Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

JayS
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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby JayS » 15 Jun 2016 13:11

deejay wrote:
shiv wrote:^^Hope the weather gods are kind

Was the undercarriage retracted?


Very much. It really zipped past.


Awesome. Good to see HAL being aggressive. BTW deejay saar, please let us know when you see LUH flying. You might see it today or tomorrow. :mrgreen:

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby morem » 15 Jun 2016 15:10

Saw the HTT fly over Bellandur Lake / Sobha apartments today morning around 9 am
retracted undercarriage , performing lazy turns and at a very low altitude

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby Kartik » 16 Jun 2016 03:55

BAe enhances Hawk trainer offering

..

Steve Timms, managing director of defence information and training systems at BAE’s Military Air & Information business unit, notes that from a lifetime order book for 1,020 Hawks – including Boeing T-45 Goshawk derivatives produced for the US Navy – there are typically 650 aircraft in use daily. Flightglobal’s Fleets Analyzer database shows that approaching 100 of this total are in use with the Indian air force and navy.

“India’s Hawks are flying 100 sorties a day, with an 80% availability rate,” says Timms, who adds that the nation “is exploring whether it can get more out of the Hawk". This activity includes BAE working with local production partner Hindustan Aeronautics (HAL) on an advanced variant, to potentially include an updated cockpit with a large area display, and a new wing. Featuring moving slats on the leading edge, the wing would shorten take-off and landing runs and also enhance agility when carrying external stores, such as weapons or sensors.


BAE’s Hawk new development aircraft is to have the new wing installed, but BAE is tight-lipped about its plans regarding flight-testing the enhanced platform. “We want to demonstrate it within the next 12 months, to give confidence in the product,” Timms says of the development. “If we feel we need to fly we’ll fly it,” he adds.

Meanwhile, BAE is in discussions with HAL and the Indian air force and navy about establishing long-term support arrangements for the nation’s Hawks. “We want to stay in partnership,” Timms says. “We are discussing how we can support them longer-term, looking at our T2 experience [with the UK Royal Air Force].”

To cover spares, repairs and absolescence management, this support arrangement is likely to be advanced through a proposed new joint venture with HAL, which also would encompass the Indian air force’s fleet of Sepecat Jaguar ground-attack aircraft.

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby Singha » 16 Jun 2016 07:23

profiles of our first three lady fighter pilots graduating on saturday

http://www.news18.com/news/india/meet-t ... 56699.html

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby shiv » 16 Jun 2016 16:36

From Twitter - Ananthakrishnan's timeline
Image

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby Austin » 16 Jun 2016 17:20

Nice Picture of HTT 40

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby jayasimha » 16 Jun 2016 18:36

I hereby declare
TSR001 = T. Suvarna Raju
just like KH = Kota Harinarayana

what a wonderful idea.
This master peice will bring suvarna from all corners of the world to our country.

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby jayasimha » 16 Jun 2016 18:41

It is with great pleasure to see TSR elevated to CMD of HAL.
He must have contributed a lot earlier as design chief and with his grit and determination must have pushed this program against all odds.

usually earlier govt. use to bring some jokers from un-related industry
only to suck the PSU from the back doors.

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby Kakarat » 16 Jun 2016 19:58

Another from @mathrubhumieng
Image

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby Kakarat » 16 Jun 2016 20:02

Propelled by HAL youngsters, HTT-40 ready to impress Parrikar

As first reported by Mathrubhumi, the BTA had its maiden flight last month (May 31) with HAL’s Chief Test Pilot Group Capt Subramaniam (Retd) undertakaing a ‘normal circuit flying mission’ for around 30 minutes. Co-piloting the maiden mission was Group Capt Venugopal (Retd), a Test Pilot with HAL.

In the last two weeks, the HTT-40 had seven flights, logging over three-plus hours totally.

HAL insiders say that during the initial flights the aerodynamic functionality, landing gear operations, roll-over take off, avionics system tests and gliding test were held. The aircraft also had an unscheduled wet-landing, thanks to the prevailing Monsoon in the city.

