Armoured Vehicles: News & Discussion

Austin
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23387
Joined: 23 Jul 2000 11:31

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Austin » 15 Aug 2015 12:05

UAE BMP-3 destroyed in Yemen ( Picture and Video )

http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1430929.html

member_24684
BRFite
Posts: 197
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby member_24684 » 15 Aug 2015 12:42

Austin wrote:UAE BMP-3 destroyed in Yemen ( Picture and Video )

http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1430929.html


I'm seeing bunch of Mines .. dropped all over the passage route

From where they get those mines ..!! Possible Iranian supply line to ambush the UAE contingent

Austin
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23387
Joined: 23 Jul 2000 11:31

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Austin » 17 Aug 2015 15:22

http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1434420.html

This time it Saudi M2 Bradley , looks guerrilla warfare at play

https://youtu.be/h87a41N-IhU

Austin
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23387
Joined: 23 Jul 2000 11:31

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Austin » 25 Aug 2015 13:42

Saudis M1A2SA against Yemen Huthis using Fagot ATGM , The first Tank suffered secondary explosion and second one atleast one manage to walk away ( Video )

https://youtu.be/a2GR-g9777k

Couple of other Saudi losses in pictures http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1443443.html

This M1 got captured by Huthis http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1446920.html
Last edited by Austin on 26 Aug 2015 09:57, edited 1 time in total.

rkhanna
BRFite
Posts: 1165
Joined: 02 Jul 2006 02:35

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby rkhanna » 25 Aug 2015 13:57

^^^ The Arabs are having a hard time in Yemen. Apparently they have lost a bunch of SPA and 4 Apaches as well.

Austin
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23387
Joined: 23 Jul 2000 11:31

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Austin » 25 Aug 2015 15:42

^^ One Apache lost , the video is there in 2nd link , Janes report

http://www.janes.com/article/53773/saud ... eni-border

Rahul M
Forum Moderator
Posts: 17047
Joined: 17 Aug 2005 21:09
Location: Skies over BRFATA
Contact:

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Rahul M » 25 Aug 2015 18:33

SPA as in SP arty ?

rkhanna
BRFite
Posts: 1165
Joined: 02 Jul 2006 02:35

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby rkhanna » 27 Aug 2015 09:27

SPA as in SP arty ?


yes

Also as per one of the ME forums I visit that Janes video is the video of a 4th Apache.

Saudi Armour destroyed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvy7VcN3tkI

They seem to have a lost a military base as well.

Ofcourse most of the videos/news out there is coming out of Iran.

shaun
BRFite
Posts: 1177
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby shaun » 20 Sep 2015 20:36

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

member_22539
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2022
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby member_22539 » 21 Sep 2015 05:46

^Looks badass :D. From where and on what occasion?

salaam
BRFite
Posts: 313
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby salaam » 21 Sep 2015 05:53

It's Tata Kestrel. For replacing Bmp-1/2.

member_22539
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2022
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby member_22539 » 21 Sep 2015 06:14

I know man, just asking what the specific occasion was and where the pictures were taken. These pics are new (as far as I know).

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66601
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Singha » 21 Sep 2015 06:33

the saudis are proving their incompetence in full flow. sending armour vehicles into isolated outposts to cow down people with the "made in america" stamp....without the infantry, artillery and helicopters and drones that protect the american armour in such overwatch situations.

houthis are having a field day creeping in and using RPG and ATGMs at close range.

we are seeing the "true" vulnerabilities of the shiny western kit without the overwhelming superiority in all aspects that makes them look so good in american hands.

rohitvats
BR Mainsite Crew
Posts: 7734
Joined: 08 Sep 2005 18:24
Location: Jatland

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby rohitvats » 21 Sep 2015 09:25

salaam wrote:It's Tata Kestrel. For replacing Bmp-1/2.


A wheeled APC will not be replacing a tracked IFV. There is a separate competition for that. Hopefully, this system will enter service and allow for much larger mechanization of infantry. Like what Stryker did for the US Army.

shaun
BRFite
Posts: 1177
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby shaun » 21 Sep 2015 09:54

Arun Menon wrote:I know man, just asking what the specific occasion was and where the pictures were taken. These pics are new (as far as I know).


copied from a different forum ...location should be pune.

In addition to that , "The wheeled amphibious ICV platform (Kestrel) that Tata Motors has developed, is an infantry combat vehicle. It is powered by a 600 bhp ISLe engine. It is also a part of the program that is funded by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO). Tata Motors has received an order for three, and will be fitted with diverse machine kits. It is a modular platform explained Noronha. He further explained that Tata Motors acquired many systems to put in Kestrel. Hydro-pneumatic struts, and electronic systems and architecture with plug and play for example. Group companies like TCS, Tata Cummins helped with the design"

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66601
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Singha » 21 Sep 2015 09:59

kestrel is without the unmanned weapons station here. i think a few are on offer depending on user request.

member_22539
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2022
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby member_22539 » 21 Sep 2015 10:42

Shaun wrote:copied from a different forum ...location should be pune.

