2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

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m_saini
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by m_saini »

There definitely is a need to free temples. If Modi were to say tomorrow that bring all the churches under gov control but we'll make a Christian welfare fund which gets money from top 100 churches, you think christians won't start a riot?

Why is that hindus can't get their full rights and are deemed unworthy, dirty and too corrupt to govern their own temples? Which religion has a 100% corruption free certificate? This is ridiculous.

What if the British had said we can't give india independence cause Indians are too corrupt?
chetak
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by chetak »

sanjayc wrote:There is no need to free temples. Just make a National Hindu Welfare Fund where money from all the top 100 temples across India is deposited every year. This Foundation will run welfare programs (temple maintenance, opening schools, orphanages and hospitals for Hindus). Currently the money from these temples goes to meet the general budget expenditure of the government, which is the main issue, or, worse, spend on churches and mosques. Hindus get nothing in the current system. Why is not Modi doing this?

Also, what is the problem in extending all the privileges given to minorities in the Constitution to Hindus too? Nobody will object to that.
Temples most certainly need to be freed.

It is not all about the money.

Culture and civilizational ethos also need to take root and grow to make us a great nation again.

Either control the religious institutions of all religions, if one has the b@!!$ or free all of them. Education of the majority needs to be under the control of the majority and majority run schools should be as free as any other.

The majority simply cannot be hobbled in this insidious and devious way by a deliberate agenda imposed by the divide and rule policy set by departing colonialists seven decades ago
vijayk
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by vijayk »

Swati Goel Sharma @swati_gs

A senior govt official tells me that Khajoori Khas in northeast Delhi has become a hub for criminals to keep kidnapped minor girls in confinement. Girls are brought from as far as Bengal. Northeast Delhi witnessed riots last year.
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by Ambar »

I think the difference between money making Church enterprises and swamys owning and running education, real estate businesses is that the church does not work actively to undermine Christianity. When a church makes money in India, the pastors & bishops pay themselves fat salaries and buy chauffeured Mercedes SUVs but rest of the money goes back into the conversion racket and expansion of their faith, whereas when it comes to sat sangs, ashrams, muttas, many of the gurus and their cronies become billionaires, the only outflow of the money is to buy elections and wet the beaks of bureaucrats, that's the difference. Jesus may well be a side business but one cannot imagine a church ever saying their denomination is not a part of Christianity, where as we have gurus who take out agitations demanding they should be treated as a separate faith and not clubbed with Hindus.
m_saini
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by m_saini »

^^ Very true and one of the reasons why I always advocate for a centralized Hindu body that controls everything and not individual temple boards governing in their own shells.

Anyone stepping out of christianity would face the onslaught of the enormous PR machine of the church, their billions and their political clout.
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by Kaivalya »

chetak wrote:
V_Raman wrote:How different is this from the Church money funding colleges? Why is this even an issue? The point is for the money from people to temple going back to people and not the govt. Are we saying church is somehow above corruption and hindu temple mgmt are not? bogus arguments - we are shooting ourselves in the foot...
They are saying that both are problematic which is the truth

no one wants a clone of the CSI or CNI setup or even the wakf setup.

we need a safe, democratic and fairly autonomous setup minus sly gurus and preening politicos playing the caste card to capture the temple administration and through that enhance and grow their financial muscle to reach their ultimate goal of CM/PM.
Zero corruption is ideal but not the goal and definitely not a realistic requirement. If my housing association (run by volunteers) can have audited books with returns submitted every year, I am sure a temple can evolve to get there.

Tier 1 temples (lots of land stolen by benami accounts, lots of contributions stolen every day, lots of vigrahams stolen etc ) have different problems than a Tier 3 temple. Currently this generalization is what is having us trip on ourselves. If money is the biggest problem - let's free temples that have audited records as the first step. We have to stop flogging ourselves on every fake Sadhu we find...This is designing policy management based on the exceptions. Every tier that is freed is incrementally better and we can use the lessons learned appropriately
Najunamar
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by Najunamar »

I would prefer the temple priests and the folks cleaning, making garlands, archanai baskets getting paid a fair share which will happen in a privately administered temple. We should not go about this self-goals - sadhguru asked a simple question, why is it that GoI should think only Hindus are corrupt also, there are numerous temples outside India that are very well administered.
shravanp
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by shravanp »

