2020 US election results discussion

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Mort Walker
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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 19 Nov 2020 05:19

saip wrote:
Mort Walker wrote:
No. Joint session is on 6 Jan 2021. NARA must transmit results to the Senate President and Archivist by 23rd Dec. If that does not happen then during the joint session, the 12th amendment is the underlying authority.

See the timeline: https://archives.gov/electoral-college/key-dates

NARA could be shutdown after 11 Dec 2020 if there is no continuing resolution.

God forbid if 12th Amendment should come into play. Right now Biden has 25 and Trump has 25 votes. Washington DC, Biden won; but can they vote? Another problem, quorum. 2/3rds. If either of the parties abstain then no Quorum. If no President till March 4, then new VP (and not old VP as his term ends on Jan 20th) will become the President ( the terms of present President and VP end on Jan 20th - 20th amendment). How to elect the new VP? It is the new Senate. It could be dead locked. Again quorum - 2/3rds. Even if Republicans are 52 (winning both GA seats) and Dems abstain, no quorum. So if there are no President or the VP on 20th Jan, then Pelosi is the President. She is already elected as the Dem leader and will be the speaker on Jan 3rd. But not so fast. If Dem Reps get a whiff that they can become President through back door, there will be free for all. Lots of ifs and buts. Let us hope it does not come to that.


For the 117th Congress that will convene 06 Jan 2021, it's actually 26 states with Republican controlled delegations and 24 states with Democrat controlled delegations. DC does not have any elected US House representatives.

If Trump shuts down the government after 11 DEC 2020, then the House will attempt to impeach him, but will not be able to in the Senate. This will be the time to get your popcorn and beer out.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby nachiket » 19 Nov 2020 05:32

People are assuming that all Republicans in the House and Senate are completely on board with Trump's allegations of voter fraud and the election being stolen. Right now some are openly supporting him while most are either quiet or just saying that the legal challenges should be dealt with in the courts before certification of results. Once the lawsuits are done with and the count still shows Biden ahead, they will have to come down from the fence on one side or the other and there is no guarantee that all will support Trump no matter what he tries to pull.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 19 Nov 2020 05:38

Many Republicans despise Trump and are happy with Biden, as he's a corrupt old DC politician, but are too afraid to say anything right now. Should Trump's challenges end, then he will be discarded like used toilet paper. It will be a return to "business as usual". The senate just the other day convened after the election. There is video of Lindsey (I never met an Islamists I didn't like) Graham fist bumping Comeallah Harris. I can guarantee you if he did this before the election, he would have been cooked alive.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 19 Nov 2020 06:01

2018 Mail-In Ballot Rejection Rate:

Clark County, NV: 2.7%
Maricopa County, AZ: 0.3%

Hennipen County, MN: 1%
Ramsey County, MN: 1%

Milwaukee Count, WI: 1.9%

Wayne County, MI: 0.7%

DeKalb County, GA: 5.4%

Philadelphia County, PA: 4.3%

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Vivek K » 19 Nov 2020 06:25

Mort Walker wrote: ... Graham fist bumping Comeallah Harris. I can guarantee you if he did this before the election, he would have been cooked alive.

As an immigrant and a proud Indian American, I would never deliberately misspell Kamala Harris’s name even if I did not agree with her. Her accomplishment is an inspiration for all of us to Emulate and tell our children and grandchildren that anything is possible. She has broken a glass ceiling for American Women, Indians, Indian women, immigrants, and Jamaicans!

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 19 Nov 2020 07:04

^^^You mean like meeting with Pakistani terrorists in Houston last year who went about condemning the revocation of Article 370?

That is not something I would want my daughters to emulate.

Kamala Harris Dec. 20, 2019
@SenKamalaHarris
It’s wrong for any foreign government to tell Congress what members are allowed in meetings on Capitol Hill. I stand with
@RepJayapal, and I'm glad her colleagues in the House did too.



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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby arshyam » 19 Nov 2020 07:35

Vivek K wrote:The important thing here is that the loser is doing Russia and China's job of calling the world's fairest election rigged. But to his dismay, Republican Officials (his own appointees) are vouching for the accuracy of the vote.
:lol:

For someone who is so vocal about desi capabilities, I was surprised you have given the title so cheaply given the indigenous capability here is much better - perhaps should we import this "fairest election" and use that under license?