In addition to that , "The wheeled amphibious ICV platform (Kestrel) that Tata Motors has developed, is an infantry combat vehicle. It is powered by a 600 bhp ISLe engine. It is also a part of the program that is funded by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO). Tata Motors has received an order for three, and will be fitted with diverse machine kits. It is a modular platform explained Noronha. He further explained that Tata Motors acquired many systems to put in Kestrel. Hydro-pneumatic struts, and electronic systems and architecture with plug and play for example. Group companies like TCS, Tata Cummins helped with the design"


Thanks man, nice update. :)

shaun
BRFite
Posts: 1177
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby shaun » 21 Sep 2015 11:31

Yes Sir , we jingos are always happy to see indigenous products :)

Pratyush
BRF Oldie
Posts: 8307
Joined: 05 Mar 2010 15:13

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Pratyush » 21 Sep 2015 12:44

Not made in Rodina. Will not be bought

Philip
BRF Oldie
Posts: 21038
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: India

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Philip » 22 Sep 2015 12:19

How many troops can the Kestrel carry? What is the armament planned for it? Size vs BMP series-for easy air lift using existing transports and lastly cost,purely for a comparative study.

It looks v. good,low and long.Could it be the platform for other variants,like an anti-tank version with ATGMs,air defence similar to the Tunguska series,etc. There is plenty of space at the rear for accommodating whatever weaponry is required.Being wheeled,it can be used only where the IA can operate wheeled AVs,but perhaps the basic hull design could be tweaked into developing a tracked avatar.Nice size for a light tank too for Himalyan uses.China has developed its own light tank for Tibet.

Manish_P
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2432
Joined: 25 Mar 2010 17:34

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Manish_P » 22 Sep 2015 15:12

@Philip

IMVHO this vehicle type is different to the BMP series, with much more versatility and flexibility of roles.

As has been mentioned on this thread earlier :

About 9 or 10 troops + 3 crew members

The Kestrel is fitted with Norwegian Kongsberg MCT-30-R remotely controlled turret, armed with American 30-mm Mk44 Bushmaster II cannon.

It is possible to convert this cannon to a 40-mm caliber. Only barrel and few parts have to be changed. This cannon fires Armor-Piercing Incendiary (API), High-Explosive Incendiary (HEI) and Armor-Piercing Fin Stabilized Discarding Sabot Tracer (APFSDS-T) rounds. This cannon has effective range of 3 000 m. There is also a secondary 7.62-mm machine gun. The Kongsberg turret allows the installation of Javelin anti-tank guided missiles along the cannon.

A prototype that was revealed in 2014 also had a remotely controlled weapon station with 12.7-mm machine gun and one more Javelin launcher. It was mounted on top of the turret roof. Production APCs can be fitted with various weapon stations and turrets, depending on customer requirements.

Weight: 22.5 - 26 t

And here are some of it's contemporaries w.r.t role, dimensions and design similarities -

Pandur - Austria

Boxer MRAV - Germany

Centauro - Italy

ATOM IFV - Russia

Havoc - USA

IVECO SuperAV - Italy

Patria - Finland

NRao
BRF Oldie
Posts: 16829
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: Illini Nation

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby NRao » 22 Sep 2015 15:42

It is Indian. That is what counts the most. The rest can be built or grow around this simple concept.

Manish_P
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2432
Joined: 25 Mar 2010 17:34

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Manish_P » 22 Sep 2015 16:10

@NRao

Absolutely!!

Let Mahindra, Reliance, Maruti et all get into making competitive or supplementary models

IMVHO it is with such type of products that the Indian MIC will start... not the glamorous big ticket items.

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66601
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Singha » 22 Sep 2015 16:37

- 9 troops
- seats attached to roof for mine protection
- two waterjets for being amphibious
- emergency roof hatches for the troops
- vision and firing ports for individual weapons
- 600 hp turbocharged diesel engine
- separation of fuel tank from crew compartment - in BMP, the rear doors are also fuel tanks.

we can use the arjun optics and thermals and the BMP2's cannon (if its made locally) to keep the cost of armaments low. the Milan2T produced at BDL can be used.

hnair
Forum Moderator
Posts: 3979
Joined: 03 May 2006 01:31
Location: Trivandrum

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby hnair » 22 Sep 2015 20:13

a-0-a, is that a bow flap for hydroplaning? :eek: But I doubt, considering the draggy wheels hanging below the keel

Rahul M
Forum Moderator
Posts: 17047
Joined: 17 Aug 2005 21:09
Location: Skies over BRFATA
Contact:

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Rahul M » 22 Sep 2015 20:25

we need to ensure that our next APC/ICV is compatible with our MTA (and vice versa). you cant simply depend on the handful of IL-76 & C17's.

shaun
BRFite
Posts: 1177
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby shaun » 22 Sep 2015 20:58

there was requirement for 200 wheeled APCs for India's various UN missions.

