2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

The Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum is a venue to discuss issues pertaining to India's security environment, her strategic outlook on global affairs and as well as the effect of international relations in the Indian Subcontinent. We request members to kindly stay within the mandate of this forum and keep their exchanges of views, on a civilised level, however vehemently any disagreement may be felt. All feedback regarding forum usage may be sent to the moderators using the Feedback Form or by clicking the Report Post Icon in any objectionable post for proper action. Please note that the views expressed by the Members and Moderators on these discussion boards are that of the individuals only and do not reflect the official policy or view of the Bharat-Rakshak.com Website. Copyright Violation is strictly prohibited and may result in revocation of your posting rights - please read the FAQ for full details. Users must also abide by the Forum Guidelines at all times.
KJo
BRF Oldie
Posts: 9852
Joined: 05 Oct 2010 02:54

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby KJo » 18 Nov 2020 22:12

Ashokk wrote:Twitter has apologised in writing for 'Ladakh in China' error: Parliament panel chairperson Lekhi :twisted:
New Delhi: Social media giant Twitter has apologised in writing to a key parliamentary panel for wrongly showing Ladakh in China and has promised to correct the error by the month-end, the committee's chairperson Meenakshi Lekhi said on Wednesday.

Twitter's deposition has come in form of an affidavit signed by Damien Karien, Chief Privacy Officer of Twitter Inc, for wrong geo-tagging of India's map, Lekhi told .
Last month, the Joint Committee of Parliament on Data Protection Bill had come down heavily on Twitter for showing Ladakh as part of China, saying it amounted to treason and had sought an explanation by the US-based parent of the social media platform in form of an affidavit.

Appearing before the panel, chaired by Lekhi, representatives of Twitter India had "begged apology" :(( , but they were told by the members that it was a criminal offence that questioned the sovereignty of the country and an affidavit must be submitted by Twitter Inc, not by its 'marketing arm' Twitter India.

"Twitter has now given us a written apology on an affidavit for Ladakh being shown in China," Lekhi said.

"They have apologised for hurting Indian sentiments and have sworn to correct the error by November 30, 2020," she added.



Apology is useless.
They must pay the penalty. Amreeka/Cheen/Roos talk less and do more, they would have imposed stiff penalties on them AND then gotten an aplogee. This is clear mischief on their part.
Hindus need to learn the way the game is played.

vijayk
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4917
Joined: 22 Jun 1999 11:31

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby vijayk » 19 Nov 2020 00:22

Primus wrote:
Jay wrote:
Love this... :rotfl:


Classic!

So reminiscent of the numerous Hitler rant parodies from 'Downfall'. Beautifully done. Let us make more of these on other topics. The fact that this is so short makes it even more effective in this age of Global Attention Deficit Disorder.


dnivas
BRFite
Posts: 260
Joined: 05 Dec 2008 05:54

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby dnivas » 19 Nov 2020 00:45

Wow so trueindology account was back online a few hours ago and has now been suspended again. This is mind boggling.

chetak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23573
Joined: 16 May 2008 12:00

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby chetak » 19 Nov 2020 01:18

Bihar: BJP Signals Change In Equations; Nitish Kumar Won’t Get A Free Run


Bihar: BJP Signals Change In Equations; Nitish Kumar Won’t Get A Free Run

Jaideep Mazumdar
Nov 17, 2020

Bihar: BJP Signals Change In Equations; Nitish Kumar Won’t Get A Free Run


Snapshot
Nitish Kumar, for all practical purposes, will be a transition chief minister for the next five years (or maybe for a shorter period of time) till the BJP takes over Bihar from him.


Nitish Kumar may have retained the post of Chief Minister despite his party — the Janata Dal (United) — slipping to the position of junior partner in the National Democratic Alliance (NDA) in Bihar, but it is the Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) which will be calling the shots from now on.

This became amply evident when Sushil Kumar Modi (SuMo), who had been Nitish Kumar’s number two since 2005 (except for a brief period from June 2013 to July 2017 when Kumar left the NDA to join the RJD-led Mahagathbandhan), was not elected the leader of the BJP legislature party.

The BJP’s choice of Tarkishore Prasad (an OBC) and Renu Devi (an EBC) as the two deputy chief ministers is pregnant with meaning.

One, it signals BJP’s intent to aggressively woo women, OBCs and EBCs; all three categories have been supporters of Nitish Kumar.

Prasad, who belongs to the Kalwar sub-caste that falls in the Baishya caste, is a powerful orator and a strong personality. He has close links with the Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS) and the BJP’s central leadership.

He is a four-time MLA from Katihar, which falls in the Seemanchal region where Muslims form a significant chunk of the electorate.

Renu Devi, who started off as a member of the RSS-affiliated Durga Vahini and then joined the BJP Mahila Morcha, is a five-time MLA from Bettiah in the Paschim Champaran district of Bihar, bordering Uttar Pradesh and Nepal.

Renu Devi belongs to the Nonia caste which is in the EBC category. She is also considered to be a powerful personality. Both Devi and Prasad are close to SuMo and acknowledged him as their political mentor after the swearing-in ceremony on Monday.

By not re-nominating SuMo as deputy chief minister, the BJP has signalled to Nitish Kumar that it will now exert itself.

SuMo has been very close to Kumar and the two were often referred to as the Ram and Lakshman (Nitish as Ram and SuMo as Lakshman) of Bihar.

Nitish Kumar had been leveraging his friendship with SuMo to extract many concessions from the BJP.

