'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Katare
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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Katare » 17 Feb 2018 10:13

No thank you once we took a free aircraft carrier for the cost of it’s air fleet. We all know how that suckered us in.

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby ramana » 17 Feb 2018 11:52

What had polio or plague got to do in my argument?

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Rakesh » 17 Feb 2018 18:39

Nothing Ramana-ji. Now you know, why I said you are talking about concepts far beyond their level of comprehension. Your message - while well intentioned and beautifully put - is falling on deaf ears.

Don’t cast pearls before the swine. The pearls get mired in polio and plague.

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby SaiK » 17 Feb 2018 23:42

Is it not time to have a white-list of deaf ears? :)

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Rakesh » 19 Feb 2018 00:04

https://twitter.com/gripennews/status/9 ... 1234779137 --> Leonardo/Saab RAVEN ES-05 AESA for #Gripen E with a repositioner for increased scan area.

Image

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Rakesh » 19 Feb 2018 00:06

https://twitter.com/GripenNews/status/9 ... 9674330113 --> Modules of Gripen E Electronic Warfare System - a GaN based solution.

Image

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Rakesh » 19 Feb 2018 00:10

Pictures in link below...

https://twitter.com/GripenNews/status/9 ... 7706113024 ---> JAS 39C/D Version 20 inducted in 2016. Radar among many things improved. Can now see further, see smaller (low radar sign) better. And less likely detected (LPI). Coupled with Meteor missile, upgraded EW, etc, a true "fighter" upgrade.

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Rakesh » 19 Feb 2018 00:22

Enabling Indo-U.S. dialogue on the F-35
https://www.stratpost.com/enabling-indo ... ogue-f-35/

There are four broad issues that will need to be discussed between the two countries as part of any conversation on approval for the F-35 Lightning II Joint Strike Fighter for the Indian Air Force (IAF).

1. Fifth Generation Fighter Aircraft (FGFA)
2. U.S. Export Controls
3. Foundational Agreements and Security
4. Lowered Expectations for Make in India

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Cosmo_R » 19 Feb 2018 05:00

^^^

1. The FGFA is a science project we cannot afford. What's the number tossed around—$25-30Bn? The IAF does not want it: deliverables aside, it will kill CAPEX needed for ops for the next decade.

"No doubt, the Russians wouldn’t be happy about this, but India has substantial existing and future plans for cooperation with their defence industry that would offset the impact of a withdrawal from the FGFA and could placate their old strategic partners."

Why do we the buyers always have to 'placate' the seller? Besides, we can collaborate with them on stuff we can't get elsewhere and they cant sell to others. Such as SSNs, SSBNs and cruise missiles.

2. Quoting the Dick Verma: "Part of the question is why should we give the technology? What kind of burden sharing or information sharing will India do or provide in the context of this advanced technology?”

Lah di dah! You've been imposing the Pakistan burden on us by giving them stuff. You want an 'Indo-Pacific' strategy? that's burden sharing.

3. Foundational agreements. The LSA was a no brainer. I have no clue on CISMOA or BECA. India has to voice its objection to specifics and get resolution. It has to be India-specific not a boilerplate agreement.

4. Lowered MII expectations. The FACO approach is more than adequate. What we should stress is MII for the F-35 expendables and munitions. Local supply chain for all the MRO items and SDBs, Indian Missile integration etc much like what is referenced here for Israel

http://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/10 ... -any-other

The price of our cooperation on the Indo-Pacific and interoperability has to be (in part) the same F-35 relationship that Israel has.

From our POV, If the AMCA is projected for IOC/FOC by 2035, then assume 2040+. In the interim, we need to learn 5G a/c tactics and supporting tech. There's nothing on the horizon except the F-35. Maybe that is the SEF

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby vasu raya » 19 Feb 2018 05:28

Even if we believe we can share the US-Israel relations on a transitive basis, does IAF have anything close to the bold part?

“We recognized that Israel is also going to have sovereign sustainability requirements,” Jack Crisler, the vice president of Lockheed Martin’s F-35

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby brar_w » 19 Feb 2018 05:42

Any nation can opt out of the multi-nation PHM based sustainment product on the F-35. You do not have to network your PHM or use ALIS for sustainment (you can pick and choose what you want) and can continue to order parts, build or purchase stocks the old fashioned way. Similarly, if a user wants organic MRO capability they can get it.

