J&K Union Territory-2019

The Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum is a venue to discuss issues pertaining to India's security environment, her strategic outlook on global affairs and as well as the effect of international relations in the Indian Subcontinent. We request members to kindly stay within the mandate of this forum and keep their exchanges of views, on a civilised level, however vehemently any disagreement may be felt. All feedback regarding forum usage may be sent to the moderators using the Feedback Form or by clicking the Report Post Icon in any objectionable post for proper action. Please note that the views expressed by the Members and Moderators on these discussion boards are that of the individuals only and do not reflect the official policy or view of the Bharat-Rakshak.com Website. Copyright Violation is strictly prohibited and may result in revocation of your posting rights - please read the FAQ for full details. Users must also abide by the Forum Guidelines at all times.
hgupta
BRFite -Trainee
Posts: 48
Joined: 20 Oct 2018 14:17

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby hgupta » 14 Aug 2019 02:12

Can we file a FIR against this guy? Is he not being traitorous and seditious by saying Kashmir is not part of India? Can we kick him out of the Rajya Sobha?

https://m.timesofindia.com/india/kashmi ... 660782.cms

Roop
BRFite
Posts: 234
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Roop » 14 Aug 2019 02:22

Hi Pankaj,
Some excellent posts from you. Your list of 5 points summarizes Paki's dilemma (what to do now?) very well. Also:

pankajs wrote:One reason why Internet, Phone and TV service is down because they were used to foment, organize and spread mayhem. Bakis/Jihadi would push highly inflammatory messages and CT and create violence...


IMO it's not just "one reason", it's the reason. Paki provocateurs would use their cell-phones to call up flash mobs of stone-pelters and bomb-throwers, and warn their media co-conspirators to be ready and waiting on the scene with cameras rolling.

... and BBC/CNN/AlJazera woudl fan the flames with coverage. And that would create more violence.

Not just BBC/CNN/Al_Jaz but also Indian traitors and Paki-sympathizers like the Lutyens media gang (UndyTV, Al Hundi) and political parties. Kaangraizwallas, AAPtards, Commies etc. would love to see violence in the Valley right now.

KLNMurthy
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3702
Joined: 17 Aug 2005 13:06

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby KLNMurthy » 14 Aug 2019 02:26

CRamS wrote:Guru, this might sound like an ignoramus question, but I am still not able to succinctly and in a slam dunk manner explain TSP meltdown post article 370 scrapping. And here is why.

1. If you note, the overt, unabashed TSP proxies in the valley, the harried rats have maintained a 'principle silence'. And its obvious why? They don't give a fig leaf for Indian constitution anyway, so anything done within its 4 walls doesn't bother them. Its irrelevant as far as they are concerned.

2. Now, TSP's position was similar even more strident, 'self determination', 'plebiscite', 'UN resolutions', 'disputed territory' etc. And their strategy was always centered on pigLeT terror in the hope that after bleeding from 10000 cuts, India will cut a deal that gives them the Muslims-dominated Kashmir valley

3. I would have thought that post 370 scrapping, they would have made the usual mockery about Indian actions changing nothing about the 'dispute' and go about their pigLeT debauchery.

4. But seeing their furious melt down means that with 370 in place, it seems to me they had some other ace up their sleeve. What was that which ModiJi had for breakfast and made they start crying so profusely?

5. Is it the obvious explanation, namely, 370 in effect promoted secession, and TSP, along with its KM proxies were expecting to extract something all the lines of MMS-MushRat formula that gives them a huge say in the valley through 'joint soverignty'? And with India given a few dog bones, its investment and other economic goodies that come with it, will suit TSP just fine? And with 370 gone, that dream has evaporated?

6. While #5 above does explain TSP melt down to a certain extent, I still feel that there was a shocker beyond that. What is it?


Paki Abdul believes Cashmere is his. He doesn't care about the finer points of UN resolutions or 370. All he knows is that Yindoos brazenly changed "something" in Cashmere which is his but temporarily occupied by Yindoos. Abdul is sad because Abdul feels insulted by Yindoo audacity.

Abdul has TFTA military that wins everything, every time, and has atom bum. Abdul doesn't understand why Yindoos are allowed to insult him like this. Abdul is slow, but will eventually wonder, maybe he should ask his invincible TFTA fauj how come?

TFTA fauj is not as slow as Abdul. It knows there is no material change on the ground. But it has to keep Abdul from asking awkward questions. So TFTA fauj loses no time in barking and snarling at Yindoos.