SuMo had been used in the past to keep aggressive BJP MLAs and ministers in check. He (SuMo) had often interceded on Kumar’s behalf with the BJP central leadership.

Kumar would have been very comfortable with SuMo as his deputy. By replacing SuMo, the BJP has made it clear that it will no longer give Nitish Kumar a comfortable time.


An equal number of MLAs from the BJP and Janata Dal (United) or JD(U) — five each — were sworn in along with Nitish Kumar and the two deputy CMs from the BJP on Monday. One each from the Vikasheel Insan Party (VIP) and the Hindustan Awam Morcha (Secular) were also sworn in.

However, the BJP will demand a greater share in the council of ministers and a large number of important departments for its ministers.

It will also demand that Nitish Kumar, who had retained the Home and other important portfolios including Vigilance, let go of them.

Nitish Kumar had, in his past three terms, justified inducting more ministers from his party citing the JD(U)’s superior strength in the assembly.

With the JD(U) now having only 43 MLAs against the BJP’s 74, the latter will demand the application of the same formula for a higher share of portfolios.

In the last assembly, the JD(U) had 71 MLAs and 18 ministers while the BJP had 52 and 13 ministers, including Sushil Modi.

Going by the same formula, the BJP should be getting 20 ministerial berths and the JD(U) 11.

The BJP has already made it clear to Nitish Kumar very subtly that it was magnanimous in adhering to its promise to make him the chief minister despite the JD(U)’s inferior strength in the assembly.

The subtle message was that Kumar should be happy that he is the chief minister and should not demand a disproportionate share of portfolios from his own partymen or the important portfolios that JD(U) ministers held earlier.

The BJP has demanded the post of the Speaker which has, so far, been held by the JD(U). BJP’s Nand Kishore Yadav is likely to be its choice for the Speaker’s post.

Senior BJP leaders told Swarajya that the party will demand agriculture, transport, rural development, water resources, animal and fishery resources, finance, road construction, revenue, health and industries portfolios, among others.

This choice of portfolios also signals the BJP’s intent to rule Bihar from 2025, if not earlier.

“By wooing all the sections that form Nitish Kumar’s core support base, and demanding portfolios through which it can develop Bihar as per its agenda, the BJP has made its intent very clear. It will rule Bihar on its own and others, including the JD(U) will be junior partners,” said political scientist Ram Baran Yadav.


The BJP will extract as much as it can from Nitish Kumar and will also demand a far greater say in governance.

Nitish Kumar had, till now, a free hand in running the government and his style of functioning was unilateral. He would barely consult his ministers or the BJP on important policy matters.

That will change now and Nitish Kumar will have to consult the BJP and his cabinet colleagues more often. He has to adopt a more democratic style of functioning.

The BJP knows too well that Nitish Kumar is hardly in a position to resist. Apart from the JD(U)’s inferior numbers, Nitish Kumar also had little option other than sticking to the BJP.

Any political adventurism on his part will cost Nitish Kumar very dearly now. If he tries to break away from the NDA and join hands with the RJD-led Mahagathbandhan like he did in June 2013, his credibility will be destroyed forever.

Nitish Kumar knows that this is his last term as chief minister and he would not like to be remembered as an unprincipled politician. He also knows that the RJD will also dominate over him if he migrates to the Mahagathbandhan.

Also, the JD(U) will surely split if Nitish Kumar makes any effort to walk out of the NDA. Many senior JD(U) leaders and MLAs will join the BJP and Nitish Kumar will be left with a rump of his party.

The BJP has, thus, signalled it will not play second fiddle to Nitish Kumar. Though the BJP will give Kumar his due respect, the Chief Minister will have to give the BJP a much greater say in governance.

But the more important takeaway is that the BJP has already started preparing for the 2025 elections by wooing Nitish Kumar’s support base.


Nitish Kumar, for all practical purposes, will be a transition chief minister for the next five years (or maybe for a shorter period of time) till the BJP takes over Bihar from him.

Also read: https://swarajyamag.com/politics/the-nda-may-have-bagged-bihar-but-it-wont-be-smooth-sailing-for-the-alliance

chetak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23573
Joined: 16 May 2008 12:00

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby chetak » 19 Nov 2020 02:22

The "81 year old Poet" who defends massacres without batting an eyelid. VaraVara Rao. :mrgreen:

WATCH


via @reddy2002_varun

chetak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23573
Joined: 16 May 2008 12:00

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby chetak » 19 Nov 2020 03:23

Abhishek Singhvi @DrAMSinghvi·15h

Doesn't befit IPS officers of the country to be arguing with anonymous Twitter Handles that too during working hours. Make a point, let it go, you aren't winning anything by arguing on SM!


yeedyot appears to be from KAR. swans around on SM during working hours. profile picture in uniform which speaks volumes about predatory intimidation.

this is gross misuse of power.

got trueindology suspended through contacts at TI whose offices are in bangalore.

one would have thought that there already enough stoopid coppers in the world without adding another one to the tally.

the last yeedyot blew away a kid's head in bihar's munger and then blatantly lied about it



Image

Jarita
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2492
Joined: 30 Oct 2009 22:27
Location: Andromeda

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby Jarita » 19 Nov 2020 03:43

I actually think Roopa's only fault was that she went on and on. It was quite silly. She should have just disengaged. However, one cannot compare her to the likes of the murderous Munger and malicious and murderous Mumbai fellows. She is a decent one.
This Truindology person, however well read also needs to know where to draw the line and where to respectfully disagree. Too much of this arrogance defeats discussion. You need to bring people over to your side. Humiliating people, communities and such is no way.
The so called RW on twitter scores too many self goals.

m_saini
BRFite
Posts: 282
Joined: 23 May 2020 20:25

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby m_saini » 19 Nov 2020 04:35

Jarita wrote:...She is a decent one....