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Jarita » 19 Nov 2020 08:05

Vivek K wrote:
Mort Walker wrote: ... Graham fist bumping Comeallah Harris. I can guarantee you if he did this before the election, he would have been cooked alive.

As an immigrant and a proud Indian American, I would never deliberately misspell Kamala Harris’s name even if I did not agree with her. Her accomplishment is an inspiration for all of us to Emulate and tell our children and grandchildren that anything is possible. She has broken a glass ceiling for American Women, Indians, Indian women, immigrants, and Jamaicans!



House sepoys are only celebrated amongst the Indian diaspora because of some faint genetic linkage. Identity politics has enabled the old colonialists to put sepoys in position of power to exploit their people. No need to celebrate.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby ShyamSP » 19 Nov 2020 08:25

Mort Walker wrote:^^^You mean like meeting with Pakistani terrorists in Houston last year who went about condemning the revocation of Article 370?

That is not something I would want my daughters to emulate.

Kamala Harris Dec. 20, 2019
@SenKamalaHarris
It’s wrong for any foreign government to tell Congress what members are allowed in meetings on Capitol Hill. I stand with
@RepJayapal, and I'm glad her colleagues in the House did too.





She also comes from rotten San Francisco. SF city council also passed anti-India resolution against CAA similar to Seattle and a few of other cities

SF and state politician and Mayor Willie Brown propped both Kamala Harris and Gavin Newsom. She also "dated" then 60-year old man Willie Brown to rise in political career in around 95.

Her life was never an "Indian" life, may be except when she was with mother as kid. Only recently she expanded black identity to also Indian/South-Asian/Asian, which was not an identity when she ran as CA Senator 4 years ago.

For this elections, they showed themselves to be pro-Muslim tilt for Muslim votebanks and also took anti-India position on Kashmir and CAA.

Insanallah Bin Den - Kamallah Haris fit correctly :twisted:

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby putnanja » 19 Nov 2020 09:16

Read about Kamala Harris' rise in CA as public official. I wouldn't use her tactics as a role model for any young girl! That would be downright disgusting. There is a whole chapter on Kamala Harris' shennanigans in "Profiles in Corruption" book. Read the article fully and it has lots more on her corruption on her way to top too. Definitely not role model, unless one subscribes to "using any means to get to the top" philosophy

https://twitter.com/AbhinavAgarwal/stat ... 5137776644

Who is Willie Brown and what's the connection?
"In 1994, she met Willie Brown, who at the time was the second-most-powerful man in California politics. As Speaker of the State Assembly, Brown was a legend in Sacramento and around the state."
3/n
"Brown was under investigation several times,by the State Bar of California, Fair Political Practices Commission,the FBI.
In 1986 ...as California Assembly Speaker, he “received at least $124,000 in income & gifts...from special interests that had biz before the Legislature.”
4/n
Now this is neither here nor there for me, except for the political angle:
"Brown was sixty at the time he began dating Kamala, who was twenty-nine. Brown was actually two years older than her father. Their affair was the talk of San Francisco in 1994."
5/n
"Kamala’s mother defends her daughter’s decision - and offered choice comments about Brown. "Why shouldn’t she have gone out with Willie Brown? He was a player. And what could Willie Brown expect from her in the future? He has not much life left."
6/n
"He (Willie Brown) put Kamala on the State Unemployment Insurance Appeals Board and later the California Medical Assistance Commission. The MAC paid $99k a year in 2002.. UIAB ~$114k.
Both posts were part-time.
At the time, she was working as a county employee making ~$100k"

...
"The Federal Trade Commission (FTC) opened an investigation into Herbalife in March 2014.
In July 2016, the FTC won a $200 million settlement against Herbalife.
But Harris never even investigated the company."
48/51
"It is worth noting that those corporations in question all happened to be clients of her husband’s law firm, Venable LLP. GNC, Herbalife, AdvoCare International, Vitamin Shoppe, and others were represented by Venable."
49/51
"In 2015, prosecutors from Harris’s own attorney general’s office based out of San Diego sent her a long memorandum arguing that Herbalife needed to be investigated. ... Harris declined to investigate or provide the resources-and never offered a reason."
50/51
These excerpts are from @peterschweizer's 2020 #1 bestseller, "Profiles in Corruption: Abuse of Power by America's Progressive Elite"
A pity this book's not received the coverage it deserves in India.
amzn.to/3iCKPt9


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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Vivek K » 19 Nov 2020 11:11

Yeah sure! I would like to use Trump as a role model. But to each their own. The Republican dirty tricks enterprise has a great track record of slinging mud on opponents. Look at the Benghazi attacks on Hillary! They never once talked about Benghazi in DJT’s 4 years of chaotic rule at best.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Vivek K » 19 Nov 2020 11:16

arshyam wrote:
For someone who is so vocal about desi capabilities, I was surprised you have given the title so cheaply given the indigenous capability here is much better - perhaps should we import this "fairest election" and use that under license?