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Philip » 19 Feb 2018 06:58

Cosmo, if the FGFA is unaffordable the JSF will take the IAF to the cleaners.Even if acquired it can never be bought in sufficient numbers to bear the brunt of IAF ops.In the IAF's history there have been basically only a few types that have been its backbone and also because they were very affordable, easy to build/acquire and operate.
The Hunter, Gnat, MIG-21 still with us(!), and now the MKIs. The LCA could in the future replace the MIG-21 but only if HAL can get its production act together and iron out all glitches improving the bird to the expected MK-2 std. within the shortest possible time.All the med. sized aircraft are too expensive barring the MIG-29.

Had it been available to us a decade ago, the F-16 would've made the grade, but it is too late now having reached almost the end of its development potential and isn't that cheap either. For economic reasons we must leverage the LCA to the max.and increase MKI numbers , half the price of Rafales which aren't BMos capable. We need to reach an agreement on the FGFA which is a superior aircraft to the MKI. HAL is geared up to proceed on the prog. and the HAL chairman openly wanted the deal to be sealed.The tech we obtain from this programme could be used to accelerate development on the AMCA which it is very clear that we cannot do it alone on our own in a timeframe that will be worthwhile and relevant.

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby srai » 19 Feb 2018 12:45

^^^
42 squadrons will remain aspirational until unless the bulk of it is formed using very affordable Tejas Mk.1/Mk.1A/Mk.2. If India fixates on expensive imports, shortages will be the norm. The GoI is not increasing the defense budget anytime soon. The end users need to be in-sync with capital budgets available to them and plan accordingly.

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Viv S » 19 Feb 2018 15:46

Philip wrote:Cosmo, if the FGFA is unaffordable the JSF will take the IAF to the cleaners.

So you say. Right now the IAF buys Su-30s for $75 mil each from HAL which is $10 mil more than buying it direct. The idea that the Su-57 could be had for less than $100 mil especially given its drip-feed production state appears far-fetched, to put it mildly. The F-35A is less than $95 mil flyaway, will hit $85 mil by next year, and there's no need to put in $6.5 bn to reimburse the supplier for development expenditure.

And that's before we consider the fact that there's a vast gulf in the maturity of the two programs. The PAK FA is yet to deliver its first production unit to the RuAF while the F-35 program has delivered 270 aircraft and clocked some 125,000 flight hours to date with some of its squadrons already registering mission availability rates in excess of 70% and deploying to operational theatres.

Your "buy test-article interim Su-57s like we did Su-30Ks" argument doesn't hold water. Given that 10 years after the IAF received its first Su-30MKI, it was still struggling with a serviceability rate of 50% and had suffered a myriad of operational problems (especially relating to the engine), the unreliability and unserviceability of interim Su-57s isn't just likely, its damn near guaranteed.

The IAF has no interest in being guinea pigs for a developmental effort (while the RuAF sits back and waits for the Su-57 to come of age, and buys Su-35s & Su-30s in the meantime).

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby brar_w » 19 Feb 2018 16:50

We need a little bit more clarity on Su-57 production. From a recent media report posted in the PAKFA thread, 12 serial production aircraft are to be ordered *soon* with 2 articles expected to be delivered in 2019. I am not sure by when the remaining 10 aircraft are to be delivered (earlier they pointed to EO 2020) or if either of these 12 will include the second stage engines. For comparison, current (2018) F-35 production is in excess of 7 aircraft a month, and this will climb to 10 or more aircraft a month in 2019. I think over 12 worldwide air-bases have the capability to operate and sustain the aircraft now and this will only grow by 2019 many partners currently training in Arizona will fly back and declare IOC on their first units. With deliveries to training, testing and tactics squadrons virtually complete (in terms of aircraft deliveries) the program will be pumping out 100+ aircraft a year (on average over the next 5 years) straight to US and foreign operational squadrons. These are two fundamentally different programs as far as maturity and industrial capablity is concerned.

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Kartik » 21 Feb 2018 03:38

Gripen E delivery schedule on target, says Saab boss


Saab remains on track to deliver the first series production examples of its Gripen E in the third quarter of next year
, and is also hopeful of concluding delayed sales of new-build C/D-model examples during 2018.

