PRC Political News & Discussions

[Karan Dixit]

China tightens rules on Muslims

http://www.upi.com/Top_News/2008/10/19/ ... 224437918/

[SSridhar]

Continuing with the above post, there seems to be a concerted move to expose China's religious curbs. IMO, the Chinese have perfectly understood Islam.

Wary of Islam, China tightens a vise of rules - NY Times

KHOTAN, China — The grand mosque that draws thousands of Muslims each week in this oasis town has all the usual trappings of piety: dusty wool carpets on which to kneel in prayer, a row of turbans and skullcaps for men without headwear, a wall niche facing the holy city of Mecca in the Arabian desert.

But large signs posted by the front door list edicts that are more Communist Party decrees than Koranic doctrines.

The imam’s sermon at Friday Prayer must run no longer than a half-hour, the rules say. Prayer in public areas outside the mosque is forbidden. Residents of Khotan are not allowed to worship at mosques outside of town.

One rule on the wall says that government workers and nonreligious people may not be “forced” to attend services at the mosque — a generous wording of a law that prohibits government workers and Communist Party members from going at all.

“Of course this makes people angry,” said a teacher in the mosque courtyard, who would give only a partial name, Muhammad, for fear of government retribution. “Excitable people think the government is wrong in what it does. They say that government officials who are Muslims should also be allowed to pray.”

To be a practicing Muslim in the vast autonomous region of northwestern China called Xinjiang is to live under an intricate series of laws and regulations intended to control the spread and practice of Islam, the predominant religion among the Uighurs, a Turkic people uneasy with Chinese rule.

The edicts touch on every facet of a Muslim’s way of life. Official versions of the Koran are the only legal ones. Imams may not teach the Koran in private, and studying Arabic is allowed only at special government schools.

Two of Islam’s five pillars — the sacred fasting month of Ramadan and the pilgrimage to Mecca called the hajj — are also carefully controlled. Students and government workers are compelled to eat during Ramadan, and the passports of Uighurs have been confiscated across Xinjiang to force them to join government-run hajj tours rather than travel illegally to Mecca on their own.

Government workers are not permitted to practice Islam, which means the slightest sign of devotion, a head scarf on a woman, for example, could lead to a firing.

The Chinese government, which is officially atheist, recognizes five religions — Islam, Protestantism, Catholicism, Taoism and Buddhism — and tightly regulates their administration and practice. Its oversight in Xinjiang, though, is especially vigilant because it worries about separatist activity in the region.

Some officials contend that insurgent groups in Xinjiang pose one of the biggest security threats to China, and the government says the “three forces” of separatism, terrorism and religious extremism threaten to destabilize the region. But outside scholars of Xinjiang and terrorism experts argue that heavy-handed tactics like the restrictions on Islam will only radicalize more Uighurs.

Many of the rules have been on the books for years, but some local governments in Xinjiang have publicly highlighted them in the past seven weeks by posting the laws on Web sites or hanging banners in towns.

Those moves coincided with Ramadan, which ran from September to early October, and came on the heels of a series of attacks in August that left at least 22 security officers and one civilian dead, according to official reports. The deadliest attack was a murky ambush in Kashgar that witnesses said involved men in police uniforms fighting each other.

The attacks were the biggest wave of violence in Xinjiang since the 1990s. In recent months, Wang Lequan, the long-serving party secretary of Xinjiang, and Nuer Baikeli, the chairman of the region, have given hard-line speeches indicating that a crackdown will soon begin.

Mr. Wang said the government was engaged in a “life or death” struggle in Xinjiang. Mr. Baikeli signaled that government control of religious activities would tighten, asserting that “the religious issue has been the barometer of stability in Xinjiang.”

Anti-China forces in the West and separatist forces are trying to carry out “illegal religious activities and agitate religious fever,” he said, and “the field of religion has become an increasingly important battlefield against enemies.”

Uighurs are the largest ethnic group in Xinjiang, accounting for 46 percent of the population of 19 million. Many say Han Chinese, the country’s dominant ethnic group, discriminate against them based on the most obvious differences between the groups: language and religion.

The Uighurs began adopting Sunni Islam in the 10th century, although patterns of belief vary widely, and the religion has enjoyed a surge of popularity after the harshest decades of Communist rule. According to government statistics, there are 24,000 mosques and 29,000 religious leaders in Xinjiang. Muslim piety is especially strong in old Silk Road towns in the south like Kashgar, Yarkand and Khotan.

Many Han Chinese see Islam as the root of social problems in Xinjiang.

“The Uighurs are lazy,” said a man who runs a construction business in Kashgar and would give only his last name, Zhao, because of the political delicacy of the topic.

“It’s because of their religion,” he said. “They spend so much time praying. What are they praying for?”

The government restrictions are posted inside mosques and elsewhere across Xinjiang. In particular, officials take great pains to publicize the law prohibiting Muslims from arranging their own trips for the hajj. Signs painted on mud-brick walls in the winding alleyways of old Kashgar warn against making illegal pilgrimages. A red banner hanging on a large mosque in the Uighur area of Urumqi, the regional capital, says, “Implement the policy of organized and planned pilgrimage; individual pilgrimage is forbidden.”

As dozens of worshipers streamed into the mosque for prayer on a recent evening, one Uighur man pointed to the sign and shook his head. “We didn’t write that,” he said in broken Chinese. “They wrote that.”

He turned his finger to a white neon sign above the building that simply said “mosque” in Arabic script. “We wrote that,” he said.

Like other Uighurs interviewed for this article, he agreed to speak on the condition that his name not be used for fear of retribution by the authorities.

The government gives various reasons for controlling the hajj. Officials say that the Saudi Arabian government is concerned about crowded conditions in Mecca that have led to fatal tramplings, and that Muslims who leave China on their own sometimes spend too much money on the pilgrimage.

Critics say the government is trying to restrict the movements of Uighurs and prevent them from coming into contact with other Muslims, fearing that such exchanges could build a pan-Islamic identity in Xinjiang.

About two years ago, the government began confiscating the passports of Uighurs across the region, angering many people here. Now virtually no Uighurs have passports, though they can apply for them for short trips. The new restriction has made life especially difficult for businessmen who travel to neighboring countries.

To get a passport to go on an official hajj tour or a business trip, applicants must leave a deposit of nearly $6,000.

One man in Kashgar said the imam at his mosque, who like all official imams is paid by the government, had recently been urging congregants to go to Mecca only with legal tours.

That is not easy for many Uighurs. The cost of an official trip is the equivalent of $3,700, and hefty bribes usually raise the price. Once a person files an application, the authorities do a background check into the family. If the applicant has children, the children must be old enough to be financially self-sufficient, and the applicant is required to show that he or she has substantial savings in the bank. Officials say these conditions ensure that a hajj trip will not leave the family impoverished.

Rules posted last year on the Xinjiang government’s Web site say the applicant must be 50 to 70 years old, “love the country and obey the law.”

The number of applicants far outnumbers the slots available each year, and the wait is at least a year. But the government has been raising the cap. Xinhua, the state news agency, reported that from 2006 to 2007, more than 3,100 Muslims from Xinjiang went on the official hajj, up from 2,000 the previous year.

One young Uighur man in Kashgar said his parents were pushing their children to get married soon so they could prove the children were financially independent, thus allowing them to qualify to go on the hajj. “Their greatest wish is to go to Mecca once,” the man, who wished to be identified only as Abdullah, said over dinner.

But the family has to weigh another factor: the father, now retired, was once a government employee and a Communist Party member, so he might very well lose his pension if he went on the hajj, Abdullah said.

The rules on fasting during Ramadan are just as strict. Several local governments began posting the regulations on their Web sites last month. They vary by town and county but include requiring restaurants to stay open during daylight hours and mandating that women not wear veils and men shave their beards.

Enforcement can be haphazard. In Kashgar, many Uighur restaurants remained closed during the fasting hours. “The religion is too strong in Kashgar,” said one man. “There are rules, but people don’t follow them.”

One rule that officials in some towns seem especially intent on enforcing is the ban on students’ fasting. Supporters of this policy say students need to eat to study properly.

The local university in Kashgar adheres to the policy. Starting last year, it tried to force students to eat during the day by prohibiting them from leaving campus in the evening to join their families in breaking the daily fast. Residents of Kashgar say the university locked the gates and put glass shards along the top of a campus wall.

After a few weeks, the school built a higher wall.

[svinayak]

Arunachal districts bordering China press for autonomy
http://www.hindu.com/2008/10/20/stories ... 970900.htm
Special Correspondent

Demand to pass autonomy Bill during current Parliament session

No basis for China’s claim over territory

Guwahati: The Mon Autonomous Region Demand Committee (MARDC) of Arunachal Pradesh on Sunday demanded that the Centre immediately act upon a resolution passed by the Arunachal Pradesh Assembly recommending creation of a Mon Autonomous Council comprising West Kameng and Tawang districts bordering China, under the provisions of the Sixth Schedule of the Constitution.
“Delhi Chalo” programme

MARDC chairman Tsona Gontse Rinpoche told journalists here that the committee decided to undertake a “Delhi Chalo” programme to mount pressure on the Centre for creation of the council, by passing the Bill in the current session of Parliament.

