J&K Union Territory-2019

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CRamS
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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby CRamS » 10 Sep 2019 21:37

Chetak, they are there all over the media and generate a lot of noise. Can't help notice them. Please read this thread for the fake narrative they are now peddling

https://twitter.com/sunandavashisht/sta ... 1828113408

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J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Peregrine » 10 Sep 2019 23:47

X Posted on the Terroristan Thread



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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby CRamS » 10 Sep 2019 23:49

Kanwal Sibal is an awesome nationalist diplomat.

Shame on this K.C.Singh (who made this guy India's ambassador) who repeats the low-IQ nonsense that libtards spew.

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J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Peregrine » 11 Sep 2019 00:26

X Posted on the Terroristan Thread

Pakistan has no right to speak on Kashmir at UN: Sindh, Baloch activists – ANI

GENEVA: Political activists of Sindh and Balochistan on Tuesday called it ironic on part of Pakistan to peddle its false narrative on the Kashmir issue at the UNHRC session in Geneva when minorities in the country have been facing worsening human rights situation.

"It is really shameful that a representative of Pakistan has come here (Geneva) to talk about human rights. These are people who have literally curbed every voice that did not align with them, they have abducted every person who wanted to raise his voice and created a hell for the religious minorities," Lakhu Ludana, the general secretary of World Sindhi Congress (WCS), told ANI.

The activists called on Qureshi to rather address the issues of enforced disappearances and killings of minorities in Sindh, Balochistan, and other parts of Pakistan by the state agencies than internationalising the "internal matters" of the neighbouring country.

"Qureshi should talk about the atrocities happening in Balochistan, Sindh and other areas than about Kashmir, which is none of his business," said Hidayat Bhutto, the United Kingdom and Europe organiser of WCS.

For long, Pakistan's establishment has been criticised over its practice of enforced disappearances and extrajudicial killings by international bodies and local human rights organisations that dare to speak out on the issue.

According to the Commission of Inquiry on Enforced Disappearances, an entity established by the Pakistani government, about 5,000 cases of enforced disappearances have been registered since 2014. Most of them are still unresolved.

Independent local and international human rights organisations put the numbers much higher. Around 20,000 have reportedly been abducted only from Balochistan, out of which more than 2,500 have turned up dead as bullet-riddled dead bodies, bearing signs of extreme torture.

Before being elected as Prime Minister, Imran Khan had admitted in multiple interviews about the involvement of Pakistan's intelligence agencies in enforced disappearances and extrajudicial killings and vowed to resign if he was unable to put an end to the practice, holding those involved responsible.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby sudeepj » 11 Sep 2019 00:35

Bart S wrote:Ignore that it is Praveen Swami for a moment and do read. Pretty worrying scenario, hope MAD has this already wargamed and is ready to deal with it
https://www.firstpost.com/india/four-we ... 07731.html


Interesting read, and accurately relates why the existing polity in Kashmir valley had to be dumped. PDP was at times in an official alliance with Hizbul!

I think, the battlefield for this war in Kashmir is not the streets and mosques there, but in our minds. In their minds too. Whoever hold their nerve and whoever shows the most amount of patience will win. In addition to dominating the streets, we also need to have a plan to dominate the cultural sphere in Kashmir. This means the mosques, the journalists and the internet as well. I hope we are ready. Or else we will need a deux ex machina.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby chetak » 11 Sep 2019 01:01

CRamS wrote:Kanwal Sibal is an awesome nationalist diplomat.

Shame on this K.C.Singh (who made this guy India's ambassador) who repeats the low-IQ nonsense that libtards spew.



Kanwal Sibal is a distinguished career diplomat who retired as Foreign Secretary to the Government of India and he is a staunch nationalist. You would be surprised to know who his brother is.

KC singh is a separatist sympathizer and he was once zail singh's secretary. he has had an undistinguished career and that perhaps rankles even today.

he is a nobody with an inferiority complex and a huge chip on his shoulder, always seeking attention with his divergent views and he does it to stay in the limelight. nobody even gives him the time of day. na ghar ka, na ghat ka.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Aditya_V » 11 Sep 2019 01:02

sudeepj wrote:
Bart S wrote:Ignore that it is Praveen Swami for a moment and do read. Pretty worrying scenario, hope MAD has this already wargamed and is ready to deal with it
https://www.firstpost.com/india/four-we ... 07731.html


Interesting read, and accurately relates why the existing polity in Kashmir valley had to be dumped. PDP was at times in an official alliance with Hizbul!

I think, the battlefield for this war in Kashmir is not the streets and mosques there, but in our minds. In their minds too. Whoever hold their nerve and whoever shows the most amount of patience will win. In addition to dominating the streets, we also need to have a plan to dominate the cultural sphere in Kashmir. This means the mosques, the journalists and the internet as well. I hope we are ready. Or else we will need a deux ex machina.


Part of the battle is to is see the collapse of Pakistan and development of India. That will win the minds.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby chetak » 11 Sep 2019 01:10

sudeepj wrote:
Bart S wrote:Ignore that it is Praveen Swami for a moment and do read. Pretty worrying scenario, hope MAD has this already wargamed and is ready to deal with it
https://www.firstpost.com/india/four-we ... 07731.html


Interesting read, and accurately relates why the existing polity in Kashmir valley had to be dumped. PDP was at times in an official alliance with Hizbul!

