Biden Presidency impacts on India

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 09 Nov 2020 04:51

There will be a difference between Biden the candidate and Biden the President. It is much easier to make statements about other countries' internal matters when you aren't in charge of or responsible for anything. When you are put in charge, you have to carefully weigh everything you say when it concerns foreign policy and geopolitics and you need to worry about how your statements might harm American interests in any region. This is why no US president ever came close to declaring Pukistan a terrorist state even when it was clear they were harboring and supporting the Afghan Taliban which was killing US troops in AFG and eventually as it turned out OBL himself.

So finding every statement Biden and Harris ever made about India, CAA, 370 etc. and using that as a barometer for what their actual actions would be regarding India would be a mistake. The same statement coming from a Presidential candidate vs a serving president can have very different consequences on the relations between 2 countries. Biden is an old hand and he knows this very well.

Secondly, statements by themselves mean little. Does anyone actually think Biden or any other US president is going to take any hard steps against India because we refuse to go back on the 370 and CAA decisions? The president would listen to the state department not AoC or Ilhan Omar for advice on what to say and do in response to any development abroad whether in India or anywhere else.

The only thing we will need to watch is how he deals with China. Because there are legitimate US geopolitical interests involved there, not to mention economic ones like farmers in US suffering during Trump's trade war when the CHinese stopped buying their soybeans etc. Trump largely stayed true to his policy despite that. It remains to be seen what Biden does. This also includes his response to further Chinese mischief whether in the SCS or against India. But to be honest, I don't expect much besides statements condemning Chinese actions in public and perhaps intelligence sharing etc. in the background with India. This is what we got from Trump as well. The new agreements like BECA etc. will remain in place to maintain foreign policy continuity.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 09 Nov 2020 05:10

Biden has a long history of being Pak friendly and got some award too. Hila-le-Imtiaz or some such thing.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 09 Nov 2020 06:01

Karan M wrote:Biden has a long history of being Pak friendly and got some award too. Hila-le-Imtiaz or some such thing.

He is a recipient of Hilal-e-Pakistan in 2008. In 2008, Pakistan awarded Biden the second-highest civilian honor, 'Hilal-e-Pakistan.' Joe Biden and Senator Richard Lugar favored a proposal to bring $ 1.5 billion non-military aid to Pakistan. In 2021, Biden will receive Pakistan's highest civilian honor of Nishan-e-Pakistan for the restoration of billions in aid. Dus Percenti and Quid-Pro-Joe have much in common.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 09 Nov 2020 06:02

Karan M wrote:Biden has a long history of being Pak friendly and got some award too. Hila-le-Imtiaz or some such thing.

Hilāl-e-Imtiyāz ("Crescent of Excellence"), is the second highest paki civilian award and honour given to both civilians and military.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 09 Nov 2020 06:43

Karan M wrote:
Amber G. wrote:Wow!
The second most powerful officials in both the US and the UK are women of Indian origin!
(Kamala Harris and Rishi Sunak)
Rishi Sunak is a guy.

Sorry for the typo.. corrected in the original message.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 09 Nov 2020 06:47

Serious implications.Biden has vowed to elevate Muslins at " every level" in his administration,and scrap the Trump ban on Muslims entering the US. The Paki Muslims in the US will find a place in his administrative bandwagon and you can bet your last dollar that the man who denied Modiji a visa will spew his hatred of India,accompanied by that feku " S.India" diva,one K.Harris. We musn't fall for the trap of imagining that because of genes her love for India is ingrained.She will now try to extract as much as she can get from the sadly fawning bunch of our countrymen who greet any famous firang with drops of Indian blood as our long lost relatives to whom the fatted calf must be slaughtered. The Paki will be looking to see how they can ingratiate themselves into the Biden boudoir, as there many inthe US establishment who hate India and favour Pak.

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 09 Nov 2020 08:28

Amber G. wrote:Wow!
The second most powerful officials in both the US and the UK are persons of Indian origin!
(Kamala Harris and Rishi Sunak)

This might be inspirational for Americans of Indian origin in US, but what's there to be proud of for India? Just because she has Indian genes, some people act as though she was born and brought up in India and that somehow helped her to rise to top. She has actively shed her Indian heritage and focused on her Black heritage in her rise, using that as a crutch and playing the race card to go up. There were lots of allegations against her when she was AG in CA and that her rise through the ranks were through not some desirable means.

