Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Singha
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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby Singha » 14 May 2010 09:55

I agree, not much useful...and having more of unburned fuel might be better as a incendiary effect.

Klub concept is really cool.

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby ramana » 15 May 2010 11:10

The Nirbhay is supposed to accelerate in the terminal phase. Looks like Singhaji is on their same wave length. Check India Forum thread.

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby SanjibGhosh » 16 May 2010 10:06


Varoon Shekhar
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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby Varoon Shekhar » 17 May 2010 07:36

IIRC, there was a successful test of Agni 2 in between the two failed launches. It was low key, and reported by AFP ( French news agency). Any corroboration? Anyway, hoping for a smooth Agni 2 launch tomorrow.

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby marimuthu » 17 May 2010 09:19

A-2 test fired

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby SanjibGhosh » 17 May 2010 09:29

TOI news flash

Nuclear-capable Agni-II missile test-fired successfully from Wheelers Island off Orissa coast

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby dipak » 17 May 2010 09:46

India successfully test-fires Agni II missile

India [ Images ] on Monday successfully test-fired its nuclear-capable Agni-II missile intermediate range ballistic missile, with a range of 2000 kms, from the Wheelers Island off Orissa coast.

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby Tamang » 17 May 2010 10:08

dipak wrote:India successfully test-fires Agni II missile

India [ Images ] on Monday successfully test-fired its nuclear-capable Agni-II missile intermediate range ballistic missile, with a range of 2000 kms, from the Wheelers Island off Orissa coast.


From the article:

However, the range can be extended if the payload is reduced.

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby Gagan » 17 May 2010 11:48

Considering how hot it is these days, rightly the scientists decided to do the field job early in the morning, and then retire to the AC rooms to do the analysis.

:D

Great going DRDO and Strategic forces !

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby sathyaC » 17 May 2010 11:53

Airborne BrahMos Launcher Prototype
http://idrw.org/?p=1684

BY: AviationWeek.com
India’s BrahMos Aerospace Thiruvananthapuram Ltd (BATL) is ready with the first prototype of an indigenous airborne launcher developed for the BrahMos supersonic cruise missile.

The air-launched version of the missile will be fitted to the Su-30 MKI aircraft.

BATL Executive Director N.R. Vishnu Kartha tells AVIATION WEEK, “This is the first time a mobile launcher for [the] BrahMos missile is being manufactured. We are ready with the first prototype.”

The basic design of the launcher was conceived by BrahMos engineers from Hyderabad and accepted by the Sukhoi Design Bureau. The main body of the launcher is made from high-strength aluminum. All the materials, processes and tests involved in making the launcher need to undergo stringent quality checks by the Director General of Aeronautical Quality Assurance at various stages.

The launcher must undergo one more final test before it is fitted onto the Su-30 MKI for flight trials. BATL has an initial order of 6.4 crore ($1.4 million) to deliver a total of five such launchers. “The launcher’s final test will be done at Hyderabad, which is the missile integration center. The launcher is a testimony to BATL’s technical know-how in delivering such complex equipment,” Vishnu Kartha says.

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby chackojoseph » 17 May 2010 14:29


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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby chackojoseph » 17 May 2010 14:38

Agni2 pic 1

Agni-2 pic 2

Captions are yet to come :)

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby Gagan » 17 May 2010 15:17

A brown colored missile!!

Looks like the strategic forces command is borrowing the paint from Railways coach factory Kapurthala.

AoA! :D

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby rohiths » 17 May 2010 16:41

Question for learned mullahs.
Why is Agni 2 TFTA (Length 20m and diameter 1m) and Agni 3 SDRE(Length 17m and diameter 2m).
Are there any specific advantages and disadvantages?

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby nrshah » 17 May 2010 17:28

Question for learned mullahs.
Why is Agni 2 TFTA (Length 20m and diameter 1m) and Agni 3 SDRE(Length 17m and diameter 2m).
Are there any specific advantages and disadvantages?