I think, the battlefield for this war in Kashmir is not the streets and mosques there, but in our minds. In their minds too. Whoever hold their nerve and whoever shows the most amount of patience will win. In addition to dominating the streets, we also need to have a plan to dominate the cultural sphere in Kashmir. This means the mosques, the journalists and the internet as well. I hope we are ready. Or else we will need a deux ex machina.


even during her father's time mehabooba was an ardent terrorist sympathizer and was quite open about it.

At the time it was her personal view because she was not the CM.

to push the same views when she became CM was both traitorous and seditious.

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J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Peregrine » 11 Sep 2019 01:16

X Posted on the Terroristan Thread

Pakistan’s Kashmir Narrative Is Falling Flat. How Might That Change? - Murtaza Solangi

How can Pakistan come out of the cul-de-sac on Kashmir?[/i]As things stand, Pakistan is stuck in a cul de sac as it tries to resolve the Kashmir dispute with India, which dates back more than 70 years. The country has fought three wars for Kashmir, is a signatory to UN Security Council resolutions on holding a plebiscite in the region, and has signed multiple agreements with India. It has tried supporting militant outfits in the valley, sent proxies from its territory and weaponized religion and nationalism to kill the Indian presence there by a thousand cuts but to no avail.

Still, advocates of old policies keep suggesting the same old tested and failed recipes wrapped in new packaging. Insanity in perpetuity seems to be the order of the day. Einstein’s saying “insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results” doesn’t seem to impress these advocates.

After the August 5 de-operationalization of Article 370 and revocation of Article 35A from the Indian constitution, an extraordinary situation has emerged in the region. Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi has shocked and awed Imran Khan’s regime and has nearly debilitated the Pakistani state in its response. Indeed, the BJP’s move has rocked the valley, putting all leaders in one anti-Delhi basket.

What is most shocking for Pakistan is the response of the international community. No country in the world has protested against Delhi’s move and no one has sided with Pakistan, except those who put out sympathetic statements on behalf of Turkey, Iran, and China.

The Chinese response, soon after Delhi’s move, advised both India and Pakistan to refrain from further escalation and protested only on the declaration of Ladakh as a union territory as it affected “Chinese national sovereignty.”

Over the last seven decades, the Pakistani state has transformed itself into a national security state because of its hostility with India and the mission it has entrusted upon itself is the accession of Kashmir. Pakistan’s obsession with Kashmir has weakened its economy and polity and has led to the abnormal domination of its military in all spheres of life and governance. India, on the other hand, has not only achieved sustained economic growth, but has also developed important economic leverage in its neighborhood, the Middle East, and with the major economies of the world.

Over the years—and especially after 9/11—India has successfully persuaded the international community that Pakistan is involved in violent incidents in India and the Kashmir valley. The movement for fundamental human rights of Kashmiris has been overshadowed by the violence in the valley. The hijacking of Indian airline in December 1999, the attack on the Indian parliament in December 2000, the terror attack in Mumbai in November 2008, the Pathankot attacks in January 2016, the Uri attack in September 2016, and the latest suicide attack in February 2019 in Pulwama have not helped Pakistan’s case.

When after Pulwama, Indian warplanes crossed the Line of Control and dropped their payloads in Balakot, the very heartland of Pakistan on February 26, there was no international condemnation.

Now, when Pakistan was diplomatically isolated, economically weakened, and politically polarized at home, Modi’s government did what no Indian government has done so far in Kashmir. On August 5, it formally ended the hollow and symbolic autonomy granted to the state of Jammu and Kashmir under Articles 370 and 35-A of the Indian constitution. As if that was not enough, government in Delhi turned the entire valley and its eight million souls into a big prison by imposing a curfew and chopping all communication links with the outside world.

With the help of China, Pakistan has tried to highlight the issue by getting it discussed in the UN Security Council in a closed-door informal discussion. But there was no statement from the world body. Not even the Islamic bloc came out with any statement condemning Indian actions in the valley, with the exception of a few sympathetic vibes from Iran and Turkey. China is the only superpower supporting Pakistan, but it too has raised and confined its criticism of India with reference to Ladakh.

Frustrated by the rejection of all requests for dialogue with India and facing isolation in the international arena, Imran Khan’s administration has pledged to internationalize the Kashmir issue. Unfortunately, the opposite seems to have happened. All moves by the government seem to have internalized the issue as the national media is forced to focus on Kashmir and state resources are being used to host events and stage protests.

Given the stubbornness of the Indian state, there is furious debate on Pakistan’s options. Some hawks have suggested sabre rattling and upping the ante. Some retired generals and defense analysts have even suggested to prepare for war with India and publicly told the government to start deploying troops on the eastern border. Some irresponsible politicos seated in Imran Khan’s cabinet keep hurling nuclear threats without realizing the international ramifications of their bravado. To them, this will ease some of the pressure on the inhabitants of the valley and may even force Modi’s government to reverse its August 5 decision and use the Supreme Court as an exit strategy when the Indian Apex court hears the petitions next month.