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby nirav » 16 Jun 2016 20:38

Glad tyre didn't burst.

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby Kakkaji » 16 Jun 2016 21:31

HAL-built trainer aircraft HTT-40's inaugural flight tomorrow

BENGALURU: The inaugural flight of India's indigenous basic trainer aircraft, Hindustan Turbo Trainer-40 (HTT-40), would be undertaken here tomorrow and Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar would witness it.

The inaugural flight of HTT-40, designed and developed by Hindustan Aeronautics Limited, is likely to take place at 09.15 AM tomorrow at the HAL Airport here.

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby Kartik » 16 Jun 2016 22:21

Looking forward to seeing a lot more of the HTT-40 thanks to the official-ness of tomorrow's function..is the IN also planning to buy basic trainers?

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby JayS » 16 Jun 2016 22:22

Lovely pics of HTT-40. Made my day.

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby Indranil » 16 Jun 2016 23:02

nirav wrote:Glad tyre didn't burst.

Please tone it down. Kartik is a very respected and knowledgeable poster. All he did was ask a legitimate question based on a prior experience working on an aviation project. You on the other hand have only used piskology for defense. Since when have Indian designers become unquestionable just because they are SDRE?!! Stop this drivel, otherwise face the question of trolling.

Kartik wrote:Looking forward to seeing a lot more of the HTT-40 thanks to the official-ness of tomorrow's function..is the IN also planning to buy basic trainers?

They must be. But, Bhadoria wants to sell recce versions to the navy as well. Capable of taking off and landing on semi-prepared coastal airstrips.

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby suryag » 16 Jun 2016 23:31

Dont know where the IJT has gone missing in all this good news :(

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby nirav » 17 Jun 2016 01:48

indranilroy wrote:
nirav wrote:Glad tyre didn't burst.

Please tone it down. Kartik is a very respected and knowledgeable poster. All he did was ask a legitimate question based on a prior experience working on an aviation project. You on the other hand have only used piskology for defense. Since when have Indian designers become unquestionable just because they are SDRE?!! Stop this drivel, otherwise face the question of trolling.


Design "questions" ought to have some sound logic or precedent..
Lack of it necessitated piskology.

I'm wondering why are you defending this whacky observation of exhaust gas potentially causing tyre burst by some guy on some forum.
It's not Kartiks observation btw,hed made it clear..

And I am glad that the whacky hypothesis was rendered invalid going by the news report and expressed it.
I fail to see how that's trolling.

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby Kartik » 17 Jun 2016 02:43

nirav wrote:
Design "questions" ought to have some sound logic or precedent..

Lack of it necessitated piskology.

I'm wondering why are you defending this whacky observation of exhaust gas potentially causing tyre burst by some guy on some forum.
It's not Kartiks observation btw,hed made it clear..

And I am glad that the whacky hypothesis was rendered invalid going by the news report and expressed it.
I fail to see how that's trolling.


You're like the road-side mechanic who can just eyeball something and tell if its good to go or not, but don't have the theoretical knowledge to understand why it may not be an issue? Did you even bother to read what Nileshjr wrote in response to the question I posted? Or was it just too technical for you to grasp? I actually read his responses, went through the manuals, and tried to see if it might indeed be a problem. And no, even he wasn't convinced that this will definitely not be an issue that HAL won't face as the program continues through its trials.

I didn't see an iota of science emanating from you on this topic and yet you act so dismissive of it, as though you were an oracle who could simply look at an engineering design issue and decide if its a valid issue or not..and if its not, in your oracle opinion, just go ahead and assign some nonsensical motive about "oh just because it is SDRE design, gora people will question onlee". If you know your design well, you'll defend it with logic, not with whining about SDRE BS.

As to whether the question emanated from me or not is immaterial.

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby Indranil » 17 Jun 2016 03:21

nirav wrote:Design "questions" ought to have some sound logic or precedent..
Lack of it necessitated piskology.