Its laughable when Indians in India jump up in joy for her, who never cared for India till she was nominated as VP!

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 09 Nov 2020 08:49

In most of the cultures around the world, ethnicity and religious affliation passes from Father to kids and not from mother. Same is the case with most of the Hindus. Hence Kamala Harris is of Jamaican origin and Black race. She herself identifies as the same. So why so much fawning?

Is she going to put Pakistan in FATF black list? Or will she increase pressure on Chinese in South China sea, if and when next sino India skirmishes start? If no then why do we care about her maternal origins.

Let us focus on what she will actually do. Within 6 to 8 months you will be totally clear on where she stands and whether she means any good for India.

For the time being be aware that this is a deep state candidate and her future career progression depends on keeping the Deep state happy. Democracy is secondary to Deep state in present ~~USSA.~~USA

arshyam · Post by **arshyam** » 09 Nov 2020 10:36

Amber G. wrote:Wow!
The second most powerful officials in both the US and the UK are ~~women~~ persons of Indian origin!
(Kamala Harris and Rishi Sunak)

This may be a naive question, but here it goes: so what?

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 09 Nov 2020 11:30

arshyam wrote:
Amber G. wrote:Wow!
The second most powerful officials in both the US and the UK are ~~women~~ persons of Indian origin!
(Kamala Harris and Rishi Sunak)
This may be a naive question, but here it goes: so what?

Couldn't have stated in a better or more concise way.

Dilbu · Post by **Dilbu** » 09 Nov 2020 12:26

The lengths we Indians will go to find a desi connection and congratulate ourselves.
US President-elect’s desi connection: A Biden from Mumbai

MUMBAI: ‘Biden from Mumbai’. That’s how US President-elect Joe Biden often likes to recall the gentleman who had written him a congratulatory letter in 1972, soon after he was elected as one of the youngest US senators at the age of 29.

The envelope of the letter bore the postal stamp of GPO Bombay and in it, Leslie Duncan Biden alias LD Biden, had congratulated him on getting elected to the Senate and had told him they were related.

Leslie was based in Nagpur, but since his letter had flown via Bombay, he would not only be etched in Joe Biden’s memory as ‘Biden from Mumbai’, but also become his go-to ice-breaker story in meetings with Indian-Americans and Indian leaders.

Leslie’s four grandchildren — who are based in Nagpur and working in other cities — are probably the only Bidens left in India and have desisted from making any claims of a link with Joe Biden. TOI got in touch with them, but they didn’t want to be interviewed.

{TOI would have loved to do the interview and splash it on their Sunday edition frontpage. However the grandchildren had the good sense not to be part of the tamasha}

banrjeer · Post by **banrjeer** » 09 Nov 2020 16:14

Indian's should understand what happened before thinking of impact

CNN won the election not Biden.

This campaign had the mother of all virtue signals.... BL(supposedly)M

Where white people scapegoat one of their own(Trump) and whip up a frenzied witch hunt reflex. And Trump? he clumsily keeps shooting himself in the foot.

It's a spectacle for the gullible colored folk that the "healing" has umm... begun. Voting Trump out will wipe out 150 years of slavery and 400 years of genocide of natives.

and why the spectacle?

It's an insecurity. The second constitutional amendment (right to be a arms )...intended not only to aid their split from Europe but also to terraform the continent, clearing the natives and putting meat on the table. The second amendment is coming back to haunt a population thats turning into a minority.

Why not enact reparation for lost land and lost wages of slavery. The rest can be forgiven and forgotten.

Cyrano · Post by **Cyrano** » 09 Nov 2020 17:50

China and Russia have so far not recognised Biden's win. India has.

That the Chinese are getting off on the wrong foot with Biden can only be good for India.

