Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A News & Discussions: 09 February 2018

gaurav.p · Post by **gaurav.p** » 12 Feb 2019 01:07

the numbers might increase considering low drag drop tanks are being developed, as stated previously by IR saar IIRC

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 12 Feb 2019 01:07

nam wrote:IAF Chief today mentioned that SU-30 sqd has 2 times the manpower requirement and 3.5 the cost of a Mig-21 sqd.

Shows us how important LCA like capability is. Single pilot, low cost jet. Reason why IAF is not keen on expanding Su30 sqd.

There is now lot of bad blood between IAF & HAL. The Mirage incident today may make it boil over.

Fundamentally we have unionized, driven by bureaucracy, late delivering HAL. IAF which does not have history of aircraft development, looking for perfection in LCA and does not trust HAL.

Watching all these is the mute MoD. Not wanting to take on the HAL union & not anger IAF.

I feel now there is a genuine issue to the security, because of this mess. Paks may become serious threat to us, based on sheer number of cheap to operate jets like JF17 and tie us down on western front.

This needs PMO intervention and some hard decisions. No point beating around the bush..

nam, HAL management will get revamped after elections.
Being in Bangalore they are acting like adjunct of Opposition party.

Suggest moving headquarters out of there.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 12 Feb 2019 01:09

Austin wrote:So eventually we will see 360 + Tejas in Mk1 , Mk-1A and Mk2 standard , this a huge number and great boost to the program

Consider that India bought about ~550 fighter aircraft from Dassault since 1953 purchase of Orougans jet fighters.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 12 Feb 2019 01:12

ashishvikas wrote:In the hustle-bustle of events, we deeply apologize for reporting this late about the First production flight of the 13th series produced Tejas (LA-5013) on 30th Jan 2019. The Flying Daggers will grow in strength to the full squadron number soon.

https://www.facebook.com/10332915642820 ... 900114780/

Jai Hind!!!

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 12 Feb 2019 01:25

Singha wrote:>>FlightGlobal understands that the Tejas Mk2, which, for all intents and purposes can be considered as an all-new aircraft
>>(or at least a substantially redesigned one) in the 16-17t weight class, will be ready to fly in the latter half of 2020

I think he meant 2020s

we need a couple of TDs flying. being 1.5t bigger, its like F16C vs F16E a totally new a/c sharing some "looks", software, avionics and the family name

Modi govt is serious. If IAF has to be equipped with Make In India fighter aircraft this is needed.
I know oldies on forum have grown cynical but please step out side and smell the fresh air.
No point in feeding cynicism to younger members..

Even the Naval LCA will get funded concurrently.
Money will not be the issue.

ArjunPandit · Post by **ArjunPandit** » 12 Feb 2019 01:29

call me crazy, but after i saw the mk2 drawing, I somehow feel that we are at the cusp of something very big. If we see the plane in large no.s. Engine will follow too. In a way this will be cart before the horse

ks_sachin · Post by **ks_sachin** » 12 Feb 2019 05:03

Ramana garu,

what is to stop the LCA and the Engine development work being done being declared programs of strategic importance like the the Nuke Sub.

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 12 Feb 2019 05:24

ks_sachin wrote:Ramana garu,

what is to stop the LCA and the Engine development work being done being declared programs of strategic importance like the the Nuke Sub.

Not Ramana-ji, but you answered the question in your own post ---> strategic importance.

A strong nuclear deterrent is a must have for our policy makers. So no matter what, acquiring your own nuclear boat was a must and is today now a reality. And everyone (especially the service i.e. the Navy) was involved in the program.

The same was not true of the Tejas (until recently, the aircraft was met with tepid response in the IAF) and my understanding the same is still not true in the engine development sphere. Only now we are seeing the fruits of decades of hard work, tears, blood and sweat in the Tejas program.

ks_sachin · Post by **ks_sachin** » 12 Feb 2019 06:30

Rakesh wrote:
ks_sachin wrote:Ramana garu,

what is to stop the LCA and the Engine development work being done being declared programs of strategic importance like the the Nuke Sub.
Not Ramana-ji, but you answered the question in your own post ---> strategic importance.