Can Pakistan go on this path at a time of a serious economic meltdown under a stringent IMF program and end up annoying the United States, which wants Pakistan to deliver in Kabul? So far there are no clear answers to these questions. Imran Khan’s government keeps huffing and puffing about the Kashmir issue but the set of actions it has taken so far suggest the administration is employing symbolic optics only aimed at Pakistani audiences and providing moral support to the people of Kashmir valley. By internalizing the Kashmir narrative, it is trying to scare the international community about regional tensions which may lead to a nuclear exchange. Will the world respond to this threat? Will hurling the threat of nuclear Armageddon generate sympathy for Pakistan?

Ambassador Ashraf Jehangir Qazi, Pakistan’s former high commissioner to India, chimed on the possibility in his recent op-ed in prominent English daily, Dawn. “Experts estimate a nuclear war between India and Pakistan could eventually lead to the death of nearly a quarter of the world’s population. The major powers will never permit such a possibility. Neither India nor Pakistan has a first-strike nuclear capability against each other. Whoever strikes first will not escape an equally deadly retaliatory nuclear response,” he wrote.

One thing is clear: Pakistan has come to the very last page of her Kashmir playbook. It has tried all tricks it had and none of them is working.

The “Kashmir Banega Pakistan” (Kashmir will be part of Pakistan) slogan is not finding any traction outside Pakistan and the Kashmir valley. Insistence on Kashmir’s accession to Pakistan has overshadowed the humanitarian aspect of the tragedy.

Kashmiris, too, have tried many options from Sheikh Abdullah to Mehbooba Mufti and from violent jihadis to the pro-Delhi players. The best thing for the people of the valley now would be to pursue only peaceful means for their fundamental rights, renounce violence and integrate with the wider democratic and pro-devolution movements of the people of India. The success of the struggle of the Kashmiri people rests on their peaceful humanitarian struggle supported by the people of India primarily with moral support from around the world, not just Pakistan.

Since none of its actions are helping, the only option left for Pakistan is to radically revise its policy on Kashmir. Pakistan must employ a new strategy if it is sincere in ending the miseries of the people of the Kashmir valley who have lost more than 100,000 people since the insurgency began in early 1990s.

Pakistan must focus on the humanitarian aspect of the Kashmiri people. The tragedies of the people of the valley of Kashmir are not the problem of the people of Pakistan, but the people of India as they are ruled by Delhi. If the Indian state denies fundamental rights to the people of the valley and treats them as subjects and not as citizens with equal rights, this is a blot on the conscience of the people of India and their democracy and a moral burden on the global community.

Yes, the people of Pakistan are connected with the people of the valley by cultural, religious and humanitarian links, but Pakistan needs a new moral high ground.

It needs to work on a verifiable mechanism to prove to the world that it has buried its old playbook on Kashmir and has abandoned the jihad project. It also needs to give full citizenship rights to the people of AJK and Gilgit Baltistan by amending the constitution with a proviso that at any given time India is willing to hold a plebiscite, Pakistan will let the people under its control decide their fate.

Pakistan cannot plead the case for human rights of the people of Kashmir if it is not respecting them in Balochistan and former FATA or other parts of Pakistan. Pakistan cannot speak for the freedom of press in the Kashmir valley if it is not respecting it in its territory.

Pakistan’s military establishment will have to loosen its grip on the state and agree to a process of truth and reconciliation to chart out a process of conversion of Pakistan from a national security to a welfare state. Let civilians take responsibility of the state, give breathing space to civilian institutions, allow the economy to grow and develop regional connectivity to influence global powers and mark a new beginning. Without taking these steps, Pakistan will remain in the cul de sac, where it finds itself now.

Murtaza Solangi is a prominent Pakistani journalist and former head of the national radio of Pakistan.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby UlanBatori » 11 Sep 2019 01:25

Pssssst! Small pooch.
"Pakistan, Cash More, Geneva, Hyooman Rites".

What is missing in this picture?
ANGANA CHATTERJI.
Any sightings? aka "Mary" cited by the Free Biscuits in the Federal Indictment of the Abdul G Whatzit of the CashMore Conference, who went to make chappatis for a couple of years as an Undeclared Pakistani Agint before being let out with an FBI mike up his musharraf.

Same for all the other "CashMore Researchers": Akhila Ra(h)man, Stalini Gera, Girish Agarwal? etc. All this ruckus about CashMore and these piglets are not out there at the trough?


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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby KJo » 11 Sep 2019 06:52

Peregrine wrote:X Posted on the Terroristan Thread




It's more a slip of tongue than an "admission". The Indian press is playing it up as if Pakistan now has an official position that JK is an "Indian state".

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby UlanBatori » 11 Sep 2019 06:55

er.. why should one make excuses for the pakis or give them the "benefit of doubt"?

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby KJo » 11 Sep 2019 07:12

UlanBatori wrote:er.. why should one make excuses for the pakis or give them the "benefit of doubt"?


It's not giving a benefit of doubt, it's just that we shouldn't fool ourselves that anything has changed.