V_Raman wrote:I would rather vote for taking over church/mosque. that will stop all foreign funding and all money based conversion activities will come down to a trickle.
One can imagine the meltdown. Why dream of something that will never happen. The only way it can happen is to link naxalite activity to Church, and bring in laws to oversee
KJo
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by KJo »

Najunamar wrote:I would prefer the temple priests and the folks cleaning, making garlands, archanai baskets getting paid a fair share which will happen in a privately administered temple. We should not go about this self-goals - sadhguru asked a simple question, why is it that GoI should think only Hindus are corrupt also, there are numerous temples outside India that are very well administered.
I think this is not an impossible task. Instead if a useless "Minister of minority affairs" for virtue signaling, the Minister of Culture should add this to their responsibility. Temples in the US seem to be managed very well, they are all clean and have to submit all accounts. There should be a way to do this for large temples. Start small, test the idea and iterate until the result is good enough. I don't know why Modi sarkar is sleeping over this.
darshan
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by darshan »

I don't believe that there's any disagreement that the temples need to be freed. Especially when Hindus were back stabbed and didn't get a Hindu nation and new laws based on Hindu civilization.

The whole debate is about how to go about it to not repeat the 1947 where Hindus were freed to be enslaved by anti Hindus.

The question isn't about if Hindus are corrupt or not as that's nobody's business other than Hindus.

The main point is whether Hindus are ready or not. It won't come without any bloodshed and battling with many govt institutions that feed on these funds.

Presently Hindus aren't even having a weekly debates on how to get it done. Every town needs to start having debates on how to get this done.
arshyam
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by arshyam »

Public pressure to do something on temple control will take a while. While most of us here are talking about financial and cultural impacts, most average people are more concerned about just visiting temples to offer prayers, or attending the next festival in their hometown. And the latter is where the battle is - in small town temples, officiating at the big festival is a matter of prestige and various groups/castes vie with each other to get it. This is in fact a huge source of attachment for people to their temples and must be respected. For these groups, govt running the temple is still preferred as it gives the unsuccessful groups a better shot at getting influence than in a private run set up. The fear of a dominant caste taking over administration and keeping other groups away is very real. This is the reality, at least in the south. And no, I am not talking about brahmins, nor am I talking about temple entry, per se. In the north (and I could use some guidance/corrections here), many temples are still privately run and so badly run that govt control is actually welcomed. I recall reading this sentiment on BRF itself a few years ago.

This may sound theoretical to many of us here, but equally, what we discuss about temple control sounds theoretical to the masses. Yes, people like Sadhguru making public declarations helps widen the overton window, but the narrative still favours the govt controlling temples. Also the fact that no Hindu group has been able to offer a workable model (please don't bring in US temples where the dynamics are very different) that works for the benefit of everybody does not help the cause. So there is still some work to be done on this front, starting with understanding the dynamics of interaction between the temple and its patrons.

As for blaming Modi, is temple administration under the state or concurrent list? Surely not in the central list. But this may give a clue on the "why Modi is not doing anything" question.
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by darshan »

There's already lot of defiance and frustration due to loss of economic opportunities but for people with resources there's plenty of time to waste instead of doing real work.
How about High Court justices going around with local police and raiding all social gatherings of well to do people?

They should also issue such fatwas on other everyday problems: land jihad, love jihad, xyz jihad, islamic fatwas, malaria, air pollution, water pollution, liquor, drugs, pending cases in courts, corruption in courts, freeing temples, human trafficking, encroachment, etc.

Why can't court officials and police drive around together and solve issues on the spot? Ever heard of digital era?
https://www.deshgujarat.com/2021/04/06/ ... id-spread/
....
A two-judge bench headed by Chief Justice Vikram Nath suggested Advocate General Kamal Trivedi that lockdown or curfew for three-four days may check the situation at the moment.

‘You may please convey our message to the decision makers that urgent serious steps need to be taken to check this otherwise it’s going to go out of hand and then it would be you know situation where again a lockdown will have to be, it’s almost reaching there. May be three four day of curfew or lockdown may check the situation at the moment. Then you an again open it. Two days or three days curfew will help I think. Like initially in March 2020 there was a curfew for three days, two days, over the weekend,’ the Chief Justice told the Advocate General.
....
darshan
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by darshan »

Shri Justice Nuthalapati Venkata Ramana appointed as Chief Justice of India
https://www.deshgujarat.com/2021/04/06/ ... -of-india/
The President of India, in exercise of the powers conferred by clause (2) of Article 124 of the Constitution of India, appointed Shri Justice Nuthalapati Venkata Ramana, Judge of the Supreme Court, to be the Chief Justice of India. A notification in this regard has been issued by the Department of Justice, Ministry of Law & Justice today. The Warrant of Appointment and a copy of the Notification of Appointment have been handed over to Shri Justice N. V. Ramana.