A strong nuclear deterrent is a must have for our policy makers. So no matter what, acquiring your own nuclear boat was a must and is today now a reality. And everyone (especially the service i.e. the Navy) was involved in the program.

The same was not true of the Tejas (until recently, the aircraft was met with tepid response in the IAF) and my understanding the same is still not true in the engine development sphere. Only now we are seeing the fruits of decades of hard work, tears, blood and sweat in the Tejas program.

Is not strategic autonomy a key goal like strategic deterrence..

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 12 Feb 2019 06:38

You are going into Indian interests thread topic.
Lets discuss in strat forum.

ks_sachin · Post by **ks_sachin** » 12 Feb 2019 09:40

That is all right sir.

Not that important.

tsarkar · Post by **tsarkar** » 12 Feb 2019 12:05

ks_sachin wrote:Ramana garu, what is to stop the LCA and the Engine development work being done being declared programs of strategic importance like the the Nuke Sub.

Not Ramana, but here's the answer.
Nuke Sub comes under the Nuclear Command Authority under the PM, so PMO can drive the project. A fighter jet is tactical. Anyone can tell the PMO to lay off like the Secretary who wrote to PMO to lay off Rafale negotiations.

ks_sachin · Post by **ks_sachin** » 12 Feb 2019 12:10

Tsarkar I dont know to respond....

gaurav.p · Post by **gaurav.p** » 12 Feb 2019 14:27

Going over IAI site, posting links of AESA and SPJ to be integrated in Mk1A

ELM-2052 = No masala found in the brouchureitis except that weight will be between 80-180kg and power 3-10kVA depending on the antenna size.
- provides very high resolution SAR mapping,surface moving target detection and tracking including target classification capabilities (RS,ISAR) feed the DDM that tejas now incorporated deep learning for target detection and classification!

ELL-8212/22 = Mk1 from news reports is going for the ELL-8222WB (wide band). There is another listing of ELL-8222SB of active phased array jammer pod. is SB the next generation of SPJ?
- Smallsize, lightweight(100kg) and low drag
- Certified for installation on A/A missile weapon stations (Sidewinder equivalent) does this mean we will sacrifice one of the two missile pods for SPJ, there is no rack configuration in consideration? or along with LDP?

JayS · Post by **JayS** » 12 Feb 2019 14:35

tsarkar wrote:
ks_sachin wrote:Ramana garu, what is to stop the LCA and the Engine development work being done being declared programs of strategic importance like the the Nuke Sub.
Not Ramana, but here's the answer.
Nuke Sub comes under the Nuclear Command Authority under the PM, so PMO can drive the project. A fighter jet is tactical. Anyone can tell the PMO to lay off like the Secretary who wrote to PMO to lay off Rafale negotiations.

And hence the long pending demand of Department of Aeronautics, similar to the departments of Space and Atomic Energy which directly come under PMO is justified. Of coarse this assumes we have a proactive and nationalistic PM who is as good or better than what we have today.

JayS · Post by **JayS** » 12 Feb 2019 14:36

Can someone find a proper side vide pic of LCA Mk1..? Real Aircraft, not schematic (unless its official source), and good quality image. I am unable to find one with perfect side view. Slightly angled views are available. If someone knows such image, it would be great help.

Bala Vignesh · Post by **Bala Vignesh** » 12 Feb 2019 15:25

JayS wrote:Can someone find a proper side vide pic of LCA Mk1..? Real Aircraft, not schematic, and good quality image. I am unable to find one with perfect side view. Slightly angled views are available. If someone knows such image, it would be great help.

Would this work??
https://flic.kr/p/TyWmdS

tsarkar · Post by **tsarkar** » 12 Feb 2019 17:01

JayS wrote:Can someone find a proper side vide pic of LCA Mk1..? Real Aircraft, not schematic (unless its official source), and good quality image. I am unable to find one with perfect side view. Slightly angled views are available. If someone knows such image, it would be great help.