Image

Seems like she's just starting to spread her "woke" wings.

Besides, why is an IPS officer, in official capacity, arguing with people on twitter anyway. Don't these people have any work to do? And the thing with TI started with her saying some stuff about how there were no crackers in ancient texts. I mean what kind of moronic logic is that? I thought you had to have half a brain to be an IPS...

chetak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23573
Joined: 16 May 2008 12:00

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby chetak » 19 Nov 2020 04:41

m_saini wrote:
Jarita wrote:...She is a decent one....


[img]https://i.imgur.com/yKUpTQS.jpg[img]

Seems like she's just starting to spread her "woke" wings.

Besides, why is an IPS officer, in official capacity, arguing with people on twitter anyway. Don't these people have any work to do? And the thing with TI started with her saying some stuff about how there were no crackers in ancient texts. I mean what kind of moronic logic is that? I thought you had to have half a brain to be an IPS...


legal fictions, indeed. :mrgreen:

why is this surya guy crapping all over Indian traditions.

thought he was a polite right thinking guy

chetak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23573
Joined: 16 May 2008 12:00

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby chetak » 19 Nov 2020 04:43

Jarita wrote:I actually think Roopa's only fault was that she went on and on. It was quite silly. She should have just disengaged. However, one cannot compare her to the likes of the murderous Munger and malicious and murderous Mumbai fellows. She is a decent one.
This Truindology person, however well read also needs to know where to draw the line and where to respectfully disagree. Too much of this arrogance defeats discussion. You need to bring people over to your side. Humiliating people, communities and such is no way.
The so called RW on twitter scores too many self goals.



decent............. , really.........

Image

her sense of entitlement is immense :mrgreen:

suryag
Forum Moderator
Posts: 3828
Joined: 11 Jan 2009 00:14

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby suryag » 19 Nov 2020 04:48

the true indology guy is great in patches, actually once i tried to really find his references but hit deadends, few references he provides are dubious. anyways, that guy is very immature

chetak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23573
Joined: 16 May 2008 12:00

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby chetak » 19 Nov 2020 04:51

the pakis cannot help but shyte in their thalis :mrgreen:


Abu Dhabi puts the squeeze on Imran Khan, Pakistanis in UAE feel the heat






Abu Dhabi puts the squeeze on Imran Khan, Pakistanis in UAE feel the heat


Abu Dhabi’s probe into the 2017 Kandahar bombing that killed 5 UAE diplomats revealed the involvement of the Haqqani Network and Pakistan’s ISI, people familiar with the matter said.

WORLD Updated: Nov 18, 2020,

Relations between Pakistan and the UAE appear to be on a sharp downward spiral in recent weeks, particularly after Pakistan Prime Minister Imran Khan was critical of the UAE’s formalisation of its relationship with Israel, people familiar with the matter said on condition of anonymity.

This has manifested itself not just in the arrest of pro-Palestine Pakistani activists in the UAE, but also of other Pakistani residents, sometimes for minor crimes. The people familiar with the matter said about 5,000 Pakistani inmates are housed in Al Sweihan Jail in Abu Dhabi alone.

It is likely that the UAE could impose tighter visa norms for Pakistani nationals who wish to travel to the Emirates for employment. HT learns that Pakistani residents are finding it difficult to renew Resident Permits, and there has been a buzz about deportation, although no reports of a large-scale exercise to this effect have emerged.

chetak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23573
Joined: 16 May 2008 12:00

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby chetak » 19 Nov 2020 04:56

suryag wrote:the true indology guy is great in patches, actually once i tried to really find his references but hit deadends, few references he provides are dubious. anyways, that guy is very immature


he is being troubled by twitter + liberandus because he is an effective fighter for one side.

BTW, this is his second account to be suspended, his first is also suspended.

that doesn't happen casually or by happenstance or because he is immature/dubious.

they were waiting for a chance to get him and aunty pulled the trigger

in a democracy, some married couples because of ias/ips jobs, actually have delusions of grandeur, and think of themselves as power couples, with a never expiring golden ticket to ride a lifelong gravy train complete with assured access to privileges and priority delivery of any facilities/service that they desire.

vijayk
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4917
Joined: 22 Jun 1999 11:31

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby vijayk » 19 Nov 2020 06:37

Image

Image

Image

Image

fanne
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3544
Joined: 11 Feb 1999 12:31

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby fanne » 19 Nov 2020 06:42

suryag wrote:the true indology guy is great in patches, actually once i tried to really find his references but hit deadends, few references he provides are dubious. anyways, that guy is very immature


Suryag sir, you must be great in your chosen field all the way (and not in patches). Please can you provide us with some insight? It is rare to find talents like these. Tendulkar also got out at 0 at many instances and lost matches for us. I heard Bradman was better. Of course you are the best!!

vimal
BRFite
Posts: 636
Joined: 27 Jul 2017 10:32

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby vimal » 19 Nov 2020 06:54

I found the true indology person to be pretty good a most of the times. I referenced his/her sources and fact checked myself a lot of time.