He gave you the precedent. Please go back and read the messages. He argued and was argued against. I argued against him. Nilesh also did. No piskology was required. Whether the MLG is in the exhuast plume or not is cleared by this picture itself.
Image

nirav wrote:I'm wondering why are you defending this whacky observation of exhaust gas potentially causing tyre burst by some guy on some forum.
It's not Kartiks observation btw,hed made it clear..

And I am glad that the whacky hypothesis was rendered invalid going by the news report and expressed it.
I fail to see how that's trolling.

The news report means nothing. Is it summer? Is it Jodhpur? How long was the plane waiting in queue to take off?

My educated guess is that the exhaust plume is not hot enough to increase the tyre pressure beyond the tolerance level. Why do I believe it? Many planes dump the exhaust under the fuselage and the general direction of the MLG, and yet I have never read the tyres bursting. But this is only a guess. May be HAL has done an actual analysis and found it to be true. But, why can't one question them just because they are fellow SDREs.

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby Indranil » 17 Jun 2016 03:23

Kartik wrote:You're like the road-side mechanic who can just eyeball something and tell if its good to go or not, but don't have the theoretical knowledge to understand why it may not be an issue?

Come on Kartik. This language is not warranted. Why are you grown up men turning me into a Moral Science teacher?!!!

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby fanne » 17 Jun 2016 03:34

the only thing I would add is, we would be the greatest aeronautical nation if we get right everything in the first go. And if we were, we should be producing 7th gen aircraft all around.

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby Kartik » 17 Jun 2016 03:44

indranilroy wrote:
Kartik wrote:You're like the road-side mechanic who can just eyeball something and tell if its good to go or not, but don't have the theoretical knowledge to understand why it may not be an issue?

Come on Kartik. This language is not warranted. Why are you grown up men turning me into a Moral Science teacher?!!!


sorry, but his attitude warranted that kind of language. You know, when one cannot give a sound explanation of why something someone pointed out may not be an issue, probably because one lacks the technical understanding for it, but one still wants to sound like an authority on the subject..

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby nirav » 17 Jun 2016 03:59

Well, I seem to have struck a nerve.
Let me share what I really think of the "issue" and question.

Exhaust is pointing towards MLG,could lead to a tyre burst.

Now either those actual engineers who came up with the design are a bunch of Cs or the eyeballing Abdul who came up with the gem observation.

My money is on the latter.

Thing is, one can come up with any non sensical observation, post obscure manuals,debate technically or something like that and still come up with - well the exhaust position might not be such an issue at all !

Speculation about an eyeball observation doesn't serve any purpose and such discussion is plain balderdash.

I've deliberately used pisko language to drive home my point.dont need HALs CFD studies to dismiss this preposterous theory of the exhaust causing tyre burst.

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby Kartik » 17 Jun 2016 04:06

lol, you've confirmed my hunch about where you stand. "CFD studies ki kya zaroorat jab mae dekh kar hi bata doonga ki koi issue nahi hain.."

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby nirav » 17 Jun 2016 04:12

Haha.

Reason for not providing CFD studies for such a ludicrous claim is, well the plane itself. The beautiful thing is flying without any of its tyres popping till date.

I tend to give credit and have faith in HALs engineering ability than the "question" on the exhaust/MLG placement by an individual on an obscure internet forum.

Too bad we don't have signature function here.
Mine would be - HTT 40, still no tyre eggsplode.

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby Manish_Sharma » 17 Jun 2016 04:42

I want to personally thank Kartik for raising this question. These sorts of questions should be raised here so they're answered and discussed by knowledgeable posters. This way if Bharatiya product is dissed anywhere in other forums, non-technical people like me can answer and clarify; stop the propoganda of other competitors.