SRajesh · Post by **SRajesh** » 09 Nov 2020 19:01

^^^More probably considering themselves on equal footing a rather 'Tri-partite World' (wishful thinking)
Considering Biden's statements on Russia and China in the past they wont rush to congratulate him.
And there is Trumpva's refusal to accept defeat!!
All ingredients for a Bollywood type 'pot-boiler' in the offing for the year 2021!!

banrjeer · Post by **banrjeer** » 09 Nov 2020 21:59

Cyrano wrote:China and Russia have so far not recognised Biden's win. India has.

That the Chinese are getting off on the wrong foot with Biden can only be good for India.

China can afford to do this.
corporate US is addicted to China profits.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 10 Nov 2020 00:36

x posted from the US election results thread

Groundwork done, Modi govt all set to deal with incoming Biden administration

Groundwork done, Modi govt all set to deal with incoming Biden administration

| Analysis

As far as Prime Minister Narendra Modi is concerned, he runs foreign policy on a personal touch with Indian interests as a top priority. He only gives up on a country or an institution after the latter shows duplicity in bilateral relations.

Nov 08, 2020,
Shishir Gupta
Hindustan Times, New Delhi

Prime minister Narendra Modi greets the then US vice president Joe Biden in Washington DC. Joe Biden has been elected as the 46th President of the United States.

The White House will have a new occupant shortly. What does this mean for India? The Modi government’s connection with President elect Joe Biden goes back to the days when External Affairs S. Jaishankar was Indian Ambassador to US during the Obama administration and present Ambassador to US Taranjit Singh Sandhu was his deputy. The two have kept in touch with close advisors of President elect Biden ensuring that US maintains its bipartisan consensus towards India.

As far as Prime Minister Narendra Modi is concerned, he runs foreign policy on a personal touch with Indian interests as a top priority. He only gives up on a country or an institution after the latter shows duplicity in bilateral relations.

No marks for guessing the countries in that category.

While the Indian foreign policy will indeed have to recalibrate its approach towards the incoming Biden administration, New Delhi knows that president-elect is a collegial guy, who was more approachable to Republican adversaries as a vice president than the president during the Obama years. A quintessential politician who stayed more than half his life in Washington and knows the wrangling at Capitol Hill.

Unlike President Trump who hid his strategy behind a brash style, the incoming President will be more predictable in dealing with the world. He is expected to be tough yet not confrontational with China, will mend fences with Europe and be slightly rough with Russia.

Even though the Chinese experts are gloating over President Trump’s defeat, the US system now firmly believes that Beijing is not only an adversary but also a threat to future. So one should not expect bombastic statements against the Communist Party of China during Biden-era but US policy on China has turned full circle and there should be a build-up on the Asia pivot that was promised but not delivered in the Obama administration. Trump, on his part, may be down but not out and will campaign for the Senate run-offs in Georgia to remain politically relevant in Republican party.

China’s all weather ally Pakistan also heaving a sigh of relief at the exit of President Trump but New Delhi believes that incoming administration will be tough on terrorism, particularly after the recent Islamist attacks in Europe by migrants. The president-elect will continue with past policy of exiting from Afghanistan but that won’t be easy as the US intelligence agencies and Pentagon (Trump dismissed their advice) have been reporting the escalation of Taliban violence with the backing of Haqqani network and Quetta based Shura with direct involvement of Pakistan deep state.

As president-elect is expected to work with expert advice on Afghanistan, then the role of British, who are tied up with Pakistan, may diminish in the near future. Islamabad’s double play in Afghanistan is now known to its former friends like the United Arab Emirates and Saudi Arabia with proof. Pakistan’s problem in fact may multiply with president-elect Biden having a very poor opinion about Islamabad’s newfound ally Turkey.

Iran’s belief that US sanctions may be lifted by incoming Biden administration’s hitching back with Europe on nuclear deal with Tehran may come true as the new administration will move towards multilateralism, which was scorned by the present Trump administration. With the US expected to seek accommodation with Europe on global issues like Climate Change and health due to on-going pandemic, frayed ties with Germany will be on the mend. The US ties with Russia are expected to decline further under the incoming administration.

While New Delhi will wait till January 2021 for formal engagement with the new administration, it appears most confident in dealing with the new occupant of the White House.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 10 Nov 2020 08:21

The danger lies with a Republican senate which will be prone to oppose any Biden administration's advancement of Indo-US relations. They may sabotage him in the name of politics. On the flip side, is that Biden may not try too hard to advance relations and then turn around and blame it on the Republican controlled senate. The FY21 budget will be of most interest as to where the Biden administration's priorities are in the Indian subcontinent.

