of what Sardar Patel actually said). And of course, Modiji is a Gandhi-bhakt. So either they have blind spots or you have blind spots, or both.

Lastly I'd be hesitant to snip one of the threads that helps bind India together. Yes, Mahatma Gandhi is one of them.

I'll point to viewtopic.php?f=1&t=7615&p=2397486#p2397312 and discussion preceding it.

[UlanBatori]

Someone gives up a life of luxury and faux privilege (which not ONE of the postors I know in PeeAref has done...) and spends the rest of his life getting kicked, beaten, imprisoned, walking barefoot, cleaning toilets, praying and generally living like the most deprived.

And he is to be judged by wunderkinden passing grave judgement on "his reactions" to horrible news at the end of his life? He was SEVENTY-NINE when he died, horrified by the out-of-control violence that he had tried to avert all his life (and mostly won... against all odds). You think YOUR brain will work any better than now, at age SEVENTY-NINE, all else aside?

Get a mirror, open your eyes and see if you can look yourself in the eye and say:

I AM QUALIFIED TO PASS JUDGEMENT ON MOHANDAS KARAMCHAND GANDHI

Oh! And pls remember to get a BandAid and splints ready to reattach your nose as it breaks against the mirror.

I am tired of reading such sh1t.

[KLNMurthy]

Modi himself is a big follower.of Gandhi. He must be upset for the party to take a stand on this.

Not everyone is suited tempramentally to every job. That is ok.

I can't even imagine what Sadhvi had gone through. It is easy for me to sit here and say, she shouldn't have said this or that.

I only wish she could have put faith in Modi as her leader and found the strength to talk as little as possible and do as much as possible.

Modi's or anyone's feelings about Gandhi or Godse don't matter. What matters is the mission, and exectting it in the real world.

[pankajs]

Sena old love for Godes

https://twitter.com/ShivAroor/status/11 ... 3709106176

Shiv Aroor @ShivAroor

Just dropping this here to fulfil today’s pointless whataboutery quota. https://dnaindia.com/mumbai/report-nath ... na-1487048

And ...
https://www.business-standard.com/artic ... 085_1.html
Nathuram Godse a patriot: Shiv Sena

[pankajs]

I agree

https://twitter.com/iMac_too/status/1199972511405891585

iMac_too @iMac_too

Bureaucracy in Maharashtra is still massively Con-Pawar fiefdom. They won't allow Uddhav a free passage. Let him sail that labyrinth first. I reckon his mental make-up is not designed for complex situations.

Fadnavis could work with hostile bureaucracy coz center was with him. Uddhav doesn't have such luxury. Treacherous Fox hasn't given him power to make his life easy. Let him taste the medicine.

Will be interesting to watch ..

[Rony]

How Lutyens media resorted to fake narrative to put Sharad Pawar on a pedestal

[sudarshan]

Gandhi used his charisma to "moderate" the Hindus, get concessions from them, instill the message in them that "Ishwar Allah tero naam," reform the caste malpractices, etc.

If he'd similarly used his charisma to moderate the Muslims, get a couple of concessions from them, instill the message of "Ishwar Allah tero naam," get them to agree to UCC, reform some of their malpractices, then he'd fully have my respect. From what I can see, he never did that, it was all one-sided.

If the argument is that one shouldn't judge Gandhi because of his sacrifices, which include getting beaten and imprisoned, etc., then similarly, one shouldn't judge Sadhvi Pragya either, because she gave up everything (sanyasa), got beaten, imprisoned, tortured (while also suffering from cancer), falsely accused, and is still being maligned. Why should anybody on this forum think they are qualified to judge Sadhvi Pragya either? More importantly, why should any of the Lutyens elite judge her?

[pankajs]

How Lutyens media resorted to fake narrative to put Sharad Pawar on a pedestal

Doesn't matter IF the news that he asked AP to take oath only AFTER the floor test is true, SP is shaken to the core and the family split is out in the open.

BJP delivered some serious blows even when it couldn't land the knockout punch and lost this round. Theek hai.

[Karthik S]

Looking at some people here, looks like congi propaganda machine has worked fine all these decades.

[pankajs]

Lo jee ... some 7 hrs back.

https://twitter.com/ndtv/status/1199976206759677952

NDTV @ndtv

"Mahatma Gandhi was and will be our 'Margdarshak' ": Rajnath Singh in Lok Sabha

[syam]

think about like this, whenever some woman is in center stage in public memory, things happened. that lady generally goes through so many hardships and comes out surviving. she will be in public memory during the testing times. it is up to us how she should be treated. sadhvi is modiji test. he is failing it big time. forget the world and all the politics. this karmic land is more than that. are we forgetting what happened to the mute spectators during draupadi vastrapaharan? no one going to score any browny points with karma by worshiping gandhi. on other hand, the dharma will destroy us if we mistreat women or let someone insult them. we don't wage wars for slaves or loot. we wage war for the honor of our women. it's bad enough that she was tortured, and now every guy telling her to what to do. just keep that in mind. /rant-end

[pankajs]

How Lutyens media resorted to fake narrative to put Sharad Pawar on a pedestal

Doesn't matter IF the news that he asked AP to take oath only AFTER the floor test is true, SP is shaken to the core and the family split is out in the open.

BJP delivered some serious blows even when it couldn't land the knockout punch and lost this round. Theek hai.

Confirmation by the chief CON dalal ... Multisourced now .. All doubts cleared

https://twitter.com/sardesairajdeep/sta ... 3785522177

Rajdeep Sardesai @sardesairajdeep

Breaking: 6 ministers being sworn in Maharashtra: Balasaheb Thorat, Nitin Raut (Cong), Chaggan Bhujbal, Jayant Patil (NCP), Subhash Desai, Eknath Shinde (Shiv Sena).. DCM likely to be @AjitPawarSpeaks who will be sworn in next week after confidence vote.

[chetak]

Gandhi had nothing to do with
* Riots
* Total breakdown of law and order by religious forces
* Partition factors, like date and boundaries that were decided suddenly
Etc

What was his reaction to all three is more of a question, was he hypocritical in his stance is the question. Importantly, who benefited from his stance and who suffered is the question.

and a lot of the times, it was the britshit establishment that benefited from his stance. Who suffered is obvious.

People in africa are calling him "the stretcher bearer of the empire"

read the book

The South African Gandhi: Stretcher-Bearer of Empire

Ashwin Desai, Goolem Vahed

https://www.amazon.in/South-African-Gan ... 080479717X

[pankajs]

think about like this, whenever some woman is in center stage in public memory, things happened. that lady generally goes through so many hardships and comes out surviving. she will be in public memory during the testing times. it is up to us how she should be treated. sadhvi is modiji test. he is failing it big time. forget the world and all the politics. this karmic land is more than that. are we forgetting what happened to the mute spectators during draupadi vastrapaharan? no one going to score any browny points with karma by worshiping gandhi. on other hand, the dharma will destroy us if we mistreat women or let someone insult them. we don't wage wars for slaves or loot. we wage war for the honor of our women. it's bad enough that she was tortured, and now every guy telling her to what to do. just keep that in mind. /rant-end

Modi will continue to fail this test if such criteria is set. Modi is focused on his objective and does not want distractions like she is creating. She can either toe the party line or quite the party and go on her own with all the freedom that it provides.

Modi gave her a sort of restitution by lifting her status when he could have let her be. He gave her a platform of dignity but not to torpedo his agenda. All she had to do what focus on the issues at hand and not open her mouth.

[SRajesh]

Doesn't matter IF the news that he asked AP to take oath only AFTER the floor test is true, SP is shaken to the core and the family split is out in the open.

BJP delivered some serious blows even when it couldn't land the knockout punch and lost this round. Theek hai.

Confirmation by the chief CON dalal ... Multisourced now .. All doubts cleared

https://twitter.com/sardesairajdeep/sta ... 3785522177

Rajdeep Sardesai @sardesairajdeep

Breaking: 6 ministers being sworn in Maharashtra: Balasaheb Thorat, Nitin Raut (Cong), Chaggan Bhujbal, Jayant Patil (NCP), Subhash Desai, Eknath Shinde (Shiv Sena).. DCM likely to be @AjitPawarSpeaks who will be sworn in next week after confidence vote.

Now that is what one would call 'eating humble pie'
Resigned/kicked out by Balasaheb, Beta-Saheb inducting him as one council minister(Congi now to boot )

[pankajs]

https://twitter.com/AgentSaffron/status ... 0689453056

Vanara @AgentSaffron

BJP govt got Sadhvi Pragya get justice. She'd have died in jail otherwise.

BJP gave her ticket from a super safe seat.

BJP didn't take action against her for first time.

BJP govt gave her parliamentary committee post.

Still BJP is accused of ill-treatment of Sadhvi.

All she had to do was focus on the issue at hand and not open her mouth. Is that too much to expect.

Modi is very unlucky ... He gets it from all sides for his sincere efforts.

[mmasand]

Where is Sanjay Nirupam? And no word from Raj Thackeray?

The real estate/builders/hundi must be partying it up big time this evening. Will be interesting to watch what happens with the BMC in 2021, a lot of the BJP MLA's are former corporators and as such will mobilise big time on the ground.

[chetak]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bZn2TW2vdhM


The South African Gandhi: Stretcher-Bearer of Empire

[SRajesh]

.

Nobody would have heard of Godse and his deshbhakti had he not assassinated Mahatma Gandhi,
Guptaji
Exactly
Just using a analogy: Sachin T developed 'Tennis Elbow' and suddenly we had about 600 million++ specialist in 'Tennis Elbow' in India