"We will stick according to the plan and deliver the first two aircraft to the Brazilian air force and Swedish air force next year," says Saab chief executive Håkan Buskhe. "Things are going according to plan," he said while discussing the company's financial results for 2017 on 16 February.

"Test and evaluation of the first [prototype] aircraft is going extremely well. We are getting better-standard data than we had anticipated," Buskhe says. A second prototype will join its fleet by the end of this year.

"It's always challenging to have this type of programme, but if it's not challenging then it probably will not be a good product at the end," he notes, while describing development work as progressing "fairly well".

Noting that Saab is eyeing potential opportunities to sell the Gripen E to additional nations, including Canada, Finland and Switzerland, he says: "Our performance in delivery will also prove that we have a ready product."

Buskhe says Saab had hoped to conclude new sales of its Gripen C/D by the end of last year, but that factors including political processes in potential customer nations prevented this from happening. "The number of possible deals hasn't changed," he stresses. "We have some intensive discussions with some countries, and there are great possibilities during this year."

..

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Rakesh » 21 Feb 2018 03:48

I say this with all seriousness, now watch how the RFP gets issued.

The IAF wants the Gripen E. And to think that in third quarter of 2019, there will be only an IOC Gripen E and not a FOC one.

Time to *UP* the game.

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby nachiket » 21 Feb 2018 04:18

Saab remains on track to deliver the first series production examples of its Gripen E in the third quarter of next year, and is also hopeful of concluding delayed sales of new-build C/D-model examples during 2018.

These kinds of news items about the Gripen E always make me wonder what exactly these guys were peddling to us all those years ago during the MMRCA evaluations. Beyond snake oil that is.

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Prem » 22 Feb 2018 09:42

http://www.tribuneindia.com/news/nation ... 47826.html
India to again scout for global players for jets

Companies that participated in the now scrapped Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft (MMRCA) project will be invited. The MMRCA project for 126 jets did not fructify and the government, in April 2015, announced the move to buy 36 Rafale fighter jets from French major Dassault.
The MoD and the IAF will keep its options open and not restrict itself to say a “single engine” fighter jet, sources have told The Tribune. The option will be to get a “fighter jet” and it will not specify the number of engines as that then restricts the options.
These will be under ‘make in India’ and to get global manufactures to have a production line in India, the project needs adequate numbers with possibility of future expansions. To speed up matters, the MoD will be looking at new additions made by global players since the MMRCA trials were carried out in 2011. The planes tested then were Lockheed Martin’s F-16IN, US Boeing’s F/A-18IN, Eurofighter Typhoon, French Dassault’s Rafale, Swedish Saab’s Gripen and Russian MiG-35.In past two years, the IAF and the MoD were in talks for a “single engine” fighter jet with two global manufactures. However, this has been superseded by the thought process to just focus on getting additional jets without getting into “single engine” or “twin engine” variants. The existing production of 123 Tejas fighter jets being made by public sector giant Hindustan Aeronautics Limited is just taking off and it will take more than a decade for the entire lot to be manufactured. The IAF has the mandate to have 272 Sukhoi 30 MKI in its fleet. The MiG 21s are on their last legs and have to be phased out.

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Manish_P » 22 Feb 2018 12:42

^ Oh dear. Another Fighter Olympics which shall keep this forum busy for the next decade (while the end result probably will be another goverment to goverment purchase of 2-3 squadrons)? Hopefully by that time the LCA Mk2 will be flying in quantity and the AMCA will be entering service..

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Zynda » 22 Feb 2018 13:04

May be the above is the brainchild of our DefMin NM...to keep busy with Olympics while our Tejas will progress in to Mk.2 and start entering service.

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Khalsa » 22 Feb 2018 14:27

Oh man
honestly we are looking like idiots wanting this circus dram for a 4th gen fighter that gets finalised in 2025 for a build to begin in 2040
facepalm

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Will » 22 Feb 2018 14:49

Looks like the IAF put its foot down and said no to the F-16 which would leave just the Gripen making it a single vendor contest. Also looks more and more like the IAF wants a fifth gen fighter which makes sense keeping in mind the fact that it is going to take at least a decade for any new aircraft to be selected and to actually join the IAF. Dont think the LCA MK 2 is on the radar anymore. Things point towards the AMCA. Also expect an off the shelf purchase of the F-35 in a govt to govt deal.