The Assembly passed a resolution in February 2004 recommending creation of two autonomous councils — one comprising Tawang and West Kameng districts in the western corner known as Mon region and another comprising Tirap and Changlang districts in the eastern corner known as Patkai region.

Rev. Rinpoche alleged that though the State government submitted clarifications and the justification for creation of the councils, there had been no response from the Union government.

The people of the Mon region — belonging to Monpa, Sherdukpen, Mizi (Sajolang), Aka (Hrusso), Bugun and Sartang tribes — intensified their movement for autonomy and organised a series of rallies at Kalaktang, Tawang, Nafra and Thirzino between October 6 and 18.

It was resolved during the rallies that in the Lok Sabha elections, the people of the region would support only those candidates and the party supporting their cause. The MARDC chairman hoped that since all the seven legislators from the region, including Chief Minister Dorjee Khandu, belong to the ruling Congress, the Mon-Autonomous Council Bill would be passed without much difficulty in Parliament.
Chief Minister in Delhi

Mr. Khandu and the PCC president have been camping in Delhi to impress upon the Central leaders the need to pass the Bill without further delay, he added.

Rev. Rinpoche represents the Lumla Assembly constituency in Tawang district as a Congress legislator.
No basis for China’s claim

To a question, he said there was no basis for China’s claim over Arunachal Pradesh’s territory, including Tawang.

[derkonig]

Rev. Rinpoche represents the Lumla Assembly constituency in Tawang district as a Congress legislator.

That explains all.

[renukb]

These are the examples of strategic blunders by Man Mohan Singh or the current UPA govt... What Nehru used to do, is continued by the ruling party in India... India's reluctance or negligience, has always helped China grow bigger. In order to please USA, the current govt is going to commit more blunders.

China may replace India in IPI project
http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=72 ... id=3510213

China may replace India in a multi-billion-dollar gas pipeline deal with Iran and Pakistan if New Delhi continues 'delaying' the venture.

Pakistan's Foreign Minister Shah Mahmood Qureshi said on Saturday that Pakistan could not delay the Iran-Pakistan-India (IPI) pipeline project any further due to its growing energy requirements.

"The IPI project can become the IPC (Iran-Pakistan- China) project or even if it is the IP (Iran-Pakistan) project, China can invest in it," he told reporters in Islamabad after Pakistani President Asif Ali Zardari's visit to China.

Qureshi added that the pipeline could feed energy-deficient areas in China bordering Pakistan.

China has not yet given any firm commitment on joining the $7.4 billion project, which has been delayed by repeated disputes over prices, transit fees and tensions between India and Pakistan.

Iran and Pakistan have agreed to finalize the deal bilaterally.
The US has also tried to persuade India into abandoning the project in order to put pressure on Iran over the country's nuclear program.

During Iranian Foreign Minister Manouchehr Mottaki's visit to Pakistan, the two countries agreed to finalize the deal even if India did not join the project.

"As we are not prepared to wait for the third partner, we will proceed bilaterally," Qureshi said.

"Iran and Pakistan will welcome India (whenever it chooses to join the project), but it has not reached the stage of making a decision," he said, adding that he would soon visit Tehran to finalize modalities for the venture.

[Neshant]

China may replace India in a multi-billion-dollar gas pipeline deal with Iran and Pakistan if New Delhi continues 'delaying' the venture.

Then why don't they? They would have built it by now if they needed it.

China does not need to go through pakistan and pay them a fee to get gas, it has direct access to Central Asia already. Secondly its population base is on the east many thousands of miles away, not the west.

There is no major credit-worthy customer for Iranian gas other than India. Shipping gas to Europe via tankers is not a viable proposition.

India is not going to jump into any deal unless the economic costs prove worth the financial and political risks. Oil prices have already been cut in half thereby reducing their bargaining power signficiantly.

[Avinash R]

Child virus kills 3, sickens 110 in east China
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gvVc ... AD93TUSV80
9 hours ago

BEIJING (AP) — Hand, foot and mouth disease has killed three children and sickened about 110 others in eastern China, state media reported.

The official Xinhua News Agency said late Sunday that all the cases were reported in Jian'ou city of Fujian province from October 1 to 17.

Citing a provincial health official, Xinhua said the children who died from the infectious disease were under a year old and came from different towns. Twenty-two of the infected children were still hospitalized for treatment, the report said.

The provincial government has sent eight epidemic prevention experts to the city to help local medical staff conduct citywide checks on children, Xinhua said.

Hand, foot and mouth disease is common in young children and is characterized by fever, mouth sores and a rash with blisters. It is spread by direct contact with nose and throat discharges, saliva, fluid from blisters, or the stool of infected persons. It is not related to foot and mouth disease, which infects cattle, sheep and swine.

In spring, the spread of the virus sickened more than 24,000 people and killed dozens across China before authorities reported a slowdown in infections in May in Anhui, the province where the outbreak was first reported.

Anhui was the worst-hit province with 26 deaths, and the outbreak was first reported there in March.

[Avinash R]

Taiwanese protesters attack Chinese envoy
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5iVy- ... AD93UP1T80

1 hour ago

TAIPEI, Taiwan - Pro-independence protesters in southern Taiwan pushed an envoy from rival China to the ground on Tuesday while shouting that their island does not belong to Beijing.

The attack on Vice Chairman Zhang Mingqing of the Association for Relations Across the Taiwan Strait was shown on television news broadcasts and comes amid improving relations between Beijing and Taipei under the administration of new Taiwanese President Ma Ying-jeou.

Ma was elected in March after promising to turn the corner on the pro-independence policies of predecessor Chen Shui-bian and seek expanded trade and political relations with China, from which Taiwan split amid civil war in 1949.

China continues to claim the island as part of its territory and has threatened to invade if it ever moves toward formal independence.

Pictures from Taiwan TV stations showed about a dozen protesters surrounding Zhang at a Tainan temple commemorating Confucius, then toppling him to the ground while shouting anti-communist and pro-independence slogans.

"Taiwan does not belong to China," protesters shouted.

Zhang was helped to his feet by an escort and rushed to a waiting vehicle. A middle-aged man stomped and banged on the vehicle but did not attempt to prevent it from leaving the scene.

"The presidential office expresses regrets over the incident and condemns the violence stirred up by a small number of people," said Wang Yu-chi, a spokesman for Ma.

The attack on Zhang comes several weeks before a planned visit by Chen Yun-lin, Zhang's boss and the point man in pushing for unity across the 100-mile-wide Taiwan Strait.

On Saturday, the main opposition Democratic Progressive Party is scheduled to hold a mass rally in Taipei to protest Ma's China policies, which include regular direct flights between the sides and liberalized conditions for Chinese investment on Taiwan.

Meanwhile, Ma predicted Tuesday before a group of high-ranking military officers that there will be no war with rival China during his four-year term as president.

"We should be able to reduce the threat (from China) and turn the enemy into a friend," Ma told the Taiwanese officers. "I am going to say boldly that there will be no war ... in the next four years."

Taiwan needs a strong defense to facilitate peaceful relations with China, Ma told the officers.

"We need to adopt a 'no unification, no independence, no use of force' strategy to create a peaceful environment," he said. "The military balance (between the two sides) is a necessary condition for peace."

The DPP says Ma's approach is undermining Taiwan's sovereignty and putting the island's de facto independence and its democratic political system at risk.

Ma says better trade relations with China are necessary to bring Taiwan closer into the international economy. He has promised not to discuss the issue of unity with the mainland during his presidency.

[Avinash R]

China releases list of wanted terror group leaders
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081021/ap_ ... iZXFes0NUE

By CHRISTOPHER BODEEN, Associated Press Writer – 1 hr 17 mins ago

BEIJING – Chinese police on Tuesday called on foreign nations to arrest and extradite eight alleged Islamic terror group leaders accused plotting attacks during the Beijing Olympics.

The eight men, all Chinese citizens, are believed to have financed, incited and organized a series of terrorist activities during and around the Aug. 8-24 games as part of an ongoing insurgency against Chinese rule in the country's traditionally Muslim west, said Public Security Ministry spokesman Wu Heping.

In brief comments during a news conference, Wu gave no information about the men's believed whereabouts, but called on foreign countries to arrest and extradite them to China to face justice.

The eight "seriously threatened the security of the Beijing Olympic Games and China's social stability, while at the same time composing a threat to the security and stability of relevant countries and the region," said Wu, who did not take any questions.

China hopes other governments will "further boost cooperation in the areas of exchanging intelligence information, extraditing and deporting terrorist criminal suspects, and severing sources of financing for terrorist activities," he said.

Activists based outside of China say none of the accusations has been confirmed and that officials were likely trying to justify a post-Olympic crackdown in the region.

The western region of Xinjiang was rocked in August by the worst violence seen in the area in years, with 33 people killed in a series of guerrilla style attacks and bombings. No group has taken responsibility for the attacks, although China has blamed the East Turkestan Islamic Movement, a murky collection of extremists believed to be based across the border in lawless areas of Pakistan and Afghanistan.