It is for better logistic foot print and MIRV... for other technicals, gurus can help

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby Sridhar » 17 May 2010 20:00

SDRE is better than TFTA (hasn't that been the case in other contexts too!!). But Agni-TD and subsequently Agni-2 evolved from the original SLV-3 design, which was TFTA. Hence, the reasons for the Agni-2s design was historical rather than some specific advantage to the design. The Agni could get designed, tested and deployed quicker and with more certainty using existing technology. But with need for greater ranges, more survivability and deployment on nuclear subs, the SDRE Agni-3 became necessary.

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby dinesha » 17 May 2010 20:01

India to fire over 5000 km range Agni V in 2011
http://www.bombaynews.net/story/636139
After the successful launch of the Agni II missile, India is all set to test fire its first Inter-Continental Ballistic Missile, Agni-V, in Mach-April 2011.

Agni V is being designed by adding a third composite stage to the two-stage 3,500-km Agni-III, having a range of over 5000 km to carry multiple warheads and will have countermeasures against anti-ballistic missile systems.

It is a three-stage solid fuelled missile with composite motor casing in the third stage. Two stages of this missile will be made of composite material. The Agni V will be the first canisterised, road-mobile missile in India.

Buoyed by the success of the Agni II missile, Dr W Selvamurthy, DRDO's Chief Controller Research and Development, said: "We are now working on Agni V, which has a range capacity of more than 5,000 kilometres. It is a strategic missile being developed by the Defence Research and Development Organisation."

"It will be ready by next year. We hope during March-April next year. It will be an Inter Continental Ballistic Missile."

......
Last edited by dinesha on 17 May 2010 20:34, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby Singha » 17 May 2010 20:05

although it appears bizarre to be announcing strategic missile launches more than a year in advance, I think its to reduce the window of time in which Unkil can indulge in back door diplomacy to try and hamper such efforts. it alerts the opposition parties and media to keep their knives sharp to beat the Govt should selective leaks be made later about Unkil putting pressure, so that the GOI can turn around and say "look we want to be your obedient munna, but this unruly democracy is at fault"

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby chackojoseph » 17 May 2010 20:40

The news is updated now.

I am going to post a picture which reads A-2 with serial no 13 :mrgreen:

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby chackojoseph » 17 May 2010 20:45


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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby chackojoseph » 17 May 2010 20:50


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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby pralay » 17 May 2010 20:55

did they qualify some special or crucial technology with the agni II test today? cos the agniV test came just after it. or is it just a coincidence ?

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby shyamd » 18 May 2010 02:03

Agni-II missile test-fired successfully

Y. Mallikarjun

— Photo courtesy: DRDO

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:Agni-II missile blasts off from Wheeler Island off Orissa coast on Monday.

HYDERABAD: After two successive setbacks, Agni-II surface-to-surface ballistic was successfully flight-tested from the Wheeler Island off the Orissa coast on Monday.

The intermediate range missile can carry nuclear weapons and has a range of more than 2000 km.

It was fired from a rail mobile launcher by personnel of the Strategic Forces Command at 9.18 a.m., as part of user training exercise.

After a flight of about 660 seconds, the missile splashed down near the pre-designated target in the Bay of Bengal and met all the mission objectives, Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) officials said.

The missile's re-entry vehicle, made of carbon-carbon composites, withstood very high temperatures of up to 3,000 degree Celsius as it descended with a speed of 3.5 km/second after reaching a height of 230 km. It was tested for the full range.

Two down range naval ships tracked the missile reaching the target, while a network of radars, telemetry and electro-optical tracking systems along Orissa's coast, monitored its path and evaluated all parameters in real time. An advanced navigation system enabled Agni-II to reach the target very accurately. The missile has manoeuvring capability to deceive any anti-ballistic weapon system. :twisted:

The missile was test-fired for the third time in last one year by the Strategic Forces Command. During the previous missions, the missile failed to meet the mission objectives after both the launches witnessed problems during the course of the flight. Monday's launch was preceded by successful test-firing of Agni-III (3,500 km range) in February and Agni-I (700 km) in March this year.

The two-stage solid-propelled Agni-II is one of the key weapon systems of the country's nuclear deterrence doctrine and had been inducted into the armed forces. It is 21 metres tall and capable of carrying a payload of one tonne.

