Second Agni-III test -1

Amitabh
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Postby Amitabh » 12 Apr 2007 17:00

sivab wrote:Arun_S: Why this 16m thingy in PIB release? Typically PIB doesn't lie though may not tell the truth. Your high res. pics gives your dimensions? Or you have independent confirmations on dia? Is AIIIT2 cfg diff from AIIIT1?

http://pib.nic.in/release/release.asp?relid=26817

What's the problem? Arun's page says 16m.

Rishirishi
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Postby Rishirishi » 12 Apr 2007 17:02

Is having ICMB am advantage or liability to India?

suddenly India will have the capability to hit Europe, Japan and Australia (but not US with only 12 000 km range).

The question is if we could make our selves to become a needless threat? No matter how good the current relations are, the EU/Russia/Japan alliance will have to make contingency planning, in case a threat arises. This could lead to denial of technologies and adverse treatment. All that is not a problem, but what does India gain from all of this.

As long as we can hit Middle east to China I do not see any need for further capability.

shyamd
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Postby shyamd » 12 Apr 2007 17:11

Apologies. Deleted.
Last edited by shyamd on 12 Apr 2007 18:45, edited 1 time in total.

Shankar
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Postby Shankar » 12 Apr 2007 17:19

Rishirshi

-the world of realpolitik does not work that way
First to have any serious credibility in the international arena you have to have the military muscle to enforce that view or protect yourself if your views are diffrent .

That particular level of military muscle need be nuclear type since the big boys who are in the bullying game all have plenty and only cautious about not being on the recieving end of the same weapon type

The newly aquired strategic missile capability does not make us a regional bully n the contrary it stops the global bullies from pushing us too far whether in arunachal or in kashmir or in indian ocean .

Simply put in a confrontation we may suffer more but there is a chance the adversary will suffer too in same horrible way .This makes the confrontation unlikely

Now we can safely go and sign the iran -pakistan-india gas pipeline deal
no sweat

Or sell a dozen brahmos to brazil and chille

or make preemptive surgical strike in POK even if unkil and dragon says not to do it

Does not mean we will go and it -but can if our natinal interest dictate it

EU and india is not likely to in a military -political confrontation not in any foreseeable future
Russia is a friend

China and US ar the problem countries for diffrent reasons but conflict with US is a greater possibility according to me than china

The reason is simple
russia and china did not went after iraq when they tried to build nuclear weapons
russia and china did not threaten north korea with military options when they tested a small nuke

russia and china or eu did not send a carrier task force to bay of bengal
to threaten our tiny naval detachment

- US did and may do it again but may be this time with some degree of caution or may just delay the decision altogether like they did in north korea

Even the strongest nation on earth is afraid of a hundred thousand body bagsx in a day -thier democracy cannot take it

There lies the true deterance value of AGNI 3

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Postby uddu » 12 Apr 2007 17:19

Rishirishi wrote:Is having ICMB am advantage or liability to India?

suddenly India will have the capability to hit Europe, Japan and Australia (but not US with only 12 000 km range).

The question is if we could make our selves to become a needless threat? No matter how good the current relations are, the EU/Russia/Japan alliance will have to make contingency planning, in case a threat arises. This could lead to denial of technologies and adverse treatment. All that is not a problem, but what does India gain from all of this.

As long as we can hit Middle east to China I do not see any need for further capability.


Need Enlightment? How can you forget the the so called technology/resource denial has taken place many times, since the teeth to bite was absent. One cannot just forget how Uranium was denied for India and was openly sold to China. One nation can mock another if they know that they are well beyond the striking capability of other and it is not as necessary to be friendly to them. See how oil flows to China. Do the so called peace mentality helped us in any manner. No need to specifically aim at any particular nation, but the capability must exist. Before the arrival of Agni-III, one must have noticed the willingness to sell Uranium to India. Now it will come without any conditions and with all kinds of friendly gestures.

Atleast we need a missile to fire towards Beijing from the southern part of the nation. That's the next step. Am I right :twisted:

Surya....