Shanmukh
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2970
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby Shanmukh » 19 Nov 2020 07:26

It is not just TrueIndology's account that is gone. Our own Rudradev acharya's account (@indosphere) is showing up as `account suspended by twitter'. Wonder if we BRFers should stand up and make our voice heard about Rudradev's account?

arshyam
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3938
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby arshyam » 19 Nov 2020 07:31

Whether (s)he is good/bad or (im)mature is not the point. The IPS officer has no business using her official position to silence his(her) voice. As simple as that. So what if he sounded a bit rude - does the constitution say anywhere that the Right to Free Expression is only for polite conversations, even more so with unelected govt officials? Ambedkar would be really sad to see how the Constitution has been changed and applied beyond all recognition. Of course, our dear "chacha" Nehru's personally piloted very first amendment placing "reasonable restrictions" on free speech is the root cause for all this nonsense: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Ame ... n_of_India.

Ashokk
BRFite
Posts: 690
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby Ashokk » 19 Nov 2020 20:54

Parliamentary panel grills Twitter over 'obscene' tweets by Kunal Kamra targeting SC, CJI
NEW DELHI: A parliamentary committee questioned Twitter on Thursday over the recent "obscene" tweets by stand-up comedian Kunal Kamra targeting the Supreme Court and the chief justice of India (CJI), and sought reply from the social media giant over the matter within seven days :twisted: , said the panel's chairperson Meenakshi Lekhi.
This came close on the heels of Twitter apologising in writing to the same parliamentary panel for wrongly showing Ladakh in China and promising to correct the error by the month-end.
Twitter India representatives deposed before the Joint Committee of Parliament on Data Protection Bill on Thursday.
"It is shameful that Twitter is allowing its platform for obscene remarks like the one by stand-up comedian Kunal Kamra against the Supreme Court and the CJI," Lekhi told reporters here.
"Twitter is allowing its platform to be misused for abusing top constitutional authorities, such as Supreme Court and CJI."
She said members of the committee across political spectrum, including Congress MP Vivek Tankha, BSP MP Ritesh Pandey and BJD MP Bhatruhari Mahtab, grilled Twitter representatives on this issue.
Lekhi also said that explanation of Twitter about banning handles and tweets was found to be inadequate.
Meanwhile, Kamra has refused to retract his controversial tweets against the Supreme Court or apologise for them, saying he believes they "speak for themselves".
Earlier, Attorney General K K Venugopal consented to the initiation of criminal contempt proceedings against him for a series of tweets following the apex court giving interim bail to Republic TV Editor-in-Chief Arnab Goswami.

suryag
Forum Moderator
Posts: 3828
Joined: 11 Jan 2009 00:14

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby suryag » 19 Nov 2020 21:01

Fanne Sir I dont claim greatness in any field, there is so much to learn. TI is great no doubt, but they way he conducts himself on Twitter is not conducive to hindu reawakening efforts. Of course, he has done a lot more than I have done in this field, my only grouse is he gets into needless arguments, he should leave this to his loyal band of followers and focus on producing relevant content. The guy/gal is probably young and with age will mature but gettin 100k followers and then getting suspended repeatedly is not helping his or our case either. We need him to stand strong and stay stable and leave the street fights to numerous other anonymous handles. Hope he gets better on this count.

Prem Kumar
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2653
Joined: 31 Mar 2009 00:10

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby Prem Kumar » 19 Nov 2020 22:54

suryag wrote:the true indology guy is great in patches, actually once i tried to really find his references but hit deadends, few references he provides are dubious. anyways, that guy is very immature


Agree on the immaturity part but disagree strongly on the knowledge part. He is one of the gems on Twitter & I've rarely found him wrong.

What this Roopa character did to him is a classic example of the rot that goes by the name of our civil service system
Last edited by Prem Kumar on 19 Nov 2020 23:31, edited 1 time in total.

Prem Kumar
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2653
Joined: 31 Mar 2009 00:10

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby Prem Kumar » 19 Nov 2020 23:00

chetak wrote:BTW, this is his second account to be suspended, his first is also suspended.

that doesn't happen casually or by happenstance or because he is immature/dubious.


This is the 3rd or 4th time he is suspended. Its clear that the left$shits are rattled by him and look for every excuse to get him suspended, doxx him etc. Twitter, being run by leftist cretins, just looks for the flimsiest excuse to ban him.

Him being immature is besides the point. A lot of obnoxious accounts get away with murder on that platform (remember Mahathir Mohammad).

TI is likely a young chap and he will learn and mature. If anything, Twitter's behavior calls out for the banning of that platform in India and nurturing of local alternatives

vijayk
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4917
Joined: 22 Jun 1999 11:31

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby vijayk » 20 Nov 2020 04:04