Strange the posters who originally objected to this query from Kartik have never objected to posters like philip who has been dissing indiginous products right and left, even going to the extent of calling LCA "Late Combat Aircraft". Great contributors!

brishit 45 destroyer is completely destroyed by just coming to arabian sea, because of their uber rolls royce engine. Now does this not show anything can happen in newly engineered products? The spanish navantia s-80 submarine had problem due to fault in design when completed, that it'd have sunk if put in water. Now both these european countries are experienced naval powers, but this happens in creating new techs/products and the only crime is to be "stung" OR "hurt" if some problem or just questions are araised.

American latest ship had to towed back as its engine melted or something.

Just keep inventing.

Kartik has been the best poster as far as aviation threads are concerned, his interview with Commodore Maolankar, or educating the forum on how chineez have stolen DSI strake tech from US has been genius.

Sad to see him trolled like this.

Here is a small sample of his contribution:

Attended my first Aero India this Saturday. I won’t describe the difficulties in getting into the show, but once I did, it was quite alright.

The highlight for me was the conversations I had with Cmde Jaydeep Maolankar, Test Pilot of the Tejas program and Cmdr Sukesh Nagaraj (Deputy Project Director, NLCA).

I was lucky to spot Mao sir alone and walked up to him, introduced myself and spoke of my association with BRF and then we had a conversation on the Tejas program for half an hour..he was incredibly frank, friendly, didn’t hold back any facts and only left when he got a call from someone..here are the salient points of our conversation, some of which we already know but am listing it anyway.

- Tejas LSP6 is the platform on which the spin chute will be integrated but it’s not here as yet. Will get done before FOC.

- Tejas Mk1 has achieved the IOC AoA limit of 22 deg and they will go a couple of degrees further in tests, when the spin chutes are integrated on LSP6. This is to ensure that they know that the airplane is safe even at higher alpha although the FBW will restrict it to the AoA limit for FOC for service pilots (which is higher than 22 deg, but he didn’t say how much)

- Mao Sir scoffed at the suggestion that the engine was choking at higher alpha. He said there is no such thing, but rather because it was designed initially for the Kaveri’s airflow and had to redesign it for the F-404. They have already tried various intakes on the LCA, with/without spring mounted doors on the intakes.

- Tejas MK2 will get an approx 10mm increase in diameter for the increased air flow requirement of the F-414 (Cmdr Sukesh Nagaraj confirmed this as well). Too small a difference to be visible to the naked eye for us jingos. The spring mounted doors may also be bigger if needed

- When asked about the STR and ITR rates of the Tejas, he simply smiled and said “it’s enough, let me put it that way”. When I queried him further, asking about the ASR that the IAF had set based on the Mirage-2000 and MiG-29’s STR and ITR, his smile vanished and he got serious.

He said that when people look at 10 different brochures and come up with requirements, without looking at whether meeting all those requirements is even possible for ANY one fighter, they set themselves and the program up for failure. He was very frank about this, stating that even those brochure specs were just that- brochure specs that even those famed fighters sometimes don’t meet. But they were taken as benchmarks anyway and then, without even bothering to look at the technological base in India, the ASR was prepared.

- He was full of praise for the handling of the Tejas. It’s a true delight to fly and both he and Grp Cpt Suneet Krishna have tremendous confidence in the aircraft itself. He said that they both push the aircraft to its current limits without any worry since the FCS is very good.

He did mention that they didn’t push the Tejas Mk1 to its limits at the airshow but just wanted to display that it is maneuverable enough.

- When I asked him whether the Navy fully backs the NLCA program, he laughed and said “I’m here, aren’t I?”. So all in all, it appears that the IN is backing the program fully

- NP1 hasn’t flown more than 4 flights because they’re re-designing some of the structures on board. This is the additional strengthening required for handling the thumping that is a carrier landing.

The landing gear is being re-designed since its overweight and NP2 is going to fly soon.

- I brought up the point he made at AI-2011 about how the Tejas should’ve started as a carrier variant and then gone on to the IAF variant.

He seemed genuinely happy that someone had remembered that point of his and described the main issue with the NLCA NP1.