A news release issued at Wu's press conference offered basic biographical information about the men and vague claims about their alleged terrorist activities. Photographs of seven of the eight men were also included.

One man, 37-year-old Memetiming Memeti, was identified as the leader of ETIM. Others included 33-year-old university graduate Tuersun Toheti, a bomb maker accused of planning attacks on Chinese targets outside the country.

Xinjiang, a sprawling territory three times the size of France, is home to 9 million Uighurs (pronounced WEE'gurs), Turkic Muslims who posses a language, culture and religion distinct from China's Han majority. Like Tibetans, they have complained of a colonial-style Chinese presence on their territory, chafing under tight religious and cultural controls and complaining that economic development has disproportionately benefited Chinese migrants.

With the Olympics over and the world's focus elsewhere, Chinese authorities have been conducting a wide-ranging crackdown featuring mass arrests, according to Uighur activists based overseas.

Dilxat Raxit, spokesman for the Germany-based World Uighur Congress, said Tuesday's announcement was politically motivated, part of an attempt to provide legal cover for the government crackdown. China's refusal to publicly release evidence or allow an independent investigation into the recent attacks undercuts its accusations of terrorism, he said.

"I have never heard of these people and none of these accusations have been independently confirmed, but I'm sure they will use them to ratchet up pressure further in Xinjiang," Raxit said in a telephone interview.

[Avinash R]

"Sore and dizzy" China official cuts short Taiwan trip
Wed Oct 22, 2008 7:13am IST
http://in.reuters.com/article/worldNews ... 6820081022

TAIPEI (Reuters) - A Chinese official who was pushed to the ground by anti-China activists on a visit to Taiwan cut his trip short on Wednesday because he said he felt sore and dizzy.

Protesters attacked Zhang Mingqing, vice chairman of China's Association for Relations Across the Taiwan Straits, in the city of Tainan on Tuesday, leaving him lying on the ground, his glasses at his side, television pictures showed.

A day earlier, about 200 demonstrators used expletives, yelling for Zhang to return to China when he took the podium at the Tainan National University of the Arts.

China has claimed sovereignty over Taiwan since the end of the Chinese civil war in 1949 and has vowed to bring the island under its rule, by force if necessary.

"Why am I leaving early? The place where I was hurt is sore, and my head is a bit dizzy," Zhang told reporters as he packed for his mid-morning flight.

Only a few people were targeting him, he added.

"I don't think I should have brought (the police) so much trouble," he said, choking back tears.

Ties between China and Taiwan have improved since President Ma Ying-jeou came to power in Taiwan in May and China's top negotiator, Chen Yunlin, is expected to visit the island later this year for formal talks.

Zhang's association had written to its Taiwan counterpart to express its "strong indignation and severe condemnation" of the attack, China's official Xinhua news agency said on Tuesday.

"We are astonished at this," it cited the letter as saying.

[satya]

CHINA’S POLITICAL CONCLAVE - Some Uncomfortable Questions

By Bhaskar Roy

The recently concluded third plenary session of the 17th Central Committee of the Chinese Communist Party (CCP) (October 9-12) ended on a sober note. There was much to be celebrated – the successful holding of the summer Olympics where China topped the medal list, followed by the hosting of the Paraolympics and most important, the successful space walk by a Chinese astronaut, known as taikonaut, aboard the Shenzou VII space craft. These were mentioned, but other issues clouded the plenum.

The communiqué issued at the end of the plenum acknowledged a serious challenge facing the country that has been generally painted over till so far. It is the rural sector where the country’s 800 million of its 1.3 billion population live. Significantly, on the second day of the plenum i.e. October 10, the Shanghai Daily reproduced a section from the World Economic Forum’s (WEF) Global Competitive Report 2008-2009 which said western and north-eastern regions of China were lagging in development with wide spread absolute poverty, approximately 128 million people living on less than US $1 per day, without access to clean water or sufficient education and health care. In terms of efficiency enhancement, the report noted some serious shortcomings, with the financial sector ranked at 109 among the 131 countries surveyed.

The WEF report also noted positives for China. For example, it moved up four places to the 30th position in Global Competitiveness Index. But it was also noted that China’s remarkable showing in GDP ($3.3 trillion), foreign exchange reserves ($1.8 trillion), and high domestic savings “should not deemphasize the enormous challenges that face China is maintaining its competitiveness”.

It is known that such reports by international organizations are usually careful not to upset large countries, and China is about to step into the G8 + along with India. At the same time, an official newspaper under the control of the Shanghai government and party committee carrying such a report at a crucial time is certainly not routine.

In another development of note, the CCP mouthpiece, the People’s Daily, commented (September 28) that young professionals joining the system at high levels with proper ideological education and commitment had created a situation where young cadres were being corrupted, who would be used in th future in power politics and making money. The newspaper was quoting a party Central Committee report.

Another analytical report in the run up to the plenum suggested that erstwhile party General Secretary Jiang Zemin had brought in senior experts into the party fold to improve economic efficiency, but after he retired things began to go wrong.

These, and other reports could only suggest that problems within China are rising, and these developments appear to have opened up the otherwise dormant power struggle between Jiang Zeman’s Shanghai faction emphasizing on the coastal region, and Hu Jintao’s Communist Youth League (CYL) faction emphasizing on rural development. In March this year, Jiang Zemin had openly criticized the energy policy of Hu Jintao leadership, an issue extremely important for the industrialized coastal region of China. The differences seem to have become sharp enough to adversely affect the development and stability paradigm of the country.

The neo-liberal nexus of party officials – bureaucrats – business interests have worked only on profit motive, with corruption playing the role of the engine. This is exactly what the People’s Daily observed.

It is not surprising that the plenum basically concentrated on rural reform. Only small and selected news about the deliberations during the plenary meetings was released. The published plenum document, delivered by Hu Jintao, frankly admitted that “The country was facing challenges in its rural development and reform”, and promised to tackle the problems firmly. At the same time the document may have failed to inspire confidence among the people when it said “new concepts and ideas” would be worked out and the government would “try to make a breakthrough” in reforming the rural system. Efforts to uplift the situation include education, health care, employment, housing and pension sectors.

The only definite decision that came out of the session was doubling the per capita “disposable” income of rural residents by 2020 from the 2008 level. A big task, but China has delivered on even bigger promises in the past.

China’s vast rural regions suffered from years of neglect to build the country’s power show-room in the coastal region. Late paramount leader Deng Xiaoping had hoped that the development of the coastal areas would flow to the interior. This, unfortunately, did not happen. In fact, the urban real estate mafia in collusion with party officials, bureaucrats and the police almost literally robbed farmers and rural residents of their land. The government is moving to enact a compensation law to ensure that owners are paid fair compensation when the state takes over their land.

This year celebrates the 30th anniversary of late leader Deng Xiaoping’s declaration of the “reform and opening up” policy. Deng focussed on liberating the rural forces by breaking the commune policy finally and introducing the system where a farmer could lease land from the state and cultivate it. The farmers were given a partial free market for their produce. The rural sector started on a fast paced growth.

Unfortunately, further reform has come to a stop in China. This despite the promise of greater transparency and political and economic liberalization by Hu Jintao. Development has stagnated because without further political reform, economic reform would not be possible.

In the run up to the plenum there were discussions about allowing farmers to lease out their land to others for cultivation. The farmer may continue to work on the land or seek some other employment. It would depend on the agreement between the two parties. This, however, did not find a mention in the plenum report suggesting serious disagreements, and signalling opposition from hardliners in the Central Committee. This decision was apparently adopted by the Politburo after the plenum was over.

The review of the economic situation was not effusive, but guarded. The effect of the global financial meltdown on China’s economy was taken note of, but carefully in order not to raise panic. But immediately after the plenum, a Hong Kong owned toy factory which supplied to top international brands like Mattel, closed down, putting more than seven thousand workers out of jobs. China’s is basically an export driven economy, and it cannot escape global depressions.

Recently, China has suffered some battering over their quality control of its products. Three major incidents were discovery of toys that had harmful chemicals, harmful preservatives in exported preserved food stuff, and baby milk food contaminated with melamine. A lesser country’s export market could have been ruined, but it is in the interest of many to keep China afloat.

The dislocation between the Central government in Beijing, and the local governments has become acute. For the best part, laws and rules remain in the books. While social unrest has been growing, the CCP and the Central government have returned to the old ways of brushing problems under the carpet. Factional sniping has added to the problems.

China’s fortunes do affect the world in some way or the other. Serious political problems in the country is also reflected in its foreign policy. These are issues that countries involved with China economically, politically, and with territorial issues need to look out for.

[shyamd]

PRC has sent a team looking for eavesdropping devices, to its embassies in european capitals as well as others.

[Avinash R]

Tens of thousands of pro-independence Taiwanese protesters condemn China and accuse President Ma Ying-jeou of failing to stand up to Beijing and then Taiwan President condemns China’s businessmen over adulterated goods

[Avinash R]

China should free dissident Hu Jia
http://www.latimes.com/news/printeditio ... 5820.story

Jailed before the Summer Olympics, he's been awarded a human rights prize.
October 25, 2008

China threw the world a spectacular party in August, and yet, to the apparent surprise and dismay of Chinese officials, the guests still don't seem all that grateful to their host.