Ashokk wrote:Parliamentary panel grills Twitter over 'obscene' tweets by Kunal Kamra targeting SC, CJI
NEW DELHI: A parliamentary committee questioned Twitter on Thursday over the recent "obscene" tweets by stand-up comedian Kunal Kamra targeting the Supreme Court and the chief justice of India (CJI), and sought reply from the social media giant over the matter within seven days :twisted: , said the panel's chairperson Meenakshi Lekhi.
This came close on the heels of Twitter apologising in writing to the same parliamentary panel for wrongly showing Ladakh in China and promising to correct the error by the month-end.
Twitter India representatives deposed before the Joint Committee of Parliament on Data Protection Bill on Thursday.
"It is shameful that Twitter is allowing its platform for obscene remarks like the one by stand-up comedian Kunal Kamra against the Supreme Court and the CJI," Lekhi told reporters here.
"Twitter is allowing its platform to be misused for abusing top constitutional authorities, such as Supreme Court and CJI."
She said members of the committee across political spectrum, including Congress MP Vivek Tankha, BSP MP Ritesh Pandey and BJD MP Bhatruhari Mahtab, grilled Twitter representatives on this issue.
Lekhi also said that explanation of Twitter about banning handles and tweets was found to be inadequate.
Meanwhile, Kamra has refused to retract his controversial tweets against the Supreme Court or apologise for them, saying he believes they "speak for themselves".
Earlier, Attorney General K K Venugopal consented to the initiation of criminal contempt proceedings against him for a series of tweets following the apex court giving interim bail to Republic TV Editor-in-Chief Arnab Goswami.


I think they need to put a 20 or 50 cr fine. Let them go to court and fight it.
Do again on another violation and again and again and again. Meanwhile go full support on other platforms indigenous

chetak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23573
Joined: 16 May 2008 12:00

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby chetak » 20 Nov 2020 04:20

vijayk wrote:


I think they need to put a 20 or 50 cr fine. Let them go to court and fight it.
Do again on another violation and again and again and again. Meanwhile go full support on other platforms indigenous


just do what the aussies have done: declare them a "publisher" and hold them liable for editorial decisions like banning, censoring, suspending and make them vulnerable to libel and defamation, to be tried in Indian courts and with no provision for arbitration just like Indian citizens can appeal a decision but cannot ask for arbitration outside the country.

or even better, suspend them for a month, suspend as in what they do to the handles of people they censor

If that doesn't work, ban the blighters from operating in India.

suryag
Forum Moderator
Posts: 3828
Joined: 11 Jan 2009 00:14

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby suryag » 20 Nov 2020 05:35

Owaisi offers pre-poll alliance to MB. Man this guy is smart, heads he wins tails MB loses. Soon he will get a national party status and yes second coming of the ML in AIMIM's form

nachiket
Forum Moderator
Posts: 8100
Joined: 02 Dec 2008 10:49

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby nachiket » 20 Nov 2020 05:47

suryag wrote:Owaisi offers pre-poll alliance to MB. Man this guy is smart, heads he wins tails MB loses. Soon he will get a national party status and yes second coming of the ML in AIMIM's form

Ordinarily MB would be extremely wary about agreeing to such an alliance because although useful in the short term, Owaisi will only eat into her own Muslim votebank in the long term and lead to her doom. But MB may not be able to see past the immediate BJP threat and will be under pressure to deny them any possibility of victory so might go along with this.

Media dalals in the meantime will be begging for her to agree (and asking to Congress to join as well no doubt) hoping to get off on seeing the BJP lose. All the while peddling the shameless lie that AIMIM, a party of Muslims and for Muslims is somehow a "secular" party :lol:

fanne
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3544
Joined: 11 Feb 1999 12:31

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby fanne » 20 Nov 2020 07:49

Or it could further polarize the already polarized poll benefitting BJP?

fanne
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3544
Joined: 11 Feb 1999 12:31

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby fanne » 20 Nov 2020 07:51

suryag wrote:Fanne Sir I dont claim greatness in any field, there is so much to learn. TI is great no doubt, but they way he conducts himself on Twitter is not conducive to hindu reawakening efforts. Of course, he has done a lot more than I have done in this field, my only grouse is he gets into needless arguments, he should leave this to his loyal band of followers and focus on producing relevant content. The guy/gal is probably young and with age will mature but gettin 100k followers and then getting suspended repeatedly is not helping his or our case either. We need him to stand strong and stay stable and leave the street fights to numerous other anonymous handles. Hope he gets better on this count.


Aapne to goalpost hi shift kar diya. So he is not wrong but immature, ok? Needless argument - What are your views on one Shri Rahul g? or many of the TV debates that happen in India? BTw, that could be valuable input for TI (they say it is a she)

Kati
BRFite
Posts: 1431
Joined: 27 Jun 1999 11:31
Location: The planet Earth

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby Kati » 20 Nov 2020 08:46

In WB, Mumtaz Banoo is in hot spot.
If she doesn't agree to Owaisi overture then a large chunk of her minority faith-fools would drift toward Owaisi. But if she
does agree to accept Owaisi's offer then it would be a golden opportunity for Bengal to consolidate the Hindus saying - "I told you so".
In fact, personally I would like to see Mumtaz swallowing Owaisi's offer. Such a golden opportunity won't come in another fifty years, - not only for WB, but also for the entire eastern Bharat.

la.khan
BRFite
Posts: 264
Joined: 15 Aug 2016 05:02

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby la.khan » 20 Nov 2020 08:53

fanne wrote:Or it could further polarize the already polarized poll benefitting BJP?

Kati wrote:In WB, Mumtaz Banoo is in hot spot.
If she doesn't agree to Owaisi overture then a large chunk of her minority faith-fools would drift toward Owaisi. But if she
does agree to accept Owaisi's offer then it would be a golden opportunity for Bengal to consolidate the Hindus saying - "I told you so".
In fact, personally I would like to see Mumtaz swallowing Owaisi's offer. Such a golden opportunity won't come in another fifty years, - not only for WB, but also for the entire eastern Bharat.

Exactly. As of now, there is polarization in WB. I think every WB Hindu sees the appeasement & pandering of one community.