The issue as he described it was that the LCA didn’t have a central keel to pass the structural loads to, something he said that the AMCA won’t face since it’s a twin engine fighter.

This meant that they had to put new attachment points which aren’t the ideal solution and result in the bulky appearance of the current landing gear.

- I was going to ask him about the AMCA naval variant and he said that currently there is no plan for it.

At this point he had to leave and I was disappointed since I hadn’t gotten to discussing anything about the Elta 2032/MMR, Litening LDP and the weapons on the Mk1 such as the Derby/Python V/R-77/Astra and Sudarshan..


Next, I went to the ADA stall and just asked aloud if anyone could talk to me about the Mk2. A gentleman in a suit stepped up and said “Yes, what do you want to know about it?

Which one, the IAF Mk2 or the Navy Mk2?” and I said “IAF Mk2” and he laughed and said “oh, you disappointed me, I was hoping you’d say Navy Mk2”..:D Turned out, it was Cmdr Sukesh Nagaraj, Deputy Project Director of the N-LCA program..

I was blown away by this gentleman. Here was one of the top decision makers of the Tejas program and he was warm, friendly, forthcoming and genuinely interested in talking about the program without even asking me what my background was (till much later in my conversation).

He was an engineer on the Sea Harrier, having served on the Viraat. Said he was rookie when Cmde Maolankar commanded the squadron. The salient points of the conversation with him were:

- The Tejas Mk2 is being lengthened by 0.5m only and not 1m as that big gasbag Prasun Sengupta was fibbing about. We really ought to never take him seriously at all. The reason cited were CG change primarily.

- F-414 was primarily an IN requirement. It turns out that the IAF was fine with the F-404IN20 engine on the Mk1. They jumped on the IN’s requirement for a higher thrust engine and requested the IAF Mk2 variant.

- The fuselage on the Mk2 will be slightly wider as well due to the larger diameter of the F-414 engine. This will be used to put onboard additional fuel

- The widening of the fuselage will push out the wings a bit, thus increasing wing span. Otherwise no increase in wing span as such. It doesn’t need it, since the wing area is massive already

- Additional fuel will be required primarily to offset the additional weight (he said approx. 200 kg additional) and higher SFC of the F-414 engine. So, it appears that the Tejas Mk2’s range may not go up significantly over that of the Mk1.

- He confirmed that the intake size will go up by approx. 10 mm for the Mk2.

- There is a LOT of work that is required to be done due to engine change.

This is something jingos must keep in mind since jingos keep asking if this or that engine can be used or not on a platform..pumps, motors, fuel supply lines, nearly everything associated with the engine requires re-design due to an engine change due to higher fuel flow rates for a larger engine and the different specs of the power generation on board.

Plus, the higher weight means localized structural strengthening as well, all of which takes time
- N-LCA will be an out and out 9G fighter. He was categorical about this.

- NP1 trainer doesn’t have a radar- the radome is used for carrying avionics. He said he was more interested in the NP2 since it was the first fighter and was going to carry the same radar as that on the Sea Harrier.

I tried to quiz him on this because the Elta 2032 on the Sea Harrier is not the same as the Elta 2032/MMR on the Tejas Mk1, but he didn’t stop what he was saying.

- NP2 is basically similar to the NP1, but with the rear seater’s canopy painted over (he said that! I asked if it was faired over and he said no, just painted over). The rear seater’s space will carry avionics (that were put into the radome on the NP1) and additional fuel tank.

- NP1’s LEVCONS will be initially having 3 positions- 10 deg, 20 deg and 30 deg, just like flap settings. I tried to ask him if the LEVCONS would be just lift generating surfaces or that they could be used as additional control surfaces by the FBW FCS to increase turn rates but he said that they were primarily required for higher lift when landing and taking off

- They’re working on the hands-free take-off for the N-LCA. He said that it was no big deal and they’ll do it for sure

- Mk2 is to get bigger MFD displays, but he said that even the ones on the Mk1 are actually good and possibly adequate

- One piece of news that will get some jingos happy- he said that he has asked CSIO Chandigarh to develop a frameless HUD instead of the current one. It’ll feature higher FoV and its easier to view through since there is no frame obstructing the pilot’s view.