Abdul is happy (because Abdul is angry) and gives more Baki Rupees to TFTA fauj. TFTA fauj is happy.

Roop
BRFite
Posts: 234
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Roop » 14 Aug 2019 02:32

Re. Christine Fair:

sudeepj wrote:... and also hardline Christian atheist (which she is).


No she isn't, she's Jewish (as she herself has said on occasion); but really, she's not a believer of any kind, she's an atheist left-wing Islam-pasand hater of conservatives. All the bile she spews against Trump and Republicans will similarly, one day soon, come gushing out against Modi & BJP, of that I have no doubt.

khan
BRFite
Posts: 524
Joined: 12 Feb 2003 12:31
Location: Tx

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby khan » 14 Aug 2019 02:41

I actually like Dr Fair. Of all the western analysts, she “gets it” - even more than many Indian analysts.

sudeepj
BRFite
Posts: 1657
Joined: 27 Nov 2008 11:25

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby sudeepj » 14 Aug 2019 02:51

Roop wrote:Re. Christine Fair:

sudeepj wrote:... and also hardline Christian atheist (which she is).


No she isn't, she's Jewish (as she herself has said on occasion); but really, she's not a believer of any kind, she's an atheist left-wing Islam-pasand hater of conservatives. All the bile she spews against Trump and Republicans will similarly, one day soon, come gushing out against Modi & BJP, of that I have no doubt.


Absolutely.. She is pure unadulterated poison.

Bart S
BRFite
Posts: 1835
Joined: 15 Aug 2016 00:03

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Bart S » 14 Aug 2019 03:15

Strictly for timepass onleee...for those who enjoy Paki ranting and randi rona. About half the show is the participants yelling over each other. :lol:


UlanBatori
BRF Oldie
Posts: 11725
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby UlanBatori » 14 Aug 2019 03:34

khan wrote:I actually like Dr ****. Of all the western analysts, she “gets it” - even more than many Indian analysts.

If you like CIA, you may also love KGB, Mossad, MI-6 and ISI.
er... it actually does not take more than a child's intelligence to "get it" that Pakistan is Terror Central, and that the way to bring peace is to improve the Rainwater Conservation programs in downtown Islamabad, Pindi, and Karachi and LaHore. Ask any thoughtful US military officer over beer and they will tell you with much greater clarity how well they understand this, given how many of their comrades are buried over the past 20 years courtesy of Paki "Frontlyin' Al-Lie-Ants".

Her rabid rants against POTUS may be all sham, to get her in good with the LBGT commies and other leftist nitwits in US, Pakistan and India (JNU), while these occasional slams against Terroristan are to impress Indian Diplobaboon and, er... ppl like your kind self, sorry.

None of it is sincere. I think I've read enough of her on both SocMed and elsewhere to have no doubt left. May be a loyal employee to her organization, mind you, and hence a brave person to go out and mingle in Terroristan. But so is a rabod pooch or a barracuda "brave".

Rudradev
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3427
Joined: 06 Apr 2003 12:31

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Rudradev » 14 Aug 2019 03:46

If you are on Twitter, please RETWEET widely.

https://twitter.com/Indosphere/status/1 ... 6948473859

Ultra-Rationalist
@Indosphere
Dear @ICEgov
just FYI: multiple undocumented Pakistani immigrants, filled with Jihadist fervour, plan to demonstrate outside Indian consulates/embassies in US cities on August 15th 2019. Happy hunting!

CRamS
BRF Oldie
Posts: 6346
Joined: 07 Oct 2006 20:54
Contact:

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby CRamS » 14 Aug 2019 03:50

I see a dangerous game being played by BIF. They actually want J&K UT to burn and India's nose rubbed in the mud. The main chieftain in this plot is none other than Pappu, Queen madam, Pappu's sister, and their slaves. Now Pappu & Co know that rest of India has supported ModiJi's decision, but yet have taken an anti-India position. Why? Because they are hoping and egging on the scum who can make the valley burn and in the ensuing mayhem, they believe in their perverted minds that it will sink ModiJi. Bloody swine.

Suresh S
BRFite
Posts: 710
Joined: 25 Dec 2008 22:19

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Suresh S » 14 Aug 2019 04:03

Christine fair gets it. Hmmm I am on BRF. May be khan saheb had too much of the good stuff.

sanjaykumar
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3972
Joined: 16 Oct 2005 05:51

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby sanjaykumar » 14 Aug 2019 04:05

Succinctly put, the post on aberrations in Western culture versus structural defects in other cultures.