If MB/TMC want to go alone, no alliance, the prized vote of RoP is split between TMC, Left, INC, AIMIM. This benefits BJP/NDA.

However, if an alliance materializes between TMC, Left, INC, AIMIM or a combination thereof (for ex. TMC+AIMIM and Left+INC), every WB Hindu can see with his/her own eyes how left out Hindus are. If a Hindu in WB values his/her voice, BJP is a good option.

Pratyush
BRF Oldie
Posts: 8308
Joined: 05 Mar 2010 15:13

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby Pratyush » 20 Nov 2020 11:10

^^^ the points raised by you are quite good. However, can one be assured that "Scientific Rigging", as pioneered by the Communists will not take place??

nvishal
BRFite
Posts: 883
Joined: 14 Aug 2010 18:03

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby nvishal » 20 Nov 2020 12:46

If the bangali castes themselves haven't learned from one partition, maybe other Indian castes should resist from interfering.

There were three major indian castes that couldn't survive the Arabic/Iranian conquest wars. The sindhis surrendered almost entirely and half of the punjabi and bangali populations collapsed.

Today, these castes barely have any legitimacy or leverage in new Delhi. The same has happened in the Indian armed forces.

When one caste collapses or retreats, the void will automatically pull other castes into the power vacuum.

nandakumar
BRFite
Posts: 1253
Joined: 10 May 2010 13:37

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby nandakumar » 20 Nov 2020 13:14

chetak wrote:
vijayk wrote:
I think they need to put a 20 or 50 cr fine. Let them go to court and fight it.
Do again on another violation and again and again and again. Meanwhile go full support on other platforms indigenous


just do what the aussies have done: declare them a "publisher" and hold them liable for editorial decisions like banning, censoring, suspending and make them vulnerable to libel and defamation, to be tried in Indian courts and with no provision for arbitration just like Indian citizens can appeal a decision but cannot ask for arbitration outside the country.

or even better, suspend them for a month, suspend as in what they do to the handles of people they censor

If that doesn't work, ban the blighters from operating in India.

The Press and Registration of Books Act only holds the publisher responsible for what they publish and not for what they don't. So declaring social media as a publication is not of much help in what content they censor.

Suraj
Forum Moderator
Posts: 13754
Joined: 20 Jan 2002 12:31

Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Suraj » 20 Nov 2020 13:18

Karan M wrote: if India had developed the capability to truly be a great power and hence weild deterrence, we would not be bothered which candidate had won. Or for that matter developed the capability to craft its own PR heavy narrative.

Sadly we aren't there yet by any means, hence all the concerns. NaMo and co have to do what they do to keep ties on an even keel, but needless to say its good we did what we had to do vis a vis Article 370 and CAA during Trumps time.

I don't understand this argument. The implication seems to be that if India is a great power, whoever is the US (or Chinese) leader will not dare to give us buri nazar. This is not how it works. There seems a separate view that we can't react unemotionally because we 'are not there yet' regarding our relative power. This is also not correct. One behaves according to the position they aspire to, not where they stand. This is the same approach associated with a workplace promotion - you get promoted when you're visibly behaving at a higher level even if you haven't ticked every last box. If we want to be members of a great power, we need to act like it. There's not going to be anyone handing us out certificates of greatpower-ness and patting us on the head saying 'ab tum bada ho gaya, here come have a scotch with us'.

Great powers test each other all the time. There is never a cordial live and let live mentality. Small or unimportant countries are generally ignored most of the time, unless they're manipulated when the moment arises. Medium capability countries with great power potential are suitably hampered for as long as feasible. We've essentially always been in this category since independence. In the context of a medium sized power, seeking good treatment from others is understandable - that is a respite from being kept down after all . But if you want to get bigger than that, you yourself have to reach out further. It's not going to just happen by itself.

The long term view here has broadly been that India has - despite never quite acting very forceful - stubbornly held on to its most important strategic goals. Despite having to beg for PL480 food, we did not sign NPT. Effectively the entire non proliferation apparatus is an exercise in ensuring there would be no #6 nuclear power in the form of us. Today we've effectively dismantled those shackles, and are literally members of groupings created to stop us. Just recently, we reversed decades of Chinese border policy and set up a new dynamic they're struggling to come to terms with. There are many more such examples. Successes and a bunch of failures. This is normal.

But if you aspire towards a position, it's important to stop behaving the way we did when at a lower station of power. Maybe we 'aren't there yet', but you still need to behave like it first. You don't wring your hands and whine about why we always suck. This is unnecessary. Any google search of western leaders speaking against China or Russia gets orders of magnitude more than anything about India. Our rise to great power status will NOT be a cordial friendly 'meeting of minds'. The status will not be given, not by anyone, not even 'friendly democracies'. It's ours to take, and our actions determine how we go about it. The status will be visible when we see people treating us differently because they don't want to risk the consequence of other behavior. The Indian policy goal is to engender such behavior. The pinpricks and challenges will NEVER stop, however. It's simply a question of the nature and visibility of our response.

If this forum aspires to see India in such a great power status, it needs to understand and approach the problem from a perspective that is not so passive. That we aren't a great power isn't an excuse to avoid behaving like we are - that's quite literally part of how you get there.

Karan M
Forum Moderator
Posts: 19839
Joined: 19 Mar 2010 00:58

Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Karan M » 20 Nov 2020 14:01

Suraj wrote:
Karan M wrote: if India had developed the capability to truly be a great power and hence weild deterrence, we would not be bothered which candidate had won. Or for that matter developed the capability to craft its own PR heavy narrative.