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 12 Feb 2019 17:27

https://zeenews.india.com/india/tejas-m ... 79496.html

Tejas received FOC in December.

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 12 Feb 2019 18:18

Jai Hind.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 12 Feb 2019 18:24

Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General of India

Design, Development, Manufacture and Induction of Light Combat Aircraft

JayS · Post by **JayS** » 12 Feb 2019 18:59

tsarkar wrote:
JayS wrote:Can someone find a proper side vide pic of LCA Mk1..? Real Aircraft, not schematic (unless its official source), and good quality image. I am unable to find one with perfect side view. Slightly angled views are available. If someone knows such image, it would be great help.

Perfect. Thanks.

gaurav.p · Post by **gaurav.p** » 13 Feb 2019 02:56

chetak wrote:Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General of India

Design, Development, Manufacture and Induction of Light Combat Aircraft

Skimmed through the report. Why publish a 2015 report now!? (Given the context of past few days) Doesn't it signal something vile at play ? ( Virtue signal was also given by Russia wrt rescue thru mig29)

Where is the secrecy clause gone now!!!

The report is signed by auditor air force(?) and auditor CAG. Direct case conflict of interest if just HAL/ADA is flogged.

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 13 Feb 2019 04:40

https://twitter.com/IndianDefenceRA/sta ... 1221500930 ---> The production of 8 trainer aircraft (4 each in IOC & FOC contracts) would be taken up only after design clearance from ADA - Raksha Rajya Mantri.

Kartik · Post by **Kartik** » 13 Feb 2019 06:04

In the meantime, HAL will just go on and build the single seater FOC versions from SP-20 onwards.

BTW, the PAC report mentioned that the first FOC Trainer variant that will be rolled out will go towards qualifying and testing the flight refueling probe. I hope they don't wait till the tests are over and the probe is proven, before building the next trainer.

VinodTK · Post by **VinodTK** » 16 Feb 2019 08:35

35 years after inception, Tejas Mark I design frozen

Thirty-five years after the inception of India’s light combat aircraft programme, the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) has finally frozen the design of the Tejas Mark I defence fighter with aircraft drawings submitted on December 31 and the certificate of combat readiness obtained from the Centre for Military Airworthiness and Certification (CEMILAC) under the Defence Research Development Organisation (DRDO).

In an interview, Girish Deodhare, director, combat aircraft and ADA, said that the first Tejas in the final operational configuration (FOC) will be delivered to the Indian Air Force (IAF) in September with another 15 fighters to be delivered in the following 20 months. The deliveries will be much faster with Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL) deciding to outsource aircraft sub-assemblies to private companies such as Larsen & Toubro.

The FOC Tejas will have air-to-air refueling capability, beyond visual range Israeli Derby missiles, high angle attack expansion with a capability to match the best fighters in its light weight class in the 4 to 4.5 generation category.

From the initial order of 40 fighters from IAF, Deodhare said state-owned HAL, Bengaluru had delivered 12 fighters in combat-ready initial operational configuration (IOC) with the next four fighters to be delivered next month. The eight remaining aircraft will be in two-seater trainer configuration, which will follow the FOC fighters and also be fitted with air to air refuellers.

The IAF order under negotiation for 83 more platforms will be Tejas Mark IA, which will be fitted with state-of-the-art active electronically scanned array radar developed indigenously or ELTA, Israel, in a tie-up with HAL. ADA, Deodhare disclosed, is already testing an indigenously developed AESA radar with Tejas Mark I.

Deodhare conceded that there have been delays in the Tejas programme due to optimistic projections of time by its designers, developers and producers, and added that Tejas Mark II will be a twin-engine advanced medium combat aircraft (AMCA) with a heavier GE-414 engine as compared to the GE 404 engine of the Mark I. The twin-engine fighter will also have a naval variant. The development of the Mark II has already received a green signal from the defence minister and is set to go before the Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) for full financial approval of development costs.