Rishi_Tri · Post by **Rishi_Tri** » 10 Nov 2020 08:31

US Election results have not been announced officially but assuming Biden and co get to lead US, we should prepare for shadow sanctions, threats perhaps more with respect to F404 / F414 (more so because it impacts future programs), C 17 maintenance and support, Apache maintenance and support because:

The Biden administration is likely to be populated, surrounded by people who virulently hate current Indian Govt, Indian PM and in many cases India. Many of them are of Indian origin and can't bear to stand the current Indian administration and India. They shall go to any lengths to weaken India and at any cost.

The sanctions or other actions such as making spares unavailable or lacklustre maintenance or even sabotage are very much likely. If we term it as 'Rupture', well my conjecture is business considerations or realpolitik notwithstanding the Rupture is closer than we can realize.

If it were to happen so be it. It shall give Kaveri and all other Swadeshi Engine programs much needed push. After all we have been working on indigenous engine for last 25 years and there is much learning that we have acquired that should come good.

As other posters have said, over time plan for Kaveri in Mk 1A and let's Go ahead and redesign the MWF around modified Kaveri. Afterall we have the ISRO success to inspire us.

--- Moved above post from Mk1 / 1A thread.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 10 Nov 2020 08:43

^^^This is a possibility, but Indian diplomats are quite shrewd and know which way the political winds blow. I would give a new administration some time. If there is some pontificating idiot appointed as ambassador will be telling or some regional special envoy like Robin Raphel.

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 10 Nov 2020 09:09

X posted

Even China which would love to see Trump drown in Pacific ocean, is refusing to congratulate Biden for now. So have Russia and many other countries. America has lost all its moral superiority over world. Doesn't matter if Biden is formalised as a "president"at a later stage. This "election" is less about biden "defeating" Trump and more about deep state replacing Democracy that too without any pretense. And what better way to show their power by getting an insipid and borderline senile candidate like Biden elected. Their is no doubt now in the minds of Putin, Xi or even Modi on who controls the lever of Power in America. The unholy combination of Military Industrial complex, Intelligence agencies and corporate world with transnstional interests including Big Tech, have shown the world who is the boss. Presidents like Trump or Biden will come and go. And they better suck up to the powers that be and not upset the applecart if they want to get reelected. Trump is actually lucky in the sense that he just lost the so called " Elections " and didn't end up in a morgue.

If I were in place of Namo, I would request Ajit Doval and other Chiefs to increase the interaction with heads of CIA, NSA and other alphabet soup agencies. Same goes for working level cooperation between the respective agencies. We already have some cooperation between the militaries especially with PACCOM. Even Centcom should be engaged. Plus permanent liason should be maintained with SOCOM/JSOC.

Also Big Tech owned social media should be totally banned. They couldn't be controlled by Trump so what chance an Indian PM like Namo has. Twitter's shutting of Trump's tweets is definitely an indicator of things to come. So is media's deliberate hiding of Hunter Biden's adventures and pollsters fake surveys according to which Biden was sweeping the polls better than even the Charismatic Obama.

The whole episode has only reinforced what many people knew already. I.e America is in the same category as China, Iran or Russia. In fact the latter are atleast better in one respect. They save their electoral process costs. Lol

Dilbu · Post by **Dilbu** » 10 Nov 2020 14:20

Joe Biden eyes Washington veterans for key administration posts

Ron Klain is an early favourite to become Biden's chief of staff, according to multiple people familiar with planning who spoke on condition of anonymity to speak freely about private discussions.

Delaware Sen. Chris Coons, a longtime Biden ally and friend,is seen as a potential choice for secretary of state. Rep. Karen Bass of California, whom Biden considered for vice president is seen as a potential housing and urban development secretary.

Former Surgeon General Vivek Murthy, who was named a co-chair of that panel, is seen as a contender for the top job at the Department of Health and Human Services.

schinnas · Post by **schinnas** » 10 Nov 2020 14:38

Sen. Chris Coins becoming Secretary of State would be great for India. He is a strong advocate of close relations with India.