Sadly we aren't there yet by any means, hence all the concerns. NaMo and co have to do what they do to keep ties on an even keel, but needless to say its good we did what we had to do vis a vis Article 370 and CAA during Trumps time.

I don't understand this argument. The implication seems to be that if India is a great power, whoever is the US (or Chinese) leader will not dare to give us buri nazar. This is not how it works. There seems a separate view that we can't react unemotionally because we 'are not there yet' regarding our relative power. This is also not correct. One behaves according to the position they aspire to, not where they stand. This is the same approach associated with a workplace promotion - you get promoted when you're visibly behaving at a higher level even if you haven't ticked every last box. If we want to be members of a great power, we need to act like it. There's not going to be anyone handing us out certificates of greatpower-ness and patting us on the head saying 'ab tum bada ho gaya, here come have a scotch with us'.

Great powers test each other all the time. There is never a cordial live and let live mentality. Small or unimportant countries are generally ignored most of the time, unless they're manipulated when the moment arises. Medium capability countries with great power potential are suitably hampered for as long as feasible. We've essentially always been in this category since independence. In the context of a medium sized power, seeking good treatment from others is understandable - that is a respite from being kept down after all . But if you want to get bigger than that, you yourself have to reach out further. It's not going to just happen by itself.

The long term view here has broadly been that India has - despite never quite acting very forceful - stubbornly held on to its most important strategic goals. Despite having to beg for PL480 food, we did not sign NPT. Effectively the entire non proliferation apparatus is an exercise in ensuring there would be no #6 nuclear power in the form of us. Today we've effectively dismantled those shackles, and are literally members of groupings created to stop us. Just recently, we reversed decades of Chinese border policy and set up a new dynamic they're struggling to come to terms with. There are many more such examples. Successes and a bunch of failures. This is normal.

But if you aspire towards a position, it's important to stop behaving the way we did when at a lower station of power. Maybe we 'aren't there yet', but you still need to behave like it first. You don't wring your hands and whine about why we always suck. This is unnecessary. Any google search of western leaders speaking against China or Russia gets orders of magnitude more than anything about India. Our rise to great power status will NOT be a cordial friendly 'meeting of minds'. The status will not be given, not by anyone, not even 'friendly democracies'. It's ours to take, and our actions determine how we go about it. The status will be visible when we see people treating us differently because they don't want to risk the consequence of other behavior. The Indian policy goal is to engender such behavior. The pinpricks and challenges will NEVER stop, however. It's simply a question of the nature and visibility of our response.

If this forum aspires to see India in such a great power status, it needs to understand and approach the problem from a perspective that is not so passive. That we aren't a great power isn't an excuse to avoid behaving like we are - that's quite literally part of how you get there.


Thats because you have completely misunderstood what I've written.

I was actually agreeing with you that we didn't seem to have the inclination or mindset in our setup to aspire for great power status prior to MAD/SJ etc and the occasional streak of stubbornness. And that to be a great power means that one would develop the capacity to deter near peer or even peer competitors. The one change I've seen in recent years is SJ stating they are setting up a special cell in IFS to deal with economic /trade aspects of diplomacy and special topics. Then there are the unilateral decisions on Balakot etc instead of MMS's whinging to Obama et al over Pak and getting a pat on the back in return. SJ ignoring Jeyapal and Modi openly showing up on stage with Trump, taking leadership on CV in Asia etc, PPE diplomacy are also welcome steps.

We've moved ahead in many respects but the ability to coerce and reward other states or individual actors is also very limited away as many in our establishment are stuck in some morality play of "doing the right thing".

Pak mobilized its diaspora to physically assault our embassy in the UK, ran a sophisticated pysops campaign to make Balakot look like a failure within days of the strike. They and the Chinese have dozens of journos and influence peddlers on their literal payroll. We were not able to even put out a coherent narrative on CAA and NRC which any half competent PR agency and lobbyist could have done. Much of the baby killer Hindu nationalist narrative in the west is because Pak runs these campaigns and we don't bother with any counter narrative.

To be a power you've to aspire for being one and develop the capacity and capabilities accordingly- coercion, and also reward. Not just always appeal to the other nation's better nature or put out some morality play PR statement.

And until we do so this angst over how other powers behave with us will continue. For all their stupidity or even over confidence the Chinese did get that part right. Perhaps that accounts for their belief that despite the current wave if anti PRC sentiment, their economic capability apart, they have enough carrots and sticks to continue to go their merry way.

Suraj
Forum Moderator
Posts: 13754
Joined: 20 Jan 2002 12:31

Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Suraj » 20 Nov 2020 14:09

The Chinese have always been clear about their great power aspirations. They've been somewhat poor at accomplishing many of their goals, but they understand and pursue the fake it till you make it approach, often overstating their capabilities and overreaching. E.g. they had ballistic missile sub decades ago, but it was just one noisy boat for show purposes. But they're good at incrementally building from there.