Scientific Adviser to Defence Minister and Director-General of DRDO V.K. Saraswat reviewed the total operations and witnessed the launch along with senior DRDO officials and top brass from the Strategic Forces Command. Agni's programme director and director, Advanced Systems Laboratory, Avinash Chander monitored the overall pre-launch operations.

Defence Minister A. K. Antony congratulated all the DRDO scientists and armed forces personnel for the success of the mission.

Awesome. Plenty of info for you engineers to bang your heads. Love the bit about deceiving any system!

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby Asit P » 18 May 2010 04:27

The missile has manoeuvring capability to deceive any anti-ballistic weapon system


This is what I liked the most :) .

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby andy B » 18 May 2010 04:50

rohiths wrote:Question for learned mullahs.
Why is Agni 2 TFTA (Length 20m and diameter 1m) and Agni 3 SDRE(Length 17m and diameter 2m).
Are there any specific advantages and disadvantages?




Me no guru but a simple phata chaddi mujahid so take it FWIW:

The phat diameter is most definitely needed for MIRV arrangement, please look at Arun Vishwakarma's articles and papers on the Indian missiles.

Also the fat diameter IMO means that it will have larger diameter engines which means greater lifting power onlee.

Also given that the AIII is the genesis behind the AIII SLBM it is but natural that they went wider and shorter and the AV is a further evolution of the AIII.

Also canistered missiles in the class of Agni V would benefit a lot more from the short and wide design than the long and thin design as it means its mucho more easily transportable on mobile launches look at the TOPOL M etc....

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby sum » 18 May 2010 08:55

Agni-II missile successfully test-fired

The fifth test launch of the prestigious missile was conducted from Wheelers Island at night.

That was for the first time in the history of the country’s missile development programme that an attempt to test-fire a missile after sunset was made. The DRDO has not yet announced when it will have another post-sunset missile test.

However, with the test-firing of the Agni II on Monday, the DRDO has managed to successfully conduct test launching of three important missiles of the Agni series within a span of just three months, which is being hailed as a milestone in the Defence Research and Development Organisation history.

The agency had already successful test-fired Agni I and Agni III earlier this year.

Hope that the night launch is tried again soon as it was a failure the last time..

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby Singha » 18 May 2010 09:23

they should do tests in worst possible weather now like howling monsoon winds and rainstorm in the dead of night. or in 45C blazing heat and dust in the rann of kutch. those are real operational tests. before that the train has to be driven around for a week to let the vibrations, temp cycles and dust have their bite at the problem.

I hope in chandipur also, DRDO is hands off and only provides telemetry tracking and range safety.

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby ramana » 18 May 2010 10:47

usually testing is done in fair weather to provide baseline performance. Adverse conditions are designed in and don need to be proofed.
Time of 660 secs flight is quite impressive.

Have they given the time of flight after re-entry to splashdown?

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby sum » 18 May 2010 10:59

In the Hindu report, author (TSS?) says that range is more than 2000 kms and then states that missile was tested for "full range".

So, what was the range tested finally?

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby Austin » 18 May 2010 11:25

Singha wrote:they should do tests in worst possible weather now like howling monsoon winds and rainstorm in the dead of night. or in 45C blazing heat and dust in the rann of kutch. those are real operational tests. before that the train has to be driven around for a week to let the vibrations, temp cycles and dust have their bite at the problem.

I hope in chandipur also, DRDO is hands off and only provides telemetry tracking and range safety.


Trials are always fair weather even if done by end user , I do not know of any country testing their system in adverse weather condition.

Although it would be a great PR if Agni could be fired in adverse weather condition like lightening , thunder storm and roaring Agni rips through Cat 5 cyclone
Last edited by Austin on 18 May 2010 11:55, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby chackojoseph » 18 May 2010 11:51

sum wrote:In the Hindu report, author (TSS?) says that range is more than 2000 kms and then states that missile was tested for "full range".

So, what was the range tested finally?


The confidence range. The missile ranges are marked as the makers confidence levels based on how mature the systems are. Definitely you cannot have an excess of more than 10-20% range unless their has been a drastic difference in technology in terms of accuracy. Reduced weight of the warhead is not the only parameter for increase in range.