The MIC is now strongly anti-China and so are all the alphabet soup agencies. Thanks to xi's premature claim for supremacy, US deep state is feeling threatened as once they lose superpower status, supremacy of dollar would be lost and so will the economy.

US needs India now more than ever before. The secretary of state and Sec Defence are key posts to watch. If they are not pro Pak or Pro China, it is the best outcome. Nothing to fear and Indian exports to US will also increase.

https://www.coons.senate.gov/news/press ... artnership

schinnas · Post by **schinnas** » 10 Nov 2020 14:40

One will be free from the evangelical interference in US policy towards India. Folks like Sen. Lindsey Graham (Republican) are notorious India baiters.

I am veering to the view that Joe Biden administration may likely continue the strong partnership with India and may even advance it further.

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 10 Nov 2020 21:14

schinnas wrote:One will be free from the evangelical interference in US policy towards India. Folks like Sen. Lindsey Graham (Republican) are notorious India baiters.

I am veering to the view that Joe Biden administration may likely continue the strong partnership with India and may even advance it further.

So in a sense you are implying that evangelical interference was not there during Obama or Clinton administrations. Is this point supported by data collected during their terms 2008-2016 and nineties respectively? Can somebody from evangelical hotspots like TN, Coastal Andhra or North East shed some light on this.

I am personally of the opinion that wrt India neither evangelical interference stops during Democratic rule nor leftist/woke/degeneracy lobby interference stops during Republican rule.

Manish_P · Post by **Manish_P** » 10 Nov 2020 21:35

schinnas wrote:Sen. Chris Coins becoming Secretary of State would be great for India. He is a strong advocate of close relations with India...

You mean this guy - 14 US Senators demand India be designated CPC

Ten Republican and four democratic senators have reportedly signed a letter to US Secretary of State Mike Pompeo demanding that India be designated ‘Country of Particular Concern’ (CPC), which is the US government’s special term for countries that have questionable standards of religious freedom.

The Senators who have reportedly signed the letter are James Lankford (R-Oklahoma), Chris Coons (D-Delaware), Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa), Marco Rubio (R-Florida), Lindsey Graham (R-South Carolina), Thom Tillis (R-North Carolina), Tim Scott (R-South Carolina), Joni Ernst (R-Iowa), Jacky Rosen (D-Nevada), Kevin Cramer (R-North Dakota), Roger Wicker (R-Mississippi), Steve Daines (R-Montana), Chris Van Hollen (D-Maryland), and Joe Manchin (D-West Virginia).

Dilbu · Post by **Dilbu** » 10 Nov 2020 21:47

Arun K. Singh, former Indian ambassador to the US.
‘US under Biden will turn to India for a more reliable supply chain’

What are the consequences for the world and more specifically for India of this – i.e. of a Washington that is distracted by domestic issues?

Domestic issues will, no doubt, remain a priority. Biden has repeatedly listed response to covid-19, economy, race and climate change as requiring immediate post- inauguration attention. For many of them, however, international cooperation will be required. Covid1-19 is a global pandemic, requiring cooperation for vaccines and protocols for response. US economy cannot revitalize without also addressing predatory Chinese trade practices, and thefts of data, technology and intellectual property. He has said that he will re-join the 2015 Paris accord on climate change, and seek enhanced international commitments on emissions. The Biden campaign had released An Agenda For The Indian American Community on August 15 this year, where it had stated that “Biden will deliver on his long-standing belief that India and the United States are natural partners, and a Biden Administration will place a high priority on continuing to strengthen the U.S.-India relationship. No common global challenge can be solved without India and the United States working as responsible partners. Together, we will continue strengthening India’s defense and capabilities as a counter-terrorism partner, improving health systems and pandemic response, and deepening cooperation in areas such as higher education, space exploration, and humanitarian relief. “

After the 2+2 talks, Secy of State Mike Pompeo had said that the US stands with India on the question of its sovereignty and territorial integrity. Is this an assurance New Delhi can rely on now that a Biden administration will be in office?