And how does that come in here? If US elections are conducted fairly, how does that impact Indian elections?

The US elections were conducted fairly as per DJT’s point man - Chris Kreb. Problem - the people voted against DJT!

Just because you did not get the result you wanted does not mean the election wasn’t fair! Why isn’t DJT able to prove the irregularities in court? Why are Republican State and Federal officials stating that the elections were conducted fairly?
Last edited by Vivek K on 19 Nov 2020 11:20, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Vivek K » 19 Nov 2020 11:19

Mort Walker wrote:^^^You mean like meeting with Pakistani terrorists in Houston last year who went about condemning the revocation of Article 370?

That is not something I would want my daughters to emulate.

Kamala is here to stay. As a political figure, she is entitled to meet people on all sides. And also have a different worldview than yours.

We remain proud of Kamala’s journey and her breaking the glass ceiling to reach this position of power!

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby m_saini » 19 Nov 2020 12:16

Vivek K wrote: Kamala is here to stay. As a political figure, she is entitled to meet people on all sides. And also have a different worldview than yours.

We remain proud of Kamala’s journey and her breaking the glass ceiling to reach this position of power!

Who's "we"?

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Kati » 19 Nov 2020 12:46

As we ‘watch’ the U.S. election outcome today, Some may also like to see how a seasoned Ghanaian journalist decided to cover U.S. election like the Western media tends to cover ours in India as well as in Africa.

—————————————

*AMERICA’S TRIBES GO TO THE POLLS AMIDST UNCERTAINTY*

_By K. Sakyi-Addo, Africa News Network (ANN)._

Millions of American tribesmen and women are voting today to elect a president and lawmakers.
Two white tribal elders are contesting to rule the Covid-ravaged wheat-exporting former British colony for the next four years. They are the incumbent Donald J. Trump of the ruling Republican Party and Joseph R. Biden of the opposition Democratic Party, both in their seventies.

Due to the levels of illiteracy, candidates are represented on the ballot by animals, the elephant for the Republicans and a braying donkey for the Democrats.

Over 230,000 people have died of covid, more than any country in the world, leading to widespread poverty and joblessness unseen in the vast country in a century.

Millions are dependent on food rations, homelessness is rife, and open defecation common in some provincial capitals.

As temperatures drop, the homeless sleep on cardboards and are warmed by steam rising from underground sewers at night. By day, they live off coins tossed their way by European and African tourists.

Some voters received assorted food packs from the ruling party suspected by the opposition to be in exchange for votes.

In parts of the province of South Dakota, children travel tens of km everyday to attend the nearest school, with many barely aware of a world beyond their homestead and school playground.

Mr. Trump who is neither a believer in God nor science, earlier this year promoted drinking cleaning detergents to the country’s 330 million citizens as the means to fight covid. Some mountain village tribesmen heeded his advice and required emergency medical care.
It is unclear which brand of bleach Mr. Trump, his wife, son and courtiers drank when they were infected with the deadly disease in October.

Some insiders are certain Mr. Trump, believes the earth is flat. He also believes opposition leader Biden belongs to a cult whose members sleep with children for juju.

Trump is a close friend of North Korean leader Kim Jong-Un with whom he publicly exchanged crude insults earlier in his term. Some observers believe the American leader envies Kim’s god-like status among his people, and aspires to a similar grip on Americans.

The opposition have accused him of packing his administration with Trump clansmen and women and in-laws.

The country has a curious system of democracy adopted in 1788 in which candidates are sometimes elected with vastly fewer votes. In 2016, Mrs Hillary Clinton, an elder from the former ruling Democratic Party had three million more votes than Mr. Trump, but was declared the loser much to the bewilderment of democracy watchers elsewhere in the world. She would have been the first woman to lead the country in more than 200 years.

Tension has been high in the run-up to the polls with armed gangs, such as the Proud Boys militia, threatening to reject the results should their candidate lose.

Some tribal militiamen were caught recently plotting to abduct the head of Michigan province and stage a military coup.