Justice Nuthalapati Venkata Ramana, will take over as the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court of India on 24th April, 2021. He will be 48th Chief Justice of India.

He is first-generation lawyer, having agricultural background, and hails from Ponnavaram Village, Krishna District in Andhra Pradesh. He is an avid reader and literature enthusiast. He is passionate about Carnatic music.
....
darshan
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by darshan »

Excellent. Here comes the bureaucracy to the rescue. The same one that couldn't figure out how to keep economy going with the masks on. Masks would have stayed on with equal and honest enforcement with the economic activity going. You can't look other way where people with connections and money are going around without masks and having big events while asking poor to keep one on to save the onea with money. Not going to happen. Especially when trying to survive on day to day wages.

GoI should be figuring out how to bring disproportionate minority controlled assets to help poor majority that can't earn during this times.
Core Committee meeting takes 7 important decisions on Covid19 pandemic situation
https://www.deshgujarat.com/2021/04/05/ ... -situaton/
...
– Oxygen producers in the state will require to ensure 60 per cent of total supply to health sector.

– 8 IAS-IFS officials are to be assigned responsibility of supervision-coordination to start 500-500 bed covid care centres in 8 cities of the state.

– Collectors, municipal commissioners given authority to declare any private hospital as designated Covid19 hospital.

– Private nursing home-clinics will be able to start dedicated covid health centre and dedicated covid care centre without ICU or ventilator facilities.

– Daily Rs. 2,000 charge per day in case of Covid health centre maximum and Rs. 1500 charge in case of Covid care centre maximum can be collected from patients. These charges exclude the price of Remdesivir injections.

– Remdesivir injection will be made available on no profit – no loss basis at Civil hospital Sola, SVP hospital Ahmedabad, Gujarat Cancer Society , Nagri Eye hospital and LG hospital in next three to five days.

– Triple layer masks will be available for Re. 1 at Amul parlors and APMCs of the State in upcoming days.
Cyrano
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by Cyrano »

Sadhguru has thrown his weight behind the free temples from Govt call. He carries enormous influence and is close to Modi.

vijayk
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by vijayk »

Image

Image
Aham Brahmasmi!!! @Sanity_3
Abhimanyu Vs Adil

Appam Vs Aslam

That's how you win a civilizational war. Brick by brick.
CBSC Class 1 EVS book Chp 3
siddhu
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by siddhu »

vijayk wrote:Image

Image
Aham Brahmasmi!!! @Sanity_3
Abhimanyu Vs Adil

Appam Vs Aslam

That's how you win a civilizational war. Brick by brick.
CBSC Class 1 EVS book Chp 3
EVS starts from class 4. Also I didnt find this text book on ncert website.
vijayk
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by vijayk »



Is this the thread for this?
naruto
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by naruto »

siddhu wrote:
vijayk wrote:
CBSC Class 1 EVS book Chp 3
EVS starts from class 4. Also I didnt find this text book on ncert website.
NCERT textbook for EVS starts from class 3.
For class 1&2, though schools teach EVS, there is no standard textbook.
darshan
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by darshan »

Anti Hindu institutes and another example of the great 1947 robbery.
‘Can’t make fun of customs of a community’: Mumbai court orders probe against actor Payal Rohatgi for Tweet against anti-Hindu riot accused Safoora Zargar
https://www.opindia.com/2021/04/mumbai- ... ra-zargar/
...
It has ordered Mumbai police to find if there is sufficient material to proceed against actor Payal Rohatgi in a complaint filed by a city-based advocate, Ali Kaashif Khan Deshmukh, against her for her alleged communal tweets.