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby shukla » 18 May 2010 14:47

IAF to receive BrahMos Missiles by 2012

The IAF will soon have its own exclusive battery of ground-launched BrahMos Supersonic Missiles to take out enemy targets. This will allow the IAF to initiate action against enemy installations like Air Force bases or anti-aircraft systems that assume a higher priority on its operational doctrine without depending on the Army's missiles to do the job for it.

The Ministry of Defence has already cleared this and has allowed the IAF to place an order for the missiles with the BrahMos Corporation. With this the BrahMos' order books look bright for the coming years as the IAF and Army are planning to purchase missiles worth Rs 11,700 crore between them. While the Army plans to raise two more regiments, IAF's idea is to have an exclusive squadron.

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby shukla » 18 May 2010 20:01

MBDA's future plans for India.. (from http://www.spsaviation.net)

Interview with Loïc Piedevache, Country Head (India Operations), MBDA Group

MBDA is a multinational company. What is the collective view of the nations involved (in MBDA) with regard to transfer of the latest and sensitive technologies to India? Are there any conflicts of interest?

Loïc: There are no conflicts of interest. MBDA’s identity is represented by advanced technology and not nationality. Transfer of technology (ToT) is a key feature that MBDA offers. Our customers do not wait for a product enhancement to be commonly available. If the customer makes specific demand for a product, we make it available for them after discussions with them about the specific enhancements in line with national specific requirements.


SP’s: The Milan anti-tank missile has been in service with the Indian Army for a long time now. It is understood that a fresh contract was signed at the end of 2008 for an upgraded version? Please elaborate?

Loïc: Milan is a real success story between MBDA and Indian public sector undertaking Bharat Dynamics Limited (BDL) which started 30 years ago. Licenses for several versions of Milan missiles have been successfully implemented in India. The last version delivered to India is the Milan 2T which has a deadly tandem warhead and enhanced operational capabilities.

SP’s: It has been reported that MBDA and the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) are jointly developing a new generation of low-level, quick-reaction air defence missile Maitri for the Indian Navy and the Air Force. It is understood that it has been offered to the Indian Army as well. Can you comment on the project?

Loïc: MDBA is considering India as a strategic long-term partner and is keen to shift from a usual buyer-seller approach to a deeper relation through a strong co-development programme involving key transfer of technologies. Developing short range surface-to-air missile (SRSAM) is in sync with this strategic step. The 3 Forces will be potential customers for SR SAM as there is a specific operational configuration to match their requirements.

SP’s: Will you also offer core technologies like the design of the active seeker head and the missile engine apart from the other subsystems?

Loïc: Sensitive technologies will be transferred in the frame of SRSAM, but at this stage, we cannot disclose more information.

SP’s: What about the missiles systems for the Indian Air Force (IAF) and missile upgradation for Jaguar and Mirage 2000? Is MBDA contemplating on participating in the mid-life upgradation programmes of these combat aircraft of the IAF?

Loïc: Regarding the Mirage upgradation, MBDA has been requested to make an offer for the air-to-air weapon. We have proposed the MICA, the multi-mission air-to-air missile system which has outstanding maneuverability, high resistance to countermeasures, two interoperable advanced technology seekers and can be used in multi-target from long BVR interception to close-in dog fight.Regarding the Jaguar, MBDA is currently responding to a request for proposal (RFP) for a close combat missile. We are offering Asraam Combat Missile for Jaguars, which has already successfully been fitted on Jaguars in other air forces and successfully tested in “over-wing” configuration.

SP’s: Is MBDA a part of the 126 medium multi-role combat aircraft (MMRCA) for the IAF?

Loïc: MBDA is providing missiles in weapon packages of the 3 European OEMs including Dassault Aviation (Rafale), EADS (Eurofighter) and Saab (Gripen).

SP’s: Can you please tell us something about MBDA’s multi-purpose combat vehicle project and its other variants? Will it be offered to India?

Loïc: The multi-purpose combat vehicle is a versatile and deadly accurate air transportable vehicle equipped with a motorised turret, with electro optical sensors. It has a small caliber gun and four ready-to-fire missiles that can be operated from an interior firing console. It will be offered to India if there is a requirement.