Pakis gonna paki till the end of time. Today they say "Indian state", tomorrow they will say "Cheeni istate", the value of their word is less than $0.00.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Atmavik » 11 Sep 2019 07:14

J&K: Conflict transformation

Gen. Syed Ata Hasnain

https://www.dnaindia.com/analysis/colum ... on-2787989

How should we view the constitutional and administrative decisions of 5 August 2019 and its impact? These have been difficult decisions taken with an element of calculated risk. Lesser informed opinion imagines the end of the so called Kashmir problem and a triumphal attitude appears to exist post the decisions. However the one thing which is absolutely clear is that conflict is likely to persist for some time, subdued violence will mark the change in environment and politics of Jammu and Kashmir will never be the same again. Since the conflict in J&K is hybrid in nature with full throated proxy support, the easiest way to get a clearer understanding is to analyse the conflict transformation phenomenon. Hybrid or conventional conflicts are never static in nature. They move dynamically from the initiation to progression, stabilisation, termination and then resolution. While change from one state to the other is never seamless a sudden step up or down, to or from a status with a distinct change in the functioning environment denotes ‘conflict transformation’. It can promise a better or worse state of things in the security environment. The term ‘security environment’ in proxy hybrid conflict includes many facets of the nonmilitary domain, hence its usefulness in overall assessment.

The inability of the over ground workers (OGW) to remain effective through the lock down and prospectively their continued neutralisation will ensure stabilisation to a far greater extent. Those who have operated in Kashmir would recall how the efforts of the Army and Police to identify and neutralise these elements could rarely materialise due to patronage from many quarters. An OGW would brazenly meet officials, call on senior functionaries, be seen on high profile panels in seminars and yet be functioning against the nation and for the separatists. Indian democratic norms were fully functional in Kashmir at most times (1990-96 was a period when this did not exist).

Freedom of expression and action many times were perceived by some of us as being detrimental to security but the establishment did not act against this. One of freest media continued to remain in existence, writing as it wished and rarely ever expressed any pro-India sentiments. The government at Delhi did not exert itself on this and allowed a degree of flexibility. While we may be critical of its lack of display of commitment towards countering separatist sentiment there can be no denying the fact that it helped create a perception internationally which favoured the Indian narrative as against the Pakistani one. While the Army and the police fought separatism and its manifestation in the form of terror and street turbulence the level of freedom enjoyed by separatists and many of those who sat on the cusp was amazingly high, to the detriment of security. The polity of Kashmir also had its own unique characteristics. Without a soft separatist stance or at the least a commitment towards enhanced autonomy these parties could not have made much electoral headway.

The recognised parties did not have any decided pro-Pakistan sentiments although they did express the sentiment that Pakistan would need to be a party to any talks to resolve J&K. One of the reasons why the situation could not be taken to the next stage each time the Army stabilised the security environment was because there existed a system which somehow helped in ‘marking time’ at the same spot. Thus, August 5, 2019, hugely altered the way India will now handle Kashmir. The Central Government had to close various ends identified as potential areas which could be exploited. Enhanced terror activity immediately in the wake of the decision was never a threat because of low footprint of terrorists and absence of leadership. Yet, that won’t last forever; it’s important now to ensure no surge in numbers either through infiltration or recruitment. The containment of immediate turbulence in the streets was absolutely necessary and the sentiments of the mainstream parties were probably considered unpredictable; hence the action to detain political leaders. That is forcing the government’s hand for now but the risk of releasing them needs to be taken and engagement with political leaders is a must. The release and handling of Imran Ansari, the Shia leader and the conduct of the Muhurram mourning could provide some indicators towards further action.

Why I consider the necessity of taking the risk involved in greater opening and engagement is because conflict transformation indicates that sufficient steps have already been taken and are yet underway to ensure that the street turbulence does not create the kind of impasse it did in 2008, 2010 and 2016. The intelligence agencies appear to have done a reasonably good job in curbing the effectiveness of financial networks.

It is important to plan beyond the first milestone of the UNGA meeting with small steps. Thought needs to be given to the rejuvenation of the polity. The democratic exercise of early elections will assist in creating traction in international acceptance. The information domain is where the major threat lies. Pakistan has pulled out all the stops and will progressively do more to cultivate international sentiment against India even though the first round of the diplomatic battle may have been won by India. There is no permanence in this and unless we do more to neutralise the perception being expressed in international media there will be no guarantees of continuing support.

Pakistan may yet be on better behaviour until the FATF decision in Oct-Nov but post that, whatever be the outcome, may not hold back in terms of greater physical involvement.

It may be difficult for the Indian government to do more towards neutralising the first and second order implications of the progressive chain of events but it would need to keep analysing all potential threats and anticipating moves. One of the most visible actions it needs to currently execute is the release of the mainstream political leadership and await the effect of that. With all other measures in place this may pass off peacefully and get India the much needed perceptional advantage to sustain its diplomatic success.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby UlanBatori » 11 Sep 2019 07:15

KJo ji: That I agree. But it is so enjoyable to make fun of them.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby chetak » 11 Sep 2019 11:14

KJo wrote:
UlanBatori wrote:er.. why should one make excuses for the pakis or give them the "benefit of doubt"?