Over the weekend, members of the opposition accused gun-totting, flag-waving ruling party supporters from the Texan tribe of trying to push their candidate’s vehicle off a cliff.

Earlier this year, dozens of towns across the country witnessed riots sparked by discrimination against black tribespeople. Their ancestors were shipped from west Africa in their millions over a four hundred year period to work as slaves on cotton plantations.

In May this year, George Floyd, a Black tribesman from the province of Minnesota, was killed in broad daylight by a policeman from the white tribe who knelt on his neck until his last breath left him as people watched. He is now out on bail. Another who shot a black tribes woman dead in her own bed at home was not even indicted, leading to further riots.

Members of the minority black tribe were counted only as three-fifths human in the 18th century and got the full right to vote in 1965.

A black armed militia known as NFAC has also emerged saying they are ready to fight the white tribes.

Thousands of shops have been boarded up with plywood and markets closed for fear of post-election unrest.

African analysts believe the African Union or Ecowas should send observers to watch the polls to ensure they are free and fair.

It is not known whether the UN has taken measures to parachute peacekeepers in, should civil war break out in the increasingly isolated territory.

_K. Sakyi-Addo, African News Network._

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 19 Nov 2020 12:54

Vivek K wrote:
Mort Walker wrote:^^^You mean like meeting with Pakistani terrorists in Houston last year who went about condemning the revocation of Article 370?

That is not something I would want my daughters to emulate.

Kamala is here to stay. As a political figure, she is entitled to meet people on all sides. And also have a different worldview than yours.

We remain proud of Kamala’s journey and her breaking the glass ceiling to reach this position of power!



Having a worldview that is pro terrorist and anti-Indian is fine. We are not proud of her and do not wish her success in destroying India and killing Indians. Many of us will vote against her until she changes her worldview.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 19 Nov 2020 13:04

Vivek K wrote:
arshyam wrote:
For someone who is so vocal about desi capabilities, I was surprised you have given the title so cheaply given the indigenous capability here is much better - perhaps should we import this "fairest election" and use that under license?

And how does that come in here? If US elections are conducted fairly, how does that impact Indian elections?

The US elections were conducted fairly as per DJT’s point man - Chris Kreb. Problem - the people voted against DJT!

Just because you did not get the result you wanted does not mean the election wasn’t fair! Why isn’t DJT able to prove the irregularities in court? Why are Republican State and Federal officials stating that the elections were conducted fairly?


The US elections have NEVER been fair not 2020, 2018, 2016, 2014, 2012, 2010, 2008... When there is no voter identification involved in several states, this is a serious problem. Every election there is improper handling of the election by various states. Not having a uniform voter identification and verification system is inherently problematic. Why is this so hard to understand? Even the common villager in India understands this.

Chris Kerbs is not DJT's point man. He is the Director of Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency within the Dept. of Homeland Security. He overstepped his bounds by commenting on something he has no authority or knowledge on as elections are controlled by the states. Kerbs should have known better and not commented even though he disagreed.

The court cases and state challenges are only beginning, but there may not be any luck due to the deliberate destruction of voter identification records and actual ballots cast. People like Stacey Abrams in GA has never conceded the governor's race in 2018. Those who are asking to look into voting irregularities are being verbally attacked by the left on social media. Law firms representing Trump are being doxed and threatened. This is not how a democracy works.
Last edited by Mort Walker on 19 Nov 2020 13:25, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Thakur_B » 19 Nov 2020 13:12

Kati wrote:As we ‘watch’ the U.S. election outcome today, Some may also like to see how a seasoned Ghanaian journalist decided to cover U.S. election like the Western media tends to cover ours in India as well as in Africa.


Chuckle worthy :rotfl:

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Jay » 19 Nov 2020 13:30

putnanja wrote:Read about Kamala Harris' rise in CA as public official. I wouldn't use her tactics as a role model for any young girl! That would be downright disgusting. There is a whole chapter on Kamala Harris' shennanigans in "Profiles in Corruption" book. Read the article fully and it has lots more on her corruption on her way to top too. Definitely not role model, unless one subscribes to "using any means to get to the top" philosophy


I agree that Kamala is no Saint, and I trust Biden more then her. But if some one has problem with Kamala and her ethics, then surely that person must take a bugger umbrage to Trump, right?

After all, this Bozo was married thrice, cheated on each and every one of his wives, and with the latest wife Melania, cheated on her with a ***** while bragging with her that she reminds him of his daughter. What a utter disgusting personality and ethics he has or lack there of, and there is no problem for Repubs supporting this degenerate.

https://www.salon.com/2018/03/23/donald-trumps-creepy-comments-about-daughter-ivanka-a-history/

We have a habit of discarding our people when they do not agree with us and this has come back to bite us. As an example, Jinnah's family was outcast by Hindus because of some inane rule that was not followed.

https://www.news18.com/news/india/fish-to-blame-for-indias-partition-book-claims-taboo-business-pushed-jinnahs-grandfather-to-convert-2000857.html

I have a contact of mine who is running for a state rep position in Texas, as a Republican. I lean Democrat and personally I do not agree with my contact's political positions. Still, I canvassed for him, and pushed his position with local voters, only because he is a Dharmic. Would it be good that he and I see things eye to eye? Absolutely. But where we are now in our quest for Hindu/Dharmic identity, I will take some one with a Hindu sounding name, over someone else with out one, if all things remain the same.

My advice/request for "no kamalala" is to just co-opt her and let her hear what we want from her. This is how influence needs to gained. Be prepared to checkmate the Social Justice Warriors when it comes to Dharmic identity.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Karan M » 19 Nov 2020 14:34

Vivek K wrote:
Mort Walker wrote:^^^You mean like meeting with Pakistani terrorists in Houston last year who went about condemning the revocation of Article 370?

That is not something I would want my daughters to emulate.

Kamala is here to stay. As a political figure, she is entitled to meet people on all sides. And also have a different worldview than yours.

We remain proud of Kamala’s journey and her breaking the glass ceiling to reach this position of power!


What kind of worldview is it to force a Pakistani POV on India? Would you be proud if tomorrow she uses that power against Indian interests as she was when forcing S Jaishanjar to meet Jeyapal?

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 19 Nov 2020 15:01

Jay wrote:
I agree that Kamala is no Saint, and I trust Biden more then her. But if some one has problem with Kamala and her ethics, then surely that person must take a bugger umbrage to Trump, right?

Biden is incoherent and old for age 78. His press conference today made no sense. It puts the India hater Kamallah in the spotlight.

After all, this Bozo was married thrice, cheated on each and every one of his wives, and with the latest wife Melania, cheated on her with a ***** while bragging with her that she reminds him of his daughter. What a utter disgusting personality and ethics he has or lack there of, and there is no problem for Repubs supporting this degenerate.

https://www.salon.com/2018/03/23/donald-trumps-creepy-comments-about-daughter-ivanka-a-history/

Trump was not running for political office. He was a private citizen. There is a big difference here. Kamallah was appointed to plum public positions, attorney general and US senator which puts her in the spotlight again.

We have a habit of discarding our people when they do not agree with us and this has come back to bite us. As an example, Jinnah's family was outcast by Hindus because of some inane rule that was not followed.

https://www.news18.com/news/india/fish-to-blame-for-indias-partition-book-claims-taboo-business-pushed-jinnahs-grandfather-to-convert-2000857.html

You're making a false analogy and trying to blame Indian Hindus for Kamallah's failings. Sorry, that's not going to work.

I have a contact of mine who is running for a state rep position in Texas, as a Republican. I lean Democrat and personally I do not agree with my contact's political positions. Still, I canvassed for him, and pushed his position with local voters, only because he is a Dharmic. Would it be good that he and I see things eye to eye? Absolutely. But where we are now in our quest for Hindu/Dharmic identity, I will take some one with a Hindu sounding name, over someone else with out one, if all things remain the same.

Pramila Jayapal has a Hindu sounding name and she's a snake along with Kamallah. Both of whom hate Indians and Hindus. When Indians can be used for fundraising or political advantage then it's all good with Kamallah.

My advice/request for "no kamalala" is to just co-opt her and let her hear what we want from her. This is how influence needs to gained. Be prepared to checkmate the Social Justice Warriors when it comes to Dharmic identity.

Sorry. We're not going to give Kamallah a pass. She is a nasty person proven by her actions.


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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby IndraD » 19 Nov 2020 18:43

Interesting to note that even on Bharat Rakshak (meaning one which defends Bharat, India) we have desi in awe and shock of leaders in US who wish ill on India, have in past sided with Pakistan and made comments against CAA & 370 abrogation! If KH has broken glass ceiling, good for you all who support her but this is not the right platform to beat drums on her behalf, please find pro 'desi for democrats' forums, there are plenty around. On this forum interests of India is at heart, and democratic policies do not inspire confidence in this regard.