- DASH HMDS from Elbit for the N-LCA as well. I had initially thought they’d go with the Thales Top Owl-F as on the MiG-29K

- Just as I suspected, I asked him if the current drop tank is transonic- he confirmed that it is. A supersonic tank is being developed to carry about 200 gal. (~750 ltrs)

- Also confirmed that there is nothing wrong with the centerline fuel tank – since we almost never see Tejas Mk1 carry a centerline fuel tank in place of the innermost wing pylon drop tanks. If required, Mk1s can carry drop tank on the centerline station also

- Regarding IFR, it is Cobham that is going to work on it. Asked if it’s a fixed probe, retractable or semi-retractable, it was confirmed to be semi-retractable, like that on the MiG-29UPG.

I asked about the lack of internal volume on such a small fighter for even a semi-retractable probe and he said that its going to be a small probe, and they’ll manage to find the space for it

- No OBOGS on Tejas Mk1 or NP1. It’ll be there from Mk2 onwards. Designed by DEBEL and certified by CEMILAC

- Regarding the landing gear, he said it was 1600 kgs over the Tejas Mk1’s landing gear weight initially!! They designed it per MilSpec which was too conservative. Also, in addition to the general Factor of Safety that is needed for Ultimate Loads, they added another Factor of Safety of 1, for a total of 2.5 because it was being done for the first time in India and they were concerned about the design..and used maraging steel which was heavy.

- He clearly said that before the NP1 first flight, none of the OEMs even believed that this program had any future and no one cooperated with them when asked for help. Then, when NP1 flew, they were interested in helping out.

- US Navy is now consulting with them on where to reduce weight, what other materials to use. All the leg work is done here itself though, and no work is being done by foreign OEMs. They are confident of shaving off 1000 kgs and bringing it to 600 kgs over the LCA AF version’s landing gear weight for the N-LCA

- On the N-LCA Mk2 they will change the position of the landing gear and bring it more towards the wing/fuselage joint. The landing gear will then retract into a fairing for that. That will also free up space in the fuselage for additional fuel

- Regarding radar, he said that they are pretty confident about it. The reason is that they’re using the same Elta 2032 as on the Sea Harrier! Since they’ve already qualified that radar for the Derby, he was pretty confident about the Derby on the N-LCA. Asked about the Python-V he said that it’s the R-73 that’ll be the WVR weapon..when I asked him how come the Python V was shown on the mockup outside, he said it’s just a mockup. Wasn’t very clear about this

- Shockingly about the radar, when I asked about what increased range one might get with the Elta 2032 since the diameter of the antenna on the N-LCA will be bigger than that on the LUSH SHar, he replied that there is no increase in range, its more than sufficient..I asked him specifically again that “really same detection range?” and he said yes. Again not very clear about this

- When quizzed about AESA for the N-LCA Mk2, he said that for now it’s the same Elta 2032 and Cmde Mao had recently even gone to Israel to test the radar that will be used on the N-LCA Mk2. Here, he mentioned that “if you get anything from Israel, just take it.

Their equipment is very good”. Then went on to mention how the Barak was tested on the Viraat and was successful on its very first trial with 2 missiles fired. The first hit the target and the second hit its debris!

- He confirmed that the anti-ship missile for the N-LCA is going to be the Kh-35E, similar to the MiG-29K. Laughed when recollecting how poor the Sea Eagle was as an AShM.

- Primary role envisaged for the N-LCA is that of CAP and Fleet Defence, replacing the Sea Harrier. He was quite dismissive about the P-3C Orion threat (jokingly saying that to shoot that down, a gun is enough!:P), but was primarily concerned about the cruise missile and anti-ship missile threat to the Carrier.