It's not giving a benefit of doubt, it's just that we shouldn't fool ourselves that anything has changed.

Pakis gonna paki till the end of time. Today they say "Indian state", tomorrow they will say "Cheeni istate", the value of their word is less than $0.00.


Its called psyops.

opportunities like this come rarely.

Don't overthink it but just ride it for all it's worth.

such gandhian (foolish, idiotic and self defeating) explanations are peculiar to the Hindus who revel in pushing the other's point of view to the detriment of their own.

No one else in the whole wide world does this kind of harm to their own community except the deluded Hindus.

The muslims invaded India, but.........,

the english plundered India, but.........,

the portuguese committed the most horrifyingly brutal inquisition in goa against the Hindus, but......

This Hindu generated list is endless.

Everyone and his jehadi uncle knows what happened and what qureshi said. Every single news report and all newsroom discussions in India were tongue in cheek and yet........

Why then, this obsessive need to point out the obvious when the GoI itself is spinning this embarrassing gaffe successfully.

BTW, every Indian, Hindu, muslim, xtian, buddhist, sikh, cat, dog, mouse and earthworm well know what these wretched pakis are all about and rest assured that no one is fooled that anything has changed.

so when an unwashed paki arse like qureshi exposes the jihadi b@!!$, inadvertently or otherwise, don't stop to smell the b@!!$ err roses, and just simply kick those tiny little pustules with your biggest and muddiest boots.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Peregrine » 11 Sep 2019 14:13

UlanBatori wrote:KJo ji: That I agree. But it is so enjoyable to make fun of them.
UlanBatori Ji:

+100³

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J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Peregrine » 11 Sep 2019 16:31

J&K internal matter, will not accept any interference : India at UNHRC – TNN

HIGHLIGHTS

- India on Tuesday accused Pakistan of using cross-border terrorism as a form of “alternate diplomacy” at the UNHR

- Without naming Pakistan, MEA’s secretary (east) Vijay Thakur Singh said one delegation had given a “running commentary” with offensive rhetoric of false allegations and concoted charges against India.

GENEVA/NEW DELHI: In a highwattage clash at the United Nations Human Rights Council (UNHRC) , India on Tuesday accused Pakistan of using cross-border terrorism as a form of “alternate diplomacy” while saying that the recent decision on J&K was its internal affair and it would brook no interference.

Responding to Pakistan’s call for an international investigation into its allegation of human rights violations in J&K, MEA’s secretary (east) Vijay Thakur Singh called it a fabricated narrative which was coming from the epicentre of global terrorism, where ring leaders were sheltered for years.

Without naming Pakistan, Singh said one delegation had given a “running commentary'' with offensive rhetoric of false allegations and concocted charges against India, as she underlined that curbs in J&K were temporary and meant to check cross-border terrorism .

Image

She took on Pakistan’s attack over recent decisions regarding the status of J&K. “These decisions were taken by our Parliament after a full debate that was televised and enjoyed widespread support. We wish to reiterate that this sovereign decision, like other legislations passed by Parliament, is entirely internal to India. No country can accept interference in its internal affairs, certainly not India,” Singh said.

Earlier in the session, Pakistani foreign minister Shah Mahmood Qureshi demanded an International investigation by the UNHRC into the situation in Kashmir and urged the world 9/11/2019 India at UNHRC: Jammu and Kashmir internal matter, will not accept any interference rights body not to remain “indifferent” after India revoked J&K’s special status.

Qureshi asked the council to urge India to immediately stop the use of pellet guns, lift the curfew, reverse the clampdown and communications blackout, restore fundamental freedoms and liberties, release political prisoners and fulfil obligations under the UN Security Council resolutions and various human rights instruments. “Today, I have knocked on the doors of the Human Rights Council, the repository of the world’s conscience on human rights, to seek justice and respect for the people of Kashmir,” he said.

The back-and-forth between the hostile neighbours over J&K dominated the session, potentially setting the stage for a bigger showdown later this month when PM Narendra Modi and his Pakistani counterpart Imran Khan will address the UNGA. India rebutted Pakistan’s allegations also while exercising its right to reply by fielding an officer who belongs to J&K, first secretary with India’s permanent mission in Geneva.

MEA first secretary Vimarsh Aryan questioned Pakistan’s locus to criticise India’s recent decisions on J&K, contending that Article 370 was a temporary provision. The official also said OIC, which too has been talking about alleged Indian atrocities, had no locus standi on the issue and J&K would remain an integral part of India.

Calling out Pakistan for its “false narrative”, Aryan said Pakistan’s was an ill-disguised effort to advance its territorial ambitions and that terrorism was the worst form of human rights abuse. Probably unsure of support from the 47-member council, Pakistan has not yet pressed for a resolution on the issue.

“We are not surprised at Pakistan’s hysterical statements with false, fabricated narratives aimed to politicise and polarise this forum. Pakistan realises that our recent decision cuts the very ground from under its feet by creating obstacles in its continuing sponsorship of cross- border terrorism against India. In this desperate mind-frame, some Pakistani leaders have even gone as far as to call for ‘jihad’ and to encourage violence both inside Jammu & Kashmir and in third countries, in order to paint a picture of ‘genocide’ which even they know is far from reality,” Aryan said.