Given that there is a certain threshold of literacy attained in the West, it is becoming more difficult to remain innocent of the issues.

Some people are genuinely sophisticated, this is not something that is within the ken of the average Indian. To them the white west is Christian. This is facile and perhaps 50 years out of date.

Some Canadians will debate the genocide in Canada of aboriginal cultures, they will see the Islamist features in pre-War German society. On the radio a few days ago there was an academic discussion on the type of a$$hole that is power on the North American landmass, Yep these are white western Christian males. There was a another discussion on the living in denial in the US population of the issue of gun violence.

Perhaps it is the several decades of Marxist teachings in universities that is responsible. However, for Indians the only knowledge needed is west is 'advanced', they are Christian, we must be Christian, then we will be 'advanced'. As false a logical argument as there ever was. As a recent inductee into transcendental meditation told me, only stupid people are Christians nowadays.

Certainly that is uncharitable. There is nothing inherently wrong with being culturally a Christian and appreciating the art, music (Miserere), architecture etc etc. But succinctly the above may have been put, it is not nearly nuanced enough.

sanjaykumar
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3972
Joined: 16 Oct 2005 05:51

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby sanjaykumar » 14 Aug 2019 04:13

https://twitter.com/i/status/1161036489343586304


Indians becoming more advanced. I see NO fault of the missionaries.

Cain Marko
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3597
Joined: 26 Jun 2005 10:26

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Cain Marko » 14 Aug 2019 04:56

KLNMurthy wrote:
Anujan wrote:
From Tariq Ali's book

Image

Also mentioned in Bruce Riedel's book

PLO formed a special militant wing called Black September, to commemorate the massacre. It was responsible for a lot of hijackings, and what would be called terrorist acts today.


These are some superb and not too well known points about the perfidy of the TSP goons. I think that we should have a sticky thread that allows well meaning Desis and videsis to not only get info but also provide pointed comebacks/soundbytes to rubbish claims, accusations and in general propaganda of the idiots in MSM.

Claim:
Kashmir is independent.
Answer: not when IOA was signed by King

Claim:
Kashmiri genocide
Answer: only by tsp in 90s and even before. Since then no such thing.

Claim:
Kashmir is mistreated
Answer: receives more federal aid than any other state.

Claim:
TSP is pro Muslim ummah
Answer: ask the Bangladesis, baluchistanis, Palestinians, pakhtuns, Shia's etc. They might not agree.

Claim:
India is hard on minorities unlike TSP
Answer: which is why minority populations have increased in India since 1947, while they have entirely disappeared from TSP.

Etc etc....

I've been doing this overtime on YouTube to counter the false narrative by All Jalzeera types

khan
BRFite
Posts: 524
Joined: 12 Feb 2003 12:31
Location: Tx

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby khan » 14 Aug 2019 05:54

Regarding Christine Fair - no two human beings are going to see issues as large & complex as India’s future & national security the exact same way.

But she gets 90% of it & has not problem slapping people around on Twitter & in conferences to make her points (90% of it which I agree with).

When I started out in BRF, “South Asia” experts were Uneven Cohen (openly Paki) & Ashley Tellis (closet Paki).

Expecting people to agree with you 100% of the time is unrealistic. The current state of affairs is a huge improvement in my book.

Mort Walker
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7567
Joined: 31 May 2004 11:31
Location: The rings around Uranus.

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Mort Walker » 14 Aug 2019 06:05

^^^She's batshit crazy. Best to stay away from her and not reference her. Her TDS (Trump Derangement Syndrome) has locked her out of current government and is useless.

banrjeer
BRFite
Posts: 187
Joined: 21 Dec 2008 14:39

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby banrjeer » 14 Aug 2019 06:19

Mort Walker wrote:^^^She's batshit crazy. Best to stay away from her and not reference her. Her TDS (Trump Derangement Syndrome) has locked her out of current government and is useless.


Trump is crazier than Fair but both have some plus points when it comes to India. He has charted an unstable path.
Fair's anti modi views are an interesting parameter but do not render her irrelevant.

Kashi
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3438
Joined: 06 May 2011 13:53

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Kashi » 14 Aug 2019 06:54

banrjeer wrote:but do not render her irrelevant.


Zero minus Zero is well.. Zero.

That's all the relevance the likes of Fair-Unfair have when it comes to India.

Jay
BRFite
Posts: 122
Joined: 24 Feb 2005 18:24
Location: Gods Country
Contact:

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Jay » 14 Aug 2019 07:12

khan wrote:I actually like Dr Fair. Of all the western analysts, she “gets it” - even more than many Indian analysts.


I agree. She may come with her baggage, but from what I heard so far, makes me believe she understands the nuances of Indo-Pak dealings better than the most foreign policy analysts.

KL Dubey
BRFite
Posts: 568
Joined: 16 Dec 2016 22:34

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby KL Dubey » 14 Aug 2019 07:53

As I mentioned earlier, it seems increasing likely that Amit will do the honors at Lal Chowk on Aug 15.

https://www.tribuneindia.com/news/nation/shah-likely-to-unfurl-tricolour-in-srinagar/817531.html

Will be the "Take 2" of the 1992 photo of NaMo and MM Joshi. If I was Satyapal, I wouldn't miss the opportunity to show up and be the other guy in the picture with Amit.

A_Gupta
BRF Oldie
Posts: 11210
Joined: 23 Oct 2001 11:31
Contact:

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby A_Gupta » 14 Aug 2019 08:42

If China cracks down on. Hong Kong, J&K will recede to almost zero in world attention.

Amber G.
BRF Oldie
Posts: 6404
Joined: 17 Dec 2002 12:31
Location: Ohio, USA

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Amber G. » 14 Aug 2019 09:48

Amber G. wrote:
In past few days I have reported (it is VERY easy to report) a few accounts and my success rate is 100% - that is all of those accounts got banned from twitter. It was cool to receive thanks from twitter too. So instead (or in addition) of "replying" a vile post, just report it if it violates twitter rules. ( promoting violence, abusive, harmful, spreading rumors all are valid reasons to report a tweet).

Folks, it looks like it is indeed quite easy to "report" and I have seen quite a few handles getting blocked. (It is cool to get a notice from twitter saying "thanks" and telling that they have taken action. Twitter's algorithm works in the way that if you have been successful in helping them to ban weight of your report goes up so take a few extra second and report vile posts)

g.sarkar
BRFite
Posts: 1853
Joined: 09 Jul 2005 12:22
Location: MERCED, California

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby g.sarkar » 14 Aug 2019 09:55

https://news.rediff.com/commentary/2019 ... pdates.htm
08:40 Pak seeks emergency meeting of UNSC over Kashmir:
Pakistan has formally called for an emergency meeting of the United Nations Security Council to discuss India's move to revoke the special status to Jammu and Kashmir, Foreign Minister Shah Mahmood Qureshi said on Tuesday. In video message, Qureshi said that he sent a formal letter to the president of the UNSC through Permanent Representative Maleha Lodhi to convene the meeting.
Qureshi said that the letter will also be shared with all members of the UNSC.
.....
Gautam

Vikas
BRF Oldie
Posts: 6045
Joined: 03 Dec 2005 02:40
Location: Where DST doesn't bother me
Contact:

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Vikas » 14 Aug 2019 10:20

Amber G. wrote:
Amber G. wrote:
In past few days I have reported (it is VERY easy to report) a few accounts and my success rate is 100% - that is all of those accounts got banned from twitter. It was cool to receive thanks from twitter too. So instead (or in addition) of "replying" a vile post, just report it if it violates twitter rules. ( promoting violence, abusive, harmful, spreading rumors all are valid reasons to report a tweet).

Folks, it looks like it is indeed quite easy to "report" and I have seen quite a few handles getting blocked. (It is cool to get a notice from twitter saying "thanks" and telling that they have taken action. Twitter's algorithm works in the way that if you have been successful in helping them to ban weight of your report goes up so take a few extra second and report vile posts)


Someone took your advice and got me suspended instead for using the word 'Paki moron'. :((
Now Twitter wants my phone number to re-activate the account which I am reluctant to do.
OT: Any other way of un-suspending my twitter account without giving away my phone number ?

Rishi_Tri
BRFite
Posts: 361
Joined: 13 Feb 2017 14:49

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Rishi_Tri » 14 Aug 2019 10:23

Bart S wrote:Strictly for timepass onleee...for those who enjoy Paki ranting and randi rona. About half the show is the participants yelling over each other. :lol:



Saw the complete video. Well hilarious indeed but there is bitter realization within them that their economy is a disaster (I have posted Pakdata on this forum) and also referenced $75 BN versus $6 BN. Also that the so called friendly nations have not stepped up to their defense. Its the economic power that is playing out in JK and L and it is the truth. Economic power drives military might.