On Thursday, the European Parliament awarded its top human-rights prize to an ailing Chinese activist who was jailed shortly before the Summer Olympic Games in Beijing. His crime: embarrassing his country's leaders by pointing out their routine torture, imprisonment and harassment of political dissidents. That's dangerous in China at any time, but especially so when the nation is on the verge of making a giant international splash (except in the diving events).

The European Union's decision to award its Sakharov Prize to activist Hu Jia, despite an intense pressure campaign from Beijing, "violates universally recognized rules in the world, which is countries should treat each other as equals and respect each other," complained Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Liu Jianchao.

Apparently we missed that page of the international rule book. We do recall Article 19 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, though. That's the portion of the United Nations' seminal 1948 document that states: "Everyone has the right to freedom of opinion and expression; this right includes freedom to hold opinions without interference and to seek, receive and impart information and ideas through any media and regardless of frontiers."

Hu, 35, may be China's highest-profile dissident since Wei Jingsheng, who was deported to the United States a decade ago (and who also won the Sakharov Prize, in 1996). After founding an organization that cares for AIDS orphans, Hu began chronicling government abuses on the Internet and contacting foreign journalists; the result was an escalating campaign of harassment by the police. The last straw may have come when, in September 2007, he coauthored “The Real China and the Olympics,” an open letter that described mass evictions to make way for stadium construction, imprisonment of journalists, Internet censorship, religious repression and other human rights violations, and showed China to be deeply unsuitable as an Olympic host. He was arrested in December and sentenced to 3 1/2 years in prison in April after a one-day trial. He is in poor health, and unless he's granted medical parole, he may not survive his detention.

If Chinese leaders are tired of all the international attention being given to Hu, there's a better solution than high dudgeon from the Foreign Ministry: They could set him free.

[Avinash R]

China has no right to demand Taiwan to discipline its official

'Unwell,' teary Zhang returns to China

[Avinash R]

China to halt any planned Taiwan visits by its officials and experts
Taiwan News, Website Editorial Staff
http://www.etaiwannews.com/etn/news_con ... ?id=784410

2008-11-09 04:46 PM

TAIPEI (Taiwan News) - After Chen returned to China after a five-day Taiwan visit, which caused serious social instability in Taiwan, a number of rumors have begun to circulate this morning that the Information Office of China's State Council has issued a document halting any planned Taiwan visits by Chinese government's ministerial-level officials due to a series of rowdy street "anti-China" demonstrations during China's Association for Relations Across the Taiwan Strait (ARATS) Chairman Chen Yunlin's (???) five-day Taiwan visit last week.

According to some reports, a managing deputy mayor of the Chongqing Municipal People's Government, which is the only municipality directly under the central government in western China, was scheduled to visit Taiwan in two days, but the visit has been canceled by China's State Council, which said that the upcoming visit might raise new worries of the increased tensions between Taiwanese public and Chinese officials.

Reports wrote that having read China's plan to stop Chinese officials and experts to visit Taiwan, many people across the Taiwan Strait found the cancellation very worrisome. They said that it would inevitably affect the number of Chinese tourists to visit Taiwan, which would be a disadvantage to Taiwan's economic development. Even though Chen said "I promise you that your trip to China will be harmonious and smooth" as he prepared to leave Taiwan for China, China's decision might result in a temporary halt to Taiwan's tourist industry.

Many are speculating as to what the main reason causing the Chinese government to ban its officials from visiting Taiwan. A China-based insider said that China has now been wary of any increase in cross-strait tensions, so it has decided to avoid inciting Taiwanese people's anti-China nationalist sentiment at this point in time.

Taiwan's Mainland Affairs Council (MAC) officials responded to China's decision by calling on the opposition Democratic Progressive Party (DPP) to let the MAC know about its appeals. The MAC said that only in this way could the MAC know what to respond to China's moves.

Prior to mass "anti-China" demonstrations during Chen's five-day Taiwan visit, ARATS Vice Chairman Zhang Mingqing (???) was jostled down on the floor amidst scuffles in front of the Confucius Temple on Oct. 21 in Tainan City. Nevertheless, the MAC officials stated that prior to the aforementioned two major "anti-China" incidents, there was no worry for Chinese government officials to visit Taiwan.

For example, ARATS Deputy Chairman Wang Zaixi (???) came to Taiwan to attend the 13th annual symposium on Chinese modernization held on July 7 in Taipei. The MAC said that Wang was able to travel freely in many cities and counties in Taiwan, and he even had a slip of the tongue during his Taiwan visit by saying something that might irritate Taiwanese people, but nothing happened, neither protests nor scuffles.

Despite the negative impact on cross-strait relations brought by the meeting between President Ma Ying-jeou (???) and Chen, the Taiwanese government insisted that the meeting was carried out successfully and the SEF denied that it was to blame for the violent protests during Chen's Taiwan visit.

The two quasi-official organizations, SEF and ARATS, are supposed to be in charge of helping "normalize" cross-strait relations, but the weak administration under Ma's direction showed that it is incompetent to lead its 23 million people, nor thaw of the cross-strait relations efficiently.

[kunal anand]

http://www.ndtv.com/convergence/ndtv/st ... 0080072220

[Rony]

A SINO-INDIAN PERSPECTIVE FOR INDIA-CHINA UNDERSTANDING

There is a chinese equivalent of AIT, but the chinese have refuted it in their own way. Its not a bad thing for the Indian historians to look into it.

These details serve the Chinese historians to refute the earlier international premise that Chinese civilization originated from Central Asia. I wonder whether Indian historians would like to do the same. But, even without touching the contentious points about the Aryans and Dravidians it may not be out of order to treat the Indian civilization essentially as a continuous indigenous growth, no matter how much external influence it has absorbed into its cultural fabrics.

The Chinese Dragon originated from the Indian Nagaraja

Some Indian Buddhist monks, like Vajrabodhi and Amoghavajra etc., demonstrated such a power by playing with the symbol of NagalDragon. We have records of Indian monks presiding over imperial rain-invoking ceremonies when China was visited by severe drought in the years 366, 726, 772 and 889, the last occurred in independent Yunnan -the state of Nanzhao.2 Both India and China were agrocultures (I have coined the term to replace the tongue-twister "agricultural culture") for which rain-fall assumed great importance. The imaginary powerful NagamjalDragon symbol definitely had a connection with it.

But the premise that the Chinese Dragon has an Indian connection is difficult for the chinese to digest because of all familiar loss of pride thing.

have taken this proposition of Naga-Long twinhood to the academic fora both in China and in Taiwan, and have encountered violent opposition. My opponents argued that Long had had its independent existence for five-six thousand years, that China was always the Homeland of Dragon, and the Chinese were famous for being the "Progenies of Dragon" {Long de chuanren). Even the idea of a part of the social functions of the dragon symbol might originate from India was unacceptable because it hurt the Chinese pride in their thousand years of affinity with Long. This, in a way, underlines the daunting task of popularizing the Sino-Indian perspective among Chinese (and also Indian) scholars while studying the history and culture of India and China

The mystification of the supernatural power of snake in India and Long in China was the product of agriculture of both the countries. While we don't have concrete evidence for the Indian input in the imagination of the pre. Buddhist Chinese Long, we certainly can trace the Indian influence on the Buddhist (and post Buddhist, if you wish) Chinese Long. For one thing, the artifacts that symbolize Long created in pre-Buddhist China are by and large free from the fierce look that typifies the Buddhist Long (like the Chinese say, "zhangya wuzhua", i.e. baring its teeth and waving its claws) which clearly demonstrate the inner social function of LonglDragon as the guardian of the imperial system. It is in this function that we clearly see the Indian contribution.

Another clear Chinese borrowing from India is the "Dragon-King" (Longwang) from the Indian Nagaraja.

We are in a position to say that Indians were among the earliest foreigners to know about the Chinese silk, and also to engage in its international trade long before the famous "Silk Road" between Luoyang and Rome became a thriving international phenomenon. The first foreign words for Chinese silk were "cinamsuka" (Chinese silk dress) and "cinapatta" (Chinese silk bundle) enshrined in Kautilya's Arthasastra which goes back to the 4th century BC

When Yunnan was annexed into the Han Empire in the 1st century AD, the Chinese authorities found that among the foreign settlers there was an Indian community named "Shendu" (perhaps a corruption of "Hindu") that was "Indians" or "India." But, the Chinese knowledge about "Shendu" went back to as early as the pre-Han days (3rd century BC) according to some ficticious historical accounts. India also loomed large in the broad rubric "xiyu" (western regions), because if we glean the data from all early Chinese narratives about Xiyu, we definitely find the depictions of India. Another ambiguous rubric is "Daqin" which was connected with India in two ways. First, India was trading with "Daqin" (denoting Roman Empire) on the sea. Second, ancient Chinese confused Europe with India and other far-away lands which they had had contacts through the sea. For instance, the Chinese records attributed elephant-teeth and rhinoceros as products of Daqin (while these were clearly Indian specialities not produced in Europe). Thus when the Han records say that Daqin was keenly interested in Chinese silk it actually indicated a triangular route of the Chinese export of silk reaching India, and also Europe via India. In 166 AD, the Chinese recorded the arrival of an embassy probably sent by the Roman Emperor, Mareus Aurelius Antonius, in the Han court. The Roman embassy arrived by sea and landed somewhere near the present Guangdong Province in southern China, and journeyed to the Han capital, Luoyang, by road. The embassy made a present to the Chinese emperor which contained ivory, rhinceros' hom (a precious ingredient for Chinese medicine) and the shell of haw"sbill turtle, all products of India

In Chinese historical and semi-historical documents: there are places called "Shang Tianzhu", "Zhong Tianzhu", and "Xia Tianzhu" which literally mean, "Upper India", "Middle India", and "Lower India". These three names actually indicate just a few square kilometres in Hangzhou City in Zhejiang Province in eastern China. How has such a mix-up come about? It is because of a legend that was the making of an ancient Indian Buddhist monk-scholar "Huili" (whose real identity is lost). In 326, this monk from western India came to Hangzhou. After seeing a hill in this area (in the vicinity of the scenic West Lake), he authoritatively proclaimed that the hill had been flown to China from Magadha (Bihar)! The Chinese believed him and, henceforth, called the hill "Tianzhushan"(the "Indian Hill") and "Feilaifeng"(the "Peak that has flown here from India").8 It was this legend that has contributed to the existence of "Upper" , "Middle" and "Lower" India on the Chinese map.

It {urns out that though India invented Buddhism she benefited much less from this invention as compared with China. For Buddhism, it had a horizontal development, and for some time it was as if all the roads were leading to China -eminent monk-scholars, scriptures, artifacts, and legends. To the Chinese, the four great Buddhist Bodhisattvas (as alluded to just now) had left India for good, but not the Buddha. No Chinese account, however daring, has the audacity to claim that Buddha is no longer residing In India. Indian mythology, i.e. the Tantric traditions, however, reached a very daring and pro-China conclusion proclaiming China as the country where the true Buddha lives. The Tantric literature Taratantra in the section entitled "Rudrayamala", described an Indian ascetic, Vasistha, having failed to obtain siddhi (divine power) in India, travelled to China -the "land of Atharvaveda" where he saw Buddha having an indulgence in meat, wine and women. Vasistha emulated such behaviours of Buddha and "attained final liberation",

Did the concept of 'middle kingdom' also came from India ?

According to a recent study the term "Zhongguo" (now the Chinese name for "China") appeared 178 times in all written documents before China's unification in 221 BC. "Guo" in the bisyllable denoted "country", or "state", while the other syllable "zhong" denoting "centre", (This has given rise to the international term "Middle Kingdom", and also the international stigma of "sinocentrism".) But, politically China was not one state when these terms appeared. A detailed investigation of these 178 concepts proves that they mean different things in various contexts, and were anything but the suggestion that China lay in the centre of the universe. One scholar felt that "zhongguo" arrived as a symbol of a kind of unity in diversity,11 This shows clearly that the progenies of the Ramapithecus north of the Himalaya started an endeavour in the hinterland of present China to build up a commonwealth sharing a common cultural development, Such a commonwealth would not exclude communities from various directions who might not be the direct descendants of the trans-Himalayan Ramapithecus. It can be said that in ancient India, the same movement towards establishing a commonwealth was in action culminating in the establishment of the Maurya and Gupta empires.

Here, Daoxuan was citing the ancient Indiar) signification of "Madhyadesa" for Magadha. That he had no hesitation in transposing the Chinese term "Zhongguo" (Central state) to Magadha, the heartland of Buddhist India (in modern Bihar) may indicate his absolute loyalty to Buddha, but also indirectly reflects the open-mindedness among Chinese intellectuals of his times. He, further, in the same text, cited a debate taken place in the court of Emperor Wen of Song (reigning from 424 to 453 AD), In the presence of the emperor, Buddhist monk-scholar Huiyan out-smarted learned scholar He Chengtian by saying that in summer in India there was no shadow which proved that India was the real "zhongguo", The emperor was pleased to hear that and offered an appointment to the monk.13 Once again, it was the Chinese ruler's being convinced, (in this case, that India, not China, was the central state and lay at the centre of the earth) that should be noted than monk Hulyan's going overboard to compliment India

We notice that Shijia Fangzhi was a famous Chinese book penned in "High Tang", i.e. when Tang Dynasty attained highest power and prosperity, while Tang Dynasty 1s generally regarded as the "golden period" of China's cultural development. During such a period, Chinese Buddhist writers, Daoxuan and many others, used the term "Zhongguo" only to signify India, while calling China "Dong tu" (Eastern Land). In non-Buddhist literature during Tang one seldom comes across (if ever) the teim "Zhongguo" -and denoting China. But, terms like "Tianzhu" (Heavenly India), and "Xitian" ("Western Heaven" also denoting India), are replete in Tang literature

Dharma" was initially translated into "Dao" in Chinese, and stories about Gautama Buddha's being the reincarnation of Laozi14 were circulated widely which were tacitly accepted by the early Chinese Buddhists for the sake of integration of the Indian religion into Chinese mainstream culture.

China has, thus, imported the concept of "equality" (pingdeng) not from the French Revolution (as it was generally believed), but from India (from the Buddhist movement).

After saying all this, the author goes in a tangent

Finally, we have a picture of not more Indian cultural influence on China, but more Chinese pro-active input to synthesize the two great civilizations. Returning to Pannikkar's observation about Indian Buddhist preachers' arriving in China "to influence and not to be influenced", the actual picture is that they, eminent among them like Kumarajiva, Bodhidharma, Amoghavajra etc., had taken China as their own country and tried to build the Tusita utopia on her soil. In contrast no Chinese Buddhist monks participated in such extraordinary altruistic international synergy (in India), hence the creation of the asymmetry. It is clear here that the two civilizations had decided to experiment cultural synergy only on Chinese soil -to marry Mahayana universalism in the mind with Chinese universalism on the ground. To conceive this Sino-Indian joint venture as a one-way traffic is out of order.

The Taiping rebellion has also has the Indian cultural input

The scholar was Hong Xiuquan (also spelled as Hung Hsiu-Ch'uan) (1819-1864), a drop-out from the Imperial Examination System (Keju) who led millions of peasants of south China to arms and established an ephemeral rebel regime named "Taiping Tianguo" (The Celestial Kingdom of Taiping). As I have written elsewhere, this Taiping Movement had many Indian cultural input in it.25 I may just add here that though the Taiping regime was revolutionary, it still circulated Confucian classics with slight modifications.

The chinese authors have far more clearer perspective on India's cultural heritage than Indian marxist historians have.

It must be pointed out that although the second millennium ushered in many centuries of Islamic domination to be followed by a Christian-Western domination in the last three hundred years in India, we still should treat India as a country of Buddhist and Brahmanic cultures

For more than a thousand years Chinese have been celebrating two festivals in the new year, one on the first day of the first month, and another 15 days later because Chinese learnt that in the "country of Buddha", i.e. India, the month commenced on the full moon which was half a month later than the Chinese practice. And the mode of celebration of the second festival (called "lantern festival") is the imitation of Diwali.

While Buddha has assumed the highest position among all foreign gods in China, the highest native Chinese god, the Jade Emperor (yuhuang dadl) is the duplication of Indra. Bodhidharma (in China from 520? to 536? till his death} took a seat directly in the Chinese heaven after his demise. The Chinese pantheon, in fact, is crowded with Indian personalities. China has the dubious honour of having the maximum numbers (numbering thousands} of Buddhas. According to Chinese oral literature, even the Indian monkey Hanuman (Chinese name "Sun Wukong"} is a Buddha with the title of "Ever Victorious Buddha in Fighting" (Douzhansheng FO}

[sklow]

Hmm, I sense some inferiority complex here, trying to claim credit to Chinese achievement like as if Chinese can claim Einstein’s achievement just because we invented paper. And “research” coming from an Indophile Indian-Chinese from India. How convincing. I even heard India invented the cure for all diseases drinking the holy yellow cow liquid during the Vedic times which was a couple of billion years ago before the galaxies were formed. Btw, Most of his arguments were hypothetical and based on similar sounding names, with no historical evidence? So let’s say Chinese had a sauce named cirri and Indian had Curry, we invented curry?

Well, for your understanding, early Chinese tribes had a few totems, including, bear, snake and the dragon most likely derived from the Chinese alligator found in the Chang Jiang river. The strongest tribe with the dragon totem won and conquered other tribes and hence the totem of the dragon was taken to represent the Chinese. Later on, additional features were added to the dragon including deer antlers and scales and also the 5 claws, an amalgamation of the different attributes of different animals found in China like the snake, alligator, eagle and deer. Well, the totem was a pride as it symbolizes our earliest existence as a nation, which was the tribe that won. It is said that the bear totem symbolizes the Koreans/Manchurians that lost in that war and moved north.

Basically dragon is a mythical animal which is revered by the Chinese while naga is a half-man, half snake deity that is negatively portrayed. Does this look like a “Long” to you? Indian contribution? You mean the naked man?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Indi ... 40_001.jpg

Another thing, there were no INDIANS prior to INDIA being incorporated by the British. INDIANS are not an ethnic race for god’s sake. So how the xxx did they find INDIANS in Yunnan? Just because Shendu sounds like Hindu and Hindu sounds like Yindoo? Prior to English, we don’t even have a concept of INDIA, we call the subcontinent by their Kingdom names individually. There is no single name for INDIA as it was never a unified entity. Tianzhu is a place where Budhism came from, most likely Lumbini in Nepal, so when the monks went to Nalanda to learn and exchange Buddhist ideas, they thought they were in Lumbini.

Technically Chinese means HAN and we are a race since the foundation of the Han dynasty tracing lineage to the Huaxia tribe in Zhong Yuan or Central Plains, later on becoming Zhong Guo or Central Kingdom. We are also known as Jiu Zhou or nine states signifying the unification of the nine states in the Central Plains.

How convenient isn’t it to claim everything Chinese to be Indian, like how we popularize Kung Fu and suddenly it came from India? Please read the history of Wu Shu (martial arts) in China. There is no such thing as Kung Fu in China. Kung Fu means skills in Chinese and when the Cantonese travelled to the West they ******** it by calling it Kung Fu. As the name implies, Wu Shu means martial arts and it was developed by the early Chinese military to train their armies and strengthen the populace or local militias against barbaric invasion. Later on, different family armies, basically armies consisting of related people with same surname developed different fighting techniques and pass it down to only their own family members. When Budhism came, some of these fighting techniques were used by Buddhist monks who were ex-military men (most felt ashamed of killing so many people) themselves. Bodhisattva the founder of Shaolin also brought some exercise techniques to Shaolin and it was later refined and amalgamated with the earlier fighting techniques to become Shaolin Kung Fu. Shaolin Kung Fu is a branch of Wu Shu and there are basically a few hundred fighting techniques in China.

“Sivapithecus or Ramapithecus is a genus of extinct primates. Fossil remains of animals now assigned to this genus, dated from 12.5 million to 8.5 million years old in the Miocene, have been found since the 19th century in the Siwalik Hills in what is now India and Pakistan. Any one of the species in this genus may have been the ancestor to the modern orangutans. “

Damn, now we are monkeys from India, what happened to the out of Africa theory?

And Mr. Hung of the Taiping rebellion actually thought he was Jesus brother not Buddha due to the early missionary works in China. Read the Taiping rebellion for more information.

You do know Sun Wo Kung is a fictional character from a novel right? And Long Wang the Sea Dragon king is a character from the same novel. All Chinese kids know this! And Sun Wo Kung was not a god in the novel, he was a monkey demon turned goodie good after learning the truth from Buddhism. The novel was written a couple hundred years after the travel of Fa Hsien to Nalanda.

[sklow]

Firstly Saar,

You must know the difference between religion, teaching/philosophy and culture. Religion is an organized form of belief while teaching is a way of thinking. Religion might influence the way a person thinks but teaching and philosophy is not a religion. It’s how we understand different concepts in life. Culture is the way humans live, from clothing to music. Budhism is a philosophy and teaching in its original form, with a symbol of chakra signifying the cycle of life whereas Hinduism is a religion with a pantheon of idols. There is a reason why Budhism was nearly wiped out from India.

Being as Buddhist myself, I am Chinese in essence but I view things in a different way like living in moderation and respecting life. But I don’t practice Indian culture like eating with my bare hands nor speaking Hindi which by the way is a Turkic-Persian dialect. Budhism is a teaching developed by an Indian prince, but that doesn’t mean I am Indian when I understand his teaching. Also another reason why I cannot claim Persian nor Armenian as Chinese colonies just because a certain Chinese Royal house founded a kingdom there or the Persian Imperial house being controlled by a Chinese Prince.

I have to agree that Budhism had influenced Chinese Civilization just as how Iranian, Middle Eastern and Central Asian Cultures had, and the exchanges had been mutual, the Chinese contributing more on cultural lifestyles rather than philosophy/religion which had always been an Indian/Middle-Eastern forte. This can be explained by the ability of Indians and Jews to bullshit better and becoming “IT Consultants” and Chinese/Japanese/Koreans being more industrious, developing industries and manufacturing. Of course, talking too much and doing nothing can be a negative attribute as seen in India.

But this does not mean Chinese Civilization is derived from Budhism, it’s merely a component in Chinese Civilization. We basically absorbed Budhism as how we absorbed others and enriched our culture and understanding of humanity. There is a difference between let’s say Cambodia and China, they didn’t have an indigenous civilization in the first place and Hinduism became their basis of a civilization. Chinese civilization is just as old as the Indus one, so when Buddhism came, it was assimilated into Chinese Civilization as the ideals and philosophy was familiar to the Chinese. Hence, it coexisted harmoniously with Taoism. For a civilization to prosper, it has to keep on assimilating other ideals to enrich itself as seen in the Western model. That’s the reason why China is the oldest continuous civilization.

Furthermore, Buddhism’s development didn’t take place in India alone; it was developed further in SEA and China and transmitted back to India to be shared by everyone. That’s the beauty of Budhism as a teaching that doesn’t distinguish race and caste and is universal. As in the case of China, a lot of Buddhist art and culture is developed in China by Buddhist monks rather than from India. For example the stupa in its raw primitive state developed into the pagoda a more refined beautiful architecture. Block printing although developed earlier was propagated by Buddhist monks printing Buddhist texts. And another branch of wushu was developed by Buddhist monks into Shao Lin Kung Fu to defend themselves against persecution.

Confucianism on the other hand is not a religion but a philosophy practiced by the Chinese. The foundation for the Chinese civilization is not a religious one unlike in India where it is founded on Hinduism. Chinese civilization had never been spiritual in essence but more on the form of political governance and legitimacy. We control the population based on how we provide for the people, (Mandate of Heaven) rather than the Indian form of devaraja, where the people are brainwashed to believe that they are serfs for the kings due to divine reasons. Hinduism (original form from Iran/Middle East) became the perfect tool to control the uneducated population and also to protect the interest of the minority Brahman class who are the offspring between darker skinned Dravidian (Australian Aborigine like people, proto-Tamil) women and invading Aryan men from Iran. This is due to the fact that the majority of the population in India at that time was Dravidian and to provide legitimacy to rule the majority, the Brahman class had to use Hinduism (caste system). Modern day India currently consists of mixed (Dravidian + Aryan) offspring and around 30% Dravidian mostly in Southern India. That also explains why latter day Persians can easily rule the local populace due to their fair skin and local reverence.

This political culture can still be observed in India and China today. Once the people are not provided the basic living requirements, people rebel in China and form the Communist state or in olden times overthrow the current dynasty. However in India, where the people are living in maybe a worse condition than China, the people are not revolting at the scale seen in China, most probably due to the cultural caste system where they think it’s their divine retribution to be poor and starving leading to early Westerners calling the Indians the “Happy Poor”. Again a civilization based on religion rather than secular structures. This also explains the success of Confucian states like Taiwan, Japan, Singapore and Korea to the Indic influenced states of Nepal, Sri-Lanka and other poor South Asian states.

Now, the ultimate question, so what is Budhism? Why it was nearly wiped out from India? Why the Chinese didn’t admire Hinduism instead they admired Budhism? What are the differences?

[Rahul M]

I wonder who actually has the complex given that you are discussing (or dissing more like) India in a thread meant to discuss "PRC Political News & Discussions", that too with pushing misinformation as fact. let me tell you that virtually everything you have typed about India is false. coupled with the racist comments you have made, this strikes you down as an extremely bigoted and narrow-minded individual.

anyway, this is not the place to discuss it. Find a better thread next time.

edit: Rony, this was not the correct place for that article.

[svinayak]

Hinduism (original form from Iran/Middle East) became the perfect tool to control the uneducated population and also to protect the interest of the minority Brahman class who are the offspring between darker skinned Dravidian (Australian Aborigine like people, proto-Tamil) women and invading Aryan men from Iran. This is due to the fact that the majority of the population in India at that time was Dravidian and to provide legitimacy to rule the majority, the Brahman class had to use Hinduism (caste system). Modern day India currently consists of mixed (Dravidian + Aryan) offspring and around 30% Dravidian mostly in Southern India. That also explains why latter day Persians can easily rule the local populace due to their fair skin and local reverence.

These are outside the facts. Get your facts correctly to discuss issues.

[vsudhir]

Panda in China zoo bites student who wanted a hug

[Arya Sumantra]

India is being overcautious on Tibet: Dalai

[Malayappan]

China: Strategic Experts Talk About a 'Partial' Sino - Indian War by D. S. Rajan
Paper no. 2939 24-Nov-2008
http://www.southasiaanalysis.org/%5Cpap ... r2939.html

Some comments in China media as monitored by the Chennai Centre for China Studies, Chennai.

Worth a read! There are plenty of nuggets worth noting so I refrain from posting select quotes!

[Malayappan]

When Great Leap Forward failed, Aksai Chin and NEFA attacks happened.

If the economic crisis hits China harder than India raising possibilities of India overtaking it, will there be some action? Can it be spotted early if Intelligence energies are focused on things like Pragya Thakur and Hindu Terrorism?

[Arun_S]

Chinese press will crush all voices with its loving embrace, because Panda is so loving and its mission so protective of the world.

China angrily dismisses US congressional report

BEIJING, Nov 22 (AFP) Nov 22, 2008
China reacted angrily Saturday to a US congressional report that accused Beijing of developing sophisticated cyber warfare and militarising its space programme.

The annual China report to Congress of the US-China Economic and Security Review Commission was aimed at misleading the public and impeding bilateral cooperation, foreign ministry spokesman Qin Gang said.

"The commission has all along seen China through dark glasses and has deliberately attacked China with slanderous accusations aimed at misleading public opinion and obstructing the development of Sino-US relations," Qin said.

"The report is unworthy of rebuttal and the aims of the commission are doomed to failure," he said in a statement on his ministry's website.

The report issued in Washington Thursday accused China of developing a sophisticated cyber warfare programme aimed at penetrating US computer networks to extract sensitive information.

"China has an active cyber espionage programme," the report said.

"China is targeting US government and commercial computers."

The panel also criticised Beijing of exercising "heavy-handed government control" over its economy and "continuing arms sales and military support to rogue regimes" such as Sudan, Myanmar and Iran.

The commission also issued a warning about China's space programme. "China continues to make significant progress in developing space capabilities, many of which easily translate to enhanced military capacity," it said.

Qin urged the commission to stop issuing such reports and refrain from interfering in China's internal affairs.

[yogi]

Did Britain just sell tibet?

Apparently Britain asks for money from China to resolve its financial crisis. China puts pressure on Britain to trackback on its treaties with tibet in early 1900's. This will be catastrophic to India's agreement with Tibet on AP border.

[ramana]

China: Strategic Experts Talk About a 'Partial' Sino - Indian War by D. S. Rajan
Paper no. 2939 24-Nov-2008
http://www.southasiaanalysis.org/%5Cpap ... r2939.html

Some comments in China media as monitored by the Chennai Centre for China Studies, Chennai.

Worth a read! There are plenty of nuggets worth noting so I refrain from posting select quotes!

Could become this story!

Panda in China zoo bites student who wanted a hug

[brihaspati]

Sklow,

(1) as far as I know only one peasant revolution was successful in overthrowing the pre-existing regime - all the others were brutally suppressed until essentially peasant revolution used by the CCP under Mao+ChuTeh (I think their first operational base in this line of combat was in the Chingkangshan mountains after abandoning the "city-based" uprising directive of the Comintern at Changsha).

(2) Aryan+Dravidian theory has very nearly been abandoned even by the strongest proponents in India and the West. The very categories are problematic now in the face of archaeological and genetic evidence - especially since the genetic evidence points to little inflow from central Asia/Iranian plateau after around 4000 BCE - highly problematic since all these fair skinned dominants are supposed to have come long after the Indus Valley civilization, either helping to destroy it or appearing after it was already destroyed - and therefore after or around 2000 BCE. Moreover genetic evidence points to consolidation of strictly endogamous classifications within South Indian society before 6000 BCE and that these classifications appear to be still respected in the "caste system" of the South.

(3) Buddhism continued to flourish in India until the final overrunning of the Indo-Gangetic plain by Muhammad Ghori. In spite of all propaganda about Hindu intolerance of Buddhism, we find that up to the invasions of Ghori, North India was still being dominated by powerful kings patronizing Buddhism and Jainism - one of the many indications being the flourishing university towns of Odantapuri and Nalanda - completely deliberately destroyed by the Muslim armies. However, the strongest rates of conversion to Islam appear to have been in the extensive Buddhist heartlands of central Asia and pockets in Northern and Eastern India - isnt it strange that the caste-repressed Hindu was less eager than the liberated Buddhist?

Please look at realpolitik - it was after all about not being prepared to wage a war to defend one's culture and civilization, that wiped Buddhism out where it came before Jihadi Islam, including in India. The CCP that declared "idols" to have "clay feet" was gushing in favour of Islam to gain the support of Muslim tribesmen of North-Western China - again realpolitik. In the future too, Buddhism, or Confucianism, or Islam, or Communism - all combinations of religions, philosophies, and cultures (they are never completely separate and they overlap) will characterize Chinese policy and behaviour only as far as they are going to be useful for its traditional concerns of international markets, access to warm water oceans and the tropics, and keeping imperialist control over Central Asia.

[Yogi_G]

Panda in China zoo bites student who wanted a hug

Saary...the news headline couldnt help but strike this thought in my head....sorry am like that onleeee

Panda = China
Student = India
Hug = Sincerity from Panda

Student will very well get bitten in leg if we run towards the Panda expecting a hug....

[Rony]

Chinese Perspectives on a Rising India

[vsudhir]

SPengler in atimes on PRC's diabolical plan to use pianists to takeover the global elite!

Read on ....

China’s six-to-one advantage over the US

What Spengler misses though is that America's chief attraction is that its supposed freedoms are fundamental and not the the temporaryt magnanimity of the government of the day. Which is why globally, talent and capital always find it a li'l bit more cosy in NY than in Shanghai. Just my 2 paise only.

The intellectual shift to the east underway has my full appaluse. Time for us eastern peoples to reclaim our civilizational narrative - written by us from our POV for our future generations to read, ponder and wonder over.

[shyamd]

Bitter enemies in the past, Chinese and Vietnamese intelligence agencies have joined ranks against Chinese criminals in Indochina who are often of Taiwanese origin and considered to act as an unofficial foreign intelligence-gathering arm of Taipei. Beijing and Hanoi are also jointly manning a string of old Soviet signals intelligence centers, among them the SIGINT station at Hop Sau in Laos which covers the South China Sea, the straits of Malacca and the Indian Ocean.

[brihaspati]

I thought Vietnam and China were usually great friends - for example in removing the Pol Pot regime in Kampuchea! They have had their highs and lows - but they wre never truly bitter enemies - the relative military strength and their mutual usefulness to each other is simply too strong a factor to ignore. Ii is a serious issue -for India has neglected the Indian Ocean rim countries of South Est Asia. China does have a strong strategic interest in connecting up with the Islamic states of Malaysia and Indonesia - for ultimately China wants to dominate the Indian Ocean, and India in particular.

[Rishirishi]

Just cam back from a 9 day trip to China. Visited the growth engine areas like Nanjing, Hanzhou, Xiamen, Shenzen and Shanghai.

Economy
The economic slowdown seems to be hitting hard to the export oriented industries. Also hit hard is the property sector, with huge empty housing complexes. Two of Chinas main growth engines, exports and investments seems to be taking a bad hit.

Political freedom:
There is a HUGE change here. Magazines like Economist, Time, Newsweek etc were sold freely in airports and 5 star hotels. CNN can be viewed in hotel rooms. The state owned Chinease media, has started to report of disasters and governmental short commings (but in a very subtle way).

The greatest change is perhaps found among the people, who have started to ask critical questions. IS the one child policy correct? why do they constantly repair fine roads? Suspecting corruption and many other things. I never encountered such things in the past.

They seem to understand Englshish much better now. At airports and top hotels, you can expect them to understand some very basic English.

[renukb]

China steps up military ties with Nepal

After India, It's China's Turn in Nepal

Nepal's Foreign Ministry issues two rosy releases at the end of Chinese foreign minister Yan Jiechi’s Kathmandu visit.

The two sides-- Nepal and China-- discuss political developmennts, trade, economy and more. China's offers Nepal approximately NRs. 1.2 billion in aid. The following is the full text of the press release, issued December 3, 2003:


Official talks between Nepal and China were held today at the level of Foreign Minister at Shital Niwas. The Chinese delegation led by Foreign Minister H. E. Mr Yang Jiechi consisted of the Chinese Ambassador to Nepal H.E. Mr Qiu Guohong as well as Senior Officials of the Ministry of the Foreign Affairs of the People's Republic of China. The Nepalese delegation led by Minister for Foreign Affairs of Nepal Hon. Mr Upendra Yadav comprised Advisor Mr Shyamananda Suman, Foreign Secretary Mr Gyan Chandra Acharya as well as other Senior Officials of the Government of Nepal.

Welcoming the Foreign Minister of China the Foreign Minister of Nepal highlighted the importance of such a high level visit from China after the declaration of Republic in Nepal.

During the talks, both the Foreign Ministers agreed to enhance and upgrade bilateral relationship to a new height with the expansion and consolidation of mutual interaction in diverse fields. They also agreed that regular exchange of visits at high levels will contribute towards enhancing mutual understanding and goodwill between the two countries.