:twisted:

Gerard
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Postby Gerard » 12 Apr 2007 17:19

shyamd wrote:Has anybody seen the video of the launch? Just saw it on NDTV. But the picture looked really different to the pictures given by Arun_S. The nose cone was far wider than the picture provided by Arun_S.
I have the video if anyone would like to see it.


Can you upload the video somewhere?

Do you know how to do screen captures? Can you post a cap?

shyamd
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Postby shyamd » 12 Apr 2007 17:21

Gerardji, I can't really upload it. It's easier if I just email it to you. The quality is not good. But enough to notice the differences.

Added Later: I will try and upload a pic onto imageshack
Last edited by shyamd on 12 Apr 2007 17:24, edited 1 time in total.

Nayak
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Postby Nayak » 12 Apr 2007 17:22

Rishirishi wrote:Is having ICMB am advantage or liability to India?

suddenly India will have the capability to hit Europe, Japan and Australia (but not US with only 12 000 km range).

The question is if we could make our selves to become a needless threat? No matter how good the current relations are, the EU/Russia/Japan alliance will have to make contingency planning, in case a threat arises. This could lead to denial of technologies and adverse treatment. All that is not a problem, but what does India gain from all of this.

As long as we can hit Middle east to China I do not see any need for further capability.


In the long run ??,, In the long run we are all dead.

Rishi-san, the Euro trash will stop lecturing us unwashed ICMB degree holders on human rights/kashmir/etc etc.......

We have the ability to chew the pan (nuke), now to build the energy (Agni III) to spit on the shifty euros/jappos/and other assorted sand n***as / camel jockeys.

Gerard
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Postby Gerard » 12 Apr 2007 17:24

How large is the video clip?

shyamd
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Postby shyamd » 12 Apr 2007 17:27

231kb

shyamd
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Postby shyamd » 12 Apr 2007 17:29

EDITED
Last edited by shyamd on 12 Apr 2007 17:35, edited 3 times in total.

vsudhir
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Postby vsudhir » 12 Apr 2007 17:30

deleted.

Tks shyamd.
Last edited by vsudhir on 12 Apr 2007 17:41, edited 1 time in total.

Gerard
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Postby Gerard » 12 Apr 2007 17:33

Rishirishi wrote: This could lead to denial of technologies and adverse treatment.


Actually the opposite. The US and company only respect power.

They've been denying technology for decades. Attempting to hobble the advance of Indian rocketry.

ISRO has been sanctioned with ludicrous claims that the PSLV can be converted into a ballistic missile.

Well, India has an ICBM now. Their sanctions are demonstratively useless.
Time for them to rethink their approach.

shyamd
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Postby shyamd » 12 Apr 2007 17:37

VSudhir, Check mail.

SaiK
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Postby SaiK » 12 Apr 2007 17:42

Gerard wrote:
Rishirishi wrote: This could lead to denial of technologies and adverse treatment.


Actually the opposite. The US and company only respect power.

They've been denying technology for decades. Attempting to hobble the advance of Indian rocketry.

ISRO has been sanctioned with ludicrous claims that the PSLV can be converted into a ballistic missile.

Well, India has an ICBM now. Their sanctions are demonstratively useless.
Time for them to rethink their approach.


well... Does India got a la Minuteman? sanctions remains till then. Realistically speaking, international politics is just street fights in India. Catch the shirt till the other over powers. :) .. or run for safety.

Countering a Denial regime is what makes nations like India. I think, those sanctions are a must for us to advance, else we would be (like Arjun and LCA - broadly speaking (i understand those techs are different)).

We need to have A3 launched from submarine or from marine vehicles.. and then we are speaking correct for saying, we have gotten to hold unkil shirt back.

:twisted:

ps: agni remains "long-ranged (not IC)" till then. :wink:
Last edited by SaiK on 12 Apr 2007 17:46, edited 1 time in total.

shyamd
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Postby shyamd » 12 Apr 2007 17:43

Apologies.
Last edited by shyamd on 12 Apr 2007 18:45, edited 2 times in total.

shyamd
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Postby shyamd » 12 Apr 2007 17:47

Need to keep up missile momentum
Even more compelling than the failure of the Agni-III test is the need to keep the momentum of the programme going. India should avoid the kind of drift that overtook the Agni programme in 1990s when two of three tests were full or partial failures; yet after the 1994 test, the programme hibernated for the next five years. As it is, India's missile deployment programme limps behind Pakistan’s, which has had the convenience of acquiring its missiles off-the-shelf from China and North Korea and carrying out many more tests.