CRamS
BRF Oldie
Posts: 6346
Joined: 07 Oct 2006 20:54
Contact:

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby CRamS » 14 Aug 2019 11:50

Vikas wrote:Someone took your advice and got me suspended instead for using the word 'Paki moron'. :((
Now Twitter wants my phone number to re-activate the account which I am reluctant to do.
OT: Any other way of un-suspending my twitter account without giving away my phone number ?


My twitter account is also in suspend mode after I called Omar Abdullah's keep a bimbo. She uses the word 'bhakts' or 'paid trolls' etc to disparage those who support ModiJi, so I wonder how is Bimbo any more offensive than those terms? But in any case, looks like a lot of female journos at the receiving end of RW are well protected on-line. They whine at the slightest offense and twitter takes action. Same thing happened when I called Burka Bibi an Uncle Tom type US mouthpiece for washing India's domestic dirty linen in the WP.

Now in the case of my tweet to Omar Abdullah's keep, the message from twitter said I can either delete my tweet or appeal. I refused to delete and I appealed citing her abusive tweets. To white Twitter said they will review the appeal and get back in 14 days. Its been almost 2 months, but no response. When I login I still get the same message, my appeal is being reviewed and if I chose to, I can delete that tweet in question and regain access.

pankajs
BRF Oldie
Posts: 11423
Joined: 13 Aug 2009 20:56

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby pankajs » 14 Aug 2019 13:06

pankajs wrote:One reason why Internet, Phone and TV service is down because they were used to foment, organize and spread mayhem. Bakis/Jihadi would push highly inflammatory messages and CT and create violence and BBC/CNN/AlJazera woudl fan the flames with coverage. And that would create more violence.

One reason why such an embargo was put in place before the GOI showed its hand. One reason why a Jurno rushed to the SC to have media/communication blackout lifted so that mayhem could be instigate and spread and make GOI backoff.

No violence and no push back. If one notices some of the "neutral" statements are truly "neutral". E.g. US statement is something on the lines of "Bla bla bla. India said that it is an internal matter ...bla bla .. bla. Notice the wording "India said" instead of the Russian "we believe".

Make a Yuuuuuuuuuuge difference! US is till playing it safe leaving an opening to reverse course. Bery chatur of the jooyes. Do not underestimate them or anyone else. Do not make the mistake of thinking everything is over. Everyone is in a wait and watch mode. Modi/GOI/India needs to be very careful for the next 6 months to a year.
By the time I had written down the last bit I had forgotten the most important point that I wanted to make. So here is the concluding part.

Now if Modi was made to roll back on 370/35A what do folks think will happen? He will be thoroughly discredited at all levels. OTOH, if he is able to pull this off he will rank amongst the greatest political leader of India since Independence bar none.

If one reads the tweets of Modi haters more than just his political opponents, one will realize their desperation is because of the above realization amongst them apart from their rage at the loss of their cottage industry build around conflict in J&K. Every single one of them wants Modi to fail on this and will go to any extent to make it happen. The petition in the SC to get the restriction on movement and communication removed should be seen in this context.

This is a pivotal moment for the BIF/Tukde-tukde/Urban Naxal gang when they feel threatened like they have never been since independence of India. Politically taking out one man can solve many of their current challenges and restore power in the hands of puppets who can then be controlled.

pankajs
BRF Oldie
Posts: 11423
Joined: 13 Aug 2009 20:56

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby pankajs » 14 Aug 2019 13:19

https://twitter.com/atahasnain53/status ... 2724398080
Syed Ata Hasnain @atahasnain53

1/2 @DevjyotGhoshal
I liked your thread. I too believe that the Kashmiri is angry and seething. But that is how it has been each time a lockdown happens. When we claim things are normal one never refers to the mood of the Kashmiri. That is highly unpredictable and dangerous

Don't get angsty with what is being reported. While the current situation is far from normal it is normal for the given circumstance.

pankajs
BRF Oldie
Posts: 11423
Joined: 13 Aug 2009 20:56

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby pankajs » 14 Aug 2019 13:22

https://twitter.com/hussain_imtiyaz/sta ... 0933006336
Imtiyaz Hussain @hussain_imtiyaz

Dimwitted analysis by half witted Kashmir experts who are disappointed at seeing no deadbodies of Kashmiris this time unlike what they would in past. Why should Kashmir produce deadbdies to satiate the ego of Pakistanis & some of their agents here in India. Please let us live.