Metropolitan Magistrate Bhagawat T. Zirape, while ordering the probe, opined that prima facie the tweets show disregard for Muslim women and the community. The court said in his order that every community has the right to profess its religion and that no individual has the right to make fun of the customs or rites of another community.
....
vera_k
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by vera_k »

^ Not 1947. In this case, the First Amendment that was passed in 1951 enables this type of judicial action under the constitution.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Amendment_of_the_Constitution_of_India

When RaGa complains about curbs on media, it would be worth asking if INC will support repealing the first amendment in Parliament. Suspect they will not as it will remove curbs on all sorts of critical opinion.
arshyam
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by arshyam »

^^ Not to mention that that amendment was championed and piloted through Parliament by that paragon of democracy Nehru.
manjgu
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by manjgu »

been reading India china war ( neville maxwell) ... lot of startling facts. and lack of strategic culture/thinking among indias elite.
arshyam
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by arshyam »

Yes, that's true, but Neville Maxwell paints a picture India was entirely to blame and China had no choice but to go to war. As a China-apologist, that's what one can expect from him, but that picture is quite far from the truth - Brig JP Dalvi clearly describes the preparations done by the PLA in the run up to the war, as well as the timing that coincided with the Cuban missile crisis. So yes, while Maxwell's assertion may have an element of truth, the spin he weaves is quite far from it.

OT here, will stop.
manjgu
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by manjgu »

sure... but many aspects of neville book are true... i also downloaded henderson brooks report... just to give u an example.. in 1960 Army ordered extra troops as a result of a war game called 'SHEEL'.. but nothing came out of it. the fact is both sides were preparing but we were just talking. reading HB report does indeed prove neville true on many counts.. anyway. the one thing i learnt from nevilles book is top leadership should talk less especially on national security matters. but we indians are prone to making bombastic statements... lot of learn from chini. few years ago i met GOC of some division in tenga ( AP). he said during border talks with chinese we talk 80% and they 20%.. old habits die hard.
chetak
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by chetak »

here is the paki and ameriki deep state game plan that is fast unravelling

note particularly, the "pandemic response co-operation"


via@Cold_Peace_
"Pakistan’s army chief has launched talks with nemesis India to secure an eventual meeting between the neighboring countries’ PMs...next steps include reopening border trade, pandemic response co-operation and India’s participation in an anti-terror drill to be held in Pakistan."
given niazi khan and bajwa's credibility, there is absolutely no reason for India to play ball.
chetak
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by chetak »

if presstitutes file stories while working from home, and also try to protect the journo belonging to their own cabal and ecosystem.

truly, this is also why it's called "journalism of courage"


Image

Varun Hiremath is absconding since a young woman accused him of rape in February. A Delhi court has issued a non-bailable arrest warrant for ET NOW anchor Varun Hiremath, 28, who is accused of raping a 22-year woman. Hiremath is absconding since the complaint against him was filed on February 23.
AshishA
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by AshishA »

chetak wrote:here is the paki and ameriki deep state game plan that is fast unravelling

note particularly, the "pandemic response co-operation"


via@Cold_Peace_
"Pakistan’s army chief has launched talks with nemesis India to secure an eventual meeting between the neighboring countries’ PMs...next steps include reopening border trade, pandemic response co-operation and India’s participation in an anti-terror drill to be held in Pakistan."
given niazi khan and bajwa's credibility, there is absolutely no reason for India to play ball.
Let our bureaucracy drag their feet on this one. Let them hope. And then crush that hope.
Kashi
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by Kashi »

manjgu wrote: but we indians are prone to making bombastic statements... lot of learn from chini.
I don't know if you are familiar with Japanese, Taiwanese or Korean media, but hardly a day goes by without a uber bombastic statement from Sheena, guess a lot of bombast either goes unnoticed or is willfully ignored in translation.
vijayk
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by vijayk »

https://swarajyamag.com/insta/harvard-s ... 9-pandemic
A study by Harvard University and shared by the Uttar Pradesh government says that the Yogi Adityanath government handled the migrant crisis 'most adroitly' when unforeseen challenges caused during the time of coronavirus pandemic took a significant toll on people globally.

An official spokesman said a study conducted by Harvard University highlighted the humanitarian crisis of migrant labourers that unfolded and focused on how efficiently the state government handled the migrant crisis.

The spokesman said the Yogi government worked towards the multi-fold agenda of providing transportation facilities, delivering ration kits, and running healthcare centres for migrants.
We need him as next PM
vijayk
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by vijayk »

Suraj strikes again this time beating the crap out of Sekhar Gupta

https://twitter.com/surajbrf/status/1379677203600793605
Suraj @surajbrf
The vaccination prioritization is set out in the official documentation posted on ICMR’s and MoHFW’s sites:
https://vaccine.icmr.org.in/covid-19-vaccination
https://mohfw.gov.in/pdf/Covid19Communi ... gy2020.pdf
Page 64 explicitly lists the priority groups.