I am also amused that over 50 muslim representatives have made it to US reps this year through democrats, but how many Indians?? Same 4-5 usual suspects who regularly espouse venom against India! It is for desis in US to ponder on why are they not treated with respect in political structure but Pakistanis are.

Over 50 Muslim candidates win US elections http://muslimmirror.com/eng/over-50-mus ... elections/


Rep. Pramila Jayapal: “Let us continue to oppose the forces of hate, racism and xenophobia that seek to divide us — let us call out injustice and inequality wherever we see it.”
https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1327 ... 08352?s=20

Biden while wishing Diwali virtue signals Islamists and here we have desis batting for them on this forum! Please spare us.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Vivek K » 19 Nov 2020 20:17

Karan M wrote:
What kind of worldview is it to force a Pakistani POV on India? Would you be proud if tomorrow she uses that power against Indian interests as she was when forcing S Jaishanjar to meet Jeyapal?

Are you certain that she is going to work against India - even before she has had the opportunity to act? Do you think that the geopolitics of the world require US to even take note of Pakistan? A lot of assumptions are being made here.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Vivek K » 19 Nov 2020 20:23

IndraD wrote:Interesting to note that even on Bharat Rakshak (meaning one which defends Bharat, India) we have desi in awe and shock of leaders in US who wish ill on India, have in past sided with Pakistan and made comments against CAA & 370 abrogation! If KH has broken glass ceiling, good for you all who support her but this is not the right platform to beat drums on her behalf, please find pro 'desi for democrats' forums, there are plenty around. On this forum interests of India is at heart, and democratic policies do not inspire confidence in this regard.

I'm sorry but who gave you that authority - can you or BR Admins clarify that anyone supporting Democrats is not allowed to post here? I suggest that you get a better education that teaches you about Diversity and how to accept differences. And I do not agree with your interpretation that Biden-Harris will be anti-India. In our opinion it will be the reverse and time will tell. And going by how quickly PM Modi congratulated Biden, it seems that others feel that way.

Biden while wishing Diwali virtue signals Islamists and here we have desis batting for them on this forum! Please spare us.

My, my! Biden wishes Diwali but that is a signal for islamists? Wah! Care to show me how that statement is coherent.

At the end of the day - BRF welcomes diverse opinion debated per forum rules of conduct. If the forum admins show me where it says that one has to have the majority view only - I will gladly leave. But my current understanding of the rules tells me that what you have posted is against forum rules and the ADMINS need to suspend your account.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby sudarshan » 19 Nov 2020 20:48

Kati wrote:As we ‘watch’ the U.S. election outcome today, Some may also like to see how a seasoned Ghanaian journalist decided to cover U.S. election like the Western media tends to cover ours in India as well as in Africa.


Wow, truly kudos to that writer. All of it is undeniably factual, good journalistic research. Presented with just that right dollop of condescension and passive accusation :). Served piping hot, just the way BBC and other such journos like to serve to the natives. Spicy historical facts added on top as garnish (such as millions of Africans being rounded up as slaves over 400 years) just to remind the reader where all this is coming from.

My guess is somebody got real fed-up of the reporting style WRT Africa. The writing style is so similar to the way of the BBC et. al., that the journo might even have served on their boards in the past. If not - great study of those suggestive journalistic techniques. This current election is going to generate a lot of laughs all over the world.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 19 Nov 2020 21:03

Since 1947, traditional Republicans and Democrats have smiled and said lots of niceties and did platitudes about India, then turned around and have stabbed India in the back, or as in Nixon and Reagan in the gut. They have tried their best to make India fail. Only two times in history has this not been the case. 1961-1963 JFK viewed leaders like JLN as statesman and reached out to help. Another has been in 2017-2020 where Trump has strictly been transactional and limited US involvement in the Indian subcontinent.

Biden-Harris is a return to status quo on policy. The harsh reality is that India is not a $5T GDP due to its own fault, nor is it one of the top 5 trading partners of the US. As such it will continue to have US interference. Trump was one of benign neglect for another 4 years, which was needed, but now we will see interference as in the past.