In the same Agenda, it was also stated that “Biden believes there can be no tolerance for terrorism in South Asia – cross-border or otherwise. A Biden Administration will also work with India to support a rules-based and stable Indo-Pacific region in which no country, including China, is able to threaten its neighbors with impunity." Biden has been supportive of India over the years: in 2001, as Chair of Senate Foreign Relations Committee, he had written to President George W Bush, calling for removal of sanctions against India; in 2008, as Ranking Member of same committee, he had helped pilot US- India civil nuclear cooperation agreement through the Senate; as Vice President, he was part of the Administration that declared India a Major Defense Partner, and expressed support for India’s permanent membership of UN Security Council.

Do you see a Biden administration nuancing/tinkering/changing current policies towards Russia, Pakistan, China, Afghanistan and the Indo-Pacific? And by how much?

The Trump Administration started with pressure on Pakistan, cutting off assistance, but has now relied on it for the Taliban talks. Biden’s response would depend on extent of Pakistan’s cooperation, and assessment of actions against terrorist groups, particularly those that target the West and US. As Vice President, Biden had argued for US withdrawal from Afghanistan, seeing the negative impact on US society, and assessing an eventual need for internal Afghan political reconciliation. He would likely seek to sustain the present effort if it moves in a positive direction. There is now a broad consensus in the wider US establishment that the earlier policy of engagement with China, in the expectation of political and economic liberalization, has failed, particularly under President Xi. China will be approached as a rival, but US will seek to coordinate more with its allies in Europe in fashioning an overall response, and some of the sharpness in the Trump Administration characterization of China could go away.

Post 2016, Democrats have been particularly antagonistic towards Russia, based on their perception of Russian interference through social media to help Trump’s election against Hillary Clinton. Biden would be expected to be guided by this, and also opposition to Russia’s take- over of Crimea and involvement in Eastern Ukraine. However, he will be less constrained than Trump should he wish to move positively, especially on arms control issues. US leaders understand that India has its own national security interests in the Russia relationship.

Cyrano · Post by **Cyrano** » 11 Nov 2020 00:16

Arre bhai, whoever threw some coins into the begging bowl would get a tin coated "$$lal-e-Pakistan" medal, with some incense smoke in the eyes and a peacock broom tap on the head. But now even those medals etc. are not affordable. Whats the big deal?

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 11 Nov 2020 03:07

Cyrano wrote:Arre bhai, whoever threw some coins into the begging bowl would get a tin coated "$$lal-e-Pakistan" medal, with some incense smoke in the eyes and a peacock broom tap on the head. But now even those medals etc. are not affordable. Whats the big deal?

Nice way of rationalizing it.

It’s all relative. Coins to some, but $400 million in military aid to TSP, which is at a minimum starting this FY, is problematic considering their total defense budget is around $11 billion.

arshyam · Post by **arshyam** » 11 Nov 2020 08:27

Cyrano wrote:Arre bhai, whoever threw some coins into the begging bowl would get a tin coated "$$lal-e-Pakistan" medal, with some incense smoke in the eyes and a peacock broom tap on the head. But now even those medals etc. are not affordable. Whats the big deal?

The big deal is the person who actually chose to throw the coins, no? I am surprised you have to ask such a basic question

(but not that surprising looking at your breathless posts on the US elections thread, I suppose)

venkat_r · Post by **venkat_r** » 11 Nov 2020 14:07

My initial thoughts were that it is going to be ok for India, but after reading this full thread have few different thoughts

Trump was good and had good personal relationship with Modi, but he did extract the pound of flesh with the military deals. It definitely is not going to be the same.

Democrats and Biden are going to take the military deals where they get, but would look for other intangible gains like democracy and human rights etc, it all would depend on how the things would be spun. It is going to be interesting to see how the relationship and engagement goes with India. India has very shrewd people on its side, but the political or democratic winds are blowing in opposite direction for now, and not likely to change in the near future. So have to fall back on the mutual interests and institutional framework and see where some common interests would emerge.

Biden’s approach would be fairly close to Obama’s, with some changes or nuances and Biden, who probably has vast experience in foreign relations, is expected to have strong opinions and would be interesting to see how they reveal themselves.