Additionally this could just be a ploy to drag things out and then just go buy more Rafales citing emergency needs. Image the stink its going to raise if this is done with allegations of favouring you know who.

On the other side me thinks this rigmarole of a new contest is for the exclusive entertainment of armchair Air Marshals and BR forums :mrgreen: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :twisted:

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Rakesh » 22 Feb 2018 18:18

:lol:

I told you that the IAF does not want the F-16.

Karan Saar said the same thing as well. Check the first page of this thread. Same with Cybaru as well.

As I stated numerous times in the past - in this very thread - that the IAF is the customer and will not accept the F-16. But a few in here got "wet dreams" of the F-16 joining IAF service. Strategic Partner, employment, parts, upgrading other F-16s, rolling other sectors of the economy and what not was put forward on BRF.

The risk assessor in chief on BRF - who claims his predictions are *NEVER* wrong - has been humbled. How does that feel? :lol:

Stop this global tender bakwaas. Start working with the US on a G2G deal for 2 - 3 squadrons of F-35As. Forget even FACO. Just buy them off the shelf, station them at one airbase in India and use them as is. Or try a 2+2 option. Get two squadrons now, with an option for 2 more.

But order 2 more squadrons of Rafales RIGHT NOW. No more importing 4th+ gen fighters after this. The fifth gen F-35 will come only by the middle of the next decade, once all the negotiations are complete. Therefore, no need to spend all our valuable FOREX now.

Just focus on Tejas Mk1A and Mk2 and AMCA. The Tejas is India's SINGLE ENGINE FIGHTER.

Tejas Tejasvi Namaham - Touch The Sky With Glory

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby srai » 22 Feb 2018 21:08

Will wrote:...
On the other side me thinks this rigmarole of a new contest is for the exclusive entertainment of armchair Air Marshals and BR forums :mrgreen: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :twisted:

Time to shutter this SEF thread and start a new one MMRCA-II. Another decade of entertainment on BRF :rotfl:

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Viv S » 22 Feb 2018 21:24

srai wrote:Time to shutter this SEF thread and start a new one MMRCA-II. Another decade of entertainment on BRF :rotfl:

Hooray!! The deja vu will be so strong we'll all feel 10 years younger. :mrgreen:

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby VKumar » 22 Feb 2018 21:57

Rakesh wrote:But order 2 more squadrons of Rafales RIGHT NOW. No more importing 4th+ gen fighters after this.

Tejas Tejasvi Namaham - Touch The Sky With Glory


IMHO more Rafale will be ordered after we start receiving the first lot. The facilities are being put up for more than 2 squadrons.

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby nachiket » 23 Feb 2018 00:14

Let's hope the manufacturers themselves are as tired of this rigmarole as we are and nobody responds to this fresh tender.

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Cybaru » 23 Feb 2018 00:42

After a decade we will realize there are too many UAV's in the world and we will buy 18 F35X to piss everyone off :) and restart UAVMRA-1 contest!

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Rakesh » 23 Feb 2018 01:39

Viv S wrote:
srai wrote:Time to shutter this SEF thread and start a new one MMRCA-II. Another decade of entertainment on BRF :rotfl:

Hooray!! The deja vu will be so strong we'll all feel 10 years younger. :mrgreen:

I am looking forward to seeing the discussion between you (for Eurofighter) and arturo (for Rafale) :mrgreen:

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Rakesh » 23 Feb 2018 01:46

VKumar wrote:
Rakesh wrote:But order 2 more squadrons of Rafales RIGHT NOW. No more importing 4th+ gen fighters after this.

Tejas Tejasvi Namaham - Touch The Sky With Glory


IMHO more Rafale will be ordered after we start receiving the first lot. The facilities are being put up for more than 2 squadrons.

I think that is likely what will happen. Air HQ has realized the SEF will not take off. Sqns are being retired and no aircraft are available to replace them. So for the IAF to maintain her force levels, a repeat order of Rafales will be likely.