This is what everyone of Modi's opponents want and hence the petition to remove the restriction on movement and communication.

pankajs
BRF Oldie
Posts: 11423
Joined: 13 Aug 2009 20:56

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby pankajs » 14 Aug 2019 13:24

After bakis the Britshit are the most troubled/pi$$ed off with India/India's rise.

https://twitter.com/nitingokhale/status ... 4063293440
Nitin A. Gokhale @nitingokhale

various Tory governments...continue to tacitly encourage attacks on India by proxy i.e. they allow human rights organisations to attack India on Kashmir and separatists such as Khalistanis and pro-Pakistan Kashmiris to take out marches near Indian missions in the UK

vijayk
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3863
Joined: 22 Jun 1999 11:31

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby vijayk » 14 Aug 2019 15:55

Coupta now offcially in Paki camp


https://twitter.com/liberal_slayerr/status/1161297031651942400
Now #ThePrintExclusive is giving tips to Pakistan.


#MaiBhiChowkidar אני שרת
@AccidentalSperm

@ShekharGupta is basically suggesting that Pakistan-based terrorists dress up as Indian forces and shoot at the protesting masses!

Peregrine
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7451
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Peregrine » 14 Aug 2019 15:59

Pakistan struggles to get traction on Kashmir, links it to Afghanistan - Chidanand Rajghatta | TNN

HIGHLIGHTS

- Pakistan has been busy dialing up the world for support over Kashmir.

- But it has found little backing, aside from calls for it to use the bilateral channel to settle
issues with India.

T-he biggest setback to Pakistan has come from its Gulf and Arab allies have gone ahead with business as usual with India

WASHINGTON: Struggling to draw attention to the Kashmir issue, Pakistan has linked it to Afghanistan imbroglio, warning that it might have to redeploy troops from its western border to the eastern front, a shift that Washington fears could complicate American peace talks with the Taliban.

Pakistan’s “Kashmir-for-Afghanistan” card was played by its ambassador to the US Asad Majeed Khan in course of an editorial board meeting with the New York Times, even as he professed that the two issues were separate and he was not attempting to link them.

However, the NYT quoted him as saying, “We have our hands full” on the western border, but “If the situation escalates on the eastern border, we will have to undertake redeployments.” Right now in Islamabad, he added, “we are not thinking about anything but what is happening on our eastern border (with India).”

The remarks came from a familiar Pakistani playbook going back to the Musharraf era, when Islamabad would often warn it would not be able to support American objectives (in its war on terror) because of problems with and perceived threats from India, in an effort to seek US intervention and/or aid. The tactic often resulted in the Bush and Obama Administrations putting a restraining hand on New Delhi to not respond forcefully to Pakistan-sponsored terrorist attacks on India.

Read also: Restrictions will be eased after August 15, J&K governor says

The Trump administration is reported to be in the final stages of an agreement with the Taliban and Afghan representatives to facilitate a US drawdown from Afghanistan, and although all parties have cautioned Islamabad to refrain from linking its support for the deal to the Kashmir issue, Islamabad appears ready to throw a monkey wrench into the works after finding that it is not getting any support for its dispute with India.

Read also: Lal Chowk not the place to make a political point, says Jammu and Kashmir

Pakistan has been busy dialing up the world for support, calling leaders from Ankara to Tehran to Kuala Lumpur. But it has found little backing, aside from calls for it to use the bilateral channel to settle issues with India, and expressions of concern for the human rights situation in the Kashmir Valley.

The biggest setback to Pakistan has come from its Gulf and Arab allies who while expressing concern about the situation in the Valley have gone ahead with business as usual with India, where there is no visible unrest among the 200 million Muslims elsewhere in the country. On Monday, Saudi Arabia announced a massive $ 15 billion buy-in into Reliance Industries’ petro business, even as India and China signed several agreements during External Affairs Minister S. Jaishankar’s visit to Beijing, despite differences on the Kashmir issue.