Kamala would have a minor role, and more would depend on NSA, Secretary of State and other appointments. Knowing what we know, Modi govt would farm Kamala’s heritage as much as possible, which would be nice - but to be fair, she grew up like an African American, and seems to mostly identifies so - may be it is better that way.

As with any new administration, Pak would try to see if they can get any mileage, they have been left on the wayside last few years. They might get a shot or two, but might not get much. Anti-terror might get more wind in this term with the EU attacks, let’s see.

Wrong time for India for US to go soft on China and hard on Russia, which opens up a new set of challenges to deal with.

venkat_r · Post by **venkat_r** » 11 Nov 2020 14:21

Their thoughts more about Indian Americans, and some about India
https://youtu.be/V_DdgijvTCE

Cyrano · Post by **Cyrano** » 11 Nov 2020 14:54

Folks seem to be just taking a position based an opindia article which rightly says Biden was awarded that medal by Pak in 2008, for his support for 1.5B$ non-military aid for Pakistan bill. But it was not his doing alone. Biden and Lugar (a Republican) had introduced a bipartisan bill for US aid plan in July 2008, which had called for $1.5 billion per year in non-military spending to support economic development in Pakistan.

Its interesting to note that in Nov 2007, source: U.S. reviews financial aid to Pakistan

Sen. Joe Biden of Delaware, a Democratic presidential candidate and chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, described the situation in Pakistan as “a real mess” and agreed that U.S. aid should be under review.“I’m not sure how much good that military aid we’re giving him to fight the extremists is doing us anyway,” Biden said on CBS News’ “Face the Nation.”

“From the brief briefing I got last night (from White House officials), I don’t know that they have any notion of what they’re going to do right now,” he said. “There’s still this faint hope that this martial law will last only a day or two, but I think we’re kidding ourselves.”

Republican presidential candidate Fred Thompson, a former senator from Tennessee, said on NBC’s “Meet the Press” that it was too soon to pull U.S. aid from Musharraf’s government, but said “we’ve got to play hardball with him.”

But in 2008, something convinced Biden to reverse that view, at least partially, and he got equal support from Republicans to table a bipartisan bill.

US Aid data is publicly available: https://explorer.usaid.gov/cd/PAK

Under Obama it shot up to an all time high of 2.7B$ in 2010, but fell as sharply the following years to reach 813M$ in 2013 and continued to fall, also under Trump, but rose from 423M$ in 2018 to 684M$ in 2019 under Trump.

US aid to Pak doesn't seem to be driven by some special love of this Rep. or that Dem. politician, but rather by Pak's utility for America's policy goals of the moment on one hand, and Pak's ability to do blackmail like a beggar wearing an explosive vest on the other. India and pro-India folks must continue to lobby against future aid to Pak since we know some part of it will be used against us.

You may be a Trump fan or Biden hater, thats your prerogative. But concluding that since Biden got a Paki medal for supporting an aid bill in 2008, he is necessarily harmful for India's interests in 2020 doesn't hold much water.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 11 Nov 2020 16:29

Spot on and in many its not what Pakistan does, but the American ( rather the need arises in Britain) to contain India, Watching various BBC which is owned by the Indian Government over the years it seems the fountainhead of Hindu phobic and Indian Hatred which is pass on to Media Orgs like Time, NYT, CNN, MSNBC etc. Reality does not bother- just pure anti India hatred.

nam · Post by **nam** » 11 Nov 2020 17:01

From our perspective, it is a very simple equation regarding Pak.

We let Biden known, you pay them as much you want for any deal, your problem. We will not be talking to Pak and any attack on India or Indians, by Pak groups to "highlight" any donkey issue, anywhere, will result in a kinetic response.

As simple as that. US is free to do what they want with Pak.

darshan · Post by **darshan** » 11 Nov 2020 17:56

Think of Trump as honey pot and not Republican. Republican, Democrat, and Trump/chaos. Trump stole CPU cycles from many outfits.

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 11 Nov 2020 18:22

darshan wrote:Think of Trump as honey pot and not Republican. Republican, Democrat, and Trump/chaos. Trump stole CPU cycles from many outfits.