“Pakistan’s nefarious designs will never succeed because the people of India are united in their determination to preserve our territorial integrity along with our core values of democracy, tolerance and unity in diversity. J&K and Ladakh will continue to progress and prosper along with the rest of India,” Aryan said, adding it defied credulity that a country like Pakistan was claiming to speak on human rights on behalf of unnamed countries

The official said Pakistan’s gory record spoke for itself. This rhetoric, he said, would not distract international attention from Pakistan’s persecution and elimination of religious and ethnic minorities — be it the Christians, Sikhs, Shias, Ahmadiyas and Hindus.

“This is the reason that Pakistan no longer publishes official statistics about its minorities as India does. Blatant abuse of blasphemy laws in Pakistan to persecute minorities is well documented. Aasia Bibi, the Christian woman was incarcerated for years. So was Abdul Shakoor, the 82-year-old Ahmadiya, under Anti-Terrorism Act for selling books. The recent
case of abduction, forced conversion and marriage of a minor Sikh girl Jagjit Kaur, exemplifies the state of women, especially from the minority communities in Pakistan,” Aryan said.

India, which had braced itself for an attack by Pakistan over the recent changes in the status of J&K, strongly stood its ground with Singh saying the decisions had been taken within the framework of Constitution and would ensure application of progressive measures aimed at ending to gender discrimination, including on property rights and local bodies representation, and social discrimination to J&K and Ladakh.

In Video : India rips into Pak's lies at UNHRC meet in Geneva

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Manish_Sharma » 11 Sep 2019 17:39

Vinita Rajput
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·
4h
Kashmiri Hindu homeless for 30 years- No issue.

Kashmiri Muslims mobileless for 30 days - Human rights issue.


https://twitter.com/Being_Vinita/status ... 04641?s=20

UlanBatori
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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby UlanBatori » 12 Sep 2019 08:03

Day 36 over. Situation NAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARMAL.
Al Jazeera sticks the knife up Bakistan's musharraf
Bakistan eej no friend of CashMore either - here's why

Ouch!

Peregrine
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J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Peregrine » 12 Sep 2019 16:55

X Posted on the Terroristan Thread

Live: Pak must implement ICJ verdict, says MEA

Cheers Image

Yagnasri
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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Yagnasri » 12 Sep 2019 17:07

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8MzHkuvU_Q&app=desktop

The well-known journalist from Srinagar. He says people asked him to tour without fear. There is at least one more post with details of the situation there.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Sanju » 12 Sep 2019 18:27

Mission POK

Troops ready, govt to decide on PoK: Army chief
General Bipin Rawat said that the next agenda of India is to retrieve PoK from the clutches of Pakistan and the decision in this regard has to be taken by the government.


Indian Army chief General Bipin Rawat on Thursday said that the Army troops are ready to retrieve Pakistan occupied Kashmir (PoK) and make it a part of India. He also said that while the Army troops are ready to take action on a cue, it is the government which takes decisions in such matters.

Speaking to news agency ANI, General Bipin Rawat said that the next agenda of India is to retrieve PoK from the clutches of Pakistan and the decision in this regard has to be taken by the government.

"The next agenda is retrieving PoK and making it a part of India. The government takes actions in such matters. The institutions of the country will work as per the orders of the government. The Army is always ready," he said.

Earlier, Union Minister Jitendra Singh had said that next agenda of the government is to "retrieve" parts of Jammu and Kashmir (PoK) and make it a territory of India.

"Now, the next agenda is retrieving PoK and making it a part of India. It's not only me or my party's commitment, but it's a part of a resolution unanimously passed by Parliament in 1994 during Congress government headed by PV Narasimha Rao," Jitendra Singh told reporters in Jammu.


Highlighting the success of 100 days of the Narendra Modi government, the minister said that the Central government took several historic decisions but abrogation of Article 370 was the biggest achievement of them.

Law Minister Ravi Shankar Prasad, too, had said that if talks were held with Pakistan in a terror-free atmosphere, it will be on Pakistan occupied Kashmir (PoK). Lambasting Pakistan for gross human rights violations in PoK, the Minister asserted that "if any talks in the terror-free atmosphere with Pakistan will be held that will be on PoK."

India had on August 5 scrapped the provisions of Article 370 that gave a special status to Jammu and Kashmir.

Addressing the media, Jitendra Singh said that the decision would help in the industrial growth, employment generation and bettering of the healthcare system in the two newly created territories.

Yagnasri
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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Yagnasri » 12 Sep 2019 19:02

GoI pressing the idea time and time as a tactic. Pakis have no capacity to be on their toes all the time. Too many shalwars but too much browning.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby vijayk » 12 Sep 2019 21:54

Yagnasri wrote:GoI pressing the idea time and time as a tactic. Pakis have no capacity to be on their toes all the time. Too many shalwars but too much browning.


Is this really a possibility?

Is this a tactic to settle LOC and stop future terrorist operations?

ramana
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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby ramana » 12 Sep 2019 22:02

No. Please don't make mistake like American experts and think BJP says what experts think.
BJP says what they think.