Indian defence officials are quick to give so many embellishments to success that it is difficult to separate fact from fiction. For one thing, many tests are needed before the missile can be declared fully developed for induction into an arsenal. The US and Russia typically carry out 20 or so tests before declaring a missile fully developed. The DRDO claims it has done so in the case of Agni-I and II, after three or four tests. Crucially, neither have been tested over land or on land targets. This is importantant because of the need to understand how the geomagnetics of landmass affect the guidance systems.

In contrast, the Ghauri — a derivative of the tested North Korean No-Dong — has been tested by Pakistan seven times already. Then there is the issue of accuracy. DRDO has claimed incredible accuracies for its missiles, but these are predicted accuracies, not tested ones as ought to be the case when a Circular Error Probable of a missile is worked out. Some claims don’t match up because Indian missiles use strap-down inertial guidance systems which are more prone to error than the mechanically gimbaled devices.

Agni III will be an important step forward for India’s missile programme because it is an entirely new vehicle designed for the purpose of carrying a nuclear deterrent rather than as a byproduct of other programmes. Agni-I and II were made by mixing and matching rocket stages from other programmes, notably India's first space launch vehicle SLV-3 and the Prithvi. As in the case of Agni-I and II, ISRO has probably played a key role in designing the two stages of the Agni III, both powered by solid propellent motors.

There has never been any doubt about the capability of Indian scientists in designing longer-range missiles. The issue is the speed with which DRDO is able to provide the other aspects— primarily guidance systems, re-entry vehicles that house the nuclear weapons, so on. The Agni is routinely displayed in Republic Day parades but on floats rather than all-terrain military vehicles, which would indicate they had been successfully inducted for use rather than mere display.

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Postby Tilak » 12 Apr 2007 17:48

chandel_alok wrote:hey.. somebody forgetting my poppins...:)... btw.. as nobody was giving us the dear A-3 during the agonizing wait for launch, I cooked some up based on Arun's line drawings... but looks like warhead for A3 needs some major mods...

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image


You made my day !! :eek: keep'em coming .. dont forget to slap that Tricolour..


Greetings to everybody involved !!!


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shyamd
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Postby shyamd » 12 Apr 2007 18:01

Indeed it is an Agni I old video. I missed the beginning of the video. Silly me.
Last edited by shyamd on 12 Apr 2007 18:43, edited 1 time in total.

Gerard
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Postby Gerard » 12 Apr 2007 18:04

shyamd wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysK2KwRf1-g

There you go folks.

Apologies for the poor quality.

Your welcome VSudhir


That is archive footage of an Agni-1 test.

Mihir
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Postby Mihir » 12 Apr 2007 18:08

http://acorn.nationalinterest.in/2007/0 ... by-commas/

Even Reuters—which is a past master in the art of the use of inverted commas—did not use it this time. Both The Hindu and the Indian Express carry the same PTI report on their websites. But only the Indian Express saw it fit to enclose the claims of success within the scepticism of its own inverted commas. Perhaps that was necessary to get over the frustration of having to can tomorrow’s editorial dissing DRDO. :D

kmc_chacko
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Postby kmc_chacko » 12 Apr 2007 18:37

What is next ?
AGNI IV
AGNI V
SURYA

or something else ?

Victor
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Postby Victor » 12 Apr 2007 18:44

CONGRATS & HATS OFF TO DRDO! :mrgreen: 8) :)

Assuming that timing is in the alphabet of diplomacy, this may be an answer to the chip transfer arrests in US and an indication of where the 123 talks are going.

John Snow
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Postby John Snow » 12 Apr 2007 18:53

COngrats to DRDO and all the engineers scientists who toil for next to nothing pay.

Notice how Chincoms are articulating the same thing spinster had said about ICBM,

"An India ICBM will foster true understanding between the largest and the greatest democracy , in addition it will usher peace and brotherly love between the oldest civilizations acsross both sides of the great Himalayas'

:D


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