Biden and Harris have a track record on India. That is all we can go by and stated policy positions. Expect interference when the NDA introduces a bill on UCC in the next couple of years.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby suryag » 19 Nov 2020 21:25

Folks - any further name distortions will earn a ban. Keep it civil dont make it look like rediff comments section

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Suraj » 19 Nov 2020 22:10

I think it's pointless to see any US administration as a binary good or bad one. Every one of them has their shares of positives and negatives. For most part, India has safeguarded her interests even at the very worst of times, while being arm-twisted as part of PL480 food grants in the 1960s - we could have rolled over back then, but did not.

Modern day issues have far less to do with national weakness, as much it has to do with the lack of specific foreign policy capabilities to influence good behavior from other major powers like the US, and correspondingly retaliate against bad behavior. However this isn't anywhere near as bad as it was even a few years ago - this summer we realigned the strategic balance vs China that had been tilted too far their way for far too long.

The same applies with the US. If the new administration behaves well and engages us positively, it gives us space to respond positively. We simply need the right measures in place to retaliate in kind if they do not. There's no scope for feeling good or bad about their behavior. They are not a family member.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 19 Nov 2020 22:44

Suraj,

You are right, but when one candidate (Biden) has funded Pakistan with billions in military aid, and the other (Harris) has conspired with anti India elements, it is hard to overlook this as simple politics.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Vivek K » 19 Nov 2020 22:54

I think that this thread has been derailed from "election results" to "which Administration" is good for India. ADMINS need to consider if a separate thread or the existing India - US thread is appropriate for the latter.

On Biden funding Pakistan - Mort you're looking at the world from a Cold War perspective and not updating to current realities. And post 9/11 both Republicans (more Republican) and Democrats funded Pakistan. George Bush in fact turned a blind eye to Pakistan's egregious actions - for the sake of the US national interest. So billions of dollars poured in to Pakistan from both sides and these were stopped when Pakistan was no longer important to the US national interest.

In the current context, Mort and others like IndraD are using outdated Geopolitics to validate their preferences for US Presidential Elections. Currently, Afghanistan is not the center of the world - but China is. And with its belligerence in all corners (against India, Taiwan and others), China will get the most of US military attention. And India will play an important role as a counter to China.

Again - India needs to look inwards and develop its own MIC and not throw money in buying imported hardware. At the end of the day that is in the Indian National Interest. PM Modi seems to know Indian national interest better as he was among the first to congratulate Biden.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 19 Nov 2020 23:06

Vivek,

This is not Cold War politics. Bush has funded them, but Biden has jumped with Republicans to fund Pak military. Harris had conspired with anti India elements - Plain and simple.

The Democratic Party is beholden to leftist and Islamists.

So what Modi congratulated Biden? He would have congratulated anyone who the media declared winner.

Your view and others have the same view people in India have about the Congress party, being the party which protects minorities and advances their cause. It is outdated.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 19 Nov 2020 23:12

Michigan Wayne county certification is in limbo. The 2 Republicans on the county canvassing board dissented and are facing doxing and threats from the left.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Vivek K » 19 Nov 2020 23:15

Well why didn't the PM wait like Russia and China?

But I don't agree with your views on Harris conspiring with anti-India elements. Biden has jumped with Republicans to fund Pak Military? Come now - that is a considerable spin of the truth.

The truth always lies somewhere in between. A nation does not have permanent friends - only interests.

Bill Clinton won US Presidency on an anti China platform. He talked about not giving the MFN status to China in his campaign and that resonated with the population that elected him in 1992 only to find that he was the most pro-China President that through globalization helped China's rise.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Vivek K » 19 Nov 2020 23:16

Mort Walker wrote:Michigan Wayne county certification is in limbo. The 2 Republicans on the county canvassing board dissented and are facing doxing and threats from the left.

Again - not the facts. The two persons have signed off and certified the election. Later Trump called one of them and now they want to rescind their "already certified signatures". Too late and not a fact.

Added Later: Trump team has dropped MI lawsuits.
Last edited by Vivek K on 19 Nov 2020 23:23, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Suraj » 19 Nov 2020 23:22

Mort Walker wrote:Suraj,

You are right, but when one candidate (Biden) has funded Pakistan with billions in military aid, and the other (Harris) has conspired with anti India elements, it is hard to overlook this as simple politics.

It doesn't matter. What they do is their policy or personal prerogative. The only questions relevant to us is what levers do we have in place with the corresponding political backing to use them in response.