Exactly. I have seen many so called political analysts conflate Trump with establishment Republicans. Some analysts these are. They couldn't be more wrong. More than democrats, he is possibly hated by these Republicans. I thought atleast BRFites should be wiser but then I am probably being too wishful.

He might not be the next president elect. But from a totally objective point of view he should be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize based on the following achievements.

1. He is the first US president in more than 40 years who has not started a new war.

2. He was instrumental in normalisation of ties between Israel on one hand and arab countries like UAE, Bahrain and Sudan on the other. The significance of this event cannot be overstated.

Barack Obama was far more cruel. Destabilized countries like Libya and Syria for dubious geopolitical goals plus arming and training various islamist groups like ISIS in middle east. Only Bhagwan knows how many he murdered.

darshan · Post by **darshan** » 11 Nov 2020 18:33

To add to my previous post, Modi isn't getting younger and new establishment in US will steal CPU cycles from Modi and co. One can all argue and go through the mental gymnastics like writing PhD dissertation but the reality doesn't change that the outcome of US elections isn't the most optimum case. Yes, I know that Modi or Trump or anyone can be gone in a second and institutions run things etc.

Cyrano · Post by **Cyrano** » 11 Nov 2020 18:51

darshan wrote:Think of Trump as honey pot and not Republican. Republican, Democrat, and Trump/chaos. Trump stole CPU cycles from many outfits.

At last the disowning of Trump by Republicans has begun. Good development though 4 years too late. It will take a lot of time to wash the Trump stains off Republican hands.

darshan · Post by **darshan** » 11 Nov 2020 18:55

Rohingya refugees living in ‘temporary shelters of tarpaulin’ in Bangladesh write congratulatory letter to Joe Biden, say Allah answered their wishes
https://www.opindia.com/2020/11/rohingy ... joe-biden/

george · Post by **george** » 11 Nov 2020 19:45

Cyrano wrote:Folks seem to be just taking a position based an opindia article which rightly says Biden was awarded that medal by Pak in 2008, for his support for 1.5B$ non-military aid for Pakistan bill. But it was not his doing alone. Biden and Lugar (a Republican) had introduced a bipartisan bill for US aid plan in July 2008, which had called for $1.5 billion per year in non-military spending to support economic development in Pakistan.

Its interesting to note that in Nov 2007, source: U.S. reviews financial aid to Pakistan
Sen. Joe Biden of Delaware, a Democratic presidential candidate and chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, described the situation in Pakistan as “a real mess” and agreed that U.S. aid should be under review.“I’m not sure how much good that military aid we’re giving him to fight the extremists is doing us anyway,” Biden said on CBS News’ “Face the Nation.”

“From the brief briefing I got last night (from White House officials), I don’t know that they have any notion of what they’re going to do right now,” he said. “There’s still this faint hope that this martial law will last only a day or two, but I think we’re kidding ourselves.”

Republican presidential candidate Fred Thompson, a former senator from Tennessee, said on NBC’s “Meet the Press” that it was too soon to pull U.S. aid from Musharraf’s government, but said “we’ve got to play hardball with him.”
But in 2008, something convinced Biden to reverse that view, at least partially, and he got equal support from Republicans to table a bipartisan bill.

US Aid data is publicly available: https://explorer.usaid.gov/cd/PAK

Under Obama it shot up to an all time high of 2.7B$ in 2010, but fell as sharply the following years to reach 813M$ in 2013 and continued to fall, also under Trump, but rose from 423M$ in 2018 to 684M$ in 2019 under Trump.

US aid to Pak doesn't seem to be driven by some special love of this Rep. or that Dem. politician, but rather by Pak's utility for America's policy goals of the moment on one hand, and Pak's ability to do blackmail like a beggar wearing an explosive vest on the other. India and pro-India folks must continue to lobby against future aid to Pak since we know some part of it will be used against us.

You may be a Trump fan or Biden hater, thats your prerogative. But concluding that since Biden got a Paki medal for supporting an aid bill in 2008, he is necessarily harmful for India's interests in 2020 doesn't hold much water.

Do you take everyone who has a differing opinion to yours as braindead fools?

That last bit about Trump Fan and Biden hater. So far your objectivity points to complete neutrality, I must say!