India has historically been very good at safeguarding some core imperatives (e.g. nuclear, space and other capabilities) but not very good at being proactive in aspiring further and paradoxically rather good at underestimating our own strength. There are definite changes in how Modi has approached this, but it's a multidecadal process.

chetak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23573
Joined: 16 May 2008 12:00

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby chetak » 20 Nov 2020 14:17

nandakumar wrote:
chetak wrote:
just do what the aussies have done: declare them a "publisher" and hold them liable for editorial decisions like banning, censoring, suspending and make them vulnerable to libel and defamation, to be tried in Indian courts and with no provision for arbitration just like Indian citizens can appeal a decision but cannot ask for arbitration outside the country.

or even better, suspend them for a month, suspend as in what they do to the handles of people they censor

If that doesn't work, ban the blighters from operating in India.

The Press and Registration of Books Act only holds the publisher responsible for what they publish and not for what they don't. So declaring social media as a publication is not of much help in what content they censor.


Obviously we need a new act/amendment to accommodate and regulate these phenomena of SM which are entirely disruptive and obviously were not covered in "The Press and Registration of Books Act". foreign entities simply cannot be allowed to influence any aspect of our internal dynamics, be it politics, religion or culture.

we do not interfere in their affairs and neither do we have the means to do so nor will they permit it, so why are we so keen to accept/allow their biased interference. It is turning out to be completely a one horse race controlled entirely by big tech because we have allowed them unrestricted access to the Indian market under some idiotic foreign construct of FOE.

if the SM selectively censor, block, promote and influence the content then it is what they publish because they have self appropriated to themselves the editorial function and use self generated editorial policies and algorithms to control viewership and hence the reach of any handle.

Also, they answer to no regulatory body anywhere in the world, leave alone India and its laws. They are the new digital colonizers, a law unto themselves where their "subjects" have nil recourse to appeal, review or even moderation.

Moreover, the application of their controls vary according to the handle and often bear no relationship to the actual nature of the so called "transgressions"

It's a clear cut case of "you show me the handle and I will show you the law" type of situation. Dictators and fascist regimes are envious of the ways in which these SM guys can get away with their totalitarian ways and BTW, the saudis are huge shareholders in many of these SM companies with disastrous consequences for India as we all saw during the shaheenbagh riots.

don't want to lose any election simply jack the crack or some other SM owning media baron poked his nose to get himself a different result.

During the US elections these SM guys did not allow dissemination of even newspaper articles critical of बायडनवा and his family members, one of whom is very appropriately named "hunter".

They very selectively censored journos and newspapers. Are we ready for them to do the same during our own Indian elections.

Karan M
Forum Moderator
Posts: 19839
Joined: 19 Mar 2010 00:58

Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Karan M » 20 Nov 2020 14:18

That has a lot to do with the fact that there was no internal cohesion or pride in terms of actually being a power through several admins. Coalition Govts or as under UPA, when the GOI in power endorses those who believe in and push Spivaks million mutinies and believe India is best divided (re: Thapar) - what talk then of being a united country which will chart its own way. We are lucky we had people like PVNR and ABV and now Modi who emerge periodically and reset the ship. Otherwise we'd be sunk if another MMS type had continued. When one sees the worthies from his admin who set policy and their views on India's role in the world, China etc one can only wonder how the heck did we even muddle our way through.

chetak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23573
Joined: 16 May 2008 12:00

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby chetak » 20 Nov 2020 15:02

nvishal wrote:If the bangali castes themselves haven't learned from one partition, maybe other Indian castes should resist from interfering.

There were three major indian castes that couldn't survive the Arabic/Iranian conquest wars. The sindhis surrendered almost entirely and half of the punjabi and bangali populations collapsed.

Today, these castes barely have any legitimacy or leverage in new Delhi. The same has happened in the Indian armed forces.

When one caste collapses or retreats, the void will automatically pull other castes into the power vacuum.


The sindhi, the punjabi and the bengali: wouldn't these be three major Indian sub cultures and not castes.

Each of these sub cultures have their own castes and sub castes.

there is also some significant intermingling between the punjabi and the sikh but maybe not so much for the two who seem to have preferred isolation or even exclusivity or maybe it's simply a dominant language thing that has acted as an insurmountable cultural barrier.

chetak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23573
Joined: 16 May 2008 12:00

Re: 2020 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Postby chetak » 20 Nov 2020 15:29

nachiket wrote:
suryag wrote:Owaisi offers pre-poll alliance to MB. Man this guy is smart, heads he wins tails MB loses. Soon he will get a national party status and yes second coming of the ML in AIMIM's form

Ordinarily MB would be extremely wary about agreeing to such an alliance because although useful in the short term, Owaisi will only eat into her own Muslim votebank in the long term and lead to her doom. But MB may not be able to see past the immediate BJP threat and will be under pressure to deny them any possibility of victory so might go along with this.

Media dalals in the meantime will be begging for her to agree (and asking to Congress to join as well no doubt) hoping to get off on seeing the BJP lose. All the while peddling the shameless lie that AIMIM, a party of Muslims and for Muslims is somehow a "secular" party :lol:



the muslim votes in bengal are sharply divided between the urdu speaking and the bengali speaking voters.

owasi and mumtaz begum appeal to different vote banks and votes from the urdu may not so easily transfer to the bengali or even vice versa.

owasi is after the bengali muslims over whom mumtaz has the monopoly. urdu muslims in bengal are relatively much smaller in numbers.

It's a trap that the commies/congis/naxals are laying out for mumtaz using owasi as the trojan.

BH election results count for zilch in WB because those votes were from urdu muslims

but owasi is both a separatist as well as muslim supremacist.

Need to observe him carefully, especially in sensitive border states.

and given the historic ties of old between nizams and turkis, one suspects that he may be funded by the turkis


Return to “Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: srin and 76 guests