Part of thinking like a great power is stepping away from the emotional feelings about any particular character. Such a power 'expects and prepares for the electoral consequences'. A nation not yet strong enough or aware of its own strength 'worries about the consequences' . There's a significant difference here and we have no business wasting so much time worrying about any particular character - focus must be on what serves as effective means of response.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 19 Nov 2020 23:25

Vivek K wrote:
Mort Walker wrote:Michigan Wayne county certification is in limbo. The 2 Republicans on the county canvassing board dissented and are facing doxing and threats from the left.

Again - not the facts. The two persons have signed off and certified the election. Later Trump called one of them and now they want to rescind their "already certified signatures". Too late and not a fact.

Added Later: Trump team has dropped MI lawsuits.


After being threatened they had no choice but to certify. It was flip flop and there is no mechanism for them to rescind their vote.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby dsreedhar » 19 Nov 2020 23:27

I am in agreement with Mort views.
Yes during Cold War US funded Pakistan which was in alignment of its national interest. The US establishment at that time is more of American interest and America first. Don't know how much of that is true anymore. Now it is more of globalism interest folks entrenched in establishment who are more aligned with Pakistan and China.
China is made focus of US military attention and action in motion (rather than all talk) to change status quo initiated mainly by Trump admin who is an outsider. The trade tariffs and bringing mfg industries back to US is a big blow to China which was enormously benefiting China by the trade with west and bringing in moolah to fund its expansionist programs.
Do not discount the leftists and islamists deep inroads into the establishment and institutions.

Having said that India has to be prepared to work with any Admin.
Lets better focus on election results in this thread.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Vivek K » 19 Nov 2020 23:28

Second that Suraj. Look at Pukistan for example - when US ditched them in the 90s, they came up with their plan to get that attention back. Here we are sitting around beating our chests expecting the worst from the Biden administration and playing up the Republican playbook of obfuscation. Instead, India should engage and make this administration pay India the attention it deserves. And BRF should focus on what GOI can do to keep the Biden administration focused for working India in the region and beyond.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 19 Nov 2020 23:35

Vivek K wrote:Well why didn't the PM wait like Russia and China?

But I don't agree with your views on Harris conspiring with anti-India elements. Biden has jumped with Republicans to fund Pak Military? Come now - that is a considerable spin of the truth.

The truth always lies somewhere in between. A nation does not have permanent friends - only interests.

Bill Clinton won US Presidency on an anti China platform. He talked about not giving the MFN status to China in his campaign and that resonated with the population that elected him in 1992 only to find that he was the most pro-China President that through globalization helped China's rise.


He has no choice as the US is India's largest trading partner. There is too much to lose if you don't hedge your bets.

Biden has conspired with the Republicans since the beginning. In 1972, he was elected as a Democrat when his state went for Nixon. He was instrumental in placing sanctions on ISRO in 1992/93 regarding the cryogenic engines and instrumental in military aid to Pakistan along with other Republicans. Go take a look at his record. He has family interests in China and views his family as political royalty like a Kennedy or Bush. He has policy statements on India's internal affairs are stated on his website. This is fact.

Bringing up Harris as role model is disgusting at the best and insulting to all Indian Hindus at the worst. Biden is not going to survive a full 4 years if elected next month. He will voluntarily step down or removed with the 25th amendment. It brings Harris into the spotlight which deserves full scrutiny.

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Re: 2020 US election results discussion

Postby Vivek K » 19 Nov 2020 23:44

Mort Walker wrote:
Bringing up Harris as role model is disgusting at the best and insulting to all Indian Hindus at the worst.

Not expected from you Mort as you and I know each other beyond BRF. But that is your view and mine is different. I'm sorry to hear you find my views as disgusting. I would never say that to you for having a different opinion.

But that is the dilemma today - do we need to demonize our opponents to win a debate or an lection? I don't think so.

In statistics, if extrapolation is done carelessly, it can give you incorrect answers. I think that is what is happening here - A loose application of facts.

On another note - DJT has made the lives of new immigrants miserable. Immigrating to the US like Mort's family or mine, is far more difficult today. Thanks to DJT's policies. I personally know of young Indian grads that have had to leave the US - these are well qualified MS students that would do well here.

Also - since this thread is already OT - in the current admins time a lot of immigrants have been subjected to racist attacks. The President has made no attempt to either call out these attacks and their supporters or to actually say that he is the President of all Americans. So this election has been fought on racial lines. Hopefully this will change in the future - though there seems to be little hope of that happening.
Last edited by Vivek K on 19 Nov 2020 23:54, edited 3 times in total.


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