It all depends on how much the MoD is willing to spend (on a repeat Rafale purchase);

- I do not expect such an order (of repeat Rafales) to take place prior to May 2019 (elections). If the BJP wins again, then a repeat order of Rafales are a definite yes. The IAF needs to make a strong business case to the Raksha Mantri for such.
- At least another two squadrons will likely be coming (min @ 36 and max @ 44) to make full use of the infrastructure being set up at Ambala and Hasimara.
- Any more Rafales that two additional squadrons will result in more expenditures incurred at Ambala and Hasimara or at some other air base. Not sure how keen the MoD will be to this idea.
- Also, anything more than two more squadrons of Rafale will diminish the prospects (basically funding) of a possible F-35 purchase. Only so much money to go around.

If two more Rafale squadrons come, expect the IAF force structure in 2025, to look like the following;

Su-30MKI @ 17 Squadrons
Jaguars @ 5 - 6 Squadrons
Mirage 2000-9s @ 2.5 Squadrons
MiG-29UPG @ 3 Squadrons
Rafale @ 4 Squadrons
Tejas Mk1 @ 2 Squadrons
Tejas Mk1A @ 4 Squadrons

The above comes to 38.5 squadrons. Four short of the magic number of 42. So perfect for 2+2 option for F-35 :) While the numbers do not change much (from 32 sqns in 2018 to 38+ sqns in 2025), look at the capability increase the IAF will have in 2025 compared to 2018.

Not to mention, if we upgrade those Jaguars to the Darin III standard and get those Honeywell engines and as well as work on the Super Sukhoi upgrade, you are looking at an IAF that is more than a match for the PLAAF. If Air Chief Marshal Dhanoa Sir says that the "2017 IAF" can give the PLAAF a bloody nose, just imagine what the above force structure can do.

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Viv S » 23 Feb 2018 01:56

Rakesh wrote:I am looking forward to seeing the discussion between you (for Eurofighter) and arturo (for Rafale) :mrgreen:

Naah. I've switched boats. Upgraded to the next gen you might say. The new one comes with a big ass flat-screen and is VR enabled. Smart design. Built for high speed broadband era.

Besides, the EF's not a player this time round, since the Rafale has already been ordered. Same for the SH. Also, the IAF isn't keen on the F-16 Blk70, so the Gripen E is probably out too. And of course it wouldn't touch the MiG-35 with barge-pole so that's a non-starter. Meanwhile, the Su-57/FGFA is years away.

Which leaves us with the Rafale & F-35A.

Another two squadrons of the Rafale are quite possible but there's still 12 squadrons of Jaguars, MiG-29s & Mirages that need replacement in the 2026-2032 period. The Rafales would provide commonality while the F-35 would provide the IAF with VLO strike options.

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Rakesh » 23 Feb 2018 02:12

I fully agree Viv Saar. Well said.

I am thinking, if the Tejas Mk2 comes out in the next decade, those 12 squadrons of Jaguars (6), MiG-29s (3) & Mirage 2000s (2.5) which are slated for replacement (beginning in 2032) can be taken over by the Tejas Mk2. It all depends on how the Mk2 pans out. With SEF likely out of the picture, a G2G deal for the F-35 is the best bet to go for. Checks all the boxes for the IAF (platform wise) and for the GOI (strategic partnership).

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby kit » 23 Feb 2018 02:19

I suppose the new season starting with the " fighter competition any number of engines" with run like the Mahabharat well into the 22nd century .Possibly to keep geopolitical pressures at bay and give time for the industry to mature . That seems to be the only sane explanation for all the seeming conundrum.

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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Rakesh » 23 Feb 2018 02:57

Now being reported by the Times of India as well. Finally RaGa turned out to be useful for his country!

Govt scraps single-engine fighters plan, asks IAF to go for wider competition
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/ind ... 034958.cms

- The govt has asked the IAF to come up with a new proposal that will take both single and twin-engine fighters into account.
- The plan was to produce 114 single-engine fighters with foreign collaboration under the “Make in India” framework".
- The aim is to increase the contenders and avoid needless allegations later,” said a source

The government has scrapped its two-year-old plan to produce 114 single-engine fighters with foreign collaboration under the “Make in India” framework, at an estimated cost of Rs 1.15 lakh crore (almost $18 billion), amid the political slugfest between BJP and Congress over the Rs 59,000 crore contract for 36 French Rafale jets. Top sources said the Defence Ministry (MoD) has directed IAF, down to just 31 fighter squadrons (each with 18 jets) now when at least 42 are required for the “collusive threat” from Pakistan and China, to come up with a new proposal that will take both single and twin-engine fighters into account. “The original plan placed an unnecessary restriction on only single-engine fighters, which limited the competition to just two jets (American F-16 and Swedish Gripen E). The aim is to increase the contenders and avoid needless allegations later,” said a source.