But he mentioned that a Carrier Battle Group consists of several rings of protection for the carrier, and that the carrier will get warned about any possible airborne threat several hundred kms before it even approached it.

With that much warning, a N-LCA could dash to the edge of the fleet and take on the threat.

- When I asked him if shooting down sub-sonic anti-ship missiles with on-board missiles was a possible scenario for the N-LCA, he replied in the affirmative

- When he mentioned this, I asked him how good the Elta 2032 was with regards to dealing with sea clutter and he said that its very good.

- NP2 is currently already going through integration tests. Will likely fly in June or July if no issues are found.

- NP1 has given them a lot of data for how the platform behaves in 4 flights itself

- Said how the LCA is designed as per the Test Pilot’s recommendations- whatever they want, ADA/HAL give it to them. He said let the IAF get the Rafale and then ask for these small changes and then they’ll figure out just how hard it is to get anything they want.

On the N-LCA, we can integrate whatever we want, and for the entire lifetime of the fighter. Easier upgrades will be available since everything is known about the aircraft to the designers

I had to leave at this point since my friend who I’d met after 6 years was in a hurry to leave so we could escape the impending traffic snarl. Thanked the Cmdr profusely and got his card as well.

I asked for some other brochures on the Mk2 and he said that he could give me a soft copy of it. To date, I’ve never had so much come from a single conversation at any airshow or business show.

Very competent fellows are working on these programs. They need our support and encouragement. Those who are constantly piling it on them, with negative reports are basically doing this nation a great dis-service.
Criticize the organization perhaps for its failings, but those who are working on these programs are to be commended and encouraged.

Indranil
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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby Indranil » 17 Jun 2016 05:59

Okay. We have all had our say. No more discussion of this or name calling. Otherwise, warnings will follow.

Philip
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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby Philip » 17 Jun 2016 11:36

A good beginning, now concerted effort in building more prototypes for flight testing and time bound action must follow ,for it to enter production and service in large number,for exports too.Just a quick query. Where do the HTT-40's ejection seats come from?

deejay
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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby deejay » 17 Jun 2016 12:21

Today was the inaugural flight of HTT 40 with the RM, Shri Parrikar watching.

Photos from @writetake

https://twitter.com/writetake

Video from @livefist
https://twitter.com/livefist/status/743705963564142592

Another video

https://twitter.com/rotormagic/status/743707065701408768

Adding the youtube link of the above (poor quality mobile video):
Last edited by deejay on 17 Jun 2016 13:01, edited 1 time in total.

deejay
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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby deejay » 17 Jun 2016 12:23

A lucky spotting of NAL Saras again today undergoing a ground run. Apologies for the poor quality and angle of the picture. I had a gate in between and only my mobile.

Image

Kartik
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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby Kartik » 17 Jun 2016 12:30

Oh wow..rare sighting indeed..the program is officially dead now, isn't it?

deejay
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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby deejay » 17 Jun 2016 12:36

Kartik wrote:Oh wow..rare sighting indeed..the program is officially dead now, isn't it?


So I've heard but why are they keeping it alive with ground runs?

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby uddu » 17 Jun 2016 12:54

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... as-423225/

The first Saras prototype is in storage in Bangalore. This aircraft, which was extensively upgraded after the crash of the second prototype, was conducting low speed taxi tests when funding evaporated. Chetty says this aircraft is ready to resume taxi tests upon NAL obtaining fresh funding.

A third prototype is in the early stages of production, its construction frozen by lack of funds.

“As of December 2013, we had no funding to continue flight testing,” adds Chetty. “But with the government looking at civilian aviation and regional connectivity in a broader framework, we are hopeful that they will appreciate an pressurized aircraft that can operate in India’s [mountainous regions].”

He adds that the Modi government’s push for indigenous production across industries under the “Make In India” programme also bodes well for the Saras’s future.

Even though this is old news, it mentions that once the funding is available they can start the ground run. Hopefully that has happened.