SP’s: Are you working on any other joint venture with BDL?

Loïc: MBDA does not have any JV with BDL. We are providing production licenses to BDL.

SP’s: Has MBDA established any joint venture or partnership with any Indian company in the private sector or do you propose to do so to meet the possible offset requirements?

Loïc: MBDA is looking for a strong, reliable, strategic, long-term and fruitful partnership with India. In this regard, we are having advanced discussions with a major private Indian group. This partnership will be a structured and comprehensive one and will meet all the procurement requirements. We are looking for a partner having complementary technologies and skills, a strategy consistent with MBDA’s global strategy, in order to become / behave as a source or an equal partner, able to export from its home base, share MBDA views on collaboration with SME’s, DPSU’s, and be recognised by the Indian authorities as a strategic industrial asset for the country.

SP’s: What are your long-term plans for India? How do you see the potential?

Loïc: Besides BDL, we have also been working with Mazagon Docks Limited (MDL) and Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL). We welcome the developments with regard to foreign direct investment (FDI) in India, which is at present 26 per cent. Emergence of private sectors would be fruitful to complement the public sector. MBDA wants to be a major local player in India. MBDA is seeing India as the fifth pillar of its structure after the four domestic countries (UK, France, Italy, and Germany).

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby Singha » 18 May 2010 20:54

IAF will probably be onlee AF in world to have its own regiments of dedicated conventional GLCMs. :eek:

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby sum » 18 May 2010 21:31

MDBA is considering India as a strategic long-term partner and is keen to shift from a usual buyer-seller approach to a deeper relation through a strong co-development programme involving key transfer of technologies. Developing short range surface-to-air missile (SRSAM) is in sync with this strategic step


Edited: Ravi_B has given a link of SRSAM ( Maitri) being canned. So, i was confused between MRSAM and SRSAM. Does the MBDA interview mean that Maitri is still on?
Last edited by sum on 18 May 2010 21:49, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby ravi_B » 18 May 2010 21:42

Maitri QRSAM is cancelled per below link. dont know??

http://indiadefenceonline.com/984/india ... th-france/

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby Rahul M » 19 May 2010 04:57

why nukavarapu ? a rad-homing seeker would be good to have but not necessary. even without it, all it requires is someone to pinpoint the position of the SAM nodes, we do have resources to do that.

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby andy B » 19 May 2010 06:36

^^^
ze targeting imho would be an elint and signit task...ARC :twisted:

also dont forget that the rambhas have lately been flying with yehudi podded sar radars ityadi...add to that I think it would also be backed by recon sats and also photographic evidence from the remote sensing sats ityadi...which will further be enhanced when GAGAN goes live...so look alive next few years lots of different sources of info to get targeting information...its quite obvious these babies will serve in the high mountains of the east...not to mention given that the most capable sams in puki inventory are spada 2000 as of now these batteries will obliterate them as and when needed...will get a tad bit difficult when faced with s300 and above but then that can be overwhelmed with sheer numbers....intersting....

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby andy B » 19 May 2010 06:46

question to learned maulanas ityadi...

in a Manoeuvring RV when it is re-entering the atmosphere if it has little thrusters like the one that AGNI does they hold fuel in the RV itself...this fuel is then done to jinx up and down and change courses to spoof ABMs ityadi...my questions is given that the fuel of these thrusters is part of the overall mass of the RV how is the change in COG managed...as the RV uses fuel there will be less and less weight and depending on the positioning of the tank it would i would imagine change the COG equation....I suppose given that the basic principle is like of that used in an arrow with a heavy head and light tail one thing that could be done is to keep that fuel in the middle or near the head as even though it would make it lighter with the fuel being spent it would still remain relatively heavy to not change the COG drastically. I suppose with a change in COG it would change the re-entry angle which may cause more drag/friction that may prover dangerous for the RV shield...head hurts so gonna stop...comments?

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Re: Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Postby ravi_B » 19 May 2010 08:47

andy_b, you missed thiers HQ9. this is copy of S300. this is long range SAM TSP hold. I think, they hold some batteries of it. though there is no official confirmation.


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