Read also: Saudi Aramco to buy 20% in RIL’s petro arm for $15 billion


But in an effort to corner India, Pakistan finds itself alone. Some realization of this appeared to have dawned on Monday when the country Foreign Minister Shah Mahmood Qureshi asked Pakistanis not to live in a “fool’s paradise” and warned “nobody will be standing there (in the UNSC) with garlands in hands” – a reference to the lonely furrow it has had to plow in the global fora.

Still, Pakistani diplomats, tasked with raising the issue at every forum possible, have been making the rounds of the media and think tanks to talk up India’s purported aggression and heavy-handedness in Kashmir, with sympathetic hearing from western media outlets such as CNN, NYT, WaPo, BBC, and the Guardian.

On Monday, Fox News featured both the Pakistani and Indian ambassadors on the issue.

Let me explain this to you and for your viewers, it is just like one fine morning, someone in Washington decides to split the state of New York into three constituent units -- without making any reference to the people of the state. And this is done on top of that state being a disputed territory, duly recognized by the United Nations, ” Pakistan’s Asad Majeed
Khan said as he attempted to throw light on an issue most American don’t care about.

Indian ambassador Harsh Vardhan Shringla’s response positioned India as a democracy whose 200 million Muslims were spread beyond the Kashmir Valley.

"In India we have 200 million Muslims. They comprise 18 percent of our population. This is the second-largest population of Muslims in the world. What is important is to understand is because we are a democracy - because we give a voice to all the people in our country irrespective of religion - there is very little [desire] among Indian Muslims for ISIS or Al Qaeda,” he explained.

"We will slowly open up the situation. At some stage we will have elections. ... They'll have their own chief minister. We will ensure that there is massive development assistance," Shringla added.

The verbal skirmishes extended beyond traditional media and TV studios to think tanks and social media, drawing in partisans from both sides. Exceptionally, there were also dissenters.

In a widely circulated video, a Pakistani national attacked Pakistan’s ambassador to the UN and her aides at a briefing, calling them “thieves” who were “stealing our money” and yelling, “you do not deserve to represent Pakistan."

CheersImage

darshan
BRFite
Posts: 991
Joined: 28 Jan 2008 04:16

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby darshan » 14 Aug 2019 16:27

Posted previously in human rights thread. Combine this with few other racial machine bias studies.

Study finds racial bias in tweets flagged as hate speech
https://news.cornell.edu/stories/2019/0 ... ate-speech

Tweets believed to be written by African Americans are much more likely to be tagged as hate speech than tweets associated with whites, according to a Cornell study analyzing five collections of Twitter data marked for abusive language.

pankajs
BRF Oldie
Posts: 11423
Joined: 13 Aug 2009 20:56

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby pankajs » 14 Aug 2019 16:32

https://www.tribuneindia.com/news/comme ... 17559.html
Not many options for Pakistan -- Tilak Devasher - Member, national security advisory board
On August 5, 2019, even as Imran Khan was preparing to celebrate a year in office, the revocation of J&K’s special status under Article 370 demolished Pakistan’s narrative and the carefully constructed nationalist architecture. In one fell swoop, the government of PM Modi demolished the central pillar of the ‘ideology of Pakistan’ and struck a sledgehammer blow at the raison d’etre of the army’s domination.

Where does Pakistan go from here? For the long term it will have to go back to the drawing board and rethink all old narratives. But Pakistan is not known for introspection and for taking a long-term view. Given the kind of propaganda that the people have been fed with for decades, they will demand an immediate response. Failure to do so will severely dent the army’s image.

However, the government’s options are limited and in inverse proportion to the rhetoric emanating from its leadership, both civil and military. Moreover, Pakistan is also constrained by the fact that while there is unity on Kashmir, it is a divided house internally with intense polarisation among the political parties and economically is on the brink, seeking doles from friendly countries.

<snip>

Three facets of the Pakistan narrative are noteworthy: The first is that the move would change the demography of J&K and so materially breach the plebiscite arrangements of the UNSC resolutions on Kashmir. Second, as articulated by Imran Khan, India might stage Pulwama-like incidents to find an excuse to start an armed conflict with Pakistan. Third, Pakistan would try to project that developments in Kashmir would adversely impact the Afghan peace process and resultant US pullout.

<snip>

Its helplessness was revealed when a visibly upset Imran Khan, responding to the opposition’s criticism of the government’s response during the August 6 joint session of Parliament, asked Shahbaz: ‘What do you want me to do? Attack India?’