Even though the FOC Tejas will come with some deviations from the air staff qualitative requirements, 1985, the fighter will not loose any of its fighting capability and will optimally perform its duties of defending air bases under attack and Indian borders. While the turnaround time of Tejas Mark I is high as the designers focused on the development of the aircraft primarily, with only the secondary focus on maintenance and repairs, HT learns that IAF has finally been handed over initial documentation (the manual) of the fighter with the upgraded and complete documentation ready in the next two to three months. The force needs this manual for training and operating purposes.

Prasad · Post by **Prasad** » 16 Feb 2019 09:00

What utter rubbish. Ddm is ddm.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 16 Feb 2019 10:50

DDM will never understand in 1985, Air to Air refuel, BVR especially Active seeker missiles, advanced IIR, IRST Missiles, PGM's , Reliability, etc were just fantasy or concepts as far the IAF was concerned.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 16 Feb 2019 21:31

Tejas dropping LGB in Vayushakti-2019.

https://twitter.com/DDNewsLive/status/1 ... 7990647808

ashishvikas · Post by **ashishvikas** » 16 Feb 2019 21:49

Alright, @DRDO_India's ASL & R&DE(E) have begun work on a quartz radome for the Tejas which once ready will be used on Tejas MK-IA delivery units instead of the imported Cobham radomes currently fitted on Mk-I deliveries.

https://twitter.com/SJha1618/status/109 ... 93248?s=19

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 16 Feb 2019 22:45

Rahul M wrote:Tejas dropping LGB in Vayushakti-2019.

https://twitter.com/DDNewsLive/status/1 ... 7990647808

From the video, it looks like after the bomb has been dropped, Tejas just moves on (i.e. it is not lasing the larget; unless it is an optical illusion due to bad camera work). Was the target being lased by other source (other aircraft or ground) or was it a GPS/GLONOSS enabled weapon?

Kartik · Post by **Kartik** » 17 Feb 2019 01:00

AFAIK, the target can be lased by the LDP at an angle that allows the aircraft that carried the LDP to move past it. There is no need for the leasing jet to be only in front of the target.

Kartik · Post by **Kartik** » 17 Feb 2019 01:02

Another fact is that because this is a demonstration, the LGB was dropped from a relatively low altitude so that the bomb is visible all the way. Typically the LGB would be released at a much higher altitude to maximize its range.

JayS · Post by **JayS** » 17 Feb 2019 05:20

ashishvikas wrote:Alright, @DRDO_India's ASL & R&DE(E) have begun work on a quartz radome for the Tejas which once ready will be used on Tejas MK-IA delivery units instead of the imported Cobham radomes currently fitted on Mk-I deliveries.

https://twitter.com/SJha1618/status/109 ... 93248?s=19

The recent PAC report has some details on this radome thinggy.

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 17 Feb 2019 07:13

in the Vayushakti video @ 11:07, the commentator says the "AeWACS has conveyed the ground coordinates to the Tejas" what does this mean ? that there is a datalink functional between the two birds ?

Kakarat · Post by **Kakarat** » 17 Feb 2019 07:25

One important thing from this years Vayushakti is total 6 Tejas participated in the exercise and 4 participated in firepower display, dropping 1 LGB, 6 1000lb bombs and firing 1 R73 unlike just 1 from previous editions

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 18 Feb 2019 00:20

What's the status of Tejas at HAL? When do they commit to deliver remaining birds.

Kartik · Post by **Kartik** » 18 Feb 2019 00:59

Tejas from No.45 Squadron firing a R-73 CCM during Vayu Shakti 2019

ArjunPandit · Post by **ArjunPandit** » 18 Feb 2019 05:11

One thing is for sure, IAF has full weight behind it. I've noted for last 2-3 tejas beeing talked in same breath as su30
1. IAF ads
2. IAF posters in WAC HQ
3. Vayushakti announcements

ks_sachin · Post by **ks_sachin** » 18 Feb 2019 06:45

ArjunPandit wrote:One thing is for sure, IAF has full weight behind it. I've noted for last 2-3 tejas beeing talked in same breath as su30
1. IAF ads
2. IAF posters in WAC HQ
3. Vayushakti announcements

So why dont they increase the size of the order...
Let them out their money where their mouth is...