Indranil
Forum Moderator
Posts: 8224
Joined: 02 Apr 2010 01:21

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Indranil » 22 Sep 2015 22:12

Rahul M wrote:we need to ensure that our next APC/ICV is compatible with our MTA (and vice versa). you cant simply depend on the handful of IL-76 & C17's.


The height and breadth of the MTA cabin is identical to IL-76. So vehicles that "fit" inside IL-76, will fit inside the MTA (and of course the C-17). Coming back to the Kestrel, it will fit, but it is too heavy. This is why, there have been calls for the MTA to have a payload carrying capacity of 25 Tons. However, such calls have been quickly rebutted because it is very rare for planes to take off and land with max payload at airports near Indian borders, which are either hot or high, or both. For example Boeing was very gung-ho (and rightly so) when C-17 landed and took off with a 30 ton payload at Leh on a summer day. The IL-76 cannot do so with even 0 payload during such days.

Rahul M
Forum Moderator
Posts: 17047
Joined: 17 Aug 2005 21:09
Location: Skies over BRFATA
Contact:

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Rahul M » 22 Sep 2015 22:56

exactly, 20 t would be the tops for MTA and we need to have a version of APC lighter than that. may be removable bolt on armour as an option but this compatibility is a must need if we ever intend significant force movements 10-15 years down the line.

NRao
BRF Oldie
Posts: 16829
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: Illini Nation

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby NRao » 23 Sep 2015 02:13

MTA?

For the SCS you need some good landing ships.

But, I do support "our MTA".

Surya
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5034
Joined: 05 Mar 2001 12:31

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Surya » 23 Sep 2015 03:46

The MTA is nowhere in sight

I would first get the Wheeled APCs in and change some parts of the IA from a lorry army

shaun
BRFite
Posts: 1177
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby shaun » 23 Sep 2015 05:50

^^^ 100+

Austin
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23387
Joined: 23 Jul 2000 11:31

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Austin » 23 Sep 2015 11:46

T-72 Upgrade with Urban Warfare Kit displayed at RAE-2015 ( Photos )

http://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/67815/

Karan M
Forum Moderator
Posts: 19835
Joined: 19 Mar 2010 00:58

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Karan M » 23 Sep 2015 12:12

Austin wrote:T-72 Upgrade with Urban Warfare Kit displayed at RAE-2015 ( Photos )

http://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/67815/


That cupola is an ATGM/RPG magnet.. easy way to kill 1 crew and make the tank withdraw
A RCWS with 360 deg optics, redundancy and armored doghouse would be a 10x better solution.

Austin
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23387
Joined: 23 Jul 2000 11:31

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Austin » 23 Sep 2015 12:19

^^ If you recollect even US Troops operating MRAP in Iraq and Afghanistan had similar coupla , the kit looks like a cheaper quick fix option for Urban environment not a comprehensive fit with other options

Karan M
Forum Moderator
Posts: 19835
Joined: 19 Mar 2010 00:58

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Karan M » 23 Sep 2015 12:40

US troops doing it for quick fix doesn't mean its a sure shot solution does it...M60 had a cupola..removed in Abrams for the kind of weakness it represented...this is a tank not the MRAP.. should get the best kit since its an offensive tool.

Abrams Urban Kit for standard is much better http://defense-update.com/products/t/tusk.htm,have the cupola as protection only when loader etc steps out but not as a standard solution..

It is a quick fix solution indeed.. but with significant limitations when operating against professional armies.. perhaps good against irregulars with limited training/ammo eg FSA in Syria..

member_20453
BRFite
Posts: 613
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby member_20453 » 23 Sep 2015 12:49

Actually the Kestrel is the ideal platform for plenty of things;
FICV for use with the IA
Marine ICV for use with IN's upcoming Naval Brigades
IMO the ideal platform for Namica
105mm Light Wheeled Artillery or light tank that can be air dropped
Ideal platform for Akash Launcher
Unmanned Ground vehicle
Command and control, recon vehicle
Arm this puppy with the Sky shield Air defense module and you also an have a dedicated Anti Air vehicle for the strike corps

However, it is quite important in this day and age to have it properly equipped with an APS, this should drastically increase survivability in high threat zones.

I feel a nice fat order of around 5000 of these in various forms would be needed.

member_20453
BRFite
Posts: 613
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby member_20453 » 23 Sep 2015 12:51

I also feel Sky shield should be the common Anti Air system across the board, can be fitted on trucks, armored vehicles, ships. Ideal, the system is pretty advanced and the best replacement for the Anti air guns.

Gyan
BRFite
Posts: 1183
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby Gyan » 23 Sep 2015 13:45

The whole concept of Air Defense Guns is out dated and this role can be taken up in India by Akash missile system.

shiv
BRF Oldie
Posts: 34982
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: Pindliyon ka Gooda

Re: Armoured Vehicles Discussion Thread - August 9 , 2014

Postby shiv » 23 Sep 2015 13:50

Gyan wrote:The whole concept of Air Defense Guns is out dated and this role can be taken up in India by Akash missile system.

Nonsense. What do you think close in weapons systems use?


Return to “Mil-Tech Archive”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests