Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

nam
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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby nam » 27 Feb 2019 16:20

For people asking why Mig-21, we cannot have Su-30 providing cap on entire 1000+ KM IB & LOC.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Sanju » 27 Feb 2019 16:20

Arun.prabhu wrote:Whom did I bait?

Karan M wrote:Arun, pls dont bait people. Emotions are running high as it is.


Different Arun. There is no prabhu in Karan M's note.

Karan M
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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Karan M » 27 Feb 2019 16:20

Not you.

Arun.prabhu wrote:Whom did I bait?

Karan M wrote:Arun, pls dont bait people. Emotions are running high as it is.

pankajs
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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby pankajs » 27 Feb 2019 16:21

putnanja wrote:Its a shame the pakis were successful in luring our Mig21 across the border into a trap. However, if we stop now, it will appear to be a stalemate. And will not change paki behavior a bit, rather gives them a boost of confidence. They need to feel a bit more pain, which imposes cost on them. Else they will brush this off and restart their games

Even if today was a stalemate, the Balakot was an unqualified success at many levels as I and others have listed before.

So while the closing scene, if this is THE closing scene, looks balanced the overall action was not. It does given bakis some propaganda points especially the capture of the pilot.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Pratyush » 27 Feb 2019 16:21

vyomvir wrote:I sense de escalation and the usual perception optics saga, do you guys feel the same?



No chance in hell. The best move the TSP military had was to keep quiet.

Now they are in for a paddling.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby pankajs » 27 Feb 2019 16:22

gauravsh wrote:WTF is this chap Abhijeet Iyerval posting. He just posted a video of pigs manhandling our officer.
My blood is boiling enough now.

There is a showoff within each of us. Everyone wants to be the *exclusive* star. Theek hai.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby chandrasekaran » 27 Feb 2019 16:23

Pak PM is now saying if a war breaks out it will not be "in his" control anymore. I hope India escalates this big time. Want to see hell's fury unleashed over Pakistan!

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby ramana » 27 Feb 2019 16:23

Austin wrote:Nothing wrong in using Mig-21 in a hot zone the Bison are well equipped and pilots are trained to combat a type which enemy has.

And you could get shot down for many reason no matter if you are fighting in a Mig-21 or MKI or Rafale.

Twp reasons:
1) Malfunction
2) AAM

Could be Stinger too

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby arun » 27 Feb 2019 16:24

Karan M wrote:Arun, pls dont bait people. Emotions are running high as it is.


Out of deference to the emotionally down mood, my emotions included, tell me how we can take matters off line and private.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Arima » 27 Feb 2019 16:25

chandrasekaran wrote:Pak PM is now saying if a war breaks out it will not be "in his" control anymore. I hope India escalates this big time. Want to see hell's fury unleashed over Pakistan!


when was he in control of his armed forces in the first place??

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby sum » 27 Feb 2019 16:25

I really dont think any military assets were targetted. Pakis just tried to probe crossing airspace at multiple points and one such probe led to a showdown

Its just sheer bad luck that the pilots ended up landing in PoK. Were they shot down in A2A?
Why a trainer i will not understand though

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby pankajs » 27 Feb 2019 16:26

varshar wrote:
Leh can be equipped / upgraded to host high-end offensive capabilities - why not?

It doesn't seem right to throw Bisons up-front while we have better options available.

- Varun

Do you consider them useless?
If not in which situation will you use them?
Where will you *hide* the Mig21's 'cos they still form a big chunk of our forces?
Last edited by pankajs on 27 Feb 2019 16:27, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Bharadwaj » 27 Feb 2019 16:26

*That* video is going to cause blood to boil( heck mine is well and truly boiling)..... Beyond emotions, the optics for NAMO are not good. Retaliation has to be swift. Or at least put out the sat intel of the busted pig sty.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Karthik S » 27 Feb 2019 16:27

Got to respect and admire the guts of Wing Co. chasing F-16 inside enemy territory in a 3rd gen Mig 21.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Panther » 27 Feb 2019 16:28

Request all the have faith in our armed forces capability and government. It's better to go down fighting like a true shoulder then to be a sitting duck inside a bus and get killed. Some of the statement ?? The wisdom on IAF in employing its resources hurting more then the news of losing our aircraft and pilot. Lot of negative vibes after a single setback. With this kinda public support difficult to win a war.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Singha » 27 Feb 2019 16:29

I did not see this level of debate and discussion and hand wringing when the CRPF bus thin skinned with aluminium was blown up - no talk on why each bus could not have IED jammers, composite armour etc. they were poorer people from the hinterland and pilots are "more like one of us". the middle class in each country gets more emotionally impacted when "one of our own" takes a hit. and TSP will be happy to play games with the POW and oblige all of you. manhandle him and make your blood boil unable to do anything about it

that is the modus operandi of the criminal state.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby varshar » 27 Feb 2019 16:30

pankajs wrote:
varshar wrote:
Leh can be equipped / upgraded to host high-end offensive capabilities - why not?

It doesn't seem right to throw Bisons up-front while we have better options available.

- Varun

Do you consider them useless?
If not in which situation will you use them?
Where will you *hide* the Mig21's 'cos they still form a big chunk of our forces?


I'd prefer Bisons to be south of Ambala AFB strictly for training & recce. They're definitely useful - but for different things.

It's interesting that instead of upgrading Leh AFB, it's being given to civilian authorities for tourism (with IAF getting something greenfield nearby).

- Varun
Last edited by varshar on 27 Feb 2019 16:31, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Singha » 27 Feb 2019 16:30

Panther wrote:Request all the have faith in our armed forces capability and government. It's better to go down fighting like a true shoulder then to be a sitting duck inside a bus and get killed. Some of the statement ?? The wisdom on IAF in employing its resources hurting more then the news of losing our aircraft and pilot. Lot of negative vibes after a single setback. With this kinda public support difficult to win a war.


you said it brother. I am pretty disappointed if this is the level of BRF...what can one expect of the common middle class living in their coddled existence?

its only poorer folks in the hinterland and smaller towns who understand what true hardship is and will get behind the flag.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Karan M » 27 Feb 2019 16:31

Guys I have a sincere request. Emotions are running high. If you get outraged at something, dont respond angrily. Walk out come back, inform the admins if need be. Dont pick a fight.

Arun, nothing required from your side either. Understand you must be upset as well, just that the post was inappropriate at this point. Thanks for understanding.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Arun.prabhu » 27 Feb 2019 16:31

Showcases training and attitude and if there really were eight intruders and our Migs went beyond our air space to interdict them.

Karthik S wrote:Got to respect and admire the guts of Wing Co. chasing F-16 inside enemy territory in a 3rd gen Mig 21.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby pankajs » 27 Feb 2019 16:32

chandrasekaran wrote:Pak PM is now saying if a war breaks out it will not be "in his" control anymore. I hope India escalates this big time. Want to see hell's fury unleashed over Pakistan!

The latest version of old baki style bargaining by pointing the piston to its own head.

Has he lost control of *his* Military?

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Singha » 27 Feb 2019 16:32

GAURAV C SAWANT

Verified account

@gauravcsawant
25m25 minutes ago
More
Clear act of escalation by Pakistan. Targeting military installation is an act of war. IAF Bison pilot engaged & brought down Pak jet. Is PoW. India will respond. Escalation is by Pak. Yudhay Krit Nischay!!! Defeat Pak state terror. There are no low costs options. #IndiaFirst

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Paul » 27 Feb 2019 16:32

Why MIGs were left for CAPs at this critical juncture is beyond my understanding. They should have moved 29s during Kargil time from Adampur to Srinagar for LRPs.

I hope this this does not come to an end without IAF using the heavy guns.

Was there an update on the MI17 crash?

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Austin » 27 Feb 2019 16:33

Karthik S wrote:Got to respect and admire the guts of Wing Co. chasing F-16 inside enemy territory in a 3rd gen Mig 21.


Bisons are quite capable and the fact it has shot an F-16 proves it.

Pilots are trained to fight any fighter types of their adversary ...There is training tactics and weapons thats comes into play

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby ramana » 27 Feb 2019 16:33

KaranM, Just give one week ban to Arun.
I will end up banning permanently.
Reason insubordination in this thread.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby pankajs » 27 Feb 2019 16:35

varshar wrote:
pankajs wrote:Do you consider them useless?
If not in which situation will you use them?
Where will you *hide* the Mig21's 'cos they still form a big chunk of our forces?


I'd prefer Bisons to be south of Ambala AFB strictly for training & recce. They're definitely useful - but for different things.

It's interesting that instead of upgrading Leh AFB, it's being given to civilian authorities for tourism (with IAF getting something greenfield nearby).

- Varun

training & recce? Are you serious? Open sky and all that!

I nominate you for the Chief of Air staff post ....... of my Air force i.e
Last edited by pankajs on 27 Feb 2019 16:40, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby chandrasekaran » 27 Feb 2019 16:35

Nope, you are not getting the message. He said the same about our PM too. Essentially putting the blame on hardliners. Expect our peaceniks to fall for this one more time and put enormous pressure on GoI to get the wing commander back by de-escalating.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Austin » 27 Feb 2019 16:35

Paul wrote:Why MIGs were left for CAPs at this critical juncture is beyond my understanding. They should have moved 29s during Kargil time from Adampur to Srinagar for LRPs.

I hope this this does not come to an end without IAF using the heavy guns.

Was there an update on the MI17 crash?


Coz the Bison are quite capable and IAF knows too well what type should be deployed

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby ramana » 27 Feb 2019 16:36

Paul wrote:Why MIGs were left for CAPs at this critical juncture is beyond my understanding. They should have moved 29s during Kargil time from Adampur to Srinagar for LRPs.

I hope this this does not come to an end without IAF using the heavy guns.

Was there an update on the MI17 crash?


You can thank Congress who wanted their bribe and delayed Rafale buy. Mig 21 were be phased out by 2018.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Aditya_V » 27 Feb 2019 16:36

I dont think the Bisons did not end up using BVR R77, they probably went for a peace time protocol of identifying the intruder before engaging, lets see on how we respond.

PAF today has identified it will engage India as response to attacks on ISI, can leave it at this, should probably attack PA tonight and lure the PAF in.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby nam » 27 Feb 2019 16:38

If the Mig CAP were baited, then a clear act of war.

Need to grind PAF down.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby arun » 27 Feb 2019 16:38

ramana wrote:KaranM, Just give one week ban to Arun.
I will end up banning permanently.
Reason insubordination in this thread.


Ramana, A request to discuss matters privately and offline is how insubordination?

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby ryogi » 27 Feb 2019 16:38

Look at the optics: we are saying to them

"A MiG-21 Bison took down your frontline fighter; wait till our shiny new toys come to the fore."

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby arun » 27 Feb 2019 16:39

Karan M wrote:Guys I have a sincere request. Emotions are running high. If you get outraged at something, dont respond angrily. Walk out come back, inform the admins if need be. Dont pick a fight.

Arun, nothing required from your side either. Understand you must be upset as well, just that the post was inappropriate at this point. Thanks for understanding.


Sure.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby pankajs » 27 Feb 2019 16:39

sum wrote:I really dont think any military assets were targetted. Pakis just tried to probe crossing airspace at multiple points and one such probe led to a showdown

Its just sheer bad luck that the pilots ended up landing in PoK. Were they shot down in A2A?
Why a trainer i will not understand though

This would be even more interesting.

The briefing was brief because GOI wanted the message to be pitch perfect AND yet they introduced "PAF targeting military targets"! Now that was not by a slip of a tongue.

Now that would imply GOI want's escalation if read with you line of reasoning.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby abhijitm » 27 Feb 2019 16:40

Singha wrote:GAURAV C SAWANT

Verified account

@gauravcsawant
25m25 minutes ago
More
Clear act of escalation by Pakistan. Targeting military installation is an act of war. IAF Bison pilot engaged & brought down Pak jet. Is PoW. India will respond. Escalation is by Pak. Yudhay Krit Nischay!!! Defeat Pak state terror. There are no low costs options. #IndiaFirst

Beautiful. Key is "there are no low cost option". We all need to be prepared for war casualties and some set backs. Focus on end goal, not each engagement.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby rajithn » 27 Feb 2019 16:41

Our briefing after the strikes were clear: that ours was a pre-emptive non-military strike on terrorist targets.
Now, theirs has been an attempted targeting of a Brigade HQ > A military target. They escalated. And this is also the sum of the briefing by the MEA this afternoon.
The fact that an AVM was present at the MEA briefing: my guess is that the signaling is that it is now being handed over to the military and future briefings will be by the armed forces reps.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Karthik S » 27 Feb 2019 16:41

As situation stands, we targeted terrorist camps in their territory, didn't target civilians or military assets. But they responded by trying to attack ours, but got repulsed. So IOW, they have climbed the escalation ladder. What our response should be next? My guess, we will target their military assets. But if usual suspects pressurize govt to not escalate given they have a POW, and if the govt indeed de-escalates (probability is low). Then at he end, pak would have won this round because at the end of the day, we lost 40 plus CRPF. They lost whatever cheap cannon fodder, then we both lost 1 jets.

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Shivaji » 27 Feb 2019 16:42

I am a freelancer and any day I do not work, I do not get paid. Not feeling like working for last few days. I wish to contribute in whichever way I can. Since my military understanding is yet rudimentary though I have learnt a lot on BRF and will continue to do so. To avoid clutter, will post only facts after verification which I think can help learned members.

Few from diplomatic realm. One panelist on Newx highlighted these developments and hence thought of sharing.
1) Pakis had threatened to boycott OIC meet if India allowed. UAE who is convener of the meet, has snubbed them.
https://www.aninews.in/news/world/asia/ ... 226182317/

2) Wuzhen meet had Hans trying to be neutral
https://swarajyamag.com/insta/wuzhen-me ... ooperation

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Re: Indian Forces Strikes Pakistan Terrorist Camps

Postby Sumeet » 27 Feb 2019 16:42

abhijitm wrote:
Singha wrote:GAURAV C SAWANT

Verified account

@gauravcsawant
25m25 minutes ago
More
Clear act of escalation by Pakistan. Targeting military installation is an act of war. IAF Bison pilot engaged & brought down Pak jet. Is PoW. India will respond. Escalation is by Pak. Yudhay Krit Nischay!!! Defeat Pak state terror. There are no low costs options. #IndiaFirst

Beautiful. Key is "there are no low cost option". We all need to be prepared for war casualties and some set backs. Focus on end goal, not each engagement.


what is end goal ? Please define.


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