Incidentally, F-16 manufacturer Lockheed Martin had joined hands with Tata Advance Defence Systems Ltd, while Swedish aviation major SAAB tied-up with the Adani Group in anticipation of the mega project to produce the fighters in India under MoD’s ‘strategic partnership’ policy, as was earlier reported by TOI. Faced with a further two-year delay now, which will ensure the beleaguered force will not be able to reach its sanctioned strength of 42 squadrons even by 2032 as projected earlier, the IAF is now scrambling to finalize the new plan based on its operational requirements, the required transfer of technology :roll: and other aspects. It was the then Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar who had advised IAF to go in for the single-engine production line because he said the country could afford only 36 of the twin-engine Rafales for meeting its “critical operational necessity” immediately. Single-engine fighters, of course, have a lower acquisition and operating cost even if there is a slight compromise in capability.

The 36 Rafales, ordered in “flyaway condition” by the NDA government after scrapping the original MMRCA (medium multi-role combat aircraft) project for 126 jets initiated by the previous UPA regime, will be delivered in 2019-2022 under the 7.8 billion Euros contract inked in September 2016. But they alone will not make up the numbers. With all the 10 existing squadrons of old MiG-21s and MiG-27s slated for retirement by 2022, it’s projected the number of squadrons will go down to 19 by 2027, and may further reduce to 16 by 2032, given the long delays in the indigenous Tejas fighter. The new project to include both single and twin-engine fighters will, in effect, be a repeat of the MMRCA project first proposed by the IAF in 2001-2002. The formal tender or RFP (request for proposal) for the MMRCA project, under which the first 18 jets were to come in flyaway condition and the rest 108 being licensed produced by defence PSU Hindustan Aeronautics, was floated in 2007. While the F-16 and Gripen-E as well as the twin-engine Russian MiG-35 and American F/A-18 were rejected after exhaustive field trials, the Rafale in 2012 had emerged the winner over Eurofighter Typhoon after commercial evaluation. But the final negotiations were deadlocked for long before being scrapped in June 2015 by the NDA government.

Cosmo_R
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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Cosmo_R » 23 Feb 2018 04:21

As the former IAF chief said "There is no plan B". I fear there is also no plan A. Just 999 exquisitely drafted ASQRs

HAL better deliver the 250 shortfall with LCAs and 'emergency inductions' of more SU30s if it can't.

The Pakis and PRC are smiling

Rakesh
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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Rakesh » 23 Feb 2018 04:23

Cosmo, it is just conjecture at this point. Just wait for an official statement to come out. DDM is famous for false reporting.

Katare
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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Katare » 23 Feb 2018 05:31

I hate to say it and. Know it is wrong on so many levels but the first thought that came to my frustated mind was IAF deserve it for being too import pasand

Rakesh
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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby Rakesh » 23 Feb 2018 06:10

For BRF's Import Lobby :mrgreen: and America's Policy Influencers 8)

The Five Stages of Grief

They are right now in Stage 1. Anger will soon come in Stage 2 in the form of Psy Ops, Fear Mongering, Scare Tactics, etc.

At every stage, the pro Tejas team on BRF must provide the following;

1) Information and Communication (aka Hard Facts)
2) Emotional Support (Let them Cry on *YOUR* Shoulder)
3) Guidance and Direction (Lead them to the *RIGHT* Decision - Tejas)

Image

srai
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Re: 'Make in India' Single engined fighter

Postby srai » 23 Feb 2018 06:21

...
With all the 10 existing squadrons of old MiG-21s and MiG-27s slated for retirement by 2022, it’s projected the number of squadrons will go down to 19 by 2027, and may further reduce to 16 by 2032, given the long delays in the indigenous Tejas fighter.
...

These guys keep rehashing falsehood. Repeat enough times, it becomes the truth so they say.

Looks like these guys only know how to do subtraction (MiG-21/27 + seem to exclude Jaguars/MiG-29/Mirage-2000 as well) but nothing about addition (Su-30MKI, Rafale, Tejas) ;)


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