Quote Alyssa Ayres.
Bottom line LOC is not IB.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby vimal » 12 Sep 2019 22:06

I'm all for taking back POK but once we've taken it back India must remove all the pukes from that area and send them packing back to Isloo. Article 370 then must be ruthlessly applied to POK. Only original folks of GB and JK must be allowed to stay.

ramana
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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby ramana » 12 Sep 2019 22:14

vimal wrote:I'm all for taking back POK but once we've taken it back India must remove all the pukes from that area and send them packing back to Isloo. Article 370 then must be ruthlessly applied to POK. Only original folks of GB and JK must be allowed to stay.


You mean the Pak settlers whom Islamabad settled to change demographics.

I think CAB will apply to retaken lands.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby pankajs » 12 Sep 2019 23:06

GB merger is easy with its population, after weeding out the settlers, not being too great to imbalance the rest of J&K UT. Doable as far as population balance is concerned.

Plus the bonus of cutting the Karakoram highway and a probable fully Indian land/air bridge to Afghanistan.

UlanBatori
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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby UlanBatori » 12 Sep 2019 23:26

"The next agenda is retrieving PoK and making it a part of India.

Question is at what point the Pakis believe that there is a clear and present danger to their Joogular penile vein. I think they already know in their musharrafs that this is coming.

UlanBatori
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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby UlanBatori » 12 Sep 2019 23:29

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQSDZ8t0G8k

PostPaid BSNL to resume. Pakis :((
Last edited by UlanBatori on 12 Sep 2019 23:30, edited 1 time in total.

vimal
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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby vimal » 12 Sep 2019 23:30

ramana wrote:
vimal wrote:I'm all for taking back POK but once we've taken it back India must remove all the pukes from that area and send them packing back to Isloo. Article 370 then must be ruthlessly applied to POK. Only original folks of GB and JK must be allowed to stay.


You mean the Pak settlers whom Islamabad settled to change demographics.

I think CAB will apply to retaken lands.


Yes all illegal Pak settlers must be evicted.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby KJo » 12 Sep 2019 23:52

I would love for us to take back PoRK but always is good to think this through.

1. It may be legally ours but we still would have to go in invasion style. The land is ours but the people aren't. The "international community" looked the other way for 370, they may not for PoRK take-back.
2. What do with the people? A few may be Kashmiris, many would be Pakis. OK, what to do with them? Do we push them back? If we did, would they take them back (no). Now what to do with them?
3. How long would it take to re-Indianize PoRK land after centuries of Islamization? We have a far lesser problem on that front with J&K.

I am not sure I know the answers to these questions.
Also, it's not really about what is right - perception, leverage and ground realities are important too. We have leverage with the Gulfies (economic), so they shut their kabab-hole about 370. If we were a basket case like the pakis, they would be screaming AoA Green Jihad on the Kafirs.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Supratik » 13 Sep 2019 00:09

A lot of noise is happening on POK. Are we going to see some action?

As for population it is doable but more so in GB than AJK. The Mirpuri pop is very radicalized but the Shias of GB may not want to stay with Pak after their 70 years experience and they number a few lakhs only (rest are settlers). Depending on what the military strategy is may be go for GB first. AJK is closer to Pakjabis and have similar behavioral characteristics but their actual pop is only 1.5 million. Can be easily overwhelmed.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Bart S » 13 Sep 2019 00:38

We have enough on our hands right now. Nevertheless the POK statements are nice to keep the Pakis on edge and paranoid.

Actual recovery of POK can happen at a time of our choosing, after a gradual tightening of the screws over time. Slowly slowly catchee Paki!

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby pankajs » 13 Sep 2019 01:08

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=7757&p=2377916#p2377916
pankajs wrote:The Russians or the Americans weren't defeated by bunnies fighting alone but the bunnies backed by Bakistan with RR, Hospitals, Medicine, Food, shelter, weapons, training, etc. Hell there are folks who claim the bakis regulars fought alongside with bunnies. Till bakistan has the ability and the freedom to interfere in Afghanistan it is not going to allow anyone to succeed in Afghanistan. Folks who suggest a couple of divisions will be sufficient to pacify Afghanistan don't know what they are talking about.

As the bakistanis themselves state very proudly, the path to Afghanistan lies through Islamabad. It was true for the Americans and it will prove true for India too should it enter that theater unthinkingly. All other paths ignore the stark ground realities. IF India has to confront bunnies they have to do it in Slumbad/Pindi.

https://twitter.com/Massoud151/status/1 ... 7158581248
Massoud Hossaini @Massoud151

An advise for @realDonaldTrump: If you do not destroy #Taliban’s safe heavens in #Pakistan, you would not able to change anything! I have covered war in #Afghanistan for 18 years and I know it!

Someone from Afghanistan who thinks like Carlotta Gall and others.
I was born in the wrong place, Afg, Grew up in the wrong place, Iran, living in the wrong place, Kabul. Im 2012 Pulitzer winner & work: Former Associated Press

Supratik
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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby Supratik » 13 Sep 2019 01:14

These are likely to be opening shots to keep Pakis off-balance while their economy starts tanking and nothing is going to happen till our side of Kashmir is stabilized further.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby krisna » 13 Sep 2019 01:21

https://www.wionews.com/opinions/article-370-abrogation-foreign-medias-india-bias-249191 by Minhaz Merchant

Why does India get bad press internationally? The answer lies within complex layers of history and culture. Global media coverage of Kashmir is just the latest example of how misinformed, inaccurate and biased Western reportage on India can be.