The bland statements issued by the international community show that Pakistan’s narrative is not succeeding. Concerns expressed are about human rights violations, restrictions imposed in the Valley, urging restraint and not critical of the measures taken. Thus, the US has noted that it was an internal matter. Russia has categorically stated that it is under the framework of the Indian Constitution. Even China has emphasised its own territorial dispute in the Ladakh region. To Pakistan’s discomfort, even the Taliban have debunked any linkage between Afghanistan and Kashmir.

Whatever options Pakistan chooses to adopt, the basic question that it needs to ask is whether any or all of them will lead New Delhi to reverse its actions in J&K. The answer has to be a resounding no. Ultimately, there is likely to be sullen acceptance that the international community would do little; Pakistan, by its own admission, is not looking for a military option, using terrorists could boomerang and the legal challenge would not amount to much. The constitutional moves of the Indian Government are a fait accompli and Pakistan will have to learn to live with the changed reality.

Vikas
BRF Oldie
Posts: 6045
Joined: 03 Dec 2005 02:40
Location: Where DST doesn't bother me
Contact:

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Vikas » 14 Aug 2019 16:49

Not that it matters but Tweets by Di'm Khan almost border on Hinduphobia by calling Hindus names.
Imagine if the Hindu word is replaced by Muslims in the tweets, how obnoxious they would sound.

With all the chest beating by Imran against India PM, How will he meet Sh.Modi sometime in future.

Rsatchi
BRFite -Trainee
Posts: 50
Joined: 04 Aug 2019 22:03

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Rsatchi » 14 Aug 2019 17:22

Read more at:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/arti ... aign=cppst
Look at the clap-trap (by the yindoo for the yindoo)
Subdued celebrations in Leh/Jammu.
Maybe needs a charter flight by SP Malik for thse coconuts to visit Leh and check out :evil: :roll:

Rsatchi
BRFite -Trainee
Posts: 50
Joined: 04 Aug 2019 22:03

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Rsatchi » 14 Aug 2019 17:35

Rsatchi wrote:Read more at:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/arti ... aign=cppst
Look at the clap-trap (by the yindoo for the yindoo)
Subdued celebrations in Leh/Jammu.
Maybe needs a charter flight by SP Malik for thse coconuts to visit Leh and check out :evil: :roll:

And if Gunami Baba was indeed 'Netaji' he sure did not want to be identified with his grand niece and nephews turning out as they did :oops:

menon s
BRFite
Posts: 673
Joined: 01 May 2010 09:51
Location: Bangalore

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby menon s » 14 Aug 2019 18:00

Was watching Dimrans speech from, PORK.
He seems to be at his wits end.....the so called pm of azad kashmir raja farooq haider (aka head chaprasi at Mirpur brigade HQ) said something

strange " Sir, aaj Kashmir ka baari, kal hamaari hai" ........ :lol:

and then dimran set off .....Modi, rss, muslimphobia, nazi ideology, hitler, ....how muslims donot fear death....etc etc.....and in the end.......there is going to be a war and if the international community, donot interfere.....there will be a nuke war and everyone will be responsible.........

Shanmukh
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2910
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Shanmukh » 14 Aug 2019 18:50

There is a petition started by the `International Commission of Human Rights' that has urged

STOP UN HIGH COMMISSIONER FOR HUMAN RIGHTS TO DROP THE UN REPORT ON KASHMIR INSTEAD URGE THE UN HUMAN RIGHTS COUNCIL (UNHRC) FOR A ‘PANEL DISCUSSION’ ON THE REPORT URGENTLY
. [Everything I have quoted is verbatim from their petition].

They have started a petition and have 4 lakh+ signatures [as of the time of writing] on change.org. This is the organisation https://ichr.uk/about-us/our-organization. Do we know anything about this particular organisation? I think all the British, Canadian, and maybe even Australian Leftist/Human Rights organisations are being mobilised for the moves against India.

mmasand
BRFite
Posts: 505
Joined: 19 May 2009 23:46

Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby mmasand » 14 Aug 2019 19:29

Barkha and company are in some serious trouble, Shah Faesal shows up in Delhi this morning(enroute to somewhere abroad) sent back and rearrested. Any guesses how he 'escaped' detention conveniently after giving an interview to Barkha? I'm surprised there is no one at Srinagar airport to vet those leaving the state.

PS totally unrelated, but has anyone tried to crawl into the boot of a car?


Return to “Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: EswarPrakash, kPrakash, s_gopal and 60 guests