It was published back in 2020.
Shekhar Gupta @ShekharGupta

PM Modi wrongly blames the ‘babus’. Problem is the Bharat Sarkar mindset. It believes it always knows what’s best for the citizen who must be a dumbo. That’s why it knows who NEEDS the “scarce” vaccine, and who WANTS it for vanity. Governments love rationing.
https://twitter.com/TheJaggi/status/1379680585187266562. gives thumbs up

https://twitter.com/NAN_DINI_/status/13 ... 7616925697

https://twitter.com/vinod_sharma/status ... 7463276551
Excellent take-down of Coupta and others of his ilk in media on Covid vaccination.
Last edited by vijayk on 07 Apr 2021 21:32, edited 1 time in total.
SRajesh
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by SRajesh »

manjgu wrote: ( AP). he said during border talks with chinese we talk 80% and they 20%.. old habits die hard.
Manjgusir
the number of post on the forum corroborates that fact Na :D
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by bharathp »

not sure where this news should go - please move to appropriate thread:
https://news.yahoo.com/taiwan-says-indi ... 16135.html
Taiwan worked with other democracies to help its diplomatic ally Paraguay get COVID-19 vaccines after China put pressure on the South American country to ditch Taipei in exchange for shots, and India stepped in to help, Taiwan's foreign minister said.
In Paraguay, the Chinese government was "very active" in saying to the public that if Paraguay severed diplomatic ties with Taiwan they would get millions of doses of China's vaccines, which put pressure on Taiwan to help, Wu added.

"In the last few weeks, we have been speaking to like-minded countries, including Japan, the United States, India etcetera, and India fortunately has been able to provide some COVAXIN vaccines to Paraguay," he said, referring to a shot developed by India's Bharat Biotech and a state research institute.

India has already shipped 100,000 doses to Paraguay and there will be another 100,000, Wu added.
and the best part:
The United States, India, Japan and Australia are working to counter China with a billion-dose vaccine pact.
chetak
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by chetak »

does this sound workable


Image
Lisa
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by Lisa »

^More to the point, why is India the ONLY country that needs to administer Hindu temples? What is so peculiar about Hindus in India ALONE that necessitates this course of action?
KL Dubey
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by KL Dubey »

Amit Shah has clearly said that temples should be in the hands of believers and not managed by non-believers. There will action on temples down the line.

The pandemic and the chinese drama has delayed most of the big-ticket legislations for more than a year.
chetak
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by chetak »

Lisa wrote:^More to the point, why is India the ONLY country that needs to administer Hindu temples? What is so peculiar about Hindus in India ALONE that necessitates this course of action?
the politico godman nexus, be it Hinhu, muslim or xtian or sikh etc, is why.

there is an incestuous relationship between the two that has long existed. the britshits showed us how to divide and rule, play favorites and sideline opponents.

The muslim rulers beheaded the opposition while the britshits belittled and diminished them

the manipulations and the unwanted influences exercised by these religious heads and the politicos make the exercise of power sometimes a bloodletting but always a competitive sport.

we have the most insidious thing that not many other countries have, the BIF and their conversion armies
m_saini
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by m_saini »

chetak wrote:does this sound workable
Centralized body is argued precisely because Hindu temples are so diverse. When the Sabarimala situation arose, there was hardly any support from other temples in north, east or west india. A centralized body would change that.

A lot of day-to-day activities and responsibilities can definitely be left upto individual hindu sects but a centralized body is required to shape and mould the general direction. Just like Delhi manages defense, foreign affairs etc but individual states are free to shape other policies as they see fit.
chetak
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by chetak »

m_saini wrote:
chetak wrote:does this sound workable
Centralized body is argued precisely because Hindu temples are so diverse. When the Sabarimala situation arose, there was hardly any support from other temples in north, east or west india. A centralized body would change that.

A lot of day-to-day activities and responsibilities can definitely be left upto individual hindu sects but a centralized body is required to shape and mould the general direction. Just like Delhi manages defense, foreign affairs etc but individual states are free to shape other policies as they see fit.
then politicians and religious heads who will eventually gain control will forcefully come in to "redistribute" the offerings and that is the start of a very slippery slope.

some temples are famous and attract large numbers of local devotees along with enviable contributions. A central management body will hardly serve the purpose.

we used to have localized control in the days gone by but society has changed and power, not service or devotion is what attracts a lot of people.

surplus funds will have to be banked or invested and in all such cases, unscrupulous middlemen will spring up with offers of commissions.

we see this even in housing societies.

damned if you do and damned if you don't
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Re: 2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Post by vijayk »

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