The aircraft in IAF colors means something. May be we will hear some good news pretty soon. :)

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby shiv » 17 Jun 2016 13:09

deejay wrote:A lucky spotting of NAL Saras again today undergoing a ground run. Apologies for the poor quality and angle of the picture. I had a gate in between and only my mobile.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClIuDS0UkAAAcGl.jpg


Man that is one of the sweetest pictures I have ever seen. Vayusena colors and flag. Appears to have a rear door/ramp!! Probably new props.

Many thanks. May you find a thousand horny goats in your cave tonight!

Deejay - may I copy paste this image on Teetar?

deejay
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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby deejay » 17 Jun 2016 13:20

shiv wrote:
deejay wrote:A lucky spotting of NAL Saras again today undergoing a ground run. Apologies for the poor quality and angle of the picture. I had a gate in between and only my mobile.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClIuDS0UkAAAcGl.jpg


Man that is one of the sweetest pictures I have ever seen. Vayusena colors and flag. Appears to have a rear door/ramp!! Probably new props.

Many thanks. May you find a thousand horny goats in your cave tonight!

Deejay - may I copy paste this image on Teetar?


Yes Sir, though it is already on my handle @rotormagic. I've retweeted with you marked.

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby JayS » 17 Jun 2016 14:20

indranilroy wrote:My educated guess is that the exhaust plume is not hot enough to increase the tyre pressure beyond the tolerance level. Why do I believe it? Many planes dump the exhaust under the fuselage and the general direction of the MLG, and yet I have never read the tyres bursting. But this is only a guess. May be HAL has done an actual analysis and found it to be true. But, why can't one question them just because they are fellow SDREs.


Just some funfacts from this nice primar on tires by Bridgestone (I have seen same numbers from other sources as well. These may be FAA regulation numbers): http://www.bridgestone.com/products/speciality_tires/aircraft/candm/care_win04.html
- The tolerance on the tire-pressure is +-5% after which some corrective action is needed.
- Rule of Thumb: 10°C difference approximately changes tire pressure by 3.7%. Or 1% variation for each 3°C variation in Temperature.
- The tires to be maintained at normal operating level with respect to the coolest temperature it will be operating in. That is if destination is a colder place, pressure is reduced from departure airport itself.
- If the tire surface temperature is more than 30°C higher than the ambient temperature then its considered a "Hot Tire" and needs to be inspected for air pressure.
- Tires are not recommended for further use when tire surface temperature exceeds 225°F (107°C), or when brake heat creates temperatures that exceed 300°F (149°C) at points where the tire is in contact with the wheel surface.

Even in a place like Jodhpur with ambient temperature at 50°C - the tire has minimum of 57°C of margin for operation.

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby JayS » 17 Jun 2016 14:22

deejay wrote:Today was the inaugural flight of HTT 40 with the RM, Shri Parrikar watching.



It passed over my house while turning for landing. I could only catch a glimpse by the time I ran out to see it. But I loved its sound - sounded very lovely to my hears. Cant wait to see it in IAF colors.


member_23061
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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby member_23061 » 17 Jun 2016 15:47

So does this replace the Pilatus Pc-7??

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Re: Indian Military Aviation - 21 Sept 2015

Postby rahulm » 17 Jun 2016 15:53

Full marks to the GoI and Manohar Parrickar. The HTT 40 progress and now looks like the Saras program is on. It was a sad day when the Saras funding was stopped.

What would it take to for MP to have the same laser focus on getting desi land, air and water prime overs across the line? For starters, operationalise Kaveri in its present thrust (apparently, blade durability is an issue for now but will have to check latest status), Kaveri Marine, an Indian engine for Arjun and FICV, turbo shafts for helicopters and turbo props for Saras and HTT 40. The tank engine form factor is a challenge.

Perhaps, an Integrated Engine Development Programe (IEDP) along the lines of IGDMP with generous funding and freedom from red tape.


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