The Foreign Minister of Nepal briefed the Chinese Foreign Minister about the current developments in Nepal and the peace process. He also expressed his thanks to the people and the Government of China for their valuable support during Nepal's transition and peace process. They agreed to enhance and broaden the areas of cooperation in the days ahead. The Nepalese side lauded the economic achievements that China has made over the years and requested for Chinese cooperation in enabling Nepal to derive due benefits from bilateral partnerships and joint undertakings.

They also reviewed the projects being undertaken with the assistance of China such as Syafrubesi-Rasuwagadi Road, National Ayurveda Research and Training Centre and National Trust for Nature Conservation as well as other important projects. They also discussed about future projects for their detailed technical study and prioritization.

On bilateral trade, both sides emphasized the need for promoting sustainable trade, thereby enhancing mutually beneficial trading relationship through promotion of Nepalese exports to China. In this context, they also agreed to consider Comprehensive Trade Agreement between the two countries. Both sides noted with satisfaction the Chinese investment in Nepal in diverse areas and also decided to further promote such investments to contribute towards strengthening economic ties between the two countries.

Both sides also discussed about the establishment of Special Economic Zones (SEZ) and Dry Ports in border areas. They also agreed to make the best use of the existing geographical advantage to expand relations between Nepal and Tibet and promote border trade between the two countries through more facilitating measures. While expressing their appreciation for growing business to business and people to people relations between the two countries both sides agreed to promote and encourage them for mutual benefit in the days to come.

Nepalese side highlighted the advantages of better connectivity by all means of transport including railways to promote linkages between Nepal and China. The Nepalese Foreign Minister also appreciated the Government of China for providing scholarships as well as human resource training opportunities in China. Both sides agreed to promote tourism between the two countries through various initiatives and appropriate measures.

Both sides directed the bilateral consultation mechanism to hold regular meetings to review all aspects of bilateral cooperation, explore new areas of cooperation and prepare long-term measures and a vision paper to promote bilateral relationship between the two countries. They also discussed other issues of mutual interest.

The two Foreign Ministers reviewed regional and international issues of mutual concern and agreed to cooperate in the international forums for promoting their common interests. The Chinese side appreciated the reaffirmation of Nepal's 'One China Policy' and its principled stand of not allowing its territories to be used against China. The Chinese Foreign Minister extended invitation to the Nepalese Foreign Minister to pay an Official visit to China at a mutually convenient time.

On the occasion, the Government of the People's Republic of China agreed to provide the Government of Nepal with a grant of RMB 100 million (Renminbi Yuan one Hundred Million only) equivalent to Nepalese Rs. 1.2 billion approximately. To this effect, an Agreement on Economic and Technical Cooperation between the Government of Nepal and the Government of the People's Republic of China was also signed by the Foreign Ministers of the two countries. According to the Agreement the grant is to be used for projects to be discussed and decided upon by the two Governments of Nepal and China.

(Official talks between Nepal and China were held today at the level of Foreign Minister at Shital Niwas. The Chinese delegation led by Foreign Minister H. E. Mr Yang Jiechi consisted of the Chinese Ambassador to Nepal H.E. Mr Qiu Guohong as well as Senior Officials of the Ministry of the Foreign Affairs of the People's Republic of China. The Nepalese delegation led by Minister for Foreign Affairs of Nepal Hon. Mr Upendra Yadav comprised Advisor Mr Shyamananda Suman, Foreign Secretary Mr Gyan Chandra Acharya as well as other Senior Officials of the Government of Nepal)

[renukb]

The riddle of India, China military exercises
http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/2008/ ... exercises/

India and China are holding joint troop exercises this weekend in southern India. As exercises between nations go nowadays these games named “Hand-in Hand 2008″ are fairly low level and limited in scope. Certainly not on the scale of the naval, air and ground exercises that India and the United States have embarked upon in recent years.

But this is a difficult time in South Asia following the attacks in Mumbai which New Delhi says were orchestrated from Pakistan and for which it is seeking decisive action. So, for China, - Pakistan’s all weather ally - to be sending a bunch of troops to India at this fraught moment is certainly worthy of note, if nothing else.

Obviously the exercises were long-planned and perhaps both sides didn’t want to send a negative signal by calling them off at this stage. Relations between India and China are themselves dogged by deep distrust long after they went to war in 1962 and every move forward or lack of it is closely watched by Indo-Sino watchers.

There is even an anti-terrorism element to the exercises. An Indian defence ministry statement said that troops taking part in Hand-in Hand 2008 will carry out tactical manoeuvres and drills interoperability training; and finally “culminating in a joint counter-terrorist operational exercise with simulated enemy.”

In India’s case elements in Pakistan can only be the simulated enemy, especially with the wounds from the Mumbai attacks still raw. The reverse holds true for large sections of Pakistan who have for long felt threatened by India, its bigger neighbour to the east.

But what of the Chinese? Who are they thinking of as the enemy when they go through the drills? Separatists in its Muslim-majority Xinjiang region or perhaps Tibetans who were the target of a clampdown following unrest this year?

A little Chinese riddle perhaps, these exercises at this time ?

[svinayak]

Huanqiu, China

Financial Crisis
Makes a Substantial
Improvement on
Sino-American Ties



By Peng Guangqian

Translated By Ming Li

05 December 2008
China - Huanqiu - Original Article (Chinese)

The global financial crisis that started from the subprime calamity in the U.S. is now spreading globally, and the impact that it will have on China-U.S. relations is worthy of concern.

The three pillars that have supported the U.S. empire for a long time- financial hegemony (dollar hegemony), military hegemony and cultural hegemony- have been heavily wounded in this financial crisis in a way never seen before. The ebb and flow of the balance of strategic powers between China and America is beyond expectation and improvement in China’s strategic posture comes earlier than expected, but it is groundless to judge that the “turning point” of the strategic power contrast between these two countries is coming. As a dollar empire with its foundation still intact, the U.S. is still a strong nation owning the most advanced technologies in the world and the American homeland still has huge production capacity. There is not a currency that can replace the dollar’s role, even though the dollar hegemony has been impaired somehow. Deep-rooted problems existing in China’s structure have been enormous hidden trouble, which limits its development. The strategic disparity between China and America can’t be erased overnight. It is a risky hallucination to think about challenging the world’s richest nation when China just discards the bowl used to beg food.

What can be certain is that the U.S. government, which names the financial crisis as its top priority, will be forced to focus on the domestic economy for some time. The outgoing American government, kidnapped by neoconservatism, ran the war machine, which greatly consumed the country’s strategic resources and impaired the country’s comprehensive strength. There are no other choices for Obama, who cried “change” out loud when assuming his presidency at a time of crisis, but shrinks to his front line. The newly elected government will turn its attentions from abroad to home, from military affairs to economic in the terms of administrative emphasis, resource allocation and policy focuses. During the time that the U.S. tries to pull its troops from Iraq and solve a few hot-spot issues by political means, the readjustment of its global strategic concerns and the construction of a new hub for its Asia-Pacific strategy within which Guam is the center, might be moderately slowed down. While America is busy with its own business, the strategic pressure China faces will get some relief though it will not vanish completely.

More importantly, against the backdrop of the financial crisis, working together to deal with the crisis is becoming a new base of strategy for Sino-American ties. The worsening financial crisis is the biggest threat shared by China and the U.S. these days. The degree of dependency on China by the U.S., who is anxious to jump out of the crisis, will widen and increasing strategic cooperation, including those for economy in this hard time, will further form a main rift of Sino-American relations. The past has witnessed China and the U.S. working together to form an anti-Fascist front to fight bravely against the Fascist powers of German, Italy and Japan and a historic handshake by China and America, who let go of past rancor, for a common goal to resist the expansion of Soviet hegemony. To counter international terrorism, the U.S. has to redirect its policy that once improperly treated China as its strategic competitor. It is not an enemy with a gun in hand that the two countries share today, but an economic disorder with grimness, damage and destruction never seen before and neither one of the two countries can deal with it alone. This new strategic pattern will widen the surface of cooperation between China and America by limiting the conflicts in traditional China-U.S. strategy constitution to a degree. The strategic tie between China and the U.S. will assume a new content and will get new development thanks to their cooperation against the financial crisis.

Some invoke the fact that World War II was a result of the world economic crisis from 1929 to 1933 and fear that the U.S. might begin a war to transfer the crisis. It is understandable, but the situation is not any more the same then as when a war could stimulate the stagnant economy, and the recession today is not caused by lack of stimulation, but excessive debt. War again, like drinking poisoned wine to curb thirst, will stimulate nothing but will backfire. It can be said that the economic friction and occasional shocks are inevitable but for the moment, they will not hit hard on Sino-American strategic relation. On the contrary, the economic interdependence and the increasing economic cooperation will bring a substantial improvement to Sino—American strategic ties.

(The author is an expert on China’s national strategy)

[Malayappan]

Cross Posting,

http://www.csmonitor.com/2008/1212/p25s03-wosc.html

From the article,

India also sought to have the UN committee include on the list Hamid Gul, a retired Pakistani Army general who headed the country's main intelligence agency, the Inter-Services Intelligence Directorate, in the late 1980s. However, China, a close ally of Pakistan that has veto power on the Security Council, apparently blocked Mr. Gul's inclusion.