Talks about @NYtimes articles.
Exhibit one: The New York Times editorial board wrote: “The Indian government’s decision to revoke the semi-autonomous status of Kashmir, accompanied by a huge security clampdown, is dangerous and wrong. Bloodshed is all but certain. The United Nations recommended holding a referendum to let Kashmiris decide their fate, but that never happened.”
Note the confidence with which The New York Times makes the assertion: “Bloodshed is all but certain.” Worse is the newspaper’s reference to the United Nations “recommending holding a referendum”, without mentioning the fact that the UN had set a pre-condition for Pakistan to vacate PoK before any referendum could be considered.


@reuters article
Exhibit two: Reuters reported: “Police used tear gas and pellets to fight back at least 10,000 people protesting Delhi’s withdrawal of special rights for Jammu and Kashmir in its main city of Srinagar on Friday, a police official and two witnesses said.”
Reuters’ sources? An unnamed police officer and two anonymous “witnesses”. The report of “a crowd of 10,000” protestors has been disproved by on-ground accounts from credible, independent Indian journalists. Reuters’ reportage clearly does not meet the standard of accurate and responsible journalism.


The New York Times editorial board has often been forced to apologise for inaccurate commentary. The BBC’s and Al Jazeera’s editorial coverage of Kashmir has been equally tendentious. Neither media organisation sufficiently stressed Pakistan’s malignant role in abetting terrorism in Kashmir. Without context, such journalism sets a low bar for itself.


Now history. Days before J&K acceded to the Indian Union on October 26/27,1947, Pakistan connived with Britain to annex J&K by force. Islamabad, with tacit support from the British, sent tribal Afridi fighters towards Srinagar. What transpired subsequently is well-documented. The Afridis were stopped just outside Srinagar and evicted by the Indian Army.


For Britain and the West, post-independent Pakistan has served as valuable geostrategic real estate. It helped thwart Soviet influence extending beyond the Khyber Pass. Pakistan plays the supplicant, ever ready to do the West’s bidding. The US prefers doing business with dictators — in the Middle East, South America and South Asia. Pakistan’s long line of military dictators, from the 1950s right up to Pervez Musharraf, has served Washington well.



Bangaladesh war in december 1971.
The West’s pro-Pakistan tilt was evident when US President Richard Nixon and his Machiavellian Secretary of State Henry Kissinger tried to goad China into opening a second front against India during the 1971 Bangladesh war. A timely Indo-Russian treaty of peace and friendship signed astutely by Prime Minister Indira Gandhi with Moscow in August 1971, kept the Chinese at bay. The US attempted, unsuccessfully, to help the beleaguered Pakistani Army by sending its Seventh Fleet to the Bay of Bengal in December 1971 to intimidate India. .


The US, Britain and other Anglo-Saxon nations have a grim record of committing historical crimes: trafficking Africans to North America during the centuries-long Atlantic slave trade; invading and colonising countries; waging extra-territorial wars; destabilising elected governments; supporting apartheid in South Africa; dispossessing Aborigines in Australia and indigenous Indians in the US; imposing a racist White Australia immigration policy; and segregating African-Americans in the southern states of the US till as late as the 1960s.


Amidst all this, India is a tempting target. A large, diverse democracy, it has multiple mutinies, as the late VS Naipaul wrote, going on raucously at the same time. These provide easy pickings for Western journalists. They have learnt their lesson the hard way after the French magazine Charlie Hebdo was attacked by Islamist terrorists, several of its staff killed and the publication eventually forced to change ownership. The lesson learnt? It is safer to criticise India. Indians don’t hit back.


India, in fact, provides Western media an invaluable additional resource: Indian journalists. These editorial sepoys can be inveigled to write how brutish and viscerally communal India is. Were Western journalists to write the same articles, they would be accused of racism. Indian journalists thus serve as useful surrogates. The Indian government has compounded the problem by not having daily briefings to provide timely information on key political and economic issues, allowing international media to misinform and distort as it has done in its reportage on Kashmir.


India has real problems of poverty, corruption and sectarianism, but there are gripping stories as well of startups, space technology and the rise of a new Dalit entrepreneurial class.
You won’t find much reportage on these in the Western media that picks its Indian mutinies carefully.

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Re: J&K Union Territory-2019

Postby KJo » 13 Sep 2019 01:21

Bart S wrote:We have enough on our hands right now. Nevertheless the POK statements are nice to keep the Pakis on edge and paranoid.

Actual recovery of POK can happen at a time of our choosing, after a gradual tightening of the screws over time. Slowly slowly catchee Paki!


Yes, this seems most likely to me, and I think it is a good strategy also. Keep up the leaks that GoI is looking to take back PoRK and it will keep the pakis scared. They know big bad Modi and Shah actually have the guts to pull it off if they wanted to unlike MMS. Turn the discussion from JK to PoRK which has not been done until now.


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